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Media

Filesharing Up 10% After RIAA Threatens Users 750

Moldy-Rutabaga writes "Technews says filesharing has gone up 10% on some sites such as Grokster since the Recording Industry Association of America's announcement on June 25 that it will start tracking down and suing users of file-sharing programs. Wayne Rosso, president of Grokster, commented 'even genocidal litigation can't stop file sharers'."
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Filesharing Up 10% After RIAA Threatens Users

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  • by gilesjuk ( 604902 ) <giles@jones.zen@co@uk> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:08PM (#6377276)
    They're considering suing normal people, people who for the most part don't shoplift, don't deal drugs, don't kill people etc..

    You need to understand your market if you are to sell your product to it. With the Internet the market has changed, selling a song to the 'net generation is a lot more complex than a flashy video and radio play. This is the X factor that the recording industry hasn't really bothered to look into and I find it very interesting that one of the most successful online music sites is part of a computer company (Apple).

    In summary the record labels need to send their marketing and product development guys off to college, study the success of e-commerce and redesign their business model cus CD is after all only a storage medium.
  • A good thing? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Tinfoil ( 109794 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:08PM (#6377280) Homepage Journal
    While I am a little suprised to see the numbers up 10%, I can't say that it wasn't expected. More and more people seem to want to taunt the recording industry, they want the RIAA to come after them it seems.

    All the money they are spending on their lawyers should rather be dumped into iTunes or Rhapsodey like services. How much proof is needed that that is the way to go?

    The industry needs to face facts. The full-format physical media isn't going to sustain their business model. With todays need for instant gratification, people want to buy only what they want and they want it now.

    Removing dependance on full-length physical media will do a couple of good things. First it will force the industry and artists to put out more quality tracks instead of relying on a couple radio tracks to sell a disc made mostly of filler. Second, the consumer will no longer get stuck with a lousy disc.
  • Not it! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Davak ( 526912 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:09PM (#6377287) Homepage

    Weiss said the recording industry should lobby for special taxes on CD burners and Internet access as a way to recoup losses incurred from file sharing, an idea that Grokster's Rosso also supports. Rosso was in Washington recently to talk to lobbyists about forming a coalition of file-sharing firms.

    Interpretation:
    We don't mind the RIAA making money... just make them get it from somebody except us

    AKA, the "not it!" theory.

    Davak
  • by bajo77 ( 632115 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:09PM (#6377288)
    People generally don't respond very much to possible consequences. There is a high chance of getting a speeding ticket, yet almost everyone goes above the speed limit, often ignoring the safety of themselves and others. There's not likely much the RIAA can do to make even a slight decrease in file-sharing.
  • There are lot of people who shoplift. Why hasn't that been made legal yet, anyway?
  • by shadowbearer ( 554144 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:15PM (#6377316) Homepage Journal
    With the RIAA being in the news so much recently, is it possible that this is simply more people all of a sudden discovering that they *can* share files?

    "What? We can do that? Cool. Look, there's links in the article to this software..."

    SB
  • by Lelon ( 443322 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:16PM (#6377321) Homepage Journal

    It should be noted that this contradicts what has been reported in the main stream news, with one cable news channel reporting a 15% drop in file sharing.

    (off topic, when I'm posting a new comment to an article, slashdot should include the article on the page where I'm responding so I can reference it)
  • by Black Parrot ( 19622 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:17PM (#6377328)


    > Seriously, if enough people blatanly disobey copyright laws, if there is enough civil disobedience, it almost HAS to force a change in the law. The question, though, is how much is "enough" and do we REALLY need to go through all of the heavy handed law enforcement attempts before this happens?

    How many people do you suppose are in prison right now for smoking pot, and how long has that enforcement been going on?

    > Can't the law makers see for once, that this is what the PEOPLE want and step up to the plate to do their job?

    Most of them will take an interest exactly when they think the number of votes the current arrangement costs them will hurt worse than the number of lobbying dollars an alternative tack would cost them.

    Welcome to the lobbyocracy.

  • by garcia ( 6573 ) * on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:19PM (#6377338)
    Uhh, prohibition on alcohol is over with but drug prohibition is not.

    We spend millions and millions of dollars on the "Drug War" and millions and millions more on holding people in jail because they do/sell drugs...

    How many people smoke pot? How many states have made it a minor offense to smoke it? How many people are still being busted for it, having their cars and houses seized for buying a dime bag?

    And you think that filesharing is going to continue because people do it? Get real.
  • by Jaysyn ( 203771 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:20PM (#6377341) Homepage Journal
    Not stupid, greedy. Of course this is probably going to bite them in the ass anyhow. I'm also very surprised to see Green Day doing this, considering when "Dookie" was new you could get it for $10 at a record store here.

    I could give a shit about Linkin Park, they don't even write thier own music.

    Jaysyn
  • by Cruciform ( 42896 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:21PM (#6377348) Homepage
    Say that an album has 12 tracks. Usually only 2 or 3 of those tracks are the reason people buy the cd, since the rest is filler (in some cases good filler, in other cases crap).

    Now if you pay full price for the CD, they make more money than if you just bought the two or three good songs off iTunes.

    It makes perfect sense to them.

    The thing they need to realize is now that the option is there, people will prefer to spend 3 or 4 bucks getting the songs they want off an album rather than pay 15 for castoff songs. And if they don't learn to embrace the internet, they will be left behind by it.
  • by carpe_noctem ( 457178 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:22PM (#6377354) Homepage Journal
    I think that the difference here is that civil disobedience can change -laws-, but we're not fighting laws here. We're fighting money.
  • eDonkey vs. Kazaa (Score:3, Insightful)

    by xYoni69x ( 652510 ) <yoni.vl@gmail.com> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:30PM (#6377392) Journal
    If any, definitely Kazaa.
    eDonkey doesn't have a central server, and anyone can run a server if they want to. That's more than RIAA can currently(1) handle, I think.
    Also, Kazaa seems to be more popular for sharing MP3's.

    (1) What I mean is, RIAA can eventually summon enough power to bring down both, but Kazaa would be much easier.
  • by Daimaou ( 97573 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:32PM (#6377396)
    I view the sharing of music now days as a form of political protesting.

    Regarding the music industry, there is a lot to protest about in my opinion. Prices are too high, quality is questionable, and the RIAA are out of control. What better place to protest and get your points across than downloading music from the internet?
  • by ejaw5 ( 570071 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:33PM (#6377401)
    I think there's another part of the market, the Compact Disc. Its a very durable and long-lasting medium that reproduces sound well. In the past, I'd say the RIAA profited from people repurchasing music on cassette tapes when upgrading from LP, and the same with CDs from cassette. Also have to consider the "replacement" purchases made when an LP or cassette wore out. CDs last a very long time (if not infinite life) if you take care of them. --CDs from the mid 80's in my collection still sound the same when played today. A new and improved medium could be introduced, but since the current CD is 'good enough', it probably won't catch on. In addition, If you ask music listeners today, the music pumped out today probably isn't worth buying again if the medium did change.
  • Re:How? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by angle_slam ( 623817 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:34PM (#6377408)
    Yes for now except once they get done with the filetraders then I can see them starting after the leechers with download bots recording the IP addresses of leechers too.

    Once the filetraders are gone, the leechers will be also, because there will be nothing to leech off of.

  • Why, why, why? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by themaddone ( 180841 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:35PM (#6377414)
    RIAA threatens to sue dozens, hundreds, or thousands of file-shares. File-sharing increases, and we brag about it? "Woohoo! Look at us! You can't get me RIAA! Your threats and lawyers and lawsuits don't bother me at all!"

    Look, I'm all for giving the RIAA whatfor, just on principle, but STOP TELLING THEM YOU'RE INFRINGING THEIR COPYRIGHTS (not stealing, as we all know... right?) AND QUIT FLAUNTING THAT YOU'RE NOT AFRAID.

    Because they are going to drop the hammer. And they are going to sue some poor college kids and high school kids and ruin their savings and credit and quite possibily their future. This isn't funny. People should be switching to anonymous technologies ASAP. It's like a burgular going back to the same house after having a long conversation with the owner in a coffee shop about how he previously stole from the owner, and he didn't care that the owner now has some nasty looking guard dogs, a moat, and a team of lawyers ready to defend him when he shoots the burgular in "self-defense."

    So shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. It's for your own good.

  • by tinrobot ( 314936 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:36PM (#6377423)
    Your parents have a lot more to lose, like their house. If you get caught while using their internet connection, they're the ones who are going to pay the price.

    It is marketing, but the RIAA knows the people who scare easiest are the ones with the most to lose.

    Eighteen year old kids can afford to lose their life savings, because they can get it back in a week or two.
  • by angle_slam ( 623817 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:38PM (#6377429)
    The artificial scarcity created by government regulation (copyright) is way out of touch with the reality so the free market, even when it has to operate as a black market, will take care of the customer demand.

    What 'artificial scarcity' are you talking about? There is nothing 'scarce' about music. You can go to any number of internet sites and buy CDs. Try buy.com [buy.com].

    The free market is in action. It's just that people would rather pay $0.00 for music rather than anything more than $0.00.

  • A losing battle (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Kenshiro70 ( 610599 ) <Kenshiro70@hotma ... m minus caffeine> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:40PM (#6377435)
    The RIAA can't win here - the very business dynamic they are trying to exploit is what will hurt them the most. Just like the major airlines, which make a majority of their money from Business Class passengers, the music indutry makes its money from a small number of acts (Britney, etc). Those acts and albums will be shared, whether in the US or overseas (out of RIAA reach), so they will be hurt regardless. Much like Southwest Airlines disrupting the major airlines business through a new, low-cost overhead business model, things will change. This current negative PR campaign of "suing your customers" will only hasten this trend.
  • Comment removed (Score:3, Insightful)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:49PM (#6377478)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • by tinrobot ( 314936 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:50PM (#6377484)
    So, someone please tell me how the RIAA has the right to sue, since they own no copyrights

    Artists own the copyrights, but they assign the legal authority to protect the copyrights to the record companies, who, in turn, band together under the guise of the RIAA.

    Kinda like a pyramid scheme...
  • by compwiz3688 ( 98919 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:53PM (#6377498)
    Sounds just like the "Do not click on this link!" found on my prof's course webpage [golden.net]. (And yes, I did click on the link.)

    If you tell a person that they cannot do something, they are almost certainly going to try to do it.
    I think it might have something to do with "It's not gonna happen to me".
  • Philippines (Score:4, Insightful)

    by minairia ( 608427 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:53PM (#6377499)
    The basic issue is that music and DVDs are not worth 20+ dollars anymore when everyone know that blank CD's cost less than a couple of cents, if that. In the Philippines, file sharing is not that popular because it is actually cheaper and more convenient to buy the excellently pirated and reproduced media (complete with liner notes, etc.) from the old women in the market than to deal with Kazaa, etc. (bandwidth isn't really an issue, for people who can afford PCs, affording broad band is not a problem.) If the record and movie industry's were to sell there product at the same price as the pirates (or a little more with the guarantee of quality) they would beat the inconvenience of file sharing very easily. They just can not accept that the days of overcharging consumers are over. Every Filipino gets with a CD player has all the Brittany, Madonna, CDs etc. he or she wants. (sorry, that's what they're into ...) You can already get perfect DVDs of Terminator 3 Charlie's Angels on the street, not badly done copies made by some guy with a camera but real copies. Friends of mine send me these everynow and then (no ... I won't sell them here. Jail isn't fun.) My point is that the record industry should learn from this example, that millions of people are willing to pay money for CDs and DVDs instead of downloading when the prices are reasonable. Likely, the won't learn though. Now, every few months, the record industry pressures the State Department to enforce copy protection laws in the Philippines. The local authorities dutifully bulldozer some CDs from the market place. What isn't mentioned is that the same authorities worked it out with the merchants the night before, saying that they have to put a show on for some stupid Americans at such and such a time and place and could the merchants have some old, defective or otherwise unsellable stuff ready for smashing on the evening news...
  • by AndroidCat ( 229562 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:57PM (#6377521) Homepage
    Hmm, and how is this going to detect and add to the enemies list a RIAA Collectinator using a dynamic IP address? It's not like they're going to have a big sign on their packets. By the time the law suits start landing, it's too late to look for shelter.

    I can see a small whitelist circle of trust system working, but I can't see a wide system with blacklists managing to fly under RIAA's radar.

  • by U6H! ( 549238 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:58PM (#6377524)
    Not to give the bastards ideas, but it's only a matter of time before they start doing high profile random prosecutions. Right now people feel safe because they think, I'm not sharing a ton of files, they'll go after the big dogs and leave me alone. But if the RIAA starts doing random prosecutions then people will really get spooked. My recommendation, boycott RIAA affiliated products. Buy from indy labels. Right to your favorite bands letting them know why you are boycotting and try to persuade them to leave the label and/or speak out in favor of sane legislation. I think the last idea might be the most effective. If we can get the stars to back a balance between public domain and IP, we can declaw the RIAA and MPAA. This will require some meeting in the middle. Artists are very protective of the work. We must not come out saying everything should be free, but rather that both IP rights and public domain are both very important and need to be preserved. The other part of the problem, the punishment far outwaying the crime. This is harder to fix. Perhaps we need find ways to prosecute companies, congressman, branches of government and judges under the DMCA.
  • by realdpk ( 116490 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:59PM (#6377529) Homepage Journal
    These same artists that have supposedly declared their albums are the "full picture" allow the radio stations to chop up the album in to individual songs, allow the DJs to chatter during the lead-in and lead-out, and allow the radio stations (or the labels) to censor their lyrics.

    Artistic integrity is quite obviously not the prime concern for them.
  • Re:Lazy RIAA (Score:2, Insightful)

    by C_To ( 628122 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @12:59PM (#6377538)
    Something close to this exists in Canada. We have a levy on blank CDs here, with the money going to the RIAA to recoup costs. Fortuneatly, with the creation of the levy, the copyright rules changed slightly, allowing other users to make copies of music CDs they don't own as long as I don't do it for them physically.

    But on the negative side, how many people back up their data on CD-Rs? I'm sure that most of us have used at least 1-2 CD-Rs to back up data for work, for school or what not. I mean let's be realistic, we're not going to back up that 20GB drive of ours onto floppies and DDS DAT drives are too expensive. So whenever I use a CD-R to back up data I made, part of the cost of that media goes to the RIAA, which is unfair and in my opinion stealing. They're assuming with their large ego's that whenever a CD is burned, they're losing money. I have done some consulting work in the past for copies that use CD-Rs to back up important database files because the unit and the media is still fairly inexpensive. But the media could be even cheaper without this assumption of being guilty of a crime without even committing it yet.
  • The problem is that this could lead to the abolition of copyright altogether.

    This would affect songs, movies, software, books,... anything that is copyrighted.

    The net cost to publishers would rise because they would not be able to reliably recover as much of their costs, so the publication of works would become increasingly rarer. Although any material may be freely shared, not all of it would necessarily be easy to find. Fans of artists or authors of obscure works would be entirely out of luck.

  • by draziw ( 7737 ) * on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:01PM (#6377549) Journal
    It used to be that if I heard a song on the radio (or in a movie, TV show, etc) I liked, or that a friend would mention, I'd go download a few from the group. If I liked them, I'd buy the CD, if not, I wouldn't. I bought _more_ CDs after the start of music sharing (eg: via Napster, usenet news (newscene rocks), and winmx, than I had before. The more BS RIAA speaks, the fewer CDs I buy - now I haven't bought one in almost a year.

    Price CDs at $6-10, and I'll think about buying. Remember - they said CD prices would drop lower than tape.

    --
    +1 Karma Bonus due to RIAA love and low user ID.
  • by garcia ( 6573 ) * on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:04PM (#6377562)
    Umm.

    Critical Mass... So you think that the 60+% of the current adult population that has smoked weed and thinks it is "more or less" harmless than alcohol isn't an important statistic?

    Ok, so you don't think that they have organization against the laws? What about groups like NORML [norml.org]? You mean to tell me that they haven't done anything to move towards the legalization of marijuana and growing hemp products?

  • by thgreatoz ( 623808 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:10PM (#6377610)
    I really hate it when different "groups" start lobbying for a new tax to solve all their woes. I will be outraged if I have to start paying a special tax on a new cd burner or internet access to offset the RIAA's losses. It's not MY fault they have an antiquated business model. And not everyone has internet access solely for the purpose of filesharing...hell, I bet nearly NO ONE does. Why am I going to pay the RIAA so I can read slashdot and backup my harddrive? This has all been said before, so mod me down if you will, but come on...now even the filesharing companies, who are supposed to be on "our" side, are showing their true colors...it's all about the benjamins.
  • by Tingler ( 56229 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:13PM (#6377637)
    Why do americans seem to have such a problem with this phrase?

    Why do you assume he is American?
  • Poor Grandma. (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Dark Fire ( 14267 ) <clasmc@[ ]il.com ['gma' in gap]> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:20PM (#6377677)
    I work in a college IT department and we found early on that students using file sharing programs didn't even know that the files were setup to be shared by default. As I understand it, the RIAA is going after the bigtime uploaders. A lot of people may be bigtime uploaders without even realizing it. Let's say Grandma has a broadband connection to download pictures/videos of the grand kids. Let's also say a few of the grand kids like free music a lot and setup a file sharing program on grandma's pc. A lot of music accumulates on grandma's computer which is left on most of the time. The grand kids acquire quite a music collection at grandma's. Then one day grandma get's busted by the RIAA for pirating music via p2p. The whole point of this little segment is to point out the distinct possibility that many of the greatest p2p uploaders on the net may not even know they are big uploaders or uploaders at all.
  • by goon america ( 536413 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:21PM (#6377683) Homepage Journal
    You need to understand your market if you are to sell your product to it.

    Kids.

    They want kids to act irresponsibly, but only in ways that help their bottom line.

    Oh well, what goes around comes around.

  • Re:How? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by reallocate ( 142797 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:29PM (#6377731)
    I don't think the RIAA is after every bloke who has ever downloaded an MP3. They're after people who are, in effect, wholesale providers. If they can successfully close down a few of those, they expect to see a ripple effect.

    People copying a few CD's here and there are probably just noise to them, akin to passing around cassette tapes not so many years ago. But, when someone starts distributing most of a company's catalog, that's a different matter.
  • by the gnat ( 153162 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:34PM (#6377759)
    How about doing it in a public place, and letting the populace watch you face the (theoretically unjust) consequences of your actions? That's how protest/civil disobedience is *supposed* to work.

    Exactly! Go out to your local record store and stand in front handing out free copies of the latest Metallica album! Spread free music to the world! Remember, you're not "stealing" if you're not taking something physical. That's what civil disobedience is supposed to be about, not hiding behind your ISP like a total pussy.

    By the twisted reasoning I'm seeing posted here, I should view the guy I saw selling DVDs of "Finding Nemo" and "The Matrix Reloaded" in the NYC subway last week as a noble hero fighting the scourge of the RIAA.
  • by DamEEZ ( 129572 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:39PM (#6377782)
    I have to say that I am partial to the long-playing album. The iTunes style of music distributionoffers a lot of freedom to the consumer to purchase as much or little content as he or she would like, but could this threaten the existence of the long-playing album? What insentive does the artist/music industry have to create albums when the model has changed so drastically? It seems like artists and labels would now want to get each track out as quickly as possible.

    I was a little distressed at this idea at first, because I really think that the album can have some holistic worth that is not present in the tracks individually. This is most obviously true in the genre of progressive rock where concept albums are popular. Concept albums are albums in which the songs are tied together by a theme or plot that operates within the lyrics and often also within the music itself as themes are reprised and re-orchestrated in a manner that allows them to be expressive through their relationship to each other as well as their own intrinsic expression. And there are many other non-concept albums out there that stand as complete pictures that would not at all be the same were the tracks to be separated.

    As the musical medium has progressed from live to vinyl to magnetic recording to compact discs and now to the intanbible realm of bits, I do feel that we are losing as much as we gain. Im only 19, but I know that back in the days when the Beatles were releasing vinyl, you would buy the album not just for the music, but for the art and other goodies that came along with it, and, perhaps most importantly, because you wanted to support the group and teh ideas they represented. Nowadays music seems to be as disposable as all of our other goods have become. Im horified by the idea that music could become as stripped down as it now is.

    However, I fully support the new way that music distribution is going, not because I think that disembodies mp3s are better than vinyl or even compact discs, but because I think that it may challenge artists to create something worthy of our ownership.

    I've really been nauseated over and over by the crap that is being pumped out of the music industry lately. From the boy band thing to linkin park and rap rock, music has gone from a medium of expression to a formulaic and mindless medium of moneymaking. This is not entirely true of music, but of most of the junk that teh RIAA is representing in its rampage.

    As an artist myself, I look at an album as more than some sort of physical medium for the noise I make. Seeing the album as an arbitrary medium for music is analogous to the functionalist school of AI. The way we are demmanding our music to be served to us shows that we dont see the medium thorugh which we hear or acquire it as important to the music itself. while I do subscribe to a certain brand of functionalism when it comes to AI, I actually believe that the medium is very important when it comes to music. Music is art, and the musical release - the album - should be a work of art. The graphic art and words that come along with a physical album ought to contribute to the music, and the music itself must merit the words and grapgic art that accompany it.

    so I am not protesting our lack of concern about how we acquire our music. Rather, I am hoping that the music industry might now be driven to create music that deserves to be embodied and owned in something more corporeal than a digital file.

    I guess Im done ranting, but inconclusion, if Metallica and the Red Hot Chili Peppers are going to refuse to let peopel download their music because the want to protect the long-playing album, they had better get started creating an album that is not translatable into digital files as easily as they are now. Im talking abotu a different kind of copy-protection here. when more mainstream artists begin releasing albums that are worth more than the sum of their tracks, more people will shell out the bucks to own a piece of art. I'll still have my ipod loaded with music, but I will also have the albums of my favorite artists at home so that I can appreciate them as a whole.
  • Re:A bad thing? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Music To Eat ( 594768 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:40PM (#6377793)
    Removing dependance on full-length physical media will do a couple of good things. First it will force the industry and artists to put out more quality tracks instead of relying on a couple radio tracks to sell a disc made mostly of filler. Second, the consumer will no longer get stuck with a lousy disc.


    Some bad things:

    1) Instead of having one or two radio friendly songs to get you to buy the album, so you can then hear the more innovative stuff they really want to do, record companies may force bands to only release "radio" friendly music, since that's what sells. Leaving a lack of innovative music.

    2) Selling individual songs on the internet could lead to bands being pressured to shorten their songs. If you get 99 cents a song, record companies would rather a 3 minute 3 Meg song to a 10 minute 10 meg song.

    3) The death of the "concept" album. If each song has to stand or fall on it's own, what incentive does a band have to release something with a larger scope? No more Darksides, Quadrophenias, Red Headed Strangers, Kind of Blues, etc.


    Buying music by the song may be the future of bubblegum pop, but I hope it'll never be the future of truly creative music.
  • by AndroidCat ( 229562 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:42PM (#6377800) Homepage
    Big blocks of IP addresses. Like AOL? :^P The RIAA is hiring independent companies who are going to going to use dial-ups and whatnot on scores of ISPs. They'll look like normal users (and maybe not even leeches if they share legit stuff). "Are you sure?" "I would."

    And what is a known offender? When someone gets hit with a lawsuit, it's not going to say "IP x.x.x.x sends his regards". Somewhere in the log of people that downloaded the offending file(s) is the IP they used, and are now using something completely different.

    Blocklists might lock out file hogs, but they'll be useless against the RIAA's collectinators.

  • by Surak ( 18578 ) * <surakNO@SPAMmailblocks.com> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:42PM (#6377801) Homepage Journal
    This is the same damn argument that pro-"sharing" pundits keep spouting over and over again--and it's just wrong on many levels. You want to break up Abbey Road, or Dark Side of the Moon into singles too?

    Abbey Road, Dark Side of the Moon. Yeah, those would be by the Beatles and Pink Floyd, artists with great enough talent to produce concept albums.

    Tell me (and no fair using google): What album was "Come on Eileen" by Dexy's Midnight Runners released on? Many people like and enjoy the song, but I'd be willing to be almost NO ONE has the album.

  • Re:How? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Arctic Dragon ( 647151 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @01:42PM (#6377803)
    I remember reading about how something like 90% of the content on P2P networks is provided by only 10% of the users (I don't remember the exact figures). Those people are certainly the RIAA's biggest targets.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 06, 2003 @02:02PM (#6377902)
    I checked out that site, but apparently you can only buy songs all bundled together on one CD.

    And apparently the track layouts are fixed and you can't mix them from different artists.

    And I didn't see what format they were in (MP3, WMA, etc) so I could get them on my computer faster.

    And apparently they would have to ship something to me through the MAIL to unlock my tracks (or maybe the thing they ship actually IS the music, what the hell).

    Well, you get the point. These are different markets. But I can call BS on your post anyway, I buy LOTS of tracks from the iTunes music store (mostly jazz), and the ones I can't get there, I download over P2P. Occasionally I buy the physical CD afterwards if I like the music. Indie labels always get my business.

    I really don't care if it costs $2 or $0.50 or $0.00, I just want it to be AVAILABLE, understand?

    PS: have you ever USED the iTunes music store? It's worth 0.99 per track just to be able to quickly find what you need and download it without errors. The stuff on P2P is worth about $0.00 because you have to hunt the stuff down and hope the guy doesn't turn off his computer, etc.
  • by macdaddy357 ( 582412 ) <macdaddy357@hotmail.com> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @02:03PM (#6377907)
    From the article: Weiss said he's also seen a surge of postings on Morpheus message boards from users who are ticked off at being in the RIAA's cross hairs. "People are just outraged at the actions of the recording industry," he said. "I've got people saying they want to organize groups to boycott buying CDs now."

    Some groups like that have been around for a long time, since the first "copy protected" CDs that won't play in a computer came out, such as Don't Buy CDs. [dontbuycds.org] and Boycott RIAA. [boycott-riaa.com] An industry that presupposes that its customers are freeloaders and thieves doesn't deserve to have any customers.

  • Genocidal? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by stinky wizzleteats ( 552063 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @02:04PM (#6377913) Homepage Journal

    even genocidal litigation can't stop file sharers

    Although I'm not familiar with the case, I don't remember extermination camps being discussed as part of a remedy. The RIAA's efforts are punitive, vengeful, and certainly suicidal, but not genocidal.

    I am very much against the RIAA in this affair, but ridiculous exaggeration like this severely damages our ability to make the case to Joe Sixpack.

  • Re:A good thing? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Mac Degger ( 576336 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @02:23PM (#6378024) Journal
    What's always surprised me is this: their justification for the high price of cd's around the world was always 'distribution costs are so high'.
    The fact that they then don't immediately take up a new, cheap distribution method (over the net) means that they're
    a) criminaly negligent towards their shareholders for not implementing something which would give their shareholders more money, or
    b) scamming us, and have been for years, 'cause that 'distribution' line is total crap and they don't need a new distribution model.

    I'd say they can get sued either way :)
  • by K8Fan ( 37875 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @02:24PM (#6378028) Journal

    Why don't we just consider the possibility that retailing music is dead?

    It was a situation made possible with the fairly recent (in historical terms) invention of printed sheet music, followed by piano rolls, wax cylinders, 78s, 45s, LPs, cassettes, CDs and now DVD-Audio and SuperAudio-CD. That's all happened within a span of 100 years or so. It's no longer needed.

    Seriously. Things are invented, manufactured, sold and used. But eventually every thing has a lifespan. At one point in the US, everyone got their heat by burning coal or oil. But the cities built natural gas distribution systems, and everyone converted over to gas. Almost every company that was involved in distributing coal and heating oil went out of business, along with all those companies that made related products. The ones that survived adapted.

    What possible harm could come of a return to the historical nature of music as something that belongs to the public?

    As for the argument that musicians would starve...the truth is, most are starving now because of the corruption of the record business.

    The commercial distribution of music has actually caused there to be fewer musicians alive today than at any prior time in history. Before the advent of recorded music, every family had several musicians. People played their own music for pleasure (ask your grandparents about this). But the record industry has redefined the meaning of music. Now, unless you can sell more than 100,000 copies of a recording, you are a failure.

    So, what if we said "Hey, let 'em die!"? What if all of the big 4 giants were allowed to implode? Would people stop making music? Of course not! In fact, in the absence of a gigantic "Industry of Cool" (Lester Bangs' immortal pharse), we'll hear more music.

    We could return to the heyday of Napster, when you could message people downloading music from you and suggest other artists in your collection. And then people could download that, and if they like it, buy it from the artist.

    Because that's the main thing ignored in all of this - people like artists. But they don't like giant industries. I enjoy sending money directly to an artist. I enjoy buying the CD from the artist at a concert even more - especially as I know the majority of the money will go directly to the artist - (Did you know that if you have a major label contract, if you want to buy copies to sell at your concert from the label, they charge you $11 each? More than they charge stores?)

    Sorry, but anyone who has watched more than two episodes of "Behind The Music" will have no sympathy for the giant labels. Screw 'em!

  • Re:A bad thing? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Music To Eat ( 594768 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @02:30PM (#6378058)
    Indeed, number one could almost be seen as false advertising. Which leads to distrust among consumers. It does allow new bands to get their music out there though. I'm sure most of them would rather not be pressured into releasing a radio friendly song in the first place.

    Which is why I think indie labels are seeing such growth. They allow the artists to decide what is art, not some marketing survey. The RIAA's real problem is the RIAA.
  • by tkrotchko ( 124118 ) * on Sunday July 06, 2003 @02:48PM (#6378188) Homepage
    I've never heard anyone claim there is a morality to copyright. Its my understanding that copyright is a business proposition to encourage artists to produce more stuff, not a indication of ownership.

    Ideas can't be owned; they can simply be monopolized to a certain extent by government fiat. But that hardly constitutes a moral imperative.

    Let me put it another way.

    As a consumer, I can listen to the radio. I can tape songs off the radio. I can take that tape and burn it to a CD. That's apparently okay. But if I add "Internet" in that chain of events, then its not okay, even though the end result is the same.

  • by tuxenvy ( 669899 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @02:49PM (#6378192)
    This statistic of 10% growth does not show that people are diregaring the RIAA. It just shows that certain file sharing programs user base grew 10%. If the user base grew 20% the month before...and now it only grew 10%...well, maybe people are afraid to file-share. Regardless, the article doesn't give enough information to draw any real conclusion...especially one as broad as people are disregarding the RIAA announcement. Does anyone know the preceding 5 or 6 month percentage growth so we can compare?
  • by wuice ( 71668 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @02:55PM (#6378222) Homepage
    I especially don't like the idea of buying a CD that won't play on my PC (which is where I listen to the majority of the music that I listen to). I consider this an unreasonable obstacle to my ability to use a CD that I paid for the way I want to. Because the recording and cd manufacturing industry has put as much energy as possible into obfuscating which cds are and aren't copy-protected, and eventually want all CDs to be copy-protected anyway, I'm not going to take my chances. That's why I stopped buying cds, not because I can get them on Kazaa.

    Of course, since the government has decided that other (harmless) acts I take part in are illegal (smoking weed for example), I am very accustomed to breaking the law and consider it part of my life here in the United States. I don't flinch at it very much. When people wonder why so many break the law in the US, I always try to remind them that a big part of this is because we have so many laws.
  • by SN74S181 ( 581549 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @03:04PM (#6378282)
    There couldn't be a 'big hemp.' Not like with tobbacco. Hemp is extremely easy to grow and it can be cultivated about anywhere. Tobbacco, on the other hand, is difficult to grow and a very labor-intensive process. It will only grow well in a limited area of the world.

    Pot as a recreational drug frightens government types particularly because it's very difficult to control. It would be hard to tax and regulate if it were made legal. Any pothead will tell you they'd have their patch growing in a minute, and let's face it, there wouldn't end up being much of a commercial market.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 06, 2003 @03:32PM (#6378425)
    Suppose that I possess a copy of Metallica's new album (I actually don't, but let's imagine that I do).

    The music on Metallica's new album is not intrinsically or naturally a scarce resource. It is in fact an unlimited resource. I can, at no (or insignificant) cost to myself, meet an unlimited demand for this particular resource.

    However, copyright law prevents me from meeting an unlimited demand for this resource.

    There are people who would like to have a copy of this music, but who are not willing to pay the price associated with it at a retail store. If it were not for copyright law, I could satisfy this demand.

    Because this scarcity is not intrinsic or natural to the resource in question, it is an "artificial" scarcity.

    The intent of causing artificial scarcity of a resource is either to increase the market value of the resource, or to regulate the resource for broader social reasons.

    The meager (at best) potential benefits of copyright on artistic works do not in our present society warrant its continued status as law.

    The majority of those who truly have the potential to advance the arts will do so fully or to a sufficiently acceptable degree whether or not they are granted monopolistic control of the distribution of their work.

    The benefit of the few who will not or who will not so greatly, is outweighed by the free mixing and distribution of ideas that will come about in our society in which it is becoming increasingly true that everyone, not just a select few, are creators and innovators (and yes, you twit pisser, producing a derivative work is being creative and innovative).

    The arts are not advanced to a greater extent because artists are able to indulge in luxuries daily that cost more than the average worker makes in a week.

    That Mr. Pfuckshisowndiddy can throw millions around like pocket change is not a cause that we as a society have an obligation to advance.

    Just the opposite: we have an obligation to take his wealth up to the point that were we to take any more he would not able to advance the greater good as much as he has, and instead redistribute that wealth to those who will innovate, create, and advance the greater good.

    For his contributions, Mr. Pfuckshisowndiddy deserves an annual income of about $22,000 USD, and not a cent more.
  • by visionsofmcskill ( 556169 ) <vision AT getmp DOT com> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @03:34PM (#6378443) Homepage Journal

    If the RIAA gets it's way... which is a distinct possibility.... we will see 2 things happen amongst traders.

    First will come the file-trading encrupted and distribiuted networking solutions... such as freenet.... where communications will be inherently anonymous and highly hidden... where the data will be spread across the network in a simlar fashion to RAID... keeping them availble and at the same time not dependant upon one users machine.... imagine if everyone simply gave 40 megs of space to a netowkr of millions of users to be shared out RAID style....

    the second thing we'll see is the advent and return of sneaker-net... with so many small and highly portable devices that store data on nearly everyone.... the ease of getting songs at your buddies house or work or in the park will become more and more prevelant. Although not easy with the iPod right now.... i have a distinct feeling it will be shortly.

  • by KevMar ( 471257 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @03:35PM (#6378446) Homepage Journal
    the RIAA just keeps shooting themselves in the foot. Every major lawsuit just leads to more public attention.

    I remember when mp3's were only found on IRC or FTP server or crappy porn filled mp3 warez sites or college network shares. the Dimond RIO suit put mp3 in the spotlight and the napster lawsuit made mp3 a household name. They may will according to the law, but thats all they are winning.
  • Since when? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by AstroDrabb ( 534369 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @03:36PM (#6378451)
    has it been the job of the US citizens to support the RIAA/MPAA business model or any business model for that matter?
    From the article:
    Weiss said the recording industry should lobby for special taxes on CD burners and Internet access as a way to recoup losses incurred from file sharing

    When has it become our duty as US citizens to make sure that any business model succeeds? If a business cannot adapt its business model for each new generation, then it deserves to go down in flames. The sad thing is that something like the above could happen. The dirty RIAA/MPAA with their dirty money will bribe the prostitutes of congress and have them pass a bill that allows them to tax all internet usage or all cd burner purchases. As if the only possible reasons we dirty citizens use the internet or buy a cd burner is to steal their crapppy music. This crap makes me mad.
  • by alizard ( 107678 ) <alizardNO@SPAMecis.com> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @03:53PM (#6378585) Homepage
    We have to be very careful before claiming a law is unjust simply because of popular opinion. And the argument that people should be able to use an artist's work outside of that artist's terms of creation because "everyone's doing it" (well, a lot of DSL users are doing it) strikes me as a very dubious argument at best.

    Everybody always has done it, up to now, legally.

    Any musician and anyone else serious about music who's older than Britney Spears' generation grew up taping off the radio and swapping tapes. This was how people swapped music files before the Internet and personal computers.

    Do any of us feel guilty about STEALING MUSIC and being PIRATES!!!

    Of course not, tapes effectively extended the range of radio broadcast promotion of albums, i.e. taping songs off the radio helped sell albums, just as P2P and Internet radio helps sell CDs now.

    The only difference between fileswapping and taping is that the RIAA paid Congress to make swapping songs via Internet illegal.

    If you believe differently, you have been suckered by RIAA propaganda.

  • by Snaller ( 147050 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @03:56PM (#6378607) Journal
    "Artists hold out on iTunes on principle"

    The principle being greed.
  • by DannyO152 ( 544940 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @04:16PM (#6378721)
    A new medium has appeared. It's called (approximately) a hard-drive. More efficient in storage space, it continues the clear progression of convenience that began when the LP replaced the 78.

    The full implications of this new medium are still being worked out with many approaches being tested. Perhaps the most successful approach for exploitation and profit has not been precisely conceived yet. My point of view is that using litigation to lawyer it away misses the meaning of the sea change, and looks like an expensive way to sell less product. I also think that recording artists and/or their management and lawyers who insist on a buy it all or nothing approach are also likely to be left behind.

    The more I've thought about this over the past few weeks, the more I feel we could be on the verge of a pop explosion centered around, as the great pop explosions of the past, the single. It is so much easier to be brilliant for 3:35 than for 65:13.
  • by Fallen_Knight ( 635373 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @04:26PM (#6378778)
    Its hard when your righting agiast the prison gurads, police and other people who are employed by the so call "war on drugs" that only puts people in jail for a really really long time and wastes tax payers money.

    There are lobbies for the prison guard unions fighting agaist leagal pot BECAUSE so many people are put in jair for insanely long periods of time for haveing a little baggy of pot. Its all about money and who gets the money from a drug war.
  • by Greyfox ( 87712 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @04:59PM (#6378955) Homepage Journal
    "This is the Central Scrutinizer. It is my responsibility to enforce all the laws which haven't been passed yet. It is also my responsibility to alert each and every one of you to the potential consequences of various ordinary everyday activities you might be performing, which could eventually lead to... The Death Penalty. Or affect your parents credit rating. Our criminal institutions are full of little creeps like you, who do... Wrong Things."

    Amazing how a guy who's been dead for 10 years can still be on topic...

  • by fermion ( 181285 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @05:48PM (#6379189) Homepage Journal
    Society has made an agreement, via its legislature, that artists have some control over how their works are distributed in order, in part, that they can at least have a fair go at getting some payback for what they did.
    Society in the past has made an agreement to give the author time to earn money on his or her creative work. There were assumptions about who the author might be and what a reasonable amount of time might be.

    That's a reasonable agreement, and many artists - musicians, authors, directors, etc - have created entirely new works and made them available on the understanding that this agreement stands.
    No sane artist is going to claim a completely new work. There is give and take, and in some cases outright theft. Beyond that, the copyright laws are suppose to release works into the public domain on a regular basis so the future artists can create works targeted to new generations.

    This is an important and important process or recycling. For example, there is little original in Harry Potter. It is an effective recycling of ideas created by a British writer of other British writers and targeted to the a new generation of children. The same thing is true for Madonna, which just repackaged Blondie's look (and feel) for a new set of teenagers.

    Even when one comes up with the argument that there are laws that "no longer represent the majority of the people", it strikes me as bogus to suggest that this immediately makes a law unjust
    So it is not just a matter of the people thinking that the laws are wrong. I agree that such a thing is necessary, but not sufficient condition. The real issue is the copyright laws have changed significantly enough so they may not be fair to authors or customers. First, we are being asked to accept that a corporation can be the 'artist.' Though many would say that this is just a natural extension of the law, I think it hurts the true artist. Despite popular opinion, a corporation is not a person, it does not create art, and does not promote creativity. Humans or groups of unincorporated humans are those we wish to encourage to create works, not fictional entities. Second, we are being asked to rescind the requirement that old work go back into the public domain so they can be retooled to new generations. The fact that Disney has made it's fortune, and continues to make it's fortune, doing this is well documented. The fact is that Disney is not the creative, or financial powerhouse, it used to be. If the U.S. needs anything it is a financial powerhouse like Disney used to be. Where is this company going to be if the U.S. has copyright laws that prohibit the use of old work into perpetuity? Outside the U.S., of course, helping another country's economy.

  • Re:How? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by shepd ( 155729 ) <slashdot@org.gmail@com> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @05:50PM (#6379206) Homepage Journal
    >They have a snapshot of the files you shared along with a file or two or three that they received from your computer. They then sue you (or your parents or your roommate, whoever the isp has as the customer)

    If easily fabricated evidence such as this can get someone in jail, how come I can't just say "Person x shot at me with a gun -- sorry, the finger prints have been wiped off and the room where he shot me demolished".

    Seems to me a judge would need more than a screenshot and some pirate files coming from the accuser to blame you. Otherwise, this could make a very good insurance scandal: "Yeah, he stole the cash from the safe! See, I'm missing it! And I have his name and address! That should be enough! Now gimme my money!"
  • by alizard ( 107678 ) <alizardNO@SPAMecis.com> on Sunday July 06, 2003 @07:25PM (#6379605) Homepage
    No, you're not, except in a tiny handful of cases. If it were the case, the record companies would be bankrupt by now.

    Find a better place than RIAA propaganda to get your info.

    You are of course, simply wrong to the point where nothing you say about the business of music can be taken seriously. The case for every song on commercial radio being a result of payola can be considered established fact.

    BTW, the major labels are all in major financial trouble, and paying for this part of promotion is part of the reason. Better cash your paycheck quickly.

    No guarantee on data availability. I simply keyword-searched on my personal database on payola. If any URLs don't work, Google is even your friend. Keyword search on "payola".

    http://www.salon.com/ent/feature/2002/06/25/pfp_co ngress/

    http://www.salon.com/ent/feature/2002/06/25/eagle_ eye/

    http://slashdot.org/articles/02/05/24/1515236.shtm l?tid=141

    http://features.slashdot.org/features/01/06/05/103 4234.shtml?tid=141

    http://slashdot.org/articles/02/06/25/1316255.shtm l?tid=141

    http://www.latimes.com/cgi-bin/slwebcli?DBLIST=lt0 1&DOCNUM=41999&TEMPLATE=9002&DBPUB=20010529KFHQeKB S&QDesc=Logs%20Link%20Payments%20With%20Radio%20Ai rplay

    I've never seen a pro-RIAA posting on Slashdot.

    THAT'S WHAT THE PREVIEW BUTTON IS FOR. READ YOUR POSTS BEFORE POSTING.

    There's a serious issue here concerning the rights of artists.

    Only in your mind, and only in the imagination of RIAA publicists. Eminem's latest album was completely uploaded to the Net as MP3? His album went straight to #1. Please explain to him in public how his rights were violated by EVIL PIRATES.

    There is NO convincing evidence anywhere that P2P displaces record sales.

    As for your example, Isaac Asimov, too bad he never saw the Baen Free Library [baen.com]. Out of print science fiction books have been uploaded by several name authors to the library, betting that it would expand the sales of current titles. NO DRM, just zipfiles you can turn into .RTFs or html pages.

    The experiment has been a success, and given Asimov's intelligence, we can be sure that if he were living today, he'd have his back-issue stuff either there or somewhere similar under his control.

    Your copyright strawman doesn't cut any ice with me, I'm a published writer and have applied for more than one patent, and know far more about the law in this area than you will ever need to know. I certainly don't support getting rid of copyright.

    While there are some people here who want to do away with it, most here would be content with reform, i.e. changing current law to add mandatory Internet licensing to mandatory broadcast licensing, so anyone who broadcasts via the Net for commercial purposes has to pay a royalty to songwriters, collected via Performers Rights Societies like ASCAP and BMI. (and tracked via the same people who do SoundScan)

    Selling music is about promotion, and the RIAA version of the story is simply an attempt to restrict mass distribution of music promtional materials to channels like radio they can buy control of.

    Thanks to your RIAA buddies, I had a hell of a time getting the music tracks of an independent artist I'm personally working with onto Kazaa for fear of attack by the thugs you either work for or even stupider, are working for free of charge.

    As for your imaginary "moral obligation", our moral obligation to artists is buy from them if we like their work. We have NO moral obligation to RIAA labels and no amount of your whining can make one. Perhaps you will buy a major label record because a label ad says to. Nobody else will.

    Distributing broadcast-quality tracks of an artists' work simply provides them with free promotional exposure. If you think there's something immoral about someone hearing a track off an album that a record company didn't pay for radio time or the bandwidth before, you're a dumb shit.

  • by VB ( 82433 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @07:35PM (#6379678) Homepage

    Your comments ignore the issue this article was meant to emphasize. Please, educate the uninformed that copyright holders have rights. That's perfectly appropriate. But, also educate them that the holders of copyrights aren't necessarily the people who wrote the material that was copyrighted, as well. Make sure you let them know the RIAA represents the interests of organizations that exploit artists for 95% or so of their rights for the works they create for commercial gain for very, very long periods of time in the interests of making money.

    What the RIAA is doing is quite legal. But, what they've done to gain those copyrights is morally quite questionable. Artists create out of compulsion; not of commercial aspiration. Unfortunately, the wheels of commerce usurp that product to the exclusion of the creator and, while they're legally justified in suing consumers for gaining access to that content outside the distribution channels they concocted for that purpose, they _must_ come to terms with the reality that the consumer is now wise to what they've done to the creators of those legal assets.

    Educate the consumer as to the law, sure... But, please give the proceeds to those who create the art, or you're supporting the system to the demise of those for which the system was originally set up. You need to teach that in your college class...
  • by K8Fan ( 37875 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @08:23PM (#6379899) Journal
    A Mr. A. Coward posted:
    "Copyright only exists to protect and encourage the arts and sciences. There is no intrisic moral value in copyright." There is the intrinsic moral precept that a person can reap a reward from their own labours. This is why communism was a failure. Copyright does for the "world of ideas" what is considered an inaliable right in the "brick and steel world" that we exist in.
    The difference, which is plainly obvious, is that to make additional bricks you need additional clay...to make more steel you need more iron ore. But to make a second digital copy of a work of art doesn't require more art. Sorry, but there is a good solid reason why it's called "intellectual property" - that's because it is not, and never can be, physical property. The whole IP industry is based on scarcity - on the now defunct concept that in order to get access to a song, you have to by a physical carrier for that song. A Mr. A. Coward continues:
    " "Given the nature of modern technology, and the low cost of modern distribution (electronically), we can safely abolish the concept of copyright." Actually we can not. While todays discussion may be over MPAA/RIAA, copyright isn't confined to just that. A great deal falls under copyright, even your posts on slashdot. Technology isn't a substitute for a sound social policy.
    Frankly, we don't have a sound social policy. What we have is a system that has been abused and stretched to the point of absurdity by our members of congress. Your argument seems to...what...that we should retain copyright because we should retain copyright? My modest proposal is that if the scarcity no longer exists, the reason for copyright no longer exists. Humans have created ever since they aquired the intelligence to do so, and they will continute to do so even if the whole "intellectual property" business were to disappear tomorrow. Record executives have the same relationship to artists as pimps have to prostitutes. And pretty much the same effect.
  • Idea (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Cinematique ( 167333 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @09:30PM (#6380173)
    Maybe the people behind Gnutella should come up with a way to only share a fixed (yet random) set of songs at any given time.

    Don't get it? Try this.

    Develop a function that allows others to "see" a max of 50 songs at a time per user. The user could have thousands of songs but only 50 would be viewable at any given time. Set the refresh to something like 60 seconds... thus obfuscating the difference between the small and large fish by making it difficult to determine how many songs a user truly has.

    If I knew how to code, I'd do it myself :(

  • by Dossy ( 130026 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @09:31PM (#6380180) Homepage Journal
    Newsflash: RIAA understands "viral marketing" and is getting P2P filesharing networks LOTS of free press!

    They obviously figured out that P2P filesharing has caused revenues to go up. However, they wear the veil of ignorance and claim that filesharing is evil and causes revenue loss -- all the while embezzling money and otherwise squandering it, to make the bottom line look reduced to support their phony claims.

    All this buzz around P2P filesharing and how easy it is to get pirated music for free causes people who would not normally try such a thing, to go out and try it -- repetetive "advertising" of these filesharing networks in the form of headline news almost daily.

    RIAA can then pocket even more money once the viral marketing takes off and they need to spend less money on actual marketing and promotion efforts. Just hire a few more lawyers to keep the news buzz going and get rid of the marketing folks ...

    -- Dossy
  • Re:How? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by ethanms ( 319039 ) on Sunday July 06, 2003 @09:52PM (#6380281)
    I knew it would only be a matter of minutes before someone came up with a name and the actual quote.

    The essence of it is very powerful (even if I didn't remember the exact wording).

    I don't like the idea of people "stealing" music, and personally find it to be a pain in the ass to find decent tracks, so I usually end up on iTunes or just go buy the CD... but I also don't like the idea that some poor shmoe is out there trying to defend her/himself against legal action from the RIAA because s/he downloaded some songs. His/her life gets wrecked because s/he has to fork over thousands in legal fees, spend days in court, loses his/her job, house, car, whatever...
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 06, 2003 @11:59PM (#6380840)
    "I've been waiting for years for RIAA to do what they are now doing. There is no way the industry will survive attacking their consumers. Consumers vote."

    With what? The money they didn't spend? Or the vote they never used to keep the political process balanced?

    Call me when you guys have real teeth.
  • by cpt kangarooski ( 3773 ) on Monday July 07, 2003 @12:24AM (#6380933) Homepage
    May I suggest taking a look at the US constitution

    Perhaps I should make a disclosure here. I've memorized that clause. I'm working very hard towards practicing copyright law in a couple of years. I do know the foundational materials, the theory, all that jazz. But I appreciate the rhetorical device.

    By giving people control over what they produce and, critically, the ability to make a living from it, you encourage them to create new and wonderful things.

    But you're not quite through. You're so close. You ought to be able to smell it. But there's one step left. What do you do when those new and wonderful things are there? What's the purpose of getting them? How does their mere existence promote the progress of science? (N.B. if you read the clause carefully, and recall the 18th century meaning of words, you will note that copyright is intended to promote science, or as we would now say, knowledge. The 'useful arts' refers to the patent half of the clause, and refers to what we now might call practical technology)

    We say to artists that if they produce new and wonderful things, we will give them control of that content. It is therefore wrong for us to remove that control, or expect them not to protest and not to take legal action when individuals remove that control, and do so in the most extreme way - redistributing their content, non-consensually, to millions of strangers.

    Naw, not really. Congress can decide to raise the price of postage to $20 for a postcard if they like. It's done at their discretion. There's nothing whatsoever wrong with changing the rules on artists.

    Because no matter WHAT copyright laws exist, those laws will usually be better for artists, and the public, in sum, than not having them at all would be. And that's a viable alternative too. Congress can always decide there shouldn't be any copyrights. And in the right circumstances, it would be the right decision to make as well.

    The few cases where artists and the public in aggregate will be worse off with copyright than without it are, ironically, when copyright is at its strongest. A few artists will thrive; they'll basically have a license to print money. But most will suffer since the ogliarchy won't much care for the competition. And the public will be even worse off.

    As for protest, I don't have a problem with that. I just don't care for their arguments, unless that argument is merely that the optimal point -- optimal for everyone -- of the copyright system lies elsewhere. Anything else would be arguing irrelevancies.

    Remember: we didn't say that we'd give artists control in exchange for them creating new things. We said we would when it was a good thing for us. That I'll stand by. But we're the judges.

    So far few are proposing fixes to copyrights beyond seriously disembowling it and removing the rights of artists completely.

    Ok.

    Without delving too deeply into the details -- I'm still thinking about some of the nitty gritty music and video licensing issues -- I'd say this:

    5 year term; renewable five times. Except software, designs, and masks, which aren't renewable at all. Fees for renewals would likely be pegged to gross profits to raise revenue for the Library of Congress and the Copyright Office (see below for some uses of that money)

    Existing terms would be retroactively shortened to fit into the new scheme.

    Strict formality requirements in order to get a copyright at all; a "common law" copyright (really statutory, but based on the old ones) might exist for some works, but wouldn't be safe to rely upon, since I'd want to promote publishing. This would include strict deposit and disclosure requirements to eliminate protection on copyrighted works other than copyrights, e.g. trade secrets. So, for example, software would all be disclosed source, though still copyrighted.

    Acts contrary to the ultimate public domaining, and fair uses would be grounds for voiding copyright; no copy
  • by Kaneda ( 3744 ) on Monday July 07, 2003 @08:26AM (#6382145) Homepage
    this is not scientific research, but I have found that just about everything is around 20% more expensive in the uk when compared to the us. When I was in the market for a laptop I did a lot of shopping around, and for some models I could have bought a ticket to the us, bought my laptop, and flown back with change rather than buying in the uk.

  • Re:Stop stealing. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by duren686 ( 463275 ) on Wednesday July 09, 2003 @12:20PM (#6400900) Homepage Journal
    From a strictly technical perspective, you would be buying a set of data which, when accessed by the correct program, would play back Eminem's Without Me with a certain degree of accuracy.

    When you download it for free, the data may contain Without Me, but it could also contain anything else, and at any quality. If you were to buy it, you would (I would think) be buying the assurance that the file you download will have the song you wanted, at a high quality level.

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