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Businesses The Almighty Buck

SONICblue Hits the Auction Block 214

turkeywrap writes "Looks like there's no hope for SONICblue, makers of ReplayTV and Rio MP3 players. An agreement with D&M holdings (parent company of audio equipment makers Denon) fell through, so now a bankruptcy court will hold an auction for both of the main business units, ReplayTV and Rio, on April 15. Glad I bought my tivo."
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SONICblue Hits the Auction Block

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  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @09:30AM (#5643691)
    Not being the U.S I have no idea, but does ReplayTV not operate on the same basis as Tivo E.g. you pay a subscription to recieve the programme data? If that's the case, what will happen to all the ReplayTV users? Would there be anyway to recieve data from an alternative source, or are they all S.O.L?
  • What if... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Quixote ( 154172 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @09:30AM (#5643694) Homepage Journal
    Glad I bought my TiVo

    What if it was the other way around, and TiVO was going under? Obviously you wouldn't be too happy (of course), but the bigger question is: will SONICBlue release the specs of their service, so that others can now provide it ? Would TiVo release these specs if they were going under? Or will the bankruptcy court treat these as trade secrets, worth some monetary value to the creditors, and prevent the release?

    I'm just wondering what the future holds for such fee-based services, where the fees are taken upfront. Will the people who forked over the $300 (or whatever) for "lifetime service" be considered creditors too? Shouldn't they be?

  • Re:Tivo (Score:3, Interesting)

    by diabloii ( 33174 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @09:52AM (#5643775) Homepage
    Comcast On Demand doesn't do any recording at all. It functions more like a PVR that can only play, pause, rewind, and fast forward. So, I don't currently see any competition from Digital Cable providers at the moment. Your point is valid about DirectTV and EchoStar though.
  • Re:I wish... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Jaegar ( 518423 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @09:56AM (#5643793)
    I wouldn't let this affect your descision too much. The Replay is still a quality piece of hardware that doesn't mess around with all the "user-friendly" features of a Tivo. Maybe I'm just of the mindset that if I want to record something, I will. I would rather not have the Tivo make an educated guess at my tastes.

    There's a few companies that are looking into purchasing Replay, one being D&M. All my experiences with them has been fine, and SonicBlue's customer support has always been a black spot on the Replays. The only problem the new owner may run into is the pending lawsuits over Commercial Advance (an awesome feature when it's working), but even if that ability has to be disabled, there's still a 30 second skip button on all the recent models.

    So, to make a long post, even longer. If I were you I'd take a hard look at both systems and figure out exactly what out of a PVR. Replay users are not going to lose service, and we tend to be a fanatical bunch. I have three myself.
  • Yet, somehow.... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by David_Bloom ( 578245 ) <slashdot@3lesson.org> on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @10:04AM (#5643829) Homepage
    Yet, somehow, they managed to get RedHerring's "Top 100 Companies Most Likely to Change the World" award [sonicblue.com] (see left column on that link).

    They're just changing the world differently now, by their absense.

    SonicBlue invented many nifty products, including, obviously, the MP3 player (invented under its former name, Diamond), the audio set top box (they made the chipset in DELL's box), and many other innovations. They'll be missed.

  • Re:TiVo (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Erasmus Darwin ( 183180 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @10:08AM (#5643850)
    "With Sonic Blue down, TIVO is next in the sights."

    I have to disagree. There's a fairly clear delination between the features that got Sonic Blue in trouble (automatic commercial skip; sharing shows with people over the internet) and the features that TiVo supports. Furthermore, TiVo's been fairly careful about both partnering with networks (through such features as the TiVo Showcase, which allows networks to advertise specific special shows) and limiting the ability of people to pull TV recordings off the device (as it's enough of a hassle that you're probably better off just using a separate TV capture card in your PC).

    The most important thing is that what the TiVo does is generally no different (or even less powerful) than that of a VCR -- at least from the perspective of avoiding advertising and sharing shows. A VCR lets you timeshift programs and then fast-forward through the advertisements. Ditto for a TiVo. In contrast, ReplayTV let you make the commercials automatically disappear. A VCR lets you record a program and then pass that single copy on to friends. A TiVo doesn't even let you do that, though you can view that copy from anywhere in the house. In contrast, ReplayTV let you send out up to ~15(?) separate copies of the show while retaining the original.

    So overall, I think you fears are unfounded. TiVo just doesn't have the risky exposure that Sonic Blue had with the Replay units. Even the suit against Sonic Blue was on shaky legal ground, so TiVo should be sitting high and dry.

    (As a minor aside, I'd like to clarify my comparison between TiVo and a VCR above. Generally, when people refer to TiVo as a better version of a VCR, I have to correct them. TiVo is better than having a VCR, a couple dozen scrap tapes, a copy of TV Guide, and a trained monkey who knows how to change the tapes and record shows. It blows the entire VCR paradigm out of the water. However, with respect to the issues at hand -- avoiding commercials in television shows supported by advertising and the sharing shows with friends -- the VCR analogy is still fairly applicable.)

  • I remember when.. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by rf0 ( 159958 ) <rghf@fsck.me.uk> on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @10:18AM (#5643893) Homepage
    I remeber buying for first Reo when it was made by Diamond Multimedia, along with the S3-Virge card. I loved it and still use it to this day. The interface was simple and worked well. Its sad to see the Reo story end like this

    Rus
  • Re:What went wrong? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by spanky1 ( 635767 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @10:23AM (#5643946)
    The hackability of TiVo is certainly awesome, but I doubt that even 5% of TiVo users hack their system. The price between the two systems has always been comparable, so I doubt that was it either. It probably boils down to marketing and the legal battles.

    I'm glad TiVo is playing it safe and not implementing features that piss off the networks (automatic commercial skip, sharing of recorded shows, etc). The ReplayTV had some great features that TiVo lacked, but it got the networks on their bad side.

    In any case, I can already rip shows off of my TiVo and burn them easily to VCD or SVCD. The only real problem is my TiVo is WiFi-enabled so a 1 hour show takes like 3 hours to transfer. 100mbit would be better but I haven't run Cat5 all over the place.
  • by splatter ( 39844 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @10:24AM (#5643954)
    "With the ReplayTV units, the service is "free", but the retail price of the units are a few hundred dollars more expensive (or at least they were when I compared prices). So even though there's no explicit subscription fee, you're essentially paying for the same thing as a TiVo with lifetime service. "

    Sorry your wrong...
    Both have the same payment options. Either a one time lifetime fee, or a monthly payment.

  • by szquirrel ( 140575 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @10:49AM (#5644138) Homepage
    Hey, what do you know. The same guy who piloted 3dfx down the toilet was at the helm when SonicBlue went tits up.

    Look, I understand that CEO is not an easy job, but how much accountability is this guy held to when investors are left holding the bag of his failures?
  • Anti-TiVo FUD (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Foosinho ( 87829 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @10:57AM (#5644219) Homepage
    In interests of full disclosure, I own a DirecTV PVR (formerly called DirecTiVo).

    The anti-suggestions bit is pure FUD. It's a zero-impact feature when on (ie, it _NEVER_ uses tuner or space that would otherwise be used by a program you specifically requested), and it can be turned off. I leave it on expressly because it's zero-impact, even tho I rarely watch suggested programs. Every once in a while I don't want to watch anything in the recorded list, and I'll find a gem in the suggestions (a movie I hadn't seen, or a syndicated rerun of Simpsons).

    That said, I _love_ my TiVo. I considered a Replay, but the TiVo was a better choice for me, since I was also getting DirecTV at the same time. I like the Replay procuct, especially all the networking capabilities. It's a shame the company is struggling.
  • Re:Too bad... (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @11:44AM (#5644558)
    I also just bought an S10. You'd better make sure you go and download the latest version of the firmware to your S10. I guess this crushes any hopes that they will continue to revise the interface and support future formats. However, while the company still exists, we can get our hands on version 1.8 of the firmware.
  • Re:I wish... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by richardtallent ( 309050 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @12:23PM (#5644832) Homepage
    Yes, the guide data protocol (RNP) has been reverse-engineered and people have been successful at retrieving guide data and setting the internal clock through some proxy tricks. Check the AVS Forum for more details. One caveat: no one is sure exactly how monthly-subscribed units (vs. lifetime) will end up reacting if/when SB's activation servers go offline. I'm sure someone will figure that out, but it is an open question for now.

    External guide data may actually be a boon for Replay users, the existing Replay guide database does not support "big-dish" systems, Canadian cable systems, PPV channels, etc., and it would be really neat to be able to tweak the channel-renumbering scheme. In addition, by running your own "guide server," you'll have infinite control over which channels appear, how the guide data is formatted and truncated for space, filtering, etc.
  • Re:Mindset (Score:4, Interesting)

    by MarkGriz ( 520778 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @12:37PM (#5644899)
    I agree. I've only had mine for a week and it's already recorded a few interesting things that I probably never would have seen otherwise.

    I've been careful to "thumbs up" on some manly programs, just so my Tivo doesn't think I'm gay ("not that there's anything wrong with that")
  • by djan ( 121552 ) on Wednesday April 02, 2003 @06:30PM (#5648107)
    TiVo --> VHS
    ReplayTV --> Beta

    We now know who won the PVR war.

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