TiVo Starts Testing "Pop-up" Ads 603
mkraft writes "ZDNet is reporting that TiVo has started a testing a new pop-up style ad on a random and limited number of subscriber's TiVo as of this weekend. The ads are designed to be displayed on screen when the user fast forwards through specially tagged commercials. Clicking the thumbsup or select button on the TiVo remote will take the user to a menu containing more information about the advertisement (text and/or video).
Unfortunately according to reports on the TiVo Community forums the ads are also showing up during actual programs as well."
"Our goal..." (Score:5, Interesting)
TiVo has gone from a cool company with financial problems to another advertising laden CrapCo that's cutting it's own throat. Even more reason to cancel cable entirely, buy a divx/xvid ready dvd player (well under CA$100) and download what really interests you without ads. Don't worry, the big studios won't starve. They're making buckets on product placement within the shows now.
Replay had a pop up too (Score:5, Interesting)
I have seen the Tivo commercial "thumbs up" but it is really non intrusive and you have only a half second to press the button the get the ad. It is just a matter of time until the commercials are back in your face though. Since I use both Tivo and Replay for comparisons. I am fortunate to pay per month instead of forking of the case for a lifetime subscription. I bet the people that have lifetime memberships will have more popups in the future. My rate of revenue/return via popup ads will approach zero if the become too intrusive.
My opinion... (Score:5, Interesting)
Advertisers simply have to learn to place ads below this annoyance threshold, and they will reap the rewards. One example of a company that 'gets it': Google. Their ads are sufficiently innocuous that it's not worth the trouble to block them or get rid of them. The result? They make lots of money off of ads.
The big networks should realize this. They want to keep their current paradigm, where a person watches 15 minutes of commercials for every hour of TV. That won't work in the future, since the users will use something like TiVo or a download that has no ads in order to get around the annoyance. If, on the other hand, the network offered us a free download of our favourite show, and during each ad segment, there was a single 10-second ad (and it was relatively funny or cool), then we wouldn't skip past it, and they would make lots of ad money.
I think these companies need to wake up to what consumers are really willing to put up with. We are willing to watch ads and buy products we like, but we are not willing to have our time wasted.
Re:So much for TiVo (Score:2, Interesting)
I think it would be interesting if they did something like this for free downloads of shows. 5-10 seconds for an image of the ads that would normally be where a commercial break is. You can pay to not have the ads.
Well, that seals it. (Score:5, Interesting)
Goodbye Tivo, you'll be out of business soon.
Err well.. (Score:3, Interesting)
Also, how are TV networks going to take this? Not only are their ads getting skipped, but now other ones are being shown in their place! Crazyness.
But yeah. Lame. Down with TiVo!
Scrap that Tivo purchase. (Score:4, Interesting)
Oh well. Nice knowing you, Tivo.
Re:Why does this not seem right? Everywhere... (Score:5, Interesting)
Let me see:
1: I drive to the movie house (have you seen the price of gasoline?)
2: Pay an insane amount for a theater ticket (not to mention popcorn)
3: Get 5 minutes of commercials for other products (that's before the 10 minutes of trailer commercials for other movies)
4: PROFIT! (for someone else).
Yeah, its happening everywhere because we aren't pushing back hard enough. So far, legislators in one state are pushing the idea that theaters will be requried to post the actual starting time of the movie.
Just how much more of this do you plan to take?
Re:So much for TiVo (Score:5, Interesting)
Nothing like watching a great show and having to minimize the link for the latest viagra pill with your kids.
Outstanding point. My brother is equally if not more concerned about what ads his children are exposed to while watching TV. One solution was to filter all ads with the notion of there never having been a worthwhile ad to watch. The assumption is that all ads are harmful to children. TiVo was a device that could help parents accomplish such as task.
TiVo Officially Evil (Score:4, Interesting)
Might as well just cross them off the list of "Good Guys" as if the deal with ComCast shouldn't have already strongly suggested that, but consider TiVo have had this ability in there all along and, like summoning a sleeper agent to commit some dastardly act (like replace all your Guinness with Budweiser.)
Adios TiVo. Rot in hell.
Create an "Ads Channel", watch it, you pay less (Score:5, Interesting)
It was the most viewed time slot for the whole week!
Tivo, however, could create an "Ads Channel" where if you watch it, you pay less on your monthly.
To keep viewers honest AND interested make it interactive like having a short survey at the end of the commercial.
They could even make it a game or a game-show (name the advertized product!)
What they have done instead is given their user-base a reason to hack their TIVO box or bail right out of their revenue stream!
Three Seconds.... (Score:3, Interesting)
Personally, I don't care what's on my screen for those 3 whole seconds, it could be black for all I care.
Frankly, if it's something cool, such as a full length movie trailer or a product I like, then I'll pay attention. If not, I'll still ignore it for 3 seconds like I do now...
Yuck (Score:3, Interesting)
I can only imagine that Tivo will eventually bog my S2 down to the point with crap that it's nearly unusable. And this I could probably live with even this and the ads IF Tivo had the brains to come out with an updated standalone box that was worth buying other than for a slightly faster CPU or slightly bigger disk.
But no, Tivo's been staking their future on getting knocked up by a cable company, not on innovating their hardware, so there's no new standalone I can buy that would have WORTHWHILE features like cablecard support (planned for fscking '06???), digital audio recording and playback, a real fast ethernet interface, etc.
Even though I love my Tivo, given what the thing costs relative to my financial commitment with a cable company box, I may have to get used to liking their box, which at least records HiDef.
Piece of information from the article (Score:3, Interesting)
Interactive advertising was part of TiVo's distribution deal with Comcast announced earlier this month.
This functionality was a requirement of TiVo's distribution agreement with Comcast. Rather than 'good company gone evil' I think this is a case of 'desperate company gets in bed with the Devil.'
Now I'm not going to defend this business practice in any way. I've been using the DirecTiVo since day one and have evangelised the product on many occasions in the past, but the second I start getting invasive pop-up advertising during FF I'll shed a tear and move on to something else. TiVo MUST know that this is the sentiment of a significant and vocal number of the install base, which makes me think that they saw no other way forward for themselves.
A sad day indeed for TiVo enthusiasts, and definitely I feel a sign of the 'End of Days' for TiVo.
Class Action...? (Score:4, Interesting)
I have a Dish Network DVR box that still has instant 30 second and back 10 second skip. Hit the skip button 5 or 6 times and I'm completely through most commercial breaks in a second or less. The "fast forward" stuff is crap on a DVR!
DIY TV Station (Score:3, Interesting)
I could even make my own commercials, "Nothing to do? Give your husband a back rub!"
Two Lessons (Score:4, Interesting)
There are two important lessons to be learned from the rise and fall of Tivo. First, don't lock yourself into any pay subscriptions. There is no guarantee they won't turn into ad machines. By subscribing for short periods of time or by using a free or ad supported scheduling service you can demand quality service or walk.
Lesson two, any company can be bought or can partner with one that does not have your best interests at heart. I would not buy a encryption service from the government. I won't buy a garage door opener from a car thief. I won't buy a device to remove ads from TV from someone partnered with those ad providers. It is important to buy products and services from someone motivated to make you happy as their business model. That is no longer Tivo's business model. They make money by making Comcast happy first, and users second. It makes me glad I bought a device without a subscription from someone who does not work with the cable companies. It is also why I don't have to view ads and why I can record what I want, burn DVDs of what I want, and skip 30 seconds without a hack.
Tivo has made a huge mistake, and a very big potential competitor here is MS. I don't trust them at all, but right now they are motivated to making their customers happy with a media center. RIP Tivo.
Way to go TiVo (Score:5, Interesting)
I've never seen a company go so quickly from "cool" to "near sco-level"
If this is true, they can go feck off and die, and rot alongside the rest of the popup mongering scum.
If it's an early April Fools... well... that's another story!
Re:Scrap that Tivo purchase - and buy a replaytv (Score:3, Interesting)
I did call to complain (Score:3, Interesting)
Oh, and I did post a message on their official forum. Twice. They deleted it. Twice. It didn't conform to their warm-and-fuzzy "TiVo is the best!" requirement.
Advertisers pay for the original transmission. (Score:3, Interesting)
That doesn't give them the right to take up that space on my recording of the event.
This episode makes me happy that I have a ReplayTV and not a Tivo.
Re:Why does this not seem right? (Score:3, Interesting)
So it became obvious that it's the advertisers that cover the cost of the magazine. This was made further apparent when I had the "opportunity" to subscribe to a technical journal - one of those 12-page pamphlet dealies with monochrome ink and no ads, for the cost of $95 per year. No freaking way! But that's the price you have to pay if you don't want ads.
So it occured to me - why do they even sell these things at all? I mean, if they're selling ad prices based on pairs of eyes reading the ads, why not just give the things away to ensure the most pairs?
And this is what's happened, sorta. I'm currently getting a few technical publications for free - I got an actually useful spam ad from Fawcette and ever since I've been getting Visual Studio magazine for free. Actually, it's been over a year now so I guess they renewed me for free, too.
The only snag is that the advertising is only worth it if the target demographic is right. So it's been a given for many years now that people who subscribe to a magazine like the topic the magazine is about, so that's how the advertising models work. The 350,000 people who pay $30 a year to get PC Gamer make it such that the advertisers think it's worth it to target those subscribers. I had to fill out a survey to get VS Magazine, so that's how they can justify to advertisers that developers are really reading it. I could find a free sewing magazine out there but I don't sew, so it would be useless for everyone involved.
The only flaw in this logic is that I don't think they actually deny people the free magazines. I found a magazine from Fawcette called "The .NET Magazine", so I signed up for it and took the survey. It became obvious that this isn't a magazine for developers, it's a magazine for the head of the IT purchasing department. So when asked questions like "how much money in hardware purchasing decisions do you make" I answered $0. Same for how much software, etc. I still got the magazine and since then they've had the good sense to rename it "Windows Server System Magazine".
Re:In other news, the sky is falling.. (Score:4, Interesting)
I am a happy user of my cable company's HD DVR (motorola 6xxx model), and I'm a picky SOB. There are a few small annoyances that I can't think of offhand, but its a pretty slick box (and it does not use my phone line).
Being that my cable box is a monthly add on service to my existing cable bill, it would seem illogical for the cable company to add a "feature" like popup ads. Regardless if I view ads or not, the cable company gets the channels at a fixed rate and I pay a fixed rate according to what channels I want. The tv channels get their advertising revenue at a rate based on their audience, not by the view (like web advertising) or according to me viewing the ads or not.
Also, its worth mentioning that I still see a good amount of ads. It seems like I still see the same ad multiple times. In fact, I just went out and bought 8 brand new cars on those low lease deals because the ads were so good to distort my logic. (Just kidding)
Now, TiVo too gets paid the same if you watch the ads or not. So why are they doing this? I guess the base rate of revenue is not paying off their debt fast enough.
Re:Sign up now for "How to kill your product 101" (Score:2, Interesting)
I've said this before on Slashdot - I can tolerate 'ads' on NPR that are spoken in a normal voice (like "this show brought to you in part by HP" or whatever company). There are often ads during Howard Stern that are spoken by him, and these aren't annoying at all. I can even live with product placement in TV, film, and video games. These types of ads do not interfere with the experience in any way and they're very non-intrusive.
I always wondered why anyone would pay for satellite radio receivers and subscriptions, however after listening to a friend's I realized ther a ton of excellent channels with music I like that are commercial free. I'm in the market for a tuner now.
A tad extreme (Score:3, Interesting)
Come on. Exactly what is the harm with this? You're not missing your show. Tivo's just trying to stay alive. Do remember they're a company, and their goal is to sell things and make money. If it's not ads, it's higher subscription fees or more expensive hardware. If they can reduce my fees and stay in business in a nonintrusive fashion, go for it.
Personally, I'd rather see an ad banner while I'm FFing than take your suggestion and download everything I want to watch. Blech. Sounds like you're trading convenience for anti-ad ideology. I'm not much for ideology, I'll take the convenience of a hopefully still alive TiVo.
Remember, "cool companies with financial problems" become "cool bankrupt former companies" unless they find a way to reduce costs or make more money. I don't see an easy way for them to reduce costs, so how else do they make more money?
Re:How did Tivo fail so horribly like this? (Score:3, Interesting)
> subscribers etc etc. And let's face it, the equipment can't be all
> that expensive (for them).
We studied TiVo's business model in one of my MBA classes. Basically, they lose money on each box they sell and they make ridiculous amounts of money for the service -- more than 70% direct margins, if I recall correctly.
So the obvious idea is why the hell is TiVo selling hardware at all? Just sell a service that different devices can subscribe to. The remote control is part of it, but what's killing them in terms of margins is the set-top box.
Personally, I like the concept of TiVo, but I hate the subscription fee idea, and I don't like the idea of buying a lifetime subscription and having TiVo change the terms over time. So no TiVo for me yet.
Re:So much for TiVo (Score:5, Interesting)
My TIVO no longer accepts updates from the mothership, is networked, runs a WEB server to allow me to control it, and can accept additional modifications anytime I want. You can do this and more and it doesn't take much more than some research to do it...
Re:Advertisers pay for the original transmission. (Score:2, Interesting)
The reports of TiVo's demise... (Score:4, Interesting)
Think about it, advertisers want a captive audience for their advertising. They pay for product placement in movies and TV shows because they know the audience is watching attentively. Not true for running commercials on radio and TV. People walk away for a bathroom break, to grab a snack, or any number of other things.
But if someone fast forwards through a commercial, advertisers know that you will be looking at the screen, because you want to stop fast forwarding before the show starts. You are a very captive audience, and you will be looking right at the advertising.
Users may not like the banner ads, especially as TiVo is currently testing them and working out any bugs. In the end though, the ads are an incredibly good thing for TiVo (the company.) As long as TiVo services, TiVo subscription service will continue, and new TiVo models and features will be introduced. Good for TiVo.
There is definitely more positive than negative with the new banner ads.
I'm ready! Tivo, get lost! (Score:3, Interesting)
Count me in.
I've been preparing for this moment for the past several months. My MythTV box is waiting, ready-to-go, so the instant I see my first fast-forward advertisement I'm calling Tivo and telling them to cancel my subscription, effective immediately.
I guess I'll be checking my tivo recordings tonight, phone in hand.
Re:Why does this not seem right? (Score:3, Interesting)
If TiVo continues in this direction I will toss them too.
Re:A tad extreme (Score:3, Interesting)
To me, this is analagous to the ads that movie theaters have been playing in recent years--I'm suddenly the captive audience for a commercial, and I DON'T like it. Not coincidentally, I used to spend a great deal more money than I now do at the movies.
I seek out advertising free zones in my life, and it's always sad to see another one passing away.