Legal Troubles Continue To Mount For Diebold 115
dstates writes "The State of Maryland has filed a $8.5M claim against Premier Election Systems (previously known as Diebold), joining Ohio in seeking damages from the company. The claim alleges that election officials were forced to spend millions of dollars to address multiple security flaws in the machines. Previously, Diebold paid millions to settle a California lawsuit over security issues in their machines. The dispute comes as Maryland and Virginia prepare to scrap the touch screen electronic voting systems they bought after the 2000 presidential election. California, Florida, New Mexico, and Iowa have already switched to optical scanners, and voters in Pennsylvania are suing to prevent the use of paperless electronic voting systems in their state. Meanwhile, Artifex Software is suing Diebold for violations of the GPL covering the Ghostscript software technology used in the proprietary voting machines."
whats the point anymore? (Score:2, Insightful)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efKguI0NFek [youtube.com]
!Paperless (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:!Paperless (Score:5, Insightful)
The truth is that while paperless may sound sexy it is not really practical.
The truth is that Diebold's problems have nothing to do with the paper or paperless issue, and everything to do with incompetent design and execution. Which is all the more galling considering the relative straight-forwardness of the programming task. A corrupt or inaccurate paper audit trail would be just as useful as no audit trail at all, and arguably more harmful.
Re:!Paperless (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm sorry, but if you think this is a straightforward task, you are making the same mistake Diebold did. Programming is just one minor part of the whole system they need to implement.
then don't rant - act (Score:1, Insightful)
As a lone rant it won't make a difference, but as a group you can change what's happening in Washington. Get rid of the aspects of the US that clearly go against your espoused morals, including but not limited to Guantanamo Bay (the weakest excuse ever to perpetrate atrocities), move towards the principles of the Constitution once more and go after ANYONE who tries to get away with anything dodgy. INSIST on transparency, also from all the agencies. You may have to bury a bad past, but that's no excuse for an equally bad future.
The latter includes the judges who were supposed to guard your legal system but has sat back and let it become the playground of the rich and unprincipled, the security "services" that willingly break the law with the excuses of "terror" and "for America". Even now, the US has heaps of potential but the Bush administration has willingly ruined the standing the US had in the world.
Last but not least, think again about impeaching people. If you impeach one president because he's human you should CERTAINLY impeach those who trampled the very founding principles and imperilled the entire world with their grab for money. I'm not against making money, but I am against slaughtering the goose with the golden eggs to benefit just a few.
The US standing has never been so low, the currency never so weak, the national debt never so high. Yet, you can still overcome this - if you back to core principles.
I refuse to believe that a nation that can produce people like the late Randy Pausch can be all bad, but you sure worked hard making it appear that way. There are very few nations left who would trust the US as the basic assumption is that you won't hold yourself to any laws, even your own, and you will cheap, bully and blackmail to get your way. Quite a nice image to have as the formerly leading "democracy".
On the bright side, it can't possibly get any worse. Unless you start another war..
Re:!Paperless (Score:4, Insightful)
Well not exactly. Diebold managed to screw up several parts of the system.
The software
The lousy hardware locks
The poor update process
Just to name three off the top of my head before my second cup of coffee. Makes one wonder about Hanlon's razor. I guess you gotta be good at something.
Re: (Score:4, Insightful)
It's not about technology (Score:3, Insightful)
Paperless shouldn't even be attempted.
This is the system used to elect leaders. Trillions of dollars and millions lives are affected by election results.
Whatever system you choose must have full audit capabilities ... and that means paper.
The only reason for using electronics is to get faster results to those with short attention spans.
Re:The rich got what they want! (Score:2, Insightful)
It's funny, but you know, its people like you that have let the people like Bush get away with what they have.
Enjoy what you've been arguing for, because we'll be a long time digging out.
Re:!Paperless (Score:4, Insightful)
Won't work. Once the vote is public information, people can be bought/pressured to change their vote.
Re:then don't rant - act (Score:5, Insightful)
then don't rant - act
Think I haven't? Short of taking up arms against my country, I've done all the legal things I can. The tide is turning, I think, but it takes a long time to wake up the U.S.A.
I honestly believe that the vast majority of Americans are motivated less by money and more by "doing the right thing." The problems is that "the right thing to do" has been purposefully obfuscated by the bastards in power. By using christiantity and the talking heads of talk radio, propaganda minister of the Bush administration, Karl Rove, has successfully turned America in against itself. Dividing families and groups against each other over simplistic moral debates, while completely drowning the substantive discussions about what is truly best for the country.
All this so that they can rob the country of its wealth and make themselves rich at the same time.
I'll say here and now, Bush and Cheney and everyone in their administration have been traitors to the U.S.A.
Signed, patriotic American!!
Re:!Paperless (Score:3, Insightful)
Yes. You know it's broken, you know how it's broken, and you probably know who broke it. With an auditless election you cannot logically know any of these things beyond a reasonable doubt.
Do you understand the normal paper counting process and why it is logicaly possible to trust it? Do you understand why it is logicaly impossible to trust a computer that the opposition cannot audit? Paper is not perfect, neither is democracy come to think of it but both are indeed usefull.
Re:Bleed 'em dry! (Score:2, Insightful)
I'm usually not someone who sides with people trying to drain a company through legal means, but in this case I'm willing to make an exception. Bleed them. Make them go bankrupt. If they go under, that's the last we'll see of EVoting, because nobody would willingly touch it again with a ten foot pole.
Bah, if there's any proof that they tampered with election results, surely that should be grounds for a criminal case, not a civil one?
Heck, as far as I'm concerned screwing with the democratic process amounts to high treason.
Re:The rich got what they want! (Score:3, Insightful)
Who cares? I know that it's fun to bash Bush, but geez, let's stick to bashing diebold.
It is Diebold in Ohio that enabled the shrub to get re-elected.
For the record, I have no problem with computerized entry machines, but the final output that I turn-in needs to be easily readable paper that is counted by human eyes at some point in the process, IMO.
One of my first jobs, right out of high school, was as a bank teller. Right around the time of the introduction of the ATM in the late 70s/early 80s.
More or less 30 years have passed and a measurable percentage of the population are afraid or are incapable of using one. What makes anyone think that this is appropriate technology for voting?