Chinese Blogs, Netizens React To the Tibet Issue 926
Bibek Paudel writes "Over the past few weeks Chinese bloggers and people on Internet forums have been reacting to events in Tibet and the protests disrupting the torch relay. The BBC and Global Voices have interesting insights on the recent happenings on the Net. A western commentator says, 'Lots of Chinese people now view the Western media, human rights groups, and Western leaders' criticisms of their country as part of the Racist Western Conspiracy to Stop China From Being Successful.' One of the most vocal appeals by the Chinese blogs, forums, and text-messages has been to boycott French goods in response to the protests that accompanied the torch relay in Paris. One response post reads, 'Who is abusing human rights? Who is bringing violence to this world?' There also are two versions of music video of the song Don't Be Too CNN, and its lyric has assumed the status of a cult catch-phrase. Sina.com has a popular page: 'Don't be too CNN, fire to the Western media.' Many analysts believe that the protests over Tibet have only served to strengthen Chinese nationalism rather than evoke sympathy for the Tibetan cause. Sina.com has a petition against the Western media which has reportedly accumulated millions of signatures. There is also Mutant Palm, a blog by an expatriate in China who has been watching and commenting on the fallout from Tibet and torch protests online."
Re:Racist (Score:4, Interesting)
Brilliant, evil, or both? (Score:5, Interesting)
Having observed the Dali Lama's tours and speeches for the last few year I find Chinese media assertion that The Dali Lama is running a terrorist network absurd, but their reporting to the contrary might be causing Tibetan supporters of the Dali Lama to become more extreme as the only media source available to them tell them that the Dali Lama is urging armed uprising.
In many ways the Chinese government is seeding the dissent which will give them an excuse for violent oppression of the Tibetan people. I am not sure whether this is evidence of a brilliantly executed evil agenda or standard government incompetence.
In all this noise... (Score:3, Interesting)
Just think about that, for a moment...
Welcome to the 21st century (Score:4, Interesting)
I have a lot of Chinese (national) friends, even one who is a member of the CCP. They definitely take the Tibet protests personally. The CCP has been very clever at manipulating national sentiment on this issue, and it is very interesting to me because it is a clash between the western narrative of China as a brutal oppressor and the eastern narrative of the west as a patronizing colonial force.
Talking to Chinese of all stripes, I find they don't understand the western image of China is a man standing down a tank. That isn't the life they came from. On the other hand, most can't grapple with the Maoist atrocities. They're taught all about the opium wars and colonialism, though. So when east meets west, both sides see the world in very different light.
Personally, while I do worry about Tibetan culture being diluted and people being oppressed, I'm not sure that (a) I have the moral standing to tell others not to opppress people (It's not like we're going to offer Hawaii autonomy now, is it?) (b) it's generally good for every ethnic group to live in its own autonomous enclave.
I also think that worrying about cultural dilution is something rich nations can ponder, along with rights for dogs, and all the other quandaries of affluence.
I do wish the Chinese would confront the human rights abuses in their past more fully. I wish they had better protections for workers and better labor laws. Communist regimes seem to always have this problem. If the government is made of labor unions ("soviets"), but the union is no longer responsive to the workers needs, who can they turn to?
It's not an idle question. Look at the coal mine riots in the USSR during the 30's. The workers "unionized" and complained about unsafe conditions and long hours. The government, nominally concerned primarily with the average worker, sent in the troops who busted the riot in a way that would make Pinkertons blush.
I'm not saying that's how life in China is, but I am saying it's a structural flaw of a one-party government. But if it looks like I'm casting stones from my glass house, I'd say that my own government was set up to have competition between branches that would protect my freedoms. However, the formation of political parties has lead to collusion between branches, undoing much of the good envisioned by the writers of our constitution. It'd be nice to have a structural change here to deal with that.
Re:They're Right (Score:5, Interesting)
But in this day and age of "remote" media, there is no (visual) connection between people - and the assumption fails at the very premise.
If Tibetans had an army, fought a war - and lost - they would have a much better say.
Welcome to the age of mob rule (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Racist (Score:3, Interesting)
I agree with your post about diversity, and although I'd hate to be a Star Trek borg I'm already a cyborg by dictionary definition. I have a device planted in my left eye that replaces its focusing lens, the first IOL that actually can focus. Details are in the link in my sig, I just had another operation to that eye 2 weeks ago that replaced most of its vitreous (latest journal) because the retina detached.
I'm fond of saying "you will be assimilated. Resistance is not only futile but when the time comes you will beg to join us".
You have a great sig btw. So sad, too true.
Re:Welcome to the 21st century (Score:3, Interesting)
I have a lot of Chinese (national) friends, even one who is a member of the CCP. They definitely take the Tibet protests personally. The CCP has been very clever at manipulating national sentiment on this issue, and it is very interesting to me because it is a clash between the western narrative of China as a brutal oppressor and the eastern narrative of the west as a patronizing colonial force.
Despite the fact that the majority of his thinking years were spent in Western countries, he was fiercely pro-Chinese government. He used to get in arguments with anyone that would bring up Hong Kong, Taiwan, and Tibet. Utterly unapologetic, and very much saw Americans/Westerners caring about these places as trying to keep the Chinese government down. He would defend crackdowns and government actions as the price of improving the nation, etc.
On the otherhand, another friend of mine from China had the exact opposite point of view he did. She was in fact VERY anti-Chinese government. Then again, she had vivid memories of hearing gunshots as she was in gradeschool a few blocks from Tianamen square when the protests there went down... I think that's the kind of thing that can change your perspective.
Re:Welcome to the 21st century (Score:3, Interesting)
Read the wikipedia talk page - anyone on them related to the torch relay. Coming from nationalist family myself I can totally understand the knee jerk reaction from a Chinese - but it still baffles me that in this whole show, Tibetans are not even involved.
Re:Brainwashed. (Score:5, Interesting)
I am currently teaching ESL in Korea.
there are a lot of Chinese people working in Korea, and since they speak limited English, and I am here with a friend who speaks Chinese, and we are foreigners in a strange land, we spend a lot of time together, talking.
One day, Tienanmen square came up, and they wondered why Westerners always made a big deal about that particular spot.
"it was just a bunch of bad students" one said to me. she knew something happened there one, but no specifics.
that was all they knew.
Tienanmen was just "A bunch of bad students"
I went online, showed them that famous footage.
there was shock, outrage, and disbelief.
2 of them now refuse to return to China.
makes you wonder what our governments are hiding from us.
My Chinese friends are always making little jabs at me here and there, because British Colonialism was so awful, and wrong. And being white makes me inherently guilty of everything wrong with the world. (despite the fact that i am not British)
They all agree that Tibet is a part of China
I told them all "fine, i will agree to that, Tibet is as much a part of China as India is a part of Britian."
Re:In all this noise... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:They're Right (Score:5, Interesting)
Two things:
1. I think it's pretty dangerous to try and 'dictate' anything to a country armed with nuclear weapons and ICBMs. This includes China and the United States.
2. Yes, I think our ongoing injustices (Gitmo comes to mind) should be part of the global discussion. I also think our Allies and Trading Partners should be encouraging us to live up to past promises (*cough* Geneva Conventions *cough*) and the better parts of our history.
In that same vain, I don't think the West should be dictating anything to China. But we don't need to be their lapdogs either. We don't need to overlook their abuses simply because it's profitable to do business with them.
Personally, while I'm not going to encourage a boycott of the Olympics, I'm not really feeling any particular desire to go out of my way to watch them either. I felt a lot better about them when the Chinese were treating them as a well-deserved (IMHO) reintroduction to the World after decades of oppression and stagnation. If they turn them into a nationalist spectacle than I don't think comparisons between 2008 and 1936 are entirely unjustified.
Re:Uh.. (Score:5, Interesting)
To be honest, I'm far more concerned about that than Al-Qaeda. Remember what happened the last time nationalism was this rampant and blind? 2 countries were invaded - 1 without any reason. Furthermore, many of the internal violence across the world can be traced to excessive attachment to a particular tribe/ethnicity/nation. The exception to that are the various communist movements and drug cartels.
Here's something else I've learned from the comments left by Chinese nationalists on various blogs and news stories: they have less in common with me than I have in common with Iraqis. Their concept of free speech is completely different. Their concept of human rights is completely different. Their concept of historic relativism is completely different. Here's what I see:
Chinese nationalists value territorial integrity, international face, unity and harmony above all. I value individual self-determination and free speech above all - in other words, chaos over harmony.
You can easily see this in their rage against news outlets, where a bad story about a Chinese government action is taken as an insult from all of western civilization against all of China.
Re:Uh.. (Score:2, Interesting)
Basically, the issue of "sympathy toward oppressed Tibetans vs. Chinese pride" sounds extremely similar to the era of the civil rights movement in the US, where the issue was "sympathy toward oppressed black people vs. Southern pride". In both cases the oppressors get all offended when you dare to question their practices.
And for folks who aren't familiar with how this story ends, well, there are still idiots in the South who cling to the idea that agitators and Yankees were meddling with their Utopia, and everything would have been fine if the White Citizens Councils and the KKK had taken care of everything. If similar resentment becomes ingrained in the Chinese people (or if their government manufactures enough of it), this has serious implications for human rights in that country.
Re:Uh.. (Score:5, Interesting)
It's a pretty dramatic story, actually. The nationals had chased the communists all the way from southern China up to the north, spent months doing so in what is known as Mao's Long March, and were finally about to crush the rebellion. The nationals were camped at the ancient hot springs outside Xi'an (these springs have been in use by kings in China for 1,500 years at least). The Japanese had invaded, but the leader still wanted to crush the Communists before facing the Japanese. At that critical moment, some of the nationalist troops kidnapped the nationalist leader and forced him to give up chasing the Communists. This event is memorialized in Communist tradition as 'the Xian incident.'
Re:They're Right (Score:5, Interesting)
A LETTER FROM AN ORDINARY CHINESE
When we were seen as "Sick Men from East Asia", we were called The Peril.
When we strived to get stronger, we are called The Threat.
When we closed our doors to the world, you forced them open with drugs and guns.
When we finally embraced Free Trade, you blame us for taking away your jobs.
When we were falling apart, you marched in your troops and robbed us blind.
When we put the broken pieces back together again, "Free tÂbet" you screamed, it was an invasion!
So, we tried Communism, you hated us for being Communists.
Then we learned from Capitalism, you hated us for being Capitalists.
When we had a billion people, you said "The planet is starving."
So we tried to limit our population, you said it was Human Rights Abuse.
When we were poor, you think we are dogs.
When we loan you cash, you blame us for your debts.
When we build our industries, you blame us for global warming.
When we sell you goods you can afford, you blame us for dumping inferior products.
When we buy oil, you called that exploitation and assisting genocide.
When you fight for oil, you called that Liberation of Its People.
When we were lost in chaos and rampage, you wanted Rules of Law for us.
When we uphold our law and order against violence, you called that Violating Human Rights.
When we were silent, you said we have No Free Speech.
When we are NOW silent no more, you say we are merely "Brainwashed".
"Why do you hate us so much?" We asked.
"No" You answered, "We don't hate you."
Truth is we really don't hate you either, but do you understand us?
"Of course we do" You said, "We have BBC, CNN and AFPs."
So we ask you now "What do you really know and want from us?"
And "Why do you find it SO hard to accept us?"
Re:They're Right (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Brainwashed. (Score:2, Interesting)
I'm currently studying in Seoul, Korea, and the nationalism of the chinese students I encounter is pretty frightening.
The weird way they swerve between the official government line that's burned into their minds and their own rationality is extremely interesting to see too. Very 1984-ish.
On the other hand, nothing discredits the western fear-mongering over chinese intentions quicker than a sitdown over a cup of soju with a chinese dude.
It'll be interesting to see how the chinese government will handle the rampant nationalism. Sometimes they can use it, like now with the olympics/tibet, but other times it really messes up their whole 'peaceful rise' idea... they're doing their darndest to become a non-threatening part of the international capitalist system, and then their own internal problems always get brought up as criticism.
Not that it isn't their own fault for allowing economical freedom without political freedom...
Re:They're Right (Score:5, Interesting)
I've said it once, and I'll say it again. We are in a state of economic mutually-assured destruction.
They call in our debt: our economy collapses. They can't sell their shit to us anymore. Their economy collapses.
We stop buying their shit: Their economy collapses and they're forced to call in their debt. Our economy collapses.
While China's economic strength is tied to ours, our strength is just as equally tied to theirs.
Re:They're Right (Score:3, Interesting)
Remember why people object to Guantanamo Bay. It has little or nothing to do with the treatment of the prisoners; people who have actually been there, even those very critical of the facility, find no fault there. (What few allegations there are show every sign of having been trumped up by the terrorists if you actually investigate it, and that is literally out of the terrorist playbook... and by literally, I mean that documents telling terrorists to make allegations of Koran abuse if they are captured have been found.) The complaint about Guantanamo Bay is that the people being held there weren't having their human right to a fair trial upheld, they were simply held there without trial.
This is certainly a strong start to an argument that Guantanamo Bay is a place where human rights are repressed.
However, in China, everyone is treated that way and worse [jrank.org] . Everyone. Read that link. (The whole thing. It also shows some interesting progress being slowly made. But the rules for defense would be utterly unacceptable to the same people protesting Guantanamo. Read the last sentence, too.)
To hold up Guantanamo Bay as an equivalent atrocity is to betray the very arguments being made against GB. To complain that treating a handful of active, violent enemies of a state that conduct their activities in flagrant and persistent violation of the Geneva Conventions (which as so many people conveniently forget lays responsibilities upon combatants too, not just countries) is equivalent to treating an entire country worse, not even the same but worse, is to display a moral relativism that simply staggers the mind.
If you object to Guantanamo Bay, you should be objecting to the Chinese regime a millionfold more! In China, Guantanamo Bay would be the progressive prison.
Re:Uh.. (Score:2, Interesting)
But just about all the US aid to China went to KMT, not the communist. Communists was more tolerated than helped by the US at the time. And after the war, guess which side the US backed when KMT and communist went after each other? Hence the fallout between the US and China.
Btw, I think Stillwell (or was it his predecessor), while sent to help KMT, was reported to be disgusted with KMT and suggested to help the communists instead, to no avail.
Re:Sometimes it gets personal (Score:3, Interesting)
The last weekend in January I took a trip to Philly to pick up a car I'd bought. My eight year old daughter pleaded with me to go because she wanted to see the Liberty Bell and Independence Hall, so picked up two extra one way tickets for her and my son and we flew out Friday morn.
Saturday, we spent all day at Independence hall, the National Constitution Center, and all that jazz. As we entered the building that houses the Liberty Bell (in which I had to submit to a search and I mused out loud, "I'm surrendering my liberty, in order to SEE the Liberty Bell. how ironic." The guards were not amused.) there was a large Chinese tour group ahead of us. My impatient kids ran ahead to the back of the building to see the bell; I stopped to take in the displays.
If you've not been there, there is a display with a photo of the Dalai Lama visiting the Liberty Bell. Several members of the tour group were standing there, taking photos of themselves with the photo, forming a gun with their fingers behind his head. I openly snickered in disgust when I saw what they were doing.
Of course, I'm quite sure you won't catch anyone giving the gun salute to photos of Chairman Mao in the PRC.
Re:Uh.. (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Uh.. (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:The reaction should not be surprising (Score:3, Interesting)
but it would be interesting to hear your opinion on the TIBETAN protestors, which, here in midtown manhattan near the UN, i've been seeing almost daily for the last few weeks
in other words, its one thing for you to dispute the words of idiotic westerners, which i agree with you about. but one would be really interested to hear in what way you dismiss the concerns of tibetans themselves
i think real peace in tibet comes when the han colonists stop treating the tibetans so badly. perhaps even back out of tibet. or, barring that, stop being allowed a two-tiered class system where the han get jobs, and tibetans get kicked to the roadside. appeasment of the tibetans will of course also include a large amount of self-rule, return of the dalai lama. but apart from outright independence, if china were to allow tibet more internal autonomy, this might even pave the way for china to prove to the world that the absorption of taiwan would proceed smoothly too
but when the wider world watches how han imperialism crushes tibetan basic rights, in their own damn country/ province, one thinks nothing but that china does not deserve to get its hands on taiwan
think about it. making the tibetans happy is the path to china peacefully reuniting with taiwan
outright xenophobic ultranationalism and han imperialism and treating tibetans like dirt means the wider world defying taiwanese reunion
nationalism is ugliness, and self-defeating. even when the chinese do it. the chinese must learn this, and they will, the hard way, or the easy way. not because the west has anything to teach the chinese, but simply that blind pride and hubris is self-defeating
the point is, han imperialism is the real problem, western idiots are the sideshow. not visa versa. western hippies do not create han imperialists. han imperialists inflame western hippies. you have your cause and effect backwards. and therefore, if you understood the real cause and effect you would be focusing most of your criticism at han imperialism, not western idiots
or continue your chinese nationalist pride, and justify to yourself why it is ok to think the tibetans have no validity to their complaints
and reap what you sow
True (Score:5, Interesting)
1. Must supporting Tibet and the Olympics be mutually exclusive?
2. Talking to my Chinese friends (I have many), almost none have ever actually seen CNN. They have A. read www.anti-cnn.com or B. read or seen about it in Chinese media.
3. China is not the last bastion of independent thought, nor is the USA for that matter. Chinese people almost never seek out secondary sources of information, either because of lack of education (cannot read English, etc), Western media is blocked (i've lived there, don't tell me it is not true, though it is accessible if you know where to look), or lack the desire, or discipline, to seek out other perspectives.
When I lived in Beijing from 2004-2006, I got the general feeling that Chinese were enamored with Tibet and thought they were doing no wrong when they brought development to Tibet. So naturally, Chinese think they are in the right. By human nature, people will believe what they want to believe, and furthermore, people develop strong convictions based on little or no information.
Another thing is that the Chinese have demonized the Dalai Lama, which is somewhat absurd. They cannot in any demonstrable way connect him to the violence. Furthermore, the Dalai Lama is a wily politician who has forged relationships with powerful people in the West, whereas the Chinese have little guanxi outside their own nation, save countries they are pouring money into.
Like I tell my Chinese friends, if I want to know what bad things Taiwan has done this week, I'll read Xin Hua or People's Daily. They are at least as crappy as CNN, though they are a different kind of poison than CNN.
One lesson China should be taking from this, and I have seen no evidence of this so far, is that they really need to do a better job of Public Relations. Frequently my Chinese friends, try to make the argument that Bush would not let Texas separate from the USA (I am from Texas), just as China would not let Tibet separate. To which I reply, Texas was already an independent nation, and if you really want a compelling argument, read about the American Civil War on Wikipedia (har har).
I have a fair number of friends from Taiwan as well, and I have guaged their reaction to be a combination of A. Apathy, because Taiwan has been going through this sort of nonsense for a long time, and they are sick of it B. Not agreeing with violence from either party C. Some empathy for the Tibetans, because the Olympics presents them with a rare opportunity to gain media attention.
So, what to take from all this. I'm not quite certain, because I do not have all the information. I am sympathetic to both sides. Living in China was the happiest part of my life.
My feeling is, if China wants to be a great nation, they need to act like a great nation, not whine on anti-cnn online forums.
Re:Uh.. (Score:5, Interesting)
Have monks and nuns been tortured? How many? Have locals been "displaced"? Have they been forced to move from where they were living before? How many? How valuable was the land that they lived on?
The problem I am having is that one side claims that these things are happening, the other side claims that they are not. Some times they agree that the thing happens but disagree on numbers by many orders of magnitude (ex: one side says 100s killed the other side says 100,000s killed when China invaded Tibet).
I am struggling to find clear documented evidence of these great "human rights" abuses. Of course, I am also finding no evidence that such things did not occur.
I cannot get factual answers to the following:
1. How many native Tibetans have advanced degrees?
2. What percentage of the bureaucracy in Tibet has native Tibetans in it?
3. What is the ratio of Tibetans to non Tibetans?
4. What geographic region is precisely the one being argued out about? It seems that there are edge case territories in the boundary that change the counting system when they are included or excluded.
5. Who exactly is participating in the turmoil in Tibet? Are normal everyday Tibetan citizens engaged in this? Again I get two sides claiming different facts.
6. What precise religious rights were taken away from native Tibetans?
7. What percentage of native Tibetans see the Dalai Lama as a great religious figure?
Every fact I have seen claimed seems to have no really strong foundation when you go inspect the original materials. If anybody can provide better sources of information, that would be great.
The problem of course is that China is in the best position to have accurate answers to these questions. But there is not a single example in history (counter examples are welcome) of self-appointed leaders (of reasonably large countries) ever providing non propaganda versions of information to others.
Re:Uh.. (Score:1, Interesting)
this is an extremely ignorant thing to say. Everyone of us who left China and stayed in China knows what happened in TAM square. A lot of the expatriats and their parents even participated in it. I can tell you stories about students tying themseles up on bridges to stop train traffic. I can tell you stories about the human walls they formed against the soldiers. Most of oversea Chinese know more about what happened in Tibet than anyone else does. We read the Western articles and the Chinese articles. I'm not blind to the mistakes of either side.
As someone who has lived in the country, away from it and visited there on frequent occasions, let's get some basic fact straight here:
1. Chinese gov't does not randomly go arrest people in the middle of the night as some people think.
2. Chinese gov't has far higher approval ratings than the American gov't.
3. Chinese people are now more free and well off than they have ever been in the history of China.
4. There are definitely a lot of human rights issues that China needs to work on. Very few Chinese people will dispute that.
5. The great democracy that is know as Taiwan took 45 years to go from an authoritarian state to a democracy. As recent as the 2004 election, we had a fake assassination attempt, underaged voting and 10+% discard votes. It takes time to go from a situation not accustomed to having democracy to one that does.
6. China will only become a democratic country + have human rights from the efforts of the growing middle class through this economic growth. Shoving Western doctrines down Chinese people will only annoy them.
"It is often hard to tell when the Chinese nationals are shouting down dissenting points of view if they actually believe that crap, or if they're just doing what they're told. I have a suspicion that a lot of them (even the ones here in Canada who were protesting against Western media bias last week) honestly don't know any different version of events. Therefore, they assume that we really are trying to hurt their national pride. They don't want to be told that their government is and has been lying to them."
Let's see the facts and see which of this you actually know:
1. Tibet before 1959 was a feudal state with slaves. If it continued that way till today, it would be one of the most backward society in the world. Dalai Lama will just be another religiou zealot with many worshipping slaves.
2. Dalai Lama's so called autonomy sounds more like independence than autonomy. if you check this page where it stated what's the Tibet in exile's demand. http://www.forbes.com/opinions/2008/04/10/tibet-china-macbain-oped-cx_lbm_0411tibet.html [forbes.com]
You would see that their demand consists of having no Chinese troop in Tibet, a separate gov't + judicial system just for Tibet, Chinese people not being able to move into Tibet. Does that sound like autonomy or true sovereignty to you?
3. The requested area by Tibet in Exile includes not just the Tibet region itself, but also includes most of Qinghai, a large part of Sichuan, parts of Yunnan and Gansu. That's part of the reason that the discussions haven't moved forward if you read the forbes article. In this area, Han Chinese actually far outnumbers Tibetans. So in any kind of real referendum, Tibet would never be able to leave. Kind of funny huh? Real democracy would actually work against Tibet? Of course, chicom will never allow such a referendum to happen, because it would set dangerous precedence for Taiwan.
4. There were clear videos and interviews conducted by CNN and a number of Western media that sh
Re:The reaction should not be surprising (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:They're Right (Score:3, Interesting)
> When we strived to get stronger, we are called The Threat.
Not many US policymakers consider China to be a threat, though China is the closest thing to a threat the US has. Consider it a badge of honor, only two other nations in history ever really were.
Let's start the discussion with a wholehearted "fuck you". Consider it as a badge of honor, since I don't think I've been using this level of profanity since my first comment on slashdot.
> When we closed our doors to the world, you forced them open with drugs and guns.
But forcing Tibet's doors is just fine. I'll freely admit that the US has committed many, many wrongs. Acting like China hasn't does not paint a healthy picture of you.
Nobody said USA "forced them open with drugs and guns". When this began to happen USA didn't even exist. Heh. Or you'd think the USA is the only Western country? Get a perspective. Take a look at the Opium Wars [wikipedia.org].
> When we put the broken pieces back together again, "Free tÂbet" you screamed, it was an invasion!
It was an invasion. No matter how atrociously Tibet's previous leadership treated its people, it's still an invasion. In truth, it would not concern us so much if you did not try to suppress or co-opt belief systems.
The Tibet occupation/invasion was not a religious crusade of any kind. Unlike you Americans and those bible-loving-fundamentalists, the Chinese are at least tolerant with religion as long as they don't involve politics.
> When we were falling apart, you marched in your troops and robbed us blind.
Ah, yes, I suppose we should have let Japan run free and build the Greater East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere. How many Nankings do you want?
In 1900, Your troops invaded Beijing [wikipedia.org], robbed and pillaged the city. The Japanese were resisted in China by the Communists and KMT.
> When we sell you goods you can afford, you blame us for dumping inferior products.
Lead and arsenic in products is, by Western standards, inferior. Your point?
The point is, you don't bother to crank out the money to buy higher quality products. If you pay crap, you get crap. Simple.
> When we were lost in chaos and rampage, you wanted Rules of Law for us.
America has long appreciated peace. Peace is good for business. These past few decades have been an odd spot.
Lol? Tell me which in decade America hasn't been at war invading others. Look at Chinese history in the past 300 (that's BEFORE your country was even established) years and the ONLY instance of so called "invasion" is Tibet?
Yeah right America has long appreciated peace.
> When we loan you cash, you blame us for your debts.
Who's blaming -you-? You could always not lend, but that's not an option for you. When two people place themselves into a mutual trap the fault is not the sole fault of one or the other.
Trap????? Tell that to the Bank of America who should to be blamed for lending money to all these people and holding them mortgage. Duh money lending should be criminalized! I mean, a bankrupt person should be able to file suit on his creditors because they entrapped him into borrowing money from them!!
> When we had a billion people, you said "The planet is starving."
No, we said 'the planet is starving', and an American man showed you how to feed a billion people.
Who is this great American man? You?
> When we are NOW silent no more, you say we are merely "Brainwashed".
You have your points, and we have ours. If you are unwilling to look at another side of an issue, you are.
You mean, since you are all knowing, always correct, never wrong, you've investigated all sides of the issues, that if we don't agree with you