Zimmerman Charged With 2nd-Degree Murder 995
George Zimmerman, the neighborhood watch volunteer who shot Trayvon Martin, was charged with second-degree murder. He faces up to life in prison if convicted in the shooting. From the article: "Special prosecutor Angela Corey announced the charges but would not discuss how she arrived at them or disclose other details of her investigation, saying: 'That's why we try cases in court.'
Second-degree murder is typically brought in cases when there is a fight or other confrontation that results in death and but does [not] involve a premeditated plan to kill.
Corey would not disclose Zimmerman's whereabouts for his safety but said that he will be in court within 24 hours."
Bad Slashdot (Score:4, Insightful)
Not news for nerds.
who cares? (Score:0, Insightful)
Re:News for nerds? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:0, Insightful)
For one, that won't bring back her son. For another, I think she's at least as responsible for Trey's death as Zimmerman was. When you have a son and he starts thinking that gangsta thug culture is GREAT, that all the rap and hip-hop about how awesome it is to be a career criminal is something more than entertainment, that's your cue to ACT LIKE A PARENT and straighten his ass out before he gets either jailed or shot in the streets. Of course, not deciding to start and raise a family in a high-crime area is a nice touch too.
What the hell kind of parent allows this to happen and doesn't teach their kids that being a gangsta thug is not as glorious as MTV makes it look? What kind of parent raises a teenager who attacks strangers? A shitty unworthy parent, that's what kind. I mean seriously. Being a thug ("THUG LIFE YO!") has only one of two possible endings: prison for a very long time, or an early grave.
The only surprise here is that it wasn't another violent teenager who shot him.
"the neighborhood watch volunteer" (Score:2, Insightful)
He was not a neighborhood watch volunteer. He had no affiliation with any organization, no training and this whole tragedy stemmed from his disregard for standard neighborhood watch procedure.
He was an armed vigilante.
Re:Bad Slashdot (Score:5, Insightful)
More like, still not news for nerds.
How many fucking Treyvon/Zimmerman articles do I have to read here?
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:5, Insightful)
Why don't we all calm down, let justice get served legally, and not have any more people wind up dead.
It took time to work out that he could be convicted, this is normal procedure, liek the prosecutor said "we don't prosecute by petition" and that's hwo we want it.
He stayed in touch with authorities and now they are going to prosecute with a 2nd degree murder charge, if convicted he will be in protective custody, which means 23 hours a day in a cell one hour out for the rest of his life.
That's a lot more brutal than you might imagine, and maybe a lot less than his family might want.
Re:Talk about media bias (Score:5, Insightful)
There's 43 murders every day. Do you recall reading 43 stories? No. When things go normal, they are not national stories.
So anyway, since you don't seem to have figured it out, the difference in the two cases is the police response. And that is the racial issue! When the situations are reversed, a black will be charged right away. A white will not always be. (Google Brandon Gotwalt. Almost the same situation, no charge. Now google Daniel Adkins. Big difference.)
The black kids who set the white kid on fire were found right away and charged. Things are working as they should be. There are 100s of hate crimes every year, and only the most egregious situations make national news. What was egregious here was the government not applying the law evenly, and not even charging the guy. It's basically the same thing (not charging) that happened with the Danziger cops in New Orleans during Katrina: Kill a minority, no charge. Plus the cops do it all the time too -- but that's so [sadly] normal it doesn't rise to to the same volume as the Zimmerman case.
Re:News for nerds? (Score:4, Insightful)
Too much politics here creeping on this site.
Preach brother.
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:3, Insightful)
There are a lot of angry people on both sides of the issue that's why, should give you insight into how the media effects issues and how stupid people can be.
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:2, Insightful)
He wasn't doing anything wrong when he was harassed by an unknown creep, and his killer had no knowledge of his parent's child rearing skills.
Meanwhile, it was Zimmerman who was rolling around the neighborhood with a gun looking for trouble. Why don't you rant about his parents (his father was a judge, ffs) and his screwed up attitude?
Re:Talk about media bias (Score:4, Insightful)
Wow. Can't help but feed the troll here. Where to start? Let's see... your link to a story that 'hardly gets a column in the local news' is a link to the NY Daily Post about an event in Kansas City. A simple google search shows various other coverage of the case. And a big difference in that case: the police were *actually looking to arrest the perpetrators* (whether they've caught them or not is not clear).
The Trayvon Davis story blew up because of how it was mishandled between the police and the DA. If they had arrested Zimmerman from the start, even if he ended getting off on a self-defense claim, it wouldn't have been as big. It would be a footnote in the list of reasons why an overbroad "Stand Your Ground" law is a bad idea.
And, even if the attack in KC was mishandled similarly, what's that have to do with the Davis case? Outrage would be warranted in both cases.
But yeah, your recent photos of Trayvon (including one fake one) convince me. He flipped the bird at a web cam! And he's black! Death for the hoodlum! Wait, you know what? I need to see a photo of the suspect in a suit. If you can produce one of those, then I'll really be convinced.
I'll give you this though: you really have provided clear support for that Einstein quote in your sig.
Re:This is out of control (Score:4, Insightful)
Someone put six bullet holes, last night they shot up, a parked police car that was left near the scene of the shooting. The message being that violence against the police is coming if they don't arrest Zimmerman and charge him with murder. They shot up a cop car. As if that neighborhood didn't need a reason for a neighborhood watch now they have guys firing live rounds into police cars? That's a safe neighborhood?
It stopped being a safe neighborhood when armed vigilantes started stalking the streets, harassing people based on their suspicious blackness, and killing them when they legitimately stand their own ground against threatening behavior.
The police didn't want to nip that in the bud, so now they have an even bigger problem. I hope they get off their asses and establish sanity with a minimum of further violence.
Re:Talk about media bias (Score:5, Insightful)
Recent photos of Trayvon: http://i39.tinypic.com/1yvg5h.jpg [tinypic.com]
So what's your point? If somebody looks like this, he somehow deserves to get shot?
Re:This is out of control (Score:4, Insightful)
I still have a twinge (only a twinge) of hope that by putting this in the court's lap we'll get to have actual facts during discovery and a real investigation by detectives, not the media.
But at this point it's been worked into such a frenzy that so many sides have put their hand in the pot that there's almost no soup left. Each group will be approaching both defense and prosecutors with all sorts of conflicting information, promises, leads, and threats. Then you have the political pressure you brought up, where I'm sure there's a DA or ADA who wants to look good for elections and will sweep tidbits under the rug to "prove" Zimmerman guilty. Or whatever lawyer announces to do it pro-bono to get his own high horse and sweep a different set of tidbits under the rug to "prove" him innocent, all until the rug resembles a mattress. Then the hard part will be to find 12 people who can't/won't get out of jury duty and at the same time either have not heard of the case or haven't let the media frenzy tell them what to think.
Still, a twinge.
Zimmerman is an asshole (Score:3, Insightful)
He's an asshole because he ignored the 911 operator's instructions to wait for the cops, and got out of his car with a gun to confront somebody.
(Didn't he think it out? What did he intend to do after he confronted Martin? It had to turn out bad.)
It seems harsh to send somebody to jail for a big part of his life because he's an asshole. I feel sorry for him.
But somebody is dead because he's an asshole. I feel even more sorry for Martin, and Martin's friends and family.
In America we do give people long prison sentences for killing somebody in a street fight.
A lot of black people in Florida go to jail for less.
What else can you do with Zimmerman?
Yes, you do go to jail for being stupid.
Re:This is out of control (Score:1, Insightful)
Zimmerman was well known for calling 911 to report black people as suspicious.
You can (legitimately) hate the media hype, the political opportunism, etc., but the defendant is a creep who killed someone for no good reason.
Re:This is out of control (Score:2, Insightful)
This event is exposing the BEST of this country. Most people are outraged by this event because up until a few hours ago THERE WOULD BE NO TRIAL. Now, the wheels of justice are spinning, in large part due to public attention on this case. The fact that Zimmerman wasn't arrested is where the travesty lies. He's not automatically guilty now that he's been arrested, and he's not automatically innocent because the police declined to arrest him originally. His innocence or guilt is in the hands of the court, which is where it belonged all along.
Re:Bad Slashdot (Score:4, Insightful)
Oh, for crying out loud... this sort of whining has been going on since Slashdot was first started.
Why is it so hard for people to understand that Slashdot is "News for Nerds" AND "Stuff that Matters". Really, it's always been there, and it's hardly a long motto. RTFA has never been a favorite activity of Slashdotters, but it seems we've decended to the point where people can't even be troubled to read the entire name of the site. There was an enormous discussion on Slashdot on the day of the 9/11 attacks and that was hardly "News for Nerds", but it sure as hell fell into the "Matters" category.
If you want to complain, then at least complain about the relative merits of this case being something that "Matters" outside of Florida or not. At least you'll be a little more on track with that.
Re:Take this off of Slashdot please (Score:4, Insightful)
This does not belong on Slashdot. Please take it off.
- Nerd
My impression of you:
Whiny, whiny, whine. Whiny, whine, whine, blubber.
- Whiner
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:3, Insightful)
DId you forgive the man that shot your son? If so you get a pass on your comment.
If my son got shot because he started beating him and slamming his head into the pavement (a potentially lethal move) then there would be nothing to forgive. I would say the other guy acted reasonably. I would then feel ashamed to have raised a son like that and all the waste it represents.
If you are asking me whether I am committed to my principles even in the face of a great deal of emotion, yes I am. It's called being an adult.
This situation is just another young violent black thug-wannabe who finally picked the wrong guy to fuck with. That's all there is. I don't get shot at. You know why? Because I don't go around attacking people. If I think somebody is creepy or whatever I call the police, I don't walk up to the guy and start beating on him.
You guys really cannot see the connection between attacking a stranger and getting shot? Jesus H Fucking Christ people can be so stupid when they badly want a situation to be different. Nobody really wants a 17 year old to get shot and killed. I get that. But to pretend like the way that 17 year old behaved had nothing to do with it? Madness.
Course the media loves that kind of madness and how weak and stupid and blind and emotional everyone is acting. That's why they show photos of Trey when he was 12 years old, not when he was 17 and 6 foot 3 inches tall. That's why they try so badly to make this into a racial issue because immature fucks eat that shit up. Nevermind that Zimmerman tried to mentor black youth (why just the other day I saw the KKK doing that, no wait they'd never do that). The bullshit way all of this is being presented and all of you are being led around by your childish little heartstrings is so fucking pathetic. I am ashamed to be an American.
Re:This is out of control (Score:2, Insightful)
Funny how liberals pick the ethnicity that suits their argument.
Obama is from mixed race parents, but is referred to as black because he looks black.
Zimmerman doesn't look Euro white, but it is convenient to emphasize his white parent when picking sides in this story.
Of course, the whole race issue in mixed race people is a clear indictment of how poorly we communicate about race in general.
Also, I'm a flaming liberal.
Re:Bad Slashdot (Score:5, Insightful)
panem et circenses (Score:4, Insightful)
Bread and circuses. Don't discuss anything important, especially if it's complex. Go after something visceral like this case or Kim Kardishiam's bra / toenail / latest sex change operation.
Oh, we just invaded another country? Look! Over there! A breast!
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:5, Insightful)
It took long enough (Score:5, Insightful)
In Canada, the first thing the courts would do would call for a media black out until the judgement is rendered, and then likely another black out until sentencing. The idea is to prevent bias in the potential jury pool.
Unfortunately, due to incompetence and delays in deciding to file charges and make an arrest, they're going to have one hell of a time finding a "jury of peers" that isn't tainted by public opinion and forced to recuse themselves from participating.
Re:Stand your ground, kill a black guy, get a coup (Score:5, Insightful)
"Meant only to protect white people"? What an inflammatory and completely unsupported thing to say. Like so many other people, when you can't actually find evidence for racism, you just fabricate claims of racism.
In the case you cite, the shooter, a black male, was not arrested and was not charged for an entire year. Eventually, under public pressure, the DA did charge the shooter and he was found guilty by a jury.
I don't see how the cases are analogous either. Zimmerman claims to have been attacked by Martin from behind, while walking back to his car, and that's consistent with physical evidence. McNeil seems to have provoked a confrontation. Even if McNeil should have been found innocent, how does one injustice justify another one? Would racially based injustice against black men mean that we need to dismantle our legal system altogether, just to justify the mob?
no other choice at this point (Score:4, Insightful)
At this point, the only way to settle this is for it to go to trial. The facts need to be laid out in court, experts need to testify, and a jury needs to decide.
I think there's a good chance that a jury will find Zimmerman "not guilty". The DA's original assessment was that there wasn't even enough evidence to win a conviction, and that's consistent with the evidence that has come out since.
Re:This is out of control (Score:5, Insightful)
His innocence or guilt is in the hands of the court, which is where it belonged all along.
Nope, it is where it belongs (in court) if the prosecutor decides to bring charges, and not before that time. It's easy to sit in your armchair and pretend to know facts that can really only come out of a thorough investigation, but there may be a time, if you ever happen to just be in the wrong place at the wrong time, that you are grateful that such things are investigated before arrests and charges are made. False charges have ruined the lives of innocent people before. The system may have flaws, but the fact that crimes (which may not be crimes) are investigated before charges are filed is not one of those flaws.
In this case--unless the prosecutor is simply bowing to pressure from the uninformed masses, which would be disgusting--the prosecutor was not convinced of George Zimmerman's story or believes his actions were not sanctioned by the current laws on the books. In that case, a trial is perfectly reasonable. If Zimmerman is found guilty by a panel of his peers, he will be punished. If not, he will walk. This is the way it should be, but only after a proper police investigation and review of the facts by the prosecutor--not the supposed "facts" you get from your nightly news anchor, but the real facts insofar as they can be determined.
Re:News for nerds? (Score:5, Insightful)
Confusion is the first step on the road to knowledge.
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:3, Insightful)
I have zero faith that any jury would deliberate for more than 15 minutes before declaring Zimmerman guilty.
Seriously? Have you not seen the vitriol spewing forth from both sides of this issue? Do you honestly think that Zimmerman's lawyers will be so completely incompetent that the prosecution will be able to completely stack the jury?
--Jeremy
where is the evidence? (Score:5, Insightful)
The 911 operator told him that he didn't "need to" follow Martin and Zimmerman said "OK" and was going to wait by his car for police. Zimmerman testified that he was returning to his car and it was Martin who confronted him and then punched him. Witnesses saw Zimmerman on the ground, with Martin on top, and Zimmerman's injuries and dirty clothing support that.
I don't know of any actual evidence that support the idea that Zimmerman ignored the 911 operator's suggestion and followed and attacked Martin. Maybe you can share what evidence you think there is?
There is no evidence that Zimmerman confronted Martin.
I don't know whether that's true or not, but if racism causes the justice system to be unreasonably harsh towards black people, then we need to fix that, instead of destroying our justice system for everybody.
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:4, Insightful)
With that fair and balanced recitation of events you won't make it into the jury pool.
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:5, Insightful)
When you have a son and he starts thinking that gangsta thug culture is GREAT, that all the rap and hip-hop about how awesome it is to be a career criminal is something more than entertainment, that's your cue to ACT LIKE A PARENT and straighten his ass out before he gets either jailed or shot in the streets.
You know, "acting like a parent" isn't just some magic thing you do and instantly your kid is wearing polo shirts and khakis and has perfect grammar.
Re:Based on the (actual) 911 transcript (Score:4, Insightful)
And if he was attacked by Martin first, Martin was only exerting his right to Stand His Ground, no?
The first person to (reasonably) feel threatened with death or serious violence was justified in defending himself. The person who created that (reasonable) fear can not claim self defense, any more than a convenience store robber can shoot a clerk who pulls a revolver out of the cash drawer in "self defense".
Z fscked up (Score:5, Insightful)
He went into hiding, probably depressed. Didn't stay in touch with his lawyers.
Then, worst mistake, he called the DA and talked to them without a lawyer present.
He's screwed.
Re:Bad Slashdot (Score:5, Insightful)
How many fucking Treyvon/Zimmerman articles do I have to read here?
None, if you stop clicking on the links. Odd that you are in this story when there are 14 other current stories, and links to 5 most talked about, and 5 "on this day" stories on the front page. You must want to be here.
Besides, what is this, the second one? On a story of national interest?
Or should we be checking your post for a secret clue to where you are being held captive and forced to read Slashdot against your will?
Re:This is out of control (Score:5, Insightful)
Does it make his actions acceptable to you? Ignoring sane neighborhood watch protocols and the 911 operator and confronting someone while packing a gun?
I don't know that Zimmerman did confront Martin. The operator told him he didn't need to follow, and it's unclear what happened after that because of conflicting testimony. Considering how few real facts are known, the only reasonable response is to say that I have no idea whether Zimmerman's actions are acceptable or not. However, following someone is not usually illegal. Having a gun is not illegal. And, in Florida, shooting someone and killing them with a gun is not illegal under certain (very special) conditions which you may or may not agree with, although it is the law.
Now it seems the prosecutor has collected enough facts that she thinks she can convict Zimmerman for breaking the law. A panel of Zimmerman's peers will determine whether or not he really is guilty. If he is guilty, I hope the trial is the least of his discomforts. If he is innocent, the trial will probably not be any worse than how the media and race baiters have already ruined his life, but having to battle false charges certainly wouldn't make things any easier. Whether he is guilty or innocent, let justice prevail.
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:4, Insightful)
LOL what exactly do you think "Neighborhood watch" is?
Let's see first you need a neighborhood. Check. Next you need to roll around and look for trouble. Check. The gun was just a bonus.
Of course if he hadn't had it all we would have heard about some teenager asaulting a neighborhood watch captain, and really wouldn't have put much thought to him spending time in jail.
Re:where is the evidence? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:5, Insightful)
Stand your Ground laws need to be appended a bit. Here's why. Suppose you get in a random fight at a bar. Most bar fights end pretty quickly when the two realize that getting punched sucks, or when they get ejected. However, with Stand your Ground laws the way they are, you have no duty to retreat and can simply pull out your gun and shoot them as soon as they get the upper hand over you, saying that you fear for your life. Similarly, when you pull your gun, they'll pull their gun, saying they fear for their life. So what you have is both combatants standing their ground and the fight won't end until someone (or both of them) is dead.
It also leads to situations where you could go pick a fight with someone and then shoot them before they even get to you because you feared for your life because you thought they had a weapon.
There's going to be a lot of people using Stand your Ground laws as an excuse to escalate a run of the mill fight into a deadly situation that wouldn't otherwise have turned deadly. Some things might be justified, like if someone is car jacking you or trying to force their way into your home, but other things wouldn't..like someone catching you in bed with their wife and ending up dead because you feared for your life and had no duty to retreat from their home.
Re:Bad Slashdot (Score:2, Insightful)
Why is it so hard for people to understand that Slashdot is "News for Nerds" OR "Stuff that Matters".
FTFY.
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:2, Insightful)
The police report states that Zimmerman was treated at the scene by the FD for bleeding from his nose and the back of his head.
Trayvon's mother, and father, may never think poorly of their son's behavior despite any evidence. It is a common failing among parents.
Re:News for nerds? (Score:5, Insightful)
So add my vote to those saying that this _is_ the sort of thing I want to see on Slashdot (within reason, buyer beware, etc.)
Re:News for nerds? (Score:5, Insightful)
I think it's very easy to see that the Slashdot community is very interested in topics like this.
Slashdot is about the only place where nerds convene on a regular basic to discuss politics. The editors simply need to look at the comments to see that the majority of people posting here are very interested in political and, especially, topics regarding society in general.
I don't care if I get modded flamebait, people rarely take this much time to argue against political news on Slashdot these days. People (not me) are simply sick of hearing about the case and don't feel that it warrants the attention it's gotten. So they bitch about the relevence here, and on every other news site.
Personally, I find it very disturbing and absurd that self defense laws can be used to justify deadly force against someone you were chasing at 7pm.
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:5, Insightful)
I suggest you review the way Florida handles other shootings. Specifically, look up the incident involving Trevor Dooley and David James. It has many similarities.
Dooley confronted James. Dooley had a gun, but did not pull it out. James initiated a physical altercation to take the gun away from Dooley. James was shot in the process.
Dooley was 69, with fused discs in his neck. James was 41, six inches taller, seventy pounds heavier, and had been in the Air Force. Dooley claims he feared for his life - a claim I find reasonable, given the disparity between the two (much more reasonable than a 28-year old man armed with a gun fearing for his life at the hands of a teenager armed with skittles and iced tea). Eye witnesses saw James go for Dooley's gun, while acknowledging that Dooley initiated the verbal confrontation.
There are, however, two significant differences. The first is that Trevor Dooley was arrested merely two days after the shooting. The second is that Dooley is black and his victim, James, was white.
So yes...declining to file charges that the lead investigator recommended is unusual. The state attorney driving 50 miles on a Sunday night to discuss the incident is unusual. Taking the shooter's word for it that his record was clean is unusual. Making no attempt to notify the parents of a dead teenager and instead waiting for them to file a missing person's report is unusual.
Needs to be stated again (Score:5, Insightful)
What made this case national news is NOT because a light-skinned guy killed a black guy, or that he was 17 years old, or that he was only holding candy. What made this story news is that the local police dropped the investigation like a hot potato (possibly because of Zimmerman's parents job titles), held onto the body without informing the parents when they had ID and his phone (which family and friends called BTW), then announced that there wouldn't be charges based on spurious coverage under their stand-your-ground law.
All of the false equivalence citations to coverage of other cases where a black guy killed a white guy, how black kids dress, or how Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are "uppity troublemakers" is totally IRRELEVANT!
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:panem et circenses (Score:2, Insightful)
A person was killed, quite probably murdered. A police department refused to follow any sort of procedure to investigate the killing or the killer. The killer's background exhibits at the very least dangerous vigilante tendencies and mental health issues, and quite probably racial motivation for same. A whole segment of society erupted into an apologist frenzy on the killer's behalf, even further focusing on the racial elements of the case.
Those are the facts of the case. Each one of those facts carries a lot of importance, in their own right. And while we're at it, any society that can't muster the maturity required to deal with a case like this—or to distinguish it from pop culture drama—is far from the maturity required to address something like "we just invaded another country".
Re:panem et circenses (Score:2, Insightful)
I guess we've heard from Bizarro world now. Cute how you inverted most things.
Re:where is the evidence? (Score:4, Insightful)
In the dispatcher's tape, Zimmerman said he was following Martin. In Martin's girlfriend's account, Martin was worried and quickly walking away, when the phone went dead and she couldn't call him back. I would call that a confrontation.
In Zimmerman's story, he was returning to the car. when Martin attacked him. We don't know whether that's true or not. It's not consistent with the girlfriend's story, which sounds like Martin was running away when Zimmerman caught up to him. According to the girlfriend, Martin said, "Why are you following me?" Zimmerman said, "What are you doing here?" They each repeated those lines. Then the phone went dead. Martin might have attacked Zimmerman at that point. Zimmerman might have threatened or pushed Martin first. We don't know. (Under Florida law, Martin only had to reasonably believe he was in danger. He didn't have to back down.)
We don't know what all the physical evidence and witness statements are, because the DA hasn't released that information. One of the witnesses said she gave an account to the police, and the police changed her account.
I'd like to see an investigation in which all the witnesses are subpoenaed to testify under oath. I'd like to see them cross-examined by lawyers. We'll never know what happened with certainty, but that's the way to get as close to the truth as possible.
There's a very thin difference in a case like this between justifiable homicide and a barroom-brawl type murder. I don't think Zimmerman's life was in danger when he was getting beaten up. When I was a kid in Brooklyn, it was fairly standard practice in a street fight to pound the other kid's head against the pavement. It happened to me, and I lived. In hindsight, it doesn't look to me like a justified killing. Zimmerman's life wasn't in danger. Nobody wants to get their head bashed against the sidewalk, but you don't kill somebody for that.
It would have been best if Zimmerman hadn't gotten into that situation in the first place. If Zimmerman thought Martin was a dangerous intruder, he should never have gotten out of his car. He never should have tried to follow Martin on foot. After all, Martin might have been legally carrying a gun. Even cops wouldn't approach a potentially dangerous suspect alone. The rules for neighborhood watches tell you not to do that. 911 told him not to do that. That's why, based on the facts that have been made public, Zimmerman is an asshole.
Whether he's guilty of murder, whether he gets convicted of murder, and whether he loses a civil suit, are separate questions.
Re:Zimmerman is an asshole (Score:5, Insightful)
If Zimmerman was following the dispatcher's instructions, then how did he wind up on the sidewalk with Martin?
You left out Martin's girlfriend's account that Zimmerman caught up to him and Martin asked Zimmerman why he was following him.
Why shouldn't Martin have believed that Zimmerman was a threat? If I was coming home at night from the store, and somebody was following me with a car, and then came out to follow me on the ground, I'd be worried. Especially if there were break-ins in the neighborhood.
Zimmerman never should have left the car. There are rules for neighborhood watch groups, and he violated them. Now he's in a lot of trouble. Yeah, the prosecutor is under political pressure. Yeah, the newspapers are having a field day. Welcome to reality. Why shouldn't the White House put political pressure if they think the DA is going to drop the case (as they were going to)? There was a pattern of black people getting killed and cops doing nothing.
The bottom line is that Zimmerman killed a guy who was going about his own law-abiding business. If you kill somebody, you're likely to get into a lot of trouble.
Re:Stand Your Ground (Score:4, Insightful)
barring the brandishing of a weapon
Considering Martin was shot by Zimmerman, this condition may have been met before any altercation started. But we can only speculate.
Overall, I think the entire thing has been badly mishandled by the police, the prosecutors, the media, and the public. It has been blown out of proportion by the media, the public reacted with mob justice in mind as a result, and the police/prosecutors appear to have not done anything resembling due diligence in investigating the death of a teenager (as, whether or not it would have led to an arrest, it seems there was essentially no investigation to begin with).
Re:Good luck with that fair trial thing (Score:4, Insightful)
Yes, it is an established fact. You're being way too literal and are misinterpreting the intent and meaning behind the dispatcher's sentence.
In standard English there is a kind of understatement which is very common and universally understood. For example, I encountered a friendly but unintelligent young woman earlier today and mentioned to a friend that "she's not the smartest person in the world". This did not mean that she had an IQ of 215 which would place her just shy of the smartest person. It meant she was dumb. It was a kind of understatement which is understood by everyone.
Similarly, the statement "we don't need you to do that" is a friendly way of saying "don't do it." For example, if my boss observes someone at work doing something pointless or a waste of time, he might say "we don't need you to do that" because it's more polite than outright commanding them to stop. The meaning would be understood by everyone because that kind of understatement is part of standard conversational English.
Re:where is the evidence? (Score:5, Insightful)
And doubtlessly, carrying a weapon gave Zimmerman a false sense of security.
I don't think his sense of security was false. Of course -- and this is a point I make strongly and repeatedly to my concealed carry students -- if you're carrying a gun you really should try even harder than when you're not to avoid situations where you might feel you have to use it, because by being armed you've raised the stakes, and may have to deal with the legal, financial, emotional and social effects of shooting someone.
But there isn't any falsity about the sense of increased security you have when you're armed. The gun does give you significantly greater ability to protect yourself or others.
lol (Score:4, Insightful)
911 dispatchers are trained to give orders. They are trained to deal with people in various excited emotional states, and their job is to convey instructions as clearly and loudly as is necessary. "Sir, STOP DOING THAT. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? STOP FOLLOWING THE SUSPECT AND WAIT FOR THE ARRIVAL OF THE POLICE".
See how much more effective that is? If you listen to various recordings of 911 calls, you will know that's the language they know how to use and are trained for. This "you don't need to do that" does not convey a directive.
P.S. I'm responding to your comment, not the entire case, by the way.