Some iPod Fans Dump PCs For Macs 1036
dereklam writes "The popularity of the iPod could be boosting Macs' popularity as well. News.com reports that 6 percent of iPod users have made the switch from PCs to Macs. An additional 7 percent said they are planning to dump their old PC for an Apple machine, according to the survey." I wish the linked story had more details; it's not clear from the results mentioned whether there's a strong causal relationship here.
Still a small margin (Score:3, Insightful)
Yup. (Score:4, Insightful)
Works great on my Linux box BTW. Whew. Good thing too, girlfriend would think I was giving her a line of poop trying to explai why she's got to get me a different gift.
Well... (Score:5, Insightful)
I'd say I've been proved wrong.
Not for techs (Score:3, Insightful)
Clearly the article lacks meaningful statistics
Re:Still a small margin (Score:3, Insightful)
as soul coughing said (Score:2, Insightful)
Man bites dog (Score:5, Insightful)
I kinda think that's the point of the story. People finding the iPod a sufficiently good reason to switch their OS is not a run of the mill event. How many people switch just because there's a neat new scanner out on the market? Or for a new printer? (Not counting high-end RIPs, of course, since they're pretty much stand-alone.)
OS X is selling Macs (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Bought my iPod Mini on Monday (Score:5, Insightful)
The fact that you bought an iPod and not some of the more feature rich players shows that you wanted something that did the job with little fuss. Macs do this too.
So sick of iPOD (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:It makes sense... (Score:3, Insightful)
You are partially correct, it's flamebait, but it's not true.
Grow up.
Re:Not for techs (Score:4, Insightful)
Go on Slashdot crowd, none of you have the data, but I'm sure you all have an opinion.
How about this correlation (Score:2, Insightful)
I'd imagine a small percentage (say 10%) of iPod users probably bought the most expensive model at the time be it the large 40GB iPod or the new iPod Photo. Whereas most of us don't have the money to drop on the latest and greatest iPod this group could purchase 1 or more if they so desired.
As another post pointed out it's probably people in this group (fat wallets) who are making the switch. "I can afford the $500 dollar iPod might as well as get the computer that goes along with it". So there's your 6%.
Personally I'm too entrenched in my Windows box, and I can't afford an iPod let alone a whole computer from Apple. Anyone want to get me an early Christmas Gift? Heck a belated gift if it's an iPod
--J
Re:Odd correlation (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Still a small margin (Score:5, Insightful)
The x86 PC has more options and cheaper options but I would rather have something work better than it be a few bucks cheaper and be a hassle in the long run.
Re:So sick of iPOD (Score:5, Insightful)
ok lets settle this...purchasing music from iTMS or "stealing" music from P2P is not the only way to fill an iPod. Of course, my CD collection might be a tad larger than yours.
Re:Only a study of 200 users! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Still a small margin (Score:5, Insightful)
The iPod is just bringing Apple into the public eye; the computers are selling themselves.
Re:Not for techs (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Odd correlation (Score:3, Insightful)
Maybe I'm not looking at this deep enough, but what does a piece of hardware for playing MP3s have to do with personal computers?
I'd say it comes down to integration. Yes an iPod works with Windows, and using iTunes no less. On the Mac, however, the experience is very different: iTunes is only a single part of the puzzle. Every one of the iApps, from GarageBand to iMovie, integrate together to make doing any of their tasks hugely easier. It is this that makes using the iPod on the Mac a far nicer experience than it is on Windows.
Re:Not for techs (Score:5, Insightful)
The switch to Apple seems an obvious choice if you can afford an expensive computer and you are neither a big techie or a hard-core gamer.
Gamer I'll give you, but hard core techie? No, don't think so. If you are are a techie the Mac opens up world's of *nix possibilities to you, and if and when you get tired of dinking with X Windows, etc, you have a great GUI for use.
But I personally use my Mac as a fileserver from which I serve video to our other systems (one iBook and an older PC), have a webdav server which we use to consolidate and share calendars, and the UW imapd server setup just for the hell of it.
And now that I think about it, even if you do mean "hardware techie", you can still get your jollies that way, too. When I switched to the Mac I hooked up and successfully mounted the NTFS drive from my old system and was able to get all my old crap off of that. (Can't write to NTFS, but you can read from it.)
No, the Mac satisfies my tinkering desires quite nicely, thanks.
Re:I'd love to be one of those statistics... (Score:2, Insightful)
?!? You'd settle for a (in your own words) P.O.S. Winbox when for $300 more you can get a "P.O.S." iBook? The top of the line 1.33 Ghz (with CD-RW/DVD-R) 14 inch iBook is $1499, while the 12 inch 1.2 Ghz iBooks are listed at the Apple Store [apple.com] new for $999 (with free shipping), or you can hit their "Special Deals" section and get a refurb 12 inch 1 Ghz iBook for $799... or a refurb 1.25 Ghz eMac for $649 .
Re:Not for techs (Score:4, Insightful)
I switched. (Score:5, Insightful)
And yes, I did try Linux, but I always wound up at the same point after installing it: "Ok, now what?" and never having an answer to that question.
Re:Still a small margin (Score:2, Insightful)
you can buy a hell of a lot more hardware four your dollar/euro in Intel/AMD land
For $2500, you can get a very nice G5 PowerMac running OSX. You can pay less for a Dell (corporate versions only, please), but the G5 will likely last longer, and the OS will be less screwed up after 2 years. Hardware has gotten to a point where good enough is comparatively cheap, but software is still a large differentiator - my next computer will be a G5.
Re:Still a small margin (Score:5, Insightful)
While they're there, they notice the other nifty things (like computers), and get pleasantly surprised by the price and/or cool factor and/or features. And then they think about switching.
Personally I'm happy running my Linux on my frankenstein's monsters, but having been in an Apple Store I can see the appeal.
Re:Not for techs (Score:3, Insightful)
Even if it were, PCs have the advantage of being able to tune the hardware features to individual requirements. Expensive components that may only collect dust can be dispensed with.
Plus you can shuffle around things so that you get even BETTER components for those things that really matter too you while still being cheaper than Apple.
Re:Well... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Not for techs (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:One Right Here (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:So sick of iPOD (Score:4, Insightful)
And then there are those of us who have 500+ CDs sitting in our media center shelves. After a decade or two you can build up a large music collection. Not every iPod user is 17 years old.
Repeat after me: (Score:2, Insightful)
It's just as plausible that sunspot frequency affects stock prices or hem lines.
Jeez, people, think a little more critically. Now, granted, brand quality may be a factor in these users' decisions. But it's a far leap to then suggest that it's the cause.
Re:It's iTunes, not the iPod. (Score:4, Insightful)
I simply cannot understand how all iTunes (a free download) users could be iPod users (an expensive peripheral). Given that iTunes is bundled with the iPod rather than vice versa, and that unless you are particularly political in your choice of OS, the iPod as-good-as requires iTunes as its computer-to-peripheral interface, how can iPod > iTunes?
Further, you seem to suggest that iTunes requires you to buy all the music stored therein. I am worried that their are people reading this site who are this uninformed. My iTunes Library is full of >20Gb worth of MP3s, mostly ripped from CDs - I have one iTunes Music Store-bought AAC file. Therefore those who "choose not to pay fees to download music" (i.e. those who download MP3s) will find iTunes an excellent interface for their "borrowed" collection.
Sorry for the tone, but sometimes...
iqu
Dog pees on man. (Score:2, Insightful)
It's called "foot in the door" (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Bought my iPod Mini on Monday (Score:2, Insightful)
The iPod's remote, by contrast, costs $40 and has six buttons and no display. I wouldn't consider it in the same league.
Re:Still a small margin (Score:3, Insightful)
Hard to say. I think it has more to do with brand recognition than the desire to buy a computer that more "natively" supports your iPod. Because their purchase of the iPod has increased their brand recognition of Apple and also made them think, "Hey, this Apple company makes some cool stuff. If their computers are half as cool as this, it's sure to be pretty swell."
It doesn't really matter what OS/hardware the average person uses to surf the 'net and check e-mail. The user interface and experience may be more useful to these people, something that Apple is good at.
Re:Not for techs (Score:1, Insightful)
Quartz and Quicktime, mostly. But Steve has nothing against the underlying technology, he simply derides the "some assembly required" philosophy of Linux, describing that requirement as a good deal more than just "some". You must admit, Apple has done a heck of a good job on assembling things into a very consistent and usable package. Frankly, I think KDE has as well, but it has far more rough patches that they just don't have the resources to iron out (as well a few places where they just don't even try very hard to do so).
Re:Funny how the iPod is successful (Score:3, Insightful)
They're not priced higher than most competitors with comparable features and capabilities.
They're perceived to be priced higher because they don't offer a low-end (POS) to match up against the competition that are driven by the low-end market that those other manufacturers pander to. On top of that, there is no other company that offers the ease-of-use, integration, stability and security that Apple can offer out of the box.
Before the flaming starts, I don't care about what you can scrape together in your home from scouring the universe for inexpensive components because you don't include the value of your own time for those projects, if you did then your "built it myself" boxes are far more expensive than any other machine out there. This is about features and hardware by valid retail/internet manufacturers.
Re:Still a small margin (Score:5, Insightful)
So where is the superior, cheap Intel hardware?
Re:Still a small margin (Score:3, Insightful)
I know if I drove two cars with similar handling, price, and appealing appearence, the presence of something like an in-dash MP3 player or GPS navigation system would seal the choice. }:)
-Z
Re:Funny how the iPod is successful (Score:3, Insightful)
They don't have to put anyone out of business. They just have to sell a few million machines a year. Comparing Apple to most other computer companies is like comparing a Diamler/Benz to a GM. People by other brands because they need a car. People by a Benz because they want a Benz.
Re:Bought my iPod Mini on Monday (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm glad you've seen the truth
About a week or two later, I went out and bought a Powerbook, first Apple computer I've ever owned, and from my experience so far it defeinitely won't be the last
Back to the original point though, since getting the Apple products I've asked (after research of course) numerous questions to the Apple community on the official community boards at apple.com (Dr Smoke rocks) and mac-forums.com - both have resulted in very kind, helpful answers, usually perfectly presented/formatted, in clear English and backed up with facts+links. I've been truly stunned at just how nice, and helpful, people in the "Apple Community" tend to be.
You know, at the risk of sounding mildly troll-ish, some areas of the Linux community would really benefit from that kind of attitude. It could push Linux forward a long way.
There is a little elitism and OS-mockage in some of the posters, just like with any other OS, but no more than others.
Re:Still a small margin (Score:5, Insightful)
It isn't about choosing your computer to suit your peripherals -- you can use an iPod with a Windows box. I think it's more like this. Maybe you had a flash based player before. Clunky, inelgant, with a totally brain damaged idea of what "style" entails. You get an iPod, and realize that it is everything your old player ought to have been: convenient, elegant and sleek.
Then one day while you are listening to your iPod and working on your probably popup infested computer, you have two epiphanies.
Epiphany 1: Windows is clunky and inelegant and ugly.
Epiphany 2: Apple makes computers.
Re:I don't understand some people's stubbornness (Score:5, Insightful)
If you wanted one basic app do do all of the above list you would want iTunes. You != Everyone, in particular Everyone != tech savvy.
The import process is a pain in the behind
You put in a CD and push the button on the top right hand side that says import. Or, if you are particularly lazy, you set the preference that says "import songs on CD insertion". How is this a pain in the behind?
It's a bit of a resource hog
Does it hog more resources than EAC, Nero, and JRMC all running at once? Genuinely curious.
and the interface is nicely non-standard
Or if you wanted too look at it differently, Windows interface is non-standard. As many other comments have pointed out, this is an Apple product ported to Windows made to function as closely as possible to OSX, so, the interface is actually pretty close to "standard" to OSX.
Re:Not for techs (Score:3, Insightful)
Well, a windowing environment that is useable, and applications that most users would consider actually using.
(hint: most non-slashdot reading users don't know of the existance of OpenOffice.)
I am one of those people (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:It makes sense... (Score:2, Insightful)
So you're saying the cost of the software is bundled in? Please stop forcing me to buy software I don't want. That reminds me of a story my friends tells about a college roommate he had. The guy ran across a bargain on produce at a local stand, and brought back to the apartment 3 bags filled with it. He got a great price, but none of the guys in the apartment really ate any vegetables. It all rotted. Good deal, though.
I'd like a iBook deal that costs less and doesn't include iDVD or iMovie. If the cost is bundled in, and I'm not going to use it, it's not a good deal for me.
Quick comparison:
Lowest price preconfigured iBook I can find at the Apple Store [apple.com]:
1.2GHz PowerPC G4
512K L2 cache @1.2GHz
12-inch TFT Displays
1024x768 resolution
256MB DDR266 SDRAM
30GB Ultra ATA drive
Combo Drive
ATI Mobility Radeon 9200
32MB DDR video memory
AirPort Extreme built-in
Cost: $999
Dell Inspiron for same price, from Dell's site [dell.com]:
Intel® Celeron® M Processor 340(1.50GHz/400MHz FSB)
15.4-inch TFT display
1280x800 resolution
512MB DDR SDRAM (333MHz)
60GB Ultra ATA drive
24X CD-RW/DVD Combo Drive
NVIDIA® GeForceTM FX Go5200 (ATI Mobility Turbo is an option)
32 MB DDR video memory
Intel® ProWireless 2200 (802.11b/g) mini PCI wireless card
Cost: $999
So, for the same price, the Dell gives you a bigger display, with higher resolution, twice the memory, twice the HD space... but the iBook isn't expensive because I get iMovie and Garage Band?!?
Re:It makes sense... (Score:3, Insightful)
We think Dell is overpriced as well! Oh look, if you compare Apple with the most overpriced PC vendor, it doesn't look so bad.
Try comparing to eMachines AMD64 Laptops, which are amazing.
Simple Reasons. (Score:3, Insightful)
Most people when upgrading there PC they don't even think about going to Mac. I wasn't when I was thinking about getting a new Notbook a couple of years ago. Then while me and my friends were at the mall they wanted to rent a Tux and I didn't so while they were at the Tux store I went next door to the Apple Store and looked at what they had to offer then I decided I like what I saw. Then doing some more reshearch and cost comparison I decided to get the Powerbook because it was the best deal for what I wanted.
So the popularity of the iPod just basicly reminds people when they need a New PC that Macs are a possible solution.
Of Halos & Macs... It's all about the games... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Bought my iPod Mini on Monday (Score:4, Insightful)
Me too. Oh sure, in any large group there are the trolls and rude people. But by and large you get very helpful responses from the Apple community. I think part of it is the perceived niche status. People who feel they need to stick together to help each other out often do try to be more helpful.
Another part of it is there are fewer resources available for the Apple crowd compared to the Windows crowd, so there seems to be a feeling of 'Well, this site is fairly rare, better make it a good one.' So you get fewer resources, but often the quality of them equals the best of the Windows resources. End result: You have what you need.
And there has to be a sociological aspect to it as well. Apple users must be a self-selected subset of society, a group that is similar to, say, BMW or Mercedes buyers. People who like well-crafted machinery, good performance, ease of use. The kind of person who is drawn to these qualities may also tend to be helpful to their fellow Apple- (or BMW-) owner.
Re:Well... (Score:4, Insightful)
First, I don't know the actual stats on people switching the other way. But even if 6% did switch the other way, it's still not a wash.
Why? Because the number of OS X users is different than the number of ipod users. Assuming (again, don't know the numbers, but it seems reasonable), that there are far far more ipod users than OS X users, 6% of a large number is much much more than 6% of a small number.
Re:Still a small margin (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Mac Envy (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Still a small margin (Score:3, Insightful)
are these the criteria that make a computer good?
Dude, you are talking to a man who in twenty years never failed to lose the case of his computer, at least until I switched to laptops.
That said, you should come down off your high horse. Good design is better than bad design. And poseurs in my experience tend to gravitate towards the latter (SUVs like the Hummer being a case in point -- a more perfect match of ugliness, stupidity and appeal to insecurity has never graced the road).
Good design is more than skin deep: it complements, and in some cases even enhances functionality. My family always drove Buicks when I grew up, and they always had overwrought (bad) instrument panels. I remember my mom muttering as she struggled to set the temperature with a ridiculous thumb wheel control that required something like ten turns to go from one extreme to another so that it could drive a stupid bar graph indicator gadget.
Why pretty much epitomizes bad design: slap some chrome or some gimmick on as an afterthought in order to make a statement.
By contrast, the instrument panel in my accord is almost zen like in its simplicity. It is logical, well laid out, and doesn't have anything that is unnecessary. But it manages to be elegant and is a pleasure to use.
Which epitomizes good design: logic, efficiency, organization and a concern for the user.
elegant and sleek are criteria that make anything! (Score:5, Insightful)
Why do you even assume it's about image and self esteem or feeling better about yourself?
An iPod is undeniably sleek and elegant when compared to everything that came before it, and many that came after it.
The same with Apple computers.
There are TECHNICAL reasons why elegance is a worthwhile attribute for any device, not just mp3 players or computers. Sleekness requires definition, but elegance has it's own context:
Gracefulness.
You can also define things by the inverse, in this case elegance:
Clumsiness.
So if a computer is graceful and not clumsy, I think anyone would agree that it is better than a computer that is clumsy and not graceful.
Re:Still a small margin (Score:2, Insightful)
No. Most people (buying a home computer) buy winTel out of ignorance, fear, or lemming mentality, not because they've determined that it is the best tool for the job. (Yes, there are plenty of "smart" people that buy winTel because they like it - don't get your panties in a twist)
People who buy out of ignorance just don't know any better and are not interested/too lazy to look at other options. People who buy out of fear, do so because they are afraid of change and just want to stick with what is familiar to them. And the lemmings, of course, buy winTel because "if that's what everyone is buying, it must be the superior product."
Most typical home computer tasks are handled as well or better on a Mac (web, email, word processing, digital photography, digital video). The only common "task" that a winTel may handle better is games, but only because of availablity of certain games, not useability.
Re:Still a small margin (Score:5, Insightful)
Your argument is invalid because all of its points have been refuted successfully in this thread and elsewhere on Slashdot, the internet, and the real world.
Apple managed to make a computer that is both elegant and good at its task. Get over it.
There are people in this world with more money than you, and the right to spend it the way they want. Get over it.
Apple's products are not overpriced. It doesn't matter how many times you say it, it's simply not true. Get over it.
Some people have different product requirements than you do. Get over it.
In summary: Get over yourself.
Re:The iPod merely brought attention to iBook or G (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Still a small margin (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Still a small margin (Score:5, Insightful)
A little hint to all those saying this like parrots: it's not true, at all. Pcs crash a lot more, fail more often, cost more for the same power (SAME, not number wise but real-life wise) are constantly being attacked (my anti-virus keep finding stuff about every day, adaware doesn't even remove all of the spyware I get...) and need protection software constantly monitoring the computer for malware, which in turn seriously slow it down and interfere with your normal operations (and YES I use firefox before some fuckin Linux asshole point his wisdom to me). The OS is still clunky as hell, you still have to press start to stop the OS and the interface is built around the concept that you want to work with the computer not on your creations.
In short I deeply regret my switch, I play games on my PC but have switched back to my old iBook dualUSB 500MHz for everything else, this little fellow let me do more stuf in a much more stable way than my 3.4GHz 1GB ram monster PC which cost me 4230$Canadian, monitor included.
Look & Feel (Score:2, Insightful)
But then I was given an iPod (4G 20GB). Just holding it makes me want to go "ahhhhh". The ease of use and functionality made me realize that Windows is just one big compromise. XP is much better than older versions, but it's just not the same.
My current laptop is a 5-year-old IBM ThinkPad. It has served me well. My next laptop will be a powerbook. I really like the ahhhhhhhhhh...
jdw
I can confirm this... (Score:4, Insightful)
Seeing as none of them are particuarly computer literate, I've helped a few of them with various applications. As a result I have become a proponent of Macs for technically-challeneged people. They are in a technological bliss I have never seen with the average casual user.
Instead of continuing the Linux crusade, I suggest techies push OSX on people. It will be an easier switch and will eventually help everyones anti-Microsoft cause. In the end it will even help Linux because software will be built with Windows/Unix cross platformity in mind.
Re:Still a small margin (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Still a small margin (Score:2, Insightful)
I challenge anybody to name a single MS innovation since they ported somebody elses code to the Altair. Not much of a record for a so called 'Industry Leader' hah.