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LG High-Def TVs To Stream Netflix Videos
Posted by
ScuttleMonkey
on Mon Jan 05, 2009 12:29 PM
from the moving-closer-to-real-on-demand dept.
from the moving-closer-to-real-on-demand dept.
DJAdapt writes to tell us that LG has launched a new line of high definition TVs that will be capable of streaming Netflix videos with no additional hardware. This is just another in a long line of expansions from the once DVD rental service, which has expanded to the Roku set top box, Xbox 360, PC, Mac, and Linux platforms recently. "Piping movies directly to TV sets is the natural evolution of the video streaming service, said Reed Hastings, the chief executive of Netflix. "The TV symbolizes the ultimate destination," he said. That idea -- shared by Sony Corp., which already streams feature films and TV shows directly to its Bravia televisions -- is still in its early stages. Netflix's streaming service taps a library of 12,000 titles, while the company's DVD menu numbers more than 100,000 titles. Hastings expects that gap will "definitely narrow" over time, but he noted that DVDs maintain an advantage over streaming, which is that "they are very profitable" for film studios."
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the streaming-media set-top box has decided to Open Source its software. Roku had received praise for its streaming solution, and was in the press recently for its deal with Netflix, allowing users to stream Netflix movies directly to the box.
From the article, 'Roku will release an open source version of its software by the end of the year. The CEO says he's looking for deals with content providers to stream their products through his device, and hopes to sell a bunch of them as a result.'"
[+]
Apple: Netflix Extends "Watch Instantly" To Mac Users 205 comments
CNet is reporting that Netflix has opened up its "Watch Instantly" feature to Mac users (here is Netflix's blog entry). They accomplished this by using Microsoft's Silverlight technology on both platforms, abandoning the Windows Media Player solution that had been employed in the first, Windows-only, version. Silverlight's DRM capabilities meet Netflix's needs, apparently. Netflix warns that this is beta software. Mac users can opt in here, then watch instantly with Safari or Firefox 2+, with the Silverlight plugin in place. Movie selection is somewhat limited.
[+]
Science: Interest Still High In the Netflix Algorithm Competition 77 comments
circletimessquare brings us an update to the status of the million-dollar Netflix competition to develop a better algorithm for movie recommendations. We've discussed aspects of the competition since it started two years ago, but the New York Times has a lengthy overview of where it stands now.
"The Netflix competition is still going strong, with a vibrant, competitive roster of some 30,000 programmers around the globe hard at work trying to win the prize. The Times provides a look at some of the more obsessive searchers, such as Len Bertoni, a semi-retired computer scientist near Pittsburgh who logs 20 hours a week on the problem, oftentimes with the help of his children. There's also Martin Chabbert in Montreal: 'After the kids are asleep and I've packed the lunches for school, I come down at 9 in the evening and work until 11 or 12.' The article gets into the history of the search algorithm Netflix currently uses, and explores the hot commodity called 'singular value decomposition' that serves as the basis for most of the algorithms in competition."
[+]
Netflix Comes To Tivo, AppleTV, Linux 190 comments
An anonymous reader writes "Netflix on Tivo is officially out and leaving satellite users out in the cold. Tivo announced today that if you are a subscriber to both services then you can start receiving many Netflix titles on your Tivo for no extra charge. This is only available to subscribers with TiVo HD, TiVo HD XL and TiVo Series3 DVRs. The majority of Tivo's subscribers are probably Series 2 owners and will be forced to 'upgrade' if they want this new service but it won't be that easy for those on satellite. Tivo's current model lineup does not really offer a solution for satellite subscribers. The HD and HD XL are cable only and there is no sign of the Series 3 on their site." Another reader also writes to tell us that "Linux PC and AppleTV users are about to gain the ability to stream Netflix's movies and TV shows directly to their systems. Although Netflix's instant watch service only officially supports Windows and Mac, Boxee expects to release Netflix streaming support to the Ubuntu version of its free A/V media center software within a couple of days, and says that adding Netflix streaming support to AppleTV asap is its top priority."
[+]
Roku Box Adds HD, Grows Beyond Netflix 95 comments
DeviceGuru writes "Roku has announced two free updates to its Internet-enabled Netflix movie-streaming set-top box. The initial update adds advanced compression capable of streaming HD video over average consumer broadband connections, while the second (expected during the first quarter of 2009) will add A/V streaming from sources other than Netflix (e.g. YouTube, Hulu, Comedy Central, MSNBC, etc.). Roku faces growing competition from other providers of Internet-based video-on-demand STBs, such as Blockbuster's STB, Syabas's Popcorn Hour (aka NMT), AppleTV, and others. Roku hasn't said anything specific, but perhaps it'll partner with Boxee, which already provides a popular AppleTV hack."
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...and TiVo HD (Score:5, Informative)
don't forget TiVo HD and Series 3.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
or the Xbox 360. My wife and I have using Blockbuster the last two years for our movies and our switching to Netflix because of the streaming service (just got a 360 for Christmas). The only thing we're losing is the ability to trade our mailed DVDs in at the store for real rentals. Though we didn't do that often, what's the point of going to the store when they're mailed to us anyway?
Soon it will be what's the point of going to the mailbox when I can stream it. Though the current selection is not that
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
You don't want to wait for the mail.
I have netflix, and I've been known to fo to Blockbuster and rent a movie from time to time because I require instant gratification. I have to know what happens next in the series. I've also watched my movies and then had a friend that wanted to come over and watch a movie. In this situation, I've gone to rent a movie. Waiting for the mail was not a valid option to solve my wants.
Re:...and TiVo HD (Score:5, Funny)
I found that switching to decaf is an alternative solution.
Parent
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Seems like using a few of your DVD slots for the next couple DVDs of the series would help alleviate that.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
I've been using it quite a bit on my S3 lately (most recently I've been watching Amazing Stories season 1) and I must say I really like it. It's capable of very high quality video (I get almost full quality according to their little display, it looks like HD to me).
I only have two complaints about it. The first is it seems a little buggy. At times when I finish watching something instead of going back to the Netflix menu I'll be booted back to the main TiVo menu. Most of the bugs seem to be something like
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About 'Instant Queue', it's a security feature. They want you to queue your movies by logging into your account, because they assume you might attach your neighbor's TiVo to the service, but not share your NetFlix account details with them.
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About 'Instant Queue', it's a security feature. They want you to queue your movies by logging into your account, because they assume you might attach your neighbor's TiVo to the service, but not share your NetFlix account details with them.
Sounds quite logical.
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About 'Instant Queue', it's a security feature. They want you to queue your movies by logging into your account, because they assume you might attach your neighbor's TiVo to the service, but not share your NetFlix account details with them.
This makes me think of security in general (not just this example of how NetFlix protects their own interests) and how it will apply to this arrangement.
This is the second paragraph of the fine article:
A TV that has a network connect
Bad summary, bad! (Score:2)
Linux? (Score:3, Interesting)
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In Linux I've been running a Windows VM via Sun's VirtualBox to stream netflix. Unfortunately it's not HD yet (even in native Windows), but it gets the job done. It's a bit overkill to need a VM to stream netflix, but I have to admit VirtualBox is pretty sweet.
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Re:Linux? (Score:4, Informative)
Many news articles about Netflix moving to Silverlight were titled, with "Mac and Linux" in the article title, but at that point (and still), the Silverlight version of the Watch Instantly service supports only Windows and MacOS, not Linux. Linux support was planned but no news on that yet - in theory Monolight provides Silverlight support under Linux but I wouldn't be surprised if the DRM component were missing.
Interestingly enough the Flash-based system used by CBS and Hulu has no DRM (other than some rudimentary anti-ripping features) but the studios still seem to be OK. As a result they work in Linux... Sort of. Flash under Linux has insanely high system requirements for video playback. My old desktop (which is now my HTPC) can't playback directly via the site (incredibly choppy), but if I rip the video on another machine (as I said, rudimentary anti-rip), it plays back happily in mplayer on the aforementioned Athlon XP 2800 machine.
Ripping is a pain in the butt, I wish I could just playback directly on that machine. Hulu's commercials are minimally intrusive.
Parent
MCE app please! (Score:2)
I wish Netflix would make their video streaming be integrated into Windows Media Center (and MythTV while they're at it). They already have in-browser working so it should be relatively trivial to make a plugin app. They're already spending so much money and attention on the set top boxes and now this.
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I wish they'd make the XBox360 streaming option much more robust.
Currently you're limited to one Watch It Now Queue and can only view movies on the Queue. So you can't even browse their selection for something on the XBox.
There is also no "Favorites" Section to save movies to in case you want to watch again another time.
It might be nice to have random or suggested movies displayed and ratable for you as well, right on your TV.
The Quality of video is however much better than I can get any of my other comput
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A good idea (Score:2, Insightful)
Integrating into the TV also helps sign on those folks who just aren't savvy enough to hook up DVD players or other external devices.
The reason it's integrated into the TV (Score:5, Interesting)
The TV supports the DRM scheme used. It's going to be *that much harder* to put some box in between the TV and the servers in order to capture, rip, and copy the movie.
That's why this is important. Before, TVs were just dumb display devices. Now that most have firmware instead of just solid state circuits (hell my parents TV has a bootup sound) this sort of thing is possible.
The push to having every little device do everything is that these days devices start out obeying their creators instead of their owners. Eventually many devices end up being Freed or at least placed more under consumer control, but it'll be a harder effort for consumers to hack everything all at once.
Parent
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That didn't look to me like an argument that he wanted to copy a rented film - it looked like an explanation of why it better suited the providers to do it that way.
Personally, I want my TV to be a dumb display device because I want to be able to control the "experience". I would prefer to have my own "set top box" that runs my own software, consumes services that I pay for, and outputs to whatever sort of viewing device I choose (whether this is a TV, or my stereo, or my computer screen, or a projector
DVDs (Score:5, Insightful)
but he noted that DVDs maintain an advantage over streaming, which is that "they are very profitable" for film studios
And you can hold them and touch them, resell them, and duplicate them for safekeeping, and you can play them a thousand times without having to engage a "service." They are property. How is this latest innovation any different from the old Divx?
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And you can hold them and touch them, resell them, and duplicate them for safekeeping, and you can play them a thousand times without having to engage a "service." They are property. How is this latest innovation any different from the old Divx?
Uh, what? You realize we're talking about a rental service here, right? And one that's been fairly successful? (And by that I mean actually profitable?)
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I use this service, and I love it.
I subscribe to the cheapest program they have, I get 1 DVD at a time - which with several Redbox units nearby, is really not that big of a deal.
However, I can que up 50 or so movies from my account that I 'might' want to watch on my XBox. Like, seasons 1-4 of The Office. I watch each episode when I want, no rental, no return, no hassles. The quality was about the same as watching a VHS tape player when I had 4 Mbps internet service, and improved remarkabaly when I upgrad
Re: (Score:2)
This replaces renting. Legally you can not copy or resell NetFlix disks.
Of course I wonder if anybody has studies just how many NetFlix DVDs are copied?
Re:DVDs (Score:5, Insightful)
How is this latest innovation any different from the old Divx?
Because there is no waste--no physical medium, no risk of damage before being able to watch. There is also no time limit. You can stream any title as long as it is available.
And you can hold them and touch them, resell them, and duplicate them for safekeeping, and you can play them a thousand times without having to engage a "service."
There are drawbacks to everything. Yes, you can hold and touch DVDs, which means you can lose and break them (and even with backups, you still have to be able to prove legitimate possession). You can resell them, yes, but you also have to pay a one-time fixed amount for production and higher distribution cost, as well as wait for them to arrive (or leave your home to acquire them), and buy them individually at the same price, whether you want to watch it twice or two hundred times. You can play them until you damage, sell, or lose them--but you also need a player that will break down or become obsolete.
On the other hand, with digital subscription services, you can watch a huge library of titles at any time on any compatible player (which Netflix is expanding). Sure, they also save quite a bit of money and the enjoyment of the service is dependent on the existence of both the service and Internet connectivity. Connections are insufficient to match BD quality. The library of tiles kind of sucks (much like BD!). But many of the big drawbacks are a result of newness.
Yes, streaming systems will likely always have some kind of DRM to prevent reproduction, and will require an ongoing account. But if you can play any one of tens of thousands of films on screens small and large, there's no actual need to "own" any slice of the content.
Selling limited-rights copies was a compromise to get people to pay for productions that cost more than theater sales could recoup, and where customers wanted to see films after the theater run. The studios need to run a business, the artists need money to produce their works, and consumers want to be entertained. In the 20th century, there was no real way for consumers to get value except by owning a limited-rights copy (essentially derived from a regular shareholder investment scheme, where the profit is entertainment instead of monetary profit). In the 21st century, there's no longer a need for a physical object to achieve this, and since consumers never owned any of the intellectual rights to begin with, there's no longer anything left worth "owning" for the consumer.
You're paying to bring the theater home. For the price of a DVD a month, you get access to thousands of films. You get quite a bit more, but there's no free lunch. Something's gotta give, and in this case, that's persistence of ownership. Some other system has to be created for true fair use (e.g. an online service available at public libraries that allows you to export clips of films to DRM-free digital files) and personal use (e.g. iTunes-style CD burning for mixes and syncing to portable devices).
Parent
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And you can hold them and touch them, resell them, and duplicate them for safekeeping, and you can play them a thousand times without having to engage a "service." They are property. How is this latest innovation any different from the old Divx?
It has nothing to do with the kind of morons who believe people want to buy the movies they'd rather rent.
No thank you (Score:5, Insightful)
These integrated devices are never a good idea. Go all the way back to VCR/TV combos. What do you do when the VCR breaks? Throw the whole thing out and get a new one. What do you do with this thing when you cancel netflix and get service from another provider? At the very least you'll have to get a new set top box, which you should have done at first anyway. This is just one more complex and expensive component on an already expensive and complex piece of technology.
AV components should be like UNIX tools. Do one thing and do it well. My TV should display video and that's it. If I want to stream video to it, I'll get a device that can do so. XBMC, AppleTV, whatever PVR my cable company has, etc.
Re:No thank you (Score:5, Insightful)
On the surface I agree. I think we've all used those combo devices where one part of the combo was failed.
However if my TV already has all the necessary power to do the job and all it needs is a little software, I'm all for it.
Take my TiVo Series 3. It does Amazon Unbox and Netflix streaming. It already has all the hardware it needs due to it's other purpose (DVR). There is no reason not to include the feature if people want it and the device is capable of it. If it's only an extra $50 on this TV, I'd be in (if I didn't already have my S3).
Also, don't forget, that the problem with the devices you mentioned is usually hardware going bad (like the tape mechanism). In these cases where it's all CPU and RAM they shouldn't have much of a failure rate at all, and it's not effected by use (where VCRs are more likely to fail the more they are used).
Parent
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I really don't get what you're bitching about.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Some people like to live in houses with better design sense than a 80's-chic man-cave black entertainment center tower with 12 big black ugly devices all blinking lights into the room.
While this seems a little extreme since the odds are very low that someone using this wouldn't have a DVR box (which is a better place for it), the desire to get rid of components is something I completely understand now that I have tried to live in a house that isn't decorated in "college bachelor pad chic".
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Software has bugs in it. The more software, the more bugs. Personally, I don't want to have to worry about security updates on my TV. It should be a dumb device, period. If a bug happens in software/firmware, or someone releases a virus, I'd rather replace a bricked $50 set top box than a $500 TV.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Of course, then when a new protocol comes out and the TV doesn't support it, you buy a new TV. ugh.
Codex packaging is already standardized, unless i'm totally mistaken, so there isn't anything preventing them from allowing users from installing their own. They can host some signed ones themselves, and allow users(probably after checking a 'I'm not a clueless retarded' box) to install their own. If they made it simple to reset back to only signed ones, tech support wouldn't be too rough.
Of course, there's a risk of getting malware on your TV, I suppose. Unfriendly codexs exist to some extent, and with
Buffer space? (Score:2)
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!linux (Score:2)
Boxee (as I finally garnered an invite) does not stream netflix movies on linux. It relies on Silverlight 2.0 support which is not in Moonlight. The previous stories about this were based on badly worded blogs.
but how (Score:2)
their streaming selection is somewhat skimpy... (Score:2)
(this is based on using it on my 360...)
at least in terms of "name" movies.
There is a wealth of stuff like old tv shows, documentaries, etc, but in terms of recent movies that you missed in theaters, forget it. Its not going to be there 95% of the time. You'd have better luck selecting their instant movies as a search item and hope there's something there you want to see.
In terms of video quality... its not great. I have a pretty good connection (okay, the fastest that is offered in my area in terms of D
I actually use this service ... (Score:5, Informative)
So many comments, so many people who have not tried this feature.
When the XBox 360 update came out, I was one of the first to download it. After the download, I saw the Netflix feature and decided to try the free 30 day offer. I opened my account on my PC, selected a host of movies to stream (Heros seasons 1-3, The Office seasons 1-4, Logans Run, Kelly's Heroes, ect.) and finished the setup with my XBox.
There is some buffering done, I don't know how much is buffered whether it's 3 seconds or 10 minutes - don't know. I do know that my cable ISP had my limit set at 4 Mbps, so almost every time I would watch 2 minutes, then be alerted that my cable speed had 'slowed' so the download was changing to support my lower cable speed. Usually, this wasn't really visually obvious (I have a 120" HD 1080p projector) - the picture quality was what one would expect on an over-the-air antenna. Not great, but certainly watchable.
I later upgraded to a 6 Mbps internet package, and the picture improvement did improve. Sometimes I'd say that it was comparable to a DVD, other times more like a good VHS tape. All in all, viewable by any person who doesn't want to whine about non-Blu-Ray quality.
On my screen, the picture was perfectly acceptable. I wouldn't keep Netflix around if it weren't for the streaming video. I get UNLIMITED streaming with the lowest package they offer (~$8/month). The movie selection on streaming is extensive enough that when there isn't anything to watch on my Dish - I keep myself perfectly content watching something from the 10,000 movie selection. The contents do change every couple of months - so there is always a variety of stuff to stream.
Is it better than owning the DVD? yes and no. No, the quality isn't always as good as a DVD. But, yes in that a great deal of what I watch are movies I wouldn't be interested in buying and storing. Some movies are watched simply because they are 'classics' and you need not own them. Like "Logan's Run", "Clockwork Orange", the original "Omega Man" - for me, watching them once every 'x' years is often enough.
From the article (Score:4, Insightful)
So let me get this straight. I can get a Roku for $99 that I can move between TV sets, offers more than just netflix for $100-200 less than this? I guess not having another box on my entertainment center would make my wife happy, but really what is having another box, especially as small as the Roku?
with no additional hardware.? (Score:2)
It woulg be cool if they could stream video with no additional hardware... Does the TV contain its own satellite aerial? Or does it use IP over power lines?
Meh. (Score:5, Interesting)
I just got a Roku for Xmas, and I'm quite pleased with it.
Frankly, I prefer my hardware modular. I understand the appeal of having "all in one" boxes, but if I have a DVD player, and a monitor, I'd rather they be SEPARATE (at least insofar as the separation doesn't impair quality) so I can upgrade/replace parts as needed.
And FWIW: "...Netflix's streaming service taps a library of 12,000 titles..." of which about 11,900 are truly SUCKY MOVIES.
Most of the good ones are STARZ-licensed, meaning they are only available for as long as they are up on the STARZ network, meaning a handful of months at most.
Don't get me wrong, I love my Netflix, and I really like Roku (lots of good TV stuff there), but don't for a minute think 12,000 movies means anything close to 12,000 GOOD movies you want to watch.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Personally I rarely use the Netflix streaming service. Even though I have a 5/30mbps internet service, the movies often stutter or drop frames, the playback often stops to rebuffer (usually at a lower quality level) or just simply quits, and Netflix doesn't offer 5.1 surround sound in the download stream. The movies quality is also not nearly as good as what I get from my upconverting DVD player.
Couple that with a sucky selection of titles and there just isn't any attraction. If this is the world of online
Dumb Devices (Score:4, Interesting)
Most folks I know have the ugly wooden console set that is almost 25 years old, and won't replace it until it breaks or bit the bullet on a 27"-32" when their console died. They aren't going to go out and drop $2,000 for a set that has feature X,Y,Z to have features suddenly drop because Sony or Universal decide to take their ball and go home; or have it bricked by a hack programmer trying to patch a DRM flaw before his boss fires him because Big Content is going to walk if they don't fix it.
They should work with cable/sat providers to include the software in their boxes because most folks have digital cable or satellite and need some kind of reciever box anyway, and other than the TiVo loyal; the market has proven folks would much rather rent than buy these boxes, and if bricked they can take it back to their Cable Co for a new one and let them worry about getting it fixed. I would think this would only drive acceptance of PPV purchases for those not on NetFix yet if people can be swayed from the physical media and/or physical video store habit of entertainment. This way no TVs are harmed or depreciated while those displays still work, and I can let the provider worry about getting the content to my screen... whatever that form takes or changes in the 10-20 I've got this display.
Re:Oh no, not again. (Score:5, Insightful)
Yet another bad idea in the long, sad history of bad ideas.
Why not add in a DivX player too while you're at it?
Now...if the $300 bought me a built in open source DVR and the Netflix gateway was included, I'd be interested.
Explain to me why this is a bad idea.
Netflix is about RENTING movies.
They (currently) offer their OnDemand service for as a free bonus to your rental subscription. It's better than the free OnDemand services your cable provider offers.
Until recently, their OnDemand service was only available on PCs using Silverlight. Little-by-little set-top boxes are being released to allow viewing on the TV.
Parent
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