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Media Encryption Security

Blu-ray BD+ Cracked 521

Posted by kdawson
from the bigger-they-come dept.
An anonymous reader writes "In July 2007, Richard Doherty of the Envisioneering Group (BD+ Standards Board) declared: 'BD+, unlike AACS which suffered a partial hack last year, won't likely be breached for 10 years.' Only eight months have passed since that bold statement, and Slysoft has done it again. According to the press release, the latest version of their flagship product AnyDVD HD can automatically remove BD+ protection and allows you to back-up any Blu-ray title on the market."
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Blu-ray BD+ Cracked

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  • Re: BD+ Cracked (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Panaqqa (927615) * on Friday March 21, 2008 @07:56AM (#22817950) Homepage
    I'm beginning to increasingly believe the old cliche, "Information wants to be free".
    • Re: BD+ Cracked (Score:5, Insightful)

      by TheLinuxSRC (683475) * <slashdot.pagewash@com> on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:09AM (#22818070) Homepage
      The whole problem with encrypted media is that in order for the customer to want to purchase it, they will need to access the media they have purchased. In order to access that media, they will at some point need the key(s) that unlock it. Simply put, the purchaser of the media has the locked media, but they will also have the key. If you give people the key to the lock along with the lock, it is only a matter of time before someone figures out how to get the key.
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Minupla (62455)
        It's the same problem as there is any IT security problem. Protectors need to be perfect every time, attackers need to be lucky/good (in that the protector missed something) once. Add to this basic fact the matter that there is an inherent architectural problem in content protection (you gotta give the attacker what they need or users can't see the media) and the fact that the usual relentless march of technology favors the attacker (more CPU power = easier key breaking, additional CPU power doesn't benef
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by scubamage (727538)
      As long as the content ultimately gets decrypted/decoded to a format which is percievable to human senses, it can be cracked. There is nothing stopping a dedicated pirate from going, pixel by pixel, dumping the current pixel color values into a massive 2d array - in fact in the pre-deCSS days there was a program that worked with PowerDVD by doing that very thing. Dump all the pixelvalues as arrays into a screenshot bypassing Windows, then stream together the screenshots in a video format of your choice, and
      • Re: BD+ Cracked (Score:5, Informative)

        by mrchaotica (681592) * on Friday March 21, 2008 @09:26AM (#22818958)

        Dump all the pixelvalues as arrays into a screenshot bypassing Windows, then stream together the screenshots in a video format of your choice, and you've got uncompressed, perfect digital video.

        No, you don't. It's uncompressed, but not "perfect" because it still has the compression artifacts. Then, when you recompress it, it has two sets of compression artifacts. Although it's higher quality than aiming a video camera at the display, it's still more-or-less the same as the "analog hole."

        To really count as "cracking," the attacker needs to get access to the decrypted but still encoded stream.

    • Re: BD+ Cracked (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Midnight Thunder (17205) on Friday March 21, 2008 @09:53AM (#22819278) Homepage Journal
      I'm beginning to increasingly believe the old cliche, "Information wants to be free".

      I am also beginning to increasingly believe that if you create a good enough dare, people will take you up on it, just to prove you wrong.

      Mother nature likes to join in too sometimes, as one ship has shown us.
    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by Phisbut (761268)

      I'm beginning to increasingly believe the old cliche, "Information wants to be free".

      Actually, I think the whole meme reads as such :

      - Information wants to be free
      - Entertainment wants to be paid
      - You just want to be cheap

  • pwned (Score:5, Insightful)

    by JeepFanatic (993244) on Friday March 21, 2008 @07:58AM (#22817972)
    When will people learn that making bold statements about their technology's security will only make them look like a fool when it is finally broken?
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by Z00L00K (682162)
      It's OK to make bold statements if you can do it with humor and not depend on the failure of that statement.

      But when it comes to things like DRM and security it's just a disaster waiting to happen. What happens is that this will be a magnet and a challenge for all hackers regardless of intent just because they want to prove the statement wrong.

      • Re:pwned (Score:5, Insightful)

        by rubycodez (864176) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:14AM (#22818110)
        why call it disaster? it's GOOD when any and all copy protection schemes are broken so I can get fair use out of my purchases. Those who are creating DRM are trying to take away my rights. When will they learn they may as well just abandon their wasted efforts and instead get smarter about how content is priced, sold and distributed.
        • Re:pwned (Score:4, Interesting)

          by h4rm0ny (722443) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:30AM (#22818262) Journal

          The only bad thing about BD+ being cracked is that it didn't happen sooner. A naive faith that it would be secure may have been one of the factors in studios throwing their weight behind Blue-ray instead of HD. Now that HD seems to be going down the pipes, it leaves blue ray in a monopoly position, free to keep their prices high. Okay - it's not quite a monopoly position as they still have to compete with traditional DVDs. But it's a worse situation for the public than if HD were still around. Still, every little crack helps.
          • Re:pwned (Score:5, Insightful)

            by PJ1216 (1063738) * on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:56AM (#22818610)
            this whole "blu-ray monopoly" thing is getting old. prices went up because they don't have to undercut their costs anymore. now, prices will eventually go down when the technology is actually cheaper. DVDs were expensive at one point too, but had no competition at the time (if you really want to count VHS, thats up to you). They started high (in some categories, higher than hi-def dvds), but due to never having to undercut their costs, they started as high as they could and then went down. Blu-ray didn't start as high as it could. It noticed it had to cut profits to try to win first. Now, they don't have to. Prices are now controlled by the actual cost of the equipment. Competing formats is *NOT* good for the consumer unless all content is available on all formats. The fact that one of the hi-def formats died is *GOOD* for the consumer. Competition isn't automatically good for the consumer and a so-called 'monopoly' (which is most definitely isn't) isn't automatically bad. When HD was around, it was a terrible situation. People were torn between choosing various studios. What if I liked movies from two studios that weren't on the same format? I'd have to buy a dual-player or even just two players. How can you justify saying its a good thing for consumers that they'd have to pay twice as much money on equipment?

            Anyhow, on the topic at hand, is anyone really surprised it got cracked? DRM will eventually die at some point. Right now its just something that we gotta continue fighting until companies realize they lose more money by utilizing it. Music has begun dropping DRM. Some book companies have started releasing straight pdf's of books without any DRM. Video will eventually follow.
          • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

            by earthforce_1 (454968)
            Unfortunately, it is still only a "closed source" crack proprietary to SlySoft. You would have to run their software under wine and we would be back to square 1 if anything bad happened to SlySoft. The good folks at doom9 still need to keep working on this. muslix64 and DVD Jon, are you listening?
        • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

          by Phat_Tony (661117)

          Those who are creating DRM are trying to take away my rights.

          What right are they trying to take away?

          If they are abridging your rights, why don't you, or one of the many other people who hate DRM, or the EFF, sue them for abridging your rights?

          The bill of rights doesn't say "The government shall make no law abridging the rights of the people to transfer video content from their TV set to their computer or portable media player." Perhaps it would have if they could have conceived of such problems.

          If you're referring to fair use, that's for purposes of criticism

    • Re:pwned (Score:5, Interesting)

      by elrous0 (869638) * on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:12AM (#22818090)
      They know damn well that no DRM is ever really secure. But the bread and butter of these companies is to sucker the studios into thinking otherwise. So they don't make such statements because they actually believe them, but to sell their DRM scheme. By the time it gets cracked (usually about 5 minutes after anyone bothers to try), they've already made their money and can laugh all the way to the bank.
      • Re:pwned (Score:5, Interesting)

        by phobos13013 (813040) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:52AM (#22818572)
        Be assured it was this argument that Sony brought to the studios to get them to kill the (IMO better standard) of HD-DVD since it has already been cracked. Also, be assured that Sony knew their argument was bullshit. Sadly, it was this lie that killed the standard, not a few thousand people skewing consumer purchasing towards BD. Ca va...
    • Re:pwned (Score:5, Funny)

      by Yvanhoe (564877) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:16AM (#22818118) Journal
      It was eight months ago. The crowd he delivered his statement to doesn't have that kind of attention span.
    • by raddan (519638)
      There are a lot of people on the planet.
  • by tompatman (936656) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:00AM (#22817988)
    Now that that's been handled, looks like it's time to start shopping for a BD player.
    • by chasingporsches (659844) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:08AM (#22818062)
      i completely agree... and i think that's the message that movie studios should be taking from this -- now that it's possible to create backups, more people are wanting to buy BD players when they wouldn't have otherwise -- not that the pirates have won again.
  • dupe (Score:2, Informative)

    by Google85 (797021)
    The original was Posted by kdawson too... http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/10/30/2034242 [slashdot.org]
  • Not fully broken (Score:5, Informative)

    by Watson Ladd (955755) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:02AM (#22818012)
    Wikipedia states that it only enables backups, which are then played with a software player which is Blu-Ray compatible. It doesn't look like VLC will be playing BD+ protected media anytime soon.
    • Theoretically, though... once you have it playing on your PC in any form like that, couldn't you capture the video output to some other device and have an unencrypted form of the video that way?

  • by nurb432 (527695) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:03AM (#22818018) Homepage Journal
    Its not really details of how it works, its a FBI sting to get people that are intent on learning 'forbidden knowledge".

    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by webmaster404 (1148909)
      You must be new here, we on /. never RTFA
      • by nurb432 (527695)
        While i was 1/2 joking, that means i was 1/2 serious too.

        I can see the FBI/etc putting fake websites up for things like crack sites, or security hacking sites as you know if a person goes there they HAVE to intend to do something bad.. How about a fake KKK site, since we all know if you read that you will go out and kill people? What if you bought a book at amazon ( or just searched for one.. ) telling you how to make a machine gun, or a bomb... means you are a terrorist, right?

        The fact they are getting a
        • by DrSkwid (118965) on Friday March 21, 2008 @09:39AM (#22819116) Homepage Journal
          Since I bought a copy of The Shellcoder's Handbook Amazon keeps trying to get me to buy other cracking books, for instance :

          Hello, Dr Skwid., Amazon.co.uk has new recommendations for you based on items you purchased or told us you own.

          Reversing: Secrets of Reverse Engineering
          Buffer Overflow Attacks: Detect, Exploit, Prevent
          Rootkits: Subverting the Windows Kernel
          The Database Hackers Handbook: Defending Database Servers

          Sockets, Shellcode, Porting, and Coding: Reverse Engineering Exploits and Tool Coding for Security Professionals
          Professional Rootkits (Programmer to Programmer)

          Now that the UK & Germany has outlawed knowledge it's like a trap!
  • Bogus claims (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:04AM (#22818022)
    This is completely bogus marketing on Slysoft's part. They have "broken" the current titles by extracting the code from each one, but BD+ relies on code being downloaded from the disc itself to decode the data. The bar will just be raised now and new code will be added to newer titles.
  • "Admittedly, we are not really so fast with this because actually we had intended to publish this release already in December as promised. However, it was decided for strategic reasons to wait a bit for the outcome of the "format war" between HD DVD and Blu-ray."

    Interesting that they wanted to wait for the outcome before releasing this. It's almost as if they were waiting to thumb their nose at the BD camp once all the companies had moved over to that side. And did anyone get the feeling the press releas
  • unimportant (Score:2, Insightful)

    by rucs_hack (784150)
    The vast majority of customers for blu-ray technology won't give a rats arse about this. I certainly don't

    We've been able to crack dvd's for years, but every house I visit still has a pile of purchased dvd's, and I know of not one person who backs them up. The only people who use the cracking stuff that I know, do so either directly from borrowed dvd's, or indirectly through downloading movies. A know a few who never buy dvd's, because they prefer some dodgy rip. Beats me why, I know the average quality, an
    • Re:unimportant (Score:5, Interesting)

      by webmaster404 (1148909) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:12AM (#22818092)
      It however does a few things...

      1. It tells that Blu-Ray is already supported enough to buy a player now
      2. It allows you to even if Blu-Ray ends up failing, you can rip your Blu-Ray movies to the new format (and don't expect media storage to be made as long as VHS and DVD did anymore...)
      3. It will allow various third-party projects to soon take advantage of this (even if right now it only lets you make backups) and add Blu-Ray support to media players on OSes such as Linux.
    • Re:unimportant (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Stuart Gibson (544632) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:17AM (#22818128) Homepage
      I agree that is the reason for the vast majority, but there are some cases where people have a legitimate reason. I'm in the process of ripping my 600+ DVDs to an increasingly large hard drive array so I can access them all around the house without the need to get the discs. I know it's unusual but there are legitimate reasons.
      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        by Chabil Ha' (875116)
        I do this at home already, and it's wonderful. My intentions are this: I have a two young kids who like to watch movies and I'm protecting my investment by putting the legally acquired discs on the top shelf of my closet where peanut butter covered fingers can't get them. They get an easy way to watch movies through a client, I get to protect my investment from the inadvertent damage of my kids.
    • Re:unimportant (Score:5, Insightful)

      by the_other_chewey (1119125) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:24AM (#22818194)
      The vast majority of customers for blu-ray technology won't give a rats arse about this. I certainly don't

      Well, I do. Let me tell you why:
      I don't own a TV. I *do* however own a computer with a WUXGA display. In its current
      config, my computer would not be "MAFIAA certified" to play BD discs, even if I hab a BD drive.

      I want to be able to play the content on my computer.

      With the OS of my choice. With a display of my choice. Without this HDCP crap.
      I own a bunch of DVDs because deCSS has become ubiquitous today, and nearly every
      computer with a DVD drive can play them, without any platform or software dependencies.

      I'm waiting for the same to happen for BD - until then, no money from me.
      Please make it happen soon, HD video looks great.
    • While I agree with you that the MAJORITY of people use these technologies because they don't intend to pay for movies, I actually myself archive DVDs for my girlfriend's kids so that they don't ruin the originals (as has already happened on more than one occasion). So now you can amend your blanket statement that ONLY people who don't pay for the movies use the technology.
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by ledow (319597)
      I think you're wrong about people legally backing up. I know of people that can't navigate a start menu who have backed up their kids DVD's, give the copies to the kids and put the actual DVD's out of reach. I know of people who back up music CD's and only play the backups in cars because they have a tendency to get scratched, lost, trodden on, or left out in the sun.

      Only last week, I bought a book that came with a video DVD. It cost me about £30 and the DVD will only play in my DVD player because
    • Re:unimportant (Score:5, Insightful)

      by molarmass192 (608071) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:31AM (#22818274) Homepage Journal
      I own and rip my DVDs to put them on my media server. I pay, and I "crack", so I can watch DVDs on demand without hunting them down, sitting through ads, and even on the road on my iPhone. So where do I fit into your argument? I'll concede that some people will borrow / rent DVDs to rip them, but honestly, it's much easier to torrent the movie you want than to rip / encode for 99% of the people out there. I'd say at least 50% of rippers do so legitimately, DMCA not withstanding.
    • by debest (471937)

      We've been able to crack dvd's for years, but every house I visit still has a pile of purchased dvd's, and I know of not one person who backs them up.

      Well, I'm one who would have never purchased a DVD player without the ability to back them up. I have a small child who likes to watch movies (think Disney/Dreamworks stuff and the like) and although she's finally old enough to be (somewhat) careful, no WAY was she going to lay a hand on any of those DVDs unless they were backed-up copies of the originals. VHS may have degraded over time, but those tapes could stand up to physical abuse way better than an optical disc ever could.

    • Um. The *only* way i'm able to even *watch* dvds on my computers (not a single windoze box in the house) is because of 'illegal' copy protection breaks via decss.
    • by khafre (140356)
      It's not about backups. I for one like to be able to rip my DVDs to watch on a personal video player (e.g. iPod Touch). Now I can buy my media once on Blu-ray and watch on everything from my big screen to my personal video player.
  • by AchiIIe (974900) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:08AM (#22818058)
    Slysoft has made this claim before. It turned out to be bogus. The crack allowed a user to copy a BD to the harddrive and play it back from there using only a specific version of Cyberlink's PowerDVD (3319a), but not to transcode, otherwise manipulate the content or play it back from a burned BD-R or BD-RE. (Wiki)

    Now I'd like everyone to remember that BD+ is not an `algorithm` per se. It's not a DRM one way function. BD+ is a virtual machine and a blu ray disk is a full fledged program that runs under the VM and can even run native code to patch and upgrade the virtual machine.

    This is akin to running a java application that can inspect the java VM.

    It's a cat and mouse game for now.

    *Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BD%2B [wikipedia.org]
  • by robably (1044462) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:09AM (#22818068) Journal
    Envisioneering n.
    a. The application of false promises to scam money from the gullible. From Envision "to see a way" and Profiteering "to improperly profit by".
    b. The profession of or the work performed by an envisioneer.
  • by elrous0 (869638) * on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:09AM (#22818074)
    Wow, these guys are getting slow.
  • by jskline (301574) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:19AM (#22818144) Homepage
    It really does. If they "delayed" release of this, then they must have been waiting to "lock in" the format war so that they wouldn't have to go supporting both standards. Apparently the Blu Ray was easy enough for them and now that there is "vendor lock-in", this pretty much says that they really are dictating the markets. This really speaks volumes about marketing tactics.
  • by fyrie (604735) on Friday March 21, 2008 @08:43AM (#22818434)
    The crack allows you to play the media at full quality on systems that do not have a fully HDCP compliant chain. Example: If you have a home theater TV hooked up to an older HDTV that only has component inputs, or if you have a non HDCP video card, you can use this "crack" to play your discs at full quality.
  • by Danathar (267989) on Friday March 21, 2008 @09:13AM (#22818800) Journal
    The blue ray encryption geniuses should read my subject line over and over and over and over.
  • by PPH (736903) on Friday March 21, 2008 @01:28PM (#22822182)

    Thanks to the recent demise of HDDVD, additional cracking manpower has recently become available to work the Blu-ray problem.

    Yet another success for IT project management.

Real Users find the one combination of bizarre input values that shuts down the system for days.

Working...