Why Amazon Wants To Pay Sales Tax 647
Maximum Prophet writes "A while ago, Amazon caved on paying individual states sales taxes. Now we know why. Amazon is setting up same-day delivery warehouses everywhere. They will put most normal retailers out of business." If that's a bet, I'll take it.
Re:Who remembers Kozmo? or Webvan? (Score:5, Interesting)
Amazon bought Kiva Systems last year - a company that specializes in pick and pack robots. If I remember my dot.com history correctly it was the picking and packing aspect of the business that killed on-line grocery WebVan. (Which Amazon was an early investor in. I wonder f Amazon has any of the old WebVan stuff around.)
Cant Wait (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:would i rather (Score:5, Interesting)
You could. Walmart has free shipping. Even to Alaska.
That's completely insane - they are undercutting local businesses by 20 - 40%. Don't know how long they're going to keep this up but watching it is entertaining.
Re:Who remembers Kozmo? or Webvan? (Score:5, Interesting)
Robotic warehouses are not the nirvana that so many claim they are. The problem comes when demand falls off (all demand is cyclical) and your competition lets people go while your left with the same fixed costs. This is happening right now in the industry I work in, where the former leader is plunging out of control from large infrastructure costs, particularly their very sophisticated warehouses, that their competition doesn't have.
The strategy also seems to overlook that thing where, you know, people don't wanna' pay sales tax. Here in California that amounts to an almost 10% savings for those consumers who violate state sales and use tax laws (of course, I don't).
Doesn't make any sense to me (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:would i rather (Score:5, Interesting)
On the topic of local distribution centers, I'm sure that this will not be a full selection of Amazon products available for same day deliver, just a selection of the most popular items, which will still be nice to get faster.
Re:Wal-Mart Competition? (Score:2, Interesting)
yep, they could always force the cart pushers at the local wal-mart to do same day delivery in their 20 year old ford escort hatchbacks.
At least the ones who are not wards of the state and farmed out as slave labor by the local catholic state funded school for boys too retarded to serve their prison sentences. That is real BTW. The "school" is Mississippi.
Re:Cant Wait (Score:5, Interesting)
"I know lots of people do that, but I think it crosses the ethics boundary."
I have no ethical obligation to Walmart.
Walmart are wealthy enough to compete with Amazon in the same way, and could even do better by using their local stores (or areas they own but vacated to upsize their stores) as shipping hubs.
Re:Jobs (Score:5, Interesting)
The sooner capitalism gets destabilized due to increases of productivity resulting in a lack of work to go around for people to earn a living, the quicker we will start investigating and experimenting with how to build a post-scarcity economy. Progress does not apply to technology alone, it works on society as well.
Re:Jobs (Score:5, Interesting)
While the US doesn't do large scale industrial widget manufacturing anymore, we still do lot's of manufacturing for the military, oil/gas industries, medical industry, auto and aerospace industry. Many companies are now pulling out of China as the cost benefit is vanishing as the Yuan has been allowed to float. These companies are creating automated assembly lines and pulling as much labor out as possible to produce goods here that are higher quality and at the same cost (or lower) as manufacturing in China. Additionally, companies are finding they can have much more agile supply chains and can cut lead times tremendously.
My advice to the 300 million people is find something that you like to do and get good at it. Competency is a rare commodity these days. And if you can't find something you love to do, then find a field and specialize in something that can't be outsourced, examples: pipe-fitter, welder, electrician, plumber, amazon warehouse picker robot repairer, physical therapist... and the list goes on.
Let me give you a brief list of the items in my home (purchased in the last 2-years that are Made in USA) * Garage Doors * Garbage Disposal (InSinkerator) * Entry Doors * Lumber to Construct Split Rail Fence * Roofing Shingles * Insulation (for Walls) * Drywall * Craftsman Tools (with lifetime breakage guarantee) * Spatula (for cooking, yes I found one made in USA) * Ford Mercury Mariner * Step2 - Playground Equipment * Open Sprinker Valve Controller * Paint * Various adhesive products * Worktables * Furniture * Mattresses * Toothpaste/Shampoo/Deodorant/BandAids and the list goes on and on. While the USA is not producing electronics (which is really stupid for national security reasons) we still produce lots and lots of stuff.
Re:would i rather (Score:4, Interesting)
Amazon as a system of getting goods makes sense, and if done right would cut down on gas consumption with everyone driving to the store separately. I happen to live in Seattle and have used AmazonFresh (grocery delivery) and have automatic monthly diaper delivery with AmazonMom and it's awesome. I look forward to a future where I don't need to drive anywhere to do my shopping, and can spend that time out hiking and having fun with my kid.
Exactly. A hundred thousand shoppers driving around to multiple stores in rush hour traffic to by the same old stuff, or bar scan that tin can with your cell phone before you throw it in the recycle so that another one will appear magically on your doorstep.
Probably the "Store" still gets to exist, but it serves a different purpose. "Try it" centers. Where you can see new things before you commit to buying it blind. But once you found your favorite brand of canned beans, you probably won't need to revisit that isle again for many months.
Pike Place Market isn't going anywhere, and neither is the Farmer's market. But 95% of the goods that come thru the door could just as well be picked for me, packed for me, and delivered. Employs lots of pickers, lots of packers, and lots of delivery people, but saves me the trip and the aggravation.
Webvan - popular, but not yet efficient. (Score:5, Interesting)
If I remember my dot.com history correctly it was the picking and packing aspect of the business that killed on-line grocery WebVan.
Kiva Systems was founded by a former WebVan exec. He saw that Webvan was very popular with customers, but they couldn't deliver the service at a low enough cost. If they could eliminate the people...
Webvan's real problem was botched expansion. They had 3% market share in 30 cities, when they needed 30% market share in 3 cities. Too much truck mileage per shipment.
Safeway does grocery delivery now, but not very well. They just use order pickers picking from retail store shelves. So their systems don't really know what's in stock. Most orders thus lack some items ordered. A more automated system knows what's in stock, so the customer gets to decide when ordering how to handle out-of-stock conditions. (Ordering a different brand or size or item is an option then. Safeway doesn't do that.)
Delivery uses less energy than shopping. There's some whining about the "thousand mile salad", but moving a 45,000 pound truckload of lettuce a thousand miles uses less energy per head of lettuce than the 5 mile trip in the 2 ton SUV that moves 20 pounds of groceries.
A few more years, and automatic driving will meet up with automated warehouses.
Re:would i rather (Score:4, Interesting)
I'm afraid I don't see how online merchants have killed my choice of products. In my not so limited experience, the exact opposite is true. Most local stores have almost no product selection. This trend of reduced product selection was in place long before Amazon existed or Wal-Mart appeared in my local area. The selection of products in almost every category has skyrocketed with online shopping. I'm sorry for the local merchant who goes out of business as a result, but, as a consumer, I see this massive selection as a very good thing.
Even with the reduced selection, I don't see grocery stores disappearing any time soon. Same day delivery is not the same as the 20 minutes it takes to run to the local store and pick up the items needed for tonight's dinner.
Your experience may vary, but I go into my bank branch at least once a month. I will admit they don't have nearly as many tellers as they once did, but there's seldom a wait of more than a couple minutes -- considerably less than it used to be before ATMs and direct deposit -- they don't charge me to talk to a teller and the service is always top notch.
Re:would i rather (Score:5, Interesting)
after a long while, i've come to agree. small stores that are worth going to for whatever reason (friendliness; reliability; or even just an interesting gimmick) tend to make it, though not always. the reason so few do, is that they really have nothing going for them.
on the other hand, i went to an art and art supply store and after i complained about the price of his poster hooks, he showed me the books; he was paying more, wholesale, than wal*mart was charging retail. that was an amazing insight into economies of scale. he still made it by reputation and selling a diverse array of weird stuff (e.g. tubs of dmso; essential oils; and vintage softcore pornography).
Re:would i rather (Score:5, Interesting)
They also get good tax breaks from local governments who naively think they're going to attract jobs and thus a larger tax base. Or else if the local government doesn't play ball then Walmart builds the store just outside their jurisdiction (counties generally tax less than cities in most places). Walmart stores are always build large, they never start small and then expand if business picks up. They already know business will pick up as soon as the competition goes bankrupt. So they're willing to build the stores at a loss, even offering to pay for all city infrastructure improvements. This is not a free market.
Re:would i rather (Score:4, Interesting)
Small stores that are worth it do survive, the sad problem is: most aren't. Hardware stores as an example. 10 years ago the local hardware store had all sorts of crazy hardware and small tools in stock, and people who could help you find it. Now we have a Lowes, I've grown to despise them, and the local hardware store seems to be doing just fine. Although for me, too many wasted trips with neither having what I need: I plan ahead when possible and order everything online (generally from amazon). Its not about the price, its about the wasted time, and compromising for the item they happen to carry, not the item I want. Will the Lowes and local guy suffer? Maybe, but they're not really competing for whatever reason. Want to compete against Amazon on choice and availability? Do what auto parts stores can do- look up and order just about anything, with most things just a couple hours away via courier. Anyway- I'm not crying for anyone in this game, the internet has brought more of everything, and best of all I don't have to depend on Amazon- they're the top of the heap today, but they falter and someone else can knock them out.
Re:would i rather (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Did you read your own link? (Score:0, Interesting)
Hmm, a social movement with stupid beliefs based on naivete and lack of imagination, and the willingness to use violence and destruction to get their way. This movement was met with what some might interpret as ridiculously Draconian responses including executions and exile to Australia, and repressed with the use of more military troops against their own civilian population than were devoted to stopping Napoleon. (Since Napoleon only wanted to take over Europe, not return it to the Stone Age.). The Draconian legal responses seem to have been specifically drafted to please wealthy company owners. (Who were sick and tired of having their property vandalized and destroyed by ignorant sheep.)
FTFY