Kurt Vonnegut Jr. Dies At 84

At least twenty-two readers took the trouble to make sure we knew that Kurt Vonnegut has died at 84. From the Times obituary: "Kurt Vonnegut, whose dark comic talent and urgent moral vision in novels like 'Slaughterhouse-Five,' 'Cat's Cradle' and 'God Bless You, Mr. Rosewater' caught the temper of his times and the imagination of a generation, died last night in Manhattan... Mr. Vonnegut suffered irreversible brain injuries as a result of a fall several weeks ago, according to his wife, Jill Krementz." Reader SPK adds: "He will be remembered not only as a great writer, but also as a staunch civil libertarian (long-term member of the ACLU) and as a 'mainstream/literary' author who integrated science fiction concepts into his writing. So it goes."

Bokononist last rites

[djdead]

God made mud.
God got lonesome.
So God said to some of the mud, "Sit up!"
"See all I've made," said God, "the hills, the sea, the sky, the stars."
And I was some of the mud that got to sit up and look around.
Lucky me, lucky mud.
I, mud, sat up and saw what a nice job God had done.
Nice going God.

So long, Kurt...

[Lurker2288]

...from those who have taken a flying fuck at a rolling donut, or a flying fuck at the moooooon.

Another one bites the dust. Ho hum.

Thanks for the good reads, Kurt

[drewzhrodague]

Thanks for the good reads, Kurt. Time to go through my bookshelf, and do a little rediscovery. Thanks so much.

a little less love

[stoolpigeon]

a little more decency - please.

I'd easily have traded all of hollywood,

[Spazntwich]

to give that man 10 more years.

The world is truly poorer for his loss. :-(

Kurt Vonnegut dies at 84.

[penp]

So it goes.

Kurt is up in heaven now

[antifoidulus]

Mitigating circumstance to mentioned on judgement day: he never asked to be born in the first place.

RIP

Re:Thanks for the good reads, Kurt

[Scott7477]

A big part of my appreciation for Vonnegut lies in the fact that his work has been accepted as literature by the literary elites while including elements of science fiction. Typically science fiction is not considered to be literature.

Re:Bokononist last rites

[hey!]

I wonder if he died while thumbing his nose at God.... It would seem a fitting gesture.

The inability to conceive of a God who would find that amusing is the biggest reason that belief is on the decline.

The idea of an omnipotent God who creates a creature capable of reason, then throws an eternal hissy fit when that creature doesn't spend all his time telling God how wonderful He is... Well it seems like rather insecure behavior for an all powerful, all loving being.

A God who didn't want anybody in heaven unless they had the spunk to spit in His eye would make more sense. So Vonnegut, you're in. Give my regards to Twain when you see him.

Re:Tralfamadore

[Harry Coin]

"Pulls plug on cancer patient living in delirious agony."

Good or evil?

"Builds nuclear weapon to figh WWII."

Good or evil?

"Allows birthing mother to bleed to death to save baby."

Good or evil?

"Beheads monarchy to establish democracy in France."

Good or evil?

"Creates strawman to win argument on Slashdot."

Good or evil?

The rules are signposts, not walls, and all morality is relative. Deal with it.

Re:Bokononist last rites

[MoronBob]

The Bible states "God made man that he might have joy". I would rather focus on this belief. I did not have children so they could worship me. I want them to have all that I do and much more. I did not get to go to college but I will make sure they have that opportunity. God is our parent. He asks us to follow the commandments. He does not strike us down if we don't. But we must live with the consequences of our actions and this grieves him when we make bad choices. The evangelical belief that if you don't believe exactly as they do you will burn in hell fire for all eternity is crap. We will receive exactly what we deserve. If you do good and are good to people then you will be rewarded with the chance to progress. If you used your talents to harm others you will be dammed. (Dammed as in you will not be allowed to progress like the water behind a dam.) The real God is more forgiving, more loving, more tolerant, and more just than most can imagine. Thats why I believe in him.

Re:Thanks for the good reads, Kurt

[Moofie]

A big part of my appreciation of Vonnegut has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with what a bunch of "literary elites" think about anything.

As a matter of fact, I can't think of a single time in my life that I thought to myself, "Gee! I wonder what the literary elites would think about that?"

Re:Bokononist last rites

[C0y0t3]

I have to disagree with your interpretation of a pretty straightforward phrase, "men were created to worship god". Although it could be seen as meaning what you suggest, that men benefit from worship, the statement is obvously designed to be at least initially interpretted as "the purpose for which men were created was to worship god, god created us to worship him". You have to bend over pretty far backward to see the other interpretation as primary, but most religious people probably perform these sorts of logical contortions without batting an eye daily if not continuously. theres no need to justify them, controversy is supposed to occur. they are not content with your atheism

Re:Bokononist last rites

[geekoid]

Why is it that atheists know theology better then the worshipers?

Re:Bokononist last rites

[bkr1_2k]

Because Atheists question, and read. "Believers" simply believe, and by doing so think that all the questions are already answered.

I can't say who's right, but I can certainly say I raise my kids to question everything, even me, if they don't understand it.

Re:Bokononist last rites

[Johnny5000]

Why is it that atheists know theology better then the worshipers?

I think learning enough about theology is probably enough to turn anyone into an atheist.
Read enough holy books, and you'll realize they're lovely fictional works that do contain some generally good lessons, but couldn't possibly be the work of a superhuman being.

Re:Bokononist last rites

[kripkenstein]

Why is it that atheists know theology better then the worshipers?

Do you mean, why do I presume to understand religion better than a person who believes in it? Or, on the contrary, do you mean that the believers are misled about their own beliefs? I'm not sure.

In any case, I think that knowledgable people know more about everything. A learned believer, or a learned atheist, will know about the same. But the vast majority of people are unlearned in such matters. As a consequence, the majority of believers do not fully understand the complexities of their religion, while all of the atheists who are interested enough to learn about religion will know quite a bit (but exactly the same as the learned believers). That may be misleading at first glance, of course.

Re:Bokononist last rites

[Anonymous Coward]

Since you referenced the Bible, maybe you could explain your contradictory views. Several times God kills his followers for not obeying him. How does this make him a good parent, as in your analogy? And then it's clearly said in the new testament that the one necessary condition to go to heaven is believing in Jesus. You can be a kind Buddhist priest who would never harm a soul, but that's irrelevant.

You seem like a nice guy, and I would like this notion of social justice to be true too, but wanting does not make it so.

Now get going, you have a big book to rewrite.

Re:Bokononist last rites

[Bush Pig]

There are two reasons, it seems to me. One is that atheists are generally smarter and better educated than believers. The other is, that it's useful to understand the mind of your enemy.

Re:Bokononist last rites

[hesiod]

I don't know the poster's POV, but for many people, being a Christian and using parts of the Bible doesn't necessarily mean you believe the whole thing is true, or even that any of it is meant to be taken literally.

Too many times people try to refute Christians by trying to force a false dichotomy "Either you believe the entirety of the Bible is the infallible word of God, or you are a heretic to your own religion." That's just dishonest to try to do that.

No insult intended to you, I just wanted to reiterate the point. /I'm an atheist, FYI