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Learning UNIX for Mac OS X

Posted by timothy on Thu Oct 03, 2002 09:45 AM
from the this-is-unix-i-know-this dept.
Books Media Businesses Apple
Spencerian writes "I've become quite accustomed the depth of co-author Dave Taylor's writing on UNIX in previous books such as Teach Yourself UNIX in 24 Hours . As you can note from Dave's recent writing credits, his experience and knowledge of UNIX is vast and varied. That said, I was mildly disappointed with this latest offering that discusses the UNIX underpinnings of Mac OS X." Spencerian explains the logic underlying that conclusion in his complete review, below.

For starters, I was annoyed to find that the book's title implied a larger format than the 139 pages it comprises. The book has an audience problem because of its size. UNIX guys like thick books. Is this book mostly for newbies to OS X, to UNIX, or to Mac OS X's implementation of UNIX? Despite this targeting problem, the book's contents are still useful, but I think its audience is more geared to new UNIX users. The book just doesn't have much depth for even a reference title, especially for a topic such as UNIX, and particularly for a new, little-documented UNIX family operating system such as OS X.

While Mac OS X is a BSD variant, it has a few idiosyncrasies that may throw off a veteran UNIX user, and this book manages to address most, if not all of these notable problems. For instance, Dave notes problems in sendmail that prevent it from working from the command line in Mac OS X's Terminal application, and presents a fix for the problem. If you use command lines in UNIX all the time, the book does present good instructions on getting Lynx, IRC, newsgroups, pine, and the like up and running in Terminal. The book shies away (quite appropriately) from any graphic interface items unless required, such as when changing Terminal's preferences.

This book was very recently published (May 2002) but already has fallen behind with the release of Mac OS X 10.2 (Jaguar). Some components of Jaguar, such as CUPS support for stronger printing options, are completely missing from this book. If you have Jaguar installed on your computer, don't dive headlong into the NetInfo Manager steps for LPR printer configuration. Books typically don't age this fast, but in the case of this book, small changes seem to mean a lot to this title's usefulness -- the introduction of CUPS may have made Chapter 5's contents almost irrelevant.

Another small nag involves the lack of information on useful commands for Mac OS X users that weren't available (or were difficult to find) with the old Mac OS 9. One such command, cron, makes my life easier for handling some tasks on my home computer. It's not even mentioned in this book, nor will you find much information on shell scripting or compiling UNIX code you might happen to find. I guess I'm most annoyed at the lack of compile information since the Apple Developer Connection marked this book as a Recommended Title.

Despite our fondness for (and tolerance of the slightly-higher prices of) Macintosh computers, Mac users aren't made of money and don't like to buy a bookstore's worth of tomes for basic information. It would have made a lot of sense to talk more about compiling software since Apple's software or other GUI products don't meet or can configure all UNIX needs. And I won't even talk about the lack of coverage about XDarwin, an application that starts XFree86 within a Mac OS X installation, allowing X Window applications to run atop or in tandem with the OS X interface. XDarwin has become popular enough for it to become part of the stable XFree86 distribution. Given that not every UNIX user is a command-line freak, this is a pretty critical omission in my mind.

So, who should buy this book?

If you are completely new to UNIX and have been a gooey-kiddie who's used almost nothing except Mac OS 9, this is a very good reference to get your toes moist with UNIX. However, as drug dealers say, "the first taste is free." This book will leave you wanting more detailed information. More experienced UNIX users can probably find out what they need about Mac OS X's command line from a few free locations such as Mac OS X Hints.

One last thing: A pox upon Tim O'Reilly for not using the platypus for the animal on the book's cover. Given that the open-source core operating system of Mac OS X is named Darwin and has a nicely-modified take-off on the BSD mascot that depicts both the name of the OS and its BSD origins, I would think that O'Reilly would have jumped on this obvious cover.

You can purchase Learning UNIX for Mac OS X from bn.com. Slashdot welcomes readers' book reviews -- to see your own review here, read the book review guidelines, then visit the submission page.

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  • I for one usually read O'Reilly books on any given subject because they are smaller, more to the point and less filled with useless graphics (usually screen shots), than most publishers. Granted O'Reilly isn't always that way (how many shots of -borderwidth did "Learning Perl/Tk" need?), but as a rule they are better than most publishers (cough*Oracle Press*cough).

  • Hexley does seem the obvious choice, but all the Apple-themed O'Reilly books have a dog motif. I guess they thought consistency was better.

  • Teach yourself Unix in 24 hours? (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Yeah, you must be a real hardcore techie.

    Read dummies books too?

  • Its a shame its not 10.2 (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Hunts (116340) on Thursday October 03 2002, @10:01AM (#4380530) Homepage
    I've been having major problems with OS X Server 10.2 thats driving me insane.

    Thinking in a more unix way, I starting trying to hunt down the proccess involved..but all to no avail. I couldnt find any proccesses that seemed to be having problems..and was told by a friend in the know that my issue was more of a mac gui thing...something I know nothing about :/

    A good decent book on OS X Server 10.2 would be really nice at the moment
    • It's like the chinese curse "my you live in interesting times". Mac OsX has given us a wonderful set of opportunities and pitfalls. Books are sorely needed, and needed quickly. Most of all are books that point out the pit falls of assuming linux and macOSX work the same way.

      Apple gave us a lot of power but has not told us how to use it. In the mean time We are encouraged not to use them until they are documented, but being geeks we cant resist poking and prodding. And assuming that because we know linux or BSD that we know Mac OSX. Then we get MAD when we get into trouble from our uniformed meddling or we discover some bit of uglyness behind the veil that we dont like exactly how apple has implemented it. Whereas before we were bilssfully unaware and untempted. It seems like all the anti-apple slashdot critiques that are at leaset slightly based on experience are along the lines of "well linux doesn't do it that way, so apple is wrong."

      When I first got OS X beta, I nievely tried to set /etc/fstab and /etc/exports. Got steamin mad. Then discovered netInfo. (I vaguely knew where to look from NeXTstep) Thought that was truly wonderful and sorely needed unification of unix configuration. Blessed apple. But apple had not issued the manual. No matter, I waded in, did some cool things, and by the end of the day my computer was unbootable from one leeetle mistake. (had to re-install). Cursed Apple for not documenting this. (I had called them on the phone and they warned me not to meddle with it!) But within 6 months the NetInfo manual was indeed out along with some idiot proof gui "training wheel" tools for making changes to certain records.

      My experience with OSX has been extremely positive. I make some whopper mistakes, but that was really y fault. mac unix is unix but its not LINUX and HFS+ is NOT UFS. But that does not make it worse. In fact on the whole I think its much better. But if you assume that cp and mv do the same thing they do in linux, well you will eventually get a surprise.

    • It wouldn't be a bad idea if those people who've read the book and have ideas about what should be added to the next edition (focused on 10.2 and, um, perhaps beyond) sent me a note about it!: taylor at intuitive dot com
      • I agree--having to shuck a few thousand down for a class is a pain in the patootie.

        I've already written one book. [premierpressbooks.com] I'm hoping to take these classes and write study guides for the various Mac OS tests so we can all save a few bucks but get the training we need.

        I've recently played with an Xserve and 10.2 Server for a few weeks. It does rock, but Apple really needs stronger and enterprise-based documentation. They write too often with consumers in mind, not IT people.
      • I've been reading the 622 page admin guide. My first impression was "622 pages!!!! that is not why I bought an apple." After reading it two things are clear. First they are very gentle so even a unix weaking can understand both the big picture and the little picture. Second, it is not a unix manual,instead it focuses on using gui tools and a fixed, thought rather broad, set of tasks (e.g.setting up LDAP, mounting a disk). It still does not teach unix. A book teaching command line unix that specialized in mac's has stillnot been written (Yes I am aware of the various attempts). My third impression is that it needs a second edition. There are a lot of incompletely explained concepts that only an experienced NeXSTstep user would understand or descriptions that dont quite match the actual gui-tools. But it's wonderful to have a reference now.
        • I have been looking through the admin guide and I realized one big thing: dead tree docs are so much better than electronic docs! I am seriously thinking about printing the whole damn guide and binding it. The only thing holding me back is just what you said, the guide is way too general.

          I want a very in-depth guide, or set of guides, similar to the old Inside Macintosh series, but for MacOS X Server admin. So what if it covers Unix topics, or GUI topics? Cover it all and break it down into modules that you can buy and read as you want. Have an intro book for general topics, have a book on mail, a book on web serving, a book on firewalls and NAT, etc. I'm sure Netinfo and LDAP will take a book just by themselves.

          The point is that these introductory Mac books just don't cut it any more. They are all pretty much clones of each other and they tell you simple stuff like how to set up your web browser. That's great for the home user, but it does nothing for the professional system administrator looking to use Macs.
        • Heh, well it's quite easy really. I backed up the user accounts I had using the ditto command :

          sudo ditto -rsrcFork /Users/ /Volumes/VOLUME_NAME

          I then did a complete reinstall of the server. Yeah it was a bit of overkill but it totally cleared up all of my troubles. (I had a few other odd problems that were plaguing me.)

          Since then I have been a bit smarter about how to run the server. I have been keeping the user accounts on a separate drive. That way I can mess with the server drive without having to worry about messing up the data. I was circumventing Apple's tools for the firewall because I had a much more involved rule set that I wanted. Now what I am doing is using Apple's GUI to start the firewall and then adding in ipfw rules around the ones the server software creates.

          If you are having problems with logging in it may be one of several problems. First of all, you may have messed around with Netinfo's domains. If you bork Netinfo then you lose many of the authentication services. You may also have created firewall rules which mess around with your loopback. If your server can't use its loopback properly, then it may not be able to do authentication lookups. Lastly, you may have accidently messed up one of the configuration files that controls your authentication services.

          I'm not that well-versed in running a MacOS X Server machine, but these seem like the main issues. Since I did a re-install of the server and I was a bit more careful about messing around with things, I have had very few problems. My main one now is the fact that I am having trouble setting up IMAP accounts. It may be due to the fact that I'm running NAT, but I'm not sure yet.

          Good luck with it!
  • Why should MacOSX Users learn UNIX? The other review of this book I read said that that point wasn't covered.
    • Why should MacOSX Users learn UNIX? The other review of this book I read said that that point wasn't covered.

      Do you mean the "explaining why you might want to learn about Unix" part, or do you mean that the book doesn't do a good job of teaching parts of Unix that are of interest to most users of OS X? If it's the latter, I would agree that most Mac OS X users probably don't care; they're going to buy the "Missing Manual" series or something. If it's the former, that might be more of a problem.

      My guess is that the average reader of this book is somebody who was really into Mac OS X, and then saw somebody perform a Unix command line magic trick that saved tham a whole day's work. This does happen, and it does have an effect on the witnesses, who then go forth, intrigued, to the bookstore. But, lo: the Unix books are written for the high priests! Ah, here's a book for an acolyte like me...it even says "Mac OS X" in the title. :-)

      Time will tell if there really is an audience for this or not.

  • the oreilly 'gotta get something published' model? (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    IT seems that this book is of the 'Gotta get something published on this topic NOW'. Hey, see if JimBob can write a 100 pages on topic X!

    I'm seen this example with this book and with things like Rob Flickenger's 'community wireless networks'.

    It's not at all that they AREN'T good books, or not informative, but they are, indeed, lean and seem to be something just to get published.

    After all, we now have OSX: the missing manual (second edition coming soon) and other OSX manuals (which I can't name cause it aint out yet) that are more of the OReilly 'tome' size (400 + pages)

    I am not a publisher and I really dont know how the publishing business really works, but as an end user and a buyer of dozens of Oreilly books, this 100 page short book thing seems to be a way to get a book, ANY book, to the market ASAFP while larger tomes are worked on.

    $.02

  • Mac OS X for Unix Geeks (Score:5, Informative)

    by CMU_Nort (73700) on Thursday October 03 2002, @10:06AM (#4380564) Homepage
    It sounds like the book he really wanted to get was O'Reilly's Mac OS X for Unix Geeks [oreilly.com]. It includes a lot of his gripe topics like:

    * A quick overview of the Terminal application

    * Understanding Open Directory (LDAP) and NetInfo

    * Issues related to using the GNU C Compiler 9GCC

    * Library linking and porting Unix software

    * An overview of Mac OS X?s filesystem and startup processes

    * Creating and installing packages using Fink

    * Building the Darwin kernel

    * Running X Windows on top of Mac OS X

    • That's exactly the content I was expecting to find in this first OS X/UNIX book that O'Reilly offered. I did scan the book before I bought it and knew it didn't have what I was really looking for. It never hurts to have Yet Another Useful Reference Book, however.

      Don't get me wrong--it's an excellent book. But in the past year or so, I've already outgrown it's content. I've dived into the UNIX innards of OS X quite often, and you can't help but learn the basics that way. This book was really for someone who has never used UNIX before but knows a bit about Mac OS.

      The "UNIX Geeks" book definitely requires a read for me.
      • Don't get me wrong--it's an excellent book. But in the past year or so, I've already outgrown it's content. I've dived into the UNIX innards of OS X quite often, and you can't help but learn the basics that way. This book was really for someone who has never used UNIX before but knows a bit about Mac OS.

        Well, I was baffled about why you didn't think the title made this very clear. O'Reilly "Learning" books are for beginners (in some sense), and the title of this one is "Learning Unix for Mac OS X". What is the intended audience? Beginners. What will they learn? Unix, in the context of Mac OS X. Believe me, there are thousands of those people around, including many who don't usually buy many computer books and therefore have not come to expect the "brick of verbosity" tomes that some people really seem to want.

        Having said that, I have to confess that I fell into a similar trap back in the day with "Learning Perl/Tk". Now there's an O'Reilly book that earned something approaching scorn in the geek community, and the reason why is because that one really didn't have much of the audience intended (beginners wanting to learn Perl/Tk), but instead was the only real book for *anybody* to buy that really talked about Perl/Tk...and most of the actual buyers were complete geeks in search of something that would augment the then sparse-ish documentation for the toolkit. But all's well that ends well; we now have "Mastering Perl/Tk", and I think we're all happy again. :-)

        The "UNIX Geeks" book definitely requires a read for me.

        Me too. I'm guessing that this book if it turns out to be as good as we'd hope will sell a *lot* more copies than you might expect given the rate of adoption by geeks of (T)iBooks. When I went to YAPC in St. Louis, i was floored by the number of those being used during talks...

        • I agree with your comments completely. I guess I'm falling into that UNIX trap of geekness. I expected this book to be deeper because UNIX is deep, period. I guess I felt as if I got a tutorial book on quantum physics and felt cheated because they left out a section on building your own toroid quantum particle accelerator.

          I wrote the review with /. folks in mind, of course. The book would have a glowing review otherwise--it's just not the book for most /.ers.
      • Don't get me wrong--it's an excellent book. But in the past year or so, I've already outgrown it's content.

        Right, but that surely is a mark of success with a Learning title? As the lead author, I look at it this way: I want to prepare the reader for their future journeys into Unix. Jerry and I did our best to ensure that we explain potentially foreign Unix concepts clearly, enlighten readers on the philosophy of command lines, flags, pipes, redirection, and other weird Unixisms that are a long way from Mac OS 9 / Windows interaction, and generally push everyone in the right direction so that they (you) can learn more and shed the book!

        I'm quite delighted to read your comment, Spencerian, actually. I wish that all my readers came back a year later and said "thanks for getting me started. I don't need your book any more!" :-)

  • I didn't know Mac users had that kind of attention span!

    (ducks...)

  • Oh I don't know (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Drath (50447) on Thursday October 03 2002, @10:09AM (#4380584)
    UNIX guys like thick books

    That's a misnomer, My Kernighan & Ritchie C book gets a lot of use and it's only ~280 pages. Large does not espessially mean better.

    • I've reviewed a small amount (say, thirty) Linux / Unix / and (a couple of) Windows books for an Australian computer magazine (APC).

      As a rule, if a book has more than two authors and is more than four hundred pages long, its quality is generally poor. This is because such titles - eg, most of the Unleashed series - take content from several diffferent authors, but don't maintain consistent style of build a solid learning path. One fellow explains the /etc/passwd file, then another fellow explaining NIS does a longer version of the same explanantion using a different analogy, rather than building on what the audience already knew. The change is style and analogies is often confusing for those new to the platform.

      I'm not saying all huge books are like this, but because of their nature they're more than likely to need a good editor to make all the disparate content a little more seamless, and because most are churned out like nobodies' business they rarely get this attention.

      Other examples of why big books are often poorer includes the 1400 page Upgrading and Repairing PCs compared to the 700 page O'Reilly's PC Hardware in a Nutshell. Upgrading and Repairing loves including charts of the details about every PC product made by every manufacturer since the edition was published. This information is generally out of date, but th books publishers tell you you can fidn newer information onlien at the oublishers web site. Well, er, actually, I can find it at any web site. PC Hardware in a Nutshell is a lot mroe concise but contains most of the useful information. What it lacks in out-of-date charts it makes up in providing users with real-world experience and facts-supported opinion by the two authors - eg, they'll tell you that HP don't often release or support newer firmware for the CD drives they rebrand, so it might be best to avoid HP gear.

      Another famously bad exampel of a large book is John Chirillo's Hack Attacks Encylopaedia. Its ~1500 pages (IIRC) of mainly unedited text files from outdated h4x0r tools, with a chapter by John at the start. It disgusts me that a) he has the nerve to call himself the authro of the title when he's clearly the edit, and a lazy one at that b) that this is a so called premium security title and is charged accordingly.
    • My Kernighan & Ritchie C book gets a lot of use and it's only ~280 pages.
      280 pages? Mine's got only 230!!! I must have been ripped-off!!!!

  • Not familiar with O'Reilly books? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by wunderhorn1 (114559) on Thursday October 03 2002, @10:23AM (#4380673) Homepage
    Too me, "Learning UNIX for Mac OS X" implies a book for newbies to UNIX. Definitely not a reference volume, they would save that for an "... In a Nutshell" book. (For example, "Learning Perl : 300 pages. "Perl in a Nutshell": 800 pages.)

    Also, O'Reilly already used a platypus for "Web Database Applications with PHP and MySQL", so no dice there.
    However, I just got an idea to somehow play off of the BSD Daemon/Apple connection by using a picture of the story of the devil offering Eve fruit from the tree of knowledge. Also sort of a connection to Darwin via the evolution/creationism debate.

    OK, so it's a pretty big stretch ;-)

    • In addition to having already used the platypus for another title, O'Reilly is following a pattern of using various dogs for the MacOS X titles (Learning Cocoa, Learning Carbon, etc).

  • "Audience Problems"?? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by vi-rocks (611108) on Thursday October 03 2002, @10:26AM (#4380686) Homepage
    The review stated:

    The book has an audience problem because of its size. UNIX guys like thick books. Is this book mostly for newbies to OS X, to UNIX, or to Mac OS X's implementation of UNIX? Despite this targeting problem.....

    This is crazy!!! There is no "targeting problem" -- the book is written for people who are new to UNIX -- that is the target audience. The book is right on for this crowd. As mentioned by others, there are other books that the UNIX savvy will find useful. -- Why would someone who owns "Unix PowerTools" or "Essential System Administration" even consider bying a book with "Learning Unix" in the title???

  • Online UNIX tutorial for OS X (Score:3, Informative)

    by phatvibez (518108) on Thursday October 03 2002, @11:12AM (#4381030) Homepage
    Here is a MacOS X UNIX tutorial I just found yesterday. If you're an old time Mac user or just want to learn some UNIX commands then this is something you might want to check out...

    http://www.osxfaq.com/Tutorials/LearningCenter/ [osxfaq.com]

  • A Really Thick Book on OS X (Score:5, Informative)

    by Melantha_Bacchae (232402) on Thursday October 03 2002, @11:33AM (#4381199)
    If you want a really, seriously, thick book on OS X (probably a bit dated post-Jaguar), try "OS X Unleashed". It covers both the Mac and Unix sides. The X Window System is covered, as is setting up a mail or ftp server, programming in Perl, using MySQL, even installing Lynx (if you want a text based browser).

    It makes a great reference book, and comes in real handy whenever you need a heavy, if slightly soft, weight around the house. ;)

    "Godzilla's coming"
    Io, "Godzilla 2000" (US version dialog)
    G Countdown: 26 days (www.godzillaoncube.com)
    • It's the book I currently recommend to people from a UNIX background who are interested in OS X. Yes, it's a bit dated right now as of the Jaguar release, but it's decent even now, and the highly-likely updated version for Jaguar should be out soon (in my opinion, I don't know any specifics or inside info on publlishing dates).

  • Book Doesn't Make Compelling Case for LearningUnix (Score:3, Insightful)

    by CaptMondo (232861) on Thursday October 03 2002, @01:50PM (#4382492) Homepage
    I remember being really interested in this title when I first heard of it -- most of the Mac OS X books I've looked at don't really take a good hard look at the BSD Unix heart of the OS.

    I ended up reviewing this book [canadacomputes.com] for The Computer Paper, and my editor summed it up with the title: "Unix book doesn't explain why Mac users should learn it".

    Okay, I know it is aimed at the beginner, but aside from teaching the basics, none of it really goes into learning any of this would be useful to the reader. Why teach someone about using the lynx browser for example, and not show them how to use grep for finding files, or the basics of shell programming to automate common tasks.

    Best book of its type that I've seen so far on this specific topic is Mac OS X Unleashed [canadacomputes.com]. For the beginner, I'd recommend Mac OS X: The Missing Manual [canadacomputes.com] which probably has about as much info on the Unix end of things while having plenty of good general useful info on OS X.

  • The only thing unique about shell scripting OS X (Score:3, Informative)

    by guttentag (313541) on Thursday October 03 2002, @03:39PM (#4383342) Journal
    Is the audience.

    Mac users will require more initial hand-holding to become comfortable with the command line. And they'll need instant gratification to convince them that dealing with such an apparently-archaic interface is worth the effort.

    If you know someone who is in this situation, get them:

    1. The latest version of BBEdit.
    2. An easy-to-use shell scripting book as a reference. Reading a book like Teach Yourself Shell Programming from beginning to end is going to either bore them or scare them off. But as they are experimenting at their own pace and discovering just what they can do with shell scripting, they'll want a reference to thumb through for solutions to the problems they encounter.
    Start them out with something simple and relatively familiar, like df, and explain what information it provides.

    Then show them df | bbedit. They'll feel more comfortable seeing a connection between the GUI world they know.

    Then shown them df | grep disk0s9 | bbedit.

    And df | grep disk0s9 | awk '{print "Disk Size: " $2/2000 " MB"}'.

    Work on basic one-liners first, then show them sed, head, tail, wc, etc. And when you go to show them something new one day and you discover that they wrote something on their own purely because they were interested, you know the fire has been lit.

    And if they have any doubts about the value of shell scripting, show them the Linux version of my Buddy program [sourceforge.net], which is really just a collection of over 70 shell scripts (most of which are reasonably-well commented) and explain that the Mac OS X version is just the Linux version with an AppleScript Studio GUI slapped on top.

      • The vast majority of Mac users do note have Unix experience. Most Windows users don't have Unix experience either. This is one of primary reasons for the relatively slow adpotion of Linux.

        There are many Mac and Windows users who do have Unix experience, but your comments suggest that your perspective is skewed because you work in a Unix environment. We're talking about people who are not using Unix (hence the title of this discussion, "Learning UNIX for Mac OS X) but could benefit from it.

    • Microsoft owns nowhere near 51% of Apple's shares. The shares they bought in 1996 were a) non-voting and b) maybe a percent, at the very most. Although I believe the shares have been converted to voting shares at this point, but still, incredibly far from being controlling shares. Not to say Microsoft still doesn't hold sway over Apple in some way.
    • microsoft own 51% of shares in apple since 1996 i think

      Was it nice crack?

      a grrl & her server [danamania.com]
    • From yahoo finance [yahoo.com] => Institutional ownership: 59%

      as long as Microsoft is not an institution is quite hard that it can own 51% of apple shares

    • Re:OSX and Unix (Score:2, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      It was August 1997, MSoft ponied up something like $168 million. Apple at that time was a $10 Billion (with a B) company - so that is less than 2%, and as the previous poster mentioned, it was non-voting stock anyway.

      Reminds me of some of the truly moronic comments I got at the time. "So what are you gonna do now that Bill Gates has bought Mac?" Sheesh.

    • Re:OSX and Unix (Score:5, Interesting)

      by MouseR (3264) on Thursday October 03 2002, @10:20AM (#4380652) Homepage
      yes microsoft as microsoft own 51% of shares in apple since 1996 i think

      Jesus! What kinda smoke have you been inhaling?

      MS bought 150M $ USD worth of NON-voting shares of Apple back in 1996. That's peanuts. Apple was worth net 2.1 billion at that time.

      That's nowhere near 51%.

      Besides, you're factually wrong to start with. BSD was a set of tools that sat on top of AT&T's Unix. It eventually grew so large it required only a few files to become it's own OS. That was the kernel. They eventually got that.

      Mac OS X (or, Darwin, actually) is entirely FreeBSD (some tidbits of NetBSD too), except for the microkernel, which is Mach (no relation to "Mac").

      And YES, Darwin/Mac OS X *IS* Unix, as it has licensed the trademark from the Open Group, the rightful owner of the trademark.

      What makes a Unix is not the kernel. It's how the package operates and how well is follows the standards (such as but not limited to Posix). The Unix trademark is awarded upon proper registration and evaluation of the OS. There are costst involved, is is pretty much the only thing that keeps Linux being called a real Unix.
      • Actually it's more in the neighborhood of 15%, and it's non-voting stock.

        It was nowhere near 15%, and the shares were sold many months ago.

        And though Apple does admit to changing the kernel, this is no more different the many UNIX variants.

        It's not accurate to say that Apple changed the kernel. They're using their own kernel, xnu, which is based partly on the Mach work out of CMU and partly on work done by NeXT and, later, Apple themselves.

        So please before you post, get your facts straight.

        Physician, heal thyself.

    • Again: "Unix for Mac OS X" is NOT Unix!!

      Note: The BSD m4 Macro processor is dated as
      1991 and is nowhere as powerful as the GNU m4.


      But GNU is Not UNIX, is it?
    • Note: The BSD m4 Macro processor is dated as
      1991 and is nowhere as powerful as the GNU m4.

      what does bsd m4 have to do with Darwin?

      [14:02:33][jeremy:~]$ uname -a
      Darwin Jeremy-Erwins-Computer.local. 6.1 Darwin Kernel Version 6.1: Fri Sep 6 23:24:34 PDT 2002; root:xnu/xnu-344.2.obj~2/RELEASE_PPC Power Macintosh powerpc
      [14:02:37][jeremy:~]$ /usr/bin/m4 --version
      GNU m4 1.4

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