Senate Passes 4-Year Re-Up of Patriot Act Provisions 422
Bloomberg News reports that, as expected, today "[t]he US Senate approved a four-year extension of provisions in the USA Patriot Act allowing law enforcement to track suspected terrorists with roving wiretaps. ... The measure goes to the House for final passage before being sent to President Barack Obama for his signature. The surveillance powers would be extended until June 1, 2015." The story mentions that the Patriot Act powers this approval includes would extend "to so-called 'lone wolf' suspects who aren't affiliated with any terrorist group."
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
"lone wolf" suspects (Score:5, Insightful)
Lone wolf? (Score:5, Insightful)
approval would extend "to so-called “lone wolf” suspects who aren’t affiliated with any terrorist group."
So, more needle in a haystack stuff, we need to violate everybody's privacy just in case one in the 7billlion people on the planet hate us. Didn't they use to hate us for our freedom? Not a problem anymore....
Right violations on the installment plan (Score:5, Insightful)
it goes beyond mere roving wiretaps (Score:5, Insightful)
And goes into a 4 year extension of Big Brother spying on what books you read or buy, what your emails contain, etc. It allows Big Brother to collect information on you sans any justification whatsoever - you don't even need to have ANY connection to a so-called "terrorist" or "terrorist organization" (like environmental groups, worker's rights groups, anti-corporate groups, etc...you know, horrific "terrorists").
It is not a "yawn". It is yet another shiv into the heart of so-called "liberty" and "freedom".
Land of the free, home of the brave MY ASS. Land of the chattle, home of pansy candyasses is more accurate.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:it goes beyond mere roving wiretaps (Score:5, Insightful)
>home of pansy candyasses is more accurate.
Indeed, we used to be braver than this not that long ago.
All the boomer "rebels" turned into fraidycats.
No protest songs.
No protests.
If Kent State happened today, people would just shrug their shoulders and blame "the terrorists"
--
BMO
Re:it goes beyond mere roving wiretaps (Score:5, Insightful)
If Kent State happened today, people would just shrug their shoulders and blame "the terrorists"
No, they'd demand to know if it was going to have any effect on the price of gasoline.
Democrats, just another side of the same coin... (Score:2, Insightful)
And don't start whining about how it's never going to matter because of them needing more than whatever share. With that attitude, it never will matter. So grow a pair and start filling in some alternative boxes next election.
</rant>
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:5, Insightful)
Maybe people will start to finally learn that the choices they are fed are bullshit and that both A and B are part of the greater subject -- C. If you vote for A, it benefits C. If you vote for B, it benefits C. Instead of idiots arguing "derp derp derp red versus blue" they might finally invest that energy into understanding what is really going on and doing something about it. Then again, probably not.
I'm sure the president has the ability to veto this though. Surely he will? All these people that were so intent on voting this past election for "change" because the new jackass was going to be entirely different from the last jackass are surely going to have saved us from evil, right? So their pony will do everything he can to overthrow the USAPATRIOT Act, right? That must be why we haven't heard him say a single damn word about it. At all. Because he's just holding his tongue, so he can wield the veto power, yeah?
I'm sure everyone will finally stop investing all of their energy in Obama's birth certificate and being raging homophobes and marching around abortion clinics so they can focus on things that are actually impacting our entire way of life, like government oppression and the absolute corruption of government by corporate shills. Right?
Don't Forget. (Score:5, Insightful)
This is the act that allows the president to declare ANYONE an enemy combatant. Even an American Citizen. And disappear them. No representation. No trial. They just vanish, to be indefinitely imprisoned and even tortured. Hell, killed, for all we know. Since nobody knows that the person is being held, there's no limitation. Granted, this has gone wrong pretty much every time it has been used (documented incidents of innocent people being shipped off to gitmo for example) against innocent people a number of times. But hey, it has the word PATRIOT in it!
These assholes despise the citizenship of this country so much that they stuff something called the PATRIOT act with everything that is the opposite of patriotism and that directly undermines the country they claim the act is meant to protect. And we all sit around like fucking sheep, worrying about meaningless bullshit like birth certificates. And worse, all those jackholes who went around doing the "you HAVE to vote!" last year think that they've done their civic duty, because they voted. They chose between the giant douche and the turd sandwich and disavow any responsibility for upholding the status quo that continues to pin us all under its thumb.
Step by Step (Score:5, Insightful)
Step 1: Be attacked by terrorists.
Step 2: Implement draconian laws designed to 'combat terrorism' citing the terrorist attack and getting everyone scared. Temporary measures, of course.
Step 3: After society is good and locked down, pass extension of those laws.
Step 4: President gets elected that promises to remove these. President instead extends these.
Step 5: Another terrorist attack or foiled plot.
Step 6: Obviously this one law isn't working, so pass another.
Step 7: Progress and repeat until you can't take a shit without someone needing to be there to look up your asshole and make sure you aren't about to shit a bomb into the public toilet at the gas station.
Step 8: Children grew up with these laws, and they're just how things are.
Legislative Process (Score:5, Insightful)
Staffer: "How much time do we need to debate the Affordable Care Act?"
Senator: "At least eight months!"
Staffer: "How much time for the federal court appointee?"
Senator: "T is Undefined. We're filibustering him without a vote."
Staffer: "How about to renew the USA PATRIOT act?"
Senator: "Oh, four to six hours."
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:5, Insightful)
If your congressman or senator failed to vote against this violation of the fourth and fifth amendments, he or she has violated their oath of office. Don't vote for them again unless you want this shit to continue.
-jcr
I hope this is a lesson to everyone regarding temporary suspension of powers. There is NO SUCH THING AS TEMPORARY. Once you give them away they are gone until the next revolution and re-establishment of laws.
America's Dead. Get over it. (Score:2, Insightful)
Despite getting off to such a terrible start with the genocide of the "Native Americans" America was the last great hope for humans voluntarily creating a true democracy. The Constitution is an absolutely wonderful work. Future historians will marvel at it's elegance as the founding fathers saw, and attempted to protect against, what would come after them.
Sadly they underestimated the unstoppable inertia of the mass of the "sheeple".
America failed. It's another dead end.
Ho hum... On with the show...
Reboo, restart, on with the show.
Sweet (Score:2, Insightful)
Here's more "Hope and Change" for us.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:3, Insightful)
people like you who think this retarded shit are the reason we have nothing but the shitty futuristic frying pan to look forward to. run a campaign for someone in your home town who shows promise. ffs run yourself. if enough people did it and fucked with the system the system might churn out some results other than this crap. but no, you're an ass. and everyone around you is an ass too. like 290 million asses. and we wonder why things are going to hell.
Re:"lone wolf" suspects (Score:5, Insightful)
Lone wolf is particularly bad. Wolves are horrible hunters when solitary. They're only a significant threat to anything in packs. (The German U-Boat fleet discovered that, too, when they became incapable of forming their own wolfpacks.)
If you want a meme that describes solitary madmen, "lone lolcat" would be more effective. Cats are dangerous on their own. Just ask a cheezburger.
Re:This is just the tip of the iceberg, John. (Score:5, Insightful)
Youd almost think that those retarded Republicans thought the founding principle of the country was a small, limited federal government, or something...
Nothing the Republican Party has done in the past 50 years has illustrated that they actually believe this.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:5, Insightful)
And if people stopped buying shitty appliances, producers would have to produce what the customer wants and the free market system would work.
Guess what? We still have shitty politicians, we still have crappy goods and we still don't get what we really want in either. Why? Because people can't organize, that's why.
So please, keep your ivory tower ideas to yourself unless you also provide an idea how to implement them.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:This is just the tip of the iceberg, John. (Score:3, Insightful)
Our schools are receiving less and less money, reducing our GPA as a whole and decreasing our abilities to field educated people in our society.
The issues in Texas where they have put creationism in books, a fundamentally specific religious ideology towards christianity.
The issue where the Church somehow gets a pass on pedoiphilia without being prosecuted.
Republicans do have that ideology, but constantly increase government, look at both Bushes vs Clinton.
What they do though, is they try to underfund/undermine those parts of the government that actually look after consumers and patrons.
Queue images of Gulf Oil Spill and Katrina.
Re:This is just the tip of the iceberg, John. (Score:2, Insightful)
Im sorry, its almost like youre trying to blame me for what other people have done, or infer what I believe from what others have done.
That aside, Republicans believe in a smaller government than the Democrats, and thats a good first step in my eyes.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:4, Insightful)
Take any speech of McCarty and replace communist with terrorist and every reference to Russia with a reference to some Arab country and you'd be amazed how recyclable it is...
Re:This is just the tip of the iceberg, John. (Score:3, Insightful)
That aside, Republicans believe in a smaller government than the Democrats, and thats a good first step in my eyes.
Except they really kind of... don't. At all. They just disagree in which areas the government should step in and fuck things up (Interfering with our corporate overlords vs. say... marriage.)
Been that way for at least 25 years (probably more but I would have been too young to remember).
Re:"lone wolf" suspects (Score:4, Insightful)
Hey Mr. Ass fuck, read this (Score:3, Insightful)
Why doesn't it start with YOU?
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:1, Insightful)
The rest are guilty of High Treason against the Constitution in my opinion. They should be arrested, tried, and when found convicted publicly executed for the world to see what happens when you attack the Constitution of the United States like this. We kill "terrorists" who do less against us. Terrorists might kill a few of us, knock down some buildings, but they don't DESTROY OUR CONSTITUTION. That has to be done by traitors HERE, not there.
Can't we Grand Jury indite every damn one of them for this when they set foot back home in their perspective states? Not only do we need to recall each one of them, but we need to prosecute each one of them. That oath to protect the Constitution isn't some formality, its vital and sacred. These fuckers need to be taught that and in a lesson hard enough that any fuckers in the future think twice about violating it again.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:5, Insightful)
How cute. Yeah, change starts with me, and if we all thought like this we'd be living in a better world.
Call back when you have a workable solution how to do it.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:5, Insightful)
There is NO SUCH THING AS TEMPORARY.
Wikipedia: The Banking Act of 1933... introduced banking reforms...commonly known as the Glass–Steagall Act... provisions that prohibit a bank holding company from owning other financial companies were repealed on November 12, 1999.
Temporary seems to apply to good laws more than bad.
Re:Right violations on the installment plan (Score:4, Insightful)
A nice way of saying the PATRIOT act will stop being extended when we get rid of every last human being who hates America.
Exactly correct. The PATRIOT act will end when we have eliminated those who hate America: the "representatives" who continue to extend it.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:5, Insightful)
Politicians are salesmen: they're going to give the customer what they want, not what they need.
Politicians take it a step further. They make people think they need what the politician wants. How else could somebody possibly be elected with a campaign entirely based upon Hope and Change? The problem with politics is that in order to make it you must be a slimy bastard. People can fantasize all they want about how they could go in and fix politics but the fact is that you're not going to get past your local city council without back room deals and backstabbing the public.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:5, Insightful)
Ah, the old "run for office yourself" gambit. It makes you look all, like, cool and worldly and stuff, and liberates you from actual thought.
I did work on two state campaigns here in California, for people I initially liked. Learned they were just sociopaths in it for themselves like all the others.
OK, I'll run. Do you have a great big pile of money I can use? Or donors who will give to a nobody like me? Oh, and when I am beaten because some union, Party or corporation backed scumbag pwns me in the culpable media, can you make sure my job is there to go back to?
Oh, wait, I have a rather interesting personal past. Nothing criminal, just interesting and experimental. The media will go after *that* to the exclusion of all else, including actual issues.
Give me or point me to a workable strategy for a real citizen politician, who hasn't exactly lived the life of a monk, to pull it off, and I'll seriously consider it.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:2, Insightful)
More than 50% of the population want to end tax credit to oil companies, raise taxes on people earning more than $1MM/year and businesses and have universal (single payer) health care.
None of these have a hope in hell as long as getting re-elected costs so much money (which favors the incumbent) and the money for that reelection comes from big oil, insurance companies and the companies that benefit from low taxes.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:3, Insightful)
If your state has closed primaries join a group to help get them open and participate in this effort.
Drop your party affiliation if you currently belong to a major party.
Put a candidates sign in your front yard.
Use the interwebs to spread the word in a rational fashion.
Contribute to third party candidates that you find acceptable. Start on the local and state level. Third party candidates who run for federal positions are mostly a lost cause right now. I know people who like to throw a few dollars their way to keep the names in the spotlight but locals and state level candidates have a real chance at winning with some momentum behind them.
And above all else: Actually vote third party! As long as people think that voting for a small party or an independent is a waste of a vote it will be a waste of a vote. The number of people I know who are sick of the majors is incredible but few do anything about it because they take the 'lesser of two evils' cop out over actually standing their ground. How do we expect change with that way of thinking?
These aren't 'ivory tower ideas', these are things you can do today with near minimal effort. Your voice will be heard if you just stop trying to rationalize away the efforts of third party/independent candidates. If nothing else, your vote going to a third party or independent candidate will show whichever major party you'd normally be aligned with that you're ready to take on an alternative seriously. Maybe if there is enough of a threat to the party they'll see that putting a token figure in place is going to cost them and there may be reform from within. The Republicans almost headed in this direction before they lost their way again. Maybe the next batch will be more in line with the Republican party of old if running corporate puppets and wanna-be thugs out there only brings dissatisfaction to their normal supporters.
We can do this but we need to stick together.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:2, Insightful)
Still, it would at least be discussed. With whatever percentage are opposed to the healthcare reform, there was talk of repealing it during the midterms and still is talk about it.
And speaking of percent opposed to healthcare reform, I strongly disagree that there was an -obvious- majority. There was a lot of noise, but it was not obvious to me that most voters were opposed to it. Then again, I was for it and didn't really care how many people were against it, much as I don't care how many people are okay with the patriot act.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:2, Insightful)
Really? What about all of those politicians that don't believe in evolution, believe in young earth creationism, etc.? I'd say largely the politicians are just as dumb as the rest of us with the exception of politically-relevant skills (spinning, P.R., maintaining a public image, etc. - and even then they fuck those up a lot!).
Thanks for posting this (before I did ;) ). (Score:5, Insightful)
Actually, Rand Paul was filibustering this for 7 hours, just asking for a (promised by Reid last time it was extended) full week of discussion!
(I liked this title: http://www.unelected.org/democrat-harry-reid-blocks-rand-pauls-filibuster-of-the-patriot-act [unelected.org] but you are welcome to google your own!).
And then we see people still thinking that there is some major difference between people wearing 'D' or 'R' labels, rather than between honest people and liars, and true "public servants" (as in, *Representatives* of *Us, the People*) and ones who pretend to be, to advance their agenda and get rich in the process...
And, before you start protesting, saying that all he wanted to do is to amend it with some additional "gun rights" language, it was only one of his several proposed amendments (picked by Media for obvious reasons of further polarization of us). I guess it was quite a brilliant move to provoke at least some discomfort of cognitive dissonance in the minds of mainstream NRA-supporting republicans, who *also* see absolutely no harm in PATRIOT act!
Well done, "Aqua Buddha"! ;)
Paul B.
Re:Right violations on the installment plan (Score:3, Insightful)
Because now that Osama is dead, this abomination is now to protect from mysterious random people....
Lets clarify this a bit, shall we?
Yes, it will help protect us from mysterious people - currently unknown people who are in contact with terrorist groups, as well that people plotting attacks. That is the point after all, isn't it?
Although most people on Slashdot seem to oppose spying on anyone, most Americans are OK with spying on people in direct contact with terrorist organizations like Al Qaeda (organizations trying to kill large numbers of people, not Dennis Kucinich/Ron Paul voters ... unless they happen to be eco-terrorists [globalbrief.ca] engaged is actual terrorism).
And maybe you've forgotten, the Patriot Act has been amended in the past to address civil rights concerns [usatoday.com].
As to Osama being dead... let's try a thought experiment.....
If Steve Jobs were to die tomorrow,... would Apple computer vanish? Would the board of directors and senior executives vanish? The tens of thousands of employees and contractors? The factories that make Apple products? The thousands and thousands of stores that sell their products? The tens or hundreds of millions of customers that own or are buying Apple products? Would the products vanish? Would any of it vanish anytime soon if Steve Jobs died tomorrow? The answer is: No. The Apple board of directors would name a new CEO and the company would continue. Apple might ultimately fail and vanish after some years due to lack of vision, or drive, or by losing its iconic chief visionary, but it wouldn't vanish immediately. It is also possible that they would benefit from Jobs exiting the scene... it would take time, probably years, to determine.
So, what about Al Qaeda? Now that Bin Laden is dead,... has it vanished? Has Al Qaeda's world-wide leadership vanished? Have the tens of thousands of varied terrorists and insurgents around the world swearing loyalty to Al Qaeda vanished? Have the caches of weapons and cash vanished? Have the tens or hundreds of thousands of people that they trained vanished? Have the hundreds of thousands or millions of active supporters around the world vanished? Have the tens of millions of Muslims that approve of them vanished? The answer is: No. Al Qaeda has named successors to Bin Laden, and they are carrying on in their various plots and campaigns of destruction, murder, and mayhem. In a sense they may even be more lethal now --- Al Qaeda's leadership has vetoed some planned attacks in the past since they projected that it wouldn't meet the Al Qaeda standard for body counts. The new leadership may take what they can get. Of course, if you have enough incidents killing dozens or hundreds at a time, you can still reach a total body count in the thousands. So, yes, Al Qaeda is still dangerous.
It has been understood by anyone interested that this is a problem that will almost certainly last decades - that was being discussed not long after 9/11. Here is something from 2007: Pace Says War on Terror Will Require Decades of Effort [defense.gov]. What is the alternative? Give in the their demands? Bin Laden's demands [guardian.co.uk] are that the United States convert is Islam, throw away the Constitution, and govern by harsh Sharia law [americanthinker.com]. In case you are wavering about which way to go, here are the top ten reasons this may not be a good thing from the previous link:
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:2, Insightful)
Because it wastes your resources, wears you out and finally you end up like me, someone who has tried what you propose and failed, got jaded and doesn't even bother to look for a solution anymore.
First get a concept that's worth your effort. Something that can actually succeed. Else you're just the comic foil of the next election.
Re:Did your congressman do his duty? (Score:5, Insightful)
Amen, brother. I vote for who I want in office, not 'the best that could win'. I hate it when people say a vote for a third party candidate is a wasted vote. It's that attitude that ensures we are stuck with the status quo.
Re:Thanks for posting this (before I did ;) ). (Score:4, Insightful)
It was an R that was trying to filibustering this.
This isnt to say that all Republican's are like Rand Paul, but there wasnt a single Democrat senator actively trying to stop it so it is quite fair to say that NO Democrat is like Rand Paul.
My hat is off to men and women in Kentucky who voted this man in.