Bletchley Park WWII Staff Finally Recognized 122
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Soulskill
from the what's-a-few-decades-among-friends dept.
from the what's-a-few-decades-among-friends dept.
99luftballon writes "Nearly 70 years after Station X (aka the Bletchley Park cryptanalysis unit) was set up, the surviving members are to be honored by the British government. Bletchley was one of the most important computing centers of its time and housed giants of the technology industry (as it was) like Tommy Flowers, who built Colossus, and Dr. Alan Turing. I was lucky enough to meet one of the staff at the site 11 years ago, and she was very bitter that their work was never recognized, and that they were bound by the Official Secrets Act and couldn't talk about it. It's just a shame that so few of the staff are still alive to receive the award."
Only for the living? (Score:5, Insightful)
Their value system is out of whack (Score:3, Insightful)
What the British government did, by covering up and hiding the work these people did, is an affront to the very concept of a free society.
But what's wrong with the people involved that they can't do it for anything more than love of their country? Barring that, why aren't they satisfied with the money they received for it?
Let's Start With an Apology (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Their value system is out of whack (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm sure they enjoyed what they did, but if you have given most of your life to a cause, then you'll want some form of recognition for it. These people received no such public recognition, while many people in similar fields have, so it is understandable that they are upset by the lack of recognition.
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As for the British Government hiding this work, they likely believed that by revealing it at the time they were endangering the staff of the facillity, as well as the country as a whole.
it's the price you pay (Score:1, Insightful)
I guess I can understand being bitter about not being recognized for your work but like, it's a clandestine operation. What do you expect? You knew the job was dangerous (thankless) when you took it ... Fred.
Re:Their value system is out of whack (Score:1, Insightful)
That kind of attitude reminds me of the graduation ceremonies for kindergarteners, elementary school students, and middle school students. Recognizing the daily work of people as something extraordinary when in fact it is not only ordinary but required and demanded. Praising someone for doing the bare minimum is not only an insult to that person but to all people to whom you would ever reward.
These people did their duty and saved the lives of many of their countrymen. But their work was not done at great peril to themselves. It was not under a hail of cannon fire and bullets that they worked at Bletchley Park. Their work is appreciated, but it cannot be more appreciated than the lives of soldiers who gave much much more in the defense of their countrymen.
Re:Their value system is out of whack (Score:5, Insightful)
This was not ordinary work. It was extraordinary work, with some of the most brilliant minds of the time and with amazing mathematical and scientific developments worth of Nobel Prizes.
A lack of recognition might have also helped so many of them work quietly in the "BBC World Service" for decades after the war.
Re:Let's Start With an Apology (Score:3, Insightful)
The two things are separate.
First, he worked for the government as a code breaker. While he has not received official recognition until now, it must be remembered that this was a top-secret operation and there was always the possibility that the operation would never be recognized.
Second, he was gay. Like other gays in Britain at that time, he was persecuted and prosecuted.
Now if you want to say that he should be recognized above and beyond his workmates at Bletchley because he was also gay, that simply doesn't make any sense.
If you want to say he should be apologized to more than any other persecuted gay person because he was somehow more useful to the government than the others, that also doesn't make any sense.
Putting these two things together is a non-sequitor.
Re:Their value system is out of whack (Score:5, Insightful)
I must disagree with the notion that the work at Bletchley Park was not done at peril to those involved. No, the codebreakers didn't die in the mud taking back pieces of Europe, but what they did was so important that when they went to work, they too went to battle. Secrecy was their armor. If Nazi Germany had truly known what was going on at Bletchley Park, they would have sent every plane in the Luftwaffe to turn it into a crater. Honoring those that served there does not diminish the honors bestowed on those who died on battlefields.
Re:Unprofessional (Score:1, Insightful)
How about recognizing the Navy personnel in Hawaii who worked on the Japanese codes? My late father in law, pre war IBM, was commissioned and sent over there as one of the supervisors to the group using IBM tabulating machines. He never broke cover in all the years I knew him. Even when I figured out what he and other of his IBM colleagues had done, he simply changed the subject. And, that was over 22 years after the fact. Classified is classified and there is no shelf date.
Re:Let's Start With an Apology (Score:3, Insightful)
Surely he does. He deserves two apologies. Unfortunately, one of them, namely the persecution for homosexuality is simply not possible. To apologize to him specifically for that, while not doing the same for all the others is tantamount to singling him out because he was also a codebreaker.
Apologizing for failing to recognize his code-breaking work is possible. There are a sufficiently small number of them (all with identities known to the Crown (i.e. in the records)) that apologizing to all of them is viable. However, people tend to be somewhat adverse to apologizing to the dead (with the exception of those known personally). So this also seems unlikely.
He is in good company though. Darn near everybody is owed apologies that will never come.
Re:Let's Start With an Apology (Score:2, Insightful)
Why just him? Shouldn't all gays persecuted under those laws get an apology?
The singling of Turing out for special treatment is not my idea, it's apparently yours.
Re:Let's Start With an Apology (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Let's Start With an Apology (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Their value system is out of whack (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Let's Start With an Apology (Score:5, Insightful)
It does, though. I don't think anyone would suggest that the UK government apologize to Turing and Turing alone, but singling him out as a symbol of the terrible things done to homosexuals at the time isn't unfair. His torture and eventual suicide have become symbolic for what hideously repressive things were done to homosexuals back then, at least to the small percentage of people who know and care of such things.
Remember, society is all about symbolism and people care about symbolic gestures very much. Alan Turing wouldn't be the first person to be made into a symbol of repression. Rosa Parks wasn't the first black woman told to move to the front of the bus, but it wasn't unfair to single her out and give her a state funeral. Nelson Mandela wasn't the only black leader imprisoned in South Africa, but he was the symbol of apartheid and elected to be president in 1994. Muhammad Ali wasn't the only draft dodger to be stripped of his livelihood and publicly ridiculed, but his was the case that went to the US Supreme Court.
Re:Their value system is out of whack (Score:1, Insightful)
Still, better than trying to wipe out the native peoples. Never mind, eh?
Besides, the only difference between the poms and yourselves is that you were stupid enough to get caught.
Again, never mind.
Documenting their experiences (Score:3, Insightful)
For those who still survive it would be cool if they could document their time and Bletchley park, and then put under seal until such time the government accepts those experiences to go public. For me, if this is not done we lose an important part of our history and insight into what happened then. I would hope that after 60 years the government would be willing to allow this information to go public.
Everyone who participates in defending our freedoms deserves recognition, but the sad thing is that when it is not an armed force we are often unaware who did their part. Even if some of these figures seem do be doing very little, the resulting actions can be very important.
Re:Their value system is out of whack (Score:3, Insightful)
That's absolutely true. But it was possible for the people of Bletchley Park to be recognized for their achievements without giving up the technical details of what they did--especially when you consider that, by the 1970s, it was already common knowledge everywhere else in the world but Great Britain.
I frequently get pissed off by the shenanigans of my own government (U.S.) but when it comes to unnecessary secrecy and invasion of privacy, the British government has about the worst record in the (nominally) free world.