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Groupon Deal Costs Photographer a Year's Free Work 209

Posted by timothy
from the just-sign-this-dotted-line dept.
Andy Smith writes "One professional photographer in Somerset, UK, thought he was drumming up lots of extra business with a special deal on the Groupon group-buying site. Sadly he has ended up committing himself to nearly a year of unpaid work, plus he has to give out over 3,300 free prints." This analysis seems to be based only on the author's observations (rather than the photographer's experience), but the numbers are interesting. It can't work against everyone, though, or I bet there'd be fewer repeat advertisers on the daily-coupon sites.
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Groupon Deal Costs Photographer a Year's Free Work

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  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 08, 2011 @09:44AM (#36063002)

    TFA doesn't take into account the chance to up sell his products once in the house. These people could be paying £30 to let a salesman into his house to try and fleece them for all he can. It woulnd't be the first time I've heard of this.

    • by digitig (1056110)
      I wondered about that. The usual technique there is to only offer one modestly-sized print, and to then sell premium prints. In this case the deal includes 11 prints, but there's still a chance to try to sell premium products such as the 30" x 12" framed family montage I have over my mantlepiece, which cost £300 (about $500). That was at the studio, wasn't a hard-sell and eight years down the line we are still glad we made the purchase. Given that this photographer is going into the homes, the chance
    • Seriously, if the photographer does a better than mediocre job at best, he'll still manage to sell 100 quid worth of additional product once he returns to show off what's he's done. What's best is, he doesn't even need to have his own studio to do this and by using a proper photo printer (dye submersion for example), he can even do the prints at a good profit to himself.

      This guy lists that he managed to get into 301 houses... let's say that's over a year. Even if he only averages 100 quid a house, he'd mana
  • by Colin Smith (2679) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @09:46AM (#36063036)

    We have offered deals through Groupon and generally a lot of them are given as gifts, and promptly forgotten/binned by their recipients.

    This is in fact Groupon's business model. You pay for nothing, they keep the money. The business offering the deal only gets paid when they have provided the service.
     

    • by mjwx (966435)

      We have offered deals through Groupon and generally a lot of them are given as gifts, and promptly forgotten/binned by their recipients.

      This is in fact Groupon's business model. You pay for nothing, they keep the money. The business offering the deal only gets paid when they have provided the service.

      So, in effect Groupon is a scam?

  • Groupon is a good idea, but you have to make a profit for each sale including the coupon. If you don't do that then you shouldn't be doing the promotion. Lost leaders help no one.
    • Was your "Lost leader" a PHB and does he have a particularly bad sense of direction?
    • you have to make a profit for each sale including the coupon.

      That's rather difficult, considering that Groupon expects you to slash your price by at least 50%, and then they typically take 50% of the remainder as their commission.

      So unless you can turn a profit while charging <=25% of your normal rates/prices, it's best to think of Groupon as an advertising expense—not a business method.

      • Re:Making a profit (Score:4, Informative)

        by NFN_NLN (633283) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @10:58AM (#36063760)

        you have to make a profit for each sale including the coupon.

        That's rather difficult, considering that Groupon expects you to slash your price by at least 50%, and then they typically take 50% of the remainder as their commission.

        So unless you can turn a profit while charging <=25% of your normal rates/prices, it's best to think of Groupon as an advertising expense—not a business method.

        That's why Groupon, at least in my city, has been steadily going down hill. It use to have offers from worthwhile companies. Now it's limited to high margin service sector companies. Groupon is slowly killing itself. I don't even bother checking anymore, and here's why:

        - Laser hair removal
        - Pet grooming
        - Body waxing x3
        - Hair electrolysis (hair removal using electricity instead of lasers)
        - Sun tanning
        - 50% off wine magazines
        - Lipolaser fat removal
        - Window and Eavestrough cleaning

        So Groupon is really targeted at fat, hairy, pasty white people with dirty windows.

        • by radish (98371)

          So Groupon is really targeted at fat, hairy, pasty white people with dirty windows.

          And yet I'm still not interested :) Has always seemed like too much hassle.

        • That pretty much sums up why Its been useless to me. I have seen a few restaurant coupons there. But they're places I have no desire to eat at anyway.

          I've been getting them for more than 6 months, and never used it.

      • You're missing a lot of factors here.

        One, about half of groupons don't get redeemed. So you're really only losing 50%, not 75%.

        Two, you're only losing 50% on whatever the coupon gets the customer. The key is, you don't want the customer to only buy what the groupon gets them.

        For example, if you are a restaurant and you sell $40 groupons for $20, you want to make sure your customers are spending $60 or more to eat at your restaurant.

        If you are, say, an amusement park, selling a $35 admission for $10 is st

    • by petes_PoV (912422)
      ISTM Groupon are being greedy, taking a 50% skim off the top (i.e. without sharing the credit card commission). So if you were to make a profit on a groupon deal. you'd have to be charging over 100% of your costs to do so. With the recession / crisis (different countries, different words - same squeeze on the wallet), there can't be many businesses that haven't pared their margins and can't therefore afford to take As for follow on business? I doubt many bargain hunters would come back. if they're too tigh
    • by GayBliss (544986)

      Groupon is a good idea, but you have to make a profit for each sale including the coupon. If you don't do that then you shouldn't be doing the promotion. Lost leaders help no one.

      You apparently don't own a retail business. Advertising is very expensive and sometimes it's necessary to run a business at a loss in order to get people to notice your business and give it a try. It does help, and can lead to a very profitable business in the long run. Loss leaders can pay off big if done right.

  • by ffflala (793437) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @09:47AM (#36063044)
    This just seems like basic business sense: don't enter into unprofitable agreements. The photographer put a limit on the number of these offers. It seems like a reasonable guess that he was better able to do the arithmetic than the article author, who is purely speculating that this came out to a net loss.
    • by meta-monkey (321000) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @01:59PM (#36065146) Journal

      No, the author is dead on. Your "reasonable guess" that the photographer was able to do arithmetic is based on the false assumption that the photographer is not an idiot. The thing is, the vast majority of "professional photographers" are idiots, who have no education or experience in either photography or business. I've been a full-time professional photographer for 10 years, and the bulk of the competition is just mind-bogglingly dumb. A photographer in my local market offered a similar groupon and I did the same calculations as the author of this article. The girl wound up selling enough to work for 5 months, 40 hours a week for an $1800 GROSS profit. So that's before paying for equipment, insurance, phones, computers, etc.

      The other problem with groupons for luxury services like photography is the kind of clientele they attract. If you're going to offer portrait photography, it has to be done with a high level of quality and service, and therefore a high price tag. You simply cannot compete on price doing button-pusher work because then you're competing with the loss leaders at the Sears portrait studio. So, you have to make something artistic and unique that someone is willing to pay a premium price for or else you're not going to make any money. Groupon customers, however, are by nature deal-seekers. They're people who shop based on price, and are therefore unlikely to come back and pay premium prices for luxury services like portrait photography.

      Groupon is just a bad idea for photographers all the way around. You lose a lot of time and money and only really gain exposure to people who make for poor clients.

      • Yeah, I'd imagine that insurance is pretty expensive in a high-risk industry like photography. And the computer is only a monthly cost if you're renting it from Aarons; but if you were doing that, they'd already be taking the pictures for you. ;)

        • Lol, think I will contact groupon.

          Knock off 20% of my normal service call price, discount refrigerant by 75% and make money.

          Keeping in mind R-22 costs around 180USD for 30 pounds and every company in town sells it for at least 50 bucks if not 65 bucks a pound.

          Not to mention parts are usually marked up by massive amounts. One local company was selling a simple fan relay that cots $1.23 or so off sale and less than $1.00 when on sale, for $119.00, not to mention the $85 bucks an hour labor charge, a $45 d

        • Well for me, equipment insurance is about $1000/year, liability insurance is about $350/year, and then there's auto insurance on the company vehicle.

          It was just an example of one of the many minor expenses that come with running any small business. People gloss over it, but it's death by a thousand cuts. The #1 mistake anyone makes with any business is confusing gross and net. And people, owners and customers, do it ALL THE TIME. Of course from a different point of view. Prospective business owners

  • 42% would not repeat (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Hermanas (1665329) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @09:49AM (#36063072)
    According to this survey [screenwerk.com], 42% of Groupon SMBs would not repeat. That's quite a lot, and it's from this and cases like this story that I suspect that the Groupon-like business model will not last too long, once the fad has died.
    • by smitty777 (1612557) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @10:02AM (#36063218) Journal

      According to this survey [screenwerk.com], 42% of Groupon SMBs would not repeat. That's quite a lot, and it's from this and cases like this story that I suspect that the Groupon-like business model will not last too long, once the fad has died.

      I'd give you mod points if I had any. The article mentions one of the benefits is "getting good exposure". But it works both ways. If you have to rush to get all 300 done and do a bad job, you've just delivered a product for a lower profit margin and provided yourself with bad publicity - worst of all worlds.

      • by RoFLKOPTr (1294290) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @10:29AM (#36063500)

        According to this survey [screenwerk.com], 42% of Groupon SMBs would not repeat. That's quite a lot, and it's from this and cases like this story that I suspect that the Groupon-like business model will not last too long, once the fad has died.

        I'd give you mod points if I had any. The article mentions one of the benefits is "getting good exposure". But it works both ways. If you have to rush to get all 300 done and do a bad job, you've just delivered a product for a lower profit margin and provided yourself with bad publicity - worst of all worlds.

        I don't understand why anybody would offer such a labor-intensive service via Groupon. Groupon is great for coupons at restaurants and stores and getting exposure for your little hole-in-the-wall store that has cool things but nobody seems to have heard of. It also seems to be great for dentists given the number of ads I get by email every week for dental services. But photography? First of all, that's not really something that's usually based upon a set price. That's something that should be a negotiated price on a per-contract basis. A Groupon would be just fine for, say, $25 for $100 Off Services From Hasselhoff Photography, but $29 for a $200-value remote photoshoot in the location of your choice? That's just ridiculous.

        He made a really stupid decision and now he has to eat it. That's all part of running a business. It's not Groupon's fault. But I also don't see anywhere that the photographer himself is complaining... The article doesn't mention any statement by the photographer or have any links to his website. This just seems to be some retarded commentary from the sidelines by somebody who thinks he knows what he's talking about when he says "look what happened to this guy because of Groupon omfg". This whole thing is leaking stupid out of every pore.

        • But photography? First of all, that's not really something that's usually based upon a set price. That's something that should be a negotiated price on a per-contract basis.

          You've got it quite backwards. Photography is virtually always based on a set price for a package or per item on a menu of choices.
           
          It's not a high margin business, and every hour spent negotiating is an hour spent accumulating costs and not making money.

        • by baegucb (18706)

          Looks like http://www.capturedlightimages.co.uk/ [capturedli...ages.co.uk] is his site.

      • by rolfwind (528248)

        Plus mass, untargeted exposure isn't everything. Marketshare at the cost of margins has been tried and failed in the past often enough. People protest when you raise prices because they are used to the old deal and most services/products are commodities anyway, to be had elsewhere.

    • I just don't think it'll get very large.

      This kind of business model has existed in only slightly different forms for quite a while. In the 70s, there were large coupon books that were heavily advertised and contained one coupon from each of many businesses.

      They gave huge discounts, but you only got one coupon for the company per book. The book was sold for a fee that wasn't so small that you could afford to buy the book and throw away all the coupons but the one you wanted. But if you used many of the coupo

      • by vegiVamp (518171)

        > I don't see why companies are falling over each other to get into this business space.

        Because, just like with patents, it's "on a computer".

    • by MoonBuggy (611105)

      If the Groupon model fails, I wouldn't be surprised if it's down to their own greed. Their running costs are basically a few servers and little else, yet they're taking a full 50% of every sale - combine that with a 50%+ discount on the sticker price, and the seller is only taking home a quarter of their normal sale price. Even with relatively low redemption rates it's hard to turn a profit on that, so a listing on Groupon becomes a one-off advertising expense.

      If Groupon took 15%, on the other hand, there w

      • by vegiVamp (518171)

        You are assuming that groupon failing is a problem for the owners.

        As you say, running costs aren't particularly high, and given how they've spread, long since recouped. As long as it keeps going, they're making a killing at the current rates. If it starts to decline, sell in time to some schmart corporation or keep going until profit becomes too small, then close shop and start a new sca- err, venture.

    • There's a good chance that a lot of those 42% won't repeat because they only needed to drum up initial publicity once. Having done it, they don't need to do it again.

    • There are 27 million small businesses in the US. If groupon can make $14 * 300 = $4200 per business the potential market is $113 billion. (And that ignores selling to the 58% that said they'd do it again).

      That's a lot of money to go through.

  • by xMrFishx (1956084) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @09:49AM (#36063078)
    I can't tell who's fail it is. Was it Groupon for not allowing a finite amount of offers to be sold (or notifying the photographer to set a finite amount), or was it the photographer for not gauging his limits as to how many at-cost shoots he can feasibly, and thus setting his "sales limit" too high. TFA shows he sold 301, but was that His limit, or Theirs? I figure it was set by the photographer, and therefore he screwed up by pre-agreeing to do more than he was able.
    • I can't tell who's fail it is.

      TFA doesn't provide any evidence of a failure - read TFA carefully - its someone who has seen the ad on Groupon presenting their own calculations as to its viability (which may be exaggerated e.g. - £5 each for photo frames in quantities of 300+? Has the guy never heard of China? Even retail, one-off at IKEA [ikea.com] you can get them for under £3.)

      As several other posters point out, he doesn't include the value of unredeemed coupons.

      Nor does he take into account how much extra money the photographer co

      • by xMrFishx (1956084)
        My OH uses Groupon for bagging offers, but I'm more the sceptic who looks at these and says "too good to be true". Much like you say, sold extras.

        I see what you mean now about the article being a poor estimate at best. When I wrote that I misinterpreted it as a report via the photographer who was claiming he was at a loss and thus someone else drummed up an article around it. I now see what the article is, thanks.
    • Or it's nobody's fail and the photographer up-sold 300 new clients on $200 worth of prints.

      We're in a similar industry and part of our pricing model assumes that we're not working 50% of the time or more. I know photographers who price their services for even higher rates of underutilization.

      Since about half of groupons go unused he only has to do 150. If they do have 50% down time then that's one a day that would have been unpaid time anyway. If they could on average make $50 on additional prints late

  • Am I supposed to feel sorry for, or even relate to, the guy who didn't sit down for 30 minutes at the most, assuming he's not a business person, and do a break even analysis?

    Here, this is a layman's break even in this case: minimum # sales = (desired total revenue)/(groupon take home amount) -(total cost of a package)

    Simplistic. You need not know fixed cost or contribution margin definitions, just how much the typical shoot costs you and how much Groupon is going to fork over to you. While this isn't techni

  • Funny (Score:4, Insightful)

    by madcat2c (1292296) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @09:56AM (#36063154)
    It does't say a professional photographer does it? It just says photoshoot. They could be keeping the interns busy. But a decent chunk of these things never go claimed, and I am sure there are things that they can upsell the groupon buyers on.
    • But the cost of the prints is still higher than the take from each sale. It doesn't matter whether the business owner is doing the work or unpaid interns are, the hard costs are higher than the receipt. You can't exactly lose money on every sale but make it up in volume ;)
    • by coofercat (719737)

      These sorts of photoshoots are frequently given away for free. Basically, the photshoot is £50, and each print is some huge amount of money. They "give away" the shoot for free, then get you to buy a few prints.

      Why this doesn't have a "nothingtoseehere" tag, I don't know.

  • So an idiot offered a deal where he lost money. It's not like Groupon set up the deal, decided on the services offered or set the price and number of packages. That was all the photographer's choice, it's not Groupon's job to decide any of that or do an analysis of the deal. Their job is to sell the coupons.

    Stores didn't tell Gillette to charge for the razor, they just sold the blades. It's not the store's job to determine if the manufacturer makes money. Groupon is no different.

  • by Anonymous Coward

    I've seen nearly-identical "deals" for photography packages on Groupon before. To be a successful commercial photographer, you need 1) equipment 2) a measure of skill and talent and 3) enough business smarts to make enough money for your time.

    The move to digital has significantly lowered requirement #1, equipment. Until an photographer starts building a portfolio and eliciting feedback from others (preferably experienced photographers), they won't have a clue as to requirement #2, their skill level. That la

    • by Ziwcam (766621)
      No sig when you post as AC...
    • by westlake (615356)

      The move to digital has significantly lowered requirement #1,

      Has it really?

      I would like to see how much the pro budgets for cameras, optics, lighting, computer hardware, software, peripherals, services and supplies of every sort.

      • by muridae (966931)
        The cost difference is the dark room equipment. Camera bodies cost about the same, a little cheaper if you consider them the same as 35mm film and never plan to enlarge a shot much above 8x10. Optics, lighting, all of that equipment is pretty much the same price as it's always been, now you just have built in wireless flash controls instead of lugging around some wires.

        Now, a dark room, you are going to have film developing and print developing. For film, you might go cheap with a couple of canisters and s
      • by Lumpy (12016)

        It depends. the stupid pro that has to have "the best" of everything? far too much, at least $40,000 in hardware for a single portrait shoot.
        the smart Pro photographer?

        Instead of a Canon 1DS you use a Canon T2i. Saved $1500.00 there.
        Instead of L series glass you use decen non L series prime lenses. Save from $1500 - $30,000 depending on lens.
        Instead of high end pro backdrops, buy the china crap for $250.00.. Saved $2500.00 there, just buy new backdrops every 1-2 years.
        Instead of high end Lighting, ag

    • by Bieeanda (961632)
      I've seen stories similar to this one, several times over the last year-- mostly wedding photo contests thrown into disarray by contestants with contacts in large web communities.

      I know that wedding photos can be extremely expensive-- there's equipment, labour, expertise, and covering for dry spells between commissions.

      Speaking as someone who's done commercial photography, how much repeat or word-of-mouth business would you say that photographers see, on average? Situations like this always make me wonder h

    • Disclosure: I've done some work as a commercial photographer, mostly because I enjoy the occasional change from the usual 9-5 IT work. Feel free to hit up the link in my sig.

      Dear Anonymous Coward.
      You forgot to turn on your sig in your user preferences.

  • The way to look at Groupon, or any other kind of coupon/discount deal, is as a form of promotion/advertising.

    If you take out a magazine or billboard ad, you're paying up-front for something that may or may not generate new business.

    If you set up a Groupon promo, the only cost is to provide your service or product at next-to-no-profit. This is a very small price to pay and you're only paying it for actual clients. If a client winds up not using it within the allowed time frame, you end up pocketing your ha

  • Did he consider that many people may never actually use the coupon?
    (just like people impulse buy games on Steam @ 90%off, but never play them)

  • It happens often enough.. A company offers groupons then goes out of business. Customers complain to groupon and get refunds, no questions asked. I think everyone, including Groupon, is really fine with it and no one ends up going to court or doing slave labor.
    • by makomk (752139)

      It happens often enough.. A company offers groupons then goes out of business. Customers complain to groupon and get refunds, no questions asked.

      Except the person who quite likely put a lot of money into going into business, and possibly even went into personal debt, only to be driven out of business at a huge personal financial loss by unwise use of Groupon.

  • by Andy Smith (55346) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @10:26AM (#36063466) Homepage

    I'm afraid my humble blog has again yielded to the footfall of a thousand stampeding slashdotters. One of these days I really should move to a dedicated server, but for now here is the text of the article...

    Beware of the Groupon piranhas eating you alive!

    This is a cautionary tale for anyone who may think of offering a deal through Groupon, the group-buying site that promises great deals for customers and great exposure for businesses.

    The idea is that, as a business, you offer a special deal on the Groupon web site. For example a restaurant may offer a meal-for-two worth £200 for the bargain price of £80. Groupon takes a 50% cut so the restaurant gets £40 which should be enough to cover the actual cost of the food, plus they've had some good exposure and, hopefully, the few hundred people who bought the deal will go back another day and pay full price. Maybe they'll even become regular customers.

    But look at what happened to one independent photographer in Somerset:

    He offered a £200 portrait package for £29, which was bought by 301 people.

    Let's break that down...

    Firstly the photographer will only get £14.50 because Groupon takes half. And if the client pays by credit card, which they probably will, then the photographer has to pay the credit card fee, so he's only getting around £12.

    Each shoot lasts one hour, but it can be anywhere the client chooses within 15 miles of Bristol city centre. So let's suppose the total time for travel is half an hour each way, plus 20 minutes to set-up lighting and background and 10 minutes to tear it all down at the end. Already he's up to 2.5 hours so he's charging £4.80 per hour, not taking fuel costs in to account.

    "Every photo taken will be put on CD or DVD in high resolution" -- this is fairly trivial, let's say 15 minutes work and £1 for the disc and case. He's now getting the equivalent of £4 per hour.

    But the deal gets better! "20 of the images will be professionally edited and air brushed" -- now I assume this is nothing more than a bit of spot removal and some minor tweaks, because there's no way you can do a full retouching job as part of a £29 package, and there's certainly no way you can do 20 of them. So we'll estimate a super-speedy 5 minutes per picture and imagine that he somehow gets the whole lot done in 2 hours. He's now on £2.32 per hour.

    Anything else included? Yes! You get "one 12x10 framed print, two 10x8 prints, two 8x6 prints, two 5x4 prints, two 4x3 prints, and two 3x2 prints" -- a total of 11 prints, with the largest one framed. I'd estimate the absolute rock-bottom price for producing those prints will be £8 plus another £5 for the frame if he's buying in bulk. That's £13. That's more than he's getting from each client, and he's got 301 clients to make his way through.

    Even if this photographer is doing each job to a bare minimum standard, he has committed himself to nearly a year's work for no money. If that doesn't sound like good business sense to you then be very careful if you decide to offer a deal through Groupon or any similar site. What may at first seem like success could very easily put you out of business.

    • I think his website is pretty hopeless, he has adopted a name which is already well used and he has an email link rather than a proper form submission linked to a database. Also, what's with the "Somerset"? There's no address on the website, but he quotes a 15 mile radius of Bristol - which is in Bristol, thank you very much. (I live on the Somerset/Wilts border.)

      I can't help but think that what he really needs is some good business advice, though as he may possibly now end up having to go into hiding from

  • This looks like a loss-leader, and death-by-coupon isn't anything new. In a big city it's pretty easy to spot the restaurants in deep trouble; they start with coupon specials, which turn into permanent coupons. Then they start closing on Mondays and Tuesdays. Similarly, it's easy to spot a professional photographer that can't get steady work. Groupon isn't doing anything that hasn't been done a thousand times before, and there will be no shortage of photographers and restauranteurs with extremely poor busin
  • by Animats (122034) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @11:15AM (#36063932) Homepage

    He underpriced his offer, but it doesn't have to be a disaster. It's a workflow problem. The photographer gets to schedule the shoots, so he has to get them organized into blocks in the same area. Many people won't have a location in mind, and he can get them to go either to his studio or to one of several pre-selected scenic locations. Once set up in a location, customers can be run through in an hour each. Customers who insist on a specific location have to wait longer for a time slot to open up.

    The post-processing work is also a workflow problem. For most shots, a minute or two in Photoshop is enough. Those can be farmed out to an intern, or even some site like GetAFreelancer. The paper printing, DVD making, and framing gets done in bulk, with bids from various companies.

    If half the people who bought the coupon actually use the service, and the photographer is organized about it, it's probably about six weeks of work.

    The photographer can up-sell. Want hair, makeup,or costuming? Available for an extra charge. Some of the business will be wedding-related, and that's an opportunity to sell a whole wedding package.

  • A Similar Story (Score:4, Informative)

    by Big Sean O (317186) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @11:59AM (#36064264)

    "Cupcake Gallary" (a small Chicago bakery) got stung because Groupon essentially gave them an ultimatum. They declined and Groupon cancelled all the previous Groupons.

    http://www.uptownupdate.com/2011/05/groupon-cancellation-cupcake-gallery.html [uptownupdate.com]

    I think Groupon is a great idea, but this type of bullying douchbaggery to their "partners" is making me rethink ever using them.

    • Douchebaggery is a superb word and I will be using it in conversation at some point this week :-)

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Did you actually read all the details and comments on that story? Groupon canceled out because the store wasn't honoring the groupons as sold.

      Groupon wasn't the bad guy there either.
  • How can this be groupon's fault?

    I don't understand. They didn't force the photographer to create that ad. As well, perhaps the photographer has more business sense that the poster, and has figured out a way to do this at a profit.

    Either way. This is an undeserved dig at groupon. It is simply a business arrangement! If you don't like it, you should be able to tell that before using them.

    Of course, the other option is the photographer is an idiot, like a lot of people out to make money quick, and did not

  • Honestly Whoring yourself at gutter prices? the man deserves it. what he promised he was completely insane to offer at that rate.

    Oh and those thinking that he will make money on stock photo sites... No he wont. you can't sell them to a stock photo site without a full model release from the person in the photo, Owning copyright does not mean crap if you dont have a release from the model that says " you can do anything you want with these images, yes even using my image to advertise massive herpes outbr

  • Even if the guy only gets ~12 pounds out of the deal, as the article suggests, he can easily make that up by buying materials in bulk and following the letter of the deal. 12 pounds equates to ~$20 usd.

    1) You can bet the framed photo in the deal is for a cardboard photo frame...a box of 350 of these cardboard frames can be bought for $250, or the equivalent of $0.71 per frame. These are 8x10 (I couldn't find 12x10 frames), so lets add some more to that and make it $1 each for the cardboard frames.

    2) Even

  • The article's author has no idea what this guy's finances are, what sort of company he operates behind his name etc.

    For all we know he has several staff who handle post processing and a deal with a print house for cheap prints.

    The author literally doesn't know what he's talking about because he didn't actually bother contacting James Corrin to find out why he did the deal, what he's getting out of it etc.

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