Protesting DMCA 114
It began in David Niemi's head early this year.
Niemi is a Washington D.C. system administrator who decided he didn't want the restrictions embodied in last year's Digitial Millennium Copyright Act to sweep into effect unnoticed, and organized a protest demonstration that took place this morning outside the U.S. Capitol building. Speaking a few days before today's event, he explained that the idea took hold of him "[a]bout two months ago. It started when I had just read the DMCA, and realized what exactly the problems were, and gave a short talk to DC LUG and later to NovaLUG, after which I enjoined people to take a day off of work and help protest. If we have even half of those people [who said they would come], it'll be great."
The chance to show up in person to show dissatisfction with the law and start spreading the news of its dangers ended up attracting an interesting cross section of the software community -- between 20 and 25 people -- and one observer for the Copyright Control Association. Members of the DC, Virginia and Maryland LUGs which helped publicize the event, and others who heard about the event (here on Slashdot, or through mailing lists and forums which were forwarded the information) showed up to create and hold signs with messages like "Restore Fair Use -- Repair the copyright law" and a banner reading "The Digital Millennium Copyright Act Promotes Digital Monopolies." Most of the demonstrators were professional programmers or sysadmins, students, or both.
Why spend so much time and energy fighting a law that was passed last year? In part, because not all of the provisions of the law have yet been enacted, and their implementation can still be altered. And, as Niemi points out, "[t]he DMCA is actually fairly readable -- it's quite easy to see why it's unreasonable. UCITA is quite a bit harder [to understand], especially as amended by Virginia, which was done as edits to a long piece of code." Efforts to curtail DMCA's effects will be good practice in fighting the other laws which no doubt will follow, starting with UCITA and stretching into the forseeable future.
University of Maryland researcher and some-time instructor Peter Teuben was the only representative today from the University of Marlyand's LUG. "Probably because the others have classes to go to," said Teuben with a smile. "I just took off because I didn't have to teach. The software that I write is open source, so I have been been an active participant for at least 15 years in the whole idea of open source. I come from an academic background where that's normal." But there is another reason he was in Washington today "This is near to my heart. The simplest reason is the fact that I bought a DVD player, and now that I've bought it, suddenly I 've learned that I can't play the DVDs that I buy in Holland. I was totally shocked -- I didn't know that. It makes no it makes no sense to me, because it's digital, just like CDs -- even the same size." Something as simple as watching a movie purchased or shipped from abroad is made complicated by the restrictions the DVD license holders have attached to the medium. "The funny thing is that software allows you to do that [switch region settings] five times, but that's still limited. There's ways around that, but they're illegal."
Economist Doug Galbi also took time off work to show up on the street west of the Capitol building. Galbi said his interest was mostly philosophical. "I don't do that much programming, but I have a sense that this [isuue] is huge." Galbi said that for consumers, "The fear is that reasonable, common-sense fair use would be outlawed ... that their actions would be vulnerable as a felony act under the law. What if I'm going down the street singing a Beatles song, are they going to arrest me because I don't have the rights to it?"
Marsha Wilbur, studying at Connecticut's Three Rivers College and about to continue her computer science studies at Arizona State, hopped on a train when she heard about the demonstration on a mailing list from the Open Law project at Harvard's Berkman Center. "I said 'Oh, I'm there!' Also, there's a guy in Connecticut who's being sued, and they're using this -- " She gestured at a copy of the law -- "to harrass him. That's my feeling. And I don't think it's right. That's why I'm here."
Because seniors at his school graduate in 3 1/2 years instead of four, Lenny Grover spent the morning in Washington, while he waits for responses to both job and college applications. "I'm always interested in things that affect the technological community. And I think the provision that products with, I believe it says, limited commercial potential which circumvent copy protection, would also have prevented the VCR. And that turned into billions of dollars a year! These people are so shortsighted -- they don't even see the benefit it could bring." Pointing out that programs like Napster/Wrapster and Gnutella are essentially content-neutral distributed file systems, Grover said, "The question is, where do you draw the line between innovation and breaking copyright?"
Discussions among the participants about the nature of software and the best ways to balance individual, public and corporate rights simmered throughout the protest, which ended at noon with a walk that took us from the Capitol past the Supreme Court. During the hike network engineer Rama Kant voiced a thought about the perceived lack of tolerance among copyright holders for what has traditionally been called fair use: "I feel that it impinges on your ability to watch or listen to what you paid for. I sort of disagree with that. If I buy a CD, I want to be able to listen to it at whatever time I want, whatever conditions I want." Kant, who does contract work for various organizations in the area, heard about the event through his membership in NoVaLUG. "I've been a Linux user for a while, and that's how I got into this. I use Linux, and Unix also. I use a lot of Linux boxes in my work."
Perhaps the least-expected person to show up this morning was Penny Kozakos, an employee of public relations firm Burson-Marsteller who came to observe and collect literature from the protesters. Kozakos seemed puzzled by the demonstration, and listened curiously to an explanation of what computer operating systems have to do with watching the movies her agency's client keeps encrypted, and why the DCMA was poised to drastically change the scope of what consumers and computer scientists could do legally and without asking industry permission. "This is all new to me," she said, explaining that she was merely doing a favor for the Los Angeles branch of the company by showing up to make a report. "This isn't what I deal with normally at all."
Was today's demonstration a success? Perhaps not in any spectacular way; fewer people showed up than Niemi initially hoped for. However, the flyers and DMCA summaries handed out today were mostly to passers-by who expressed no knowledge of the DMCA at all, and most of whom seemed shocked by its brazen assertion of control over purchased entertainment media. Cultivating public knowledge that there even is such a thing as the DMCA seems like a minor success to me. And if more than 20 Linux users can collect themselves at short notice for three hours on a Washington weekday, it bodes well for similar actions in the future.
See pictures of the event taken by Sally Lynch, by Peter Teuben, and by Declan McCullagh.
Lame (Score:1)
Does Adobe scare anyone else? (Score:1)
The scary part is how the PDF can be locked: As it has been, you can control permissions for printing, copying, and annotating. With PDF Merchant, you can also lock down the PDF file to a user's CPU ID, local hard disk, or "portable media".
It might not look bad right now, but if you're a college student, I can guarantee that very shortly you'll be buying required class texts in this format. How this pertains to "fair use" and the DNCA should be pretty evident.
Let's get media attention (Score:1)
Re:Does Adobe scare anyone else? (Score:1)
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:1)
On another note, it's none of the Movies industries BUSINESS if I want to pay for a comercial DVD driver or not which is Closed Sourced. Once I by the DVD disk, it's mine - not THEIRS. There statement that we're too cheap to buy the non-existing vaperware DVD players implies that unless we're willing to purchase a DVD player that gives a kickback to the Motion Picture industry thart it's us who is morally bankrupt. The truth is that it is THEM who are morally bankrupt for insisting that we pay a kickback to them above and beyound the cost of the product to use it after I made a legal purchase.
In a word, they are extortionist.
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:1)
The only reason Creative are making this and Jack not having a hissy about is is that the legal gray area parts (CSS, etc) are done in that little PCI card.
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Re:More demonstrations (Score:1)
Re:High Tech Protest (Score:1)
Freedom is a multi-edged sword (Score:1)
Under other circumstances I might agree with you.
However, the veterans in question are, ironically, supporting a measure which is designed to add a restriction to the very thing they defended: freedom.
People, freedom in general is like free speech: it's not free unless there is the possibility of it conflicting with your own preferences. Speech is not free if it's restricted to, say, speech that you happen to agree with, or speech that you don't happen to find offensive, etc. Actions are the same: I'm not free unless I can perform actions that you disagree with, but which otherwise do not harm you or others. Flag burning is an example. You and others might not agree with it, but it doesn't harm you.
It is very important to distinguish between actions which infringe upon the rights of others and actions which do not. The latter should be allowed unconditionally. The former will require a compromise.
To be honest, I don't understand why there are so many attempts by so many people to restrict what others say or do simply because it's disagreeable (however disagreeable it might be). It's as if nobody has any backbone anymore when it comes to this kind of thing. What's with this society turning into one full of wimps?
It would be nice if people would quit acting like little babies that need to be protected from the big, bad world.
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Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:1)
Get All the users groups to send 20-25 people to protest in front of their senator and representatives offices.. or something of the like.
Do it all on the same day.. so that the small groups acting have a greater effect (just a brainstorm.. distributed commuity.. use distributed techniques, nothing new.. just why don't we do it?). I've got no experience with such things.. how hard is it to do?
(now where do we need to set up the spinlocks to make this all syncronize?)
Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:1)
Re:MPAA's VP of Public Relations says: Sigma (Score:1)
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
You wanna talk about irony? (Score:1)
On another note, the hordes of veterans seen swarming the Capitol yesterday were there to lend their support for the anti-American Flag desecration Constitutional amendment. Kinda ironic considering we were defending freedom,and they were there to, in a way, curtail it.
Yeah, let's criticize the people who have risked their lives to uphold our freedom. I'm sure their testicular fortitude is no match for 20 Slashdotters who are upset because they can't watch the DVDs that mommy brought back from Japan.
And people say that the kids around here have no sense of proportion. Go figure.
Cheers,
ZicoKnows@hotmail.com
Re:Because... (Score:1)
Re:Just flout the law. It worked for Prohibition. (Score:1)
Re:Just flout the law. It worked for Prohibition. (Score:1)
Excerpt from my Comments to patent office (Score:1)
Time-Warner, in their pro-DMCA comments (comment 43) offers a metaphor for the status of fair-use under the proposed DMCA. "A fair-use defense might allow a user to quote a passage from a book but it does not follow that the user is allowed to break into a bookstore and steal the book." This is, of course, true, but it has no bearing on the issue. We don't need a DMCA to make software or video piracy illegal any more than we need it to make breaking into bookstores illegal.
A more apt metaphor would be that the DMCA would make it illegal for the owner of a book to use scissors to clip a piece from that book. If you have an oversize book that in itself doesn't fit into a copy machine, how else would you acheive the kind of fair use protected by law? Even worse, this protection could prevent legitimate enjoyment of the work - a blind user might be unable to feed the book into her automated reading device without cutting it, or a fan might be unable to tape a favorite page to the wall of his room. It may sound as if I'm stretching the metaphor, but all of these activities have a direct analogue in the digital domain.
In the end, this is about much more than illicit copying. It is about who controls the experience. Imagine a video system designed to disable the "fast forward" button during the initial previews. If I, as owner of a video, am legally prohibited from circumventing such a system, I have lost my fundamental right to control my experience of something I own. If the medium is the message, this sends a very powerful message. The ultimate abuse that would be possible once the content providers could disable certain VCR buttons would be fake documentary footage with the pause button disabled. Anyone who found the stillframe where the shadows came out wrong would be liable for having circumvented the access protections.
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:1)
There is a driver/player using the Creative dxr2 card that works well under Linux. Since the CSS decoding is done in hardware, all the code is both legal and open source.
You can find it at
http://opensource.creative.com/ [creative.com]
Re:MPAA's VP of Public Relations says: Sigma (Score:1)
What would his answer be for those of us who own cards like the dxr3, and still can't watch them in our favoured operating system? You have an e-mail addy I can send a polite message to? Put the question to him yourself if you get the chance?
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:1)
The dxr2 driver was developed by reverse-engineering one of the drivers. Sigma Designs, which from what I understand manufactures the dxr series, couldn't release the hardware specs due to DVD-CCA NDAs. This is the same problem preventing them from releasing a software driver for the dxr3, since the CSS decoding is done in software on that board.
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:1)
Re:Making a difference (Score:1)
I don't think the dxr2 driver would count, since half of the development relied on reverse-engineering (the other half on what information Creative could provide on the Sigma-produced dxr2). Sigma's information indicates Linux support is coming, as well at NT4, but right now Win9X is the only option.
Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:1)
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:1)
LinuxWorld has article with pics (Score:1)
Mostly based on interview with David Niemi (the protest's organizer) but also gets a comment from an attorney for the DVD Copy Control Association (plaintiff California case).
We should create a non-profit to do this through (Score:1)
I am a member of the American Owners and Pilots Association (AOPA). We are 300000 members strong. This gives us a voice that will be heard on topics that affect General Aviation.
We should create a similar group for Geeks. Then when something comes along like the DMCA we can use our collective voice to combat the legislation.
I don't know if the ACM does this already but would could use that as a starting point.
Politician - Geek Crossproduct = 0 (Score:1)
The Politicians out here are always accused of being out of touch; doesn't matter if we talk about taxes, immigration, interns, or computers. But the problem is that there have been people around for years lobbying to explain to those politicians what decisions are best and for what reasons. Corporations are used to this, and those that aren't can hire people who are good at it. That's why they get what they want.
Open Source supporters and the swarms of informed geeks on the 'net, on the other hand, don't seem to get the idea... but we're learning. Right now we've got dynamic, vocal members in our ranks, but most of their time is spent preaching to the choir as it were.. Perens, Stallman, and a large portion of the community have a lot to say, but we say it internally. We post messages and articles to places only geeks tread. There was considerable commentary recently that the various states approving creationism teachings over, or on equal footing to darwinism was largely because the people who support creationism were much more supportive of the school system. They attended PTA meetings in much higher percentages and could garner votes even if a much greater percent of the outside community considered their ideas without merit. The same is true with us. We are just now realizing how to play the political game that will shape the future of the 'net. With the example of the DMCA, however, we arrived at the game very late.
Would I do something differently if I had this protest to do over? Almost certainly. We should have talked to the larger (outside the DC-Area) community much earlier to garner wider support. We should have aggressively contacted Senators and Representatives to more alert them to the protest. We should have pursued slightly different permits than we had.
But we've learned this now. We must approach politics as we approach everything else in life. It is a black box. We need it to work a particular way for us to thrive and survive. It responds to inputs (peaceful protests, illustrative letters, defacing government web sites) with predictable responses; some good, some bad. Politicians won't vote favorably for us if we don't tell them what we want and why we want it. And we must accept that we can't expect them to learn our language... we have to learn the language of politics; at least for now.
The press surrounding the DC protest has been generally negative... we can't claim a true victory even if we have biased press (Thanks again, Timothy). But we can't give up either. With the UCITA looming, and new laws threatining the privacy of electronic communications, we must stand up for our rights in arenas other than those we created ourselves.
If someone has a better way to do it; don't criticize our attempt... help us do a better job next time, for there certainly must be a next time.
---Chip
Where was everyone? (Score:1)
-Rav
Re:Someone forgot to call the media (Score:1)
And the protest was on the west side of the Capital Grounds, as close as we were allowed, which was the sidewalk on First ST [N-S]W, from 9am to 11am. Then we went to the Library of Congress (Copyright office).
The media just don't think this is important enough to cover, not sexy enough. Or for the conspiracy folks out there, they decided it was not in the best interests of various parent companies. Guess who owns CNN, etc?
We did get coverage by Wired, one of the Linux pubs, and of course Slashdot.
Re:The problem (Score:1)
I passed the group of people (like six or seven, ten max) protesting Mitnick's imprisonment on the day people were supposed to protest at federal courts around the country, and man was that sad. They just seemed to stay huddled in their group, not really approaching people (killing the point of disseminating information).
Another day, a few weeks ago, a friend and I got bored, so we just walked around the Capital area. There was some protest going on (well, it was more a rally since it was sponsored by a congressman) about health care. I agreed with what they were saying (health care for everyone, even if it would cost more money), but I couldn't help but think "What are they accomplishing?"
Protests like this are masturbation. You don't really accomplish anything other than make yourself feel better because you at least did something. Protests don't get the eyes of policy makers unless you capture the eyes of the public, and the public probably doesn't care about a protest like this. It's just another protest; the people who work in DC are used to seeing them, it's not much new.
In short, if you really want something done about the DMCA, a protest isn't the answer. You need to find a real means of change, not just an outlet.
You should have taken the offer. (Score:1)
Stealing a government flag is theft. Burning that flag is arson. Buying your own flag and burning it is what, exactly (besides the loss of whatever you spent)?
<snort> You have the nerve to call that civilization? The USA imprisons more of its population than any other nation, Amnesty International is already up in arms over draconian punishments meted out in the USA, and you want to make yet another crime out of an act that harms nobody.Canada has confiscated imports of lesbian literature on the grounds that it is "degrading to women". "Civilization", in the sense you're using it, is just another term for oppression, regimentation and intolerance.
Yup, I was born in the USA and lived here all my life. I love my country. My government needs to be told to stick it in its ear a heck of a lot, but the freedom to do that in creative ways is one of the things I love about this place.
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Re:a couple of points (Score:1)
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Re:Is there a DMCA FAQ? (Score:1)
Why weren't more people there? (Score:1)
Political activism is a wonderful thing. Now that I am in Israel (a country without a real constitution) I see just how important it is that the people have someone to write to and share their thoughts with. It's a shame that more people in the states don't exercise this right as much as they really should. 20/20 hindsight is soo sharp!
Now that this is over, when is the next rally? POST IT ON
Rami James
Pixel Pusher
Altec Lansing R&D, IL
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Re:Where was everyone? (Score:1)
- Serge Wroclawski
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:1)
Re:You wanna clue? (Score:1)
You wanna talk about the Iron Cross? (Score:1)
The First Amendment does not apply to hate speech. You have a right to freely express your facts and opinions. But no one has a right to pervert expression, with the sole purpose to degrade, insult, and abuse. That is what flag burning is about.
It was not long ago that Blacks were lynched by the light of a burning cross. That Jews were gassed and starved under the swastika. And it was only sixty years ago that the best of America's young men left to fight and die in faraway lands: not for their own freedom, but for others'.
Re:You should have taken the offer. (Score:1)
But what I was really trying to impress upon you was that the application of the first amendment is too arbitrary due to its current form.
Surely you must admit that draft card burners were prosecuted and punished because of their protest, not because of the lost property. Just picking up an extra W2 would cost the government about as much. Perhaps the laws were based formally on destruction of property, but they were clearly directed at political expression.
There is also the question to what extent speech can interfere with anothers' rights. This determination is also arbitrary. One example: the the organizers of St. Patrick's Day parades can keep out groups that identify themselves as gay. I think that reasonable people can agree with either the majority or minority opinion of the Supreme Court on this case. (I personally am somewhat more inclined toward the majority. I wish the organizers were more tolerant, but forcing them won't help matters.) I really think that opinions are consistent with the Consititution. The decision is really based on value, and not on explicit law.
These sorts of cases make me think that the written law is only a tiny part of de facto oppression. It is true that Canada misuses hate speech laws to attack what they think is pornography. But you cannot judge the law based on its misuse.
It is more appropriate to structure the law precisely, to minimize misinterpretation.
It is necessary to avoid the fascistic extreme of overspecification in law. But it can be just as wrong for the law to become too powerful through its very looseness. A law which is too open to interpretation, as the First Amendment and the Right to Privacy currently are, will eventually be misused.
Sorry that I am not more clear on this - ignorant of my own advice, I try to avoid taking a firm position. I am often glad that the Supreme Court has "discovered" that the Constitution gives us a fundamental right to privacy. But in constitutional interpretation the true strength of
judicial precedent is often overestimated. What one Court has invented from unclear sources, another can easily take away.
Therefore I do favor additional Amendments, even if they limit speech and privacy to a reasonable extent. Because more than I distrust Congress and the Presidency, I distrust the potential misuse of the Supreme Court. If under our current system we try to limit the power of government by seeking a minimal set of laws, we give the court system tremendous power for tyranny.
Also, I don't think burning an American flag is *really* necessary to convey a message. If it remains legal, fine, but if it becomes illegal, it won't be the end of the world!
Typo (Score:1)
Fourth paragraph:
I really think that opinions are consistent with the Consititution.
I think that both opinions are consistent with the Consititution.
Additional (Score:1)
To further explain why my topic changed the way it did... The point of my initial posting was more to make people with small imaginations realize that, to some, flag-burning can be just as thoughtless and hateful as the 'n' word or any other insult.
My replies to you are motivated mostly because I am suspicious of claims of an ideal system of government. So maybe all forms of hate speech ought to be allowed, but that really is not immediately obvious to me.
Just in case you care...
Re:You can't comment. Screw my karma. (Score:1)
Re:Just flout the law. It worked for Prohibition. (Score:1)
Putting our heads in the sand and ignoring bad laws is all well and good, until you're the one that gets made an example of, and you find yourself doing life in prison without parole for a minor offense..
Think it couldn't happen? Ask Douglas Lamar Gray, sentenced to life in prison without possibility of parole for the purchase of one pound of marijuana. Or perhaps Gloria Van Winkle, sentenced to life for selling $40 worth of cocaine.
When we ignore unjust laws, politicians just raise the penalties for breaking those laws, often to absurd extremes. Since 99% of us don't get caught, should we just hope we never end up in the unlucky 1%? Pax Save me, Jebus!!!!!!!!!
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:1)
Personally, I like DVD. The image is clear, you get aditional features with the movie, but currently, I'm just SOL if I want to use my DVD-ROM to play any movies. Of the two OS's I'm currently working with -- Windows 2000 and Debian Linux, neither support DVD decoding at this point. The idea of a binary only player for Linux bugs me somewhat due to the fact that the idea of binary compatibility is completely lost on Linux, where if it's a bug, it's going to be fixed, no matter how much shit is depending on it. In contrast to the Windows world, where Microsoft has to be extremely careful about fixing bugs in their library calls because they could easily break hundreds of programs.
Re:Is there a DMCA FAQ? (Score:1)
Re:You wanna talk about irony? (Score:1)
Exactly, because someone who risks his life can do no wrong and is clearly above all reproach. Perfect.
High Tech Protest (Score:1)
Is there a protest site, where your protests have at least some audience and that is respected by the gov. officials? I doubt it. The best type of a protest so far were DOS attacks against
Can some one fill me in here... (Score:1)
Who do they pertain to?
Nathaniel P. Wilkerson
NPS Internet Solutions, LLC
www.npsis.com [npsis.com]
democracy? (Score:1)
Good job (Score:1)
We need constructive action (Score:2)
While I am personally against the DMCA and all that it stands for, what we need is real constructive action here. Going on protests like this is all very well for "geek pride" but in the end it is likely to acheive nothing beyond a fleeting interest in the tech-savvy news.
What /.ers and other members of the computing community don't seem to realise is that we need to fight this kind of law from the inside. Until we as a community enter into the political process our voices will be limited to the small subset of people who already agree with us, which is pointless. We need lobbyists to fight for our causes, not ineffectual protests which do little but make us feel good.
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:2)
I use this in linux, but you need the now hard to find Creative Labs Dxr2 decoder board, which has CSS on-chip.
Re:You wanna talk about the Iron Cross? (Score:2)
It was not long ago that Blacks were lynched by the light of a burning cross.
I don't have a problem with them burning a cross (unless they do it on someone's property without permission). I do have a problem with lynching people though.
That Jews were gassed and starved under the swastika.
Swastikas arn't illegal are they?
Seems to me that flag-burning isn't hate speech, but political speech. They aren't expressing their hatred of a particular person or group of people. They're expressing their opinion that the US government is full of lying, cheating assholes, some of whom went out of their way to avoid serving in the military (*cough* Clinton *cough* GDubya). Ok, maybe not that opinion necessarily, but they're expressing their opinion about our government and its actions. As political speech, flag-burning should be protected.
If you start lowering the standard of what qualifies as hate speech, then some group somewhere will be able to label just about anything as hate speech. That's a bad thing.
Re:Making a difference (Score:2)
A poster earlier said that Sigma Designs [sigmadesigns.com] is working on a player, but that it's not available yet. I don't know of any others.
The whole thing makes me wish I lived in DC.. err.. maybe just within driving distance. :)
I'm curious though. How does one "make material relevant to the legislative process?" How do you figure out what the individuals' interests, sympathies, etc are?
DMCA-UCITA-Fighting-HOWTO (Score:2)
Face it, protests like rarely accomplish anything substantive. People have to look at things objectively. A combination of clueless judges and corporation with large legal budgets stack the odds heavily in their favor.
Barring some unexpected stroke of luck for the ACLU and EFF, I think that they will lose. So, what can a nerd do?
Let's come to grips with the fact that in the courtroom, the decks are stacked against us. The only reasonable chance of defeating DMCA and UCITA is by repealing them.
Legislation is enacted and repealed for only two reasons: either an overwhelming majority of the American population want it, or a selected few American businesses lobby heavily for it (enactment or repealment, either way).
Expecting a groundswell of public opposition to DMCA and UCITA is a bit naive. 95% of the people have no idea what it is, despite the press coverage, or what it's all about.
So, that leaves big business. Big business has to realize that the DMCA and UCITA will hurt them. So, how to tell big business that?
Well, I only know of one way. Big business needs as many nerds as they can find, to run their big honking server boxes, where they keep the company jewels. And there aren't enough nerds to go around.
Personally, I will refuse employment or consulting work for any company that's headquartered in any state that so far has passed UCITA, or any company that actively supported or prosecuted under the DMCA. That may seem to be silly, but I'm a silly guy. I'll do that as long as I possibly can. Thankfully, so far, there isn't exactly much of a shortage of nerd jobs. And I'm still sufficiently naive to believe that if enough people did that, something might happen.
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Re:We may have already lost. (Score:2)
Perhaps I was not clear, what I was trying to say is that the current CB enthusiasts are the same type that were involved before the big CB boom. The hobbiests and technical enthusiasts.
With the net, we'll never be able to go back to that point.
LK
We may have already lost. (Score:2)
They don't understand our culturee, they don't understand the technology, and they don't understand what's at stake.
Like CB radio back in the 1970s, the CB subculture was underground and slowly growing. But as soon as people thought it was "cool" there was an explosion of morons. On every channel you had numb skulls talking about "Smokey" and "Good Buddy". There were also the assholes who would illegally amplify their signal for no good reason.
All of a sudden, everybody realized how lame it was and they stopped using the CB. Now it's just the same crowd using CB who was there before.
The internet is a different situation. Instead of voice only, like CB. Any kind of information can be sent out. Megacorporations see untold dollars to be made so they're going to make sure that every moron on the planet is going to be online.
Unless we stick together on certain issues (Like DMCA and UCITA) and put our differences aside on issues like Napster and porno, we're going to LOSE BIGTIME.
It may be worse than talking to a rock, but someone has to let these newbies understand what they could lose.
LK
Re:Freedom is a multi-edged sword (Score:2)
Well, it seems like a lot of people took my post as a point about flag-burning. It wasn't. I've never done it, and I certainly don't plan to, and I can definitely empathize with veterans who think otherwise, but I think it should remain a constitutionally-protected right. (Of course, it would be nice if the liberal wankers so in favor of maintaining the right to burn the U.S. flag would get a reality check and get some consistency and quit stomping all over our other rights. E.g., racial/gender issues, politically correct censorship, the right to bear arms, etc.)
The point of my post was a comment upon the original poster presenting his group of people looking for DVD access rights as wonderful defenders of freedom while taking a gratuitous swipe at a group of people who have actually put their own lives on the line to defend their country.
Cheers,
ZicoKnows@hotmail.com
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:2)
If any newspapers got hold of that article that would be a step closer.
Re:What we have to do! (Score:2)
* "If you go overseas you can't legally play DVD's you buy there and return to the USA without hacking the DVD player"
* "The law treats even legit customers as possible 'criminals'"
* "It removes trust in the consumer."
Reply if there's stuff I forgot to put in.
I was not there, but would be happy to go again. (Score:2)
If there is another protest in Washington anytime soon, I will do anything I can to attend, and help organize/promote it as well.
Ryan
Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:2)
Well, if there are some gnu around that see the falling tree and stampede, and some zebras see the gnu and start to run, and some Thompson's gazelles join the crowd, pretty soon there'll be a thundering herd. And the thundering herd sound is one that congresscritters tend to hear well (not as well as the sound of money dropping into their coffers, of course, but still well).
Kaa
Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:2)
It would be neat to do a more distributed protest system -- maybe on a certain day LUGs all over the country protest at their individual cities/colleges/whatever. It seems that might have more of an effect on the general population than one protest in DC. Especially if local news picks up the story.
Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:2)
I have been email the President, my Senators and Congresspeople about this for the past several weeks. You get a form letter back but you know you've been counted!
Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:2)
You mislepped 'HURD [fsf.org]'. Hope this helps.
Oh, and HURD doesn't thunder. It moves very slowly towards a point which recedes infinitely towards the HURD release event horizon.
Re:We should create a non-profit to do this throug (Score:2)
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:2)
I suppose "Linux-based DVD player" doesn't necessarily have to refer to a program that runs under Linux; could there be hardware DVD players that use Linux as part of the embedded software??? Bizarre.
--Bruce Fields
This story has been censored (Score:2)
The MPAA must have put the presure on.
Re:Making a difference (Score:2)
As far as interests and sympathies - that's something a presence in DC gives you - part 2 of a good lobby, a small group of people who focus on the hill, who know the people, and who understand what motivates them.
Making material relevant: There is a principal in DC - if it can't be said in one page - it's not worth doing. This doesn't mean you won't have 500 pages of supporting material, but a one page, bullets summary - that hits all the important points - will get you in the door. Many government haters can ridicule this, but there's a pretty good track record of distilling important ideas, like the bill of rights, down to their essence.
Also, be accurate, one obviously biased assertion or misleading statement will banish you to the second tier at best. Don't attack your opponents, state your own case (unless their lying - then you can point it out, but understand gray areas - if they're blatantly lying, prove it with hard, indisputable facts, if they're being misleading, make certain that your own argument is not similarly misleading to your end. Provide notes (links) for additional information. Finally, suggest solutions that follow from the original problem and your argument, 1+2 does not equal 5, no matter how much you might want it to be so.
I think I will write some more on this at a later date, with more time, more organization, and a little more thought, but that's an answer off the top of my head.
Yeah, I wanna talk about irony. (Score:2)
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The weight of effort (Score:2)
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You wanna clue? (Score:2)
Flag burning is about expressing contempt for some part of what it represents. I think it is worthwhile to express contempt for people whose view of America is inseparable from their view of the sitting government, and especially for politicians who try to pull the same stunt that these veterans are pulling. Thus the new .sig.
--
Is there a DMCA FAQ? (Score:2)
More than a minor success (Score:2)
As a group we all need to be active in getting information about the DMCA out, not just bitching about it here (Don't get me wrong I get a lot of good arguments from postings here). But we also need to be explaining this to non-technical people (I got in a long discussion with my Uncle, he was absolutely horrified).
Spread the word people,it's our most powerful weapon!
On the flip side (Score:2)
Funny thing. I'm not a very idolotris person - never cared much about crosses, stars, flags or anything else except as pretty patterns. I used to ride my bike home past a buisiness out in the country where the owner flew the absolutely huge all weather flag. Never thought anything of it - until the Supreme Court struck down an anti-flag burning law as unconstitutional. That was the only day that I felt something when I rode by that flag and was moved to give it a salute. It meant something for a symbol to stand for something more important than itself.
True story. Only time a flag meant anything to me without being draped over a coffin.
-Kahuna Burger
Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:2)
My uncle is in the U.S. House of Representatives for my region (parts of western indiana), and serves on the house transportation and judiciary committees (I still need to bug him about letting the DCMA slide through the judiciary committee - I never got a chance to ask him if he voted for or against it, though I usually find that he votes the way I would have). Anyways, back to your statement.
You are entirely correct. The standard, in congress, for email, is to have a secretary read them, and tally up statistics based on voter opinions. Almost never will the politician read email themselves. Snail mail is different; while most snail mail won't get read by the politician, some will; and, statistics compiled from snail mail are generally considered more than from email. I find this a shame, as it weighs the opinions of the computer illiterate more than those of the computer literate... but its how things are done.
Just my 2 cents.
- Rei
Is your Browser breaking the law? (Score:2)
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:2)
Dx2. However it is TV output last I saw.. I have seen others in the makeing. And one trend I see for the Linux DVD market. The decodder is hardware based. In alot of ways I feal its a smarter role. Orginaly DVD was not going to allow software based decoders at all. I have also seen a few companys who are WORKING on decoders for linux... Every company so far has shown off some sort of PCI card...
Another reason I think the group was soo small, 1 alot of us work full time and can not do such a protest on a weekday.. *Sigh* and ton of us don't live in that area....
Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:3)
I'd love to see that too, but let's face it, we're fighting a traditional, legacy culture: the US Legislature. We all know how clued in to the digital age they are, don't we? Using distributed tactics to influence the thoughts and opinions of that segment of the population wouldn't be very effective.
It doesn't take a whole lot of effort to write an email. I suspect most legislators therefore probably give a physical letter snail-mailed more consideration than email. Physically getting up and going to protest requires even more effort, implying how important the issue is for those voters doing the protesting. Hence it should, in ideality, carry even more weight in the minds of those whom the protestors are trying to influence.
Sadly, I don't think we'll see our distributed culture being able to use native methods of communication to make their presence felt in our Republic for quite some time. Hence, we probably won't be a noticable factor in the political landscape until at least another ten years has gone by. Just look how long after World War II it took for a member of the post-WWII generation, aka the "baby boom" generation to become elected to President.
Media manipulation for fun and profit (Score:3)
What do the media consider newsworthy? The media want sensationalism! They want IMPACT. They want to improve their ratings, sell more newspapers and the like. And what is best? Something that grabs the attention of someone so they watch this channel, or buy that newspaper.
So you need a bit of planning. A peaceful protest with 10,000 people is often good enough to make the news, especially if traffic is blocked, or other peaceful disruption occurs. But if you've only got 25 or 50 people, the protest alone will not be enough to grab the attention of the media.
So you need something that grabs the attention. You need a media stunt.
What constitutes a good media stunt? Look at what Greenpeace does. They sail their boats between whaling ships and factory ships. They climb tall buildings and display huge banners. You need something attention-getting like this.
Often, the attention-getting stunt might involve something like trespassing to display that banner, and it is inevitable that some people might get arrested, so you need a group fund to cover bail if people are arrested. And in fact, getting arrested increases the sensationalism factor, so you might want to get arrested on purpose.
The best stunt in the world won't do anything though if the media isn't there to see it. Don't post stuff on the web and hope the media find it. The media isn't going to come to you. You have to go to the media. Call the news lines of all the major media outlets in the city, and a few others elsewhere for good measure. Tell them what you intend to do, the itinerary if any, and what the protest is about. Aim to have as many television and photographic cameras there as possible.
Once you have the cameras there, the protest is underway, the stunts have been performed and the like, the media want to know why you're doing this. They might interview people at random, so it's best that everyone is coached on what to say. Have everyone issued with flyers as well.
Remember, too, that the television news media operate in "sound bites", five to ten seconds of someone saying something that they can include as a segment on the news. You need to provide that sound bite. At some point in the interview, you need to summarise what your protest is about, in 25 words or less. This is usable as a sound bite, and the television media may then choose to use it.
Above all, treat the news media that show up with great respect. It's often hard work lugging that camera around, because they often meet unco-operative subjects in their day-to-day work. Co-operate with them, and if they want to stand on the roof of your car with the camera for a better shot, let them. This protest is probably not the only one you stage, and if you treat them with respect, they will return the favour.
One last thing. You need to form an organisation. Call yourselves something like "People against DMCA" and always use that name when calling the media to tell them about upcoming protests. If you then organise a series of protests, use of that name will give your protests continuity, and will help your cause. Whatever you do, don't be a disorganised rabble.
These methods are used frequently by the environmental movement when they try to get their message across. And they have succeeded, because you've heard of Greenpeace, and environmentalism is now taught in schools. Follow their methods, and you will succeed.
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Re:Conventional Tactics? (Score:3)
========
More demonstrations (Score:3)
A live demonstrations shows a real commitment to an issue - even if it involves only a few people. It's also likely to be taken more seriously than a bunch of "Fsck you" and "Hot grits" emails which will probably only be skimmed and binned by a secretary anyway.
Conventional Tactics? (Score:3)
Why don't we use distributed tactics: Email writing and the like?
Re:Is there a DMCA FAQ? (Score:3)
timothy
CNN has a report on this. (Score:3)
Making a difference (Score:3)
[Also - I'd really like some feedback on this - both the RIAA and MPAA have alleged that there is a licensed DVD player for Linux - is this true? (and no "yeah, windows" jokes). If it isn't, AND you are absolutely certain of this fact, the reporters who wrote the stories that included those quotes would be very interested to hear this. There's nothing reporters hate more than being lied to. If the information is presented well, it may even result in a favorable follow-up story)
As long as you are taking the time to come out and do some Rah Rah (the term of art for a group of people 10-10,000 rallying on the Capitol grounds,) Why don't you actually schedule time to come in a see the congressional staff - the people who wrote the DMCA in the first place. [someone had mentioned that they didn't have much luck with this - usually the only people who don't get a meeting are clear crackpots ("the UN is building the staging point for a US invasion at the local community college") - if you could not get a meeting with a staff member, and you were a constituent, I would take a close look at your approach] One poster had mentioned hitting representatives at town halls in their districts and states. While this should not be discouraged, the end result will be the member going back to their staff, asking "have you heard many complaints about the DMCA" and when the answer is no, filing you away as a crackpot. Yes, the MPAA and RIAA are here, so is the Patent Bar lobby, but none of them are grassroots organizations, they represent business interests, and they are treated as such (for better and worse). [What this means is, the staff will take their (voluminous) information on an issue, and may take time to meet with them, but usually only if they a representing a constituent interest or company]
AIPAC (the America-Israel Public Affairs Committee) is often ranked as the most effective lobby in Washington by other lobbyists and legislative staff. Every year they bring 3-4000 members to Washington for a 3 day conference. This includes a "Hill Day" when members "storm the hill", groups going to the office of their own Congressmen and Senators. Offices will never say no to meeting constituents in DC. The AIPACers sit down with staff and push their legislative agenda for the year. Backing up these visits is the other end of AIPAC is a very intelligent, thoughtful group of academics who can supply supporting material for any pro-Israel argument a member or hill staffer would like to make. This small group is located in DC, they understand how to make material relevant to the legislative process, and they know how to target the individual members [interests, sympathies, security].
The point of this is, I know the tech crowd has some roots in the ex-hippies of the 70s and early 80s, and barricading the doors of congress (as suggested by one post) seems like a effective idea. [I find it interesting that the first poster regarded these as "conventional" tactics] Most techs are very intelligent, if not eloquent, individuals. The web is the single most effective tool for political organization we've ever known, and it's your domain. Organize and communicate. [Develop concise, informative materials that a congressional staffer can use to advocate your side of the issue] When you come to DC or NOVA, make time to meet with the staff of your Senator or Congressman. Maintain lists of members, rank their votes on issues - know who your friends are, stay in touch with the staff. Once you have the business card of a congressional LA, you can call or e-mail that person at will (or at least until you make a nuisance of yourself - be professional). Stop whining that Congress won't take a personal interest in you, take a personal interest in Congress.
If you truly believe that the government is out of your reach and it doesn't matter what you say, why bother to even come and protest? You should be hiding from the black helicopters by now. If you want to get something done, get involved, grok the system, and work it.
What we have to do! (Score:3)
These laws can change the way we use and work with our computers, for the worse. They allow the Microsofts of the world to become private dictators.
We have to first become politically active. Register to vote, and let your elected reps know how you feel. And then vote against them if and when they screw up.
Next we have to educate. The news media is not reporting this stuff. Maybe because its not sexy. Maybe because CNN is owned by a company that is also in the movie and music business.
So educate your friends, neighbors, family, etc.
Because... (Score:3)
Because it takes no effort to send an e-mail. It makes much more of an impression if someone cares about an issue enough to actually take the time to travel and physically show up somewhere to protest.
No matter how wired we get, I know I'd be more impressed by someone using up a whole day to travel somewhere than spending 10 seconds cutting/pasting an e-mail that they probably don't even know why they're doing it.
Not to mention that e-mails can be forged extremely easily. How do I know as a representative that 1,000 e-mails aren't coming from the same person?
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The Protest (Score:3)
The original posts about how small the protest was and how pointless it is to have a small protest only futher emphasize that it's up to you, the invididual to show up to these kinds of events. If more people would have showed up, then we wouldn't be getting this "no one showed up" feedback. If you care about the issue, go out and make yourself heard.
For most of the event, I handed out flyers with two or three people holding signs. Some people were interested in what I had to say, others not. But I was able to gain attention with only three people. If everyone contributes and makes thier presence known to another event of this nature, then it will be more difficult to ignore us.
I hope to be putting up a web page on the event as a whole by the day's end (I'm collecting media coverage and images and whatnot), so if anyone has any which haven't been mentioned yet, send them along to me.
Thank you all again for your support,
- Serge Wroclawski
You can't comment. Screw my karma. (Score:3)
It sounds like you aren't a veteran yourself, so you can't speak for us.
As a member of the U.S. military, I was asked to support and defend against all enemies, foreign and domestic. That means I was defending our country's interests, be they political, or economic.
Do you really think that as I hauled my dead friends out of the water after their helicopter went down that I was thinking about "Gee this sucks. Screw these Iraqui bastards, we just want the oil." I was thinking, "What did politicians get me into now?" Many of us risked our lives for what you call opressive or futile purposes. We didn't have a choice. We swore an oath.
I swore an oath, and I followed up on it. It's a hard thing to do. Try it yourself sometime. I swore that oath on the U.S. flag. That flag is a symbol of my oath to support my country. Tell me what's wrong with doing that. So, the flag means a LOT to me, and to people like me.
Maybe it's unconstitutional to burn the flag. Fine. We have EVERY right in the world to try to protect it from people who don't know or care what that means to us. Think of anything that means a lot to you. Do you go to church? Would you permit me to waltz in and scream obcenities at the altar to "express my feelings?" I doubt it. How about art? Maybe I don't like the art you created. So I burn it. I'm just expressing my feelings, right? I have the right to do that, right?
I don't have to like your opinion of flagburning any more than you like mine. That's the beauty of the U.S. Everybody gets an opinion. And, in the represenative DEMOCRACY that we live in, if enough people feel that a certain way, well then a LAW gets passed. That's what these veterans are trying to do. You don't have to agree. We want people to know what's happening.
But don't you EVER belittle our sacrifices as the judgement of the military. Try asking your civilian congressman or your president what they were thinking.
Maybe you should ask another veteran or two how and why we feel the way we do about the flag. See if they give you a different answer.
Contact Congress information (Score:3)
Go to this web site [visi.com] for an up-to-date database of congressional contact information.
- tokengeekgrrl
"The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions
Protesting. (Score:3)
Best of Luck!
Someone forgot to call the media (Score:4)
* They stayed there for a longer period
* Newspapers and other media were there
* More people showed up
We need a supplemental protest NOW. People will quickly lose interest unless those three conditions are met. Anyone in Southern CA willing to help set up a protest?
Protests aren't the only thing we need to do. We also need to set up a site kind of like the @dopt an MP site at www.stand.org.uk where you can fax and email your senator or representative.
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:4)
"He [Mark Litvack, the MPAA's legal director for worldwide antipiracy] added that there are authorized Linux-based DVD players on the market."
Is this accurate? Can anyone provide a link to a commercial or non-commercial Linux player authorized by the DVD-CCA?
Re:You wanna talk about irony? (Score:4)
You have to be careful about assuming that veterans risked anything "for your freedom". Many US veterans risked their lives to suppress the freedoms of other people (Vietnam), or to keep oil prices low (Iraq). There are no Civil War veterans left alive, but were you able to ask I'm sure you'd get at least two different viewpoints on who was fighting for what.
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:4)
He says, in part:
"Linux users are not being barred from playing DVD movies on their systems. The professor obviously is not aware that all Linux users have available to them a licensed application to do precisely that."
I believe the "licesned player" he mentions is also known as
timothy
I was there, and will be happy to protest again (Score:5)
There were a few logistical problems caused by, well, the fact that this was the first such protest the organizers had done. We had some difficulty coelescing at the outset and I heard some complaints about lack of proper notice -- particularly more might have come a long distance to the protest if given sufficient warning.
Still, these were niggling issues and I consider the protest a success. We had a lot of curious folk approach us and ask of the DMCA and why it was a Bad Thing. Maybe it's just wishful thinking on my behalf, but most seemed to come away better educated and rightfully concerned -- kudos should go to the articulate spokesmen who clearly explained what the DMCA was and its associated problems.
There was casual discussion of another protest. If one should materialize, you can count me in again.
On another note, the hordes of veterans seen swarming the Capitol yesterday were there to lend their support for the anti-American Flag desecration Constitutional amendment. Kinda ironic considering we were defending freedom,and they were there to, in a way, curtail it.
Cheers!
Mark
MPAA's VP of Public Relations says: Sigma (Score:5)
He seemed unsure about availability, though, and promised to send me more information. He forwarded to me a press release, which can be found on the Web at:
It says, in part:Sigma Designs, Inc. (Nasdaq: SIGM), a recognized leader in digital video solutions, announced today that it will
add Linux support to its new REALmagicâ NetStreamÔ 2000 card and EM8400 progressive MPEG-2/DVD decoder chip."
The Sigma Website [sigmadesigns.com], however, still says such support is coming "soon."
The company, and their plans to release a Linux DVD player, have been discussed here on slashdot before.
Re:CNN has a report on this. (Score:5)
What I want is a re-affirmation of the principal that if I buy a book/movie/tape/CD I own the book/movie/tape/CD and not just a license to use it under certain conditions as decided by the publisher. I am willing to deal with copyright protection, that is to say, "I will not re-publish this item under my own label for fun or profit. I will not make copies of this item and give them away, but I may make copies for personal use, such as archiving or interoperability." I am not willing to deal with, "I hereby admit that I have bought a license to use this item under certain conditions dictated to me by the copyright holder."
This is a fundamentally new idea, it recently saw its most obvious and egregious application with the late and unlamented Divx, but is seeing a rebirth under DVD restrictions. Up until recently, if I bought a book, copyright holders had no way to stop me from loaning it (or giving it) to my friend in Japan. It's my book, if I want to give it away, that should be my business. Suppose I want to do the same with a movie? The current copyright owners want:
1. Technological restrictions to prevent me from doing so.
2. Legal muscle to prevent me from doing so if the technological restrictions fail.
Therefore, I consider if I "buy" a movie on DVD, the people who sold me the movie consider that they still own it. Not just the right to copy the movie (otherwise known as copyright:), but they still own the actual disk they sold me.
Consumers rejected Divx, but the MPAA and its ilk never did. They just realized that Divx went to far too fast, and that they couldn't fool people into believing that a "gold" level Divx, which would play on your home Divx player.... as long as you kept your Divx account open and the player plugged into the phone line... but not on your friends player was equivalent to buying the same movie on a tape.
DVD restrictions seem mild by comparison, but they are still indefensible. There is no reason why geographic borders should be used as tools for censorship and price gouging. There is no reason why control of content should be used to maintain the monopoly of a company like Micros~1.
The DVD CCA may throw us all a bone, and allow a licensed binary for Linux. Heck, they might even give away a free version where you can view the source and just maintain their rights over it (i.e. give it away under there own license rather than GPL it, like AOL/Time/Warner did with the Netscape code). I would hope that the people who are against the MPAA and DVD CCA would see that that isn't the point, and that it was just, "Here, now maybe they'll shut their yaps and we can go back to screwing over the average consumer." They need to rethink their Draconian and absurd position on copyright, and return to fair use and a balanced view of consumers rights. Otherwise, I will resist them until I die. What's the point in buying something if you aren't really allowed to own it?
Re:Excerpt from my Comments to patent office (Score:5)
Your "blind reader" comment got me thinking of another analogy.
Consider a device that scans a book and outputs braille, either on paper or electronically. If these things are expensive, our clever blind hacker might decide to make his own.
If this worked the same was as the deCSS case, then that person would be legally prevented by the publisher from using his home-made device to translate into braille the books he's bought!
In one case, the translation is decryption. In the other case, it's a 'known' translation method. It doesn't matter! Fundamentally, you are translating the contents from an unreadable form to a readable one. That's it!
Let's see that addressed by the RIAA and company.