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ZOMG New Zunes 358

Posted by CmdrTaco
from the can't-begin-to-care dept.
BarlowBrad writes "From PC World: "Microsoft announced a new slate of Wi-Fi-equipped Zune players today, including $150 4GB and $200 8GB flash-based players, and a $250 80GB model that's slimmer than the original Zune. All of the new models feature touch-sensitive controls and wireless syncing with your PC, a much-demanded feature that Microsoft will also make available on the original 30GB Zune when the new models debut in mid November." Wireless. More space than a Nomad. But draw your own conclusions."
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ZOMG New Zunes

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  • But... (Score:5, Funny)

    by cayenne8 (626475) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:35PM (#20839027) Homepage Journal
    ...can I hack it into a working phone, and then connect it to AT&T....?

  • by Stormwatch (703920) <<rodrigogirao> <at> <hotmail.com>> on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:36PM (#20839037) Homepage

    Wireless. More space than a Nomad. But draw your own conclusions.
    Lame.
    • by mabhatter654 (561290) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:43PM (#20839149)
      can't buy tracks from the largest online sellers that support windows OS.. napster, walmart, itms.... doesn't work on my mac.... no web surfing or 3rd party software hacks.
    • by CrazyTalk (662055)
      Actually, for the first time, we see a device that HAS wireless and HAS more space than a Nomad - perhaps it WONT be lame.
      • by hedwards (940851) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:57PM (#20839407)
        The nomads were good solid players. They just sucked in the way that most Asian made hardware does, a lack of interest in developing drivers, firmware or support software. The hardware, was for the most part reliable, as long as you just used the base unit, and treated the headphone jacks with some degree of caution. Never had an issue with it myself.

        I know that it is popular for ipod users to badmouth the competition, but the other players aren't bad, they just aren't as popular with thieves. From what I gather, the original zune wasn't a bad player, the woman I know that ones one was happy with it.

        Not being compatible with walmart isn't a bad thing, as they pretty much insist on destroying any groundbreaking non pop music they can find, but not being easily used at other stores is probably a bigger problem. And not necessarily the ITMS, although that is rapidly changing, most ipod users apparently don't use the apple store much, so it shouldn't represent a problem for most people.
        • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

          by ScrewMaster (602015)
          ... most ipod users apparently don't use the apple store much, so it shouldn't represent a problem for most people.

          Does that mean iPods truly are, after all is said and done, little more than repositories for stolen music like the RIAA says?
  • by nweaver (113078) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:37PM (#20839049) Homepage
    You still only get 3 plays out of stuff you transfer to friends...
    • by moderatorrater (1095745) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:47PM (#20839229)
      I go with the old frat-house adage that any squirt is a good squirt.
    • Take your bitching to Apple and have them add sharing files to the iPod :)

      * I'm sure there's some, somewhere.
      • With a Touch or iPhone, I can buy the song myself right on the spot if I like it.

        Being able to buy songs right on your device is a more powerful form of sharing, since it works regardless of which device either person has.
        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by badboy_tw2002 (524611)
          Wait, are you for Apple or MS? Because

          "Being able to buy songs right on your device is a more powerful form of sharing,"

          sounds like spin out of the MS PR department: "Paying a license fee to see our source is more powerful form of open source because you know what you're getting is supported code"

          Just admit its a better feature than the iPhone/Pod and move on with it. You'll still get into Apple Heaven when you die, and be greeted by a hundred user-friendly black turtlenecked angels blowing their iTrumpe
    • I never really understood this complaint. Mostly because I know of no other portable MP3 players that allow you to transfer songs wirelessly quickly. Isn't three plays better than zero plays? Ignoring the DRM issues (I never heard for sure whether squirting wraps the song in DRM or not), but this doesn't sound like that horrible of an idea.

      disclaimer: I don't own a Zune, Ipod, or even a Rio.
    • This random 3 plays limitation has a terrible uncertainty feeling. The 3 plays are so arbitrary when it comes to how people listen to music, or evaluate it. That's why it's a stupidly thought-out limitation: MS just doesn't get it.

      Firstly, how are the 3 plays counted? What if I start listening to the song while working, but then I take the headphones off while a coworker asks a question? If I forget to hit pause, the song will finish playing, but I won't hear it. What if I'm scanning through songs on shuffl
  • by PortHaven (242123) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:37PM (#20839055) Homepage
    In other words...

    "Microsoft releases iPod killer. However, the new Zune was designed to kill the last generation of iPods - not the currently released iPods."
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by cp.tar (871488)

      So, basically, it's just like any other Microsoft product compared to an equivalent Apple product.

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      The currently-released iPods are plagued with problems [apple.com], so you might want to hold off on the sucking-up for a moment.
      • by Bobartig (61456)
        plagued with problems? This doesn't describe my experience, and the numerous happy owners of nano fattys and iPod touches that i know. Maybe its all the classic, I don't know anyone who has one. Either way, youre just being overly alarmist.
    • by Lumpy (12016)
      actually it was designed to kill Gen 1 ipods, but they needed to change a few things to make the muisc labels happier, so now it's only capable of killing 1st gen mp3 players from RCA.

      The 3rd gen Zune will only accept music from their pay service, and delete the songs after 10 plays making you pay for them again.

      You think I am kidding?
    • by p0tat03 (985078) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @01:47PM (#20840213)

      Wow, and I thought *I* was a Apple fanboy. C'mon, I run multiple Macs at home, and I own an iPhone, and even I like the new Zunes.

      Same price, same storage, but wireless sync? On that itself I'm sold. But now add a DRM-less online store with an optional subscription model? Score. Larger screen than the iPod classic? Score too. If the battery life can live up to iPod, this thing is a clear winner for the time being.

      The "Zune Nano" is a bit of a disappointment. The specs are nice, but in the end the design leaves much to be desired. The black border around the screen screams "We couldn't put a larger screen in here so we'll just pretend"... Either give us a bigger screen or a smaller device, or at least find an aesthetically improved way to get around the problem. IMHO these things need to have a storage edge over the iPod nano if they expect to win.

      The big-boy Zune though... that's going to give iPod a run for its money on the Windows side.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by brajesh (847246)
      they did something else which is noticeable too:
      http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/zune/firstgen-zune-getting-all-the-new-features-this-is-how-you-treat-your-customers-306422.php [gizmodo.com]

      All. Sure, the new Zune is more of a half step forward than a completely new design. But Microsoft's done something fantastic here by rewarding first gen buyers with cool new stuff that also happens to be free by software upgrade. And talk about spin-- Microsoft just took a middling jump in hardware and turned it into a genuinely good mov

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by falcon5768 (629591)
        And as was pointed out by numerous people in that thread, Apple does that too IF the previous gen iPods can support it with their chip/memory. My 1st gen iPod got a number of new features over its lifetime, as has my fiance's mini, and her sisters nano. A simple search of Apple's download site would pull up a slew of Firmware upgrades for all their generations that added new features to older iPods.
    • "Microsoft releases iPod killer. However, the new Zune was designed to kill the last generation of iPods - not the currently released iPods."

      The term "iPod killer" is generally used for MP3 players that have some supposedly cool feature that the iPod doesn't have and that nobody wants, and "iPod killers" tend to disappear quite quickly. Microsoft is a different case; it won't disappear until Microsoft's losses on Zune exceed Apple's profit on the iPod.

      I have never heard that SanDisk is making any "iPod killer", and yet somehow they managed to become number two in the market, where Microsoft is maybe a distant number four.

  • by mattgreen (701203) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:38PM (#20839069)
    Do we hate this irrationally still? I don't read the newsletter much, but I want to feel like I fit in.

    Thanks!
    • by spun (1352) <loverevolutionary@@@yahoo...com> on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:46PM (#20839221) Journal
      No, we've always hated it rationally. Also, you don't have to do what the herd does to fit in here, you can also post smart, witty, insightful, or intriguing posts. If they are well written, and the arguments presentedtherein are cogent, you will be accepted here, as is the case anywhere that nerds congregate. Good luck.
      • by langelgjm (860756)

        Also, you don't have to do what the herd does to fit in here, you can also post smart, witty, insightful, or intriguing posts. If they are well written, and the arguments presentedtherein are cogent, you will be accepted here, as is the case anywhere that nerds congregate.

        What planet do you live on, and how do I get there?

        More seriously, it seems to me that "Overrated" has become a synonym for "What you say may be true, but I don't like it (or you), so I am going to mod it down."

      • by Liquidrage (640463) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @01:02PM (#20839477)
        What is the rational arguement then?

        You can rip your CD's, or get Mp3's or whatever from elsewhere that don't have DRM built into them, and it'll never question where your music came from. It's had a nice form factor and disk space for the price. Had a nice looking screen, and built in FM.

        A DRM-gimped wireless music sharing feature that no other device really has anyways? OK, so don't use it.
    • by fbjon (692006) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:47PM (#20839245) Homepage Journal
      I find your ideas outdated, and wish to unsubscribe [slashdot.org] you from our newsletter.


      By the way, given the headline, shouldn't Zonk have posted this story?

    • by hobo sapiens (893427) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:47PM (#20839257) Journal
      "Do we hate this irrationally still?"

      No. It is hated because it's an inferior product. Maybe it has nice capabilities, but these are then crippled by obsession over "content protection". The Zune is made to placate the RIAA, from it's DRM laden squirt "feature" to the pirate protection cost built into the price. It totally ignores even MSFT initiatives like playsForSure, which is just sloppy in my opinion. In fact, that's why I hate it the most. Not because of the DRM (because I don't care about that since I won't buy one) but because of the sloppy you'll-take-what-we-give you attitude from MSFT. They didn't even have the foresight to make it play well with their own stuff.

      So, to sum up: hated, yes. Irrationally, no. There is no newsletter to read here, just read about the product.
      • by mattgreen (701203)
        So do you wake up every night at precisely 2:43am in a cold sweat, and shake your fist in the general direction of Redmond, yelling, "CURSE YOU FOR RELEASING ZUNE! CURSE YOU!! I SHALL HAVE MY REVENGE!!"? Of course its an inferior product with limited capabilities. Why do you think it hasn't taken over the market? Along with 20 other me-too products that have one or two additions over the iPod. Except they aren't the subject of this "hate." You never hear about the little Samsung player or the crappy early Z
        • *sigh*

          The only reason I am replying to this post is that it made me laugh. That has to count for something, even if you said I was backpedaling. As if!

          I feel about the same way about the Zune as I do when I see a colossal trainwreck [hvysl.org] of a web site (since I am a web developer). No, there is no personal vendetta, it just irritates that someone could be *that* inattentive to details...well, no, details is the wrong word here. I should say inattentive to things that *aren't* minor details, like, oh, backward
      • by p0tat03 (985078)

        Well, then I would hope your hate for the iPod is several times that of this new Zune. Even from an Apple fanboy like myself I have to admit that the Zune is much more open than the iPod. DMR-less store? Sharing of files (albeit in a limited way)? It's not the freest device it could possibly be, but it's certainly better than anything else on the market. And unless they leave out mass storage, you can at least pull files off it (unlike a pod-like device out there).

        From my first impressions it looks like M

      • by suv4x4 (956391) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @01:58PM (#20840429)
        No. It is hated because it's an inferior product.

        What defines inferior. WiFi sync, WMV support and FM are useful features to me, and the fact i don't need to run the hideous iTunes Win port is yet another great feature.

        The second generation of Zunes looks quite promising (the first didn't quite) both as form factor, weight, battery life, features, capacity and price. And the 80 GB model has real earbuds, not the garbage shipped with iPod which you throw away and buy 3rd party ones.

        I don't have too much love for Zune, but it's a nice product in its second generation. Don't forget Microsoft always hits a homerun on attempt 3 ;)

        Last question: Do you always hate inferior equipment? Why on Earth *hate* it? Ignore it, dismiss it, not buy it, tell your friends it's not a good buy sure. But hate it? Someone has issues.
      • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

        by GeckoX (259575)
        ZOMG!!! It's from MS so say something against it and watch the mod points roll in!!!!
        Even if it's total bullshit!!!
        Even if it disses things that this does better than the comparable Apple product!!!
        But don't diss the Apple product or you'll be modded into oblivion ZOMG!!!!

        Sorry, but someone has to say this, what a pile of fucking crap.
        There is absolutely NOTHING mentioned that isn't the same or WORSE with the iPod, and yet that is gold plated and shit-stain-proof isn't it?

        'sloppy you'll-take-what-we-give yo
    • I picked up a white Zune for $150 off of Woot a month or so ago (I think you can get them off of there now for a bit less when they come up). It cost about as much as a 2gig Ipod nano at the time and had 15x more space. It was much bulkier but it could play videos and I have pockets. I don't care about squirting the music so I turned the wireless off.

      So far I'm pretty happy with it and the only things I'd change are that it's difficult to put videos on it, the battery life is shorter than the nano, an
  • by MoFoQ (584566) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:39PM (#20839101)
    what about the DRM "feature" that essentially made the original zune so...pointless and unwanted by many?
    • by dedazo (737510) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @01:30PM (#20839961) Journal
      You mean sharing songs with people wirelessly and getting to listen to those songs three times? Which is three times more than the iPod? Does that make it "unwanted by many"? Because otherwise the "DRM" thing is applicable only to songs purchased from their online store. You can rip your song collection and put it in the Zune without involving any DRM whatsoever. Is this not how the iPod works as well?
      • by BlueHands (142945) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @02:19PM (#20840833)
        So, i was reading a number of the comments that said basically the same thing - it might not be good, but it is better than nothing. Obviously some people feel it is NOT better than nothing, myself included and I wasn't sure why. So, I started thinking about it, trying to understand why I felt the way I did.

        I think part of it is a feeling of MS being dishonest. It feels like they are trying to "cheat" the users, to cheat me. "Here is what you want, but not really, so why don't you buy our crippled product."

        It ALSO feels like it carries a certain mental baggage. By accepting that someone else can only play it 3 times, I am buying into a system that thinks DRM is a good thing in a very obvious way. With the iTunes/iPod connection, DRM is still there but it is not nearly as blatant. Basically, Apple doesn't get the same grief because the are better at seduction then MS. Apple is the smooth talker that just says, "hey baby, marriage just is not for my thing. Maybe it will be someday." While MS says, "I could give you what you want but I am not going to. Deal."

        It is a strange situation. We geeks often hate MS and love Apple. Both are not giving us what we clearly want, but one is more upfront and honest about it. You could also say blunt even. Which, if either, is better? Personal choice I think. Some of us prefer the pleasant lie, some prefer to take whatever we can get right now.

  • Microsostrich (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Space cowboy (13680) * on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:41PM (#20839121) Journal
    It seems Microsoft's answer to the ipod Touch and the iphone interface id to ignore it completely. And whereas the improvements to the Zune (V1, I suppose) are welcome and useful, I don't really see how it is supposed to beat out an ipod any time soon. What people will do is compare the Touch to the Zune (no matter how unfair that comparison is), conclude that the touch is better, and then buy an ipod if they can't afford the Touch. Yes, people are weird that way - having the market-leader, even if it's not generally affordable, is a big push for sales across the board.

    Also, it's not the player - I still can't believe people are missing this. It's the synergy of the player, the music, the store, the industrial design, the marketing and the ubiquity. MS have just changed maybe 2 of these (the design looks to be better). That's not sufficient.

    If you saw any of the zune V1 adverts, I think you'll agree they were just plain weird - Apple's promotion of (ahem) a *music* player was to show people enjoying their music. Microsoft's approach should be a case-study in how not to market stuff -
    • "the social" is a term of derision for unemployment benefit,
    • "squirting" music. Really ? That was really what you came up with ?
    • brown. Enough said. (although some will like it, it's not the #1 choice of everyone, is it?)
    • Complete disconnect from the product when marketing it. What ???
    • I could go on... the problems were legion


    Let's see if they do better this time around. I think they will, marginally. I still don't think they have a world-changer on their hands, and that's what they need - in the same way as Apple need a world-changer to upset the MS hegemony in the PC sphere; even with steadily increasing monthly saled percentages (far better than the zune is doing), a Mac is still very much a second-tier choice.

    So - nice try MS. Must do better.

    Simon
    • It will take months to come up with a competitor. These products were probably at manufacturing approval stage before Microsoft got their hands on an iPhone.
    • by Otter (3800)
      "the social" is a term of derision for unemployment benefit

      What country are you in? I've never heard that usage before and a web search didn't turn up anything.

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Zebra_X (13249)
      "It's the synergy of the player, the music, the store, the industrial design, the marketing and the ubiquity."

      I used to think this is why the iPod was so great. However, the greatness of the iPod is diminishing imo.

      iTunes was great at managing music. Then apple went and added movies, tv and video. The interface for managing that video was crap however. I was shocked that apple would realease a "video player" that could not play full screen. In addition the video files were useless unless you had a video iPo
  • by bogie (31020) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:41PM (#20839125) Journal
    Is that I hear they are backporting all of the new features to the original Zune. So gen 1 Zunes would get the wifi improvements etc. Hey Apple you listening?
    • by Arcturax (454188) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @01:17PM (#20839721)
      Explain to me how Apple is to backport video to ipods with no video decoder hardware or the ram to run them. Explain how to backport wireless to ipods with no wireless transmitter.

      Apple has backported a lot of features, but not all are possible to back port due to hardware limitations. It's like asking Sony to backport your cassette based walkman to play CD's.
      • by homer_ca (144738)
        I can think of one feature. They backported Shuffle Songs to my 3G ipod, and they gave it its own item in the top menu. I know. Whoop Dee Doo.
    • OMG I am so bummed I didn't buy a 1st gen zune so I could get free back ports of the wifi and playsforsure capabilities that were crippled in the first place.
    • Apple backports features as well - on the 1st gen iPod I had previously, I had updates well into the third generation of iPods that were still adding features.

      But really the better comparison for Zune updates in the Apple world is between the Touch and the iPhone, since it's a much more similar case - very similar hardware with one released after the other. The Touch shipped with the WiFi music store, and a few weeks later we get that on the iPhone too.
  • How do I order the "new black is the new white" color?
  • Buhuhuhu. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by stonecypher (118140) <stonecypher@gmai l . com> on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:43PM (#20839161) Homepage Journal
    Does it do Plays For Sure yet? No, no, sorry, nevermind, I don't want to ruin the slashvertisement.
  • by Goth Biker Babe (311502) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:45PM (#20839191) Homepage Journal
    You still have to charge the thing. How difficult is it to plug your player in before you go to bed and in the morning it's charged and synched.
    • How difficult is it to plug your player in before you go to bed and in the morning it's charged and synched.
      Well, it wouldn't be any more difficult, provided we actually had a combination data/power cable. But AFAIK, we don't. As it is, adding another cable increases the likelihood of having a spaghetti octopus under your desk. I don't know if the increase is logarithmic or exponential, but somebody somewhere must have done the math...
    • "How difficult is it to plug your player in before you go to bed and in the morning it's charged and synched."

      Not very difficult. But it is a good deal more convenient to sync wirelessly if you just want to add a couple of songs. If you've ever used BlueTooth or 802.11, you have all the pre-requisite knowledge needed to grasp this concept.
  • by fermion (181285) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:45PM (#20839193) Homepage Journal
    How dare they introduce a better product so soon after the original was released. What about the dozens of early adopters that spent good money on the first generation Zune. I hope MS will give some sort of trade in to compensate those that were conned into buying the original, inferior, zune. It has not even been a year!

    Frankly I think we are lucky that they did not change the DRM and force everyone to buy new tracks for the new player.

    • by Sciros (986030)
      You're probably just joking around, but really with all these players (Creative, Apple, MS) as long as your music doesn't have copy protection on it to begin with it will play on any of these players just fine, no questions asked. So just don't load up on DRMed music to begin with, and then you won't have to worry about whether these players support DRMed tracks or not (that is, whether they honor the DRM restrictions or not).
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Scottoest (1081663)
      I know you were being sarcastic, but Microsoft is actually extending this update to old Zune owners - meaning they aren't really missing out on anything.

      - Scott
    • How dare they introduce a better product so soon after the original was released. What about the dozens of early adopters that spent good money on the first generation Zune. I hope MS will give some sort of trade in to compensate those that were conned into buying the original, inferior, zune. It has not even been a year!

      Frankly I think we are lucky that they did not change the DRM and force everyone to buy new tracks for the new player.

      They are updating the original Zune firmware to support all of the features in the new model.

  • Interface (Score:4, Funny)

    by llthomps (470748) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:49PM (#20839277) Homepage
    http://www.zunescene.com/zune2pics/zc1-380.jpg [zunescene.com]

    With only seven options on the main menu, you think they could've fit it on to a single screen (settings is below the fold). This is the sort of crap that makes me not take Microsoft seriously. To quote SNL - "Who's the marketing genius who came up with that one?"

    Zune. No grapes, no nuts. What's the deal?
  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:49PM (#20839281)
    So the next generation can wirelessly synch with a desktop. This still misses the potential for wireless.

    Can I access the store and buy music DIRECTLY ON THE DEVICE?

    Can I download free MP3's available on the Web DIRECTLY ON THE DEVICE?

    Can I listen to online streams? (including the BBC, so realplayer may be needed)

    Does it have a PodCatcher, or can I add one, so that I can download podcasts DIRECTLY ON THE DEVICE?

    Can I use it without ever synching anything with a desktop?

    These are the features that could set the Zune apart (yes, even from the iPod) It isn't clear that they get it yet.
  • Unpopular... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Scottoest (1081663) <[scott] [at] [bampage.com]> on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @12:53PM (#20839337) Homepage
    I know this opinion will be like an STD here, but the new Zunes actually seem alright.

    Disclaimer: I pre-ordered an iPod Touch last week, and am actually expecting it to arrive today via FedEx.

    Ars Technica had an overview of the major changes yesterday:
            * Wireless syncing with a PC? Check.
            * Software now supports podcasts? Check.
            * Move TV shows automatically to the Zune? Check.
            * Share whole playlists, albums, and podcasts (with no more silly time restrictions)? Check.
            * Bring DRM-free music to the Zune Store? Check.

    For Windows users, those actually seem like pretty nifty features. The wireless syncing alone is pretty darn cool, and is a feature iPod users like myself have wanted for a while (and my iPod touch STILL will not have). The DRM-free music bit is obviously in response to Apple, but it is a welcome move no matter what the catalyst. Being able to record TV shows using Media Center, and then move those recorded shows to the Zune is nice functionality too.

    I also think it was pretty good of Microsoft to extend this firmware update to existing Zune owners, so they get all of this new functionality, and aren't pushed to buy a new Zune.

    It's also worth noting that the new Zune's don't come in brown (the 80GB one only comes in black, for example), according to Ars.

    I am an iTMS user, so the iPod touch is still my personal preference (and I like the iPhone UI), but for others, the Zune 2.0 finally seems like a more than decent alternative.

    With that in mind - flame away.

    - Scott
    • My only objection to the wireless syncing idea is that a lot of people seem to not realize or at least acknowledge that it has drawbacks. The thing will still have to be charged somehow, wireless does take power where wired syncing will charge the device. Also, the speed of the syncing will be at best, twice as fast as USB 1.1 for WiFi "g", because "g" gets at most 20Mbps actual data speed. Maybe Zune has "n", but the linked story doesn't seem to say so.

      If those demanding wireless syncing understand this
    • by dabraun (626287)

      Being able to record TV shows using Media Center, and then move those recorded shows to the Zune is nice functionality too.


      This alone guarantees that I will purchase one. Daughter + Car + Zune + Dora. Done.
    • by geekoid (135745)
      except it is not stylish or cool. Two things that are key to getting into this market.
      Also, it's user interface isn't very good. It has the same MS philosophy that what the computer wants is more important then what the user wants.
    • by SuperKendall (25149) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @02:20PM (#20840837)
      You still can only play shared music three times, even if the limit is gone. And that includes DRM free tracks you buy.

      Also note the post below about how wireless syncing requires the Zune to be docked!
    • by fermion (181285)
      I see the Zune and iPod being pretty similar pretty soon. MS has huge amounts of money to burn, and Apple has a bad habit of losing their lead. The deciding issue may be the music store. This may mean that Apples decision to use relatively weak DRM for music will come back to haunt it.

      For example, one thing that made the iPod great was the firewire bus. Firewire, unlike USB, can charge even if the computer does not mount the device. It was that I always charged the iPod on the computer, and it made s

  • does it have Gapless Playback? Please tell me it's got Gapless Playback.
  • Wouldn't that be stealing [slashdot.org]?

  • Being able to play Halo 3 on it.

  • Is a headphone jack on the Surface table! Now that would be a PMP that would sell!
  • ah yes, that's what happens when you have a huge bank roll and an utter, ruthless determination to penetrate all markets regardless (xbox, media center, zune, mobiles, pdas). that way you can run at a loss whilst trying to unseat generally successful and entrenched designs with nothing more then pale imitations.

    on one hand it's good business. on the other its desperate tactics.

    on the gripping hand its still a untrusted (at least by me) DRM infected iPod wannabe with only the merest smidgen of innovati
  • Double standard (Score:3, Insightful)

    by starlabs (610056) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @01:25PM (#20839867)
    I've always wondered about this... and it perplexed me to no great end that no one in the media mentioned this...

    When the Zune came out, everybody lambasted it for not having wireless syncing, even though it had WiFi (come on, this is a "duh of course you should have it" feature). Yet the iPhone came out and it didn't have wireless syncing EITHER. But nobody complained, heck nobody even MENTIONED this. AND... the Zune didn't have the capability to be used as a storage device (e.g. usb drive). Guess what? Neither does the iPhone and iPod Touch!

    I'm not a Microsoft nor Apple fanboy (heck, I have an iPhone myself!). But I'm curious as to why no one's complaining about the lack of wireless syncing with iTunes with either the iPhone or iPod Touch. Seems like a... "duh of course you should have it" feature. :) Definitely a double standard. Apple up to this point has had a lot of slack given to it, both by the media and its users. They better be careful though, with all the missteps lately with the iPhone (price drop timing, locking down the device, etc) they shouldn't rest on their laurels. I for one, will never buy an Apple product again within 6 months of its introduction.

    (I do know that at least one review complained of the lack of use as a disk drive - iLounge's review).
    • When the Zune came out, everybody lambasted it for not having wireless syncing, even though it had WiFi (come on, this is a "duh of course you should have it" feature). Yet the iPhone came out and it didn't have wireless syncing EITHER. But nobody complained, heck nobody even MENTIONED this.

      Just search back through any of teh 10k/minute iPhone stories from earlier in the year and you'll see this is not true. There were (and are) a LOT of people asking for wireless sync from the iPhone.

      I would personally li
  • Up your Game (Score:3, Interesting)

    by JamesRose (1062530) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @01:25PM (#20839873)
    Seriously, microsoft wants to take this market. If they really want this, why aren't they pushing the boundaries, middle of the road design, middle of the road capacities, and a mediocre implementation of their killer feature. Seriously, how hard would it be for them to stick in a 250gb hard disk, keep the product small, sell it for a loss, and wait for higher uptake and lower costs whilst keeping their products at the high end price ($300). No one seems to play the long game anymore, so Apple never gets challenged.
    • by imsabbel (611519)
      Pretty hard, considering that those HDs are only available at 160GB (and those are apple exclusive, too)
      • by GeckoX (259575)
        Er, those drives are not apple exclusive. Apple doesn't make them. Want some? Go place an order for a couple million and you'll have no problem getting it filled.
  • huh (Score:3, Informative)

    by eyeareque (454991) * on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @01:28PM (#20839909)
    What's a Zune? :)
  • Well, I'm not an iPod hater, but I would certainly never buy for all the reasons that you've probably heard before.

    But the Zune? If MS is going to overcome Apple huge lead and cool factor they will have to do much, much better then this. If I had to pick between Zune and iPod I would hold my nose and pick the iPod.

    If I could pick anything I wanted I would buy something from one of the many smaller players. One of the ones that supports the subscription services from yahoo, etc. Those services are great,
  • by SuperKendall (25149) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @02:30PM (#20841027)
    Did anyone else think the Zune menu font choices in the pictures are a little... gigantic? And grey and Helvetica... It's like the spirit of web 2.0 came down and settled in the Zune.

    I wasn't sure if those were real screenshots, or what.
  • Not Mac compatible (Score:4, Insightful)

    by gsfprez (27403) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @03:35PM (#20842057)
    I can't use it on my Mac. It is, therefore, irrelevant.

    Seriously - if Microsoft wants people like me (and the other 2 million people in the last 4 months that bought a Mac) to consider their products, step 1 is making it compatible.

    This is a singluar reason why iPod is crushing Zune.
  • by gentlemen_loser (817960) on Wednesday October 03, 2007 @11:17PM (#20847199) Homepage
    From the Zune web site:
    Music and entertainment, your way. Learn more.

    Burger King's slogans:
    Have it your way.
    Your Way, Right Away

    I propose the following for the new 3rd gen Zunes (when they get here):
    We do music right.
    Finger Lickin' Good
    Microsoft Zune. We're Hot and on a Rock 'n Roll.
    Zune. Squirt fresh
    and... Zune. I'm McLovin it.

    Hmmm... Maybe I should trademark those now...

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