Retailers Press For Unified HD DVD Format 293
datemenatalie writes "While the war between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray continues over who will be the direct successor to DVD, the Video Software Dealers Association (VSDA) has issued a strong statement to Hollywood and the consumer electronics industry regarding the looming HD format war. The statement, which supports a single high-definition disc format, also offers advice on dimensions, packaging, features and even how marketing materials should be designed. The statement argues, "two formats, each capable of storing high definition movies on DVD, are planned for release into the market. Retailers uniformly agree that the concurrent distribution of more than one format is likely unsustainable, and that the launch of a single format is preferable to a format war which could confuse the public and lead to reluctance to embrace either format." This comes just weeks after early indications that HD-DVD will only allow playback of full 1080 resolution video signals through HDMI connectors, leaving consumers with older HDTVs (pre-HDMI) out of luck."
Only Marginally Good News (Score:5, Insightful)
Xesdeeni
The question and answer is: (Score:5, Insightful)
war: what's it good for? (Score:3, Insightful)
... ya think?
I certainly hope (Score:5, Insightful)
By all rights, Blu-ray *should* be the next-gen standard. It is superior in just about every way. Which, studying history, means that HD-DVD will probably win out in the end
Why worry about it (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Only Marginally Good News (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:I certainly hope (Score:5, Insightful)
who cares? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:That really hurts HD-DVD (Score:5, Insightful)
Doomed to fail? (Score:5, Insightful)
DVD was successful because in addition to picture and sound quality, the format offered quite a few advantages over the prevailing standard VHS tapes. The new format was more durable (could be played over and over again without degradation), portable (smaller, easier to store), easier to manage (no rewinding, could easily jump to any portion of the film) and provided the viewer with quite a few new valuable features (extra features, commentary, switchable subtitles and foreign languages etc.)
A HD DVD standard only offers the advantage of better picture. I just can't see regular people willing to invest in new equipment and update their video libraries just for that, and in turn I don't see publishers being motivated to offer a large amount of titles in the new standard.
Sure, I'll buy it, but that's because I'm a dork and I like fancy electronic equipment, especially if it shows off the capabilities of my HD TVs. But most people aren't dorks (heck, a lot of people still prefer full screen versions of DVD movies).
Re:Only Marginally Good News (Score:2, Insightful)
Maybe not stupid, but definitely powerless. Boycotts don't exist anymore; they have to be forced on people; e.g. international embargos, regulations, militarily-enforced cartels. Facing a lack of options, most modern people (especially now-minded Americans) will take the best of what is available to them. As a result, anything short of fearing for safety, isn't sufficient to maintain a boycott.
Re:Retailers could force the issue! (Score:3, Insightful)
I don't usually reply to my own posts but in this case I think it's warranted. It wouldn't really take a united retail front. If Wal-Mart, Circuit City, Best Buy and few more of the major retail chains got togather and decided to get behind a single format that would seal the deal. Hell Wal-Mart alone might due the trick, look at how the RIAA bend over backwards to make sure Wal-Mart will carry certain CD's.
Damn, wish I was smart like you. (Score:3, Insightful)
HD is already slow to be adopted. While this has nothing to do with OTA transmission, it will likely hurt public acceptance of HDTV once again. Let's all just wait and see if there is an even more newer-newer-newer standard we'll be forced to switch to.
Well, Blu-Ray is coming anyway. (Score:3, Insightful)
Moreover, Blu-Ray isn't going to hurt the PS3-- since if Blu-Ray movies turn out to never happen, then from a consumer perspective all three video game consoles have the exact same video playback features (they all three play DVDs, though the Revolution requires an adapter and the PS3 has the additional optional bluray ability).
So, what effect does the above have?
Re:Why worry about it (Score:3, Insightful)
I bet you think it's a good idea that you have no fewer than five different digital cellular phone standards in the United States. Inter-operator roaming is unheard-of (because of differing standards), resulting in every operator having to build their own network EVERYWHERE, which they obviously can't do. So you get worse call quality because there are less usable cellphone towers for you (since you can obviously only use one service at a time).
Europe went with GSM, and cellphone coverage has not been an issue in Europe since, oh, about 1995. Even the remotest locations in Finland tend to have perfect signal quality. The GSM standard is open, allowing any manufacturer to produce devices for it. All in all, this decision has benefited both consumers and the manufacturers. But boo fucking hoo, I guess fake freedom overrides sanity and clear consumer benefits on the other side of the pond.
(I call it fake freedom because the lack of a single standard actually makes it EASIER for operators in the United States to lock people into their service only - you can't take your mobile phone and use it with some other service. Don't give me the crap about being able to unlock your phone - most people don't realize that this is an option and the benefits are not transferred all the way to the customer anyway - you're paying the same $29,95 a month whether you bought a phone with the service or not!)
(Note: This post contains exaggerations which are necessary to drive the point through. If you reply, please concentrate on the meat instead of the hyperbole.)
Re:Same story, different product (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:HDMI Only? (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm sure it wouldn't be long until somebody creates a little dongle that will convert HDMI to a S-Video or Component signal and defeats any DRM imposed at the same time.
Same applies to Gnome vs. KDE (Score:1, Insightful)
As far as I'm aware (Score:5, Insightful)
As far as I'm aware, the advantage is and always has been easy backward compatibility for the content industries. From the consumer perspective, Blu-Ray and HD-DVD will be equally backward compatible with DVD, and both will achieve this backward compatibility in the same way-- by adding a third laser to the two which DVD drives already possess (one laser for CD frequencies, one laser for DVD frequencies, one laser for the "blue" HD disc frequencies).
In fact from the consumer perspective if anything Blu-Ray is more backward compatible than HD-DVD-- because it is possible to manufacture Blu-Ray discs which can be placed in a standard DVD or CD player, and which appear as DVDs to a DVD player and Blu-Rays to a Blu-Ray player. (However, it is unclear if any such Blu-Ray discs will ever be manufactured, and anyway it may not be too late for HD-DVD to adopt this same feature.)
The tauted "backward compatibility" of HD-DVD is, as noted above, from the perspective of a content producer. That is to say, you can manufacture HD-DVDs in the same machines you manufacture DVDs in, with some slight upgrades. If you wish to manufacture Blu-Ray discs, you must buy a new machine. Of course, we are told, if it is cheaper to manufacture HD-DVDs than Blu-Ray discs because you don't have to buy new machines, then the discs will be cheaper for the consumer as well. Hooray for trickle-down economics!
And of course from the perspective of a content producer, forcing your cattle, I mean consumers, to buy new "secure" equipment-- as HD-DVD does and Blu-Ray probably will-- is a big plus.
No guarantees with bendable standards (Score:3, Insightful)
As long as the running battle continues on securing DRM, nothing you buy will be safe from flexible standards; each standard will go through a phase of being new, then being cracked, then being replaced with something else which renders previous versions obsolete and "non-standard".
I'm not really pissed because I'm not interested in buying into HD DVD unless it's Blu-Ray, usable on my PC, and as usable for home recording as my current Panny E80 HD recorder is.
Re:The question and answer is: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:I certainly hope (Score:3, Insightful)
You think BluRay won't? Just because Sony hasn't announced it won't doesn't mean it won't. Sony is notorious for giving the consumer a big "screw you," so I'd expect them to be announcing the same thing in about 3 months (their release schedule is about 6 months behind HDDVD). Hell, Sony is both a hardware and content producer, so they'd really want to lock out the analog hole.
Toshiba locking out older HDTVs and Microsoft saying the next Windows will suck balls for playing media on current monitors (do you even know anyone with a monitor supporting HDMI? I don't, and I have a newer LCD) are both trends in the market that aren't going away. Sony will probably step right in line.
My hope right now is that the consumers will be so jaded that no new technology works with the expensive stuff they just bought the past two years and have no guarantee the format they buy will be around next year that they just refuse to support EITHER format and refuse to upgrade to the new Windows. I think these large companies need to find out who really pays their bills.
Both formats destined to die? (Score:4, Insightful)
1) A new TV @ £1500 Sterling.
2) A new HD-DVD/blueray player @ £?
3) Copies of Films I possibly already have to play on it @ £?
4) An upgrade to my satalite equipment to receive HD content (2 channels atm?) @ £?
5) An upgraded sat subscripition. @ £?
You know...to me (IMO) the above does NOT lead to
6) Profit!!
Why? Because in 5 years time, when all this stuff is priced at a more reasonable level and the quality/quanity of content could justify upgrading...there WILL be a new/better/cheaper format on the horizon (and VERY close to the horizon as well given this tech were talking about now is nearly 2 (lab) years old).
Even worse is MANY consumers (well those of us with better than NTSC) WONT be able to see the real benefits to the upgrade and are NOT going to be replacing that DVD collection; uptake in the mass market is likely to be quite slow.
This is quite probably going to lead to this generation of "technology" being largely shuned in the market place or only occupying a niche in the "videophiles" high end market and eventually going the way of laserdisc!!
So let the release both formats!! It will only quicken the demise for both and HOPEFULLY somewhere in the implosion the draconion copy protection measures will take some of the flak!
The fight is over (Score:5, Insightful)
In the same 18 month period that the most optomistic forcasts have 500,000 HD-DVD players sold Sony is projected to sell 15-20 million PS3's - which will include a BD player. Given the forecast price of the PS3 you can bet a large percentage of families are not going to be willing to buy that and a seperate hd-disk player when they get both in the Sony package.
Given that the studios are complete whores and given the substantial decline in DVD sales, they are going to sell BDs for the PS3 no matter how much they prefer HD-DVD - they won't have a choice if they want to keep their phony-baloney jobs.
After two years - an installed base of 20M+ vs. an installed base of 2M+.... It won't even be a contest, and there are no viable theories that contest these well hashed over market projections (with the possible exception of the PS3 never being released.) Even if the X-box takes 50% of the market (Microsofts finest dream, not considered likely) that's still 15M PS3s in the first 18 months.
Oh, and for all the HD-DVD partisans who try to say that Sony will drop BD from the PS3 (other the n the complete absurdity of that contention) Just keep in mind that Sony can count the royalties it gets from every BD sold (and into the future) to subsidize the market price of the PS3 from day one due to the lock it will give it on the next generation format.
Re:Wow, read this part (Score:3, Insightful)
Manufacturers who refuse to lock down their boxes securely will wind up seeing all their keys revoked and it will be impossible to purchase any kind of warranty/insurance coverage on their devices.
It's actually a well thought-out evil plan.
Re:Only Marginally Good News (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:ROFL!!! (Score:1, Insightful)
I'm in the market for a new TV. A few months ago, I knew nothing about HDTV. I didn't even know the difference between plasma and LCD. All I knew was HDTV was supposed to be the "good thing" now. So did I go out and buy the first shiny HDTV that a blue-shirt told me to buy? No, I did extensive research, which helped a lot, because it showed me that the TV I thought I wanted in the beginning wasn't really what I wanted.
I also know nothing about vaccuums, but if I was to buy one tomorrow, you better bet I'd be looking up reviews and complaints tonight.
"Yeah, but not everyone know how to research the 'net for relevant information."
Yeah, and there are still people in the country who still use outhouses. So?
Re:Both formats destined to die? (Score:4, Insightful)
I doubt many people are going to go out and buy a new TV so they can watch HighDef Discs. In the US, most everyone is going to end up with a new digital TV over the next few years, with or without HD-DVD/Blu-Ray.
It's most likely that you are going to need to buy a new DVD player to hook-up to your new digital TV, anyhow.
Nonsense. You can play all of your current DVDs on the next gen of DVD players. No re-buying necessary, unless you're die-hard, and WANT to spend money to get copies of your current movies in HD.
The two big sat companies in the US essentially GIVE AWAY their equipment, and I don't see the upgrade to HDTV equipment being any different. They will also be carrying far more HDTV channels, very soon.
This is up in the air. I think it's most likely the satellite and cable companies will charge about the same rates for HD as they do for current television. They are making such huge profits as-is, and they have equal operating costs whether they have 1 subscriber, or 1 billion.
So, to summarize.
1) Everyone will be getting a new HDTV eventually.
2) You'll want a new DVD player, and high-def ones may be nearly as cheap.
3) You don't need to re-buy any movies.
4) Probably Free.
5) Probably the same as current prices.
That's a pretty ridiculous claim to make. We've stuck with the current TV standard for 50+ years now. I can't see anything above HDTV comming along in the next few decades. Since BluRay/HD-DVD have enough room to do full-resolution HDTV, it's very unlikely something else will come along to replace it on HDTVs.
Absolutely ridiculous. No doubt you're talking about PAL, which is just slightly higher res than NTSC... HDTV DOUBLES the vertical resolution, and almost triples the horizontal resolution.
That would be 1.8 times the vertical, and 2.5 times the horizontal, if upgrading from PAL. Plus, you'll get a 20% increase in refresh-rate, which is a huge improvement.
NOBODY NEEDS TO REPLACE THEIR DVD COLLECTION.
Since you've got almost everything else wrong, I can't see any reason to have any faith in your conclusions.
LaserDiscs were huge and cumbersome, and you needed multiple discs for one single movie. The price was also prohibitive. BluRay/HD-DVD are certain not to suffer from the first problem. The second, though, is entirely up to the studios. Whether the HighDef formats live or die depends on the prices of the movies released for them, and the difficulty of circumventing the copy protection to a lesser extent.
Since I don't know how they are going to price the HD movies, I can't say if it will be a success or not, but it's certainly got everything else going for it.