Enterprise Getting New Aliens, Hairdos, Weapons 619
Steve Krutzler writes "The news about Enterprise's radical "new direction" for its third season is going mainstream on May 10th in TV Guide. Rick Berman reveals that the season finale will bring about major changes in the struggling Star Trek series for next year including new aliens, new weapons, new hairdos and a mission he calls a Star Trek "first."" I've felt like the show has been slipping all season, so here's hoping.
Please god, (Score:5, Insightful)
No Q
Thank goodness!!! (Score:2, Insightful)
Forget about new aliens and hairdos... (Score:5, Insightful)
But, no! (Score:4, Insightful)
I've been loving the show this season. Great characters, a focus on the kind of culture clash stories that TOS specialized in..
It sounds like they're not getting the ratings that they want, but I hope they don't change the show too much. An alien probe coming to earth which wreaks havoc? Haven't we seen [imdb.com] that [imdb.com] before?
Fire Berman! (Score:5, Insightful)
New aliens and a few hairdo's wont change the story or character dynamics which reack.
Here come the Borg! (Score:3, Insightful)
I certainly hope they are doing more than that to improve the show! Just bringing in the Borg kind of breaks the idea that Earth didn't have any major confrontation until STTNG. If an earlier Enterprise happened to encounter the Borg, I would think that some records would have existed for Pickard to to be more prepared.
-Alex
Slipping all season? (Score:5, Insightful)
Same show, rehatched ideas, visionless direction; lather rinse repeat. Bah...it's turned into a "PC our morality is always right" and your is always wrong show. Last nights episode was a good example.
What happened to entertainment, if I wanted to be taught morality, I would goto my local public school.
Fucking Trek Leadership (Score:5, Insightful)
On the other hand, last night's episode "Cogenitor" was the first episode of Enterprise I've ever seen which actually had a reasonably original story (trigendered species and a crewmember's fuck-up with cultural interference, clearly meant to establish the principles behind the future prime directive) and which didn't do a hollyood-liberal hippocritical pussy/cop/whore-out, and have the end be all preachy, with a thousand years of injustices and hatred completely reversed with a single visit and impassioned speach by the captain (are you listening, Voyager?). Kudos on that, but the episode was still dull as an old dog's balls.
Re:A Star Trek "First"? (Score:2, Insightful)
I wasn't particularly thrilled with last night's episode. And if they're bringing the Borg into the mix, then that just might cross my threshold of tolerance for how Star Trek history is being rewritten.
Ugh!
Re:Fucking Trek Leadership (Score:2, Insightful)
Usually they will let the character, Trip in this case, just plod along repeating the same dumb behavior season after season.
I kept on waiting for Archer to add "Yeah, you were wrong. And I would have made the same mistake" at the end of his speech. But no, he left him hanging high and dry.
Of course, they had to alienate themselves from that race, otherwise there would be no explanation for why the humans didn't get a shitload of the cool technology.
Re:Alien aliens (Score:3, Insightful)
The problem with doing that is that Star Trek tries to maintain a style that doesn't degrade much over the years. For example, there's very little in STNG (post season 3) that makes people wince today like Dr. Who does. That's one of the reasons that they stick with the 'bumpy head' approach. Okay, it's not so 'alienesque' but it does stand the test of time longer than other approaches, plus the actors can act with them.
I'm not saying it can't be done, but I'd be on the side of surprise if they did do that. Still though, I'd prefer it to muppets.
Re:Forget about new aliens and hairdos... (Score:5, Insightful)
Dude, if I had the power to get J. Michael Straczynski on board, I'd do it in a second.
Only thing is, he's used to working with coherent, well-planned, non-contradictory storylines. I doubt even he could save Enterprise or Trek as a whole at this point.
The idea was blown from the beginning... (Score:5, Insightful)
Only one problem, everything here feels the same as every other show. They still have transporters, they just don't use them on people much. They don't have tractor beams, but that's an excuse so they can have a cool lookin toilet plunger launcher instead. Their phasers aren't as powerful as later shows, but big whoop, they're still phasers. Same shit, different smell, music by a Ron Stweart wannabe.
A show I WOULD have watched eagerly would have been one BEFORE all this technology (save the ability to travel at warp). NO transporters, NO phasers, NO tractor beams, heck no artificial gravity even (though that could be a problem cost wise and quailty wise, unless you have rotating sections like B5, though that doesn't mesh with its own "history"). And if you think that no longer makes it Star Trek, then you really are brainwashed about that show.
Give us something different instead of the same and simply changing it a little to seem different while giving writers the exact same conventions to fall back on under different guises.
This would help.
Well, that and having decent writers that don't simply add the "alien with the cigarette burn on the forhead of the week" each episode.
Oh yeah, and water polo? Who the hell watches water polo?
Rick Berman needs to just go. (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Bold New Direction? Ask the fans!!!!! (Score:2, Insightful)
I'm with the "GET NEW WRITERS" crowd. I love star trek, having grown up on the original, and enjoyed young adulthood on TNG. I never bothered watching the latest after catching an piece of an episode while channel surfing. What a waste of 10 minutes. If you can't make me care about a character in 10 minutes, something is very wrong.
Ask the fans what they'd like to see. The new show is just trying to pander to the FOX crowd, not real SF fans.
Re:But, no! (Score:5, Insightful)
So, I may not be loving, but I'm watching. Hopefully whatever this "new direction" is, it isn't back in the direction of more decontamination gel rubdowns.
Re:But, no! (Score:2, Insightful)
All Trip did was teach a person how to read--she killed herself. He is NOT responsible for her suicide, and Archer chewing trip out is just, well, so out of character I can't stand it.
TOS would have written it off as "a tradgedy", and Kirk certainy wouldn't have blamed Checkov for trying to teach someone how to read.
Hell, they should have let her go back, but perhaps foever cloistered but able to read... or had her die from "information overload" that the casual scan couldn't account for. Or just had her kill herself, and not have %!#$#@^Ting Berman make a subtle "America is bad for thinking our culture is right" line.
Re:Here come the Borg! (Score:3, Insightful)
I can almost guarantee that that is what they are going to pull. They've been hinting at it since the first episode, what with the whole "temporal cold war" that was never refered to in any other show and all.
Re:Slipping all season? (Score:5, Insightful)
Err did you watch to the end of that episode? "Morality" caused somebody to commit suicide. Not only did this episode illustrate why the Prime Directive is more important than human morality, but it also showed (again) that the Enterprise really fucked up. It's startlingly different from STNG or Voyager where everything ends better for the good guys.
What I particularly liked about the end of this episode was the chewing Trip got over the whole situation he caused. It was evident that some serious damage was caused between Archer and his First Officer. If this carries over into future episodes, we could have a heck of a story arc.
I agree that Enterprise has been a little stale in recent episodes, but last night was a surprisingly good one. The catch is that you have to really pay attention to what's said in the end to enjoy it. Turn it off early and the whole ep is wasted.
Re:A Star Trek "First"? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Forget about new aliens and hairdos... (Score:5, Insightful)
Jason
ProfQuotes [profquotes.com]
Re:I hope they don't use Borgs! (Score:3, Insightful)
IT's as if DS9 never existed.... (Score:2, Insightful)
Funny, I thought the last few seasons of DS9 did deal with a specific threat to the very future of mankind. Does Berman want to pretend that DS9 doesn't exist?
The Romulans? DS9? (Score:1, Insightful)
But there has never been a Trek series built around a specific mission and specific stakes-in this case, the very future of mankind. Mr. Berman, you seem to be forgetting about the last 2 or 3 seasons of DS9 here. IMHO, the future of the Federation and by extension mankind was placed in peril due to the war against the Dominion. I've been trying to give you the benefit of the doubt for a long time, but you've gotta work with me here.
Re:Borg (Score:5, Insightful)
No. That ship happened before the Enterprise went back in time. The reason that the Enterprise-E was involved with repairing (not building) that ship was because the Borg Sphere attacked it.
B'sides, most of the people I've heard bitching about the continuity of Enterprise don't seem to recognize the time-line is different, even though you're pretty much beaten over the head with the Temporal Cold War that was introduced in the pilot. Either people just like to bitch or they're just plain non-observant.
"Wait a minute! They can't meet the Feringi, Picard first met the Feringi! WTF?! Damn Brannon and Berman!" -- I've seriously heard that stupid comment. They can remember a passing detail in an old ep of TNG, but they can't remember the Temporal Cold War, First Contact, or the that the NX-01 left space dock several days earlier than planned. Heh.
Okay, that rant was pretty geeky. I just find it startling that people can be beaten over the head with information and still not get it.
Re:Thank goodness!!! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:the "problem" with Enterprise... (Score:2, Insightful)
Bad science fiction is the old stories but fought with ray guns instead of colts.
Good science fiction is where the plot is intimately entwined in a scientific concept. A genuinely new story based on a hypothetical concept.
Also Enterprise is shit because its totally illogical check out http://www.firsttvdrama.com/enterprise/e1.php3 for a small sample..
Re:Borg (Score:2, Insightful)
Even if this ep bombs, there's still some potential here. (Note: I'll never forgive Voyager for pussifying the Borg.)
Excuse me? I believe ST:TNG did it first, in "I, Borg" [caltech.edu] from Season V, the Borg were well on their way to being domesticated.
Voyager had more lame episodes than good ones, but don't blame them for screwing up the Borg.
Re:the "problem" with Enterprise... (Score:5, Insightful)
Now, given that I find watching all but a handful of episodes of TOS a painful experience, that should give you some indication of how badly I think of Enterprise.
Granted, I've only watched about 8-10 episodes of this latest show, but it doesn't take more than that to see that this latest offering is dire, dire, dire.
It's not that the show predates all other Treks per se, it's just that putting it before all the others shows in the Trek universe timeline seriously limits the writers as to what they can and can't do with the characters, races and technology available to them. Putting your writers in a creative straightjacket, limiting their creative scope and presenting the viewers with a wider story that leads them somewhere that they've already been doesn't work very well - just look at the Star Wars prequels for evidence. (So that's yes to your first question; but not for the reasons that you were probably expecting.)
And it's not just that it rewrites Star Trek history on the fly (Klingons that look like TNG/DS9/Voyager versions, rather than TOS oneS, etc), rather that it does so so badly. (So that's a yes to your second question; it's not entirely faithful to the previously established Trek universe.)
But if I had to give just one reason why Enterprise sucks it would be that it's dull as dishwater. None of the characters seem to have any depth to them, and there isn't a single one that I can empathise or admire in the way that I do Data, Worf, Picard, Sisko, Odo, O'Brien, Chakotay or Spock.
Frankly, Enterprise seems like a one-dimensional show with a bunch of one-dimensional characters.
It's already oversexed... (Score:3, Insightful)
Wrong. Treat me like I'm not a walking lump of hormones. I have an intelligent brain and I like to watch intelligent shows that don't use sex as a replacement for a storyline.
The sex factor in Enterprise was already overused from episode one. "Hey, I have a great idea, let's have T'Pol strip down to her underwear, and rub lotion all over the studly guy. And we'll make it the longest scene in the show, to show off the 'smart storyline'. That's gotta be original, and it will appeal to the intelligent women in the audience."
What the hell were they thinking? How the hell can I take this show seriously when they stoop so low?
I'd rather them focus on the storyline. There are dozens of TV shows with cute girls, even some with personality, but few of the shows are worth watching.
How about some good plots with believable struggles science. Time travel? Please...
I miss Babylon 5. Granted, the characters weren't very sexy, some of the acting was cheesy, and yes the Vorlon-Shadow war had a really stupid ending, but in general it had a good, consistant storyline which kept me coming back episode after episode. I have most of Season 3 & 4 on tape, and I still watch them.
Deep Space Nine got really damn good, and it had better actors then B5.
Re:Please god, (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Borg (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Please god, (Score:2, Insightful)
Having the Klingon homeworld only 3-5 days away at Enterprise's warp 5 isn't going to mess things up?
If you believe in a Federation with some dark aspects, it would be quite possible for Starfleet to simply mark reports about, say, Q as "need to know." Perhaps Picard wasn't the only one visited by Q in TNG, leading to the information about Q becoming more available.
But this only works because Q isn't a threat to mankind (if anything, they're just observing and cheering us on...) The Borg, on the other hand...
Maybe Starfleet's headquarters get nuked in the first war, and they don't have backups, and so they lose information about early contact with the Ferengi, Borg, etc...
Of course this all pivots on whether the writers actually care about creating a world/universe that has consistancy. So far, they've shown none.
Ripping off JMS *again*? (Score:5, Insightful)
Babylon 5 had a heavy story arc. Later, Deep Space 9 developed a story arc. Babylon 5 used CGI heavily when Trek was using models. Of course Trek now uses CGI; perhaps that one was inevitable, but they probably adopted it sooner because of the example of Babylon 5.
After Babylon 5, JMS had a short-lived series called Crusade. The ship in Crusade had a limited amount of time to find a cure that would save the lives of all humans on Earth. Now we find out that Enterprise is turning into Crusade -- they will have to go and stop the Xindi super-weapon.
And new hair styles? Given that Babylon 5 was famous for its wild hair styles, I was amazed they were hyping this.
All that said -- I'll try to hope. Stopping a superweapon is closer to "Trek with phasers" than preachy episodes like "Cogenitor". I'd like to see it be fun and exciting, with far less lecturing.
But I'm afraid that next week (the Borg prequel) is going to be the "jump the shark" episode.
steveha
What "Enterprise" should have been. (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Ripping off JMS *again*? (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm a huge DS9 fan, but I find this really tough to swallow.
So did TNG. Remember the Klingons? That was spread out over several years.
Technology increases at the speed that it is researched.
God knows we never saw the "save Earth against next to impossible odds!" [google.com] plot before Crusade.
I don't really see "them" hyping this, rather reporters and Slashdot. I saw "them" casually mention it. And why shouldn't they?
I still need to consider whether I liked or hated Cogenitor, heh. But not that much different than I, Borg or The Outcast for instance. Although Enterprise took a much darker conclusion.
I really think anyone who views Enterprise as that much worse than TNG is relying on nostalgia, rather than the actually TNG episodes. I find Enterprise the most interesting Star Trek series so far by a wide margin (although comparing anything to the granddaddy of them all is apples to lemons).
Re:Fire Berman! (Score:3, Insightful)
Actually, the episode from yesterday to which you refer did something virtually unheard of in modern "Trek." The humans interfered with good intentions in the oh-very-PC way that they often do and it ended in tragedy. Not even an "in darkness there is hope" final scene. They followed it to the logical, unpleasant conclusion instead of pulling a happy ending out of their ass.
Your sarcasm is cute, but it breezes past the fact that freeing the cogenitor from the perceived oppression would have been the point in most Trek episodes, and this one took a markedly different route. While I don't think depressing episodes are in and of themselves signs of quality, if more "Enterprise" episodes had the courage to be that honest, there'd be a lot less to bitch about.
Re:*sigh* (Score:3, Insightful)
I mean, these are the same borg that fought their way to Earth in the 24th century, against 24th century weapons and defenses, then traveled back in time to the 22nd century. They kicked righteous Federation ass. Now they're being unleashed on 22nd century Enterprise? What the hell are the writers thinking?
This is the same Enterprise that has 'polarized hull plating', pulse cannons and a top speed of what? Warp 5? It's been established that they're not even a match for the Vulcans! And they're pairing them up against the Borg who can rip through 24th century shields in a couple of minutes, are nearly immune to phasers and photon torpedoes and can propel their ships at speeds well above warp 10 using transwarp?
If you want an idea of how badly this will go for the good guys, go watch the first ST:TNG borg episode again, and multiply the ass whooping that Picard and crew took by 100. It's like putting Pee Wee Herman in the ring against Mike Tyson on PCP. It's pretty much guaranteed to be short, brutal and very messy.
The only way they'll be able to hit the proverbial 'reset' button in an hour is by introducing some horrible plot device, because there is no plausible way for the crew to handle something like this on their own. Basically, the entire episode is going to go like this: (given an episode length of 47 minutes without commercials)
1) Enterprise is called to investigate (20 minutes)
2) The Borg kick Enterprise's ass. (20 minutes)
3) A miracle happens. (5 minutes)
4) Everyone lives happily ever after. (2 minutes)
Ugh. I think I'll just save my brain the agony, thank you very much. This is just another example of one of the three classic horrible sci-fi plots. There is no faster way to ruin a good story than by introducing time travel, clones or alternate dimensions. (and heaven help you if you manage to mire your audience in all three!) Yes, it is possible to do them right, but it's dreadfully easy to do them wrong...so very wrong.
The Reset Button (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm starting to wonder if the whole "Temporal Cold War" thing is just going to be a really convenient Trek Reset Button when they wind the series down/do anything substantial. Aliens from the future, Warship Enterprise, lotsa death, destruction, and mayhem--and then whoops! It was all an alternate timeline that was never supposed to happen, so the 29th century time guys put it all straight by the end of the season, if not the episode.
Enterprise is fine for dumb fun, but it could be sooo much better. I wish it was.
Re:Ripping off JMS *again*? (Score:3, Insightful)
I seriously doubt it. The cost of CGI had been dropping (and continues to do so) relative to using models. CGI was cheaper at that point then using models - for Babylon 5. For Trek CGI was still more expensive, because they already had the models.
If you were starting from scratch CGI was cheaper. If you had already built a bunch of models then models were cheaper. Trek exists solely to make money, as soon as doing CGI was cheap enough to make the change worthwhile they did it.
I guess you could argue that Babylon 5's use of CGI helped bring the price down faster.
Re:Ripping off JMS *again*? (Score:3, Insightful)
This just isn't true. Babylon 5 didn't air until 1994, at which point TNG was was in it's 7th season. TNG was using CGI nearly a decade before Babylon 5's inception. In fact the series pilot, "Encounter at Farpoint [imdb.com]", was acclaimed at a milestone in the field of television special effects, and is widely considered to be the show responsible for the CGI breakthrough in television.
Q's giant space-cargo-net might not be very impressive now, but it was CGI, and it was there.
Re:Ripping off JMS *again*? (Score:2, Insightful)
I think this is a silly thing to say. Sci-fi shows don't exist in a vacuum independent of other ones. Why are we talking as if no TV show previous to either of these had a story arc? Episodic story arcs are not some fancy invention of B5.
original? (Score:2, Insightful)
Maybe this is new to Trek, but haven't we all seen and heard this before? About dozen times?
At least B5 and JMS did with style, somehow I have a feeling that B&B will turn this into mainstreamed, preprocessed junk that Voyager was (and the current Enterprise episodes have been).
How about a real first frontier sci-fi series [fox.com]? Wagons, cattle, gunsliging captains and a interesting story? Oh that's right, you took the sky from me [fireflysupport.com]... damn Fox.
Stand-Alone? Oh dear. (Score:4, Insightful)
Ahh, right, so the DS9 Delta Quadrant stuff never happened. Mm.
This sounds *well* sucky, and goes on to fulfil a pet hate of mine which is that episodes will no longer be 'stand-alone'. Which is a pity.