LucasArts Embargoes "Clone Wars" Reviews 603
An anonymous reader writes "George Lucas CGI 'Clone Wars' movie has premiered to reviews ranging from MSNBC's 'Ugly animation and an uninspired storyline drag down the film' to AintItCool's 'I hated the film. HATED IT. REALLY HATED IT.' Critics have noted the animation style, music and slapstick humor had more than a passing similarity to Pixar's Toy Story, and wondered if the introduction of new action figures (sorry, characters) like Baby Jabba Hutt and Jabba the Hutt's Gay Uncle may have taken the franchise a bridge too far.
Lucas responding by enforcing an embargo, forcing the reviews to be taken down. While sites like AintItCool.com responded, by then it was just a little too late.
Still, the CGI eye candy will make it popular with kids. If the 'Clone Wars' movie can't save the galaxy, can it at least save the franchise?"
George Lucas (Score:4, Insightful)
Can suck my dick.
Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
Streisand (Score:5, Insightful)
If Lucas really wants those bad reviews out there front and center, he's doing a bang up job of ensuring that.
well, i'm afraid (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
Wow. Seriously dude, I've never, ever heard those words used together like that.
I know! The Clone Wars is supposed to be so awful it'll make someone five years from now post "Jar-jar was cool."
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, I was 8 when I first watched A New hope. I loved it. I watched it again few months ago...And Frankly I found the scenario a bit too simple. But my nephew simply loved it...So the real show for me was watching him :-).
Don't you feel that we are simply getting older and the star wars franchise isn't for us anymore? Kids seem to enjoy it as much as we did (IMHO).
As a 30's, I prefer is Battlestar Galactica II. I prefer six over the princess anyday ;-)
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
I think they really missed the Han Solo type of character in the new stuff. Han Solo showed you can be kickass without the force. The new movies relegated everyone without the force to cannon fodder. While watching force power fights are fun they don't really make good story as they have a lot of power. But there isn't really anyone to relate to. the Jedi were too goody goody. The sith were mostly just evil. (Duko had a chance as a good vilan but they just gave him one movie (Which was horible) and killed in 5 minutes in the next) Han Solo was the good guy but had a dark side which made him more human and recognizable. The new movies didn't have that. They kinda tried with Jar Jar but he was too stupid and attempt to be a comic role (which R2D2 and C3PO took as well) we needed a serious character who was a normal guy who kicked ass.
Except that it doesn't make sense (Score:5, Insightful)
Lets not forget that episodes 1-3 were not exactly cheap to produce. If Lucas had sold out, he would have had the movies made in hong-kong on a shoe-string budget and then raked in the cash based on the brand alone. THAT is selling out.
What he did instead is forget what made the original movies such a success, not just with kids but with adults as well (it was my mom that introduced me to Star Wars and she was an adult mother when it was released) and instead attempted to make the movie appeal to kids without understand what kids want.
Basically, he ignored his matured fanbase and tried to appeal to a new demographic that just didn't exist.
Lets face it, kids today got better entertainment then 3 films that are nothing but a punch and judy show (KIDS: look out punch BEHIND you PUNCH: where KIDS: BEHIND YOU), the jedis never being able to spot the baddie until it is way to late.
It might have worked as high fantasy with a doomed ending with just a tiny bit of hope remaining but that doesn't work in a kiddy movie.
I like the ending of episode three were you see the would be rebels dispersing, but everything before was just... Well not bad exactly, just that the actors could not act, Lucas can't write or direct and just who was the story aimed at anyway?
The most obvious failure? Nobody quotes the new star wars to honor it. "These are not the droids you are looking for" "I am your father" "I find your lack of faith disturbing" "It is a trap".
Where are the episode 1-3 quotes?
George Lucas one had luck producing a movie, it is known by fans that this was not his own creation, his wife for instance seems to have played a large role. Other directors did ESB. He should go back to producing but frankly, his most crowning achievement, getting Star Wars made in the 70's is no longer anything complex with the fortune he has know and the standard high special effects movie we got know. People forgot just how ground breaking A New Hope was from a producers job. That is gone now. Lucas has nothing to do but sign the checks and so he gets involved with other things that were previously left to others.
Lucas did not make A New Hope, he produced it. He did make episode 1-3. That's the problem.
Not the biggest movie and its STAR WARS (Score:5, Insightful)
The franchise was already lost. A new Star Wars movie is coming out to theaters and its not even close to being the #1 geek movie of the summer. Even if you took out the superhero movies and Star Trek, its still lagging behind. Ten years ago that would have been inconceivable as even re-releases were huge.
You can't live off past glory forever.
Re:What? (Score:2, Insightful)
WOOKIES DONT LIVE ON ENDOR!
Actually, this is another quote from South Park. The Halloween episode, where everyone dresses as Chewbacca.
Okay (Score:2, Insightful)
The web designer of one of the websites linked in TFA took it upon him/herself to resize my browser.
You don't touch my browser without permission. I really wonder who the fuck tought it was a good idea to even allow such crap to take place.
I have my browser set just the way I want it, centered exactly where I want it on my widescreen desktop. Whenever some crappy website goes ahead and wrecks this up, I end up not viewing it. It infuriates me to no end.
Sorry for the rant, feel free to mod me offtopic, but I felt it had to be said.
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
I knew not to see this when I saw the trailer (Score:3, Insightful)
I am not in any way a Star Wars nerd anymore, take note of that.
I saw a link to the trailer on a website I frequent back in May this year, I didn't even know a SW animated movie was coming out and honestly didn't care.
However, I'm open to try a movie of any kind, animated, puppets, I don't care if it's good - I like pixar movies, I once liked Star Wars, I even tried the final fantasy movie.
When the link was posted, within minutes people mocked it and laughed, it's got nothing to do with being untrue to the Star Wars franchise, if anything that may make some hardcore Star Wars fans 'forgive it' - I just saw a trailer for an absoloutely laughable looking kids film, not what I'm interested in, when "Jabba's son has been kidnapped!" is a plot element they feel worthy enough to put in a movie, I figure it's not going places.
http://www.shacknews.com/laryn.x?id=16928277#itemanchor_16928277 [shacknews.com]
Here is something of note which I figure most of you will agree with and sadly hollywood will never read, nor understand.
Ever since the 3 new movies, Star Wars has been forever tarnished, changing from a great story and universe I am interested in, to something I look at in my mind as simply a 'franchise' or a product.
It's a fascinating transition and one I'm sure marketing people would love to know more about, maybe it's to do with my age or cynicism? Ultimately from my perspective the entire universe is now un-interesting to me, they've caused themselves a massive dis-service as I do not salivate at the thought of any Star Wars products, I don't even fondly remember the originals as I simply can't watch them in the same way.
Yes they are still good but deep down I know that whole universe is diluted.
I had the same feeling from the Matrix sequels, I have no interest even in the first film now.
Just to clarify my stance, I was never ever a huge SW nerd, but I was I guess a light fan (I'm 30 btw) so I saw ROTJ in the cinema, too young for ANH and don't recall empire.
I was never a major hardcore fan, I never purchased the toys or anything but I did like the universe, I did really love the movies and I would've purchased them on DVD for example.
Even the changes to the old 3 movies, made it feel like a product (A New hope 1.01, buy it now!)
Anyhow people go check out the new movie, word on the st is JABBAS SON HAS BEEN KIDNAPPED (oh noes!) :/
Re:Does taking down reviews ever help? (Score:5, Insightful)
Seems to me that if you're a reviewer, your reputation for independence is more important than early access to films. Who cares if you review a movie early, if that review is nothing but a mouthpiece for Lucasfilm marketing?
Every reviewer with integrity should publish what they want, when they want. If the entire industry bars them from reviewing films until they're open, then people will learn not to see films on opening day. I don't think the industry wants that.
Re:Does taking down reviews ever help? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
I think they really missed the Han Solo type of character in the new stuff. Han Solo showed you can be kickass without the force. The new movies relegated everyone without the force to cannon fodder. While watching force power fights are fun they don't really make good story as they have a lot of power.
And now they have a Force Unleashed game coming out where they amp up the Force powers until it's like frickin' Dragonball Z. All that's missing is Vegeta screaming "HIS POWER LEVELS ARE 9000??!!!" Crazy-stupid boosting of character powers for drama's sake, it's like their script was something 13-year old boys were furiously masturbating over. All that remains is for Anakin to scream out "I AM THE BEST JEDI EVER! AND THAT IS TRUE ULTIMATE POWER!"
Oh, he's always been Lucas... (Score:4, Insightful)
...but in the past, he had interference.
Note that most of those films were made after Star Wars made his reputation, that the first two Star Wars films were clearly either constrained by the studio or largely handed off to other people, and that despite its resounding success Return of the Jedi - the film over which Lucas had the most creative control - is widely regarded to be the worst of the first three films. His then-wife also apparently had quite a bit of creative input, if this interview with Mark Hamill [filmfreakcentral.net] is accurate.
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:More For Kids, I Think. (Score:4, Insightful)
I think this one is indeed more for kids.
I've never understood why this is considered a viable excuse for being terrible. "Oh, this movie sucks, but it's ok. It's intended for kids."??
Not to call you specifically out for this, but we wouldn't accept this excuse in other things. "Oh, it's ok that this baby food isn't nutritious at all. It's just for babies." That wouldn't really fly, would it? Or, "Our school system is terrible, but that's ok because it's just for kids."
I understand that kids might be more easily fooled into thinking that a movie is going to be great than adults. I also understand that, as a parent, you can't be on constant guard and fighting every one of these battles. But in my opinion, the fact that it's for kids means that it really should be *good*. And it's not as though it's an impossible feat to make a good movie that's kid-appropriate. Pixar, for example, has been doing it for years.
Most of the reason I'm making a point of saying this is that Lucas seems to be making horrible and stupid movies on the idea that it's appropriate to make dumb, meaningless, brain-dead movies because morons and kids will really enjoy the cheap humor. Part of the reason Ep 1 was so awful was because it was "for the kids", but if I had kids, I wouldn't particularly want them to be watching that sort of crap. I'd almost rather that kids were watching good movies that had a little sex and violence than shitty movies with absolutely no value. A lot of times, the adult themes go over the kids' heads anyway, and there's not much harm done. But if you expose them to movies with any kind of value, then some of that value might sink in.
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:3, Insightful)
Not to defend jar jar or anything but someone had to hand the republic over to the empire. He served his purpose.
Re:Embargo this.... (Score:3, Insightful)
Let's all post it in the talkbacks en masse.
Seriously, if you have a few thousand Slashdotters posting it in the talkbacks, the moderators will have to spend all day banning people. Remember, it'll only take a few seconds for one of us to post it; whoever has to remove thousands of posts and ban thousands of people will have their day ruined.
I wish AICN had balls like the Inquirer. The INQ laughs at embargoes and openly mocks people who try to enforce them.
Re:TIE Fighter II (Score:5, Insightful)
Given how awesome TIE Fighter was? I'd take that.
Re:Does taking down reviews ever help? (Score:3, Insightful)
Being told there's an embargo is different from agreeing to shutup.
Re:If in doubt, read this article! (Score:5, Insightful)
Should have bought stock. Had you put that same $670 in a DJIA tracker back in '81 you'd have $8262 right now. Had you had amazing foresight and put it in Apple stock, you'd have almost $41,000!
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:2, Insightful)
Yeah, the midichlorians really threw the spirituality/mythology themes under the bus.
Actually, now that I think of it, I don't think that having force-related science was really the problem. It's entirely to be expected -- remember, we're talking about a civilization which has lasted tens of thousands of years. There's no reason to think that anything, no matter how mystical, would be left unexplored by science.
No, there are two bigger problems with midichlorians:
First, they sound like mitochondria, and are functionally vaguely similar. It really breaks suspension of disbelief if you know any basic cellular biology, because you can't help but realize that whoever wrote that crap was sort of vaguely remembering their high school biology, and not going back to research it.
And second, they completely change the dynamic of who gets to be a Jedi. It's official, now -- it's nature, not nurture.
The mechanic is somewhat like if some of us were born super-muscular (think Captain Hammer [wikipedia.org]), while some were born weaklings, and no amount of lifting weights and working out would turn a weakling into a musclehead, and no amount of slacking would turn a musclehead into a weakling.
The real world is much kinder. There is some nature, certainly -- there are those who are naturally skinny, and those child geniuses who graduate college at age 12 -- but the rest of us can study hard and work out and make up some of the difference.
In the Star Wars universe, having a high enough midichlorian count to be Force-sensitive is rare, and if yours is low, you're SOL, you'll never be a Jedi.
Oh, I have no doubt (Score:5, Insightful)
I know exactly what's driving Lucas on this. Cash. Period. Whatever motivations he may have once had for this story and this franchise, his sole concern now seems to be the bank account.
Supposedly the new movie was supposed to be televised first and then straight to DVD, and during preparation of the movie Lucas' people said he lit up and said something like "This is so good it needs to be in theaters!".
I think it was more like "Hey, I think we can squeeze another 90 to 100 million out of the suckers if we put this in theaters".
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
He is at about the same level of annoyance that the Ewoks were in Jedi, the difference is the rest of the movie. Jedi was a GREAT story, and even if the acting and some of the dialog was a little shaky. Episodes I, II and III all suffered from poor writing. The story just wasn't there. It made annoying characters like Jar-Jar just stand out all the more.
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
I'd put it another, sadder way: the first two movies were "broken" from what Lucas really wanted, and it wasn't until Jedi and the prequels that he started to exercise greater control. Or rather, what you like best about A New Hope and Empire is not what Lucas was really shooting for: these were all meant to be kid's movies, and that the first couple attracted adults and sci-fi lovers was a profitable accident.
The more control Lucas has over the story and filming, the worse the film ends up. Go see Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull and then read one of the leaked copies of Indiana Jones and the City of the Gods on the Internet. The latter is a professionally written screenplay by someone who loves the characters, the former is Lucas's "corrected" version. We need to stop having high expectations of the man.
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:5, Insightful)
Lucas is a master at coming up with stories, he just isn't great at actually writing them. He's given us Star Wars, Indiana Jones, and Willow. He is also good visually; all the Star Wars movies look fantastic visually and have awesome special effects. He just needs to let other people write and direct and only be involved at a creative level (artistic direction, overarching story, visual effects, etc.).
Mediocre? (Score:3, Insightful)
Gotta say, I've gone back and watched those as an adult and been shocked at how mediocre they really are. I guess nine year olds are an easy audience to please.
I don't think the original is mediocre at all. Simple, maybe, but that doesn't equal mediocre. I think your opinion may be colored by the fact that for 30 years, competitors have tried to ape Lucas' original genius, by adding more and more special effects, and by making the story more complex, adult, and "real".
But that's missing the point completely. Star Wars struck such a universal chord in us because it's essentially a fairy tale with a moral story at the center. The simplicity was actually part and parcel of why it was so effective. Simple was a virtue in that movie. We didn't want nuance and intrigue and grey areas. After Vietnam, Watergate, Pol Pot, Jonestown, Charles Manson, urban riots, and Soviets stretching across the globe, we had all the nuance, intrigue, and gray areas we could handle, thanks. What we needed was a simple, old fashioned, black and white tale that showed good guys should still beat beat guys. Lucas gave us exactly what we needed, what our souls were craving; a cut and dried heroic epic with a moral to the story. He just did it with spaceships and wookies.
And maybe that's why the last few movies were so abominable. He went from a straight up "good guys are better than bad guys" allegory to "only the Sith deal in absolutes"; he took away our simple heroic fairy tale, and gave us... nuance, intrigue, and gray areas.
Now its all about the special effects (Score:3, Insightful)
Now, since CGI effects are a dime a dozen, he can throw them in everywhere he wants. Now the storyline and characters are just supporting elements for all the "cool" visual effects. He doesn't want anyone to imagine anymore, he wants to spoon feed you everything the way he sees it.
Maybe a braindead audience is easier to sell "made in taiwan" toys to?
Re:Oh, I have no doubt (Score:5, Insightful)
It isn't "making money" that is the problem. There are acceptable ways to make money, and unacceptable ways. The intersection of art and money is touchy, and selling-out usually does hurt the art (though perhaps not in proportion to the feeling of betrayal expressed by fans). If your mother and sisters announced that they had become prostitutes, surely you wouldn't object to the fact that they were making money.
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:3, Insightful)
In Episode I, they put their main power reactor in a DOCKING BAY full of fighters. They didn't even need to blow up the trade federation ships, they could have just waited until some pilot accidentally made a bad landing.
Also, pretty much my favorite scene in that movie is where Anakin, somehow, manages to get through the trade federation mothership shields. Something which is impossible for the trained pilots in the exact same ship. The movie doesn't explain how he does this, except they do make it a point of having the other pilots ask, "how did he do that?" Thus, specifically pointing out to the audience that the script makes no damned sense.
Protip: if you're a screenwriter and you put something crazy in your script, don't have the other characters comment on it!
(Unless it's a gag, like with the motion detector scene in Alien.)
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:3, Insightful)
He was also younger and less powerful at the time. He surrounded himself with great talent that would advise him and criticize what needed to be fixed and he'd listen. The more power in the film industry he got the more yes men would bubble up to become his support staff. The less outside influence made it in and Lucas began making a movie from a very singular vision and little of the great outside talent helping.
biggest problem I have... (Score:4, Insightful)
How much money is enough?
Fuck you Lucas.
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:4, Insightful)
I know that's pretty backwards, but those stories had so much more depth and better characters to them. I even went back to re-read the Timothy Zahn series just this year, and came to the same conclusion as you.
Re:Streisand (Score:5, Insightful)
If you strike down these reviews, they will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:3, Insightful)
There should have been way more of Anakin trying to do the right thing, but moving closer to the dark side in the process. It would have made some of the parts of the original trilogy more meaningful, especially where Ben and Yoda implore Luke not to go to Cloud City.
Re:Oh, I have no doubt (Score:5, Insightful)
I know exactly what's driving Lucas on this. Cash. Period. Whatever motivations he may have once had for this story and this franchise, his sole concern now seems to be the bank account.
I disagree. According to Forbes [forbes.com], George's personal fortune is immense. He's worth $3.5 billion, making him #61 on the list of the 400 Richest people in America. He could buy a new Ferrari every day for the rest of his life and still have billions left over. Ditto for yachts, mansions, and jets. What possible motivation would he have to try and amass more wealth? As Bill Gates once said, at some point, no matter how much you're able to pay for a hamburger, does it taste any better?
What's driving Lucas here is that he thinks his films are the highest art in the land. He truly thinks he can write good dialogue (he can't), touching love scenes (dear God, no), and witty humor (for a three-year-old, maybe). He puts out this execrable dreck because, in his mind, it's all the other films that are execrable dreck. His wealth allows him to live in his own world, and I'm quite sure all those around him -- who are dependent upon him for a paycheck -- nod respectfully and praise his work as that of a master even when they'd probably rather wipe their asses with it.
No, it's not greed that drives Lucas to destroy our cherished childhood memories of one of the most seminal films ever made. It's his pride. He simply refuses to believe he's as awful of a filmmaker as he really is, and stuff like Clone Wars is the result.
Re:Oh, I have no doubt (Score:4, Insightful)
Supposedly the new movie was supposed to be televised first and then straight to DVD, and during preparation of the movie Lucas' people said he lit up and said something like "This is so good it needs to be in theaters!".
I don't know that Lucas is "only" in it for the money. The above is exactly what happened with Toy Story 2, yet the difference was that Lucas thought he had a good movie.. but he didn't. The more I look at his newer stuff, the more it's apparent that he simply doesn't have judgment with regards to the quality of his work. He has no one who can tell him "no, this sucks" anymore, and when you surround yourself with yes-men and that's all you ever hear, you begin to believe your own bullshit. While greed may be a big factor, I think a big part of it is just how out of touch Lucas is. He doesn't have the pure, forceful vision, and has no moderating influences.
Re:Lucas' Money (Score:4, Insightful)
> Lastly, the problem isn't money, the problem is that he's pushing yet more crap in the guise of quality.
You people really need to get a grip and take a second look at
a) what he was ripping off to begin with
b) what happened when people tried to make "knock offs" of his stuff.
It's STAR WARS. It was never Shakesphere.
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:2, Insightful)
The Quest for Glory series was Sierra.
Perhaps you're thinking of Monkey Island?
Re:Save the Franchise? (Score:3, Insightful)
Lucas is his own biggest fan. So the "like" is redundant.