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The Almighty Buck Businesses United States

Circuit City Rewards Execs As Stock Tanks 354

jamie tipped us to Dean Baker's Beat the Press blog, where Baker comments on a followup to Circuit City's firing of all its highest-paid salespeople last March (Slashdot discussion here). Circuit City's stock has cratered in the meanwhile, and their response has been to offer $1 million retention bonuses to executive VPs. Baker points out that each one of these bonuses represents 35 years' salary for one of the fired salespeople.
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Circuit City Rewards Execs As Stock Tanks

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  • Let's see here ... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by ScrewMaster ( 602015 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:24PM (#21794410)
    Lay off all the people that were actually making money for the company, and pay big bucks to keep the people who brought the company to the point where it had to lay people off.

    Brilliant!
  • by xs650 ( 741277 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:27PM (#21794428)
    It's the Golden Rule in action. Those who have the gold rule.

  • by Jah-Wren Ryel ( 80510 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:28PM (#21794436)
    Retention bonuses are common in situations involving sick companies.

    The idea behind them is that without the institutional knowledge that these people have, the company would die even quicker. Few people, including upper management want to stick around on a sinking ship, so in order to keep potentially valuable people from moving to a healthier company, they offer retention bonuses.

    Obviously the hard part is sorting the wheat from chaff and only giving the bonuses to the useful people, at least the marginally useful. Seems to be that they just hand them out to everyone in upper management "just to be safe" which in the end may not be all that safe...
  • by timeOday ( 582209 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:33PM (#21794456)
    If the company does poorly, you pay big bucks to bring in new hotshot execs. If the company does well, you pay them well to reward their results. It's quite a racket!

    The big problem I see in all this is that US executives have a huge upside (Goldman Sachs CEO got a $68 million dollar bonus this year), but with no downside (Merrill Lynch fired its failed CEO with a $160 million golden parachute). If you want to argue execs deserve huge pay because so much money is at stake, then they should also stand to leave the company hundreds of millions poorer than they came into it, if they underperform. If they don't want to be personally liable for their huge losses, neither should they stand to take so much of the potential winnings (as they do now).

  • by Chas ( 5144 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:36PM (#21794474) Homepage Journal
    It's typical corporate "head up ass" syndrome.

    CC is on it's way out/down, so the execs are going to raid the coffers before everything tanks.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:37PM (#21794478)
    This is the last year for corporations to cash in bush-style on corporate raiding. Watch Wall Street with michael douglas and charlie sheen is still the best movie on this strategy. Hell I never made any money in corporations... might try it 9 years from now myself.
  • by ScrewMaster ( 602015 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:38PM (#21794496)
    Much of the fault lies in the fact that the relationship between the CEO and Board of Directors is no longer adversarial in large corporations. This has the effect of removing any check on an errant CEO's actions. Personally, I think a good first step toward fixing that would be to make it illegal for a CEO to serve on the board of another company.
  • by ucblockhead ( 63650 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:40PM (#21794512) Homepage Journal
    It's much more likely that the guys that are being retained are golfing buddies with members of the board.

    I do find your comment mightily amusing, though. Gotta retain the execs who fired all the low-level employees with institutional knowledge of how to help customers because you've got to keep the institutional knowledge of how to run the company into the ground with idiotic, self-destructive bean counter decisions.

    Seems kind of like amputating an arm to cure the cancer but leaving the tumor in so as not to lose too much mass.
  • Better yet (Score:4, Insightful)

    by WindBourne ( 631190 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:46PM (#21794546) Journal
    they should consider closing their stores, while outsourcing what little remains. Why those VPs would save all sorts of money.
  • all industries (Score:5, Insightful)

    by phrostie ( 121428 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:47PM (#21794548)
    there is a growing trend where all Ex's are being paid more and more and the pay for the people who do the work is stagnating.
    many of these Executives never do anything to justify the increases.

    it's all industries though, not any one.

  • by whoever57 ( 658626 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:50PM (#21794556) Journal
    Investment funds have huge ownership of shares -- it is the fund managers who should be looking out for the interests of their investors and putting an end to this BS. IMHO, their lack of action makes them complicit. It's the guys at Fidelity and others that we should get mad at.
  • by arotenbe ( 1203922 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:50PM (#21794562) Journal

    The idea behind them is that without the institutional knowledge that these people have, the company would die even quicker.
    Right, but... aren't the people with the "institutional knowledge" the same ones who are steering the company into the ground? As you point out, it is very difficult to sort the good executives from the parasites. Once they are in, though, you can't get rid of either type without losing money. If you keep the bad management, you are obviously going to keep losing money. If you fire them, they get a golden parachute and you still have to pay the replacement. If you have a management system where the executives control their own bonuses, you have a no-win situation... except for the executives.
  • by jo42 ( 227475 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:50PM (#21794566) Homepage
    Why the frak would you want to keep, and reward, the people that butt fucked the company into the ground in the first place?

    1) You reward success.
    2) You punish failure.
    3) Profit.

    Now you owe me $1M Euros in management consulting fees.
  • by Kludge ( 13653 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:52PM (#21794572)
    Here's a suggestion: Don't shop Circuit City even if it is convenient. Find a nice mom & pop electronics store. They're harder to find, but worth the effort.
  • by smilindog2000 ( 907665 ) <bill@billrocks.org> on Saturday December 22, 2007 @09:56PM (#21794600) Homepage
    I hear you. It's not the "new" American way, though. It's been that way since I entered the work force full time in '86. The problems at Circuit City are that stupid people got into positions of power (kinda like some governments close to home lately). This kind of thing is more common than bombs exploding in Baghdad. I'm surprised it made it onto the main Slashdot page.
  • by CrazyDuke ( 529195 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @10:02PM (#21794628)
    Back to reality, it's much more likely the execs are trying to pump as much cash into themselves as they can before the company goes backrupt.
  • by radish ( 98371 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @10:35PM (#21794824) Homepage
    Indeed. It's an unpopular opinion around here, but the truth is it's easy and cheap to hire sales droids and difficult and expensive to hire good management. Firms get sick for lots of reasons, it's not always just because the managers suck. The opinion here is obviously that as badly off as the company is, it'd be much worse if all the VPs left (which they would, if they're good enough to get a job elsewhere).
  • Good to Great (Score:5, Insightful)

    by rpillala ( 583965 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @10:48PM (#21794878)
    In his book Good to Great, Jim Collins cites Circuit City as an example of a company that made the transition to greatness, bypassing its comparison company Silo. For each GTG company, Collins identified the company's core purpose, which in his theory must be identified as the one thing that company can do better than anyone in the world. Circuit City's concept was the creation of a large number of stores that provided a consistent experience for the customer. I can say from my own experience at Circuit City stores that they seem to have gotten that part right. I always get bad or no service. Does everyone? I don't know. I'm from India and nonwhite - my sister gets the same treatment with the added derision afforded to girls in that setting. Things like customer service can be hit or miss depending on where we travel. Now, maybe the same people who led the company to "greatness" aren't there anymore. It seems more likely to me that Collins' metric of return on money invested is the wrong way to measure greatness in a company.
  • by HangingChad ( 677530 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @11:25PM (#21795032) Homepage

    Sounds more like a case of the problem dictating the solution to me.

  • Re:Good to Great (Score:3, Insightful)

    by ucblockhead ( 63650 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @11:33PM (#21795078) Homepage Journal
    I'm a white man and get shitty service there too. Not as bad as at CompUSA, but significantly worse than at Fry's. (And if you've ever been to Fry's, you know how damn low that bar is.)

    There is one simple way to create good customer service: Treat your employees well. Look at any company known for good customer service, and you'll find reasonably happy employees. This is understandable, because people who hate their jobs are likely to take that anger out on whoever they deal with day to day. (Your customers.) They are also likely to not particularly value their jobs and thus won't go the extra mile.
  • by Detritus ( 11846 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @11:35PM (#21795090) Homepage
    Mom & Pops often have problems with relatives. There are plenty of psychopaths that are never fired because they are a relative/spouse of the owner.
  • by happyemoticon ( 543015 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @11:38PM (#21795112) Homepage

    And for every one of you in America, there's about fifty otherwise perfectly functional people who haven't the foggiest idea how to set up a home theater system, and cannot be educated by anyone as to how. They simply need a sales person or a nerd to tell them what to buy, and a lot of them feel downright embarrassed about asking a teenager to do it for them.

  • Re:Excellent move! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by couchslug ( 175151 ) on Saturday December 22, 2007 @11:40PM (#21795122)
    From the POV of personal profit, there is no reason not to loot and destroy a company if there are no negative consequences.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday December 22, 2007 @11:46PM (#21795184)
    "And people wonder why they cannot rely upon employee loyalty these days."

    And what makes you think employees were loyal? How many of you jumped ship for more money? How many up and left when the company needed you the most? It's nice to live the lie that everyone was loyal and suddenly one morning companies were stabbing left and right. But reality is more complicated. Both sides were rewriting the bargin, and now are reaping the pain.
  • by Wise Dragon ( 71071 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @12:13AM (#21795350) Homepage
    It's obvious to me that the corporate system rewards short-sighted execs. What can be done to fix this systemic problem?
  • by timeOday ( 582209 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @12:28AM (#21795426)

    Yes, top execs are by and large paid a lot, but they do take their lumps (relatively speaking) when the situation demands it.
    Actually they don't, that's the point. At the very worst, they might leave the company with only the money they made before getting fired (like any other employee). If they do well on the other hand (as at Goldman Sachs currently) they can make a vast fortune in a year or two (unlike any other employee). Standing to make a fortune without also standing to lose your shirt means you're gambling with somebody else's money. That's bad, because it promotes risky behavior.
  • Summit Seekers (Score:5, Insightful)

    by scoove ( 71173 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @12:46AM (#21795522)
    many of these Executives never do anything to justify the increases.

    Actually, they do quite a bit in the short term to "justify" the increases, but to the detriment of the rest of us.

    A year ago, I read a speech by Sir Edmund Hillary explaining how horrified he was that climbers of Mount Everest violated the ethical code of climbers, ignoring a man in trouble on their climb upward and letting him die without help. These summit-seekers were intent on reaching their own self-gratifying goal. They spent their tens of thousands on the "trip of a lifetime" and weren't about to let someone else's misfortune spoil it. Instead of setting aside their summit-reaching goal to rescue someone in trouble, they choose to let him die while they kept on seeking great returns.

    As a professional operational risk manager, I see the same behavior in countless execs. It's called leptokurtic risk (or kurtosis) - the condition of seeking artificial enhancement of returns at the center of a distribution while also taking on excessive outlier risk in the tails (called "fat tails"). These executives take on excessive risk for all of us as they seek their own personally-rewarding summits. The company I work for has struggled through significant catastrophic risk due to the neglect of systems maintenance by previous executives. Instead of spending money refreshing hardware, maintaining trained staffing and continuing license agreements with vendors, they threw it all overboard so they could puff up quarterly numbers and reward themselves for their "achievements." They left before the disasters began to occur, millions richer. They cashed out with hundreds of millions while shareholders and employees were left holding the bag. Their summit-seeking behavior let them seek greatness and riches while screwing the rest of us.

    A simple example of this would be a airline pilot who is rewarded for getting to his destination faster. Once he realizes all the safety equipment (mid-air collision avoidance, oxygen systems for depressurization, fire retardants and other items taking up weight) can be discarded letting him fly faster, he tosses it all overboard and takes on excessive risk for all the passengers. He flies this way until he's realized the plane's certain to crash, and jumps out with a golden parachute, letting the gutted aircraft collide directly into the side of a mountain, taking the lives of everyone on board. Increasingly, this is a common practice for public company and private equity executives.

    As Circuit City witnessed, there is a direct correlation between this behavior in executives and the failure of the company they harvested. The only thing I can recommend for those who find their behavior disgusting is to flee any and all companies that you observe rewarding executives for summit seeking. If they're taking on excessive risk (usually by ignoring it and dismantling all the safeguards so they have even greater funds to line their pockets with), abandon these companies. Let them collapse while the parasites are within, taking them down with them. Until capital markets become savvy to this parasite racket, we're all at risk. Watch for this summit-seeking behavior in the companies you work for and invest in.
  • by timeOday ( 582209 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @12:50AM (#21795538)

    First off Goldman Sachs is a terrible example you used.
    Goldman Sachs perfectly illustrates the point that CEOs who do well can make vast sums of money very quickly. Since the company is doing well and the CEO pay is small relative to the company, what's the problem? Simple. Since there's no corresponding personal downside for bad performance, the CEO is financially motivated to "go long," putting the company at risk. That's what the leadership over at Merril Lynch did for several years, and they raked it in. It turned out to be a bad bet, but so what? The millions paid in bonuses for past years' "good performance" is long gone, only to be repaid by investors and (if there's a mortgage bailout) the taxpayer.

    CxOs have a huge downside. Most get one shot and that's it.
    Being paid hundreds of millions to go away is not a huge downside. They're set for life and don't need another shot.
  • Re:Summit Seekers (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 23, 2007 @01:22AM (#21795686)
    Your terminology/phrasing needs work - "These executives take on excessive risk for all of us" sounds like the executives are shouldering the burden of the risk, removing it from our shoulders, when it's presumably the opposite that you mean, that by their summit-seeking behaviour, they push excessive risk onto our shoulders.
  • by PixelScuba ( 686633 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @01:24AM (#21795704)
    How about they fire him and he leaves with NO money? That makes even BETTER business sense. I can pretty much guarantee that if I royally screw up at my job I won't be receiving any bonus and I'll be looking for work again.

    Merill Lynch employs 56,300 people. 161 MILLION dollars for one man is a travesty... I will stake my life that the work of any CEO is no more demanding than jobs most of us do. That chunk of change would have amounted to almost $3000 per employee, now wouldn't THAT be a nice Christmas bonus for those individuals.

    I believe the average CEO pay in the US is FIVE HUNDRED times the average employee wage. Now, I work... oh maybe 55-60 hours a week, including unpaid time spent outside of work ON work. Now... I sure hope that O'Neal, who earned 48 MILLION dollars in 2006, works 27,000 hours a week. I will wager anything that most of us work just as hard and will probably just break ONE million in our lives.

    Maybe some people see egregious severance packages as a "good business decision" but I cannot in good conscience and reasoning even see that. Pay CEO's less and treat them like any employee... bad at your job, 'You're Fired'(tm).
  • by jhylkema ( 545853 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @01:47AM (#21795810)
    I wonder if these geeks still think unions are "outmoded" and "unnecessary." In other words, the real world is slight at variance with your Ayn Rand masturbation fantasies in your parents' basements, right?
  • Chance (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Mark_MF-WN ( 678030 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @03:12AM (#21796172)
    Where's the downside?

    If you fail you'll most likely not have another chance
    Yes, but you fail with enough money that you could immediately retire and STILL live out the rest of your life in wealth and luxury. Hell, even one million dollars is enough -- properly invested -- to live out the rest of your life wealthier than 60% or 70% of all Americans.

    How, exactly, have CEOs convinced moronic jackasses that they're soooo hard done by when they get their multimillion dollar golden parachutes?

  • Contracts (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Mark_MF-WN ( 678030 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @03:20AM (#21796208)
    There's something wrong with the fact that someone who has lost the company $2.24 billion dollars can't be fired on the spot. Frankly, there's something wrong with the fact that someone who has lost the company $2.24 billion dollars can't be taken out behind the warehouse and promptly dispatched.

    It's ridiculous that's it's so hard to fire people.

  • Sales Droids (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Mark_MF-WN ( 678030 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @03:32AM (#21796240)
    You've never actually worked in the service industry have you? It's easy and cheap to hire shitty salespeople -- the kind that make customers think "I'm am NEVER coming back here". The kind that don't speak English. The kind that don't bathe real often. The kind that don't comprehend how to properly utilize the technology of the "belt", so as to prevent the display of asscrack. The kind that steal shit.

    In the service industry, a competent employee is a gem, a thing of wonder and beauty to be treasured. Although they certainly are as cheap as the shitty ones, they are extraordinarily difficult to hire because they're so rare. Companies that are well-run identify those competent employees and hang on to them, work aggressively to retain them, because they make a HUGE difference in the bottom line. Failing companies routinely purge the competent employees, because they're often somewhat better paid or get more benefits -- because someone had the good goddam sense to try and retain them.

    When I say competent, I'm not referring to some kind of genius wunderemployees here. I'm just talking about people who can be trained to do the job properly, who don't leave the customer/client with a bad taste in their mouth. They truly are rare.

  • by Mark_MF-WN ( 678030 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @04:45AM (#21796472)

    what a publicly held corporation pays its employees is not any of the average Slashdotter's business - assuming you aren't CC stockholders - since I know you are all libertarians and not lefty redistributionists.
    Since I know you are a libertarian and not a neocon sycophant, you'll no doubt agree that we're free to debate and discuss any goddam fucking thing we please, and if some of us would prefer not to shop at Circuit City because we disapprove of their compensation schemes, we're free to do that as well. That's the great thing about the free market -- we can buy or not, for any reason whatsoever. And we can think whatever we please about Circuit City. And say whatever we please about Circuit City. Our business is whatsoever we choose it to be, thank you very much.
  • by Daniel Dvorkin ( 106857 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @05:25AM (#21796582) Homepage Journal
    What's stopping you from being a CEO then?

    He has a soul, maybe?
  • by evilviper ( 135110 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @06:37AM (#21796738) Journal

    It's obvious to me that the corporate system rewards short-sighted execs. What can be done to fix this systemic problem?

    Change the tax code to eliminate the double taxation on dividends. I recall numerous people, much smarter than I, confidently announcing that the decline of dividends (due to the increase in taxation many years ago) would have a terribly destabilizing effect on the stock market. In hindsight, it's amazing just how understated their doom and gloom predictions seem to have been.

    I believe you will see a strong correlation between the sudden steep decline of dividends, and the start of the stock market insanity we see in-force today. Because of the decline of dividends, perpetual increases in stock price are the only thing that matters to investors. Also, because of the large number of amateurs, and simplistic advice by professionals, it seems such simple metrics like quickly increasing stock prices, P/E ratios, etc., have gained mythic proportions... So much so that stocks crash on a small drop in profits, and skyrocket to hundreds of times the value of a company (not to mention more than some entire nations) when there is a small increase in profits.

    This has caused much of the stock market to become nothing but a massive pyramid scheme. Unfortunately, those who are the most idiotic, and bought into the scheme at the highest and most recent price, are now the ones who get to vote on what the company does, and of course they vote for more mergers, more insanity, and more short-term profits, and will pay executives ANYTHING to just keep sustaining the pyramid for a little while longer, until they can cash out and go destroy some other company that's still in the earlier stages of the pyramid. But unlike a standard pyramid scheme, the entire world is being affected by it, even if they didn't opt in.

    Note: I'm not a Republican, CATO, or Heritage Institute shill. By all means, increase income taxes (on the higher tax brackets) to make up the difference. But unlike something like the estate tax, singling out dividends for extra taxation doesn't make much sense, as the rich and the poor both are subjected, and has had the unintended side effect of largely ending the practice of dividends, and (IMHO) more than any other factor, caused the change of the stock market into a much more unstable and irrational entity.
  • Re:Nice (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Mark_MF-WN ( 678030 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @07:34AM (#21796886)

    Nobody here has all the answers, I merely seek to cut down those who pretend that they do -- by saying, for example, that the free market doesn't work and we need the Democrats to ride in on their white horses and save the world from the evils of the market.
    I took a quick look, and I can't find even a single post in the entire thread that even mentions the Democrats. There is heaps of criticism for the Bush Government, for neoconservatives, and for the Republican party (which, at this point, is basically the neoconservative party). Now, I understand that to you, that is probably synonymous with saying "Vote Democrat!", but it ain't the case. The Democrats just one extremely compelling trait: they're not a bunch of corporate-sycophant neoconservatives that want to completely deregulate everything except how people fuck and who can marry who.

    No sane person would claim that the Democratic Party is a panacea, or anything better than a least-of-two-evils. But the Republican party has become an extraordinarily destructive force in the world. To America, and to people and societies around the globe. There are seventy nine thousand innocent people dead because of the Republican Party's lies and deceptions, and a whole generation of Islamic extremists who need nothing more than an accurate history of this decade to motivate them to violence.

    And for what? Some magical non-existent deregulation that the Bush government hasn't provided? A reduction in government power? The PATRIOT act?! Massive increases in warrantless domestic spying? And you can actually sit there and bitch that the Democrats wont fix things?

    As long as they wont make things worse as quickly as Bush is, that should be enough for you to at least admit that they are vastly preferable to the Republicans. I mean, how perfectly do the Republicans have to re-enact the rise of Fascism before people sit up and notice?

  • Re:Better yet (Score:2, Insightful)

    by agent_no.82 ( 935754 ) on Sunday December 23, 2007 @01:41PM (#21798864) Journal
    If firing all their top-paid salespeople lead to the stock cratering, and the decision was made by the management, then why should the management be considered such valuable employees? The management controls the money flow however, and will act in their own self-interests, regardless of whether this might be good for the rest of the company.
    You assume that a corporation must act logically. That assumption is false. Corporations are composed of humans.

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