ESR steps down from OSI 503
Hope Thelps writes "According to an article on news.com.com, Eric Raymond is stepping down from his role as president of the OSI. His replacement will be our very own Russ Nelson. "
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ESR steps down from OSI
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Understanding is always the understanding of a smaller problem in relation to a bigger problem. -- P.D. Ouspensky
Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (Score:2, Interesting)
Yeah, now it's free to slaughter 30 million developers and subjugate every user to its iron grasp for fifty years. WTF?
Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (Score:4, Interesting)
Actually, this isn't always the case. For instance, the American Revolution is a good counter-example. Not only were the original revolutionaries not "eaten" but flourished in the government that followed the revolution.
Re:Approval from the OSI? (Score:1, Interesting)
That's why they stopped calling it 'free'. "Free as in you can't even write a license without our say so" didn't have quite the right ring to it.
OSI and its approval of licenses? (Score:4, Interesting)
I'm not sure I like the idea that OSI is pitching itself as "the authority" of license evaluation. Although it is a lot easier to ask the question, "is license A approved by OSI" to mean "is the software licensed under A open source for me" but the question is flawed. One has to recognized that free software licenses are not created equal. The difference of them, and the choice involved, is what makes open source great.
Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (Score:2, Interesting)
I'm not sure I agree with your examples, but I agree that it is a sign that Open Source is growing up. The article also mentioned how Open Source has transitioned from a few volunteer hackers to corporate backed programmers. GNU went through the same transformation, so again I view this as a good thing.
The only concern is how much influence corporate needs drive open source rather than individual desires. However, I think in the end the coporate influence can help solidify Open Source due to the pragmatic nature of most corporations. I would rather have one fairly standard tool (e.g., Open Office) that works pretty well, is quite common, etc. rather than a wide variety of tools that all do pretty much the same thing. Rather than building on the shoulders of those who came before, programmers tend to stand on their toes. ;^)
A good example of the problem I hope this will solve is the age old /. question: "Which Unix Distro do you recommend?" I'm guessing there are a lot of people who haven't tried Linux simply because it is too confusing taking that first step of getting a "Linux".
Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (Score:1, Interesting)
Or a sign that the OSI is finally selling out.
First they approve Non-Free Sun licenses as Open. Now they lose the biggest spokesman for Open. What next, recruit Balmer and Schwartz to the OSI board?
Re:ObESR Link (Score:2, Interesting)
A very interesting read. Thanks for the link.
Re:looks? (Score:4, Interesting)
Russ Nelson is one of the most steady-handed, brilliant, helpful people I've ever had the pleasure to know. I've been involved in small projects with him over the last decade and in every case, if static was being generated, it sure wasn't from Russ' corner.
I think people will be amazed at Russ' wisdom and even hand at making his opinion known or guiding the conversation/productiveness of any projects he leads. He is a uniter.
Any group that has him involved, is a lucky group indeed.
And he looks like a librarian. A really, really cool librarian.
Re:More info on Russ Nelson (Score:4, Interesting)
[tt] ? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:It looks like.. (Score:3, Interesting)
But the original OpenSolaris announcement did say they were bringing someone extremely well respected in the FOSS community to be the fifth board member.
ESR seemed to really have an affinity for Sun's products, he's been the most vocal about them openning Java. Maybe ESR will be joining the OpenSolaris team, which may mean we will be seeing a shift in position from Sun on the patent/CDDL issue.
Then again, could I speculate any more???
Re:Tweedle dumb replaced by tweedle dumber (Score:3, Interesting)
-russ
Re:Stumping for irony. (Score:3, Interesting)
I think you've been drinking too much of the kook-aid that RMS has been handing out.
-russ
Re:It looks like.. (Score:3, Interesting)
Stepping down to do "ambassadorial" and "outreach" work reminds me of all the CEO's who "stepped down to spend more time with their family", or on "other projects" but would "stay on the board as an advisor" during the dot-com bust.
Its good they finally fired him. Woops. I mean let him step down.
Re:OSI approval required for open-source licenses? (Score:1, Interesting)
I notice you have some pics of Reason magazine on your blog. Here's some advice. Try reading it. You and the OSI have the moral authority to stop people "misusing" open source like my cat has the moral authority to stop people from "misusing" open source.
I just hope... (Score:3, Interesting)
Russ has a fairly extreme view on libertarian economics [russnelson.com]. ("Extreme" because few people believe there should be no public liability laws -- I'd link but the archives are broken.) Fair enough; I sympathize even if I wouldn't go quite as far as he does.
My big question is: will he manage to keep his personal opinions separate from his OSI work? I do not want to hear any more OSI-related statements alluding to gun control. It's not just unprofessional, it's also a bad idea in that you may alienate people who like open source but dislike Rand.
Re:Stumping for irony. (Score:1, Interesting)
The biggest issue, as mentioned both on /. and
on groklaw [groklaw.net] is
Now software that only Sun and Microsoft may distribute might count as OSI approved Open Source[wannabeTM]; but it's certainly not Free Software.
[Sorry for the repost, but /code didn't like my poorly formated HTML, so reposting. Yes, I should have previewed too; but at least I didn't call the OSI board a bunch of kooks.]
Re:Uh, ESR is hardly a fanatic (Score:3, Interesting)
RMS has an opinion -- a very strong opinion -- that you (and many others) disagree with. He could be called a fanatic (and this is what the OP was talking about) because his opinion is, from the perspective of most people, "way the fuck out there". I take it this is your position, and it's a valid one.
ESR, on the other hand, is "reasonable" about certain things -- in fact, some of what he says is very insightful -- but sometimes he's just kooky, and by this I don't mean that he espouses a value or set of values that the mainstream finds odd, but rather, that he is at times painfully irrational and, well, beefheaded.
I've read pretty much everything on his website. To me, it seems as though he wants to be RMS. By this I mean he wants the community to respect him the way that RMS is respected (don't laugh now, whatever your personal feelings about him, he has a large following). He says, in numerous places, that RMS's creation of the GNU project -- the project that is essentially responsible, either directly or indirectly, for 80% of all the free/open source software we use today -- is actually nothing particularly special. That anyone could have done it. That in fact, he could have done it.
He says, again and again, that RMS was just "in the right place at the right time". He belittles RMS. Attacks him publicly, personally, but at the same time addresses him by his first name and claims that the two are or have been friends (something I'm in no position to affirm or deny). RMS, on the other hand, never says anything about ESR. He talks about the Open Source movement in a less than flattering way sometimes, but he almost always has a well-thought out reason for it, even if no one really cares what his reasons are.
I disagree with RMS sometimes, and I disagree with ESR sometimes. I agree with them both sometimes. RMS is fanatical about Free Software; but ESR is just a fanatic.
Upsetting (Score:4, Interesting)
What I mean by that is that geeks traditionally are (to put it in politically correct terminology) "neurologically diverse." We seem to typically be either somewhere on the autistic spectrum (I myself was diagnosed in 1992 with a Nonverbal Learning Disorder, which is an autistic spectrum/PDD condition fairly similar to Asperger's) or to have ADHD. I've always thought that RMS's major problem as far as obtaining genuine (mainstream) relevance is concerned is the fact (at least to my mind) that he is deeply and visibly autistic, which seems to be an enormous hindrance to him when it comes to relating to other people.
ESR by comparison is/was relatively mainstream. I certainly won't say completely...but a lot moreso than RMS, and definitely moreso than is usual for the geek/hacker rank and file. In dealing with the corporate world (*especially* boomer corporates) it's absolutely vital that even if you aren't normal, you can convincingly pretend to be for extensive periods of time...which ESR evidently *is* capable of doing.
The point is that we *do* need someone like that, in order to act as a liason with the rest of the planet. Not only for those of us who genuinely can't do it, but also for those of us like RMS who I suspect probably *could* if they really tried, but who see doing so as tremendously immoral.
I understand some people don't like Raymond, and from what I've read of his writings I think I can at least suspect why that is. I think it's true that he probably *does* have an enormous ego, among other things.
But at the same time, in some ways personally I tend to see him as at least vaguely resembling the sort of person I myself would want to be if I had the courage to become self-actualised. I'm not someone customarily given to hero worship...and I'm not saying I engage in that with Raymond either, exactly...he's written things that I disagree with. But controversy about him aside, I think I have been able to see in him a lot which I admire and consider valuable...and I think as far as FOSS is concerned, he *has* made a difference. I hope that even after stepping down from this position, he'll still be willing and able to keep doing so.