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Television Media

Sci-Fi Channel Picks Up Babylon 5 195

Posted by Hemos from the for-all-the-fanatics dept.
Schemer writes: "The Sci-Fi channel has acquired exclusive rights to all 112 episodes of Babylon 5 (and the 4 movies) from TNT. They plan to start airing the episodes every night at 7:00 pm starting in September."
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Sci-Fi Channel Picks Up Babylon 5 More

Sci-Fi Channel Picks Up Babylon 5

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  • Nice Show (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I really got to like the show after a few episodes. They took their technology for granted, a prop for the ongoing political problems of falling and rising empires. The humans were believable- still warlike, arrogant, and into profit and sex. The aliens, although mostly bipedal, usually had more than just a few bulges on their forheads (ala ST).

    Unlike ST, the shows must be seen in order with few missed, or the storyline will get screwed up. Each episode had a little adventure, but it was always a part of the bigger drama. They also had more than the same old characters, with the captain and senior crew usually staying at their posts. None of this "let's send the 1st officer on an away mission crap."

    The technology was just taken for granted, none of this "emit verteron pulse, save the day" schtick. Pressing a button never solved any problems. In fact, I can't think of any fancy button pushing or techno-bullshit in any of the B5 episodes.

    Unfortunately, I never bought the whole Psi-corps line, but it was enjoyable nonetheless. Some of the new-age senitmentality that forms the backbone of shows like Voyager started to creep into B5, with religious pilgrims, "techno-mages" etc. Crusader, the laughable spinoff, went straight into the ST line of scifi (pronounced, "skiffee"). New adventure every week with little overarching saga, lots of technobabble and button-pushing to save the day. I'm not sorry it was shitcanned.

    B5 is a human drama set in space. Not a space story that happens to include a few humans. I think that makes all the difference between it and Roddenberry's spawn.
  • ...then how come I have the complete set of series 1 to 5 on video (official video) sitting downstairs, eh?

  • B5 (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    the slashdot trolling project was a dream given form - a self-contained bowl of hot grits that i poured down my pants. thank you.
  • >BFD...Space has been doing the same thing in Canada for the last year.
    >THe real question would be what took Sci-Fi so long?
    >Of course, upon re-watching a lot of the episodes, I'm reminded of how
    >much raw ass they suck. Aside from the space combat, which is one of
    >the things that B5 has always done well, I find it excruciating to sit
    >through most of the shows. God forbid it's a "character development"
    >show, as opposed to some decent action.

    This from a person who's a fan of a series that brought Wesley Crusher,Troi and Yuppie Klingons to the SF world? Bleh,Bleh,and more Bleh. The only good thing that came out of the New Gen run of Trek was Q. And Q was an TOS character....
  • >The only good thing that came out of the New Gen run of Trek was Q.
    >And Q was an TOS character.... What? Q from TOS? I must have missed
    >that episode... Fill me in!

    Q was never a New Gen character. Notice how he never quite fit into the New Gen universe's mindset? On the other hand Q would've fit in with the TOS universe with no problems. I think Q and Harry Mudd would have gotten along just fine for instance.
  • I just want to say that this is going to be the first TV I'll consider keeping up with after coming over here (2 years). It rocks!

    For those who haven't seen it yet: See it in order. There is so much more storyline than other shows that just picking a show here and there doesn't do it justice at all.

    -Lars
  • Magel Barrett was a vocal B5 supporter, was a guest star, and went to B5 conferences.

    She also has been heard saying "Gene would have loved it". (See the Lurker's guide @ http://midwinter.com/lurk to find links to conference reports.)

    [Though you're obviously being a troll, since every episode of B5 wasn't about war....]
  • See title. Also, compare season 1 Babylon 5 to season 1 Crusade and tell me Crusade wasn't destined to be a far better show...

    --

  • Funny, that's exactly what made Babylon 5 different from most sci-fi shows. Most of them stink up a storm since they lack anything remotely resembling plot or character development...

    --

  • I'm supposed to take your comment about Babylon 5 seriously after you complain about Sabrina?

    laughable.

  • Wrong. (Score:1)

    by Lamont ( 3347 )
    Not according to JMS. His original plan was always to have the Shadow War end before the series was over. one of the main themes of the show was to show the aftermath of a war. Hence the series started ten years after the Earth-Minbari war and moved through the entire progression of the Shadow war, including dealing with the after-effects.
  • Of course, upon re-watching a lot of the episodes, I'm reminded of how much raw ass they suck. Aside from the space combat, which is one of the things that B5 has always done well, I find it excruciating to sit through most of the shows. God forbid it's a "character development" show, as opposed to some decent action.


    As someone else has already pointed out, the whole point of the series was character and story arc development, not space combat scenes. But, B-5 was never for those with limited attention spans like yourself.

    Incidentlally, the reason why it "took sci-fi so long" is that another network, namely TNT, already had the rights and has been showing the show for the past few years. But they relagated it to 7 am on Saturdays, so I'm glad to see Sci-fi pick it up.

  • Yup (Score:1)

    by Lamont ( 3347 )
    From Lurker's Guide, official comments from JMS:

    http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/guide/072.html

    jms speaks:

    One of the things about the way events come to a head and finish in ITF is that it's very unnerving...okay, *now* what? The ongoing conflict has become something you could count on, you knew the rough shape of what might be coming along. Now all that's kicked over, and you have to get on with the next aspect: making a new life.

    What interests me, what I wanted to do with making this show, was in large measure to examine the issues and emotions and events that precede a war, precipitate a war, the effects of the war itself, the end of the war and the aftermath of the war. The war is hardware; the people are at the center of the story.


    Is that good enough or would you like more?
  • You may want to read the Babylon 5 PsiCorps three book series, pretty good stuff....

    "Dark Genesis" "Deadly Releations" and "Final Reckoning" all by J. Gregory Keyes. Check 'em out...
  • I could be wrong, but I was under the understanding that the SFX were not at all expensive and that was one of the selling points. The idea that such great sfx could be done so cheaply.

    Vermifax
  • At least he didn't talk about his investments :-)
  • But my favorite trick of theirs is taking the non-broadcast channels that are part of basic cable (the cheapest level available), and therefore not scrambled, and moving them above cable channel 38, and putting the scrambled stuff between 14 and 38, so that older "cable ready" TVs and VCRs that only go up to 36 or 38 aren't so cable ready anymore and you have to upgrade or rent a converter box from them, and since that disables your remote, you can pay even higher rent for a converter box with a remote, just so you can watch channels that you're already paying for.
  • What was Automan? When and where was it on?

    sig nazi annoying sig follows

  • Sob! Mommy, the Anonymous Cowards are being mean to me again, make them stop! :-)
  • Well Time-Warner is the cable company around here so I guess I'll see you in the "Time-Warner + AOL worse than Microsoft" thread.
  • The AC speaks truth. The more you like a show, the better its chances of disappearing by midseason.
    What I want to know about the Sci-Fi channel is why it's a pay channel *and* it's jammed full of commercials, and furthermore, why do I have to subscribe to the golf channel and the hillbilly channel and who knows what else just so that I can pay them to see a channel full of commercials?!?
    Did I mention that it's not part of the basic service tier?
  • But since both are a sort of "Casablanca" ("Everybody Comes To Rick's")/"Cheers"/"Tales of the White Hart" blend, either one can only claim just so much originality.
    Not a slam against either show, by the way, I'm a fan of both.
  • Was "Strange Luck" the one about the kid who was the only survivor of an airliner crash, and was adopted by the cop who found him? On CBS about 10 years ago?
  • Compare Avery Brooks as Hawk in the Spenser series with his portrayal of the captain in the early DS9 episodes. Hardly seemed to be the same actor.
  • I can't get the Sci-Fi channel in Canada.
  • He has a way of just being able to turn on and off that accent, and it's amazing to hear the difference.

    I remember seeing an intervew with him in the second or so year of the series. He was saying that he could get into the character and accent when they were putting on his makeup, by saying "Meester Girraballldeeee"...and he was set for the day's shooting...

    -=Bob

  • B5 showed what Humans would *REALLY* do in situations. We help you, charge you, then offer you a maintenance contract. (;
    We really are the Frengi's of the universe.

    A real working, living Space station with commerce, space travel and adventures.
    And then a hostile take-over. (;

    -IronWolve
    B5 Technomages, Their only magic was Technology.

  • Mine too. Thier only magic was technology, and that was enough to scare anyone.

    -IronWolve

  • Now if they'd just pick up development on "Space: Above and Beyond".
  • Yeah, but "Infection" is far worse than "TKO"

    PRO-TECT!!! *zapp*

    Ugh

  • Personally, I enjoyed Babylon 5 much more than Star Wars Ep. 1.

    (It was annoying to have season 4 rushed so badly, then season 5 was really bizarre. But 1-3 were fantastic.)
  • The interesting thing is how well Peter Jurasik(Londo) does that accent. If you ever meet him in person and don't recognize him by his face, his voice will give nothing away. He has a way of just being able to turn on and off that accent, and it's amazing to hear the difference. Most actors will only slightly modify their voice for characters they are playing due to how difficult it is to keep a voice change up for a period of time.
  • I definitly encourage anyone here to help support the effort to bring the game back. I played an early version of it at a convention in late 1997, and it was loads of fun to fly around a B5 station model. At that point, they had basic network support, and had 3 stations of 4 people fighting it out in Star Furies. The promise of the game at that point was awesome, and I hope to see it in stores some day.
  • I remember reading, back when B5 started, that all the episodes were actually filmed in widescreen and would be available eventually on DVD, in widescreen, with extra scenes. Did this ever happen?

    *sigh*

    Not yet...

    Jay (=
    (looking at his calendar... "someday"...)
  • Babylon 5 is one of the greatest scifi epics to ever grace TV. Straczynski vision of the future of man was brilliant, and it one of the first TV scifi saga to show that technology does not change people but people change people. I can't wait until september when I can rewatch the amazing saga from the beginning.

    - Mark
  • Moderate me down if you will, but I just have to voice my criticism of the horrible computer generated effects in this series! B5 had an awesome story, and complex characters, but you'd think they'd be able to spend some more to get realistic looking spacecraft!

    Take a look at the space station in any given episode. Extremely simplistic specular lighting, artificial looking material! Most of the craft in the show look like they were made by a 12 year old kid experimenting with 3D Studio Max!

    Just my opinion... moderate me accordingly!
    ________________________________
  • Um, because he *wanted* to be poisoned. Or did you forget the influence he had over that telepath?
  • SCI FI picked up the rights to all 112 hour-long episodes...

    No, it just seems like each episode is 112 hours long.
  • Season 4 was supposed to end with Sheridan in prison (Intersection in Real Time).

    Most of season 5 was supposed to be about the Earth civil war, probably ending midseason. Check out The Lurker's Guide to Babylon 5 [midwinter.com] for more information.

  • Actually, TNT hadn't agreed to pick up season 5 before after season 4 had ended or at the very end of the season 4.

  • Season 5 wasn't written and filmed until season 4 was over because they weren't sure they would get picked up. That's why last episode of season 5 (and of the series) was filmed during season 4.

    I think the reason season 5 was as poor as it was (and it was poor, no matter what JMS and his disciples say, compared to the previous seasons), was because a) he didn't have time to rewrite and rethink the premises as much as he did before, and b) he had to fill up more episodes than he had planned (look at my other message for how the serie was supposed to progress).

  • And here I thought the Centauri were analogs for Czarist Russia... Well, I guess they were an amalgam of both.. .Maybe what the Roman Empire would have becone had it not fallen... Cantauri... Centurion.. Nah, too big a stretch.
  • Hmm. Perhaps this'll give JMS a chance to take the series somewhere real on a network that'll appreciate what he's accomplished.
  • "The Crusade" mini-series episodes happened after the Babylon 5 movie A Call to Arms.

    /* Warning spoiler statements below. */

    However, there was no mention of that in the article. Maybe it's because the series ended rather abruptly unlike the the B5 endings. They didn't find a cure--just a means to the way the virus worked.

    /* slightly offtopic */
    (Remember, that the first series (in syndication along with "Kung Fu The Legend Returns") ended with the Terran sun growing cold. When it got picked up by TNT, year 5 ended with Sheridan's death.)

    Crusade happened in the middle of that. (Chronologically) However, it was the last ever broadcast. Moreover, the cast of "Crusade" included almost none of the original B5 cast members. (FYI, Dr. Stephen wasn't in the original movie but served at CMO throughout the entire series and appeared in the last "Crusade" episode.) (Of course, I won't mention that really bad episode of "V.I.P." on which he also appeared) :^P

    /* Geek gene off */

    So anybody drinking chocolate flavored beer this weekend?
  • If they take off Lexx I'll KILL them...
  • Why does everybody hate Lexx?????
    It's a great show!

    Lexx is really just soft-core porn without the porn. All the bad acting and plots and none of the nudity and/or sex.


  • The Lurker's Guide to Babylon 5...is probably THE best fan site out there, with plenty of links, back-plot, production info, yadda-yadda... Well worth the click.

    Just to back up this comment, JMS (the show's creator) has said that he often used the site to check his facts in an attempt to stay consistent throughout the five years.

    skribe
    62.0% pure
    38.0% corrupt
    36.3636363636364% insane.

  • 7 PM in September

    ...All alone in the night...

  • If you liked the writing of B5, check out JMS' newest effort, a comic book put out by TopCow [topcow.com] called Rising Stars.

    I'm not really into comics, but liked B5 so much I gave it a try... very cool. If you liked the storylines about the Psi Corp, and how they get along with "normals", you'll see a lot of parallels in Rising Stars.

    Check it out.

    matt

  • Excuse me? VHs releases are alive and well. You can either go down to your local movie shop and pick them up, or go through Columbia House's RePlay and get them once a month.
  • Alfred Bester was "quiet" during B5's production because he passed away in 1987. :( That can really slow you down.

    Bester's novel "The Demolished Man" included a Psi organization that may have inspired the Psi Corps (though if I recall, it wasn't quite as sinister as the B5 version).

    Incidentally, Spider Robinson credits Bester with thinking up the names for his first two "Callahan's" anthologies (Callahan's Crosstime Saloon and Time Travelers Strictly Cash). Robinson's story "The Traveling Salesman" is dedicated to Bester; it features a manic character named "Al Phee".

  • From where are you drawing your conclusions that I'm a ST:TNG fan? I mean, here I am trying to be civil, and you call me a fan of Wesley Crusher? Sir, you go to far! You leave me no choice but to defend my honor. Q3A at 20 paces, perhaps?

  • Yeah, I remember when the local FOX (IIRC) affiliate had it first. They changed the time slot like every other week and never told our local paper so it could update the show listings, and worse they would play the episodes out of order which makes B5 darn near unwatchable.

    When TNT finally picked it up, I finally got to watch the entire story arc from start to finish, which makes for a much much better experiance. I hope Sci-Fi is planning to do the same thing. Maybe they can even resurrect Crusade if B5 is popular enough.

    I can only hope...

  • > "TKO" pretty much stands alone.

    TKO doesn't really stand at all. I'll give it "hobbles", "whimpers", "festers", or "oozes", but that episode would be improved by recording Star Trek V over it. Yeech.

    B5 certainly fits the old nursery rhyme. When it was good it was very very good, but when it was bad, it was horrid.
  • > Why to all the aliens have french accents?

    So you can tell they're ALIENS, silly! Much like the forehead bumps on the various Star Trek programs.

    Now go away, or I shall taunt you a second time!
  • Err, I think you'll find JMS offered B5 to Paramount, who turned it down, and then started production on DS9. Thus raising many eyebrows...
  • JMS always said he was filming in wide screen... I could only hope about the DVD part; but since he's a bit of a perfrectionist I would expect no less. Oh this is good news.... a lot of us in rastb5.mod were asking why the SciFi Channel didn't just go get the rights from WB sooner. Hopefully this'll replace Lexx. It would make for a great double header with Farscape (about to start, so I gotta get going).

    <*>

  • 0.
    On no other show would the female leads get together and host a joint web site as http://www.crusadebabes.com [crusadebabes.com]

  • My favorite ep had to be Signs and Portents. #116 (Though Into the Fire in Season 4 was killer on the gfx)

    It was a first season episode that got the major story arc underway... It was the one where the Centauri Emperor dies on B5, and Kosh has that one foreboding line...

    I've got the whole series on tape - except for two eps where TNT superceded the show with NBA playoffs (bastards!)

    This is the ONE (no hidden B5 reference, really...) show that would make me buy a ReplayTV unit... Having another chance to watch it makes me giddy - it's like a sugar high.

    I just hope that Sci-Fi runs the episodes in order. If they're out of sequence, the arcs fall apart - it would be a waste.
  • For all new to B5, those who want a plot archive and insider/behind the scenes tid-bits, visit:

    The Lurker's Guide to Babylon 5 [midwinter.com]

    This is probably THE best fan site out there, with plenty of links, back-plot, production info, yadda-yadda... Well worth the click.

    For the rec, I'm a HUGE fan of B5. It's a brilliant plot, even though it does tend to lean a bit heavy on Tolken. (Then again, Tolken leans on the Illiad, so NYAH!)

    B5 is the only sci-fi show with believable people, alien aliens, characters screwing up because of their faults, the good guys losing, people getting hurt - and staying hurt for several episodes, warm and touching moments, hillarious character banter, deeply developed personalities, teddy bears shoved out of air-locks, and an actual philosopy.

    The cheesiest line on B5 beats most of the profound crap on ST:xxx. "Get that cheese to sick-bay" my ass! There is no techno-babble about reversing the polarity if the sub-ionic Heisenberg compensators or any such crap. People hit computers to make them work...

    Ah... ramble-ramble... I think I'll go dust of my VCR, to make sure I can get those two episodes I'm missing. Fasten, then zip!!
  • The Technomages were covered a lot more in Crusade. They were supposed to have been revisited in season 5, but TNT had threatenned to can the show in season 4, so the plot threads were tied off sooner, hence the relatively weak season 5.

    Since TNT shafted Crusade as well, the Technomages never did get to fully shine. Too bad, they were yet another brillian facet of the show, along with the Psi-Corps, the fate of Lando and Daniel, the telepath war... Plenty of room to grow into as well, with the Great Burn and so forth.

    Oh, I sure hope this is a revival, and that JMS will get enough encouragement and support to consider picking up the B5 pen again. I can dream, can't I?
  • What you had initially said was half-right. The show DID mutate a bit, but the end of the Shadow War was exactly where it was meant to be from the start.

    The reclaiming of Earth from 'Shadow puppets' was supposed to take a bit longer than it did, a little into Season 5, with the openner of S5 being Sheridan's rescue from the Earth prison.. Follow?
    The end of S5 would be the brink of the telepath war, I think..

    The reason for the shake-up was that TNT threatened to kill the show at the end of season 4. JMS took this very seriously, and tried to tie off as many loose ends in S4, to not leave the audience hanging too badly. Then when TNT renewed contract on B5 for the 5th season, the plot was prematurely completed, and so there was need for filler at the beginning of S5.

    S5 was supposed to focus more on the troubles of the new 'Republic', with the Byron thread starting much earlier, probably towards the end of S4.

    But the Great War ended in the middle of the series for good reason, so the younger races would have to grow up a bit, and we'd get to see it.

    You really ought to visit The Lurker's Guide [midwinter.com] for the back-story, analysis and 'Everything you ever wanted to know about Babylon 5, but were afraid to ask'. :)

  • Babylon 5 (season 5, which I'm not sure was worth it) is the reason I got cable. And laziness (combined with South Park) is the only reason I haven't bothered to cancel it.

    About season 5... I watched my tapes again a few months ago, and it doesn't really suck. I mean, I stil hate Byron as much as I ever did, but it really isn't bad as long as you don't compare it to the previous seasons (especially 2 & 3).


    ---
  • If you are into the story at all, individual episodes are quite ejoyable, but are far from a complete story. As some say, watching the first few seasons is like reading lord of the rings. It's an epic. I don't WANT stand-alone. I don't believe you can convey real meaning in 35 minutes of TV. Unlike a soap-opera, B5 was thought out in it's entirety BEFORE they were aired. The whole story was written, it just took a while to tell
  • It wasn't 10%. I think B5 was costing around $800,000 per episode (which peaked out at about $1M toward the end of the series) and ST:TNG was around $1M-1.5M per episode. Everyone was aghast that Space: Above and Beyond was costing $2M, so there's no way TNG was costing $10M!

    BTW: The B5 numbers are quoted from Straczynski (back when rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5 was THE group) who was very up-front that these numbers were ballpark, and he was not allowed to go into detail.
  • Yeah, and what's up with about 50 sports channels I could care less about, which they include on the expanded tier, but they charge us for the good channels?

  • Difficult question, about the best answer I've seen was posted by a friend [deja.com]

    NB it does contain spoilers.

  • Ok, I know I'm risking my brother's freedom with this post, but I will make this an international story! So here is the anecdote:

    My brother subscribed to the short lived Babylon 5 comic book, in one episode there was a letter from a guy in Denmark. The guy in Denmark said he was happy to get the B5 comic even though he couldn't watch the series in Denmark. Unfortunately, that was the last issue of the Babylon 5 commic published. So my brother, insane Babylon 5 evangelist that he was, started taping episodes of Babylon 5 off of TV and mailing them to this guy in Denmark. (In clear violation of region coding! Oh, the villainy of it!)

    Ok, so, if there are any fan tapes of B5 circulating in Denmark now, maybe you can thank my brother...

    Now it is an international story, see... ^_-

  • Hmmm...

    Ok, how much better was Babylon 5 than The Phantom Menace?

    Would (a googleplex [whatis.com])*(a googleplex) be excessive?

    I think not....

    (I have to post this at 2... I'm afraid humorless Star Wars moderators will think of it as flamebait. Would it mollify you Star Wars moderators if I said Empire Strikes Back was one of my all time favorite movies?)

  • You can probably pick up most of the first-season episodes without prior knowledge of the series, although it helps. A background in the show helps to understand the fifth-season episodes, although I don't remember it as always being necessary -- with some exceptions, "Day Of The Dead" coming immediately to mind (otherwise the interactions between Leneer and Malden, and between Garibaldi and Dodger, don't make as much sense).

    Anybody coming in in the middle of any of the other seasons is probably going to be lost until they watch for a few weeks to catch up with the action. That's something of a drawback, because not everybody is going to put in the effort to catch up. Those who do, though, will be well rewarded.
    --
  • I never cought on to this series. I saw an episode, here or there, but it always just cought be as being a Deep Space Nine copycat. However, it seems that this assumption is actually fairly wrong. If what most people here say is correct, then it is a much better series if watched correctly in order. Thanks to SCI-FI, I'll be able to watch it the way it is supposed to be watched, which will hopefully make the series much cooler.

    Now, if only they'd bring MST3k back...


  • They may have exclusive rights in the US, but Babylon 5 has been airing up here on the Space Channel [spacecast.com] for a long time... every night. I've seen almost every episode. It's one of those sci-fi shows you don't really like at first, but later you get right into the characters. Except for all the Sheradan / Delene love crap. They overdo that WAY too much for my tastes.

  • In most American TV, each episode can stand alone. B5 RARELY had an epesode that, by itself, stands alone.

    The only one I can think of is, after the shadow war, he send the white star fleet to destroy asteroids (with the intent of the other races to believe the enemy is invisible to their sensors....but not the white star fleet)

    What episodes do you think could stand alone? Episodes that are self-explanitory, and could be pulled out of the series, and someone would feel that from a plot context-wrapup in an hour match normal American TV?
  • I remember reading, back when B5 started, that all the episodes were actually filmed in widescreen and would be available eventually on DVD, in widescreen, with extra scenes. Did this ever happen?

    Abashed the Devil stood,
    And felt how awful goodness is
  • there is a site that has all episodes and the plots of those episodes, plus commentary from JMS who write most of the episodes and analysis. I don't remember the URL, I'd have to do a websearch to find it. Anyway my advice to anyone is watch the entire series TWICE. The first time through, the first season will bore you. Things are really moving the fourth season and once you have seen it once the whole way through, you will look at the episodes in the first season and say things like "Wow, that doesn't come up until season 4 and this is only the 4th episode!!". You will see the plot threads that come together and probably be pretty impressed. It's the closest you are going to get on TV for having the complexity of a good novel. When it went to TNT, I bought cable just to be able to watch the show.
  • Its complex; keep watching. If after the episode "And the Sky Full of Stars" you haven't found you like it, feel free to stop, but give it a chance to that point. (its the episode where Sinclair is captured, drugged and has his mind probed.) The Lurkers guide is the best place for information: http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/ [midwinter.com]
  • This was announced 4 days ago! Anyway excellent show; finally you Americans can see it weekly on a well known channel. It is a completely different show when you see the episodes concurrently. I've watched most episodes more than 7 times and I still catch new information, in jokes and stuff. If you haven't seen the show before, stick with it; it begins to get really good frm "And the Sky full of Stars" there's loads of back story and you expect the answers to appear within a few episodes, but you don't get all of them till the next year! Heck there are things from the 1st season which don't have an impact until the 5th season. Talk about planning ahead. : heads home tomorrow; B5 videos ahoy!
  • That was what I liked about the original Star Trek as well, but to be perfectly honest, I find that Babylon 5 not only has integrity, courage, and human nature, but it has them in spades.

    I vividly remember the first time I saw all the episodes of B5, and those factors were what made it so good. It was a terribly realistic portrayal of a lot of what it means to be human.

    There were wars that had no meaning that went on simply because they always had. What about when Londo Mollari, the Centauri ambassador to B5, decided to give up his future, his freedom, even his very life, in order to save his people -- and right when he was finally where he wanted to be.

    Or how about Kosh being afraid of dying -- a "superior" being who had all the frailties inherent in every human being. Or G'Kar, a flat, one-dimensional character who wanted nothing more or less than to see the Centauri exterminated, who by the end of the series not only had forged a lasting peace between their two races but had also grown strong enough to turn down the chance to be ruler of his entire world.

    I could continue, but my point is that not only did all this happen and more, but all these stories were told and woven together in a way that made them all believable and made them your own. That was Babylon 5
  • To call B5 a Star-Trek rip-off is like calling one hard-boiled detective a rip-off of another. People sometimes forget that Star Trek is not the be-all and end-all of science fiction. Most people have forgotten that when Star Trek first came out it was laughed at as a Lost In Space rip-off. I mean, it had people in space, right?

    And to say the Borg mean anything, compared to the complex backstory in B5, is funny, too. At least the Vorlons and Shadows stood for the same thing consistently. The Borg started out as decentralized technology junkies, became cybernetic parasites, and were eventually turned into an insect hive, with no explanation.

    "Oh, my god, these two novels both have words in them! This one's an obvious rip-off!"
  • He became a photographer just because he was always in the wrong place at the right time.

    He doesn't just have accidents.

    But it was on Fox, but CBS.

  • The show was on Fox, not CBS. I think it would make a good "special". 6 episodes on a Friday the 13th. Maybe they can run a special of "Automan" too.

    Yeah, I know Automan was not real smart, but it was funny.

  • I watch (listen) to TV while on the computer. I have my TV on the right, OS/2 Desktop disply in front o fmy. WinNT notebook to the right, WinNT2k desktop behind me, next to my Linux server.

    I'll be back right after these few words, Input, Input, Input! ---Johnny 5

  • I was going to cancel my SCI-Fi channel. Now, if they pick up Strange Luck and bring back The Flash.
  • It was a cross between Night Rider and Robo Cop.

    It startwith this cop geek. He builds a program that analyzes data, that has the personalities of all the great detectices inputted into it. He hooked it up to a holographic projector. Now, with enough power, the program becomes alive.

    Automan has the ability to become as solid as needed. He has cursor which can draw. Of course cursor draws his car, which has no inertia. Cursor on occassion has redrawn the car into a jet and helicopter.

  • Why to all the aliens have french accents?

  • Simple version: space station Babylon 5 is a United Nations in space. Aliens from different worlds arrive to coexist peacefully, which usually fails to happen. Stuff blows up with increasing frequency.

    Thematic details: We start with fairly standard SF stories with a couple of intriguing subplots about the history of the B5 universe and its characters (Season 1).

    We then get the table kicked out from under us as a couple of the major races go to war and we realize just who's pulling the strings (Season 2).

    The good guys and the string-pullers begin to encounter each other in earnest. In the process the status quo changes cataclysmically for the good guys, and they find themselves warring on more than one front. Meanwhile, some we thought were bad become good, and vice versa (Season 3).

    Everything comes to a head, and I mean everything (Season 4).

    Time to pick up the pieces -- what is the universe like after a major war's end? Meanwhile, a repressed minority begins to flex its muscle, and a new world order slowly emerges (Season 5).

    For info on just about everything about the series, be sure to visit The Lurker's Guide to Babylon 5 [midwinter.com].

  • God when I first saw him I immediately thought of his role in star trek. By the end of the epispode I was ready to rip this guy to shreds... that takes skill ;)

    At the same time, somehow he managed to almost make me feel sorry for him at times, and he son become more than just the one dimensional character.

    And who can forget the whole 'psi-corps spy' affair!? Phew....

  • Quoth the poster:
    In most American TV, each episode can stand alone. B5 RARELY had an epesode that, by itself, stands alone.
    And we can all be grateful for that. The every-episode-alone facet of American TV is what makes most American TV mindless pabulum. And, yes, I am American, and I can enjoy mindless pabulum from time to time. But there is more you can do, and American TV rarely if ever does it.

    The episodes of Babylon 5 were intended, from the very beginning, to form a novel-like saga spanning five years. There is payoff from the first episode in the last! Although it fell down in places, B5 managed to achieve the intended effect: A world that feels real because (a) things affect each other -- cause-and-effect not being abolished and (b) things CHANGE. (This is the whole point of the first season: set the board, then begin clearing the pieces...)

    The greatest service B5 did for us is to show that television can be an art form. It rarely is, but it can be... Since B5, I haven't been able to watch any other show regularly (except ReBoot, and only when they adopted a similar interconnectedness). B5 ruined TV for me by raising my standards, and a finer service cannot be done.

  • I stand corrected with regards to Babylon 5 lacking depth. Since I don't watch the show that often, it was probably haste of me to pass judgement like that. The fact remains, however, that the new Star Trek series suck :-)

    ---------------

  • Re:Sweet! (Score:3)

    by Knara ( 9377 ) on Friday April 07, 2000 @02:59PM (#1144918)
    A couple of points of clarification:

    Crusade was about as good, script-wise and plotwise as Season 1 B5. I've noticed that people who watch S1 tend to think it moves really slow and don't really understand the value of it until they see the rest of the series.

    The Excalibur wasn't intended to me a small cruiser like the White Star fleet was.

    But yeah, TNT did some nasty things to Crusade. Sad to say that JMS was right when he said, "I'd rather stop it now and have it become a legend rather than continue and compromise the integrity of the series, making it a disappointment to the viewers."

  • Reality check (Score:3)

    by jabber ( 13196 ) on Friday April 07, 2000 @05:07PM (#1144919) Homepage
    Babylon 5 was produced on roughly 10% of the budget that ST:TNG had, per episode.

    Given this, they had decent acting, great writing, and pretty damn spectacular CGI. B5 had more original (meaning non-recycled between eps) CGI in one episode (I forget which, but I'm sure the Lurker's Guide has the statistics) than a whole season of TNG.

    Add to this that the initial CGI work was done on Video Toasters (and later on less then top-noth graphics worstations), and you've got a totally GEEKY show, made great through effort and perseverence, not a big budget. B5 is a work of art, the ST series are a politically correct marketting franshise.

    Just found this on the Lurker's guide:

    The B5 effects teams, both at Foundation and at NDI, use Lightwave 3D by NewTek and specialized software to design and render the visual effects. For the pilot, the effects were rendered on a network of Amiga computers; later, Foundation used 12 Pentium PCs and 5 DEC Alpha workstations for 3D rendering and design, and 3 Macintoshes for piecing together on-set computer displays.

    Considering that, it's pretty damn good... No?

    Also, the graphics were not poor, they were realistic, IMHO. Video of Mir and other orbitting craft look pretty cheesy too, due to the harshness of the light outside the atmosphere.

    Maybe what you meant to say was that the effects didn't look like those in big budget productions like Star Trek and SW:TPM?

  • The episode. (Score:3)

    by ClayJar ( 126217 ) on Friday April 07, 2000 @01:30PM (#1144920) Homepage
    It was "The Deconstruction of Falling Stars [midwinter.com]", and yes, it was good.

    Personally, I really liked "Severed Dreams [midwinter.com]". Delenn's speech was moving to more than the bad guys.

    Of course, then there's G'Kar's voiceover at the end of season three in "Z'ha'dum [midwinter.com]", which I actually had on my desk at work.

    And of course, "Confessions and Lamentations [midwinter.com]" was the most wrenching episode of anything I have ever seen. The feeling in Delenn when the doors opened to show her there with nobody left alive has haunted me ever since.

    No other series has ever had a moment burn itself so deeply into my mind as Babylon 5, and that is why it is significant.

  • Re:DVD release? (Score:3)

    by Sudderth ( 146030 ) on Friday April 07, 2000 @02:26PM (#1144921) Homepage

    The DVD release is in limbo at the moment -- as are, unfortunately, the VHS releases. IIRC, Warner Home Video released all episodes of Seasons 1 and 5, and some of Seasons 2 and 4, before putting the whole thing on hold. I'm not aware of any official word on whether the VHS releases have been halted.

    The problems with home video release of B5 are many. TNT pulled its support of the reruns, relegating them to 7:00 AM Saturday mornings, and killed the B5 sequel Crusade. So WHV wasn't getting any marketing support for the videotapes. There was the confusing release order. (I guess TNT encouraged WHV to rush Season 5 out simultaneously with Season 1 in order to get a fast return on their investment -- unlike the previous 4 seasons, TNT footed the bill for and first-ran the fifth season.) And, of course, B5 is essentially a 112-episode serial. Unlike STAR TREK, you can't pick up a random episode.

    So now that the general audience had all kinds of reasons NOT to buy B5 videotapes, Warner Home Video was left with the fan market... many of whom had taped the episodes for themselves... and, knowing B5 was filmed widescreen, were waiting for the DVDs...

    ... but without good video sales, Warner Home Video has no inkling that there's even a market for the DVDs. Classic vicious circle. Unfortunately, I'm not holding my breath.

  • I don't think it's entirely fair to claim that Crusade failed because we knew they found a cure. Babylon 5 has never really been about keeping the endings from you... it's how you get there that's more important. We knew from the first episode, ("Midnight on the Firing Line") that G'Kar and Londo were going to kill each other 20 years in the future. We knew Londo would be Emperor of Centauri Prime pretty early on but that didn't make his innevitable journey to the throne any less interesting, (I would argue it made it _more_ interesting). We knew Londo was going to get a keeper. We knew G'Kar was going to lose his eye. We knew the Shadows would come to Centauri Prime. We knew these things were going to happen but we didn't know how or why or the reasons they did. When it comes down to it, Babylon 5 has always been more about the characters and the way the journies they take effect them than the journies and events themselves. So I don't think it's fair to say that Crusade failed because we knew the crew would succeed. Personally I think it failed because it wasn't all that good an idea to begin with, but the Babylon 5 series prejudiced me toward a more political and character driven type of show and Crusade was basically Xena in outer-space.

  • And now.... (Score:4)

    by ajs ( 35943 ) <ajs@ajs . c om> on Friday April 07, 2000 @05:46PM (#1144923) Homepage Journal
    Here's the 10 top reasons that the sci-fi channel should resurect the currently-dead Crusade:

    • 10.
      • Galen alone is a better character than any other sci-fi channel character. Not because technomages are cool, but because he is more than just an SF stereotype. Yes, he's Aragorn and Gandalf. Yes, he's got bits of a lot of archetypes, but he's a living breathing character. Plus, technomages are cool.
      • ;-)
      9.
      • The sci-fi channel has some people (at least indirectly) who are familiar with how to integrate good animatronics into a science fiction show, and it would be a cool thing to see some of Straczynski's odder ideas put into play (e.g. the praying-mantis-like character from B5).
      8.
      • The bits of Crusade that TNT didn't f**k with were much more interesting than the bits that they did. This makes me think that a station willing to let Straczynski do his thing will reap the rewards.
      7.
      • There's a ready-made fan-base, as I'm sure the B5 ratings will tell them.
      6.
      • The sci-fi channel has good connections among teleplay-capable SF authors. This means that they can feed Straczynski with good authors and keep him down to those 8-12 per season where he does his best writing (e.g. see the first 2 seasons of B5 vs. the rest; still a lot of good writing, but not as many GOOD EPISODES).
      5.
      • They need a good companion show for Farscape (once they start writing episodes as well as they did at the end of last season, and I'm hoping that they will...)
      4.
      • A 4+ year show that's pretty much guaranteed to have interesting stories for the full run.
      3.
      • Sci-fi could use some good will among fans right about now.
      2.
      • If they don't Joe will go somewhere else, and do something that Sci-Fi will wish they had.
      1.
      • Two words: Lexx must die.
      • :-|



    Ever since I first saw Lexx, and every time I accidentally catch a little of it by way of the promo spots, I sigh and say "this is what Sci-Fi wanted in stead of Crusade." I can only hope that the move to pick up B5 is a trial before going whole-hog and developing Crusade. Fellow fans, let us hope....

  • God I loved the PsiCorps! (Score:4)

    by (void*) ( 113680 ) on Friday April 07, 2000 @01:11PM (#1144924)
    I loved the arc story about the PsiCorps. Having read Alfred Bester's The Demolished Man, I must applaud B5 in its true and honest portrayal of how a class of Psi elites must be set up, to control them, and how it eventually leads to them controlling us. Beautiful. And naming the lead character "Bester" is a very excellent tip of the hat off by Straczynski to the true master, Alfred Bester.

    This is the series that got me interested in space-opera again. Something that Star Trek, in its endlessly repititive episodes, fail to deliver. (Dons flame retardent asbestos suit).

  • Babylon 5 picked up -- B5:ITF next? (Score:4)

    by ClayJar ( 126217 ) on Friday April 07, 2000 @02:09PM (#1144925) Homepage
    Okay, this is just slightly off topic, but I think it's close enough (flame me if I'm wrong and I'll apologize personally).

    Babylon 5: Into the Fire was/is a sim based on the StarFury fighter in B5. If you haven't heard about it, it hasn't made it to life yet. It has now been dropped around twice or so, and a last-ditch effort to save it is continuing.

    If anyone cares, you can see the current status at FirstOnes.com [firstones.com]. If you liked the show, and might like the true inertial space flight sim (you can spin around in mid flight just like in space and the show), support B5:ITF now and we might even be able to convince them to port it to Linux once it's actually revived... again.

    (Just thought it would be informative for those who really liked the show and would like to fly a 'Fury. If you don't like this post, please just flame me and let me apologize in person; don't moderate it down.)

  • Babylon 5 - A Modern Epic (Score:5)

    by WombatControl ( 74685 ) on Friday April 07, 2000 @01:03PM (#1144926)
    As a fan of Babylon 5 from day one, I can say that this is news I've been waiting for a long time to hear. TNT terribly mistreated Babylon 5 after doing so much, producing the final season and four telefilms, then screwing over both Babylon 5 and it's short-lived but promising spinoff Crusade.

    For those /.ers who haven't seen Babylon 5, give it a try. Especially if you like the epic scope of The Lord Of The Rings, you'll find many parallels to Babylon 5. While Babylon 5 doesn't always have the production values of Star Trek, the compelling stories and characters more than make up for it.

    Now that it's on at a decent time, give it a try. You could end up as hooked as me and all my friends...

  • Alright! (Score:5)

    by Spiff28 ( 147865 ) on Friday April 07, 2000 @01:07PM (#1144927)

    This is the one show that I got hooked on religiously. I have none of the extra paraphenalia nor have I tried to extend its universe. I just found it to be a damn good show, one that was (pardon the fanaticism) extremely well written with intertwining plots and a human race that seemed believable.

    This was the first show I saw where I felt the politics were believable. Most of the star treks always felt like they assumed that going into space would unite humanity. Babylon 5 went with the idea that... 'ooo, space' and life moved on. Perhaps it felt believable because that world was as cynical as the one I live in today, but I really got lost in the show when it came on.

    Since I know we're all going to start mentioning favorite episodes, let me submit mine. I think it was called "The Deconstruction of a Star" but that doesn't seem right. In any case it right after the new alliance was created and everything seemed alright.. so this one episode sidetracked and stepped ahead into the future at different intervals. I don't remember all of it, but I know it showed the alliance after sheridan's death, a new 1984ish government complete with its brand of newspeak attempting to change history, and even a race of people without technology following a religion that worshipped sheridan and the alliance.

    You can bet that 7:00pm is now booked solid from now on for me.

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