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Strike on Iraq 4183

Posted by CmdrTaco
from the here-it-comes-folks dept.
According to CNN and various other news sources, Iraq is now under attack by the US. Here is a link to the current story running at CNN right now, but there's really not much except that it has started. CT Cruise missiles launched against "Target of Opportunity". The full assault has not begun. CT The attack was specifically intended to take out Saddam. CT Saddam appeared on iraqi TV to condemn the US, and Iraqi missiles have been fired at Kuwait.
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Strike on Iraq

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  • PsyOps (Score:4, Informative)

    by MaximumBob (97339) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:10PM (#5549790)
    The talking heads are reporting that this may or may not have been a PsyOp, saying that it was likely targeted at Iraqi leadership or command and control.

    The Iranian news agency is also reporting that there may be explosions on the peninsula near Basra. Tony Blair will be addressing the UK at 10:30 EST (3:30 AM GMT, I think).
  • prayers (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:10PM (#5549792)
    Here's hoping it'll be over quickly with minimum casualties. My prayers go out not only to the allied troops, but to the Iraqis (Assyrians, Chaldeans, Kurds and Turkmen) aswell.
  • War Pigs (Score:5, Insightful)

    by akheron01 (637033) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:11PM (#5549807) Homepage
    I just happened to be listenning to War Pigs on my Paranoid vinyl when I saw this story. If you mod this as offtopic you obviously don't know the lyrics of War Pigs.
    • Lyrics (Score:5, Informative)

      by Rayonic (462789) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:27PM (#5550037) Homepage Journal
      Black Sabbath's War Pigs
      ------------------------

      Generals gathered in their masses,
      just like witches at black masses.
      Evil minds that plot destruction,
      sorcerers of death's construction.
      In the fields the bodies burning,
      as the war machine keeps turning.
      Death and hatred to mankind,
      poisoning their brainwashed minds.
      Oh lord, yeah!

      Politicians hide themselves away.
      They only started the war.
      Why should they go out to fight?
      They leave that role to the poor, yeah.

      Time will tell on their power minds,
      making war just for fun.
      Treating people just like pawns in chess,
      wait till their judgement day comes, yeah.

      Now in darkness world stops turning,
      ashes where the bodies burning.
      No more War Pigs have the power,
      Hand of God has struck the hour.
      Day of judgement, God is calling,
      on their knees the war pigs crawling.
      Begging mercies for their sins,
      Satan, laughing, spreads his wings.
      Oh lord, yeah!
  • Inside Sites/Blogs (Score:5, Informative)

    by Davak (526912) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:15PM (#5549859) Homepage
    Other than typical news sites...

    -- Debka (Middle East News) [debka.com]
    -- Official Iraqi News [uruklink.net]
    -- Where is Read? - Iraqi Blog [blogspot.com]
    -- Kuwait Blog [qhate.com]
    -- Back to Iraq Blog [back-to-iraq.com]
    -- Iraq today [einnews.com]
    -- Warblogs.cc [warblogs.cc]
    -- Kevin Sites [kevinsites.net]
    -- Sky.com [sky.com]
    -- BCC News Live Feed [bbc.co.uk]
    -- Agonist [agonist.org]

    CBSnews also has a beautiful high detail webcam without all the crap on the bottom of the screen.
    God bless our soldiers.

    Davak
  • Waiting (Score:5, Interesting)

    by ELCarlsson (570500) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:15PM (#5549865)
    I'm in the US Air Force stationed Germany at work right now and we've been watching CNN non-stop all night. There is definatly a nervous tension in the air right now. But we're ready. I may not totally agree with Bush but I'll do the job I was trained to do.
    • by Sanity (1431) on Thursday March 20, 2003 @02:01AM (#5552581) Homepage Journal
      I am anti-war, but I sincerely hope that you, and other soldiers (US, British, *and* Iraqi) emerge unharmed.

      It requires immense bravery to fight for your country, and I have a deep respect for anyone that does, I just wish the leaders of the country for which you are fighting actually deserved your loyalty.

  • by Snagle (644973) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:15PM (#5549866)
    This is the start of somthing bad. As a British parlament member said few days ago, The weakening of the United Nations and the European Union are huge casualties to have before a bullet has been fired. This is a perfect example of why everyone hates the US. We are arrogant and feel the rules dont apply to us.
  • by freeweed (309734) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:20PM (#5549927)
    Just before 9pm est, CNN Headline News said something about a hijacked Cuban airliner being escorted by military jets into Miami. When they came back after commercial break, no mention of it.

    Another news station reported that a CNN reporter had been shot live on camera. Again, nothing.

    During Aaron Brown's chat with some Pentagon bigwig or another, you could distinctly hear laughing and clapping in the background of CNN's studios. Brown's face showed that he heard it too.

    All in all, considering how little has actually happened, it's been one hell of a weird night.
  • by Mumford (5197) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:26PM (#5550020) Homepage

    If you cannot find Osama, bomb Iraq.
    If the markets are a drama, bomb Iraq.
    If the terrorists are frisky,
    Pakistan is looking shifty,
    North Korea is too risky,
    Bomb Iraq.

    If we have no allies with us, bomb Iraq.
    If we think someone has dissed us, bomb Iraq.
    So to hell with the inspections,
    Let's look tough for the elections,
    Close your mind and take directions,
    Bomb Iraq.

    It's "pre-emptive non-aggression", bomb Iraq.
    Let's prevent this mass destruction, bomb Iraq.
    They've got weapons we can't see,
    And that's good enough for me,
    'Cos it's all the proof I need to
    Bomb Iraq.

    If you never were elected, bomb Iraq.
    If your mood is quite dejected, bomb Iraq.
    If you think Saddam's gone mad,
    With the weapons that he had,
    (And he tried to kill your dad),
    Bomb Iraq.

    If your corp'rate fraud is growin', bomb Iraq.
    If your ties to it are showin', bomb Iraq.
    If your politics are sleazy,
    And hiding that ain't easy,
    And your manhood's getting queasy,
    Bomb Iraq.

    Fall in line and follow orders, bomb Iraq.
    For our might knows not our borders, bomb Iraq.
    Disagree? We'll call it treason,
    Let's make war not love this season,
    Even if we have no reason,
    Bomb Iraq.
  • by t0qer (230538) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:37PM (#5550204) Homepage Journal
    Post a bunch of links to high tech weapons like the ABL, and the new mobile artillery we have, then I thought, is this appropriate?

    Some geek in Iraq, who just doesn't want to be involved in the fighting is sitting on his pc same as me, reading slashdot (if they're a fan) and probably see's thousands of people fleeing the streets, heading for the hills. Maybe he's just some student hoping to come here someday, but now has to face the horror of war.

    Iraq is no stranger to war, the middle east has had ongoing wars as long as the bible has been written. Before USA intervention, who was the country trying to break up fights between middle eastern neighbors? Was it the british? the french?

    I just heard a jet fly overhead, and it scares me, but that poor shmuck, who probably isn't too different than you or me, is hearing gunshots, sonic booms, and people running and screaming for cover.

    On top of all that, his leader, wouldn't hesitate to turn the world into one giant jonestown. Rumors of anthrax, smallpox are everywhere.

    If anyone is out there going through this shit right now, could you be brave please? Stay where you are and let the rest of us on slashdot know how you're doing?

    Good luck if you're out there Iraqi slashdoter. May whoever you worship watch over you and keep you safe.

    Same goes for the US troops too.
  • by billethius (543553) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:47PM (#5550403)
    I think American's conveniently forget sometimes that we have weapons of mass destruction too. What's different about us? If we force other countries to disarm, we should as well. A world with NO weapons of mass destruction would be much better off. Iraq's weapons do need to go, but so do ours.
    • Thankfully, we ARE! (Score:5, Informative)

      by evilWurst (96042) on Thursday March 20, 2003 @12:36AM (#5551855) Journal
      Our disarmament continues to this day. US biological programs were halted in, I believe, the early 70s, and all materials destroyed. Chemicals we don't have, as per the various laws of war banning them.

      Nuclear stockpiles continue to be reduced. The Treaty of Moscow, signed by Bush and Putin last summer and ratified by Congress this month, promises that another 2/3 of each nuclear stockpile be dismantled - the logical conclusion of decades of nuclear cuts.

      As long as hostile nations continue to possess (or seek) nuclear arms, the rest will have several hundred as a deterrant... but we've all come a LONG way. NATO, Russia, China... none are inclined to ever use a nuke ever again. I expect to live to see the day it's down to 200 warheads or less, here...maybe I'll be very very old, but I expect it in my lifetime.
  • by mbkkelsey (581343) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:52PM (#5550491)
    The only merit that this war has is that it will remove Saddam Hussein. It is a chance to make up for grievous past mistakes made by the United States in its foreign policy. If the Iraqi people are fully and unconditionally supported by America in the next few decades, Iraq has a chance to once again become one of the most stable and prosperious regions in the Middle East.

    On to a more cynical note. The war is only justified if it kills fewer people than would have died in the remainder of Saddam's rule. Over 150,000 Iraqis, military and civilian, died as a direct result of Allied attacks in the Gulf War [businessweek.com]. That's about how many Saddam killed himself in previous gas attacks against his own people. If this war truly is about the welfare of the Iraqi people, we have to make sure it doesn't make them suffer more than they would otherwise. And we have to be ready to follow up with massive amounts of aid. Not just food and medicine, but capital and technical expertise.

    As for the other reasons that justify the war? They are nonsense. Yes, Saddam has WMD, and yes, he has used them against civilian populations. AMERICA has WMD and AMERICA has used them against civilian populations twice - in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. We also used chemical agents in Vietnam that cause birth defects to this day.

    In the end, I think that America is very vaguely doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. This should have been done twenty years ago, and the war now doesn't even begin to make up for America's failures in the past. Maybe things will start to change (but, to be cyncial again - OF COURSE AMERICA WON'T CHANGE. America doesn't give half a shit about the rest of the world). We'll really have to wait to see who is vindicated, and who isn't.

  • by Sabalon (1684) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @10:59PM (#5550633)
    I am not against the war if it justified, but I hope that they have more information than just "he's a menace to the US". To me, that says nothing. Do they have some proof of operations Saddam is planning? Do they have proof of him funding al quida or something?

    If not, I agree with Putin - he is not a threat to the US so why go in now? I agree that the UN is pretty limp, but I think that we finally had their attention and that another month would not make a difference. By that time, maybe Chirac would have gotten off his "I am france, I have veto power...let me use it before I give it to the germans" stance.

    I stand 100% behind our troops and wish them the best of luck. We will be able to recover from whatever world opinion we get, but my biggest concern if for the general Iraqi populace. When the bombs start dropping, there will be civilian casualties. Hopefully they will remain small.

    Too bad SAS or some other team could not have gone in and just taken out who we need to take out and that is it. A few apache's and low altitude jumps in the middle of the night and who knows what we could have done.

    Best of luck to everyone. No matter where you stand on this issue, this is a dark day. War is never good.
  • by circletimessquare (444983) <circletimessquar ... m minus language> on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @11:10PM (#5550809) Homepage Journal
    i don't know how appropriate it is to slashdot this, but this guy's ability to blog is probably already somewhat sketchy due to oh, about 25 different reasons you or i can think of right now, so here it is: blogging from baghdad [blogspot.com].

    who knows? maybe we'll catch a first hand account. cross your fingers for him. please post updates if you notice a glimmer of activity.

    i found it through an msnbc.com story [msnbc.com].

    he updated the site at 5:46 AM... which is 9:46 PM EST here in the US i believe. about an hour ago at the time of this post, half an hour before president bush made his 4 minute speech.

    if you can't get to his blog, here is the top most few paragraphs right now... :: Thursday, March 20, 2003 ::

    air raid sirens in baghdad but the only sounds you can here are the anti-aircraft machine guns. will go now. :: salam 5:46 AM [+] :: ...
    It is even too late for last minute things to buy, there are too few shops open. We went again for a drive thru Baghdad's main streets. Too depressing. I have never seen Baghdad like this. Today the Ba'ath party people started taking their places in the trenches and main squares and intersections, fully armed and freshly shaven. They looked too clean and well groomed to defend anything. And the most shocking thing was the number of kids. They couldn't be older than 20, sitting in trenches sipping Miranda fizzy drinks and eating chocolate (that was at the end of our street) other places you would see them sitting bored in the sun. more cars with guns and loads of Kalashnikovs everywhere.
    The worst is seeing and feeling the city come to a halt. Nothing. No buying, no selling, no people running after buses. We drove home quickly. At least inside it did not feel so sad.
    The ultimatum ends at 4 in the morning her in Baghdad, and the big question is will the attack be at the same night or not. Stories about the first gulf war are being told for the 100th time.
    The Syrian border is now closed to Iraqis. They are being turned back. What is worse is that people wanting to go to Deyala which is in Iraq are being told to drive back to baghdad, there was a runor going around that baghdad will be "closed" no one goes in or out [check the map go from Baghdad in a N/E direction until you reach Baqubah, this is the center of Deyala governerate] people are being turned back at the borders of Baghdad city. There is a checkpoint and they will not let you pass it. there are rumors that many people have taken the path thru Deyala to go to the Iranian border. Maybe, maybe not.
    If you remember I told you a while ago that you can get 14 satellite channels sanctioned by the state, retransmitted and decoded by receivers you have to buy from a state company. This service has been suspended. Internet will follow I am sure.

  • by robson (60067) on Wednesday March 19, 2003 @11:26PM (#5551002)
    Please, in this thread more than ever, concentrate on moderating up rather than down. This issue is bound to foster a great deal of passionate discussion on all sides. If you disagree with a post in this thread, post a reply or mod up a reply that represents your point of view. This is not the time to suppress opinions we disagree with.
  • by uraj (660365) on Thursday March 20, 2003 @12:43AM (#5551908)

    I'd like to quote Bill Maher [safesearching.com] to get my point going:

    "As of this writing, the most depressing thing about war in Iraq was how easy it was to sell. Shouldn't it be a little harder than this to sell people a war? ... [and]how amazed I was that, of all the lies told by presidents in my lifetime, the one so many people couldn't get over, and which the media treats as the standard for mendacity, was: 'I did not have sexual relations with that woman.'

    "Huge, astounding lies that affected each and every one of us in very real ways: that we were winning the war in Vietnam; that we weren't trading arms for hostages, and if we were it was a soldier's duty to lie about it; that global warming and marijuana needed more study before we could consider policy changes about them; that there'd be no new taxes; that Clarence Thomas was the most qualified person a nation of 250 million could find to sit on the Supreme Court...

    "All these lies, all these giant, steaming-turd whoppers, and the one that broke the bank was 'Blow jobs aren't sex.' Wow, that's a stupid country."

    Yes it is.

    From Ted Rall [yahoo.com]: "Decades of budget cuts in education are finally yielding results, a fact confirmed by CNN's poll of March 16, which shows that an astonishing 51 percent of the public believe that Iraqi President Saddam Hussein was responsible for the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks."

    Monday night George W. Bush, our legally if not ethically elected leader stepped up in front of the world and told us that Iraq had "ties" to Al Qaeda (and thus WTC responsibility) and that he was a danger to the world, though nothing has ever been produced to prove this (But it's okay, there are some things the government doesn't need to explain fully, they need their secrets right?). Saddam was a danger to Kurds, Israelis, Iranians and Kuwiatis because our government helped gain him that power (the only thing about the Iraq-Contra affair that this country remembers is that a brave man in uniform with an honest face was grilled in front of a big mean Congressional panel).

    Afghanistan? An exit strategy was thought up as soon as we went in, and Iraq was it. This is public record. (see current Mother Jones issue). Also see the archived streaming video debate [rcn.com][scroll down] on the Christopher Hitchens Web against Mark Danner.

    Everyone involved in Bush's world going back decades has been involved in Oil. Everyone in his government holding any kind of power is involved in Oil. We now have bases spread from Kuwait to deep ex-Soviet Territory in Afghanistan and Uzbekistan.

    Bush and his Puppeteers lied to us.

    It's like we see but we don't see.

    Putting up a bumper sticker or flag is our way of getting involved. Cafeteria Managers are renaming French fries. Major newspapers editorialize that the French are pissing on the graves of D-day soldiers. Most Americans don't approve a pre-emptive war, but since Bush's Monday speech his ratings are rocketing. Look, He's doing something. We're like predators only interesting in moving things, in action, overshadowing the consequences.

    This is a stupid country.

    In response to the pithy "then why don't you just leave" argument, I say:

    Because it is the best going, and there's the logistics involved in repatriating. Also, I live on many different levels, in a community, a town, a state, a geography and ecosystem, in cyberspace. The notion of belonging to a nation is but one of many, but hardly my overarching modifier. Is America the best on its way down? Does being the freest nation on earth require colonial domination over the rest of the planet? If another country without the addiction to war and oil can offer the freedom

  • by oroshana (588230) on Thursday March 20, 2003 @01:10AM (#5552163) Journal
    I was born in Louisiana [worldatlas.com] and now I live in Virginia [worldatlas.com]. I was 3 years old and living in Tehran [worldatlas.com] when Iraq attacked. I don't remember the war as a series of news reels on TV. I remember the war as nights filled with bombs whistling down on me. I remember the war by the faces of the uncles and cousins I lost. I remember the war by the silent nights that punctuated the months. All this time I knew that I was American. I remember, when I was 5, I thought that America was going to come and help me. They weren't going to let me die.

    My parents didn't want to explain the dirty truths [gwu.edu] of the world to a little child. I had no idea that the bombs being dropped on my city were guided by America, but they were. I didn't know that the chemicals being used against my drafted uncles and cousins were provided to Iraq by America, but they were. I didn't know that my life was not as important as providing more oil for America, but I was not important. I am an American. I am an Iranian. I don't hate Iraqis. I don't hate Americans. I don't hate Saddam. I don't hate Bush. Hate is ignorance within fear. Fear is the mind killer [coker.com.au].

    But all occupied people rebel against their occupiers. No matter how wonderful they may be treated, they will rebel. Not because they hate their occupiers. Not because "they hate our freedoms" [freecannon.com] as my fearless leader so arrogantly phrased it. They will rebel because they are Iraqis, not Americans.

    Why did America support Iraq when it attacked Iran? Iran had the audacity to tell America to leave. Iran no longer wanted to be a puppet state, and Iran deserved to be punished for that. Iraq will be the same. Conquerors often cloak themselves as liberators.

    It might be easy for the average American citizen to accept that this is a "Just War." But, for someone who has been on the receiving end of a missile, this coupling of words is a mockery of logic and respect for human life.

    If you don't agree with me that is fine, but don't advocate war unless you feel so strongly that you are personally willing to run into a wall of enemy soldiers, armed with only a sword, knowing that you are going to die, and accepting it as the right thing to do. If you are not willing to do such a thing, then you do not truly believe that the fight is just.

    But all that I just wrote is pointless because the spice must flow.
  • by squared99 (466315) on Thursday March 20, 2003 @02:03AM (#5552602)
    I urge all Americans to actively seek other sources for news, than CNN. please. You may be surprised at hearing actual news instead of propaganda but this is a good thing.

    You may hear other sides, different perspectives, maybe things will start to sound really complicated, but thats how it is in the world.

    The last media you should trust is your own. No matter where you're from.

  • War is HELL (Score:5, Insightful)

    by targo (409974) <targo_t AT hotmail DOT com> on Thursday March 20, 2003 @02:26AM (#5552759) Homepage
    It makes me really sad to see a bunch of Americans eat pizza, watch TV and joke over the war. And it makes me even sadder to see comments moderated as 'Funny' on this page. Folks, you have no idea what war is about.
    In fact, no American (unless he has been in war) should express their opinions on war at all since their country has not seen a real war on its soil for a long time. My home country has suffered in quite a few wars, never willingly, and we've almost always lost because we are a small nation. We know the real meaning of war.
    We know that war is not about brave faces on a TV screen, not about hi-tech and shiny metal.
    War is about homes being destroyed, people crawling on the streets using only their arms because they have lost their legs, and children being burned alive.
    And there is absolutely no justification for that as long as there are any alternatives.
    There will be many many crimes on the soul of American government tonight.
    • Re:War is HELL (Score:5, Insightful)

      by argStyopa (232550) on Thursday March 20, 2003 @08:46AM (#5554713) Journal
      That's right, so "peace at any price" is totally justified.

      It certainly worked for Chamberlain in 1939, almost as well as it worked for the Tutsi in Rwanda. I'm sure they're delighted that the USA Administration of the time was too gutless and scared of the polls to step in and stop what was KNOWN to be happening. Ah, besides, they were all brown-skinned anyway, right?

      War is abhorrent. War is also sometimes necessary to stop a greater evil.

      If, in 1938, the US or Britain had said "hey, this new democratically-elected leader of Germany is a psychopath. Everything he says is based in hatred, he's a bully, he's disregarded, evaded, and finally ignored the Versailles disarmament restrictions. He *must* be removed." There would have been worldwide hand-wringing and worry about the 'costs of war'. Well, the final tally ended up higher.

      A modern-day Hitler wouldn't NEED millions of troops, marching armies, and years of conquest. Weapons of mass-destruction make warfare quick and devastating.

      (And before all of you roll your eyes "here's another conservative American comparing Saddam to Hitler", well yeah, I am. I'm not sure how Hitler scores higher on the totalitarian brutal genocidal dictator scale - maybe more industrially efficient, perhaps? But if Hussein ISN'T as bad as Hitler, is he an ok guy if he's only, say 0.8"Hitlers"? 0.65"Hitlers"? What's your personally acceptable level of brutal dictatorship?)
  • Damn Dupes! (Score:5, Funny)

    by paulcammish (542971) on Thursday March 20, 2003 @03:13AM (#5553022)
    Didnt this already happen a few years back? Bloody Taco and his dupes!
  • by Ed_Moyse (171820) on Thursday March 20, 2003 @05:36AM (#5553681) Homepage
    This is largely for the benefit of non-Brits, and in particular Americans. Robin Cook, the former British Foreign Secretary resigned on Tuesday saying that he could not support the war. The speech is relevant because some (including me) initially assumed that there must be something awful that they couldn't reveal, some imminent danger from Saddam that made continuing with 12 years of containment futile, that we wouldn't be going to war for the shaky, rapidly -changing reasons given to us.

    Robin Cook saw this secret intel, was not convinced, and his resignation speech is (for me) an extremely eloquent explanation of why this war is *NOT* justified, and why it has done severe and possibly irreparable damage to western relations.

    The speech is here:here [bbc.co.uk] but I've cut and pasted it below:

    This is the first time for 20 years that I have addressed the House from the back benches.

    I must confess that I had forgotten how much better the view is from here.

    None of those 20 years were more enjoyable or more rewarding than the past two, in which I have had the immense privilege of serving this House as Leader of the House, which were made all the more enjoyable, Mr Speaker, by the opportunity of working closely with you.

    It was frequently the necessity for me as Leader of the House to talk my way out of accusations that a statement had been preceded by a press interview.

    On this occasion I can say with complete confidence that no press interview has been given before this statement.

    I have chosen to address the House first on why I cannot support a war without international agreement or domestic support.

    The present Prime Minister is the most successful leader of the Labour party in my lifetime.

    I hope that he will continue to be the leader of our party, and I hope that he will continue to be successful. I have no sympathy with, and I will give no comfort to, those who want to use this crisis to displace him.

    I applaud the heroic efforts that the prime minister has made in trying to secure a second resolution.

    I do not think that anybody could have done better than the foreign secretary in working to get support for a second resolution within the Security Council.

    But the very intensity of those attempts underlines how important it was to succeed.

    Now that those attempts have failed, we cannot pretend that getting a second resolution was of no importance.

    France has been at the receiving end of bucket loads of commentary in recent days.

    It is not France alone that wants more time for inspections. Germany wants more time for inspections; Russia wants more time for inspections; indeed, at no time have we signed up even the minimum necessary to carry a second resolution.

    We delude ourselves if we think that the degree of international hostility is all the result of President Chirac.

    The reality is that Britain is being asked to embark on a war without agreement in any of the international bodies of which we are a leading partner - not NATO, not the European Union and, now, not the Security Council.

    To end up in such diplomatic weakness is a serious reverse.

    Only a year ago, we and the United States were part of a coalition against terrorism that was wider and more diverse than I would ever have imagined possible.

    History will be astonished at the diplomatic miscalculations that led so quickly to the disintegration of that powerful coalition.

    The US can afford to go it alone, but Britain is not a superpower.

    Our interests are best protected not by unilateral action but by multilateral agreement and a world order governed by rules.

    Yet tonight the international partnerships most important to us are weakened: the European Union is divided; the Security Council is in stalemate.

    Those are heavy casualties of a war in which a shot has yet to be fired.

  • Karma Burn (Score:5, Interesting)

    by SubtleNuance (184325) on Thursday March 20, 2003 @09:56AM (#5555270) Journal
    American Bombing campaigns since WWII:

    Korea 1950-53

    China 1950-53

    Guatemala 1954

    Indonesia 1958

    Cuba 1959-60

    Guatemala 1960

    Congo 1964

    Peru 1965

    Laos 1964-73

    Vietnam 1961-73

    Cambodia 1969-70

    Guatemala 1967-69

    Libya 1986

    El Salvador 1980s

    Nicaragua 1980s

    Panama 1989

    Iraq 1991-99

    Sudan 1998

    Afghanistan 1998

    Yugoslavia 1999

    Iraq 2003-????

    Does anyone have any omissions? Does anyone have a similar list that dates to the Founding of The USA? Any "non-bombing" missions?

    One further note, to Non-Americans: Im Canadian, I live on the border, I can tell you without a doubt that Americans* are COMPLETELY out of control. They are myopic and ignorant. Watching CNN is about 1% of what its like in the street. These people *REALLY* believe that it is their RIGHT to do this, that they are special in the world, that opposition is manafest 'jealousy' - they BELIEVE this tripe about "terrorists hating their Freedom"... its like a bad, surreal movie.

    Like Nazi Germnay before the invasion of Poland, Americans* are completely and absolutely drunk with Nationalism, Jingoism and Arrogance (its amazing) to the point that Im scared (literally) for the future of Canada and the world. This Iraq effort is the natural progression of American Empire, of 250 years of American history.

    If Iraq manages a retalitory strike on American Soil, they are going to start WWIII (nuke Iraq off the planet - the citizens will be all for it).

    An interesting Notice to Americans: Listen to this PLEASE and THINK ABOUT IT. [mac.com]

    *That I work with, that my wife works with and that Ive spoken to. Im not generalizing - i live in Windsor - this is the most busy border in NorthAmerica, the two cities literally live together.

  • Having seen a few criticisms from American officials regarding other nation's opposition to the war, I was reminded of a few word's Rick Mercer had to say on 'This hour has 22 minutes'. I present this not to criticize America, but in hopes of lightening the mood a little:

    On behalf of Canadians everywhere I'd like to offer an apology to the United States of America. We haven't been getting along very well recently and for that, I am truly sorry.

    I'm sorry we called George Bush a moron. He is a moron but, it wasn't nice of us to point it out. If it's any consolation, the fact that he's a moron shouldn't reflect poorly on the people of America. After all it's not like you actually elected him.

    I'm sorry about our softwood lumber. Just because we have more trees than you doesn't give us the right to sell you lumber that's cheaper and better than your own.

    I'm sorry we beat you in Olympic hockey. In our defense I guess our excuse would be that our team was much, much, much, much better than yours.

    I'm sorry we burnt down your White House during the War of 1812. I notice you've rebuilt it! It's very nice. I'm sorry about your beer. I know we had nothing to do with your beer but, we feel your pain.

    I'm sorry about our waffling on Iraq. I mean, when you're going up against a crazed dictator, you wanna have your friends by your side. I realize it took more than two years before you guys pitched in against Hitler, but that was different. Everyone knew he had weapons.

    And finally on behalf of all Canadians, I'm sorry that we're constantly apologizing for things in a passive-aggressive way which is really a thinly veiled criticism. I sincerely hope that you're not upset over this - We've seen what you do to countries you get upset with.

    Thank you.

Did you know that for the price of a 280-Z you can buy two Z-80's? -- P.J. Plauger

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