Northface University - Computer Science in Half the Time? 666
prostoalex writes "Associated Press runs a nationwide story on Northface University. The school, founded by a pair of venture capitalists and former technology chief found a niche with its highly intensive curriculum and corporate software development specialization. For example, a BSCS degree can be completed in a little over 2 years, and it comes with IBM's WebSphere and Microsoft's MCSD certification. Northface is also promoting its corporate partnerships, which allow current students to feel more secure about future employment. Grady Booch from IBM is quoted to be 'jazzed up' about the program, although there are many who oppose such approaches to college education."
Re:Everything will be half (Score:5, Informative)
At $60,000 for 2 years, it certainly doesn't sound like half the money. A four year degree from the Art Institute of Portland [artinstitute.edu] in game programming or game art is $64,000 for four years. Although the extra couple of years might seem like fluff there is alot to be said for the knowledge and thinking skills that can be obtained during that time.
But that's my $.02
Re:this is just a damn shame (Score:5, Informative)
Looking at their curriculum course descriptions [northface.edu], I'd say that your doubts are well founded. Looks like a trade school with a few classes in logic and discrete math thrown in. I don't see much on software engineering (aside from lip service to "the complete software life cycle"), let alone any actual computer science.
Accreditation will never happen (Score:3, Informative)
This is no drop in replacement for a well rounded and indepth degree you'll find at your local University. Accrediation means something, you know.
Re:Accredited? (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Wow (Score:3, Informative)
15 credits is "certification" courses in various random technologies. Most schools would consider them 1 credit courses at most for a total of 7 credits.
Re:Accreditation will never happen (Score:1, Informative)
They'll give you a degree you can use to bolter your job opportunities, but gives you no chance for advancement. Graduate programs at any real University will absolutely laugh if you try to use this BS as meeting the requirement for admission.
Its 97% of the class time as a 4 year degree. (Score:3, Informative)
Northface.edu runs 47 weeks a year and the program is composed of ten 10-week quarters.
10 quarters x 10 weeks=100 weeks of class in two years as opposed to 8 semesters x 13 weeks=104 weeks of class in four years.
Its a 4 year degree just a faster, cheaper (by a little bit), stronger one with additional benefits.
It makes you wonder why traditional colleges don't do this. Perhaps it is because they like raking in inflated housing fees and food sales and the annual tuition hikes. Perhaps they are simply milking their aging business model of enslaving their grad students and treating undergrads like cattel instead of customers. For Profit Colleges and technical schools continue to innovate and traditional colleges are still living in the 1950's.
A two-year Bay Area CS program (Score:3, Informative)
Mills College (Oakland, CA) has a program with similar goals [mills.edu], although a more academic focus. Specifically, Mills has post-baccalaureate programs [mills.edu] for people who already have a bachelor's degree in another field. Graduates go on to industry or to CS PhD programs, such as University of Washington, MIT, and UCSD. The coursework is primarily upper-division undergraduate CS courses, which are taught by faculty with PhDs from top schools, such as MIT, Princeton, and UC Berkeley.
FYI, I [mills.edu] direct the program. We're having an Open House on Thursday, August 19, and are still accepting applications and awarding aid for this fall. Contact me [mailto] for more information.
Re:Everything will be half (Score:5, Informative)
Physics- daily. Of course I work in an embedded field, so I deal with physical hardware every day.
How about hearing from some of the students? (Score:2, Informative)
Yes, Northface gets you through in 2 1/2 years as opposed to 4. We're also here at school, in classes, from 8 a.m. - 4 p.m. While the total number of years is less, I think the total amount of time in school (including homework) is quite comparable.
Yes, I'd like to see a bit more math. I personally love math, and have passed up to Calc II. That's the one thing I miss about traditional Universities.
Umm, not teaching critical thinking or hardware architecture? Okay, I agree there's no class specifically titled "Critical thinking" or "Hardware Architecture". But it's definitely there sprinkled in by the professors in their lectures. Dr. Halpin (ORM and databases) in particular puts a lot of logic problems into his assignments and lectures. Algorithm development has not been specifically taught yet (i.e., can you write a B-tree), but I'm only in my 2nd quarter here.
The software development cycle and software architecture are heavily emphasized. I'm in a project team now that's working on things that my brother-in-law (who graduated with a BSCS from the University of Utah) never dreamed of getting into. Homework assignments in the traditional setting get you to work on problems. Project work at Northface gets you to work on all those problems and then see how they interact with each other.
There's lots more to say. But there are probably a hundred other posts in the discussion that I need to catch up on. I emailed the other students here at Northface and encouraged them to post their experiences, so we'll see how this goes. It's no Ivory Tower over here, but I'll disagree with anyone who says we're not getting the people skills or the critical thinking experience that comes from a 4-year.
Re:Everything will be half (Score:3, Informative)
I know so many people with university education that are incompetent and I know some that are absolutely briliant.
The school doesn't make the man/woman, its their own drive, determination, and their capacity for knowledge.
As for grand-poster: I personally don't relate to the relevence of Calculus or Physics to Programming. I've been in many jobs, and the extent of my math usage has been algebraic. Yes, if your working on weather patterns, then sure it'll help, but look at it this way: If your working on an accounting software package you're better off having a diploma in accounting. If you're working on GUI's you may decide that User Interface Design courses are more applicable than calculus.
Re:Accredited? Yes, by ACICS (Score:2, Informative)
Call a few local Universities with graduate programs in Computer Science and ask if they accept a degree with ACICS accreditation as sufficient for admission to their graduate programs. I'd be willing to be most will say that it is not. The University of Phoenix has the same problem.
If you're not going to grad school, this is completely irrelevant.
Re:Everything will be half (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Everything will be half (Score:2, Informative)
NU Student is outraged by idiots (Score:1, Informative)
I am a student from NU. Many people have made a lot of very uneducated assumptions about this school. I would just like to set them all straight.
1. It is a trade school.
This school is accredited by the accredidation board because the college is actually Morrison University (Which has been around for more than a century)
2. It doesn't have enough life classes(ie pointless electives).
I personally find that electives distract me. This school does require writing classes, language classes, history classes, and yes, even a PE credit or two. We have to jump through all of the same hoops as everyone else at other universities.
3. 28 months isn't enough
We actually spend more time than the average person seeking a BS. We spend 9 hours ever day in school. On average, I also spend about 2 hours a day outside of school working on homework. This totals out close to 5800 hours for this school.
4. You won't learn enough
I went to a pre-med school before this one. Including HS and pre-med, I have learned more at this school in 5 months than the rest of my education combined.
People who get on here and rag on this school have no idea what they are talking about. The motivation of this school is not to make mindless drones. We actually determine what our own assignments are (as long as they contain elements thay are wanting us to learn ie. new algorithms and implementation of databases and/or XML) I have worked on everything from a game where you kill Orlando Bloom to a program our team jokingly called "InLook" (an OutLook look alike)
Is it that other people and other universities are feeling threatened by a new "something" or is it just that people are ignorant?
Email me with questions and/or comments please, don't knock the school until you know a bit more.
Strange Approach (Score:1, Informative)
For example, they are accredited, but it isn't because they had to work for it. From what I understand, they bought a small college that already had been accredited and then changed it and rebranded it as "Northface". Thus, I would be want to see how they fare in their next accreditation cycle before I spent two years there.
Also, look at their curriculum [northface.edu]. They require 54 credits of General Education, including communications, history, philosophy, and physics. Sound good? It's really not; the same professors that teach the CS classes also teach the general education classes! That sends red flags up for me -- do you think that a Ph.D. in CS knows much about the American Revolution, Mark Twain, or, most of all, Healthy Living (PE 170 in their catalog)?
In the end, I suppose Northface is perfect for some people, but I am glad that I wasn't one of them.
Re:Everything will be half (Score:2, Informative)
It's not CSAB / ABET accredited (Score:2, Informative)
CSAB is now part of ABET (i.e., the accreditation organization for CE and EE). The list of accredited schools is at:
http://www.abet.org/accredited_programs/computing