Vivos Founder Builds an Underground City Where You Can Ride Out the Apocalypse 150
pigrabbitbear writes "'I was inspired with a very powerful message around 1980 that I needed to build a shelter for 1,000 people deep underground to survive something that was coming that was going to be an extinction event,' he explained in an extensive phone interview. 'That's it, that's all I had. But it was powerful. So powerful that I had a successful business with 100 employees and I took time off to go up into the mountains and search on weekends looking for an underground mine or cave that could be cartoned and converted.' Today, Vicino is the owner and founder of Vivos, a company that sells space in luxury survival complexes around the country. It's what he likes to call 'life assurance'--mini underground cities, in effect, for people ride out the end of civilization in a community setting with good food, television, even a potential dating pool. He says demand has increased 1,000 percent this year compared to last—itself a 1,000 percent increase over the year before."
so... up to 100 customers then? (Score:2, Insightful)
#MATH
Re:so... up to 100 customers then? (Score:5, Funny)
Welcome (Score:4, Funny)
Pets (Score:3)
Yes, but will he look after my pet?
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111, unless the customers from previous years have already bailed.
To ride out the end of civilization (Score:5, Insightful)
What a marvelous idea. We'll just hide in this handy cave and watch TV until the zombies have all eaten each other. After that we can come out and someone will be ready with McDonalds and Starbucks waiting for us.
Re:To ride out the end of civilization (Score:5, Insightful)
I have to wonder if the perversely optimistic nature of most 'survival' plans(optimistic compared to, say, a collapse of complex social systems where service industries don't just spring up again to take your hoarded gold in exchange for fresh food, not optimistic compared to non-collapse scenarios) has to do with psychological self-selection....
The greater one's confidence in one's own individual agency, capability, ability to achieve goals, etc. as opposed to a general lack of confidence or overt recognition of dependence in some areas of life, the more likely somebody might be to treat surviving an apocalypse of some flavor as a plausible goal. However, the same sorts of traits frequently predispose people to adopt vaguely antisocial and tech-heavy solutions for a problem that is (short of magic nanites or something) unlikely to be solvable alone.
In terms of surviving hostile conditions and the closest thing to isolation from modern society that the planet currently has to offer, empirical observation pretty much forces you to bet on the various relatively low-tech, clannish, kin groups that have lots of experience with scrounging in their own squalor. It isn't a pretty strategy; but it has worked for essentially the entire period between the evolution of Homo Sapiens and the rise of agricultural civilization(and for a time thereafter, albeit only in places marginal enough that agricultural civilizations couldn't be bothered to send in the army for a bit of the old 'civilizing').
By contrast, your techie-nerd survival-through-gadgets-and-stockpiles types can be expected to last only slightly longer than their MRE supply...
Re:To ride out the end of civilization (Score:4, Funny)
Mien Fuhrer! I can walk!
Re:To ride out the end of civilization (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:To ride out the end of civilization (Score:5, Insightful)
Mod parent up, please.
The number one thing you need to survive the coming apocalypse (which isn't actually coming) is a community that works together. Stock rice and beans, but instead of stockpiling ammo, get to know your neighbor. You won't have to shoot them, then.
If human history is anything to go by, you'll unfortunately have to master both skills. Not only do you have to be good enough neighbors that your attempt at agriculture doesn't end in mass starvation and not too many disagreements over the neighborhood's offspring and their foolish dating choices end in generations-long blood feuds; but you also have to be ready for a more or less constant series of meat-grinder skirmishes with the guys who live a valley over from you, all for reasons that are largely inchoate but will seem like a big deal at the time...
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Nonsense, it doesn't matter if you're good at the "people" side of things if you're the person everyone is looking to to help them survive.
Short of being surrounded by like-minded people, you're going to have to rely on ordinaries. Ordinaries will need you, too.
There is only one way to avoid the long running blood fueds and eventually being wiped out. It's to build a new Empire of a single, cooperative and cohesive culture with its own internal enforcement structure. Think the Romans or the Khans.
That said,
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Nonsense, it doesn't matter if you're good at the "people" side of things if you're the person everyone is looking to to help them survive.
All it takes is one asshole willing to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs, and it doesn't matter how many people are looking to you to help them survive. Community is the only thing that can possibly get you through any serious badness... a community of people who have stockpiled ammo and know how to shoot.
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Socialist rubbish. You'll need to learn to get along, sure, but you must MASTER the ability to perceive deception before you get fucked over, because being fucked over, even once, in such a situation, probably means you starve to death or are killed outright and robbed. such a world will be very thin on people willing to share what they have. The sane default is to assume deception at some point along the way in any cooperative endeavor. That doesn't mean you avoid all coops but you should plan contingen
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Deception, theft, betrayal, and violent death are certainly common outcomes; but that's the major reason(second only to the fact that even small-scale division of labor beats the hell out of farming alone) why cooperation is rewarded: It is very difficult to prepare yourself against all acts of violence or deception. It is easier to have people know that yes, they could stab you while your back is turned; but they'll be shitting teeth for weeks when your displeased kin group shows up for revenge if they act
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by 'socialism' in this context, I only meant that those who expect mass sharing of stockpiled resources, especially in the beginning, will probably be shot themselves. I could see remnant governments attempting this as a power grab.
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There are people out there with the attitude of "why work and stockpile food when your armaments can ensure food from your neighbors?"
The problem is that in the country, people need skills like knowing how to grow crops, irrigation, weather, what types of livestock are best for the land and for trade, how to build a farm for most effective growth, how to handle coyotes, pumas, and other predators, dealing with rats and other vermin, maintaining a livable home, making sure one has enough firewood, making sur
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The greater one's confidence in one's own individual agency, capability, ability to achieve goals, etc. as opposed to a general lack of confidence or overt recognition of dependence in some areas of life, the more likely somebody might be to treat surviving an apocalypse of some flavor as a plausible goal. However, the same sorts of traits frequently predispose people to adopt vaguely antisocial and tech-heavy solutions for a problem that is (short of magic nanites or something) unlikely to be solvable alone.
The goal of these 'caves' isn't to rebirth the human race. They're there for those who buy in to live out the rest of their lives in comfort. You're right, one can't rebuild humanity alone, but when so few humans give a shit beyond tomorrow's episode of jersey whore, what other choice is there?
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Most survivalist guides (at least, the saner ones) actually emphasize that community / tribe aspect. James Wesley Rawles, for example, which is a prominent figure in conservative / far-right part of the movement, advocates for like-minded people to all move and settle together [wikipedia.org] in a specific part of the country, with an explicit goal of forming self-supported communities after "SHTF". And he is specifically [survivalblog.com] promoting selection on the basis of religion to ensure strong bonds.
Re:To ride out the end of civilization (Score:5, Funny)
I tried camping once. The experience helped shape my current "head for a decent bar located as close as possible to something worth nuking and attempt to be vaporized with a gin and tonic in hand" strategy for apocalypse management...
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I think this girl will be there with you:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBP6yriRFiQ [youtube.com]
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You missed the part about "potential dating pool."
Read that as "escort service."
You might as well go out with a fuck . . .
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Yeah, he might sell more spots in this venture if he gave away a few free bonus spots to some hot young blondes. Otherwise 99% of the buyers will probably be old geriatric corporate guys.
Re:BYOB (Score:2)
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They're called 'furniture'.
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You missed the part about "potential dating pool."
Read that as "escort service."
You might as well go out with a fuck . . .
Actually, "Go Out With A Fuck" would be a good name for an escort service.
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But don't eat the meat.
On an unrelated note, have you ever noticed how ethnic restaurants tend to be located right next to animal hospitals?
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Why buy into this plan? If doomsday comes, rock up to the shelters with an AK-47, and commandeer it. Even if you buy into it with $$, you'll still have to fight off the other 6 billion people to actually use it.
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Yeah this guy blew it.. He should've kept it as secret as possible..and in as remote an area as possible.
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What a marvelous idea. We'll just hide in this handy cave and watch TV until the zombies have all eaten each other. After that we can come out and someone will be ready with McDonalds and Starbucks waiting for us.
Cave??? Is THAT what they call your parents' basement these days???
Your own vault (Score:1)
Vault tec comes to life
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You have been assigned as overseer of vault 157.
The vault contains 2 of each apex predator, (1 who will remain in stasis until only 1 species is left alive) and no doors or weapons.
Have fun.
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Vault tec comes to life
Honestly, this story would be much better if each little habi-pod had its own fucked-up dystopian social engineering theme. Much more interesting that the generic 'thermonuclear Marriott' shtick.
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Can I just go live there (Score:1)
not totally irrational (Score:3)
nuclear weapons exist. you might make it to your shelter.
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Well there are two ways that things may go : either a quick nuclear war, where you're unlikely to even know the war is happening before you're vaporized, or a slow buildup to a war. And if it's slow I can guarantee you the government it going to seize all shelters for 'vital personnel'.
Re:not totally irrational (Score:4, Insightful)
There are other alternatives, also unpalatable:
Depending on where you fall on the spectrum of confidence in second-through-Nth-strike capabilities, it doesn't necessarily have to be the case that a nuclear war would involve everybody shouting FIRE ZE MISSILES!!! and launching the world's supply of strategic nukes. If confidence in second strike is very low, or is based entirely on a 'we can get our rockets off the ground in the time between when theirs pop up on the big board and when they hit', then it will be over hard and fast. If, though, you assume a much more robust and survivable capability(missile subs, widely distributed 'Davy Crocket' style low-yield tactical devices in the hands of military units, significant optimism about how hard your bunkers really are) you might see a relatively prolonged exchange of a mixture of tactical and strategic weapons, with massive destruction of centralize infrastructure(the US gulf coast refining capacity, say) in the first few hours or days; but a fairly large number of civilians who avoid nuclear annihilation in favor of dying in the rubble.
You could also postulate a scenario where the government's ability to execute coherent strategies like 'seize all the shelters' is what collapses relatively early(for economic reasons, because of a successful nuclear decapitation, some sort of nasty plague, etc.), with various well-armed-but-ill-led armed forces fragments and numerous-but-hapless civilians left to figure things out by trial and error.
Now, it isn't obvious that any of these scenarios actually makes a short duration bomb shelter worth having access to; but some of them would give you a chance to drive to your tomb and close the door before the supermutants get you.
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You could even get the drawn-out nuclear war by accident.
Assume there's some fraction of the nuclear arsenal held back from the initial exchange as a strategic reserve. Then the sky falls on Washington (or Moscow, or Beijing, or whatever) and command and control over those forces completely disintegrates. Now you've got widely dispersed units with no clear orders having to decide for themselves if being unable to raise command on the radio means they should let their birds fly or not. Some of those units ar
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Well there are a few scenarios where having a shelter might save you. But you'd have to live outside a city and very near the shelter.
Any nuclear strike will still panic the people and cause them to rush out of the cities, causing roadblocks that would prevent you from reaching your shelter. Forget air travel - the army is going to shoot down anything they don't own.
And when you get to the shelter my guess is that you're going to find it overfilled by a few 100% - why sell a spot once when you can sell it a
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Anyone who is directly responsible for a nuclear war already has a shelter.
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nuclear weapons exist. you might make it to your shelter.
Ya, you can name it Megaton.
EOW scam (Score:5, Informative)
The Mayan calendar is base 20 with the first place only going to 18. This year represents the end of the 13th "great cycle"(13.0.0.0.0). That means that there have been 12 "end of the world events" preceding this year. So the next real end of the calendar doesn't happen until 4000 something when we reach the 20th great cycle. But then it will just start all over with 1.0.0.0.0.0. In short this is NOT the end of the Mayan Calendar.
Re:EOW scam (Score:5, Funny)
The Mayan calendar is base 20 with the first place only going to 18. This year represents the end of the 13th "great cycle"(13.0.0.0.0). That means that there have been 12 "end of the world events" preceding this year. So the next real end of the calendar doesn't happen until 4000 something when we reach the 20th great cycle. But then it will just start all over with 1.0.0.0.0.0. In short this is NOT the end of the Mayan Calendar.
Wrong! The great catastrophic event killing large amounts of people around the globe did happen early this morning. Don't believe the media hype - it's just a cover up.
The event only killed people below ground.
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The event only killed people below ground.
12/20: The Earth Fracked Back.
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Evidently the Earth is a Cylon.
Eh, I've seen worse plot twists.
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In short this is NOT the end of the Mayan Calendar.
True. It already ended centuries ago, after their culture was forgotten and their calendar was replaced by the Gregorian one.
Welcome to the Vault (Score:5, Interesting)
This is so Fallout that it hurts.
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Would it somehow have been more realistic of the music being played on the RADIO magically changed to reflect what you were doing at any given moment in time?
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It's so similar that I'm actually surprised that Fallout wasn't mentioned in the article. Let's see what life is like in a vault:
It's what he likes to call “life assurance”--mini underground cities, in effect, for people ride out the end of civilization in a community setting with good food, television, even a potential dating pool.
Today, six underground complexes are underway in undisclosed locations around the country, including one in Nebraska, and another in the Rockies, respectively designed to accommodate 900 and 1,000 people. Another, designed to hold 2,000 people, is in the works, with “a ton of interest in Australia.” Only one, located somewhere in Western Indiana, is fully stocked and ready to go.
Originally, the folks at Vivos thought it may be possible to build entirely new structures for their shelters. They quickly discovered that it was much cheaper and easier to appropriate one of the country’s many empty, underground shelter complexes already in existence, relics of the Cold War.
Standard rooms in Indiana are outfitted with two bunk beds to hold four people, with access to shared bathrooms.
From the looks of a video tour available on the group’s website, the Indiana location includes common area amenities like a home theater with leather recliners, dining rooms, multi-user kitchens, a Laundromat, and a very ominous soundtrack. (“Join us for the next Genesis,” it reads.)
“What Vivos is, is a modern-day fortress or citadel, where our members are safe and secure, with all the supplies they need to ride it out. And we can defend the facilities. So if the rest of the world’s gone crazy, our people will at least be in a safe haven,” Vicino said. He wouldn’t elaborate on how, exactly, the fortresses were armed. But he emphasized that they're equipped for “not offensive, but defensive measures.”
“I can tell you, you will never get into the compound. And if you do, once the shelter’s locked down, unless you’re in the military, you’re not getting through the door.”
Yeah, that's a goddamn vault. Hell, even the second picture in the article, if you remove the guy in khakis, would look like a screenshot from Fallout.
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It's a better idea than the Pulowski Preservation Shelters.
For the right price... (Score:1)
...I wouldn't mind investing in one of these things. Especially if I could take a vacation there, too. But I'm sure as hell not gonna buy before a very popular apocalyptic date.
Re:For the right price... (Score:4, Funny)
I bet there'll be a bunch listed on real estate sites at firesale prices starting Dec 22.
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Wait until Saturday, when somebody goes up to the 2k12 apocalypse-anticipators and says, "Hey, don't feel bad... it's not the end of the world"
(...roflmao... "not the end of the world" *cough*, *cough*).
Fools (Score:2)
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Fallout 3 (Score:1)
Well, who's to say what will happen. It's not immoral if there's some possibility of an upcoming disaster coming. Since the probability is above zero, then he's not really ripping anyone off. Also, it means they aren't necessarily irrational fears. Now, the real question is if his vaults will really protect anyone and can they be maintained indefinitely? For example, does he have back up systems in case power is lost, the food source is compromised, walls cave in, the outer doors are breached by insane surv
Obligatory Dr. Strangelove quotes (Score:5, Funny)
General "Buck" Turgidson: Doctor, you mentioned the ratio of ten women to each man. Now, wouldn't that necessitate the abandonment of the so-called monogamous sexual relationship, I mean, as far as men were concerned?
Dr. Strangelove: Regrettably, yes. But it is, you know, a sacrifice required for the future of the human race. I hasten to add that since each man will be required to do prodigious... service along these lines, the women will have to be selected for their sexual characteristics which will have to be of a highly stimulating nature.
Ambassador de Sadesky: I must confess, you have an astonishingly good idea there, Doctor.
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"Wouldn't this nucleus of survivors be so grief-stricken and anguished that they'd, well, envy the dead?"
You have an astonishingly good idea, Doctor! (Score:2)
Naturally, they would breed prodigiously, eh? There would be much time, and little to do. But with the proper breeding techniques and a ratio of say, ten females to each male, I would guess that they could then work their way back to the present gross national product within say, twenty years. I hasten to add that since each man will be required to do prodigious service along these lines, the women will have to be selected for their sexual characteristics which will have to be of a highly stimulating nature
Increased demand (Score:1)
He says demand has increased 1,000 percent this year compared to last—itself a 1,000 percent increase over the year before."
So they went from 1 person, to 10 people, to 100 people?
They don't do much (Score:5, Insightful)
The business is basically buying up old government shelters for cheap, put some furniture in and then sell it for 100 times more. However much would this guy like to portray himself as a modern-day Noah, he is just a smart businessman preying on people's fears.
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he is just a smart businessman preying on people's fears.
You say that like it's a bad thing... at least he's doing this in a relatively harmless way, unlike the security/industrial complex.
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I can't decide whether it's good or bad. On one hand, they get old unmaintained shelters into usable condition once again. On the other hand, in case of a gradual escalation, the government would've done the same, and then use it to shelter loads of people instead of just a bunch of millionaires.
I couldn't care less what people spend their money on, or how rich this guy gets from it, I just don't buy that he does the whole business out of pure altruism.
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The business is basically buying up old government shelters for cheap, put some furniture in and then sell it for 100 times more. However much would this guy like to portray himself as a modern-day Noah, he is just a smart businessman preying on people's fears.
I don't have a problem with him "preying" on people's fears as long as he is really providing them what he claims. My fear with any bunker that stays locked up for decades after you buy it is who is maintaining this thing? How do you know that the food hasn't spoiled or wasn't simply removed as soon as they sold it out? After all the thing requires two of the residents to come open it up in order to see what is in there. For that matter how do you know that a couple of your co-residents haven't opened up a
Why would anyone want to ride out the apocalypse? (Score:2)
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There are probably a billion, maybe two, people that we could ask this question even without the downfall of civilization as we know it; but I'm not sure that they could tell us anything useful...
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Many many many million people live on the brink of starvation in a devastated world (it's no use to them that *we* have it nice, is it, so to them the world is all fucked up already) as we speak and have for ages.
Also, consider this [wegotthiscovered.com] -- not the situation as a whole, but between these two. And I totally don't mean this tongue in cheek.. it's easy to say "fuck it", but as long as someone you care about still wants to live, what will you do? There is no good clean death either, other than falling asleep and not
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Death by starvation or some fucking infection or some bullshit in a desolate world forced to fight mortally for cans of beans? No thanks, prefer the former. So, please, vaporization thanks. Even a bio/freak-virus attack which kills in a day or two time would suffice.
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Awww come on, don't be like that [youtube.com].
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I look forward to eating your rations.
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The will to survive is strong in people. There are a lot of "apocalyptic" scenarios that don't give you such a clean death. For example what if the crisis is in the form of a new plague that rips through the population like the black death. Under such a scenario people in an isolated facility like that may well actually survive into a world that isn't that much different, other than far fewer people and a harder life, than what they left. The really bad scenarios; such as a full out nuclear war, killer ast
So this is the new Moore's Law (Score:2)
Strong message my ass. (Score:3)
This is the best:
"Our people have a survivor mentality, but theyâ(TM)re not survivalists,â he said. âoeTheyâ(TM)re not hoarding food and guns and ammo and camo gear in their garage or their basement. Instead, they bought Vivos."
My bet is he caters to overly paranoid people with too much money. So what happens when the dust settles and his clients crawl out of their little luxury caves to find the earth is a wasteland? Then what? Go back inside and commit suicide? Where will they find food? How do they adapt to a post apocalyptic world? Be sure to bring the entire family, I am sure the kids will love it!
If the earth is about to end due to some event the last thing I would want to do is crawl inside a cave and emerge only to find a dead wasteland or a chaotic world in a downward spiral. I would rather Major Kong that event and ride it into oblivion.
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I'm pretty sure that if your response to a problem is "throw money at it, anything else is dreadfully downmarket.", you do not, in fact, have a 'survivor mentality'...
In other news, buying a black, hard-anodized, aluminum flashlight makes you 'tactical'.
Just leaving these here... (Score:2)
this one's for the in crowd: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFUqh7uF1G4 [youtube.com]
this one's for us roaches: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZWc4p5z-J0 [youtube.com]
happy derpday everybody ^^
Forget the underground bunkers (Score:1)
What can you do? Run into the woods with your friends? Call yourselves The Wolverines? Put twigs in your hair and beat back the survivalists? No... You hightail it to Pastor Richards Salvation Statue and blast off into space!
Not in the Simpsons but should be (Score:4, Funny)
(In Homer voice) So it's fears you're selling, ay?I'd like a dozen fears please. That costs HOW MUCH??? I'd like one fear please. What? Can I get just a taste? Mmmmmmm.... fear.
One question (Score:3)
Slashdot! (Score:2)
You couldn't have posted this a bit sooner than the day before December 21, 2012?
And in the end the danger was deeply ironic... (Score:3)
...when it turned out the event the Myans were warning about was an excessive outgassing of radon by rocks in underground mines.
Looks like an old Bell System facility (Score:4, Interesting)
The Nebraska facility is almost certainly a former Bell System facility. It has a classic AT&T microwave tower and high bays for switching equipment. AT&T used to have underground centers across the country for survivable communications. Here's one that is for sale. [undergroun...resses.com]
There are a surprising number of bunkers for sale in the US. I see some on the market that were being offered a decade ago. The costs of refurbishing and operating a big military facility in the middle of nowhere are high, and few people bother. Some have done so, and then realized they don't really want to live there. [silohome.com]
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Some have done so, and then realized they don't really want to live there.
That one in particular has been for sale for a very long time, and they have revamped the site at least twice to try to draw more interest. So far, obviously, they have failed. Two million for some land in the middle of nowhere is a pretty hard sell. You could bury a bunch of shipping containers much cheaper.
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That one in particular has been for sale for a very long time, and they have revamped the site at least twice to try to draw more interest.
I know. Yet it's one of the more useful sites. It has an airstrip, and it's reasonably close to major Eastern US cities. If there's an emergency, you have a reasonable chance of getting there. There's a useful house above ground, and a comfortable bunker. Even after a nuclear war, you only need to spend about two weeks in a fallout shelter before you can go outside. And there are lots of contingencies for which merely being in a solid house in an isolated area is enough.
Does nobody know anymore how to die with dignity? (Score:2)
This is really, really pathetic, all this failed terror-management. These people are so afraid of death that they lose sight of what is important and miss out on life. Cowering in some hole in the underground delaying the inevitable for a while is not my idea of how to go. In fact is is pretty much a horror-vision.
Really, my preparation for doomsday are a nice bottle of something alcoholic to take the edge off, but that is it. Nothing more required. Death comes for us all, nothing to be afraid of, except m
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This is really, really pathetic, all this failed terror-management. These people are so afraid of death that they lose sight of what is important and miss out on life. Cowering in some hole in the underground delaying the inevitable for a while is not my idea of how to go. In fact is is pretty much a horror-vision.
Really, my preparation for doomsday are a nice bottle of something alcoholic to take the edge off, but that is it. Nothing more required. Death comes for us all, nothing to be afraid of, except maybe dying badly because you are unable to face death.
Word, my plan is to just die. If i don't die right away i'm sure someone or something will kill me.
I don't want to live if i can' t access slashdot.
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You are confused. Maybe a mental infection of the malevolent religious kind?
Anyways, have a look at "terror management theory". I was not talking about speeding it along or anything. I am not suicidal. I was talking about clinging to life when it does not make any sense at all and in preparation for that actually screwing up your life. That is a terror-management fail.
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The only question is whether you die in the blast, or die watching other humans abandon every single thing you consider to be their humanity as the survivors murder kids, the sick, and everyone who is weaker than them for a can of beans. When the can goods are gone, they'll start eating each other. Then they'll die themselves in their own filth.
Possibly, though there are tons of things that will kill off much of society that won't involve any of that. Where people who prepared, and many who didn't, will simply come out afterwards and go on with their lives. Odds are the people who prepared will come out of in better shape than those who didn't.
I didn't see anything in that about having things like stocks of seeds to start farming, arms for defense / hunting, or any type of survival training of the occupants. The folks buying these bunkers are act
Not thinking through the human element... (Score:3, Insightful)
Let me get this straight. This guy is going to have 1000 rather devoted survivalists ( == probably paranoid) cooped up in an underground cave somewhere? I give it 100 days, tops, before people start shooting each other or using whatever other tools are available. Granted, having a small but reasonably-functioning little village could be nice and robust, but with those kinds of numbers it's inevitable that you're going to have some pretty bitter and high-pressure politics going on, and it's only a matter of time before a lot of people snap, particularly if it really is the "end of the world".
Unless I personally knew each and every person and knew something about their endurance, sanity, and skills in a high-pressure, low-resource situation, I'll take my chances on the surface, thanks.
5:11am central time came and went (Score:2)
very disappointed, hardly any zombies roamed the street and only a small fireball was looming over the horizon. aw heck, those were early commuters and the sun. what a ripoff
Hmm (Score:2)
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Is he, by any chance, friends with the 'freedom ship' guys who manage to update the 3D rendering of the bitchin' bioshock libertarian aqua-paradise that they are totally going to be building real soon now every few years?