NASA Data Reveals China's Industrial Air Pollution 133
eldavojohn writes "China's skyrocketing industrialism comes at a price to the environment, according to Canadian scientists who used NASA data to publish a report on worldwide air pollution (PDF) in the journal Environmental Health Perspectives. The biggest problem appears to be a bright red mass in Northeastern China around the Yangtze River Delta — a rapidly developing piece of China's explosive economy. There doesn't seem to be a lot of acknowledgment from the state media, but blogs are picking it up as one of the few sources of data on air pollution for the area. The sad fact is that particulate matter in the air less than 2.5 micrometers in diameter is not classified as pollution by the Chinese government, so they have no official measurements to provide. If you're in Shanghai and looking for a breath of fresh air, you've got quite the journey ahead of you."
Well duh....but.... (Score:5, Insightful)
The only thing that these guys listen to is the dollars rolling in or not rolling in. Choose what products you buy to support the types of governments that you want in power. It is the most powerful thing you can do.
Sup with north Africa/Middle east? (Score:3, Insightful)
How come most of the northern part of Africa and Middle East are as red as China? As far as I know those countries aren't that rich or industrialized to have more pollution than most of EUA and Europe... Could it be they're counting sand as air particle pollution agents?
This is no real surprise (Score:4, Insightful)
While many people talk about China taking a long view of things, this is not at all true of China today. In general the nation operates in a very short sighted manner. Do what is best today, never mind tomorrow. This includes things like pollution, but also more simple things like business dealings.
On a large scale this is just a result of the kind of government they have. Like most authoritarian, command and control types of governments they are good at focusing on something and making it happen, but not good at watching many issues at the same time. They are also good at ignoring problems if they don't wish them to be problems. That is what's going on here. The government is very focused on economic growth, because they want a strong China and that is what keeps them in power. So long as the economy is rapidly growing, people will overlook much else. They also don't want pollution to be a problem so it isn't, to them. They just ignore it as though it'll go away.
Of course in the long term, this is going to have to change. A system like that is sustainable for only so long. Problems have to be dealt with. It'll be interesting to see what China does, if they start to acknowledge the problems in their current setup and work to correct them, or just ignore everything until a big implosion happens.
Re:Race to the Bottom (Score:3, Insightful)
the presence of heavy particulate pollution is highly correlated with desert areas
Somewhat, yes, but the North and South American deserts don't seem to have the same issue. Unfortunately data for Western and Southern Australia isn't provided, so we can't use that for comparison.
Re:Well duh....but.... (Score:3, Insightful)
If you really want to know how bad pollution can get in this case, just check the former communist countries. They were the same, massive polluters with no protection for the environment or the workers, or even the towns that existed near these sites. Check cement factories, gold mines, just the name a few. They don't see the effects now, not global warming or anything else other than minor discomfort and a change in colour, but in a few years when that crap starts to build up in the soil, in underground water, and in the peoples bodies, the true effects will show. It's nothing new, others have done it before in the name of progress and well-being of the People. Let them keep it up, they'll give genetic disorders and infantile malformations a whole new meaning.
Re:Well duh....but.... (Score:3, Insightful)
Why do you think so many industries fled the US to China? In China they avoid things like the EPA and OSHA that cost businesses so much money in the US. They can dump toxic wastes in the rice paddy out back and as long as they are making money it's all good. Cheap labor is only a part of the draw.
Re:Race to the Bottom (Score:5, Insightful)
Another interpretation is that China is a bastion of freedom for free enterprise. Isn't this what people want, for Big Government to stay out of the way and not hamper job creation, and not force people to do stuff like using catalytic converters and CFL lightbulbs? When people use those words, we must be cognizant of what they are advocating (if unwittingly).
Re:Shanghai's Air Quality (Score:4, Insightful)
I think that might be the point the poster is making.
Re:Well duh....but.... (Score:3, Insightful)
Its actually a lot worse than that. The Chinese have the rest of the world "by the balls" as it were. We depend upon Chinese goods to fuel our Walmart economy. No company in the US can produce products at the price the Chinese can, and this even factors in the transit cost. They do this by having a low standard of living and unsafe, usurious work conditions which is quite ironic considering the whole point of Communism is to uplift the worker. They apply the same philosophy to their acquirement of natural resources such as the rare metals you mentioned in passing (because the Chinese basically refused to sell Japan rare metals until they gave over the ship Captain). Rare metals are essential for electronics which is what the Japanese depend on for their exports. The Chinese can provide rare metals cheaper because they let their environment suffer through the creation of acid lakes, gutted out topography unsuitable for wildlife, and increased emissions; not to mention the crappy work conditions of their citizens. Paired with their low cost production of resources, they also manipulate financial markets such as the way they "peg" their currency to the US dollar and refuse to let the market treat their currency like any other. Overall, the Chinese want to get all the benefits of a capitalist market, but refuse to accept the consequences and actively throw threats around to get their way like a little spoiled child. They maneuvered themselves into a position where they can just make demands and we have to accept it otherwise our own people will suffer. Shame on our government for being so short-sighted.
What do we do about the Chinese? Do we tariff their goods? Do we refuse to trade with them? Since we are currently coming out of a recession, if we do either of the things I mentioned we only hurt the American consumer. It will only drive prices up when there is not as much money to spend for the average person. This is exactly why I say the Chinese have us by the balls. I am not sure how to fix it.
Re:Race to the Bottom (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Race to the Bottom (Score:4, Insightful)
There's freedom to do whatever you want without consequences, and there's freedom to do whatever you want so long as you don't step on the freedom of another. There are a lot of us who fall into the later camp and I feel as though comments like this only end up antagonizing myself and people who share my beliefs. I think we both care about the environment so why can't we work together in this regard, even if we may share widely differing opinions in others?
Re:Race to the Bottom (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Beijing is in a permanent fog (Score:3, Insightful)
maybe the problem isnt as bad as the original poster says, but your defense is damning on its own. Bragging that the blue sky has been visible most of the last 28 days also says that there are days that you cant see the sky, and that the previous summer the sky has been blocked for most days. I dont think you should be so violent in your defense of splitting hairs.
I live in a city known for traffic and the pollution it creates, and I see blue skies on every day that it doesnt rain all day long.