India Enlists Teen "Hackers" as Cyber Cops 106
Popocatepetl writes "Apparently, you can get a job if you tell Indian government officials you can "hack" a government web site. This story is short on details, but may be interesting nonetheless, especially since the FBI is mentioned."
Uh.... (Score:2)
they can hack... (Score:1)
same in the US (Score:1)
Summer job (Score:1)
Are you all going to cry now ? (Score:1)
"Hacker is a term used to describe those who illegally break into computer systems to steal or copy information. "
Need a tissue faggot?
Huh? (Score:3)
What they fail to mention... (Score:2)
G1ve me a j0b (Score:2)
(woops, wrong kind of hacker.. P.S - learn to be l337haxor over at http://johncglass.com/leethaxors.htm [johncglass.com]
Pay (Score:1)
Definitely interesting... (Score:2)
I'd say stay away from this one...at least in the US, admitting to goverment officials that you're knowledgeable (and capable) of "compromising the security of federal property" isn't the best idea.
--Just Another Pimp A$$ Perl Hacker
So that's how it works... (Score:2)
So, where's my new job?
Jason
Brilliant eh? (Score:4)
Hummmm let's think about this one. How brilliant can someone be who would easily and openly admit to such a thing?
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do { Work(); PayTaxes(); Eat(); Sleep(); } while (alive)
Is this New(s)? (Score:2)
Can anyone confirm any previous examples of this? Or am I an idiot?
um.. I done, you can stop reading...
Not afraid to ask a stupid question (Score:4)
Okay somebody answer me this: using hackers to catch/thwart hackers sounds good, but is it really feasible? What's to say that little Wali, age 14, who built your firewall, won't share those techniques with, oh, say some kid in Minnesota who happens to post regularly to places like Slashdot, and so now your custom defense can be cracked by k1dd13s? Do they sign a NDA or something?
"I'm not a bitch, I just play one on
Why would you ever trust... (Score:1)
However, you may want to pay these people to hack other sites. Sites of companies in your country. Sites of forien countries. And I'm sure you could get them busy enough hacking on other targets for fun and profit so you didn't have to worry about the hacking at home.
I'm not sure advertising it would be smart, however.
Re:they can hack... (Score:1)
Suits are the same the world over. (Score:2)
I think the operative words here are "they told me".
I mean, the idea of co-opting the opposition talent sounds great on paper, but come on. (a) If you're going around cracking military websites, you're not going to go out of your way to attract attention to anything but your IRC pseudonym, and (2), a military website is still a website, and therefore vulnerable to script kiddies. It's not like these brats are grabbing the launch codes or anything.
YAWN.
OK,
- B
--
Age Discrimination. (Score:2)
:-)
Re:So that's how it works... (Score:1)
Re: flock of... (Score:1)
Maturity (Score:1)
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do { Work(); PayTaxes(); Eat(); Sleep(); } while (alive)
Re:Are you all going to cry now ? (Score:1)
Hack is a term used to describe someone who writes articles for CNN.
Re:Age Discrimination. (Score:1)
You're old?
:)
This is their problem (Score:1)
Yep, that's the key! If you have (a) firewall(s), you are perfectly safe! Log reviews, administrator policies, good computing practices - those are all optional. The firewall - that's all you need.
They shouldn't need a 14-year-old to tell them that it's that kind of thinking that gets IT managers fired.
OTOH, if they subscribe to "an eye for an eye" in India (I honestly can't remember if that's Hindu as well as some Muslim sects' belief), what happens to you if you hack a web server? Do you have to wear the company's T-Shirt for a week? ;-)
Wait... (Score:1)
Defense = Attack (Score:4)
I sincerely doubt a government is dumb enough to hire a hacker to put up a firewall which he would be extremely interested in taking down.
great article... (Score:2)
Since when did that become a crime? And who in the world would equate looking at pornography with breaking into a computer system or spreading malicious virri? I am glad Mehta cleared that up for me...
"They are brilliant. They told me that within five minutes they can hack the (Indian) defense ministry Web site...," he said.
"We want to use them positively so that they can create adequate firewalls so that nobody can hack our country's Web sites," he added.
hm... they tell someone that they can break into a government computer in five minutes. I don't know anything about breaking into computers but the security must be pretty awefull if they can be compromised by anyone in that amount of time. Don't tell me they use 'welcome' as their admin password...
that is a really informative article. India is hiring 15-19 year olds who say they can break into a computer in five minutes to install firewalls and configure servers? The only reason I could see to hire some 16-19 year old 'hackers' is to get cheap and semi-knowledgable labor.
Maybe they should starting hiring the microsoft 'temps' that are in charge of securing their servers.
I am confused... could someone explain why this article is important enough to be posted on slashdot?
-theman2
Re:Age Discrimination. (Score:1)
Wrong Idea I think (Score:1)
g1v3 m3 4 j0b (Score:3)
1 c4N h4x0r 4nD cR4x0r 4 r33l. n0w G1v3 m3 4 j0b!
v4xg33k
------------
a funny comment: 1 karma
an insightful comment: 1 karma
a good old-fashioned flame: priceless
Why is their ages such a big deal? (Score:2)
What the article failed to mention was that like the band Menudo the members will be forced to retire when they reach puberty.
--
J, Pixel God
My resume (Score:2)
3y3 4m iN73r3$73d i/\/ 4 j0b 1n jO0r c0mP4ny
mY r3f3r3n©3s:
aw screw it, this'll get stopped by the lameness filter anyway
-------
Pornography is terrorism? (Score:2)
"Hacking, spreading viruses are much bigger criminal offenses in cyber terrorism than pornography," Mehta said.
So in India, pornography is an offense in cyber terrorism? Thank god I don't live there! Damn!
HELP WANTED..... (Score:5)
Re:Age Discrimination. (Score:1)
Re:Not afraid to ask a stupid question (Score:1)
I don't see anything in the article that implies that these kids are going to be building firewalls. That, I agree, would not be a great security stategy.
But if they are, they're welcome to share their techniques with this kid from Minnesota who posts to slashdot. It's too cold up here to play outside.
Re:Not afraid to ask a stupid question (Score:1)
Also, teenagers in India aren't really like teenagers over here. People grow up fast in India - by aged fourteen they are often married while our teens are still fumbling behind the bike shed! And when it comes to discipline, countries like India don't muck about. American children I have met tend to be very undisciplined (though creative) while their counterparts in India have to grow up fast indeed. Its a different culture!
Hacking would be more effective... (Score:2)
Turning Script Kiddies into Cracking Narcs? (Score:1)
Just shadow your Unix password list, move the location of your logs, get a better firewall software and apply the latest security updates to your OS, and see what the logs turn up.
For more info please visit Hacker's Haven 7843 [geocities.com]
Re:Pornography is terrorism? (Score:1)
Re:Brilliant eh? (Score:1)
"j0, 3y3 c4n h4x0r n3tH1nG! MmM... p4p4duMz."
Boring (Score:4)
Wait just a cotton-pickin' minute... (Score:1)
Government: "If you can hack us, well hire you!"
JoeSchmoeHacker: "Cool! I can hack you!"
Government operatives storm in, destroying windows, doors, walls, etcetera, and smash the computer, beat and handcuff the guy, and haul his ass away
Government Operative: This is gettin' just too easy! Pretty soon, we'll get everyone who can take us down!
"Titanic was 3hr and 17min long. They could have lost 3hr and 17min from that."
Re:Maturity (Score:1)
Did they say hackers?? (Score:1)
Now i think they have the right idea about using hackers(using their terminology) but using kids to do a job like that isn't the best of ideas. If a 14 year old told you that he just hacked a government site would you believe him? I wouldn't. And also they said that teh kids don't have any crimal records, that means that they either have never done anything illegal before or haven't been caught.
Re:Brilliant eh? (Score:2)
WHAT THE FUDGE ? (Score:1)
Re:Brilliant eh? (Score:3)
For one they are clear about the difference between a "hacker" and a "cracker".
So, which article did *you* read?
Re:Brilliant eh? (Score:1)
Besides, what type of message does it send to have criminals working for your government? Would this not encourage more people to turn to a life of crime just to be hired away by their ever declining nation. How does it make ANY sense to reward bad with good?
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do { Work(); PayTaxes(); Eat(); Sleep(); } while (alive)
Re:Age Discrimination. (Score:2)
To qualify myself, I am 20 years old.
I walked into a local auto mall, sat down in a Mercedes 430 CLK loaded that had a sticker of $89,000 -- you know what? They knew I could afford the damn car because of how I acted. I wasn't dressed that nice. Wearing a black leather jacket, a pocket linux tshirt, a pair of casual pants and boots.
But, I act like I'm not some kid who is just there to waste there time. I was there because I wanted to look at a CLK 430.
Same thing with the Honda S2000, my motorcycle (that I bought in favor of the S2000) - I get asked, "Are you going to be paying in cash" more times then I get a cold shoulder while looking at expensive toys. And I purchased my motorcycle while I was 19.
The only time I get brushed off is while I'm looking at a $400 suit - ironic, eh?
Your the fool in this circumstance, because me and my younger friends (16-20) all have no problems because we know how to act. Take accountability in your own actions.
Oh No! (Score:1)
Does this mean that if I go to www.whitehouse.gov, I will be greeted with a front page of:
Are U From India?
ASL pls.
Re:Pornography is terrorism? (Score:3)
yes, and thats exactly the reason. The Shiv Ling [viskarma.com] depicted in consummate union with the Yoni ( vulva ) of Shakti (power), is representative of the most wonderful and miraculous feature of life itself. What distinguishes life from non-life, after all? Above all else, the ability to reproduce its own kind. If indians are to revere the concept that life itself is sacred- which even the Christians claim to believe- why is the most characteristic feature of life, the act of progenition, any less sacred? It is not only sex that I'm talking about here. It is the consummation of the vast and different energies of the male and female universal prerogative, of which the Shiv Ling in union is a symbol- celebrating the fact that humankind has two sexes, each with its unique attributes and qualities, and when they come together, they produce a synergy, they create MORE life, they become more than the sum of their individual parts. Many ancient civilisations recognized the wonder of this concept- including the Chinese, who represent it somewhat more abstractly in the symbol of Yin and Yang. It is a tribute to these ancient and wise people that they were able to perceive true miracles, true wonderment, in the very features of life which surround us in our everyday existence. They did not need to have some man walk upon water to see a miracle, nor see crippled people cured instantaneously- or, worse yet, read about it in some book and call their blind adherence to such beliefs "faith".
Brillian script kiddies? (Score:5)
Crack a server in five minutes. This doesn't sound like brilliance. It sounds like some script kiddies attacking servers deployed with default security settings.
Seriously folks, outside of Hollywood movies, cracking takes a lot of time and effort, except when it's packaged up and distributed to the script kiddies. Learning to use the scripts does take a minimal amount of intelligence, but the main investment is time to hang in the right usenet forum or chat room to search the scripts out. Grokking of networking dynamics or basic algorithms are not required to use the scripts. Once the script parameters have been memorized, using it is trivial; however, the change anything that breaks the script and the kiddies are SOL.
For instance, I have a nephew who considers himself 3733t due to his ability to crack copy protection on CD games using scripts he's found on the net. The dunderhead can't even count in binary and is totally baffled when presented with hex. I ask you, where is the brilliance? He doesn't create or understand anything. He just blindly copies what someone else has told him to do.
Even people that understand aspects of networking and the vulnerabilities of various OS' are not necessarily smart. Knowledge does not equal intelligence, though there is a strong correlation. I'm not saying these kids are dumb. I'm saying that 'brilliant' should be reserved for someone who can analyze a system and design an effective attack. The sort of analysis that take hours, days or weeks. The term does not apply to someone who can run a script, which is what the kids are relying on if they can be so cavalier in their claims.
Noting that, the Indian authorities still appear to be smarter than their American counterparts. Even if these kids are dumb as bricks, they have knowledge that is beneficial for law enforcement. Recruiting their help is very wise.
Paging JeffK, paging JeffK... (Score:1)
Re:Brilliant eh? (Score:1)
Re:Did they say hackers?? (Score:1)
How long is it going to be before nerds realize that their usage of terms has no direct correlation with, or influence on, the usage of terminology by the general public? The general public uses the word "hacker" to describe someone who breaks into web sites, steals data, destroys hard drives, etc. That IS NOT going to change, and it CERTAINLY isn't going to change because of whining nerds who like to call themselves hackers.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a nerd in many ways. However, I have learned enough about the English language to realize that definitions change and adapt over time to the way words are used by the majority. Get with the program and quit yer whining.
Of course, I still think that jamming someone in the side with your finger should be called something besides a "poke".
what a crock of shit (Score:1)
in all fairness, let's assume that these kids can break into computers and also secure them. they are still kids! they will abuse it, they will share with friends outside of work, perhaps for acceptance/favor. it would be much better, if the kids were hired and put under a talented software house so their skills can be developed if any into programming.
go get em (Score:1)
Would be funny if... (Score:2)
password:*******
We're sorry but our webserver is now protected by an army of 3l33t sc1pt kidd135. Your IP has been logged.
Thank you come again!
!DOH
EOF
Let me get this straight (Score:1)
Re:Pornography is terrorism? (Score:1)
Not that I have ever been to one of those sites...
Children are bad... (Score:1)
Re:Let me get this straight (Score:1)
Harsh judgement considering you do not know me. Because I look at a car that has a sticker of $89K doesn't make me a sucker. It makes me appreciate what I can purchase because of the choices I have made in life.
Do I own the car? Nope, I have a Camry and I'm buying a Jeep in feb. -- it's just fun to tinker around with a Mercedes sports car, but in realism the only sport vehicle I'll have is a motorcycle.
Now, that really sounds like a sucker right?
Re:So that's how it works... (Score:1)
Read? You mean like the article? (Score:1)
what are you getting at?
you mean i have to read the *whole* article before i post?
how come tacoboy doesn't have to read the articles before he posts the link?
what a drag!
Re:Did they say hackers?? (Score:1)
The same words can mean different things. If you're playing pool and ask someone for an 8-ball, it's drastically different if your in a crack house and ask for one.
A hacker is a hacker, a cracker is a cracker. Let the media screw it up, we can stil use our terms in our environment correctly.
worst article ever (Score:1)
Re:Brilliant eh? (Score:1)
Re:Age Discrimination. (Score:1)
And yes, there is such a thing as age discrimination against the old, although I am still young enough that I have not felt it yet.
One last thing: I would NEVER claim to be a "l337 h4x0r".
Re:HELP WANTED..... (Score:1)
Re:Age Discrimination. (Score:1)
When I see some 17-year-old kid whizzing through BSD at the commandline faster then I can loose at a game of Quake, I sure do feel it.
I had that experience when I was working on someone's webserver at $50-an-hour. This young kid sat down at the machine and started to make it sing. I told the server's owner to drop me on the spot and hire the kid.
Seems like most uninteresting news! (Score:1)
Like someone correctly pointed out, If they were smart, they would not admit to being able to crack the servers...
Leaving aside personal and racist remarks, people must have better things to discuss, wouldn't you agree?
But are they Certified crackers? (Score:2)
--
wtf? (Score:1)
expecting the technology to be more secure than it will EVER be. if you don't want it hacked, don't hook it up 2 the net. 8P
anyway, in the article, is says that they consider virii and hack related crimes worse than pornography. riiiiight. i think catching the bastards who post childporn snd snuff should be top priority, and not expecting the technology to be more secure than it will EVER be. there will always be those testing the limits.
i hope.
Hmmm (Score:1)
Re:Pornography is terrorism? (Score:1)
Not Unix
Re:Would be funny if... (Score:1)
--------
Genius dies of the same blow that destroys liberty.
Re:Pornography is terrorism? (Score:1)
dwon@zed:~$ nix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not
Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not
Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not
Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not
Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not
Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not
Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not
Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not
Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not
Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix's Not Unix
--------
Genius dies of the same blow that destroys liberty.
On hackers... (Score:1)
bahh.....
Re:Brilliant eh? (Score:1)
Isn't that what happens in the US?
Re:great article... (Score:1)
Re:Brilliant eh? (Score:1)
> and openly admit to such a thing?
even then... is someone who breaks into houses with wide-openned doors a fantastic thieve?
People that have nothing better to do than cracking webpages should do something more useful... (yeah, like posting on slashdot! )
State of Affairs (Score:1)
According to this story [globes.co.il] the F.B.I. recently arrested some script kiddies under suspicion, not evidence, but suspicion, that they were going to create denials of service attacks. These script kiddiots in turn turned over some other Israeli script kiddiots in an effort perhaps to save their own ass.
So ponder this question a bit and toss it into a conspiracy theory if you want; The F.B.I. who can track down the persons responsible for bombing the U.S.S. Cole can't keep track of script kiddies?
I think the bigger picture should be clear that certain agencies know damn well who these kids are and allow them do wreck havoc until damages of hundreds perhaps millions of dollars occur and then they use them as script kiddiot snitches in hopes of catching more morons to make themselves look good.
If you take a few minutes to view the cases at Cybercrime [cybercrime.gov] you can notice that most arrests occur monthly and the damage done on these crimes are at a very high price with the perps often getting little to no time as is seen in Coolio's [salon.com] case in which he's getting sentenced for misdemeanors while commiting felonies at an adult age. There is a lot more going on behind the scenes than most people realize or maybe care to know.
As for minors securing a network I don't see how exactly the intend on allowing this to fully materialize when half of these rootards don't even understand the meanings of IS-IS, IPSec, ISAKMP, CA, let alone fully understand upper crust protocols.
Theres a lot more thats happening thats not being mentioned here.
removing the dot in dot.com [antioffline.com]
Racist people suck (Score:1)
So what if they can (Score:1)
Re:Pornography is terrorism? (Score:1)
Maybe you haven't watched enough pr0n lately.
Re:Did they say hackers?? (Score:1)
Now the language morphs again. To the vast majority of people, a "Hacker" is an anti-social, unscrupulous, destructive computer criminal. And if the majority says that's what the word means, then that is what the word means.
Get over it.
Its NOT the Indian Government (Score:1)
Everyone.. please note that it is NOT the Indian Government doing the hiring here. It is actually a private organization called NASSCOM [nasscom.org] (National Association of Software and Services Companies) that is doing the "hiring".
Check out either this article [internet.com] or this one [sawaal.com]to find out that its not "India" doing the recruitment but an independant association
Re:Let me get this straight (Score:1)
Harsh judgement considering you do not know me.
Interesting way to think. Keep that same thought in mind as you go back and read your response to the first poster.
Because I look at a car that has a sticker of $89K doesn't make me a sucker.
You read too much into my post; being labeled something doesn't make you something. It's not your act of looking that labels you, but rather the salesman's acts of kissing ass. The instant a salesman wants to "be your buddy" or makes other similar gestures, it's only for the purpose of taking your money (that's not said in a bad way; it's their job). I've had no cash and I've had sick cash, and the respect I get for dropping a wad of bills is so transparent it's disgusting. It's a sad day when you first notice it, and a sadder day still if you never do.
next time, read what I said (Score:1)
There are a lot of teenagers who are stupid, lame, and think they are smarter than adults. I know becuase I used to be one of them. Now I am 20 and I have come to realize there is a great deal I don't know. If they didn't do their homework, they probably hired some of these 1337 h4x0rs.
so, to wrap this up, I never indicated that I have judged a single person by his/her age. Next time, if you want to make someone believe you have a brain, look carefully at what is said before doing a knee-jerk reply claiming a person's ignorance. Who is the fool now? God help India if they hired 'hackers' like you =p
-theman2
oh, and God help India if they hired me, becuase I probably know even less about computer security.
Re:Did they say hackers?? (Score:1)
My only complaint is with the complaining. I do that a lot, which makes me a complainer too!
*Totally embarrassed at my people* (Score:1)
Here come the Indian Cyber Cops beware or they will cry MOMMY!!! MOMMY!!!
People who want to start with me can mail me at cilkol@bom2.vsnl.net.in Didar Hossain
PS: I'm seriously considering the idea of collecting all information regarding the term "hacker" and posting them to Mr. Mehta. Any help in this regard will be highly appreciated.
*Educating Dewang* BTW (Mr. Mehta's website is at www.dewangmehta.com) ~
Re:great article... (Score:2)
Since when did that become a crime?
Well, we in India aren't allowed By LAW to possess explicit pornography in any form what so ever.
Believe it or not, we're punishable by 2 years RI.
Mehta is a DUMB ASS SUIT.
He knows very little of computers (from what I kno w of him) but manages to be clicked with the right people in the right places.
India is hiring 15-19 year olds who say they can break into a computer in five minutes to install firewalls and configure servers? The only reason I could see to hire some 16-19 year old 'hackers' is to get cheap and semi-knowledgable labor.
They don't pay them much except paying for their internet costs (which are pretty high in India).
The people in charge are b'crats (read idiots).
The real HACKERS (take the meaning mentioned in the Jargon File Jargon [tuxedo.org]) don't work or associate themselves with the GOVT.
Most of them go to institutes like the Tata Institute of Fundamental Research, IISc Banglore et al.
The next time you read anything about Mehta, take it with a pinch nay a sack of salt
.
Re:Brilliant eh? (Score:1)
So when did it become illegal, warrant surveillance or whatnot just because you admit you have the ability to commit a crime?
- Steeltoe
Re:great article... (Score:1)
thanks for the information, SevenSeasOfRhye.
I thought the whole thing smelled like a scam to get really cheap computer help and possibly to get india a little publicity for recruting teenage genius hackers.
I guess they will also save on bandwidth costs since the adult content is not allowed =p
Re:great article... (Score:1)
You're not off the mark by much.
We in India (the educated persons) are disenchanted with the government and 50+ years of freedom have got us not far from nowhere.
The Govt. does not have much to cheer for and neither do we.
To steer our (read everyone) attention from their screw-ups, the govt is hyping Information Technology and "Indians are so darn good at it" kind of crap.
The whole thing is a scam
Really intelligent Indians rarely work in the IT sector (yep - thats what they call it). Most of the geniuses do research etc. e.g. I know this guy who is 23 and he is an authority on the butterflies found in the Indian subcontinent. He has written a book and has tremendous knowledge when it comes to his subject.
It's not the Indian Government (Score:1)
It's not the Indian Government.
This group has been formed by NASSCOM which is an Indian association which claims to represent the Indian IT industry.
Amongst those of us who really do any work here, NASSCOM is well known as a publicity machine for
Mr Dewang Mehta.
This is obviously a publicity stunt and 14-year-old Wali will be out of a job the moment the headlines generated by this story evaporate.
Dewang Mehta? (Score:1)
Kiran Jonnalagadda
offensive youngsters (Score:1)
If I take a picture of my ass and deface the Department of Urban Development with it do I get the job????
[Press Here To Hack]
( ) AOL Screenname
( ) Government Web Site
Sad (Score:1)
This is precisely what would happen if people with absolutely no knowledge of computers come into such positions of power. But unfortunate bureaucracy and what not has made this happen.
At a point of time, this guy Dewang Mehta used be the host on computer TV shows in our nat'l television channel.
He is akin to people who think that they are technology freaks cool after reading wired, or in this case, after using MS products. In one show of his, he advocated the use of Windows as the best and most trustworthy OS available. Wow!
And the sad part is that all the good minds are scared to do anything. A lot of people I know are afraid to publish articles pertaining to sites with weak security for fear of getting caught. You may wonder why.....
It so happens that we have formulated "anti-hacking laws" to catch the so called hackers, and these guys are on the lookout for anybody even vaguely fitting the profile. You see, they have not even made a single arrest as of date, and so they're waiting for some poor curious soul to get trapped so that they can immediately brand him a damn hacker who tried to jeopardise the nation's security (or something to that effect).
And in the end, the ppl end up hiring script kiddiez for security? Wow! My country is really going to dogs.
"...Fear the people who fear your computer"