How To Stop Piracy: Raid CD-R Moguls 289
An anonymous reader writes "In what appears to be a not-so-legal move, Mexico's equivalent of the RIAA used federal police to raid the installations of Grupo Mekong, responsible for 200 of the 400 million virgin CDs imported each year, accusing them to be "capos" of the Piracy bussiness in Mexico.
What is the rationale? Record companies buy only 20% of Mekong merchandise, so the other 80% must be going to pirates! Yeah, Never mind computer users ,independent labels or other legal uses.
You can see the article here but what amazes me is the behaviour! What will the next step be? Raid the truck companies who deliver the CDs? "
Let's take on Atmel! (Score:5, Funny)
English via google (Score:5, Informative)
Re:English via google (Score:5, Funny)
Re:English via google (Score:2, Funny)
Re:English via google (Score:2)
Re:English via google (Score:2)
Re:English via google (Score:2, Funny)
I'd like to see ... (Score:5, Funny)
Or...
"I'd like to live, just long enough, to see them put your head on a pike as a reminder to the next ten generations that some boy band music comes at too high a price. I'd like to look up into your lifeless eyes, and wave, like this..."
You may already be three parts dead (Score:2)
Quoting some classical author: "Those who fear life are already three parts dead."
The guy who is The Executioner: "I don't care if they all die. I'll be content to make them three parts dead."
Point being, the object is to strike such fear into the heart of business that even legit blank media producers will bow to the will of the content moguls, preferably by going away entirely. But, you protest, Sony sells CD blanks too! Yeah, and just wait til ONLY Sony sells CD blanks. At appropriately monopolistic prices.
While I don't think it could ever come to that (there being too much of the world that the content moguls don't and can't control) I'm sure the notion has crossed certain very small minds. Scaring or annoying legit producers out of business is a first step.
Even an idiot could see... (Score:5, Insightful)
They are giving the truck manufacturers all the ammunition they need to make trucks.
Trucks give these so-called truck companies the very tools needed to have a truck company, which provides a perfect cocktail for the CD-R retailers to get their greedy, dishonest hands on the product.
Re:Even an idiot could see... (Score:2)
tyre n a ring of rubber, usually filled with air but sometimes solid, fitted round the rim of a wheel of a road vehicle to grip the road. or US tire.
CD's not CDR's? (Score:3, Informative)
It looks more like these are CD's that have to be pressed, not CDR's useable by computer users.
Don't these CD's have to be pressed in a factory?
Anyway, it's inexcuseable, but probably something the RIAA would do too if they could get away with it.
Re:CD's not CDR's? (Score:4, Informative)
Yes, but I'm sure RIAA skillfully ignored all those COMPUTER SOFTWARE DISCS that have to be pressed.
Re:CD's not CDR's? (Score:5, Interesting)
And AOL probably presses more discs than every record label in the world combined..
Re:CD's not CDR's? (Score:5, Funny)
And AOL probably presses more discs than every record label in the world combined..
I suddenly find myself ambivalent about this whole affair.
Re:CD's not CDR's? (Score:2)
They make horrible coasters. Condensation collects on the bottom of a CD, liquid goes right through the hole, and you end up with a worse situation than you would just with the cup on the bare wood.
They make very dangerous Frisbees (TM). They have a bad uncontrollable flight, and they tend to shatter.
Re:CD's not CDR's? (Score:2, Interesting)
And I don't believe it's a matter of pressing, it'd just need to be done in an industrial burner. Something like a rackmount system that took 1 real CD and dumped out 20 copies.
I can understand them wanting to shut down things like this, but honestly, this step is going a little overboard for the need of raids. What's funny is they probably had to pull the Narcotic guys off stopping drug dealers to round up all the CDRs.
Re:CD's not CDR's? (Score:2)
That's a vile thought. People catching on that the War on Drugs is mostly a way of keeping a paramilitary militia active? Declare a War on Terror! Uh oh, those damn Christ-killing liberal media bitches are daring to ask what the actual connection is between fundamentalist Al Quada and the secular regime in Iraq. What can we demonize next?
Pirates are pretty scary, right? And Joe Sixpack hates Poindexters, and everyone that burns CD's is a Poindexter, right?
Let's have a War on Copying.
It's such a vile thought that it's almost certainly true.
Don't doubt it! (Score:2, Insightful)
Well don'tdoubt it; anything that would constitute probable cause will lead them there. Anything that is touched by the merchandise is evidence. The harsh way to look at it but now that they have access to an area they will look for anything else that might be "wrong". That is basic investigation work. Sure that is not your main focus BUT you are also told to look for anything else, so
It is nice to see that they are working with other agencies though!
You call that translation? (Score:5, Funny)
Notice the dateline is "City of Mexico." I imagine President Bush lives in the "House of White."
How long before we have an international incident because someone relied on these freebie translators? Imagine the U.S. using google to save time going through all those docs from Saddam Hussein ("My God! He's stockpiled 36,000 sticks of weaponized rancid butter!").
*
I searched for "Mekong Group" (kind of a disturbing name to Americans in light of Vietnam fighting there: "The Mekong group comprises Cambodia, Vietnam, Laos, Thailand, Myanmar and China's Yunnan province, all of which border the Mekong River.") No luck.
However, from reading the article in Spanish (and I don't speak Spanish) I get the impression that the actual allegation is that the Group knowingly sold millions of discs "off the books" and can't account for them in their invoicing. If true, the action doesn't sound so unreasonable, as it suggests they knew they were doing something fishy. "Suggests" -- who knows? But this doesn't sound like a suspicionless search, and not at all Orwellian.
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
You call that funny? (Score:4, Informative)
As for the Mekong group, with a quick search you'd find their website [grupomekong.com.mx]. Note that it's "Grupo Mekong".
News flash: Not everything is based off of English. Nor does everything get passed on to American sites.
Re:You call that translation? (Score:5, Insightful)
Nice to know your Google grepping skills are so well developed [grupomekong.com.mx]. The company, being Mexican, has a Spanish name. They are "Grupo Mekong, not "Mekong Group." Also, being a Mexican company, they are not terribly troubled by things that are "kind of a disturbing name to Americans in light of Vietnam fighting
Let's see
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
Er.... come to think of it, we already have the BSA pretty much getting away with this wrt software audits.
Ya know, DEA raids set a hideously bad example...
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
I imagine the bootleggers are better connected in the Mexican government, and that these raids are only coming from enormous foreign (American) pressure. But that in itself does not prove the raids are illegitimate; there is staggering piracy going on, with Mexico City as the epicenter; and indeed if you were going to buy a raid, wouldn't you pick an actual enemy? I suspect there was at least some grounds to question their books. But no, I don't take the Mexican gov't's credibility for granted -- or the Mexican media's.
"A cynic is a person searching for an honest man,
with a stolen lantern."
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
Being lazy, I'll answer AvitarX in this same post.. So, if you're selling large numbers of ball-peen hammers that people are using to bash in car windows so they can steal stereos, should we hope that the cops shut down your hardware store?
"No one goes from idealism to realism; there's a cynical stage inbetween." -- Sir Fred Hoyle (IIRC)
Re:You call that translation? (Score:3, Insightful)
In fact -- looks like we ought to add a new verdict: no longer will someone be merely "guilty" or "innocent". The new option, in the name of crime prevention at any cost, will be "preemptively guilty".
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
Oh, I do that, too.
a rather well-greased slope
Oh, we're already there. An implied example might be the Nichols trial [cnn.com]. Actually there it is a tougher question of constructive knowledge, or shouldn't Nichols have realized what was going on? This assumes he isn't simply lying.
Reagardless of the details of this or any case, it is existing law that you can be reponsible for a crime without pulling the trigger, whether as a conspirator, accomplice, accessory. That liability might even be just civil. This liability is not absolute, it depends on the character of your participation, what you knew, and when you knew it.
I don't know the precise rules with regard to a merchant selling something to a soon-to-be criminal. But there is the possibility in there somewhere, particularly where the merchant knows of an imminent threat to a third party. Try to think of the ugliest possible facts, like the person announces, "Sell me this gun so I can go shoot my wife waiting in the car," and so on; at some point it should feel like too much. Then it is simply a matter of drawing the line.
This sounds kind of unfair because the defendant didn't "do" anything to the victim, but a good part of the analysis is about economics not morals. It is efficient to hold the defendant to a duty of care to prevent bad acts by others to others. One common example is the "dram shop acts" holding liable bars and restaurants that serve too many drinks to someone who goes out and runs over someone. Another example is that you can be liable for leaving your keys in the car, or worse leaving the car running (which in most places is illegal, too), if someone steals the car and runs over people. Yes, technically you didn't "do it" but you certainly enabled it, and the point is the safety of society more than condemning an individual.
Here [cmu.edu] is a random hit from the web, a "sale of bullets" case that appears to me correct (I skimmed it). Note that this is a civil case, and the court basically found that the plaintiff's legal arguments might be valid but needed to be developed factually in the trial court. The court did not look at who should win, just whether the plaintiff could win under their various theories of the case.
I'm not justifying any of this so much as saying it is already the law, adn has been for many years.
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
Yeah, I know "proximate duty" (or whatever all names it goes under) is on the books, but it's all corner cases and if/maybes. I think it behooves us to try to avoid creating such tangles insofar as is practical, because otherwise it's easy for it to swing too far. Frex, if I know my neighbour is a nut, but I don't go over and nail his door shut, or fail to put up a "beware of boogey-man" sign, am I liable when some night he doesn't take his lithium, and goes forth to murder random passersby?
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
The slippery slope argument is usually excessive, such as saying that to allow the government to impose a speed limit risks that one day they will set it to zero. Sure, maybe, but there are political and in extremis constitutional checks on things going to far. I assume that at some point holding someone liable for the acts of another would violate substantive due process. Believe me this has been debated for years, perhaps most famously in Palsgraf [tec.wi.us]. Look for critiques of that one and your evening is all sewed up.
Leave Frex alone.
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
Hmmm.. aren't there some "if you see X and can help, you must help" laws on some books? I vaguely recall some case where someone got in legal shit for not calling the cops when they witnessed -- wtf was it, someone shooting someone else? something like that. You're the lawyer, YOU go look it up
I'd wonder about this Frex fellow too, except his full name is For Example
[reads Palsgraf] Argh. My brain hurts. I'm gonna sue you for negligent infliction of pain and suffering. [g]
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
Re:You call that translation? (Score:2)
The translator would for the same reason not reverse White House. However, that would be a mistake in languages where the adjective follows the noun. In Spanish, White House translates as Casa Blanca, or in French Maison Blanche. So I imagine they would hear "House of White" or a similar malapropism, because "White" literally is an adjective.
soaked in the blood of humans... (Score:2)
A Day We Can Not Forget
That's not funny, I lost an eye. . . (Score:2, Funny)
Show some sensitivity.
KFG
Where does it end? (Score:2, Insightful)
I can't type that fast but... (Score:5, Informative)
these were CD-R's
The government agency APDIF (the association protecting the intellectual property of musical recordings) raided this company,
the company says its illegal because they aren't doing anything wrong, the APDIF is using statistics similar to those used by the RIAA to substanciate their claims that Mekong is aiding the piracy industry ( leaving out all legal uses of CD-R's including data, and other legal uses), Mekong suspects that the APDIF has bribed government officials, or is in some other way in bed with them, and they are specifically attacking Mekong, the article states that there are at least 50 other CD-R importers none of which have been hassled at all, while Mekong has been interferred with 10 times in the last year.
Re:I can't type that fast but... (Score:4, Informative)
apparently at the behest of APDIF
sorry for that.
APDIF? (Score:3, Funny)
Sorry, that was a really lame joke.
Re:I can't type that fast but... (Score:4, Insightful)
I don't know what the laws in Mexico are, but generally speaking if they are anything like the U.S. (and that's likely because I *think* they have signed onto the Berne Convention), then there are far more legal uses for CD-Rs than data, including burning copyrighted music to them.
Remember that fair use allows me to take my legally purchased copyrighted music CDs, rip them to MP3 files, and then burn them to a "mix" CD. There's nothing illegal about that. Note that fair use does NOT allow me to take those same MP3s and share them with the world via a P2P network, however. (Not that that's stopping anyone.
Fair use . . . according to the RIAA? (Score:4, Informative)
Well, that is your position anyway. If you look at the Audio Home Recording Act ("AHRA") [cornell.edu], you'll see that there is an immunity to making some types of recordings. One cannot be prosecuted for making those types of recordings. However, the RIAA's position (as seen here [riaa.org]) is that CD-R drives on computers are not covered by the Audio Home Recording Act:
All this may mean, however, is that, instead of looking at the Audio Home Recording Act to see if making a personal copy is legal, one would have to look at the traditional Fair Use factors [cornell.edu]. It is very arguable that the AHRA was originally intended to prevent perfect digital copies of CDs, and an MP3 is not a perfect digital copy. In fact, one may argue that distributing MP3s is a "noncommercial use," as those who place music on Kazaa are not seeking renumeration, so are thus within the spirit (though possibly not within the letter) of the AHRA.Re:Fair use . . . according to the RIAA? (Score:2)
What, precisely, constitutes a "general computer"? Is a PVR (such as Tivo) a "general computer"? Before you answer that, remember that Tivo and many other PVRs use Linux [an operating system written for general purpose computers] as their base OS. What about a PDA? Or an MP3 playback/recording device? Or a Sony Minidisc Recorder? These things are certainly based on general purpose computing devices.
My point is that computers and consumer electronics are converging. This is a result of the natural evolution of the technology. Certainly the AHRA took into account advances in such technology?
Also, what constitutes a perfect digital copy? I think even a raw bit-by-bit copy of a CD to a CD-R can result in a slight degradation of quality (loss of data) due to differences in the media between commercial CDs and CD-Rs.
I don't think many on Slashdot would argue with me if I said I thought the RIAA was full of shit.
"Fair use" is a US legal issue (Score:2)
This is only the beginning (Score:5, Insightful)
Funny, but I think this is the same case in almost ANY country. So, while it happened in Mexico because the system could be abused pretty easily, watch out for the same thing happening in other countries soon enough.
Before this happened, I had even seen commercials stating in a pretty explicit way some phrases equivalent to: "Piracy is theft". This shows it's not only a fault in our system, but because the record companies have the money and power to push their lame propaganda, laws and the perception of the crime can be shaped fairly easily by pulling the right strings.
As every educated
You see, there is a really strong music industry in Mexico, where we have literally hundreds of "artists" that sell their overrated, overpriced crap all over the continent, and predictably, this industry is controlled by the same RIAA companies we love to hate.
In fact, these events should come as no surprise, because in countries like mine, most people can't afford to pay the equivalent to US$15 for a single disk, priced as if it were an imported item, when it could be cheaper because the price markups don't need to be as high as in other countries, where everything from labor to land costs are more expensive. People DO buy and distribute bootlegs, there ARE criminals around here, but this is not the way to handle the situation. This is just a test of RIAA's power.
Companies that want to protect their profit margins and revenue sources at the expense of the user... Where do you see this happening next?
Mark my words, this is going to happen in another country and at a much bigger scale, sooner or later.
Now, who are the real "capos"?
Re:This is only the beginning (Score:4, Interesting)
How is the same in principle? Well the thought behind it is very similar. In both cases the record industry just assumes to know what those empty cd-r's will get used for. The only difference is the choice of action taken in light of that assumption.
When you think about it the thing happening in Mexico is the more logical one. Because when the first assumption is made the more logical step is to follow up that assumption with legal measures. At least the mexican stand on cd-r's is consistent in the sense that once they view it as an illegal activity they take legal actions... The dutch RIAA on the other hand chose to demand percentages of the profits made on the cd-r's. So people who just buy a 10 pack cd-r's to backup data are also paying the record companies through those percentages. This choice may at first seem logical as well (again once the first assumption is accepted) were it not for the fact that it is inconsistant with the record companies constant fight on piracy. So on the one hand they charge people for burning cd's because there are probably copyrighted mp3's involved but on the other hand they are working to make sure that no copyrighted material even exists unless pressed on their own releases. Its like on the one hand banning guns while on the other hand demanding a percentage for every gun sold.
So at least in Mexico a wrong assumption leads to an action that can be justified by that assumption while in holland a wrong assumption leads another action which in itself cant be justified by the wrong assumption.
Ah well, this whole problem will be solved with the new copyprotected discs, wont it? hehe
Re:This is only the beginning (Score:2)
More like banning guns, yet demanding a percentage on all steel sales, as it can only be used to make guns you know (at least that's what this big pile of cash sitting in front of you says, Senator. And money's never wrong.).
Re:This is only the beginning (Score:2)
More like banning guns, yet demanding a percentage on all steel sales, as it can only be used to make guns you know . . .
Exactly. Where I work, we produce thousands of recorded CD-Rs every year (no audio, mp3s, etc., just digital data). Yet we're taxed on every blank we buy to support the RIAA because we could be doing something illegal. It's like the movie Popeye, where the tax collector wants Robin Williams to pay an "up to no good" tax. If it wasn't so insane, it would be funny.
Re:This is only the beginning (Score:2)
This also happens in the U.S.
Re:This is only the beginning (Score:4, Funny)
Re:This is only the beginning (Score:2, Interesting)
Ads with "piracy is theft" (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:This is only the beginning (Score:5, Insightful)
As every educated /.ter should know, piracy IS a crime, only it's not related to copyright infringement, but to crime on the high seas [cornell.edu]. Real piracy carries a life sentence [cornell.edu].
Re:This is only the beginning (Score:2)
This is a fact. In the early 1980's, I helped a friend bring his wedding presents from Mexico City to Austin, TX. We were in a pick-up truck with a shell cover on the bed loaded with packages. On the long way out of Mexico city (his family lived in the South of the city) we were stopped by the police. My friend was told to pay a fine for transporting so many packages without a permit -- total bullshit. My friend asked what additional fine he could pay so that the policeman would escort us out of the city (so that we would not be stopped again and have to pay another made-up penalty). After paying the equivalent of $40US, we were escorted to the Northern city limit without any more troubles. I was a bit upset over the ordeal, but I was told by my native friend that this was better than having to deal with the legal system directly.
So, this is not an urban legend. I experienced it first-hand.
Re:Ah, Mexico (Score:3, Funny)
Oh, yes. One of these days we're going to cross the Rio Grande and kick your capitalist butts.
We have elite teams of car thiefs that can take the threads and wheels off of a tank in less time than it takes to start the engine, and leave it standing on four cinder blocks. Even if the tank happens to be moving.
We have crack groups of squatters that can invade and occupy any size territory in less time than it takes you to scream "cucaracha".
Our drug dealers have more firepower than the 3rd Marine Division. And they dress better, too.
The only problem right now are our nuclear weapons, since they require a match to activate. But we're working on more advanced technology - Zippo lighters.
We're going to take back California, Arizona, Texas and New Mexico. And then we'll march up to Chicago to link up with our 2 million-strong sleeper cell there.
Be afraid, be very afraid.
Re:Ah, Mexico (Score:3, Funny)
Heh. I've always wanted to see the "missing scenes" from Independence Day where a big mothership hovers over Mexico City, and goes down under millions of beggars, window-cleaners, juggler kids and fire-eaters. And gets robbed of everything that looks shiny or valuable enough, to be sold later in Tepito.
That is, if said mothership actually finds Mexico City under all that smog...
is it possible (Score:3, Insightful)
Is it possible for the company who had its CDRs ripped off to sue the Mexican equivalent of RIAA into oblivion, i.e. to ... outbid the recording industry for justice?
Re:is it possible (Score:2)
As the world has changed, so has Mexico. After 70 years, there's another party in power (the PAN), which, if anything, is far less paternalistic but more business friendly (president Vicente Fox used to be an executive in the Mexican arm of Coca-Cola, something unheard of when the PRI was in power). So, even though Televisa's influence has waned to a certain extent, the circumstances have changed and globalization has expanded the role of the big media companies into the country with the blessing of the business-friendly government.
So, in closing, if you wanted to take anyone to court, you were screwed then and you are screwed today. But for different reasons =)
In any case, if you think the US legal system is bad, you should try Mexico. All you need is enough money to buy a judge, and you're home free. There is no trial by jury, no grand jury, no peer review, very little appeal recourse and virtually no, erm, justice. Unless you happen to be rich. Pretty much the same as the US, except that in Mexico you don't have to maintain appearances - you just pay up!
Are we hearning the whole story? (Score:4, Informative)
(btw, It probably goes without saying, but I think these kinds of laws are ridiculous. In the US taxes are collected on blank tapes, and special CD-Rs that special music-only CD burners can record onto)
Re:Are we hearning the whole story? (Score:5, Informative)
Not a single PENNY has gone to anyone except the CPCC. They havn't given any of it to anyone.
And since the levy is implemented by the government, you'd expect that we (the public) could have a look at the books... Wrong, the CPCC is more or less a private company, so they don't have to show the public what they're doing behind the scenes.
What a scam.
Re:Are we hearning the whole story? (Score:2)
Re:Are we hearning the whole story? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:A difference (Score:3, Informative)
Read this:
http://neil.eton.ca/copylevy.shtml
The levy is set to increase on Jan. 2003
CDRs - 53 cents / disc
Hard Drives on portable MP3 players - $ 21.00 / GB !!! 21 dollars!
They are also going to institute levys against removable and non-removable memory cards.
This is hardly 'a few cents per CD'
Re:A difference (Score:2)
Damn! So my iPod would have cost over $1000 (Canadian).
The worst part is that they probably will tax it based on the marketing Gigabyte, instead of the Real Gigabyte...
Re:A difference (Score:2)
Interesting category:
"CD-Rs and CD-RWs (100 megabytes or more in capacity"
Are there any of these with less than 100MB capacity? 8cm CDs are around 150MB
The thing I question about the page is that it appears to not have been updated since late spring, specifically, I see no update since 2002 March 31, the amounts listed are proposed and the page has no indication saying that it has been enacted.
Comment removed (Score:5, Funny)
Re:What about the trees? (Score:2)
To add insult to injury the tree next to our house tried to drop a huge branch on us the other day.
IMHO the damn things should be banned.
Re:What about the trees? (Score:4, Funny)
Never piss off the trees. Saruman learned that the hard way.
just robber baron tactics (Score:4, Insightful)
So in essence, this is just one industry association trying to do as much damage on another industry as they can. Because they know that sooner or later, it'll all come down to "what is better for the economy" or "who has the larger bottom line".
What a GREAT IDEA for law enforcement!! (Score:4, Funny)
murders (Score:2)
I think you hit on a much bigger point! They don't have to get their hands dirty investigating REAL CRIMES like murder and actual theft(carjackings, burglary, etc.), they get to use unreasonable amounts of time and public resources(the police are a public resource!) investigating copyright infringement on behalf of the extremely wealthy.
I guess we now know who the government and police force REALLY work for...
Have a translation (Score:5, Informative)
Ok, another translation by a person who kinda knows Spanish (I do fine in conversation) but I am bound to get a few things wrong where you need to know the culture. Those who know better -- please feel free to correct me. When I'm uncertain, I put the actual literally-translated Spanish word in parentheses after my guess at the best-fit (actual meaning) English word. Here goes nothing:
UEDO (Special Unit against Organized Crime) detains (roots?) head(?) pirates
They (the pirates?) say they don't know/don't care about the way that their blank disks are used.
The UEDO spent 90 days detaining (rooting?) Efrain and Rafael Solis Heredia, owners of the Mekong Group and considered by the music indistry the "heads" of record piracy, since they alone bring into Mexico about 200 of the 400 million blank disks that are imported each year.
Idelfonso, Solis Heredia, brother of those detained (rooted?), acting as proxy, announced yesterday that the next week he will denounce PGR and the Secretariat... for the "illegal" nature of a December 18th operation where the Solis brothers were detained and 7 million CDR disks were confiscated (secured?).
"This operation turned into a search, but they had no warrant, with these situations as our basis, we are performing a legal analysis to figure out what kind of charges (demands?) will be brought, in the next week we'll have it." (run-on sentence present in original Spanish, making it hard for me to figure out what he was really trying to say...)
"They (the PGR?) were requested to release them (the Solis brothers), but the PGR detained (rooted?) them so that they could start their investigations, from that comes our concern because in the style of earlier administrations (Governments?) they are trying to make up some nonexistent crime or plant something to make us guilty of something that was never found," said the lawyer.
The Solis brothers are (SIC-were?) detained during the previous investigation PGR/UEDO/397/02, since its business, which has branches in 4 parts of the country, sells blank disks to the legal record industry as well as to pirates.
According to the calculations of the APDIF (Association for the Protection of Recording/Music IP), the legitamate industry (i.e. the record industry) purchases 20 million disks per year, but that is only 10% of the 200 million that the Solis family imports and sells each year. For this reason, they are flagged as the principle instigators of piracy in Mexico.
Among the accusations he refuted (among the supposed irregularities denounced?), Ildefonso Solis noted that in the December 18th operation, among the 7 million disks confiscated were 2.8 million units that were taken for a second time, since they had already been returned since the merchandise was legal.
"60% of these disks were produced in Mexico, 20% were disks that had been seized the previous time, and 20% are disks for which we have the necessary invoices and papers, so we can't see any reason why they make these illegal seizures," he said.
In fact, Mekong's proxy (Idelfonso) presented copies of documents from the Tax Administration Service, in which is recorded the return of 2,852,523 blank CDR disks and 3 CPUs on August 27.
Solis said that it is not their problem that some of their customers are producers of unauthorized music, and accused the AMPROFON (Mexican Association of Producers of Records and Videos) and the APDIF (Association for the Protection of Record IP) of being behind the "defamations" and operations of the PGR.
"They claim that these disks can be used for illegal activities, which is something that doesn't really concern us -- we know what we are doing, but we don't know what other industries are doing."
"We know that behind them (PGR) is the AMPROFON componay, that they (AMPROFON) have turned (taken? I'm guessing the m should really be an rn, in which case "turned" is correct) them against us, as well as APDIF, because they feel it is illegal (they feel illegal?), but we only sell original blank materal, and we sell it to the industry, we don't understand the rationale behind these accusations and defamations against us," he claimed.
In addition, he asked the PGR for "talk, not repression," since he complained that the federal authorities have only acted against ("grabbed at it") the Mekong company and not against a single one of the 50 other companies -- including international companies -- that are involved with importing and selling CDR disks.
Between December 19th 2001 and December 18th 2002, there have been 10 operations and 10 visits to 10 branches and warehouses of this company that supposedly supplies half of the pirates in Mexico.
"We know that we are not the only ones, there are about 50 companies that are involved in importing disks, and among these 50 there are many international ones that have not been bothered and that are involved in the same activities as are we, I won't name names."
"We want the authorities to talk with us and we want to not have repression, the operations that are being made are totally illegal, we want there to be dialogue, that the authorities explain to us why they are doing these illegal actions," said Solis.
Re:Have a translation (Score:2)
Wow... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Wow... (Score:2)
How much worse can it get? (Score:2)
Oh for the love of rice... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Oh for the love of rice... (Score:2)
Nice Logic (Score:2, Funny)
Damn, where'd the economy go?
CDs in Mexico, a personal report (Score:4, Interesting)
Of course people don't buy their CDs from Commercial Mexicana, they buy them from the smaller music stores, whose stock is almost entirely CD-R-based, and who charge more like 30 Pesos.
When I first moved here I spent a couple of hours at a restaurant having my brain picked by Juan Carlos, a Mexican "Del-boy" (the dodgy-goods trading hero of "Only Fools and Horses"). He was interested in improving the hard drive capacity of his CD duplicating kit -- the time he had to spend each day ripping master CDs to the burner's hard drive was down-time for the burner, and so being able to hold a larger library of masters on the hard drive would reduce the number of rips he had to do each day to meet that day's orders.
I don't condone such blatant copyright infringement, but the fact is that the CD-R makers are selling to people who would not spend the equivalent on 'official' discs (when I first moved to the US CDs were half the price I'd been paying in the UK, so I probably tripled or quadrupled the number of CDs I bought, doubling the amount I spent.)
The ultimate solution for the record companies has two prongs. First, the per capita income of the target market can be raised, but that's out of their hands and is hard to do in an economy that is hampered by some degree of corruption and by import/export tariffs that are high (or worse, indeterminate -- importing goods into Mexico may be legal, but the process is very erratic, which makes it hard to establish a reliable supply-chain). Second, bring the unit price more in line with the disposable income of the target market.
Re:CDs in Mexico, a personal report (Score:2)
Isn't this the kind of thing they want region-locked discs for? If they did this now, wouldn't people start importing cheap CDs from Mexico?
Lets raid Wal-mart (Score:2)
What do you expect in a corrupt 3rd world country? (Score:2)
Mexico is in dire need of cultural reform. If its people had a stronger work ethic and a little bit of back-bone the country would be prosperous. The bullshit that is engrained into their culture is what is keeping it in poverty. Bigots will try to tell you that their situation is caused by some sort of racial or genetic inferiority. The truth is that they are blessed with as much innate ability as any other race or ethic group. If they would get their shit together and work to better their situation they would surely suceed. After all, they've noplace to go but up.
Lee
Guilt by potental (Score:2)
It's possable for a CDr maker to knowingly supply pirates that dosen't make it true.
And if a company dose suspect a costummer is a pirate do they have a responsability to take action?
Ethicly yes legally I'd hope not.
It's just to hard to legally establish suspicion. The retailler may suspect a person is a pirate for having a backwards hat or he may not know the slogon on the kids t shirt "Gotta rip em all RIAA." is a pirates slogen.
It's would put everyone in a bad position.
In a similar issue.
During the medical pot debate in california a talk show host held a mini debate between a narcotics officer and a legalisation advocate.
During the debate the narcotics officer flat out admitted he belived he should be able to search the homes of anyone who was prolegalisation becouse anyone for legalisation MUST be a drug addict.
There are occasions when people are accused of being digital criminals based on the os they use.
Re:Link is in Spanish (Score:2)
http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A
Re:Link is in Spanish (Score:2)
Good for translating words, but the syntax was atrocious.
I'd comment on the article, but I can't make sense of it... any native spanish speakers wanna translate for this poor semi-spanish-speaking gringo?
Re:Link is in Spanish (Score:5, Funny)
So YOU'RE the one!
What, you expect special treatment?
Re:Link is in Spanish (Score:2)
But per a good translation posted up above, it looks like this time the bandwagon crowd was right.
Re:Link is in Spanish (Score:2)
This is a great example of bad translations fueling wild speculation. Never mind the general unreliability of the media when it comes to the details.
Here [slashdot.org] is an interesting post by a Mexican reader, reflecting some of the translation and cultural differences. For example, he says "arraigo" doesn't translate into SWAT raid.
BTW, I can certainly understand the appeal of a cheap CD in a country where even $10 must seem exorbitant; on the other I'd expect most of the buyers are fairly well off by Mexican standards (if they're buying any number of luxury items). But even the (not wealthy) gov't loses a lot of money to piracy, because it doesn't get to tax the profits.
just cops after bribes, its Mexico (Score:4, Interesting)
This is Mexico it happens all the time. Gez I know someone who was arrested & locked up for reporting the theft of her handbag, she paid a bribe & she was out of there. Only thing was she didn't know how things worked in the 3rd World because it took 2 days of her being locked up before she put 2 & 2 together (just because a cop wants a bribe doesn't mean they'l spell things out for you)
Re:just cops after bribes, its Mexico (Score:2)
You can bad mouth the US all you want, but at least the cops are *SUPPOSED* to have a search warrant. The fourth amendment means less each day (a certain former president told his people to "find a way around it"), but the words are still on the paper.
Re:just cops after bribes, its Mexico (Score:2)
Think I am full of it? Read Unintended Consequences [amazon.com]. That book is *NOT* about terrorism, it is about true patriots (think founding fathers).
If they push too hard, they go. Period.
Re:just cops after bribes, its Mexico (Score:2)
It happened to Pinocchio (Score:2)
Gez I know someone who was arrested & locked up for reporting the theft of her handbag
So do you claim that being locked up for reporting something stolen [everything2.com] doesn't just happen to little wooden boys in fairy tales?
Re:just cops after bribes, its Mexico (Score:3, Informative)
The fact is, every system ultimately runs on grease, whether that's preferential business deals, political favours, or outright bribes.
Re:capo? (Score:2)
As in "give me some capo, baby"?
CDs in the 50's? (Plus Royalty contract example) (Score:5, Interesting)
Um, while James Russell (I think) did actually come up with the concept for what would become the CD in 1965, Sony and Philips didn't popularize the format till 1983. So, no CDs were kicked back in the 50's - 60's.
Also remember that even today, record contracts include at least a 10% "breakage" or "container: allowance off the worldwide gross prior to calculating how many rolls of pennies the artist will get, after recouping all expenses. What they do with that 10% (since CDs don't break in shipment like the shellac records for which the breakage allowance was instituted) is a mystery. Some labels actually skim 25% off the top. No need for CD kickbacks there.
Yep, 25%. You want to see just how egregious some record contracts are? The following is clipped from an actual label contract presented to the prospective band last week. All identifying brands and names have been removed:
ROYALTIES
Company shall accrue to Artist the following royalties for the sale by Company, its licensees or assigns, or long playing Albums derived from the Master Recordings against which all sums paid to Artist herein shall be recouped.
(a) With respect to records sold up at Company's or its distributor's "top line" price level in the United States, a royalty at the rate of ten percent (10%) computed on the (SRLP) list price less a 25% container deduction.
(b) With respect to each particular type of record sold in Canada and Japan (including records exported to third parties in Canada and for which Company is paid by such third parties), royalties shall accrue at Eighty Five percent (85%) the rate applicable under subparagraph 6(a).
(c) With respect to each particular type of record sold in Germany, Austria, Switzerland and the European Economic Community (including records exported to third parties for such territories and for which Company is paid by such third parties), royalties shall accrue at Sixty Five percent (65%) the rate applicable under subparagraph 6(a).
(d) With respect to each particular type of record sold for any territory throughout world not specifically mentioned in subparagraph 6(a), 6(b) and 6(c) (including records exported to third parties in such territories and for which Company is paid by such third parties), royalties shall accrue at Fifty percent (50%) the rate applicable under subparagraph 6(a).
(e) With respect to records sold at Company's or its distributor's "mid line" price level through normal trade channels, royalties shall be at Seventy Five percent (75%) the rate set forth in subparagraph 6(a).
(f) With respect to records sold at Company's or its distributor's "budget line" price level through normal trade channels, royalties shall be at Fifty percent (50%) the rate set forth in subparagraph 6(a).
(g) Sales of any Singles, Extended Play Singles and recordings in the United States which are not long playing Albums shall be paid at the rate of Ten percent (10%) computed on the (SRLP) list price less container deductions and any taxes. Sales outside the United States shall be proportionally reduced according to the formula specified in 6(b), (c) and (d) above.
(h) With respect to the licensing of the Master Recordings to third parties, including but not limited to usage such as record clubs, compilation records and synchronization usage, royalties shall be at the rate of Fifty percent (50%) of the net amount of any such fees received by Company, its licensees or assigns.
(i) No royalties whatsoever shall be payable to Artist hereunder with respect to records (i) distributed to any person or entity primarily for purposes of promotion, (ii) sold as "scrap", "overstock" or "surplus", (iii) distributed as "free goods" (limited to no more than 20% or "bonus" records).
(I'm surprised there isn't a clause about shaking the artist by the ankles on a monthly basis to get his loose change.)
Beyond that, the more common kickback to organized crime in the music business in the 50's - 60's was cash applied to payola to help the "investments" of organized crime climb the charts.
nope, it's retarded goons who cause the problems (Score:3, Insightful)
The world has tried the lock step goose stepping methods, it doesn't work, it's heinous and criminal. Real patriots have the courage to actually follow their oaths, and not just BLINDLY follow orders. A real patriot will do these things, false patriots full of bravado and lacking intelligence will follow the old ways that lead to "sieg heil" actions.
Learn from history or be destined to repeat it, you have a binary choice there.
Re:Bauxite! (Score:2, Informative)
Sharpies are for labelling your underwear when you go to camp.
Re:this must be another branch (Score:2)
Of course, there are other legal uses for most of these chemicals, but it has been known for warrants to be issued using this as one of the reasons for it. The same is true of explosives and nuclear material. If you start ordering some suspect materials, the it's fair to say that it may bring you under an element of suspicion yourself.
Re:(Meta) Typing ntilde (Score:2)
It's easier, in that instance, to use Character Map...double-click the character, copy it from the edit window to the control, and paste it wherever. You probably had to start Character Map anyway to get the character code to type in, unless you memorized it (which you might do if you use certain foreign languages frequently).
Alt-0128 yields (euro). Using a leading zero gets you a different set of characters than if you leave it out...Alt-128 produces Ç (C-cedilla). While Alt-165 produces Ñ (N-tilde), Alt-0165 produces ¥ (yen). Alt-0209 produces Ñ (N-tilde).
(IIRC, no leading zero gets you characters from the IBM-graphics set, while the leading zero uses ISO-8859-1. Also, I think the distinction between Alt-0xxx and Alt-xxx might be Win32-only, as punching Alt-0165 and Alt-165 into joe on a Linux box both produced ¥ (yen). I've put character names in parentheses in case the characters somehow get mangled. I think that the edit box in Mozilla translates IBM graphics to ISO-8859-1 as you enter them, as the box-drawing characters are all translated to their nearest ASCII equivalents. Alt-206 should produce a double-line intersection, but it shows up as + (plus) instead.)