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1.8 Million US Court Rulings Now Online
Posted by
samzenpus
on Tue Feb 19, 2008 01:18 PM
from the star-wars-kid-v.-lol-cats dept.
from the star-wars-kid-v.-lol-cats dept.
I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property writes "For a long time now, lawyers and any serious law students have been bound to paid services like LexusNexis for access to case law, but that is slowly changing. Carl Malamud has posted free electronic copies of every U.S. Supreme Court decision and Court of Appeals ruling since 1950, 1.8 million rulings in all, online for free. While the rulings themselves have long been government works not subject to copyright, courts still charge several cents per page for copies and they're inconvenient to access, so lawyers usually turn to legal publishers which are more expensive but more convenient, providing helpful things like notes about related cases, summaries of the holdings, and information about if and when the case was overturned. This free database is not Carl's first, either. He convinced the SEC to provide EDGAR, and helped get both the Smithsonian and Congressional hearings online."
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Submission: 1.8 Million US Court Rulings Now Online by Anonymous Coward
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And the response... (Score:5, Informative)
http://bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/letter_to_west_response.pdf [resource.org]
Seems a pretty reasonable response to his initial query:
http://bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/letter_to_west.pdf [resource.org]
Thus, Thomson is justified in asserting copyright on materials which represent unique, original, or significant contributions to the content, and does not assert any copyright whatever on material which is in the public domain.
And if this work helps provide greater access information which is already publicly, but not easily, available, then it's a Good Thing.
But Westlaw and LexisNexis do a lot more than just make case law available online. There is a lot of editorial work, summarizing, organization, not to mention costs often imposed by the courts themselves, and Carl Malamud correctly acknowledges that.
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So.... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:So.... (Score:5, Informative)
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The US Constitution was enacted in 1787 -- 220 years ago.
There are three levels of federal court, including 94 District Courts. Each Court can have more than one judge -- but even if there wasn't, that only leaves each court about 88 cases per year -- that is, one every four days.
And that's not counting the Appellate courts, or SCOTUS itself.
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I'd guess that the number of cases per day plotted on a graph over time, since 1787, looks a lot like the infamous hockey stick graph, or at least like a scimitar.
Re:So.... (Score:4, Informative)
With Westlaw (and Lexis as well), every case has a little symbol in the top left corner. If it is green, it is probably good law. If it is red, then the case is no longer good for at least one point of law. Considering the amount of time that this feature saves, it is well worth the $120 a month that I pay to another law firm to use one of their Westlaw passwords. In fact, if I were to deal directly with West, I would pay at least $200 a month and they would lock me in to a 12 month contract. Other lawyers gladly sign up.
When you think about how much energy it takes to categorize and flag every single case that comes out and cross-reference it with a semi-subjective interpretation of how it treats all the cases that it cites, and to categorize every single paragraph in a case for the specific legal question that it covers, these services are well worth the cost.
If it were just the text of the cases and statutes, then it would be a rip-off. But the text of the cases and statutes are almost always available for free from other sources. Every state government should provide its statutes and caselaw online for free. As far as I know, most of them do. The same is true of the Federal system. But it's hard to make significant use of that if you don't have any of the tools that are available in a good law library. Westlaw and Lexis are like a law library at your fingertips.
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Re:So.... (Score:4, Insightful)
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No search feature (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:No search feature (Score:4, Interesting)
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While 1.8 million records does seem like quite a bit, Wikipedia (at least the English edition) has close to that many articles.
The real question would be this: What kind of person would be interested in digging into case histories and provide the meta linking information in order to make this sort of information useful?
Next question: What sort of skills would be necessary to make this happen? I know you don't necessa
Re:No search feature (Score:4, Interesting)
http://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Abulk.resource.org%2Fcourts.gov%2F+Google [google.com]
or search PDF file...
http://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Abulk.resource.org%2Fcourts.gov%2F+filetype%3Apdf+Google [google.com]
I think, it's a compromise until there is a better way.
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New Court Ruling (Score:2)
Re:New Court Ruling (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:New Court Ruling (Score:4, Interesting)
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I found a group of highly knowledgable legal experts [slashdot.org] who don't mind sharing their expertise online for free.
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I wonder how fast he's going to get sued by the legal publishers that the article refers to as "more expensive", and thus quite successful and profitable?
These businesses already have had some competition for years and it's still available so unless he copies what they offer directly, summaries and such, I don't think it's very likely he'll be sued. Findlaw does this, for instance searching for "John Gilmore" [findlaw.com] has the ruling in his case as well as commentary on it.
Falcon
yay (Score:5, Funny)
Now IANAL (Score:2)
I don't see this being used in court, but it's a great resource as much as the public law library is. Law students, people who wish to defend themselves, or just with a strong curiosity can now have a better starting point, if not a better understanding
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FindLaw? (Score:2, Insightful)
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Yea, I've been using Findlaw for years.
FalconSorry, I already patented this process (Score:2, Funny)
My, the USPTO is gullible.
not to nitpick, but... (Score:4, Informative)
it's actually LexisNexis [lexisnexis.com].
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Legal Research the Free Way (Score:2, Interesting)
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Similar Canadian database (Score:4, Informative)
Westlaw and Lexis-Nexis have similar subscription case reporters in Canada, where they cooexist peacefully with this free site [canlii.ca], where you can freely search and read most "recent" Canadian case law (e.g. from the mid 1990s to date), as well as some older important appellate cases. The paid services have more "editorial content" such as detailed headnotes and cross-referencing to commentary.
The single most important thing lawyers want, other than the case itself, is to know what other cases say about it: which subsequent authorities cite the case, and why? The ability to "note up" a case ("Quickcite" on Lexis-Nexis Canada, "Shepardizing" in Westlaw-speak) to see at a glance if it has been followed, overturned or otherwise commented on is a critical feature for any online repository of case law. Until Malamud's site does this it's not true competition to the subscription sites.
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Then again, I don't get the impression that that is what Mr. Malamud is trying to be.
Good to hear, but... (Score:5, Interesting)
But Lexis and Westlaw will remain exceedingly important and worth their fees. Publishing cases is one thing - publishing the proprietary information that Lexis and Westlaw add (headnotes, the West Key system, Shepard's citations, treatises, and countless other secondary sources) would truly make this useful for attorneys. Of course, maintaining all of these sources requires a huge effort - and is one of the reasons these databases cost as much as they do. (There are, I'm sure, less savory reasons as well, of course.)
I wouldn't count on seeing Lexis and Westlaw go belly up soon - an attorney needs much more than the raw cases. But, like I said, this is very positive for the public.
It's not micromanagement... (Score:3, Informative)
Yup. (Score:2)
On the other hand, the restatements also cover areas that legislatures have often not covered in their own proceedings - areas of law that have traditionally been left to the common law and which the people have, apparently, seen no need to change. But when the people - through the legislature - do change them, the people obviously have the power to overrule the restatements.
simplifying law (Score:3, Funny)
Maybe if an attorney had to look at the raw cases all the time there would be a grass roots legal movement to simplify law rather than constantly add to it.
I propose a new amendment to the Constitution of the USA, all laws have to be written so the average person can read and understand it in 5 minutes.
FalconI admit it - I tried a case using Google (Score:5, Interesting)
I got the verdict last Friday in a case I tried myself in federal court: Verdict, Gregerson v. Vilana Financial, Inc. [cgstock.com]
I'm not sure whether to be proud or embarrassed, but I did all my legal research using Google. The only paid service I used was Pacer, and that only for 2-3 cases. I bought one case from LexisNexis (Pinkham v. Sara Lee, 8th US Circuit), which cost $9.00. In the end, I was awarded $19,462 in damages (and I defeated six claims against me).
I found most of what I needed at Findlaw.com, www.law.cornell.edu. Specific state cases for Minnesota were at state.mn.us/lawlibrary/. I went to a law library only one time, and they didn't have what I needed, and I never went back.
I did get advice from an attorney on legal procedure (stuff not in any book). I would have used LexisNexis or West Law if it wasn't so overpriced ($9.00 for one webpage? All because the case was too old to be on Pacer, where it would cost about 18 cents). I'm going to try out this guy's service in the future.
(a full chronology of my case is here http://www.cgstock.com/essays/vilana [cgstock.com]))
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Datamining for Lawyer Batting Averges (Score:5, Interesting)
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The main motivation for lawyers is a legally enforceable obligation to take cases that meet legal requirements of validity. Lawyers cannot just refuse cases they aren't certain to win, of the case is legally sound (eg. there's evidence they're right, there's less evidence they're wrong, there's precedent in law, they have standing to sue, it's not f
Well! (Score:2)
They should get Phoenix Wright, Ace Attorney to be the site avatar/host now that he's retired.
Volunteer Resources (Score:3, Interesting)
IANAL (Score:2, Funny)
Thank You Carl! (Score:2)
Thank you Carl Malamud for doing your part in providing public access to crucial knowledge about our laws!
Isn't that redundant? (Score:2)
Carl Malamud is an information hero (Score:2)