Transportation Bill Sets Aside $45 Million For MagLev Train

tbischel tips us to news that the MagLev train project which would run from Las Vegas to Disneyland has received approval for $45 million in funding. The project has been in the planning stages for quite some time, and it was delayed further by a drafting error in a 2005 highway bill. "Derided by critics as pie in the sky, the train would use magnetic levitation technology to carry passengers from Disneyland to Las Vegas in well under two hours, traveling at speeds of up to 300 mph. It would be the first MagLev system in the U.S. The money is the largest cash infusion in the project's nearly 20-year history. It will pay for environmental studies for the first leg of the project."

Trains, US?

Trains in the US & A? Can this really be true?
Surely this must involve burning of insane amounts of petroleum somehow! Maybe the magnets are powered by petroleum?

Re:Trains, US?

Trains in the US & A? Can this really be true? Surely this must involve burning of insane amounts of petroleum somehow! Maybe the magnets are powered by petroleum?

He's a heretic. BURN HIM!

Re:Trains, US?

He's a heretic. BURN HIM!

.. with petroleum! Ahh.. that feels better.

From Vegas to Mouse-land?

It is not a train.

Its a ride.

they better check out North Haverbrook first...

Well, sir, there's nothing on earth
Like a genuine,
Bona fide,
Electrified,
Six-car
Monorail!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marge_vs._the_Monorail [wikipedia.org]

Huge construction project.. recession..

A huge construction project that would take place in during a recession/depression.. is this going to be this generation's Hoover Dam?

Well, apart from the fact a dam is actually useful, and a train between two holiday resorts during a time when people have no money to spend on holidays is all kinds of pointless.

Re:Huge construction project.. recession..

..a train between two holiday resorts during a time when people have no money to spend on holidays is all kinds of pointless.

Not at all, if it proves the technology. Ensures people are happy to use it - and paves the may for a cheap, fast, and effective mass transit to try and tempt people away from cars.

I bet the big automotive/oil firms are watching this like a hawk.

After all, who wants to drive between the cities when you can do it in a fraction of the time, cost, and in air conditioned comfort whilst reading papers, sipping tea, and chomping biscuits.

Many times in the UK I have wished we could reverse Beechings Axe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beeching_Axe [wikipedia.org]

Even more with the massive fuel price increase we have had here in the UK. The long term solution is to change demographics (get people living closer to work) and to ensure a cheap and viable mass transit alternative.

Re:Huge construction project.. recession..

Come on, this technology is well proven, there's been a testtrack running for over twenty years at Siemens in Germany, a stretch of track has been taken into production between Hamburg and someplace else (can't remember) and a line between Shanghai and Pudong airport has been running for some years now.

At the moment, it's still to expensive, and all countries/continents where passenger trains are common have extensive networks of traditional tracks ... and let's face it, the French technology in this case, the TGV, is almost as fast and runs on conventional tracks ( which, admittely, have to be purpose built for the TGV with shallower turns etc but still ).

The technology is nice, proven but at the moment there's not really a business case to be made for longer stretches of MagLev tracks.

Why Maglev? and why Vegas to Anaheim?

It would seem that Los Angeles to Las Vegas would be more population centered, thus insuring better profitability.

As far as mag-lev - why? Building a proven TGV type of track, would allow other trains to use it as well, also aiding in cost-benefit. Plan on multiple side junctions to allow the TGV type train to pass the slower trains, thus permitting dual use for freight, etc. I can't imagine the mag-lev train to be that much more efficient, since fuel cost , at those speeds, is all about fighting wind resistance, and not rolling resistance.

Re:Huge construction project.. recession..

Sorry, a $45 millions budget is not huge. In France, 300 km of a TGV lines cost exceed the 3 billion euros. (See that [wikipedia.org] in French; remember that 'milliard' in French = 1E9 = billion in English). And the LGV line is doing well. And I am not ashamed that it is funded by French taxpayers money. I wish -for American people- that the next USA administration will actually fund (with dozens of billions of US$, not dozens of millions) a better transport system in the US.

The Wonders Of Engineering

Start your day shaking hands with Mickey and in under 2 hours you can be getting a blow from Minnie! Woot Woot! Engineering has cum a long way :p

Bizarre

So a route which was cancelled because of low ridership... is getting the most expensive trainset in the country?

Maybe they should talk to the germans first

The transrapid project has had a similar length timeframe, and the only feasible implementation (munich to munich airport) was finally shot down a couple of weeks ago. Costs where double of what was originally projected. While maglev is a really cool technology, it is not as brilliant in real life due to the high costs and the competition from airtravel. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid [wikipedia.org]

Previous train route cancelled due to low useage

From the very short article

There is no train on the route--Amtrak's Desert Wind between Los Angeles and Las Vegas was canceled in 1997 because of low ridership.

This has to be a joke/troll. 45 Mil for the environmental study for a already failed train route? I don't know if I should laugh or cry.

Re:Previous train route cancelled due to low useag

45 Mil for the environmental study for a already failed train route? I don't know if I should laugh or cry.

You ain't seen nothing yet. This is a 250 mile train track [usatoday.com] - That's 400km - while the Japanese Linimo [wikipedia.org] maglev cost $100 million per km (for 9km) while the Shanghai Maglev Train [wikipedia.org] cost $1.33 billion for 30.5 km - $43 million per km.

The French LGV Est [wikipedia.org] is 300 km and cost 4 billion euros - $6 billion. $21 million a mile.

Or if you look at the British London-to-channel-tunnel rail link, it cost £5.2 billion ($10 billion) for 108 km [wikipedia.org] - $100 million a mile.

Even if economies of scale get the price down to $10 million per km the cost will be $4 billion.

Interesting Route

From a place where one makes memories with the kids, to a place where one wishes nothing remembered.

Re:Critics

Really? I am from Europe, and just have to wonder...

What about building the first Maglev between Washington and New York? What about San Francisco and Los Angeles? What about making it actually useful?

Re: "making it actually useful"

I think they are more concerned with making it actually profitable.

Re: "making it actually useful"

This is USA, home of AMTRAK. Profitable would be cause for concern. It absolutely must not provide a viable alternative to the current system. BART only runs because it is expensive and impractical. Think of the Oil Companies!

Re: "making it actually useful"

They would make a huge profit from a DC to NY train assuming it had stops in the big East Coast Cities. I grew up in Baltimore and it seems that almost everybody their worked in DC and had to drive all the way everyday. A lot of people would use it for business commutes and many college kids could use it to get home from school (UMD, GW etc) without car.

Re:Critics

I lived in Vegas 7 years. They NEED This. Even the expansion to 6 lanes between the cities was not enough. We are talking 400KM+ Of cars taillight to tailpipe on any given weekend! It's even a crazier route then VA to Washington DC.

Re:Critics

Disney land is in the LA Metro area which has a population of about 13,000,000 people while LV has a metro area of about 1,700,000 people. Most of the land between the two is desert while most of the land between DC and NYC is populated making a right of way much more difficult to obtain there. The way the summary states that it connects to Disneyland, while possibly true, is really designed to be deceptive. It would have been much more honest if it said connects to LA and LV. There exists a huge amount of both car and air traffic between the two cities. Even with the high price of gas and a recent expansion of the highway between the two cities the roads are still clogged. While I don't know if maglev is the right technology a solid case for high speed rail between LA and NV can certainly be made.

Cheers,
Greg

Infrastructure problems in the East prohibit

There is already a "high speed" train that runs between New York and Washington D.C. - the Acela Express, for a commute time of 2 hours 48 min. It is limited to a paltry 75-150 MPH (120-240 KPH) due to track conditions. Mostly the speed is limited via the existing infrastructure, the bridges, tunnels, track closeness etc. Higher speeds would necessitate reinforcement of those structures, and the overhead electrical wires to withstand higher speeds. Much of the speed inhibition is in that the train needs to tilt to navigate the sharp rail curves. Pre-existing tracks are to close together to allow for high speed cornering that would require the trains to tilt, thus preventing train collisions between regular trains, and the leaning Acela Express. Of note, there are multiple at-grade crossings on this trains route - these are rarely found on other high speed train lines for obvious reasons.

Re:Infrastructure problems in the East prohibit

Of note, there are multiple at-grade crossings on this trains route - these are rarely found on other high speed train lines for obvious reasons.

No there aren't. During the Great Depression, the Pennsylvania Railroad spent a ton of money to improve the DC-NYC Northeast Corridor to eliminate all at-grade crossings. There are a few at-grade crossings north of New York (closer to Boston, actually), but that's not the section of the line you were talking about.

Re:Critics

That's the first thing I though. High-Speed Rail [ca.gov] to San Francisco is what we really need, the current rail situation is a joke. A four hour trip from San Diego to San Francisco for under $100? Yes please!