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Craigslist Shielded From Prosecution In SC 78

Posted by Soulskill from the at-least-for-now dept.
viyh writes with an update to the ongoing legal troubles faced by Craigslist over their adult-services ads. According to CNN, a South Carolina judge has told the office of the state's Attorney General, Henry McMaster, to cease their efforts to bring criminal charges against the operators of Craigslist. "On Friday, Judge Weston Houck granted Craigslist's request for a temporary restraining order preventing McMaster and his employees from 'initiating or pursuing [any] prosecution against Craigslist or its officers and employees in relation to content posted by third parties on Craigslist's Web site' until the court rules on the merits of the site's lawsuit. Craigslist's lawsuit cites an interview McMaster gave to Fox News on Monday, in which he likened the site 'to a hotel or motel owner that knows prostitution is going on on their premises and fails to do anything about it especially after having been told.'"
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Craigslist Shielded From Prosecution In SC More

Craigslist Shielded From Prosecution In SC

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  • Mass moderation not possible (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Psyborgue ( 699890 ) on Sunday May 24, 2009 @12:51PM (#28075599) Journal
    With the sheer volume of ads on craigslist, how can anybody expect them to moderate everything on there. Isn't it easier and far more just for craigslist to take a neutural stance and let the justice system do it's job on a neutural basis. It's my understanding anyway that service providers are not responsible of the content of their websites anyway if they do not provide content under the safe harbor provisions of the communications decency act [wikipedia.org]. Craigslist has already been granted immunity for hosting descriminatory housing ads [wikipedia.org]. I'd be willing to bet they can get out of this too using the same legislation.
    • I really need to use to learn to proffread my posts. Far to used to phpbb.

    • With the sheer volume of ads on craigslist, how can anybody expect them to moderate everything on there.

      This isn't moderation. CL has a specific section dedicated to "erotic services", an illegal activity in the United States and much of the world. That's a)recognition of an illegal activity and b)catering one's services to it.

      For those of you who think we should regulate prostitution, go read the Wikipedia article about Amsterdam and prostitution. It's a cesspool of human trafficking from 2nd/3rd wo

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward

        Erotic services are illegal? Ah, so that is why there are no strip clubs in USA?

        Helping people find such services is illegal? Oh, that is why the advertisers, etc. of such clubs are thrown into jail.

        Spending money in order to get sex is illegal? Oh, cops should have thrown me to jail many times when I've offered a drink to someone.

        What exactly is illegal is far, far narrower than "erotic services" and it makes a big difference here. And while I frequently use Wikipedia myself, I don't think that it always g

        • Bad example.

          We all know that prostitution never occurs at strip clubs or between their employees and patrons off grounds.

      • Re:This is not moderation, this is accomodation. (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Zerth ( 26112 ) on Sunday May 24, 2009 @01:51PM (#28076087)

        Chances are good your local yellow pages also has a section dedicated to "erotic services". I don't see those going away. SC just thinks it can play "but it's on the internet" card and get away with it.

      • "Erotic services" is a very wide category encompassing everything from "fuck buddies" to porn acting. Could you think of a better name?

      • Re:This is not moderation, this is accomodation. (Score:5, Insightful)

        by owlnation ( 858981 ) on Sunday May 24, 2009 @02:04PM (#28076187)

        For those of you who think we should regulate prostitution, go read the Wikipedia article about Amsterdam and prostitution. It's a cesspool of human trafficking from 2nd/3rd world countries- tantamount to slavery.

        Firstly, the last place anyone should go for real facts on something is Wikipedia.

        Secondly, the situation in Amsterdam isn't as bad as you nor Wikipedia claims it to be (NGO's distort facts for funding).

        Thirdly, even if that were true, there's plenty of other countries were legalized prostitution works extremely well, Germany, Switzerland etc.

        Fourthly, organized crime is involved in prostitution everywhere, by legalizing it you are on the first step to reducing the problem of organized crime.

        Fifthly, "Erotic Services" are not actually illegal -- it depends on what that service is, and how transactions occur. Phone sex, webcam sex services for example are "erotic services" and wholly legal.

        Just because organized crime is involved in prostitution, doesn't mean that a legalized system can't be properly run to reduce that. See Prohibition for an example of how making something illegal leads to a black market and organized crime -- legalizing it reduces that problem.

        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by TrekkieGod ( 627867 )

          Thirdly, even if that were true, there's plenty of other countries were legalized prostitution works extremely well, Germany, Switzerland etc.

          Don't forget the United States. There's legalized and regulated prostitution in Nevada.

        • Re:This is not moderation, this is accomodation. (Score:5, Informative)

          by bitserf ( 756357 ) on Sunday May 24, 2009 @06:51PM (#28078379)

          We've had legalized prostitution in New Zealand since 2003.

          Contrary to the scaremongering promulgated by people with hidden agendas, the sky has not fallen, and people working in the world's oldest profession have the full protection of the law behind them, just like everyone else.

          Doesn't mean there isn't still a social stigma associated with it, but at least they're not forced into the underground and exploited by criminals, and they pay their taxes just like everyone else.

          • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

            by Petrushka ( 815171 )

            We've had legalized prostitution in New Zealand since 2003.

            I agree wholly with your reading of the situation, but one small correction: prostitution hasn't been legalised, it's been decriminalised. As I understand it (IANAL) that means basically that it's unregulated -- no employment or health-and-safety regulations, for example, other than the kind of endangerment and contractual issues that apply to everyone regardless of their line of work.

            In some ways I find this a much preferable situation to legalisation, as (a) it's purer capitalism -- less regulation --, an

            • prostitution hasn't been legalised, it's been decriminalised.

              So it's not legal, but it's not a crime either?

              Is it a civil matter, then? Who's supposed to sue the prostitutes? Their customers?

            • I have to ask because of the subject line, but when you wrote IANAL- do you mean you are not a lawyer or you like ANAL (giving or getting- it doesn't matter)?

              Just wondering.

      • A stripper at a bachelor party is providing a erotic service that is not against the law.

        If you go to Nevada you'll find that there are legal cat houses there "like from the HBO show Cat House".

        Craigs List made a statement months ago when this all started saying that those adds would be on the site with or without the "erotic services" section and at least this way the only way you would see them is if you were looking for them. That section isn't about Craigs List partnering in prostitution or even saying

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by nbauman ( 624611 )

        The best reason for having a board on Craigslist advertising for commercial sex is that, otherwise, the same people will spam the m4w, w4m and *4* boards and annoy people looking for noncommercial sex.

        And now that is in fact happening on Craigslist.

        • noncommercial sex

          I don't think those words mean what you think they mean. (The 60's were over decades ago.)

        • So what your saying is that perhaps some of the ads in w4m will be real women now instead of computer programs.

          ---

          all kidding aside, I found much better luck posting in m4w and adding a topical question-- "What is the huge shopping mall at the corner of these two freeways". the response I got which had an answer were always human. Call it a personal "Captcha".

    • Isn't it easier and far more just for craigslist to take a neutural stance and let the justice system do it's job on a neutural basis.

      I don't know, that takes some serious balls, and might leave craigslist a fertile ground for lawsuits. The courts are quite potent, you know...

  • If Henry McMaster liken Craigslist to a hotel with ho's then what was he doing there? Henry McMaster may find his stuff listed on Craigslist soon.

  • in which [McMaster] likened the site "to a hotel or motel owner that knows prostitution is going on on their premises and fails to do anything about it especially after having been told."

    Yet McMaster and (most) other politicians have been whoring themselves to corporate and special interest lobbyists since time immemorial. Not only do the "owners" of the house know this, everyone knows this, and there's actual public demand for this to stop.

    When will McMaster do something about that?

  • Oh, the hypocrisy (New York State division) (Score:3, Funny)

    by nbauman ( 624611 ) on Sunday May 24, 2009 @01:19PM (#28075821) Homepage Journal

    I see that New York State Attorney General Andrew Cuomo just indicted 7 people for running a prostitution ring on Craigslist. http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/05/20/craigslist.prostitution/index.html [cnn.com]

    The last New York State Attorney General to indict people on prostitution charges was Elliot Spitzer.

    Just saying.

  • Going after Craig'sList is a way for politicians and police to appear to be doing something so that people don't notice that they are not doing their jobs. If I was an officer of the law and I wanted to stop prostitution, I'd start contacting every advertiser in the erotic services section and arrange a meeting. Go to the meeting, arrest them.

  • Don't Prosecute it - USE IT! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by RudeIota ( 1131331 ) on Sunday May 24, 2009 @01:29PM (#28075901) Homepage

    "in which he likened the site 'to a hotel or motel owner that knows prostitution is going on on their premises and fails to do anything about it especially after having been told."

    Yes, a hotel with 100,000,000 rooms. Brilliant analogy.

    This is a perfect opportunity for law enforcement to USE CRAIGSLIST TO BUST THESE PEOPLE. Don't shut it down -- use it to your advantage! These 'criminals' will just go elsewhere and shutting down Craigslist is as effective as shutting down Pacific Blvd. after 9PM... In other words: ineffectual

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by Comen ( 321331 )

      Yes! cause that is what we need is to lock more non violent criminals in jail in the US!
      I could go on, but what is the point.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Phroggy ( 441 )

        If they shouldn't be going to jail, then the law should be changed to make their actions legal. If that's how you feel, lobby Congress. In the mean time, the law should be enforced.

        • Why not a fine instead of jail... prostitutes will call it a cost of doing business and the public will profit from the ones who get caught. Use the money exclusively for a) health costs related to STDs and b) prison expenses

          The only reason not to make it a fine is that by doing so society is profiting from something some people may consider immoral.

          I'm actually of the opinion that prostitution is illegal not for moral reasons but to maintain the status quo. With legal sex trade there would be a lot lot mor

          • If you're okay with fining people for something and then letting them carry on with it, why not make it legal and call the fine a tax? Introducing taxes via the criminal justice system is an incredibly dangerous precedent to set. Take a look at the former East Germany for the outcome of doing so there...

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by misexistentialist ( 1537887 )
      It's much more efficient making crime impossible than trying to catch law-breakers (see, for example, gun prohibition). Prostitution is similarly prohibited not because it is criminal in itself, but because it is associated with kidnapping and drug-trafficking and in this case murder. Craigslist is really being accused of not protecting prostitutes from getting themselves murdered. Sure, limiting one website has a limited effect, but it's a step to restricting communication on all websites. If government go

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Machtyn ( 759119 )
      Tinfoil hat time... Who do you think might be putting a little cash in the pockets of politicians to entice them to shut Craigslist down?

      *cough*eBay*cough*

      Tinfoil hat is now off (laugh it's funny).

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by Trahloc ( 842734 )
        Why would they want to destroy something they partially own? [craigslist.org]

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Machtyn ( 759119 )
          they partially own it so they can force a hostile takeover and kill it. It hurts their eBay business. Granted, eBay hurts their business more than anything.

          I wish their was an equally popular alternative to eBay. Craigslist sort of answers the call, but is generally only effective locally.

    • This is a perfect opportunity for law enforcement to USE CRAIGSLIST TO BUST THESE PEOPLE. Don't shut it down -- use it to your advantage! These 'criminals' will just go elsewhere and shutting down Craigslist is as effective as shutting down Pacific Blvd. after 9PM... In other words: ineffectual

      I continue to be convinced that Law Enforcement realises how useful Craigs List could be for busting prostitution. That's why they want it shut down. If craigslist exists, they'll be called out if they ignore it. I

  • What gets me on this is that there's obvious prostitution ads in my local newspaper. And there's even publications that consist of nothing but "escort services" that are sold in vending machines across the country just like newspapers.

  • [in] an interview McMaster gave to Fox News on Monday, in which he likened the site 'to a hotel or motel owner that knows prostitution is going on on their premises and fails to do anything about it especially after having been told.'

    And here I thought Craigslist was just a website! I'll have to find out where my local Craigslist flea market is, and what its hours are.

  • With all the battles that need to be fought to make our world a better place, battling against Craigslist seems pretty far down on the list of priorities. I know it'd be a nice, high-profile feather in a prosecutor's cap and all but, seriously, it would be nice if tax payer's dollars were spent on worthy causes first before people try to pad their resume.

  • Sauce for the goose... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by hyades1 ( 1149581 ) <hyades1@hotmail.com> on Sunday May 24, 2009 @01:52PM (#28076095)

    South Carolina Attorney General Henry McMaster says Craigslist deserves to be prosecuted because the site is like "...a hotel or motel owner that knows prostitution is going on on their premises and fails to do anything about it, especially after having been told."

    Perhaps Mr. McMaster himself should be prosecuted. Prostitutes openly flaunt their wares on the streets of every major city in his state, yet McMaster has failed to limit their activities in any meaningful way. If he put half the time and effort into cleaning up South Carolina's sin-soaked streets as he has attempting to prosecute a glorified Want Ads site, perhaps that situation could be improved.

    Of course, that might involve busting a few familiar faces (cough Spitzer cough).

  • "Craigslist's lawsuit cites an interview McMaster gave to Fox News on Monday, in which he likened the site 'to a hotel or motel owner that knows prostitution is going on on their premises and fails to do anything about it especially after having been told."

    Or like the local vice cop/Drug Task Force detective/cointelpro operative for the local gentry who lets the whores ply their trade at the motel in exchange for setting up, for politically and/or economically convenient drug busts, the clueless johns, or e

  • the title as:
    "Craigslist Shielded from Prostitution in SC"?

  • whaaaa??? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by superwiz ( 655733 ) on Sunday May 24, 2009 @09:03PM (#28079133) Journal
    How exactly is it even relevant if they are similar to hotel that knows that prostitution goes in it? Can a hotel be expected to refuse services to clients who are known prostitutes? Can it be illegal for a hotel to act otherwise? Doesn't it boil down to refusing service to a person because of previous criminal acts? Can the law really require a private business to refuse service to past criminals because they are likely (but not guaranteed) to use the business' services to repeat the criminal activity? When did we all become employees of the police? The last I checked their job is stopping crime -- not arresting anyone else who didn't stop crime.

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