Laser Pointers Classed as Weapons in Australia

An anonymous reader was the first to point to an article in the Sydney Morning Herald which says that New South Wales (of which Sydney is the capital) will prohibit the possession of certain types of laser pointers, defining them as weapons, and make it an offense to carry any laser pointer "without a lawful reason." (Similar coverage at news.com.au) Western Australia apparently beat NSW to the punch, and the federal government of Australia announced earlier this month it will treat laser pointers much like firearms, which, in Australia, is really saying something. The restrictions come as a reaction to incidents (not confined to Australia) in which the lasers were trained on planes, distracting pilots.

It's only class 3 and 4 lasers

[_merlin (160982)]

They aren't banning class 1 laser pointers (won't cause eye damage) or class 2 laser pointers (your natural blink reflex should be sufficient to protect you from eye damage). They're only banning high powered class 3 and 4 laser pointers (may cause eye damage and need to use eye protection). Most laser pointers are class 2. To be honest, I think this is a good thing. The less idiots with potentially dangerous lasers, the better. A class 2 laser is good enough for most people, and if you really need a bigger one (i.e. not just to compensate for your small breasts/penis), you can get a permit.

Re:It's only class 3 and 4 lasers

[More_Cowbell (957742)]

Well, I RTFAs (the whole two paragraphs of each). It certainly seems like you've hit the nail on the head and I would have to agree - at least without having heard an argument for the other side.

That said, I would wonder a few things:
1. How hard would it be to get a permit? (For instance I have no need for (nor do I own) a class 3 or 4... but I always thought it sounded fun, and I consider myself responsible enough to own one - the same as I feel about guns.
2. Punishable by up to 14 years in jail. Um, Wtf?

Re:

[by Anonymous Coward]

1. Getting a permit is as simple as providing a practical application that you require one for.
2. All this talk about lasers being capable of bringing down planes, while serious, is at this stage theoretical. While that gives plenty of people the excuse to keep saying "see, it's harmless" right up until a plane crash is caused by it (at which stage they'll switch to "it's virtually always harmless, just like using forks!"), if you're the poor joe who manages to achieve this feat, expect a 14-year jail sente

Re:It's only class 3 and 4 lasers

[propanol (1223344)]

For people who're not up to speed on laser classifications, a level 3 laser is one that outputs between 5-500 mW and a level 4 goes beyond 500 mW. Already at 100 mW the laser is strong enough to make you blind in less than a millisecond. These laser pointers are not like the ones you'll find in common shops, these can inflict serious damage on people and should be handled with the same care as you'd handle a weapon (which they arguably could be classified as).

Re:It's only class 3 and 4 lasers

[ColaMan (37550)]

Only point it up.

I believe that's the problem they're trying to address.

Re:

[syousef (465911)]

In other words YOU don't need one so YOU think it's fine.

I own a few telescopes, and have a laser pointer. I don't use the telescopes or the pointer as much as I'd like to but now I have to go home and check if it's class 2 or 3, and then work out if I have to get rid of it if it's class 3.

Astronomy education? Who needs it! Never mind that the criminal fucks that were trying to blind pilots were using more powerful lasers, lets ban the 5mW ones as well. Oh and lets classify it as a weapon so you need to sto

I've been injured by one.

[by Anonymous Coward]

FWIW, I'm one of those who've been injured with a laser pointer. It took a momentary glance up the street after leaving a Newtown bar with friends for me to be left with a blind wiggle across my right eye, from the lower right to the upper left, running right through my fovea. I'm unable to read unless I use my left eye, because with my right there just aren't any words there. I can see the big picture, but no details. That was July 2006, and two years of partial blindness makes a hell of a difference to life. Forget watching fast paced movies and having a clue what's going on, get ready to read 1/3 the speed you used to, and forget being able to look at code and tell the difference between { and ( without using a 20 point font.

And perl... it's all but incomprehensible.. oh wait, I learned that after being blinded. I kid I kid.

The thing about the tools who use laser pointers like this is they can be so far away nobody has any idea who they are, where they are, the beam is silent, and about all you can tell is it's over-that-way-somewhere. The bouncers around that night said they'd seen a laser pointer dot bouncing over guests through the evening, but thought nothing of it.

Whether or not they should be banned is one question, but comparing them to screwdrivers, knives, or axes is being a git who doesn't turn their brain on. At least if some bastard had come at me with a knife they'd have been caught, and at the very least been beaten into a pulp by either my friends, or the bouncers.

The laser pointer tools though - anonymous, quiet, pretty much undetectable, and their weapon leaves absolutely no evidence behind of what it was apart from really fucking bright.

Re:I've been injured by one.

[by Anonymous Coward]

haha. gotta love the internet experts.

1. Yes, I did see the source of the beam. That's what killed my sight. Unfortunately, you see, when you get one straight in the eyeball you don't see some guy holding a laser pointer a few hundred feet away, you see a massive flash that feels like someone's smacked you one in the face. hard.

2. Luck of the draw. On a night of how many hundred people in a nightclub, one gets hit. Go fire a gun into a crowd of 100,000 close people. Each one has almost no chance of being hit, yet you're going to hit one.

3. Here, hold this 10 gram 60C iron ball in your hand. I see you're able to hold it with a little discomfort until you absorb its heat. Now here', stick this second 10 gram 60C iron ball in your eye. What's that, you can't see now?

Re:It's only class 3 and 4 lasers

[marcushnk (90744)]

No offense mate, but that is such a classic American response... wouldn't be a yank you ya?

You need a lic for anything larger than an air rifle over here... and you can't just carry one of them around either...

We like it that way.

Re:It's only class 3 and 4 lasers

[G-funk (22712)]

Erm, no, we don't. Speak for yourself buddy. An unarmed population is an oppressed population.

Re:It's only class 3 and 4 lasers

[Digestromath (1190577)]

No, I'm actually a Canadian. I also realise that a requiring a license for something doesn't stop it from being used illegally

What is this all for may I ask? A knee jerk reaction to a vague, potential threat? Because of a "potential to cause mass murder"? How many serial laser pointer killers have there been? In Australia? In the world?

5000$ fines for possesion of non prohibited laser by a unlicensed individual. A possible 14 years in prison for a prohibited laser.

You potentially could spend more time in jail and pay a heavier fine for a laser pointer than heroin, an unlicensed firearm or a hand grenade? That doesn't strike you as... illogical?

That would be a great news story in itself. Man's home searched, found in possession of home made high power laser pointer, gets 14 years in jail. In other news, man convicted of involuntary manslaughter to get 10, parole in 7 and half.

Re:It's only class 3 and 4 lasers

[Dahamma (304068)]

No, a classical American response would be to point out that if you own a DVD burner, you already have a more-powerful laser than many of the banned devices.

But then I guess that's the difference between a country of free people who had to earn that freedom by force, versus a country full of quavering subjects who've been taught, as a culture, that they're not to be trusted.

Yeah, which explains why it took an American to use a seemingly innocent material like ammonium nitrate fertilizer to kill 170 people in Oklahoma City.

Give me a break - you can make all of the bullshit Revolutionary analogies you want, the fact is if a US single pilot were blinded by a DVD-homebrew-laser we'd all be forced to get permits for our DVD burners. For fucks sake, every air traveler in the country has to remove their shoes because one wacko thought he could put a bomb in his loafers.

Re:It's only class 3 and 4 lasers

[moosesocks (264553)]

DOUBLE-FAIL.

ANSI (American National Standards Institute) laser classifications are not used in Australia, and are indicated by roman numerals instead of digits (eg. Class IIIa). There is no class 3a in the international system.

A 5-500mW visible HeNe laser would be classified as 3b under the international system, and can be extremely dangerous if placed in the wrong hands.
Class 3R lasers are still potentially hazardous, although consdierably less so without the proper optics. I'm not sure if Australia are considering an exemption for 3R devices....
Most "laser pointers" should fall under Class 1 and 2.

(However, you were correct in stating that most laser pointers are ANSI Class IIIa)

makes no sense

[nguy (1207026)]

These incidents are, overall, extremely rare. In-flight they are not an issue at all. Furthermore, pilots better be able to deal with them, since there are lots of other sources of bright light that may cause them to be temporarily blinded (or experience the "photic sneeze").

If lawmakers are just itching to make a new law, make it a specific law that says that it's illegal to carry a laser pointer on your person, outdoors, within 2 miles of the runway, where it could be pointed at planes taking off or landing.

Actually, it's a real problem

[caitsith01 (606117)]

There have been half a dozen or so such incidents in Australia in the last few months, including one which involved coordinated beams from multiple locations directed at the same plane.

E.g.:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/08/2211257.htm [abc.net.au]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/11/2214689.htm [abc.net.au]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/03/29/2202704.htm [abc.net.au]

As an Australian who flies quite a lot, I'm extremely happy for them to ban these things if it stops morons from blinding my pilot on final approach. The fact that there have been coordinated attacks is also evidence that it is more than an incidental problem.

The laser pointers will look harmless

[antifoidulus (807088)]

compared to the chaos that will ensue after the cats of Australia have found out what lawmakers have done with their favorite toy and rise up as one to slay them.

First they disarmed the wookies

[The Famous Druid (89404)]

and I stayed silent.

Then they disarmed the ewoks, and I stayed silent.

Then they came to disarm me, and there was no-one left to speak up.

Guns don't kill people

[OeLeWaPpErKe (412765)]

Laser pointers do !

Oblig.

[tick-tock-atona (1145909)]

Homer: A high powered laser is not a weapon, Marge, it's a tool. Like a butcher's knife or a harpoon, or... or an alligator.

What about Class 3a?

[gweihir (88907)]

I carry around a class 3A ( 5mW) laser pointer, which is perfectly legal in Europe. From Class 3B onwards, you need to be a ctrained in laser safety. Would the 3a make me a weapons carrier in Australia?

They just need a warning label

[jamesh (87723)]

They just need a warning label, like 'Warning: Do not point laser at remaining pilot'.

one of your possible futures - or an exaggeration?

[moxley (895517)]

Wow..they sure have mangled the freedoms and rights of Australians in the past 8 years. Gun rights? Gone. Now laser pointers?

It's happening everywhere. Well, let's just cut to the chase (or the future):

The US, UK, and Austrailia are combined into one giant country, locked down like a prison. Everyone is chipped, everything is monitored and tracked. You cannot own a gun or laser pointer, hell - you cannot even own a flashlight without registering it as only cops and burglers need them, and you're not a cop.

Matter of fact, you can't really own anything.

So you have applied for ownership of a car, which is a class c restricted motorized device?

Nope, don't think so Application denied - only criminals and party members use cars, they are quite potent weapons and very dangerous and since we care about keeping YOU safe above all else let me just point out some of the many uses of a 'car" -

You could run someone over-especially children.

You could use the car as a bomb and run it into government buildings, and we can't have that.

You could use it in your garage to gas yourself (that is, if we don't make it there in time to stop you once we've noticed you're spending an inordinate amount of time sitting in the garage in one place with an illegal motorized device running).

You could use it to try to leave the country; that would be unsafe, you could get in an accident or end up trying to live somewhere where there is no government to protect you, or one that won't protect you enough.

  - So you can see, that we really do care - and we are, above all else: FAIR. DNA does not lie. We genotyped you AND your children and your wife and you all show a high propensity for independent thought, distrust of authority and suseptibility to disease. You children show possible criminal tendencies with a 20% liklihood of un-societal behavior. This is why you have been given a repetitive manufacturing job in the D-5 neighborhood and why your children will be educated at the government happy child camp.

Remember, safety and security above all else; without it, and without us - you have nothing!

Re:Lawful reason

[scum-e-bag (211846)]

This is a little excessive, and I challenge the govenrment in NSW to define a lawful reason.

I can think of a logical reason (if you can call it logical).

This whole exercise is not much more than a political diversion. Sydney has some major water/traffic/infrastructure/social/political problems. Rather than deal with them and have everyone talking about how bad the public transport is to the outer suburbs (for example), get everyone talking about laser pointers!!! The lower classes lap it up. It's exactly the same tactic as the Tasmanian governments tactic to push for a state bogan-ball team in the national competition, while avoiding the more pressing issue of two deputy leaders being sacked for corruption within a very short space of time.

It's got very little to do with safety and much more to do with politics and power.

Re:Lawful reason

[by Anonymous Coward]

Thanks for the commentary Mr. Armchair Aviation Security Expert.
I am an Australia Flight Instructor rated for night flying. The fuckwits target us at least once a week around Melbourne especially on approach (Usually Essendon and Moorabbin too).
How the fuck am I suppose to fucking land when I have some asshole trying blind me? As another pilot here said (Is that you Rob?) "If I'm flying VFR and I can't fucking see then I am going I'm going to have an accident".
And what possible political purpose in your dimwit mind of yours could there be to ban high powered laser pointers? A distraction for more serious issues? Are you saying that the possibility of an aircraft crashing into built areas is not serious?

Re:Lawful reason

[ta bu shi da yu (687699)]

Flamebait? which genius modded that comment to this? I can definitely imagine that a pilot might say this, given that the United States Congressional Research Service [fas.org] found that:

These higher powered laser devices can incapacitate pilots and inflict eye injuries when viewed at closer ranges. The National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) documented two such cases in which pilots sustained eye injuries and were incapacitated
during critical phases of flight. In one of these events, the pilot experienced a burning sensation and tearing. A subsequent eye examination revealed "multiple flash burns" in the pilot's cornea. In a few other documented incidents, pilots provided safety reports indicating that injuries were sustained from exposure to laser lights. In one case, a copilot received burns on the outer coating of the eye and broken blood vessels.6 In another incident, a pilot was struck several times by a laser beam and was diagnosed as having a "burned retina." In about a dozen other cases, pilots reported short term visual impairment that did not require further medical attention.

FAA researchers have compiled a database of more than 400 incidents since 1990 in which pilots have been startled, distracted, temporarily blinded, or disoriented by laser exposure. To date no aviation accidents have been attributed to laser lights, although there have been crashes caused by similarly debilitating glare and flashblinding from natural sunlight. Flight simulator studies conducted by the FAA found that exposure to bright lasers can result in unacceptable levels of visual and operational problems, but concluded that enforcing already established limits to protect pilots from laser exposure when operating near airports provides an adequate margin of safety.

Flamebait? Sounds like he's being positively reasonable to me!

Re:Lawful reason

[Kartoffel (30238)]

Well, since it's acceptable for you to ban laser pointers on behalf of the 0.001% of users who use them inappropriately, let's also ban airplanes. Here in the US, we've had a problem with a very small portion of airplanes crashing into large buildings.

You're probably the type of driver who stares directly into oncoming headlamps at night, then bitches that it's hard to see the road. Don't stare. It's a miracle you haven't blinded yourself looking at the sun already.

Re:Lawful reason

[Muad'Dave (255648)]

As an Amateur Radio operator, I use (admittedly low power) laser pointers as point-to-point communications links. I am mindful of the exposure limits, and pre-spread the beam if necessary to comply. By using higher power, I could increase not only the distance over which the link were useful, but also the data rate for existing links.

Is that legitimate and lawful enough for you?

Re:Lawful reason

[Fizzog (600837)]

"Tell me one legitimate and lawful purpose that an ordinary person needs these types of high powered lasers?"

Green lasers (which are the ones at issue here) are used by astronomers and astronomy teachers/students to point out constellations and stars at night. The green beam is visible in air while red beams are not.

Are you telling us that astronomy should be illegal?

Needs a technological solution

[maillemaker (924053)]

Sounds to me like we need a technological solution.

If laser pointers are this dangerous simply banning them is not going to be much of a deterrent against someone who wants to use one to /really/ crash an airplane.

I wonder if some kind of coating can be applied to the windows of airliners that can reduce the intensity of laser beams without compromising pilot visibility?

Re:Lawful reason

[Technician (215283)]

How the explitive deleted am I suppose to explicitive deleted land when I have some asshole trying blind me?

Most issues is with green pointers. Have you considered picking up a pair of laser safety goggles for green lasers? Many narrow band goggles will almost completely block the wavelength so you don't even see it. Demo here;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gagEdCVgRhY [youtube.com]

They work well.

Re:

[BazilBBrush (1259370)]

This whole exercise is not much more than a political diversion. Sydney has some major water/traffic/infrastructure/social/political problems. Rather than deal with them and have everyone talking about how bad the public transport is...

Crapola to you and the previous post.

Have you seen the view out of a cockpit when a laser pointer is trained on it? A. There is none...

Pilots don't like losing their view by these things. They do have a bit of responsibility to land the big paraffin budgie with all on

Re:Lawful reason

[Hal_Porter (817932)]

I really hate idiots who play with laser pointers. The ones being banned in Australia are Class III and Class IV ones which can easily blind someone.

personally, popping balloons with the things is a lawful reason to carry :)

It seems like if it can pop balloons, it's not the sort of thing you want drunken kids playing with. My right not to be blinded trumps your right to burst balloons when drunk.

Here's what a 5mW laser looks like to a pilot.

http://www.pangolin.com/faa/laser-aircraft-animation-and-explanation.htm [pangolin.com]

Re:Lawful reason

[Spasemunki (63473)]

If we're going to ban everything that isn't safe for use by drunken children, we're not going to be left with much that's legal.

Re:

[kestasjk (933987)]

That's right! First they'll take laser pointers from stupid vandals, then they'll take away our right to free speech, then they'll enslave us and treat us like beasts of burden!

Re:Lawful reason

[Hal_Porter (817932)]

"They" won't "ban" everything that is misused by drunken children. What they will do to some extent is license things where the risk of people carrying them outweighs the benefit.

Ultra high power laser pointers are a special category - they can blind someone permanently from a distance but there is no legitimate reason to carry one in your pocket. Thus carrying them without a license should be illegal and people that break the law should be punished. The rationale for that is the otherwise kids will shine them in people's eyes either deliberately or accidentally (maybe they were aiming at balloons) permanently blind them.

From what I've read, there are people that need these things for their jobs, and they will get a license to have one and training on how to use it.

In the UK there is similar legislation recommended
http://www.liv.ac.uk/radiation/pdf/laserpointers.pdf [liv.ac.uk]
The HPA considers the professional use of a Class 1 or Class 2 laser pointer as a training aid in the workplace to be justified, and regards these Classes of laser product as being generally adequate for such use. The use of Class 3R laser pointers up to 5 mW may be justified for some applications in the workplace where the user has received adequate training.

The HPA advises that the sale of laser products to the general public for use as laser pointers should be restricted to Class 1 or Class 2 devices which should be classified in accordance with the requirements of the current British Standard and should be sold with sufficient accompanying information to enable the user to operate the product in a safe manner. Toys should be Class 1 or of such low output that they do not need to be classified.

After seeking advice from NRPB (now the Radiation Protection Division of the HPA) the Department of Trade and Industry urged Trading Standards Authorities to use their existing powers under the General Product Safety Regulations 2005 5 to remove laser pointers of a Class higher than Class 2 (as defined in the British Standard) from the general market. Such devices are too powerful for general use as laser pointers and present an unacceptable risk in the hands of the consumer because they may cause eye injury in normal reasonably foreseeable use.

Now lots of other things are potentially lethal but are mostly used legitimately. Cars for example. And at least in America guns are protected by the Second Amendment.

High power laser pointers seem to be popular with idiots who use them for tricks in an unsafe way - other posters have talked about kids zapping drivers at stop lights and TFA talks about people shining them at pilots in planes. I once went to a computer user group meeting at a pub where someone had a HeNe laser and was shining out at people on the street. Later on he actually said it would cause blindness if you looked into it. Unbelievable.

I think for that reason they should be controlled by a license. If you need one for your job, apply for a license. If not, expect a prison term if you carry one around in most countries.

Re:Lawful reason

[Eth1csGrad1ent (1175557)]

I really hate idiots who play with laser pointers.

I'm with you. I'm an Aussie and I'm fine with the law.

Recent personal experience: I was the first to pull up to a stop light on a 4-lane road, with my wife beside me and my two year old daughter in the back seat. As I put my foot on the brake approaching the intersection I suddenly suffered a complete loss of vision (As IN - WHAT THE F..K??? I CANT SEE. MY EYES? WTF IS WRONG WITH MY EYES!?!?). In the confusion I somehow managed to come to my senses enough to lock the brakes before going through the intersection.

As my eyesight returned and I sat there trying to work out what just happened, I turned to see a 15-16 year old sitting in a car beside me with his mates, laughing their arses off.

I nearly wiped out my whole family - and they thought it was the funniest thing in the world.

The problem was - at the time I had NO IDEA what was happening to me - I didnt know it was a laser pointer until afterwards. At a critical moment I blinked and my eyes didnt work - it FREAKED me out, and this wasnt even one of the lasers that they're banning.

BTW - Yes I got out of the car..and YES, I still have the laser pointer the kid used.

Re:

[Technician (215283)]

I really hate idiots who play with laser pointers. The ones being banned in Australia are Class III and Class IV ones which can easily blind someone.

I just checked my stock of laser pointers. I don't have any of the super power stuff, just common red classroom pointers. They are all class IIIa devices. Can you even buy a class II pointer? The only class II laser I could find nearby is a bar code scanner. I could see a ban on class 4 lasers and maybe IIIb, but banning IIIa, would eliminate almost all la

Re:Lawful reason

[Hal_Porter (817932)]

My right not to be blinded trumps your right to burst balloons when drunk.

No it doesn't. Your right to not be blinded can only trump someone's right to point a fucking laser pointer at your eyes.

What you are saying is equivalent to "nobody should be allowed to carry a knife because they *might* stab me with it". Pure idiocy.

If we all lived in a nice libertarian utopia full of moderately intelligent people that would work well. They could be trusted to carry a weapon but not use it unless they were under mortal danger since they wouldn't want to harm anyone or go to prison. But we don't. In Australia and the UK there are packs of chavs that dazzle drivers with lasers as they pull up to stop signs to amuse their friends. Sometimes those drivers get out of the car. Then if they're lucky they beat the shit out of the chavs, and if they're unlucky the chavs beat the shit out of them. Basically the chavs want to pick a fight with people to kill time.

When you're dealing with people like that, it's unfortunately necessary to take away people's right to carry lasers that could actually cause eye damage. And come to think of it, pretty much any weapon. The problem is that the chav scum basically have nothing to do other than pick fights with random passers by. They have absolutely no ability to see that in the long run this will land them in prison. If you let them have low power lasers they will dazzle people to try to start some drama. If you give them high power lasers they will blind someone and if you let them have knives or guns they will kill someone. In both cases they will be very surprised that they get sent to prison for life for doing this since they are too stupid to see the inevitable progression from picking fights with strangers to killing or maiming someone to serious jail time. This makes them very unlike the moderately intelligent citizens of a hypothetical libertarian utopia and that is why libertarian rules are not applied to them.

In the UK if you want to carry a knife, expect the police to ask for a good reason if they search you and find it. Which if you're a chav they will do if you hang around causing trouble. If you don't provide one, you'll get done for carrying an offensive weapon. So carrying kitchen knives is out unless you're a chef on your way to work for example. Actually, if you're chav vermin, then expect to get done for carrying anything at all that could possibly harm someone, regardless of whether you're a chef or not.

Re:Lawful reason

[MrNaz (730548)]

Will my tank full of sharks count as a "lawful reason"?

Re:While we're at it...

[by Anonymous Coward]

Lots of people were quick to jump on the "let's ban X and Y every-day items as well" bandwagon. But seriously, for what legitimate reason might someone carry around a class 3 or 4 laser? If they have a reason to have that equipment (researchers, etc), then it's considered lawful use, and the authorities won't hassle you. Why is it important that the rest of us have access to powerful lasers?

Cars are an essential tool in most peoples' lives. We realize they kill more people than lasers, but we couldn't exactly give them up. Powerful lasers serve no useful purpose in the hands of someone who doesn't depend on them for work-related reasons, and so it seems like a smart move to take them away.

Of course, I don't think this will stop anyone from trying to bring down planes. It's just like banning guns in Australia - the people who want them to cause mischief aren't inconvenienced in the slightest by the lack of legal avenues through which they can obtain one. If you want to cause trouble, the black market will ALWAYS be there.

Re:While we're at it...

[Sobrique (543255)]

When I found out that it was legal to own and buy a 300mW laser pointer, I was actually quite suprised. Those are really quite hazardous without 'sensitive' handling. No one really cares about burning through paper or popping balloons, but the 'and might blind bystanders, even with just beam scatter' is IMO a good enough reason to restrict their usage.

Unlike arcwelders, or cars, I can't think of a lot of good reasons for a high intensity laser.

Having them available to 'everyone' in my opinion vastly increases the probabilty of a random fool doing something foolish.

But then, I think the same about firearms too, except even there there's 'real' self defense possibilities.

The U.S. does already

[SuperKendall (25149)]

It's illegal to have headlights above a certain brightness level, or perhaps it's above a certain number of lights - but there are light configurations you can put on a car that will get you pulled over if you have them on for street driving.

Now it's not illegal to have said lights mounted, so that's the point where the car analogy breaks (as they always do). But it does show your point is not as ridiculous as you had thought, because having really bright beams pointed at traffic is in fact a valid safety issue.

Re:While we're at it..

[Clay Pigeon -TPF-VS- (624050)]

Oh please, big government, save us from ourselves by outlawing more things! We don't need to be personally accountable for our own actions!

Re:While we're at it..

[Black Sabbath (118110)]

It's not about saving us from ourselves. Its specifically about saving a couple of hundred other people (mainly in flying metal cylinders) from idiots who think doing this is clever. Remember, your right to flail your arms around like a madman end where my face begins.

I don't know the prevalence of this "point laser at pilot" behaviour, but assuming that its not ludicrously small (there sure have been a lot of incidents hit the news down here recently, any pilots reading /. ?), and also assuming that its well nigh impossible to find the little fuckers who are doing it, then banning laser pointers powerful enough (or with a beam coherent enough over long distances), is possibly a valid thing.

Personally, I say "meh". I can't recall the last presentation where someone actually used one as anything other than a fidget-widget.

Re:While we're at it..

[electrictroy (912290)]

But is it necessary to BAN the pointers? Punish 99.99% of the population, because of the misbehavior of a few? That seems out-of-bounds.

The more logical course would be to locate the criminal with a pointer in his hand, and then shoot him dead. Punish that ONE person, not everybody.

Re:While we're at it..

[BigDogCH (760290)]

Maybe take some of the useless "luggage screeners" and send them out to grab the laser felons.

We sealed the cockpit doors, so now they come through the windows.

Maybe we should put bigger lasers on the planes, and fire back. It shouldn't be hard to hit the person....they are giving us a beacon.

Re:While we're at it..

[GigaplexNZ (1233886)]

Fuck that shit. America in its entirety is a free speech zone. Anyone who doesn't believe that, with no exceptions or reservations, can line up so I, and the rest of us who believe in the Constitution exactly as written, can piss in your mouth.

Trying to silence the people who disagree? Sounds like a typical supporter of free speech to me.

I'd just like to point out that this article is about Australia, don't bring America into this. Not everything is about America.

Re:

[ta bu shi da yu (687699)]

If I'm driving at 110km/h down the Pacific Hwy and I lose eyesight for 5 seconds, I'm probably good as dead.

Re:

[aXis100 (690904)]

Supposedly at those sorts of instances, the laser has spread out over the windscreen and flashes the entire cockpit.

As far as I am aware, the pilots themselves have reported this so I assume they think it's bad.

Re:

[Eris13 (647245)]

Yes, there have been numerous examples of this happening: http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/11/2214689.htm [abc.net.au]

Most incidents take place on landing or takeoff. Green lasers also being notoriously good at remaining focused enough for the several hundred meters needed to completely blind a pilot at night.