USAF Counter-Terror Funds Buy "Comfort Capsules" 429
An anonymous reader writes "The Washington Post reports, 'The Air Force's top leadership sought for three years to spend counterterrorism funds on "comfort capsules" to be installed on military planes that ferry senior officers and civilian leaders around the world ... Air Force documents spell out how each of the capsules is to be "aesthetically pleasing and furnished to reflect the rank of the senior leaders using the capsule," with beds, a couch, a table, a 37-inch flat-screen monitor with stereo speakers, and a full-length mirror.' Congress told the USAF twice that they could not spend the money on this frivolous project, but they did it anyway."
huh? (Score:5, Insightful)
Beowulf Cluster F^(k (Score:3, Insightful)
How is this News For Nerds? (Score:2, Insightful)
WTFOMGBBQ? (Score:5, Insightful)
Seriously, I can understand the logic of having people be able to sleep on the flight, so as not to waste time at the destination; but how could anybody possibly justify this level of ostentation(or, for the amoral weasels who just don't care, how could they possibly believe that they could get away with this level of ostentation(erm, besides a quick assessment of what people have been able to get away with these days, that is, never mind about that one))?
Congress told them? (Score:5, Insightful)
The USAF doesn't report to Congress. Since their Commander in Chief treats Congress like a jizz rag, it's unreasonable to expect anyone in the armed forces to show them any respect. They won't cut budgets, and the most that they every do is write Sternly Worded Memos, or go running to the courts like little snivelling bitches, wailing "Pretty please make everyone obey the law."
I swear, the USA is one lost staring contest away from a bloodless military coup. I mean, if it hasn't already happened. How would we tell the difference?
Re:How? (Score:5, Insightful)
In Pelosi's House, it results in a sternly-worded letter.
Re:USAF... (Score:2, Insightful)
usaf has never been on the same team as the others you mention in this regard. from building the golf courses on a base before the runway to lavish living conditions for staff - they've always been very different.
Re:How is this News For Nerds? (Score:5, Insightful)
Are you suggesting that, because it is regular practice, we should ignore these transgressions? Shouldn't the fact that this happens all the time be all the more reason to spread awareness? Your post makes little sense to me.
Re:USAF... (Score:5, Insightful)
Bullshit, the USAF does NOT build golf courses first. They build the O-Club first then whatever money is left goes to the golf course. They delay the runway and other necessary ops till the Army has to have them and pays for 'em.
Re:How is this News For Nerds? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:How? (Score:5, Insightful)
some military types have no respect even for the constitution or their own rules of conduct ( http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/07/08/atheist.soldier/index.html [cnn.com] ), so what makes you think they'll listen to congress when it comes to spending money on luxuries for themselves?
Watch Yes Minister (Score:5, Insightful)
It should be mandatory viewing because among other things it shows how little real power politicians have.
After all, how long does a general serve compared to a senator? And the general doesn't have to fight a war every 2 years and defeat his rivals.
Re:WTFOMGBBQ? (Score:3, Insightful)
but how could anybody possibly justify this level of ostentation(or, for the amoral weasels who just don't care, how could they possibly believe that they could get away with this level of ostentation(erm, besides a quick assessment of what people have been able to get away with these days, that is, never mind about that one))?
Basically, just about every political appointee and other federal elected official thinks (rightly or wrongly) that he/she is entitled to better than first-class treatment when they fly. When they have to fly military airlift (especially on something like a C-17 instead of a real business-type jet), the military has to put those "comfort capsules" on there. (Imaging riding for 8 hours in a C-17 sitting on a jump seat like a paratrooper instead.) Now, because those officials think they are entitled to kingly treatment, they probably always complain about the quality of the accommodations. Heck, if I was the unfortunate captain of that aircraft, I'd get tired of hearing about it really fast.
In fact, I'll bet that some of the people in congress who sought to deny the Air Force the permission to spend the funds that way are some of the very same people who have complained or berated Air Force crews about the accommodations. Hypocrites and all that.
Re:WTFOMGBBQ? (Score:3, Insightful)
In this case I assume they'll say, "Oh, well, there's nothing we can do. By the way, Air Force, I want to take a 'tour' around Iraq and Afghanistan, prep a C-17 with a comfort capsule on it. These capsules aren't just for Air Force personnel they are for any DV. These people who are saying no to the spending will be the same people using it next month.
Re:huh? (Score:5, Insightful)
I read the article yesterday and was disgusted. I suspect that we are going to see more than a few careers end over it. Every military promotion above a certain level has to be ratified by the Senate. Once the generals behind this boondoggle are identified they are going to find they don't see another promotion.
Fire Them (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Smells Hammy (Score:3, Insightful)
You're neglecting the other alternative:
Don't collect the money that will eventually be spent on pork.
Then its definitely local.
Re:How is this News For Nerds? (Score:1, Insightful)
News flash: government wastes money.
While I don't particularly like the wasted money, I'm much more concerned about attitude that it reflects.
First, a good leader should try to have as accurate an understanding as possible of what things are like for the followers. In this case, the leaders are going out of their way to avoid first hand experience of what it's like for the followers. Basically, they're going out of their way to remain ignorant.
Second, and more fundamentally, the leaders seem to think they're better than the followers. One of the key innovations of the American revolution was that it's better to have a system of experts working together rather than one lone guy at the top. Instead of having the king decide whose head to chop off, it's better to have a system of laws and courts with juries and lawyers and judges.
I worry that the military leadership may be seeing themselves more as lone decision makers (chosen because of their elite decision making capabilities) rather than as humble participants in a larger system. In terms of making decisions, when things are bad for the low level soldier on the ground but good for the top general in his comfort capsule, the experience of the top general should not outweigh the experience of the low level soldier.
Hypocrisy? (Score:5, Insightful)
Write your congrescoundrel. (Score:5, Insightful)
Wtf? (Score:5, Insightful)
already done (Score:2, Insightful)
If you read the arcticle carefuly it explains that this money was going to be used to 'improve' the provisions already in place for Executive officers. I am a crew chief in the military and i will tell you that we already have these things. They are basically 'silver Bullet' campers with a bit of some overhauling on the inside. We already have these things in place, and they are being used. Forget the fact that 102 soldiers fit on board uncomfortably with the center line seats. But i have an idea. why not stop the medical evac missions with their wasted space of 36 litters and just put the 'silver bullets' on board so that General skippy won't spill his F*king martini.
Re:Fire Them (Score:4, Insightful)
...then you've got the beginnings of a military state on your hands.
Um, you've not been following the news much. We're in the degenerate luxury phases of a military state at this point. We've already hit the point of comfort women [dailymail.com]. Nothing surprises me now.
Re:huh? (Score:4, Insightful)
Discharge? That's dumb, with all the decent personnel in Iraq or other combat zones, demote them down to private and relocate them to Iraq.
The promote a few of the personnel from below that have been behaving in a professional and otherwise honorable manner.
Or use that extra person to allow for a fraction of a day of R&R.
Sounds like a case of scope creep (Score:5, Insightful)
Reading from the story, the original idea was good but things got out of hand when people start deviating from the original objectives. The Air Force saw that there was a growing need for top brass and government officials to work and rest on long military flights. They have some planes for this purpose but in some areas for the world (and for security reasons), it would be more practical for these officials to fly on military transports like C-17s. Transports can be fitted to carry troops and personnel but they have the most basic of seats. So modules could be built and put into these transports like UPS or Fedex modular containers but are not made for packages but personnel.
With the idea of a traveling office in mind, some basic elements are probably necessary. Chairs and table for work. Bed for sleep. The module should probably be sound proof/vibration proof as much as possible because these transports have no shielding from either. For communications, the module might need to be plugged into the airplanes communication or its own separate feed. The module probably requires some modest power for equipment. Everything should be bolted down for obvious reasons.
After basic requirements, then it got out of hand. Certain generals wanted leather upgrades to match color. The chairs went from being standard commercial airline chairs to ultra-luxurious first class. TVs and DVD players were added. While a TV/monitor might not be a stretch if used to convey information (video uplinks), it is frivolous if used for entertainment.
Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:5, Insightful)
We're talking about high-level military executives here. Guys who have to make Really Big Decisions.
Now let's say you have one of these Generals in Washington, and they need to go to Iraq.
How do you get them there?
Do they fly commercial? Probably not very regular commercial service from DC to Baghdad.
So you fly them military.
Now, do you fly them in the jump seat of a cargo plane?
That might work for your average soldier, but do you really want the guy in command of all your forces arriving somewhere absolutely tired? Do you want to provide them with a work area for the 12-24 hours they're going to be in the air?
Regular troops have the luxary of not having to go straight from getting off the plane to directly into the battlefield. Generals are high-level decision-making executives who have to be effective all the time.
Capsules give those personnel a work-area where they can be productive on planes, and a sleep area so that when they do get wherever they're going, they're not running on a day of no or crappy sleep. There's a reason that in the commercial sector businesses pay thousands of dollars for business class seats that employees have a chance to sleep in isntead of hundreds of dollars on a coach seat. If they're flying their staff to someplace, it's important, and they don't want their staff operating on poor rest when they arrive.
So, what makes more sense: Spending millions of dollars on aircraft for moving around top military personnel, or spending tens or hundreds of thousands on some pods that can convert any standard-issue cargo plane into a flying office?
Give the guy in charge of keeping 150,000 people in Iraq alive a bed and a desk when he's got to spend 20 hours in the air. That's not a waste of money. And it sounds like building pods might actually be the least expensive way to provide those facilities.
Re:As a previous member of the Air Force... (Score:5, Insightful)
I agree with the GP; doesn't surpise me at all.
Re:Fire Them (Score:3, Insightful)
We've already hit the point of comfort women [dailymail.com]. Nothing surprises me now.
Oh give me a fucking break. You are comparing three women who were raped by their co-workers to the Japanese comfort women [wikipedia.org] of WW2? Were those women kidnapped by our military and forced into that role with the approval of our Government? No? Then it's a bullshit comparison and little better than a bad Nazi reference [wikipedia.org].
Re:The Only Reason Congress... (Score:5, Insightful)
"...to reflect the rank of the senior leaders using the capsule..."
It always bugs me how the military treats the 'senior military officials' better than the soldiers even though the soldiers are the ones putting their lives on the line. Pay increase for going from soldier to non-soldier should be only a lower risk of life, nothing else. What makes it worse is all these 'support our troops' and 'spend money on the military' types don't even realize that the troops are getting shit on.
Re:Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:5, Insightful)
If we send the guy right to the front line, I'm all for your idea. With more top level Generals where the fighting is, we'll probably have fewer wars in the long run.
Thinking about it, we could send some hothead politicians there, too!
Re:Smells Hammy (Score:3, Insightful)
I'd prefer pork not getting spent by the government at all. Then I can buy myself some local goods that I want.
Re:As a previous member of the Air Force... (Score:3, Insightful)
he costs should be borne by their campaigns.
I'd agree with that in the context of Obama's trip to Europe but I have no problem with taxpayer dollars going to send him (or McCain) to Iraq and/or Afghanistan.
Do you really see it as a waste of taxpayer dollars to give the candidates (or our other elected officials for that matter) a view of the war that they will have to contend with once in office?
Re:Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:5, Insightful)
I seriously hope you're joking...
Bed, table, okay...
But: beds, a couch, a table, a 37-inch flat-screen monitor with stereo speakers, and a full-length mirror... That's 20 inches more than you need on your monitor, a lot more mirror than you need, and definitely more couch than you need. How about you give them a bed, small table, and spend the rest on the troops.
Re:And? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:5, Insightful)
You don't join the military for a life of luxury, you join to serve your nation. Luxury accommodations are out-of-scope. A poor example for those under your command, and a bad precedent for where the U.S. command is headed.
The question isn't jump-seats versus a luxury suite. First-class airliner seats [ebay.com], six to ten grand, and that they already have. Mil-spec, hardened laptops [industcomputing.com], five, six grand, standard equipment. Good quality food and drink, gronk.
Multi-million dollar traveling accommodations? Quit the government, join the corporate world, and earn your way up to rewards that come from generating profits, not being a tax-paid decision-maker. The senior officers I've admired most are the ones who drive their own cars, and don't try to lead the pampered life on the taxpayers' dime.
Re:F that. (Score:5, Insightful)
Maybe, but I have to think that Generals tend to be in their 50s and 60s rather than late teens and early twenties. I'm only approaching 30, but I find that my body isn't quite as good at bouncing back after a bad flight or short night's sleep as it used to be. In twenty more years... I say give the guy his comfortable quarters.
The thing I *Don't* like is that they're using funds that they were explicitly forbidden to use.
I also question how much terrorism danger this country is really in if they figure the counter-terrorism funds can be better used on window dressing. That's why Congress is mad (other than because they were ignored): The military is shooting the cash cow.
Re:so ? (Score:2, Insightful)
you didnt do it with the last president
Current president, actually, however you are correct. Bush has made a fool of himself with his ignorance, and a mess of the world.
Re:Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:4, Insightful)
That's 20 inches more than you need on your monitor
More Screen = More Data Displayed = More better work.
and a full-length mirror
When your profession requires a uniform or suit with a strict attention to detail that seems like a given for someone highly paced in such organizations.
Re:USAF... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:2, Insightful)
More Screen = More Data Displayed = More better work.
Yes, because I'm sure that it's mostly used to display data, and not the latest blockbuster movie or porn. ;)
Re:Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:4, Insightful)
I have 3 20" monitors, and they're used entirely to display data.
And I just code. Seems perfectly reasonable that someone in charge of military planning might have a good use for lots of screen real estate - like battlefield maps, for example.
It's not about tough. (Score:4, Insightful)
It's about productive.
There are generals. Presumably, they're generals because they have important shit to do.
If you are flying your general around, do you want him able to work, or do you want him twiddling his thumbs in an airplane seat?
The idea behind the capsules is that you can fly generals around WITHOUT it having to take them 'out of action'. They can be on the plane and doing all the things they could do if they were not on the plane.
Hell, we spend hundreds of millions of dollars making sure the President can be productive on his 747. A few hundred thousand for the next level down in the command chain doesn't seem unreasonable.
Re:Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:4, Insightful)
There are other possible legitimate uses for something like this as well.
It could be used for secure and clandestine meetings with foreign VIPs. Some don't take well to sacrificing comfort and ostentation in the name of secrecy. This would allow such meetings to remain secret without ruffling feathers.
Say for example said VIP is meeting with a foreign head of state (or other high profile figure). The meeting needs to be top secret (no publicity or press knowledge). Said foreign VIP goes to visit airbase (US plane with our VIP and comfort pod is there waiting). While out of site of press in secure area, hops into Comfort Pod which looks like generic cargo container and is loaded into plane. Plane takes off and flies around for meeting to maintain security then returns to airbase. Foreign VIP is happy with comfort level and feels special while security is maintained.
VIP aircraft stand out. A cargo plane on a military airbase does not. When you don't know whether or not the other side is watching, make it harder for them to spot what they are looking for.
Re:How is this News For Nerds? (Score:3, Insightful)
Honestly, the s/n ratio keeps getting worse and worse here. News flash: government wastes money. Next.
What's really stupid here is that this isn't a waste of money. You think general staff and VIP politicos are going to ride down in the slings with the infantry? Fuck no! They're going to make the Air Force fly them around in C-40's [af.mil] or the like. Ponying up $1.5M for a box they can load on a C-17 is much cheaper. On top of that, when you look at the Air Force's budget, a few million is chump change. The only part of this that's even remotely dodgy is them trying to pay for it with "anti-terrorism" money. It hardly rates. All the money they spend comes from our pockets, regardless of what it's earmarked for, so what's the difference?
Re:Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:4, Insightful)
beds, couch, tables, even mirrors are all pretty cheap... Even a 37" flat TV is justified because these are pretty cheap and you need news/data in the air for 12+ hours. The idea of a box they can stuff in a cargo plane to add just 1 office rather than chartering a separate passenger plane is also a good thing.
But the whole point is that they won't buy "hotel" grade stuff like all these business hotels buy up for $100/nite business-class rooms, they'll have each unit with custom, high-end everything inflating the price to executive office levels... and the pod will be assigned by ranks, jobs, so they won't be "common use" they'll be flown around EMPTY most of the time to get the Pods to the "appropriate" people.
Decision makers should be elitists. (Score:3, Insightful)
A tired grunt gets himself and maybe his buddies killed.
A tired general gets hundreds or thousands of grunts killed.
You're also missing another aspect.
Your general is going to be making mission-critical decisions on-arrival, or maybe even on the plane. The people 'actually doing the job' have buffer time between when they arrive and when they are in mission-critical environments.
Or put another way, when the 'people doing the job' get off the plane, they get a chance to get a night's sleep before they're involved in battle. That's not a luxury available to your military brass.
Re:How? (Score:3, Insightful)
I ran into one instance back arround 1978 or 79, none since and I retired in 1998. The Military is big and diverse, you'll run into anything you'll run into in society there yet for the most part the military is more progressive than society in general.
Re:The Only Reason Congress... (Score:4, Insightful)
"Pay increase for going from soldier to non-soldier should be only a lower risk of life, nothing else."
Brilliant career soldier retention move there...
The move up in hassle and responsiblity is no joke, be it from junior enlisted to mid-level enlisted or through officer career progression. The bennies that go with rank, such as they are, are cheap compared to civilian executive compensation.
Re:The Only Reason Congress... (Score:2, Insightful)
When I was in the Marine Corps we had nothing but ancient rifles and flack jackets, and we are the ones who die.
Re:The Only Reason Congress... (Score:3, Insightful)
It always bugs me how the military treats the 'senior military officials' better than the soldiers even though the soldiers are the ones putting their lives on the line.
Class warfare, read up on it.
The soldiers' job is 100% to protect and further the advantageous lifestyle of their 'betters'. Stop idealizing the soldiers, they're just tools, and stop believing their masters, they just want the tools to have good morale so they'll be more productive.
Re:Actually, this really could be legitimate... (Score:3, Insightful)
>> Honestly, I think 68k for a change of that nature is quite cheap if you look at all of the things involved
If you know the change will cost $68,000... don't you think you could live with brown leather instead of blue?