Real Begs Apple for Alliance 387
hype7 writes "In a an extremely forward move, CEO of Real Networks Rob Glaser has emailed Steve Jobs, imploring him to open up Apple's AAC Digital Rights Management System - FairPlay - to Real. The upside for Real - all music sold by them would be compatible with the iPod. The upside for Apple - Real would make the iPod its primary device for the RealNetworks store and for the RealPlayer software. However, Mr. Glaser wasn't just dangling carrots - he implied that should Apple not be a receptive partner for an alliance, he would be forced to look towards Microsoft. There was a similar post made not too long ago, with BusinessWeek's take on the whole thing." There's a Reuters story as well.
Good! (Score:2, Insightful)
The ol' Hardware Monopoly (Score:3, Insightful)
It's very much like Microsoft, but with a twist. Some of my least favorite stunts:
1. Not allowing a person to upgrade a DVD/CD drive to a Superdrive. I bought my PowerMac two months before the superdrive was released. I get to use stupid DVD-RAM disks, but I can't burn DVD's unless I buy a whole new computer.
2. Apple keeps its iSync API locked up. There are millions of really cool things I could do to make Apple able to synchronize with things like LDAP servers, competing browsers, PC's, etc. But then Apple could use it as a leverage-point to keep people subscribing to the overpriced
3. USB video cameras, like the ubiquitous Logitech QuickCam, just don't work (well) and Apple seems to have put blocks into place to refuse iChat AV from working with anything but their iSight hardware product. (I exaggerate a little bit here, but not much.)
The iPod Quicktime-AAC is just another example. Where Microsoft fights to protect it's OS dominence, Apple refuses to make its customers' lives better if it suggests that they might loose the odd dollar in missed hardware sales opportunities.
My thoughts on the players (Score:3, Insightful)
I despise Real Player and it's unreasonable level of pop-ups and advertising. It is one of the most invasive pieces of software out there.
Real looking for a reason to exist (Score:5, Insightful)
Real won't be missed, it hasn't done anything of value to the marketplace or userbase for years now.
forced to look towards Microsoft ?!? (Score:4, Insightful)
I actually think this could be good (Score:5, Insightful)
Anyway. It all boils down to "What does Apple want?" If it wants to sell iPods, this is part of the whole "killer move" thing. Right now, I can use my iPod with iTunes Music Store and Audible.com. And since I already shelled out $300 for this portable hard drive/music player, if you're not compatible, I don't want to hear it.
Licensing Fairplay to Real (and yes, I know that Fairplay isn't owned by Apple, but I'm willing to bet they've got an "exclusive agreement" and enough clout to convince the actual owners to let Real in on the fun) would, as the header notes, make the iPod work with Rhapsody. I'm not about to sign up for Rhapsody, but all of the sudden, those "Apple's trying to lock you into their own technology" arguments go out the window. And it sets a good precident: ask Apple nicely, and you can use their service.
But - this is only if Apple sees the prize as iPods. If they see the prize as becoming the de facto standard for online music, which would put them in a very powerful position, they could say "Hm - we have about 60% of all legal music downloads now, and the #1 portable MP3 players. Forget it, Real."
Personally, I think a combination of the two is in order: license with Real as they did with Audible.com. Let Real sell "iPod compatible" songs off of Rhapsody and whatever - but make those same tunes available through iTMS, just like you can buy Audible's site or through the iTunes interface. Everybody gets to sell something, and Apple will gain the "subscription services" so people can pick and choose thier poisen.
Of course, I could be totally wrong - but I won't mind if this scenario plays out.
Re:Maybe it's just me... (Score:5, Insightful)
Cut to Real. Ouch, just finiding their free player on their site is a pain in the ass, not to mention all the spyware, the bloated nature of their products... their number one seems to be their advertisers, then their bottom line, then the consumer. My opinion of Apple would go down if they associated themselves with these fools.
Re:High Level of Fear? (Score:5, Insightful)
Frankly, RealPlayer should not pressure Apple to do anything. Real represent all that is evil with software: they took a mediocre player (RealPlayer G2) and made it into a horrible mess of marketroid-fueled insanity. You can't even "quit" RealPlayer without being assaulted with pop-up ads begging you to buy the so-called "Gold" version.
Apple respects the consumer. That's why I pray they will never, ever, bow to this so-called "pressure" from Real.
Thoughts (Score:2, Insightful)
Why are you forgetting? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:High Level of Fear? (Score:2, Insightful)
What a crack addict.
High level communication (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:High Level of Fear? (Score:1, Insightful)
Funny thing, karma. Suck it down, Real!
Hopefully both Apple and Microsoft ignore Real (Score:3, Insightful)
Has anyone really used their junk since like version 3 or 4 when it became so laden with addons and hidden hitchhikers that no one in their right mind would install their crap?
So hopefully both M$ and Apple will ignore Real networks and then Real will hopefully die soon.
Yeah I know, dream on, but hey, I'm a romantic at heart.
Re:The ol' Hardware Monopoly (Score:5, Insightful)
Or you could just buy an superiour quality DVD recorder [macminute.com] from a third-party. Unlike Microsoft, Apple allows you to use all standards-compliant hardware with their DVD burning software.
2. Apple keeps its iSync API locked up. There are millions of really cool things I could do to make Apple able to synchronize with things like LDAP servers, competing browsers, PC's, etc. But then Apple could use it as a leverage-point to keep people subscribing to the overpriced
Funny that you mention LDAP; Apple supports LDAP in its acclaimed Mail application [macosxhints.com], so you don't need to write so much as a speck of code to enable it. Getting LDAP support to work is easy as pie.
I don't subscribe to
3. USB video cameras, like the ubiquitous Logitech QuickCam, just don't work (well) and Apple seems to have put blocks into place to refuse iChat AV from working with anything but their iSight hardware product. (I exaggerate a little bit here, but not much.)
Such is the price of progress. Face it: USB cameras simply don't have the throughput to push television-quality video the likes of which iChat AV with Pixlet can support. Would you take vacation photos with a so-called "camera phone" [mobog.com]? I know I wouldn't. My wife and children enjoy seeing me using iSight: it's a high-quality multivisual experience. Sorry that your piece-of-junk QuickCam won't work with it.
Let Real Die (Score:5, Insightful)
"Let them die."
I will not miss Real too much and I know very few of us will. They make a buggy crappy player and it competed with another buggy crappy player for a different equally crappy format. The company with the bigger bank account won. No surprise there. I play my
Apple has nothing to gain by helping Real and it is unlikely that Microsoft wants anything to do with Real except maybe to wait until they are about to collapse and buy them out to own the format.
No one uses Realplayer to play mp3's except for those systems that downloaded the RealOne operating system and can't use anything else to play media files anymore.
Not exactly genuine (Score:5, Insightful)
There's no way Jobs (or anyone at Apple) is going to respond to such a blatant PR move by a floundering company less than 1/10 its size.
Microsoft has the deep pockets and market power to win with these kinds of strong-arm blackmail tactics, but Real? Come on.
I think it's sad Glaser is doing it this way, because there are good arguments for Apple opening up Fairplay to other music services. But Apple is very secretive about its partnerships and alliances (Apple writes into its contracts with manufacturing outsourcing and component producers that they can't publicly admit to it) and they won't want to be seen as even responding to this kind of public pressure from a piss-ant company like Real.
Re:The ol' Hardware Monopoly (Score:4, Insightful)
Or get an external one. They work great too.
The iSync API pisses me off as well though. We'd love to develop inhouse syncing conduits, but can't.
Re:High Level of Fear? (Score:5, Insightful)
Probably for the same reasons Microsoft would want to work with Sun after Sun dogged them for years. Microsoft would look at the deal objectively, and not emotionally, the way you did.
There are still plenty of sites out there that use or require the RealAudio format, and it's not dying anytime soon. Getting Real to switch to WMA would give Microsoft a slam dunk monopoly in streaming media. Why wouldn't Microsoft want that?
Re:Interestingly... (Score:2, Insightful)
Sorry. Real lost my trust years ago, and it'll take a tarball of C code to restore it.
Please Applet, dont do it! (Score:3, Insightful)
Real on the other hand is one of the most misunderstood companies out there. Legitimate on the exterior, Real is all but that at it's core (http://jogin.com/weblog/archives/2004/03/06/real
Real is deceptive, not technologically innovative, and unfriendly towards Linux.
Apple partnering with Real would be a horrible position to take.
It took a lot of work to get Darwin and Panther to work. No doubt Apple has *very intelligent* people working for them. Take some of the talent pool, and direct them towards developing a streaming media protocol that leverages existing formats (mpeg for example). Real hasn't done anything quite innovative lately (yes, their protocol was innovative when it came out ?5? years ago).
I have no doubt in my mind that Apple could put together:
a.) a more efficient wire protocol
b.) reach more people than Real
c.) make the interface intuitive and able to be skinned / themed
d.) do this in less time
Real is dying (search
Re:The ol' Hardware Monopoly (Score:3, Insightful)
Apple's camera isn't TV quality either. TV quality video requires at minimum a three-chip camera, and they don't sell for less than $1500.
Re:The ol' Hardware Monopoly (Score:5, Insightful)
Where I differ in opinion is with your complaint about Apple locking their software to their own expensive hardware and services.
"2. Apple keeps its iSync API locked up [...] keep people subscribing to the overpriced
3. USB video cameras, like the ubiquitous Logitech QuickCam, just don't work [...] with anything but their iSight hardware product. (I exaggerate a little bit here, but not much.)"
It's Apple's sales strategy to develop free, or low cost, software to sell additional hardware and services. I hardly see anything wrong with that. In fact it's a great strategy since the software is excellent and there are alternatives available so you are not locked in. You can use AIM or Yahoo messenger instead of iChat if you choose. Yes, I wish my Logitech camera worked with iChat AV because I don't want to buy the expensive iSight camera. But I think it's fair that they give me a great IM program and offer advanced video features if I choose to use the supported hardware. Again, I can choose otherwise and am not locked in. Same with iSync, it's free and works with a lot of things out of the box. But you get more if you buy their
Re:High Level of Fear? (Score:3, Insightful)
Unlike Apple's Quicktime, which assaults you to buy the full version every time it starts up. No "Do not show me this again" or "Never" option and no way to navigate to the only possible option - "Later"
Real switching to WMA compatibility? (Score:3, Insightful)
At first, I thought an Apple/Real alliance might be a good thing. After all, it's well known that iTMS is a loss-leader for Apple, so why not let Real have a share of the red ink?
However, if Real is trying to form an alliance, it can only mean that they believe that they are in trouble. In that case, having no alliance would mean that the market would only shake out Real that much more quickly, leaving Apple and Microsoft as the sole competitors.
Still, Apple is not good at forming strategic alliances. They always underestimate Microsoft. Always. An alliance with Real might slow Real's departure, but it also might slow Microsoft's advance, and for that reason should be seriously considered.
But here we have Glasser insulting Jobs in the press. Gee, when was the last time YOU were won over by public insults.
So yeah, Jobs should probably accept, but he's not gonna, because he's got too much pride.
Re:Image! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Image! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Interestingly... (Score:3, Insightful)
When someone comes up and takes a dump on my desk it's very hard for me to take them seriously from that point on. I've very reluctantly gone back to using TurboTax this year, but Real has continually defectated upon not only my desk, but my keyboard, chair, and my new living room carpet. They can suck it.
Re:AirAmerica (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Slightly OT:High Level of Fear? (Score:1, Insightful)
Honestly, you PC users are terrible. All you ever do is pirate software and think you have a right to do so.