Canadian Mint Claims Rights To Words "One Cent"

knorthern knight writes "A weird intersection of copyright/trademark with politics is playing out in Canada. Short background: various Canadian cities and municipalities have launched a publicity/lobbying campaign seeking a fixed take from the GST (Goods and Services Tax, a national Canadian sales tax similar to European VAT). The amount sought is 1 cent for each dollar of the purchase price. This is summarized by the slogan 'One Cent of the GST NOW.' According to a press release, the Royal Canadian Mint (the federal agency that prints Canadian paper currency and stamps Canadian coins) has demanded from the City of Toronto $47,680 in royalties for use of the phrase 'one cent', and the image of the Canadian penny. $10,000 covers the use of the words 'one cent' in the campaign website address (www.onecentnow.ca) and email address ([e-mail]). An additional $10,000 is demanded for the use of these words in the campaign phone number (416-ONE-CENT). The remaining $27,680 covers the use of the image of the Canadian penny in printed materials such as pins and posters." Here's a National Post article on the brouhaha.

Re:ummm

[Anonymous Coward]

> I thought the Romans had the cent long before Canada.

ummmm, no. They had the denarius. That's why British LSd money referred to their _penny_ as 1d -- d for denarius.

And a _penny_ was not the same thing as a _cent_. There were 240 "old" pence in the pound.

Those of us on {Dollars|Euros|Pesos|Rands|etc.}, and Cent(avo)s are using new fangled decimal money that came much later on.

"One Cent"

[kaszeta]

I'm a little surprised that they assert that "one cent" is their phrase, since, unlike US coinage, they actually use numeric denominations on their coins. The Canadian penny actually says "1 cent" on it.

Maybe the US Mint should insist they get paid instead...

Oh, and the Royal Canadian Mint isn't a "Federal Agency". It's a Crown Corporation (status similar to the US Post Office).

trademarks of common vocabulary

[e**(i pi)-1]

This fits well into other cases, where one has attempted to trademark common vocabulary:

• "You have mail" AOL
• "Hall of Fame" National Baseball Hall of Fame
• "Entrepreneur" Entreprenour Media
• "Windows" Microsoft (ruled generic 1993)
• "Memory game" Ravensburger (a website I maintain was involved in that once)

Tradmarking common vocabulary is as questionable as patenting common tasks. The problem is that it is often cheaper to pay off than go through a legal fight. And that encourages the litigators. The good thing is that such battles usually are PR desasters for the companies involved.

Read the article first, it is not the phrase...

[TomTraynor]

It is not the phrase, it is the image of the penny itself. To quote the first sentence

Demands from the Royal Canadian Mint that the city of Toronto pay for using pictures of a penny in its "One Cent" campaign

It is only fair, if someone uses an image that you created wouldn't you want to control how it is used and get compensated for the use of your image?

Paper Currency

[Anonymous Coward]

Hmm. I'm Canadian and I haven't heard of this...

Just a correction to the summary: The Canadian Mint doesn't print paper currency.

"The Bank of Canada" prints paper currency.
"The Royal Canadian Mint" only makes coins.

RCM != Paper Money

[alexburke]

the Royal Canadian Mint (the federal agency that prints Canadian paper currency and stamps Canadian coins)

Nope. The Royal Canadian Mint [www.mint.ca] stamps coins only. The Bank of Canada [bankofcanada.ca] is responsible for paper money, the actual printing of which is performed by Canadian Bank Note Company, Limited and BA International Inc (formerly British American Banknote).

Re:"One Cent"

[CastrTroy]

But they aren't claiming copyright, they're claiming trademark. And if you don't defend your trademark you lose it. So if they indeed to have it trademarked, and the government should be able to trademark certain things, so that not just anyone can set up shop and call themselves the department of defense, or something like that, then they have to protect the trademark, or they risk losing it.

Re:ummm

[UbuntuDupe]

No, but (odd bit of trivia), they did have the census, which measured someone's total wealth, and eventually morphed into Zins in German, their word for (bank) interest.

Re:No, it's one PER cent

[Tridus]

The tax in question (the GST) already exists as a 6% (formerly 7%) sales tax, all the money goes to the Federal Government.

The goal of the campaign is to take 1/6th of the revenue from the tax and give it to Municipal governments. So they don't want a new tax, they want to shift what the existing tax pays for.

Re:My two cents

[PinkPanther]

I hope 50 Cent doesn't try selling music in Canada...

When it comes to Canada, 50 Cent is already screwed [sfgate.com]

Decimal commas versus decimal points

[hummassa]

Using the USofAn/English style decimal POINTS:

21,646 ton / 4,678,000 coins =
21,646,000 kg / 4,678,000 coins
~~ 4.627 kg / coin

(which would be a quite heavy penny IMHO)

I suspect each Canadian penny weights 4.627 _g_ per coin, so it would be
21.646 ton (21646 kg) per 4678000, ie, _ONE_ 40-tonner truck half-full of pennies.

Re:Parity with US$ has gone to their heads!

[jonnythan]

Uh..... Loons don't quack.

I spend at least a week every year up on Squam Lake in New Hampshire. The place is riddled with loons. I hear them make all manner of spooky-ass sounds, but I've never heard one quack.

They're not ducks. They're not even in the same order. They don't even look like ducks. Look at their bills.

Re:ummm

[DarthVain]

This as nothing to do about "coins", other than that is the subject. (wow make sense of that sentence)

Anyway this is about the Canadian Mint claiming copyright on the word "Cent". (Which as a Canadian I am embarrassed)

I think the original post is eluding to the fact that the word "Cent" existed and has been in use long before the Canadian Mint came around (Nor is the Canadian Mint the only one to use it in Monetary terms).

I can understand if a company wants to protect its brand name, as they may have spent a lot of money advertise that name and to promote their product over time, and if another is trying to profit off of that name. However the Canadian Mint's claim in my view is stupid. Is the USA (or whoever was first) going to try and sue us for using the word "Dollar". Not to mention that it is a government institution (corporate or not), makes this even more stupid (Particularly when targeting another branch of Government. Your all generally on the same team, play nice!).

Re:My two cents

[trolltalk.com]

It's not a joke, but the mint will lose in court.

1. There is NO copyright notice on ANY Canadian currency.
2. Any copyright old enough to defeat a prior use claim will have expired
3. Any copyright recent enough to be enforceable is defeated by prior use, not just in Canada, but other countries
4. If they insist, we'll all just switch to Canadian Tire money. After all, eBay accepts it (Canadian Tire bought a bank - they're very heavy in the credit business).

Re:Simple to fix...

[DeepHurtn!]

No, you misunderstand. The tax is already at 6%. The cities have long complained that they do not receive enough support from the federal government for infrastructure costs, so this publicity campaign is trying to put pressure on the federal gov't to dedicate part of the GST (1/6th of it) directly to the cities. Right now Ottawa gives money to the municipalities mostly on an ad hoc basis, whereas a cut of the GST would give cities a steady and dependable stream of income that would make it easier to invest in long-term infrastructure projects (Vancouver's Evergreen Skytrain line, I'm looking at you!).