Ecuador To Grant Assange Political Asylum 432
NSN A392-99-964-5927 writes with news that Ecaudor will grant Julian Assange's request for political asylum. An Ecuador official told The Guardian that the country's president, who earlier indicated his decision would arrive after the Olympic Games, will approve the request Assange made in June.
"Government sources in Quito confirmed that despite the outstanding legal issues Correa would grant Assange asylum – a move which would annoy Britain, the US and Sweden. They added that the offer was made to Assange several months ago, well before he sought refuge in the embassy, and following confidential negotiations with senior London embassy staff. The official with knowledge of the discussions said the embassy had discussed Assange's asylum request. The British government, however, 'discouraged the idea,' the offical said. The Swedish government was also 'not very collaborative,' the official said. The official added: 'We see Assange's request as a humanitarian issue. The contact between the Ecuadorean government and WikiLeaks goes back to May 2011, when we became the first country to see the leaked US embassy cables completely declassified ... It is clear that when Julian entered the embassy there was already some sort of deal. We see in his work a parallel with our struggle for national sovereignty and the democratisation of international relations.'"
Good (Score:5, Insightful)
Good for Assange and good for Ecuador.
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:OK, this is senseless (Score:5, Insightful)
And to think... (Score:5, Insightful)
Interesting how quickly things change.
Re:What a turning point in American History (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Good (Score:2, Insightful)
Well, with all that money, doesn't matter where you are exiled.
Re:Good (Score:4, Insightful)
You confuse 'the American public' with 'internet nerds'. The American public is overwhelmingly anti-Wikileaks. [mcclatchydc.com]
Re:And to think... (Score:3, Insightful)
Considering the long history of dictators and military juntas they would be correct. Go to Venezuela and start some demonstrations to speak out against Hugo Chavez and see how much 'freedom' he affords you.
Re:OK, this is senseless (Score:5, Insightful)
Ecuador is taking a startlingly appropriate and laudable position here, IMHO.
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
Quite apart from any supposed CIA attacks, Assange had better make sure he only says nice things about President Correa. From the Human Rights Watch Report [hrw.org]:
Those involved in protests in which there are outbreaks of violence may be prosecuted on inflated and inappropriate terrorism charges. Criminal defamation laws that restrict freedom of expression remain in force and Correa has used them repeatedly against his critics... Impunity for police abuses is widespread... Ecuador’s Criminal Code still has provisions criminalizing desacato (“lack of respect”), under which anyone who offends a government official may receive a prison sentence up to three months and up to two years for offending the president... journalists face prison sentences and crippling damages for this offense... In a draft decree announced in December 2010, domestic NGOs, including those working on human rights, would have to re-register and submit to continuous government monitoring. The decree would give the government broad powers to dissolve groups for “political activism,”
Then again, Assange also said that Sweden was a great place where he felt totally safe, right up until the whole rape thing happened, at which point Sweden was suddenly declared a notorious US lackey...
Re:Good (Score:3, Insightful)
and one which the US won't miss if an imperial fuckton of bombs happened to vaporize it!
Re-read what you just wrote, and ask yourself if you are on the good side or the bad side.
Re:And to think... (Score:1, Insightful)
Things haven't changed, just see how people vote with their feet, and the flow of people is decidedly south to north.
BOOM!! I just fuckin destroyed your idiotic nonsense with facts.
Re:And to think... (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:OK, this is senseless (Score:5, Insightful)
And not at all suspicious that we have a known CIA operative - And a close friend of hers - as the women involved here.
That doesn't mean he didn't do it, but when it comes to "benefit of the doubt", he definitely gets it in this case.
Re:And to think... (Score:5, Insightful)
Great. How does that make Chavez any less of a dictator that jails people for speaking out against him?
Re:OK, this is senseless (Score:5, Insightful)
Sweden assisted the US in extrajudicial rendition and had police turn over two egyptian guys straight to the CIA for transport to torture. The Swedish minister of 'Justice' at the time, Thomas Bodström, who most likely knew about and ok'd the illegal rendition at the time coincidentally runs a law firm together with the representative of the women who brought the allegations.
Not to say that it's a conspiracy, but one can understand why there's a certain reluctance to trust Sweden. It's become a banana republic complicit in torture run by a frat club of criminals.
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
"Such statements have no relationship to reality..."
Interesting perspective. I think there is very real evidence to demonstrate that the USA has a habit of bombing other countries and actively overthrowing governments (even elected ones) which refuse to toe the USA line. I wonder how many governments in Central and South America alone have been targeted for "regime change" because the USA didn't like their behavior?
I think the OP has a good point. Ecuador should be watching out for armed rebel groups even if they don't need to be dodging hellfire missiles and smart bombs at the moment.
Re:Good (Score:2, Insightful)
You confuse "the American public" with "a handful of people who took some poll".
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
It beats GITMO or some secret CIA prison in the Middle East.
Re:Good (Score:4, Insightful)
Armed Robbery: Strike 1 Assault :Strike 2
Steal loaf of bread: Strike 3 and we are fucking done with you. Goodby for the rest of your miserable life.
I see nothing wrong with this.
Right, because every theft of leavened baked goods involves armed criminal action and assault, without exception.
Jackass.
Re:And to think... (Score:5, Insightful)
America? Free?
In the US, you are free to:
Work a drudgy job
Pay taxes, deducted weekly from your pay, and levied higher if they think you didn't pay enough over the course of the year.
Pay taxes at the fuel pump
Pay taxes at the grocery store
Pay taxes when you buy alcohol or tobacco
Pay taxes when you somehow manage to buy a luxury item
Pay taxes on your property anually
Pay taxes on your vehicle
Pay levies for public scools
Be assaulted by police, who illegally confiscate any recording devices you have.
Speak publicly and exercise your right to assemble and address grievances in authorised "free speech zones"
Be subjected to brutal beatings if you exercise those rights anywere else
Be subjected to brutal beatings if you exercise those rights in the designated areas, if the message is controvertial or inconvenient
Be innundated in outright lies and yellow journalism 24/7 during election years
Choose which political dick you want up your ass for the next 4, 8, or 10 years (depending on level of govt)
Buy legal immunity if you are wealthy enough
Get totally shafted in the legal system if you aren't
Get enjoined as a spurrious "john doe" in a copyright case with flimsy evidence
Have your internet unplugged through mere allegations.
Get presumed guilty until proven innocent in matters involving copyright via the DMCA
Be arrested for spurrious offences only tangentally related to interstate commerce
Be detained indefinately without evidence or council if even suspected of engaging in terrorism
And so much more!
Just look at all those freedoms! The USA is a GREAT place to live!
Re:And..."I suppose it was only a matter of time." (Score:5, Insightful)
Besides the way Obama's dealt with this Wikileaks issue I otherwise like him
So this bothers you, but his treatment of Thomas Drake doesn't? Or the fact that he considers legal medical marijuana dispensaries in California to be a higher priority target than the investment bankers who crashed the economy in 2008? Or his continued use of unconstitutional warrantless wiretaps? Or that he signed the blatantly unconstitutional 2012 NDAA? Or his unilateral assassination of American citizens abroad?
The chief of the ACLU is "disgusted" [politico.com] with Obama. You should be too.
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:OK, this is senseless (Score:5, Insightful)
Listen to Assange's side of the story.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/today/hi/today/newsid_9309000/9309320.stm [bbc.co.uk]
He isn't wanted for a crime in Sweden, only for "questioning" by a prosecutor. He was in Sweden for 5 weeks following the alleged incidents so there was ample opportunity for this. When he left, he wasn't running from the Swedish authorities like a fugitive. He's also willing to speak with the Swedish prosecutor, but he didn't want to go back to Sweden to do it.
I think this reeks of conspiracy.
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
The American public in general is overwhelmingly authoritarian.
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
South America has gone a long way from the time it was easily manipulated by US. If anything it is getting more hostile to US as time goes, and if US decides to push it too hard it may end losing a lot more than it can possibly win.
Especially with the rise of Brazil as a regional regional economic powerhouse there may be less need to South American countries in general to put up with perceived U.S. bullying.
Re:And to think... (Score:2, Insightful)
It does not, of course.
But the hypocrisy of my fellow Americans is hilarious. People in glass houses and all that.
We're a nation founded on terrorism and tyranny.
Oh, but we don't murder British civilians these days. Or commit wide-scale genocide against the natives. And, why, we exchanged slavery for good ol' Jim Crow and let the situation sit for a century or so. Magnanimous, to be sure! We may have thrown countless American citizens into concentration camps with inward-facing machine guns, but at least we didn't gas 'em, right? And hell, even are women are treated as equals, at least until a bare minority of the country manages to seize control of their uteruses.
We imprison people over consumption of plants. We constantly surveil our citizens; we molest them in a sexual manner if they choose to fly.
We have 'free speech zones'.
We arrest people for dancing - without disturbing anyone, without making abnormal noise, without preventing tourism/et cetera - at national monuments.
We assault photographers, at least in New York City. ;)
None of this, of course, makes Chavez and his ilk any better. It doesn't excuse their own brands of ridiculous douchebaggery, which is often quite a bit worse than what our own country has done and is doing to us.
Just as, "The US has done things!" isn't an excuse for Chavez and friends; tinpot dictators are not an excuse for the oppression we suffer at home.
If you don't understand the absurdity of Americans whining about the conduct of other countries while pretending the US is flawless, you are a fool.
Re:Good (Score:2, Insightful)
Sure the American public also loves poverty now affectionately called green living, runs to get vaccinated at every turn, wrinkle their noses at organic food, trusts their goverment, uses their cars less, prefers soccer over football and meat consumption is also decreasing..
Well that's what the mainstream media is saying but that has no bearing on reality whatsoever. It's opinion that is put out there so that little Deslers lap it up and make it their own. What you read or hear in the media and especially in their contrived polls is what they would like to become reality and none of it is in your best interest. Nobody in their right mind gets rid of their car to use public transportation, Americans love football and have always hated any government interference in their lives, vaccination numbers are dwindling to the great upset of the pushers and don't even come near the subject of poverty in this country.
It's not that the media are just out of touch with the population why they spout the obvious nonsense they do, it is that they operate under the theory that if they just spout an opinion long enough that it gets adopted. 60000 repetitions make one truth .. or so their thinktanks believe but if anyone is at all out of touch with reality it is that class of privileged and pampered pseudoscholars like John Holdren (ecoscience population reduction scoundrel) that spent their cushy artificial lives in isolation from us.
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
Nothing? Well, that makes you a cruel and evil person. That you can't understand this makes you also a very stupid person. Congratulations. You are a real liability and a net minus to anyone around you.
Re:And to think... (Score:5, Insightful)
Hello captain obvious.
Paying taxes *is* a requirement for a healthy state. No question. The issue is just what percentage of personal income should be extracted as taxation, before the system becomes onerous. The point of listing so many as to point out that not only does the US have taxes, we just about have taxes for *everything*.
Wanna get married? There's a tax for that!
Inherit property? There's a tax for that too!
Etc.
It isn't that I am opposed to taxes. Far from it. I am opposed to onerous, continually compounding taxes.
This "all or nothing" rhetoric that jumps straight to "move to somalia then!" As an argument is *NOT* acceptable.
Re:OK, this is senseless (Score:5, Insightful)
Actually, it's because of such simplistic stereotypes about how rape victims are supposed to behave that so many sexual assaults still go unreported. Once you know that most rapes are committed by people the victim knew, you can understand why not all victims immediately go to the police. It's perfectly understandable that, if they had already had consensual intercourse before, the alleged victim would feel bad about what happened afterward if she did not agree to having sex without a condom but did not immediately report it. It's a common reaction and victims often need the help of their family or friends to fully understand what has happened to them and realize that it was rape. The fact that they "didn't seem phased" doesn't mean much, as there are many cases of rape victims dating and having subsequent intercourse with their rapist (clear-cut example: all those who were victims of marital rape).
See for references to published research: http://www.ndaa.org/pdf/pub_victim_responses_sexual_assault.pdf [ndaa.org]
Re:Good (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
OK, care to show me the sources that estimate those millions of South Americans crossing the US border every year? Because I did look at the numbers from more than one source, and they were nowhere near those.
Re:Good (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:And to think... (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't *NEED* to point to an alternative, to be justified in lampooning the faults of my own country.
Amusingly, this is exactly why we have first amendment rights in the first place, which is a genuine good thing that many other countries DON'T have.
I don't need to give examples of perfect, candycane and strawberry unicorn spooge gushing utopias in order to point out that there's knee deep bullshit in my back yard. The existence of the bullshit, and that it is in my back yard are self-sufficient in that deterimation.
I don't require a bullshit free back yard to point to, as a source of comparison.
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
The American public in general is also exceedingly stupid.
Re:Political refugee (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't think America is that different then sixty years ago. The difference is that in these days of globalization, Americans aren't limited anymore to input from news sources who are strongly biased. It becomes harder to hide the truth about some things.
If you live in the rest of the world (even western) where you don't have "America #1" or "America the only free country" tagline which for me introduces a lot of ignorance by some Americans, you will rapidly see that America is quite a "normal" country as it has it faults and is certainly not perfect.
For me as European it even have a lot in common in some aspects with Russia or even China, especially in being raised with certain believes tied to nationalism.
However, you douches made it the only option (Score:2, Insightful)
However, you douches made it the only option. By hounding him you ensure that he has to cut a deal.
Way to go, douche bags.
Re:Good (Score:2, Insightful)
Pro or anti wikileaks has nothing to to with Assange. Many people liked wikileaks before Assange turned it into his personal ego building tool and managed to get the rest of the world to forget about the actual founders and original principals.
Re:What a turning point in American History (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes, that's the yarn which has circled in the fanboy echo chamber. Which has essentially no correlation with reality. Do you really think that two separate British courts, including the high court, reviewed the charges against him and confirmed that they met the definition of rape even in the UK, if that was the case?
Here's a brief summary [guardian.co.uk] of what was actually alleged. And here's the court's more detailed fact-finding [judiciary.gov.uk] (you should definitely read the latter). There's nothing "suspicious" about how the case was handled unless you don't actually know how the case was handled (which, of course, has been the main goal of Assange's backers).
To briefly summarize the *actual* accusations, they're that Assange quickly began trying to make out with the first woman, which she initially went along with, only to have him try to force her legs apart and pin her down trying to force sex without a condom, to wherein she consented to sex with a condom to prevent it from happening to her without a condom, only to find out later that the condom was "broken". That night she told a friend about the "violent" (her words) sex with assange, and then moved out of her *own apartment* to get away from him. Concerning the other girl, he had tried to sleep with her without a condom over and over, something which she had never done in her life, even with her previous long-term boyfriend. She kept refusing. He stayed up while she fell asleep, and she woke up to him having sex with her without a condom (if you don't think that having sex with a sleeping person is rape, imho, you're a sick bastard). And yes, she understandably freaked out after it and tried to force him to get an STD test, which he refused.
As for the whole "they didn't decide it was rape until talking together" thing, that's the most offfensive part to me. Do you know how hard it is to admit to even yourself, let alone others, that you were raped? I called mine "an unwanted sexual experience" and whatever other weasel words I could get out of to avoid using that term for myself. It took three months of denial and trying just to move on with my life before I could accept what happened to me. There's a reason most rapes are never reported. You just want to put it in the past and forget about it; the last thing you want to do is have to relive it, to face the person again, to have all sorts of vile allegations leveled against *you*, etc. But if I had found out shortly afterwards that the next day that the guy who attacked me had done the same sort of thing to another girl? I don't know how I would have reacted, but it certainly would have changed the picture.
As for the CPT, they criticize everyone [coe.int]. That's their job. The report on Sweden is no worse than on any other state, and a lot better than a number. And as for giving suspects to the US, Assange felt so comfortable with Sweden that he was *applying for residency* when he was charged with rape. And then fled to the UK from there, which is ten times the US lackey Sweden ever was.
Re:Good (Score:4, Insightful)
The American public think the TSA is doing a good job.