Free E-Books, With a Catch — Advertising 194
Velcroman1 writes "Barnes & Noble may kick off a fresh price war today for digital book readers, with its new Nook news. But the real news in digital publishing is a novel approach to the e-books themselves: Free books — with advertising. The basic idea is to offer publishers another way to reach readers and to give readers the chance to try more books — books that perhaps they wouldn't normally peruse if they had to pay more for them. Initially, Wowio specialized in offering digital versions of comic books and graphic novels, usually formatted as Adobe PDFs. So it was a natural step for the company to offer graphic ads that are inserted in e-books. 'We think we're creating a broader audience for some of these titles,' Wowio's CEO Brian Altounian told me. 'I think folks are going to download more books because they're saving the costs' of having to drive to the store or pay more for them. Would ads stop you from reading?" The new color Nook goes for $249, and comes with a browser, games, Quickoffice, streaming music via Pandora, and an SDK; reader itwbennett links to an analysis of how well it stacks up as a tablet.
oh boy (Score:4, Funny)
"It was a dark and stormy night.....in beautiful downtown Vegas!"
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It is a far, far better thing that I do, than I have ever done; it is a far, far better McDonald's... I'm loving it!
Comment removed (Score:5, Funny)
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Ye are funny but the summary said graphics ads, probably similar to the ads on Hulu right now.
I would happily take a book with ads, especially if it's free. Since my money supply is finite, any opportunity I have not to spend that money is a good one. And it's not as if you have to pay attention to the ad..... oftentimes when hulu plays ads, I do something else during that minute.
Did the editors even READ the article? (Score:2)
Re:Did the editors even READ the article? (Score:4, Funny)
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"obviously I'm a fucking retard as well"
Why "as well"? Timoth was right, you were wrong and presumptious. It was just you.
"Maybe I should apply for a job as a slashdot editor"
Based on the editor getting something right and you getting it wrong?
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And obviously I'm a fucking retard [...]
Because it's Slashdot you are probably just a retard.
Ewwww, imagine "can't skip" technology? (Score:2)
Re:Ewwww, imagine "can't skip" technology? (Score:4, Informative)
I suppose now is a good time as any to mention Project Gutenber [gutenberg.org].
Re:Ewwww, imagine "can't skip" technology? (Score:5, Insightful)
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Okay, that really confuses me. If a British novel is copyrighted in the United States, but publicly available in Australia, what are the legal boundaries? Is it legal to download it in the United States, as long as the uploader is in Australia? If not, then is it legal to purchase a copy of 1984 in Australia (where the copyright holder does not receive any royalties) and then transport it to the United States? ("I read it on the flight, Mr. Customs Agent!")
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Well I'm guessing that since it's about copyright as long as you create no copies within the united states you're good.
but then that's applying logic which laywers don't like doing.
So my guess is that if you ask a major copyright holder they'll tell you that anything up to and including mentioning that the work is out of copyright elsewhere is illegal and they'll happily push to try to get you punished.
Re:Ewwww, imagine "can't skip" technology? (Score:4, Informative)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2010/oct/26/libraries-ebook-restrictions [guardian.co.uk]
Only works on some devices, like the Sony readers.
To me, this is the killer app and I'd buy an eReader that allowed easy borrowing (i.e. time-expired downloads ) of current fiction in a heartbeat...
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"Lending" digital works really completes the circle of absurdity. It's like a metaphor taken way, way too far.
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This is possible in many places in the US. I can "borrow" ebooks from multiple libraries in the area, some of them expiring on a certain date, not sure if there's any other scheme. This works with my nook, as well as the Sony readers, and others like those Borders sells. I don't believe they work with the Kindle, but the Kindle 3 might change that from what I read.
I don't know how it works in the UK, of course.
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Project Gutenberg, alas, only has public domain works afaik. However, there are other sources of free, legal, copyrighted books online. Cory Doctorow explains in Content [craphound.com] why he posts all his books online:
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I read your site. If this is, in fact, you, it sounds like a real shitty thing, assuming that you are telling the unvarnished truth.
However, it has nothing to do with artists' rights in a general or policy sense. This is just plain old theft and fraud. It could happen in a world with "more" copyright, "less" copyright, or maybe even with no copyright protection at all.
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Longer copyright terms wouldn't have helped you, by the sound of it you brought a knife to a gunfight and got screwed over.
Did you even have your own lawyer?
you didn't mention.
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There haven't been any increases in recent years
1998 iinm. Copyright expands every time Steamboat Willy's copyright is due to expire. US Copyright was originally only for 14 years. Fifty years ago it was twenty iinm, it could be extended but there was more paperwork involved. Copyright has never contracted in its almost 300 year history.
public opinion has been strongly for taking away creator's rights
You have some scientific poll numbers? Har, I thought not. Most people don't give copyright a second thought
20 != The Answer (Score:2)
I have only half-jokingly suggested reducing copyright terms to 42 years. Yes they ought to go down, maybe further eventually, but 42 seems like a good first step.
I wouldn't make it retroactive (ex post facto), but at least stop the extensions.
Re:20 != The Answer (Score:5, Insightful)
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42 is still far too long. People should be able to freely create derivative works while the material is still at least kind-of fresh. It'd be nice if artists who were inspired by works in their childhood were able to directly use or re-imagine those works no later than their 30s, rather than in their 50s or later.
I think the original 14 is plenty, personally. 14 years is a pretty damn long time when you think about it.
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What a coincidence. 14 years is how long the original US Copyright Act endorsed. If they author was still alive, he could "renew" the copyright for another 14 years for 28 total, but records show most authors didn't bother.
In any case, the copyright should never last longer than the original laborer. His children should not be profiting when they did not do any work. That's why Jefferson had originally proposed 19 years - it was the average lifespan from creation of the book to the author's death (in
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FWIW, personally I abhor ads and would seek to locate an ad-free copy of a given book before purchasing an ad-embedded copy.
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Apparently this model is working for music so hopefully with books it won't be too much worse.
On the other hand:
"I've discovered the identity of the murderer. His name is....." "...and now a word from our sponsor."
Sounds a lot like watching TV these days.
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Damn... I can't imagine that. It's just like watching TV and having to sit through an ad. Something I don't do ever since I longer have a TV. Being forced to watch ads is becoming more of an alien concept to me. On the web I never read popups, popunders or sit through those ads they want you to see before reading. Once again they are reinventing the wheel, and remind me why I have abandoned TV.
The simpler and sources forums are usually the best, and I begrudge a device which I pay (or paid) for being hijac
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I was thinking it would be better to have a page, or pages, at the beginning and/or end. My fear was the thimble effect like sites that have a small square in the middle with the content your wanting surrounded by blinking flashing and rolling ads. I guess interruptive ads every so many pages would be the eventual goal of advertisers wouldn't it. Oh well, even if the books and device were free l'd say no thanks.
Great. (Score:5, Interesting)
Brilliant!
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So, is the idea to turn novels, anthologies and reference works into magazines? Brilliant!
Wait until scientific papers will be the same. I can already see:
Errr... hang on...
Re:Great. (Score:5, Insightful)
heh, i'd preffer it to the current model where the only people who can access scientific literature are those in academia (who have access to most journals though bulk agreements with thier university) or those prepared to pay substantial subscriptions or per-paper fees.
In my experiance you don't really know if a paper will be useful/interesting until you have read a fair chunk of it. If you were paying by the paper you could easilly run up a bill of hundreds of pounds in a few hours of checking through papers to see which were relavent. That is a lot of money if you are just reading for interest or other noncommercial purposes.
So the general public is effectively excluded from reading the primary sources of our knowlage.
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Oh, my kingdom for mod points. You have mentioned one of my pet peeves, and indeed, I have spent thousands of dollars on irrelevant papers from some of these sites. Alas, there is no option.
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Well, it would depend on what kind of books (and readers) you're talking about, right?
Your average reader of Clive Cussler and Twilight probably wouldn't care - and may even enjoy it. For them, reading is probably like watching TV or something. On the other hand, folks who read something a little substantial would probably care. A lot.
I can almost see someone advertising Glenn Beck and Palin to a Chomsky or Satre reader.
Re:Great. (Score:4, Insightful)
On the other hand, folks who read something a little substantial would probably care. A lot.
Thereby providing a rationale for further monetization: well, if you don't want ads you need to pay for the privilege, because, you know, you're costing us money by not directing your gray matter to absorb our advertising. This on top of whatever you paid for this "book" in the first place. Greed knows no bounds, and book publishers are among the most vampiric operations in our society.
It always amazes me how the business mind works. Like the phone company charging you for the service of not listing your phone number. Eventually, it becomes income to which they feel entitled.
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It always amazes me when people are looking for ethical or exotic behavioral explanation behind buisness decisions. The buisness mind works just fine. The phone company charges you for the services of _not_ listing your phone number because they essentially sell the access to your phone number by publishing phone
Re:Great. (Score:5, Insightful)
It always amazes me when people are looking for ethical or exotic behavioral explanation behind buisness decisions.
It saddens me that so many people think that by enshrining a human activity as 'business' automatically excuses unethical behavior. Business is a human activity, and no human activity should be exempt from human virtue. If morality is optional, then it is largely meaningless, and I might as well shoot you and take your money.
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Sure. Ask your Mom.
Re:Great. (Score:5, Interesting)
Oh, so you've read the fine print in the Obamacare packages?
Actually, ads in ebooks is a natural progression, it's just returning to how literature used to be published. A lot of literary works have been published or serialized and published in magazines supported by ads.
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The only purpose for TV programmes, newspapers, magazines, news web sites, radio programmes etc. is to sell ads and make money.
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Otherwise, why would Wowio (stoopid *** name as well) be in process of being granted a "very broad patent" (link in summary above) for such?
You must be new here.
DO NOT WANT! (Score:3)
Gah. Looks like I'll be switching to kindle or sony when I get tired of my current reader. Hopefully I'm wrong about the jump to the backlit bandwagon, but it sure looks like they're trying to be an iPad, only less useful.
Advertising.. sure, why not. no-money books will be good for everyone. But why does the choice have to be between way-overpriced in terms of money, and overpriced in terms of time - advertisements. Why not just price the books at what they're really worth, and make it up in volume. Especially as the marginal cost of an eBook is almost entirely licensing. If eBooks couldn't be shared or copied, but were all between $1 to $3...
Re:DO NOT WANT! (Score:5, Interesting)
Also, the stuff I wrote about e-ink vs. LCD - I know that many would find no difference between the two technologies, in other words, some people can read just fine on an LCD. I'm not one of them. For me, e-ink is far more pleasant to look at. Moreover, I started to go out for reading to breath a bit of fresh air and just be outside - sitting on the terrace of a cafe, in a park, on the beach beneath a shade... and that's where e-ink readers really shine and LCDs, including the iPAD, sucks balls. Indoors, in dim light/no light LCDs have an advantage, but I still find it better to use my Sony Reader with a lamp than reading on a screen with backlight.
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No kidding (Score:3)
The whole thing that makes eReaders so brilliant is the reflective screen. I'm fine with backlit screens, but for laptops and desktops. For reader things, a reflective screen is the way to go not only for battery life but for all purpose readability as well. The Kindle really does look "like paper" they aren't kidding. That is what makes it nice.
it was.. (Score:2)
only a matter of time. now if they could just get the hardware costs down a bit.
i really like regular books over staring at a screen, but even i might be tempted to try an e-reader if the price was right.
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Nope, you will drag me away from my collection of dead trees when I am a cold dead corpse.
Speaking of which, I am down to only a few books in my buffer, time to buy some more :)
meh (Score:2, Interesting)
What am I gunna do with it, read "Go dog, go" and "wheres waldo"?
For $250, there better be a happy ending, and I dont mean a kids happy ending, I mean a massage parlor happy ending
Dont spend your money on crap, the Dollar is still worth something!
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Let me be the first to quote John Gruber (Score:2)
The Nook Color is slow painfully slow it makes me embarrassed for Barnes and Noble. Horrendous scrolling and zooming and touch responsiveness. Just horrendous.
Good Grief (Score:5, Insightful)
Are we not all surrounded with enough ads yet? About the only place they're not yet is tattooed on the inside of our eyelids.
To the advertisers: STFU already!
Re:Good Grief (Score:4, Insightful)
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Same here. It's not advertising itself I object to, it's the excess of it. I also appreciate if they actually entertain. Of course, I have also seen attempts to entertain that fall so flat they become annoying.
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I just want the advertisers to cut out the middle men and pay me to see their ads. I will happily wallpaper my hovel with their billboard ads if I get paid for it. Stickers on the shaving mirror, whatever. Who knows, if I save up the advertising money, one day I might buy one of their products.
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Or they could try producing things people would actually pay for and foster an economy where people have enough money to do so...
Pengun patent? (Score:2)
Wowio? (Score:3, Informative)
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Yup, the same in fact that limited their sales to US/Canada and screwed the few they did pay out of a large chunk of their reader base.
Yes (Score:2)
Actually this sounds alright to me. (Score:2)
I don't know.. I hate advertising too, but think about it.. all the books I could read, legally free, and all I have to do is skip a few pages every now and then? This doesn't sound like a bad deal at all. Just like reading magazines, in fact, which everyone's already pretty accustomed to. If this means more books for everyone, bring it on!
Speaking of magazines, it only makes sense that mags would eventually start encroaching on the ebook platform. Heck, the fact that I currently can't read magazines on
Real Books (Score:2)
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How about free books? (Score:4, Interesting)
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Great series, I found them by referrals from friends. You know, switching off the computer, getting outside and, uh, talking to people :)
We regularly catch up and swap books around so that we all have something new and a little different to read.
Sometimes the best answers to these sorts of problems, isn't to make another computer solution.
No. Just no. (Score:2, Insightful)
I read books to escape the monotony of real life. I do NOT want to be forcibly reminded of the outside world while trying to lose myself in a novel. So, in short, NO THANKS. I'd rather pay for my books.
AdBlock (Score:2)
Awesome! Can somebody link me to AdBlock for Nook?
Tablet maybe... terrible book reader though (Score:2)
If you look at the spec's, it claims "up to" an 8 hour battery life with airplane mode, which is drastically shorter than current eInk based technology (I routinely get 25-30 hours of reading out of a nook easily with airplane mode on).
It is also backlit, which contributes to insomnia for those who read late at night or in bed (see La Times [latimes.com]).
I'd love to see a color, eInk based technology, but if I wanted a tablet instead of a ebook reader, I'd buy one. They both have their places, but LCD screens are not
Already trying to happen (Score:2)
Android (Score:3, Insightful)
Why block the Android market? If I could install Android apps, then it would be a cheap tablet and I'd gladly buy it. Without Android market, it is a one-off gadget and overpriced. Why intentionally limit a feature that would otherwise be a selling point?
Reviving an old concept (Score:5, Interesting)
You young whippersnappers wouldn't remember this, but back in the Olden Days most deadtree books contained advertising. Paperbacks typically had a glossy insert in the middle (most often a cigarette ad), and hardbacks had several pages of ads in the back, usually something at least vaguely relevant to the book's content, and also sometimes ads for other books (and not only from that book's publisher).
It occurs to me that if ads were placed at the end of the ebook (much as ads in hardbacks used to be at the back of the book) there's incentive to improve content, to get the average reader to finish the book and see the ads.
Inventing some new concepts (Score:2, Informative)
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All to the good. Thanks for the references. Goes to show there's more than one way to do ebooks.
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Meanwhile there are some new really interesting concepts in the ebook world, like free online reading
We used to call that a library; B&N and Borders extended it by putting Starbucks coffee companies and chairs in the store where you can read anything for free off the shelves.
coupled with new approaches to low-overhead publishing.
Don Lancaster, back in the Apple ][ days, extolled the virtues of desktop publishing on an on demand basis; complete with laser printer and thermal or ring binding.
So there actually is some really interesting stuff going on in the free books field.
There is, but ebooks expanded the market for older ideas and eased distribution. As with much technology, it has enabled a broader application of an old idea.
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I have seen a few related ads in books, but I was thinking more generally: the "free with loads of ads" concept is not new or unique. :)
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The problem I see is that advertisers naturally want to prevent people from filtering out the ads automatically, and the only realistic way to do that is to lock down the hardware so that people can't easily run their own OS and preferred software. And that approach is generally bad for open source.
If publishers expect to distribute free ebooks with ads embedded in them, they
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Actually you could strip the ads out of deadtree books, all it took was 5 seconds with a scissor or razor blade, and halfway-fair aim. (When you see an old book with a bunch of the last few pages missing, that's probably what happened.)
But the real point was that other than noticing they were there, you weren't forced to view them. Nothing prevented you from turning the page and totally ignoring them, or never going that far in the first place. (Tho the insert in paperbacks was a bit obnoxious because it ma
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Uhm, how come? Browsing through my book shelves, I can't think of ANY book with advertising other than excerpts/cover photos of other books at the end. Neither for books from the 19th century which I have just a couple, not those from 21th. Cigarette inserts? Where? Is the situation on the left side of the pond that much worse than here?
This is cheesy to put ads in what you read. (Score:2)
Direct Sponsorship (Score:3, Interesting)
It seems most folks here are pretty disgusted at the idea of advertising in books, but how would you feel about direct corporate sponsorships conducted in a tasteful manner? Let's say your favorite sci-fi author's books were all released as Intel Presents or AMD Presents, similar to the old anthology shows from the '50s & '60s such as The Alcoa Hour, Kraft Television Theater, and the Westinghouse Desilu Playhouse; would that inspire the same level of disgust?
I'm very interested in finding a way to distribute fiction for free without DRM, thus maximizing the value to readers, while at the same time raising some profit for the writer. Advertising seems to be the optimal way to get it done. The other leading contender would be the Ransom Model, but that has some inherent weaknesses that are rather difficult to work around. If you have other ideas, I'm absolutely all ears.
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At least it will be free... (Score:2)
Unlike "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo". That "novel" (since it was really just one long advertisement) was full of product placements, including an advertisement for a Swedish word processing package - complete with URL and price.
At least this way, when I'm blasted with advertisements, I won't have paid for the experience.
but not in our dreams. (Score:2)
Leela: Didn't you have ads in the 20th century?
Fry: Well sure, but not in our dreams. Only on TV and radio. And in magazines. And movies. And at ball games and on buses and milk cartons and t-shirts and written on the sky. But not in dreams. No siree!
I want AdBlock (Score:2)
I haven't even seen the first one, and I already want AdBlock. Heck, I want AdBlock for my whole life.
Sure, the ads aren't intrusive...yet. If ads are not intrusive, the advertisers are not getting their money's worth, and they will demand that the ads become intrusive. Look at other media. Commercials DVDs now have unskippable ads at the start - horrible. Ads in web pages also started out pretty harmless. Now, without AdBlock, many sites are practically unusable.
I wonder... (Score:2)
I wonder if this version of the nook will delete all of your non Barnes & Noble [consumerist.com] books too?
You can keep your e-books (Score:2)
But by all means, please do use your e-book readers for your textbooks, newspapers, magazines, PDF files, and all other otherwise printed matter than before too long ends up in the re
Only a matter of time before ads will be removed (Score:2)
Maybe ads might not be so bad (Score:3, Insightful)
If the ads added value to the book.
Imagine a science fiction book with ads for science fiction magazine or a book about learning about
computers that came with ads for newegg. Technology doesnt have to suck just because it can.
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Can we escape from the pervasive ads? Sure, people can choose to do whatever they well damn please, but I just don't want this to become the dominant mode of just about every business.
Don't we have enough weaseling in our life as it is?
Pay your book and be free of ads!!
(but not free to lend it to others. No, the book is licensed to you, you don't actually own it, you only pay for us not pestering you with ads... for now).
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I wouldn't mind buying a limited book-reading license. But I'm not so keen on paying the same price as an actual book. Also, it should be advertised as such. "License to read with unlimited re-download access. Expires three months." or "tied to device, one download only" or whatever.
But those things are less valuable to most readers than a perpetual, transferrable license would be. The price should therefore be correspondingly lower.
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Re:Just what we need (Score:4, Interesting)
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They delivered two to my house just last week. We moved in in August, and the previous owners had phone service shut off back in January, so nobody has paid for the phone service to this address in almost a year. Still get the book.