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Music Media

ZapMedia Finally Releases ZapStation 152

Posted by CmdrTaco from the convergence-media-boxes dept.
veader writes: "ZapMedia seems to have finally released the ZapStation. There is no press release yet but they are taking orders on their website. It looks to offer much more functionality than the recently released HP de100c. CD, DVD, MP3, MPG, WMA, WMV, etc." I have a model for review coming my way so I'll give a detailed report when I have time to plug it in and give it a beating. Like the HP box, it is quite expensive, but it has many more features. The real question is, at the price point for these boxes, can they compete with X-Box or PS2+Hard Drive devices that will be hitting the market and doing many of the same things, but far less expensively?
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ZapMedia Finally Releases ZapStation More

ZapMedia Finally Releases ZapStation

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  • I love the sound of /. articles in the morning... (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Sounds like failure.

    Seriously, they don't have any large partnerships to move these boxes into the home.

    12-22-02 Zap Media announces cutbacks in workforce
    • Actually they have a partnership with harmon kardon to manufacture and release these devices under the HK label.
    • Sounds like failure.
      Seriously, they don't have any large partnerships to move these boxes into the home.

      Yeah, hopefully this could become as popular as Neo Geo. Maybe Zap Media should form an alliance with SDK. Perhaps if they shipped it with a power pad to control your mp3s or some other wasteful piece of equipment.

      Seriously though, we college kids can barely afford a Playstation 2. Where are we going to get cash for one of these? College kids are going to be the aim demographic for this thing.

      Honestly, my financial aid check can't pay for this AND books perhaps reading isn't neccessary.

  • ogg support? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by GoatPigSheep ( 525460 )
    does anyone know if they will add ogg support sometime in the future?
    • Does anyone know of ANY device that will play Ogg format files? The Rio Volt SP100 and SP250 CD players look promising, with upgradeable firmware for "emerging standards." I've bothered their tech support a couple of times about future file formats, but they can't offer any real information, and I don't think I can hope for much. As about half of my digital music collection is stored in this format, it kinda makes buying such a device less than worthwhile.
      • it would be nice if there was a device that had open firmware, so people could write their own upgrades for it. I'm sure if there were such a device there would already be ogg support for it
        • Open firmware is a huge liability unfortunately. It would be very easy for people to write "plug-ins" etc that would maliciously format the flash, or other such nasties. On embedded devices such as MP3 players there really isn't memory protection, or user vs. kernel mode.

          For stuff like the zapmedia zapstation, the entire system is written in java (iirc), so they might as well let you write java components for it. They have like a celeron in it, and user/kernel mode differentiation, so having a plugin sdk would be a great plan for them.
      • Yeah!! I want support of FadSoft's FAD encoding too!!
        Dammit, why doesn't everyone support 300 different kinds of CODECs in their consumer-grade products???? Conspiracy by the Wintel cabal, I tell you!!
        </sarcasm>
      • I could swear that I saw one on /. a couple months ago, but the search comes up empty. So does google. Hmmm.. Are you sure that none of the new rios do it?

        You could wade thru the annals of http://www.mp3newswire.net/ [mp3newswire.net], which violates the first rule of web design (include a #@%#$% search engine!!).
      • Every device for the past 2 years has been firmware upgradeable. That's really not the limitation. The problem is that most handheld mp3 players use a small integer only CPU (cirrus logic 72xx family). There are a couple people working on integerized versions of the ogg libraries, plus there is at least one company that has a working integerized version of ogg available for licensing.

        The thing about ogg is that it is a more active format than mp3 or WMA. It'd be hard for a software company to keep their firmware up to date with the current version of ogg.

    • Re:ogg support? (Score:2, Interesting)

      by SeanMahan ( 533603 )
      I'm a developer at ZapMedia and we've already started discussing new features for the up coming software update. I can't make any promises right now but Ogg Vorbis is on the table.
      • This is what we all want to know: what OS are you using? We'll find out as soon as they ship and the first /. reader takes one apart, so there isn't any reason not to tell us now.

  • Um, $1500? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by raumdass ( 210351 )
    Did the marketeers at Zap not realize that any geek that would shell out this much money for a system like this could easily build a box to do all this stuff and more for substantially less cost? Jeez. $700 and maybe I'd think about it.

    • Re:Um, $1500? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by hoggoth ( 414195 ) on Friday November 09, 2001 @02:31PM (#2545053) Journal
      > easily build a box to do all this

      Ok, for those of us not as far down the path of enlightenment, how?

      Specifically,
      what stereo-component style silent-running case,
      what OS (like I have to ask here on /. :-) ),
      what hardware for TV out, Audio out, Audio in, CDRW, infrared remote control,
      what software to manage playlists on a LCD or on the TV,
      what setup to play files on it's internal HD or across the LAN on your PC or SAN?

      I'm sure I left out some critical details...

      I've looked at all the links that /.ers like to post for "how to build the ultimate A/V box" and I see more questions than answers! There is always some critical component left out of any of these descriptions that makes the spec "an exercise left to the reader".
    • I dont see why this is insightful. The poster has no idea about what it requires to bring a product to market. Simply given the cost of the hardware components on the device, there is no way they could release it at a $700 price point. Additionally, if you look at what the software does, this device is not targeted towards the "do it yourself geek" - it's targeted towards the more standard home user.

      In terms of what you could do yourself, it's important to keep in mind quality sacrafices that people make when doing their own projects. Specifically, when you do it yourself, you'll probably be happier with a less polished UI, a little bit more noise from the case, etc. Additionally, i doubt you could write the most important part of their package - the software. They have an extensive and well thought out software system on the device that would take a single person at least a year to write.
      • How do you presume to have any idea what my area of expertise is? For all you know, i could be the head of engineering at TiVo. For your information I am very aware of what goes into bringing a product to market, and bringing a product to a market that dosen't exist isn't terribly bright. I was not saying that you could build a consumer electronics product like this yourself. I was saying you could build a computer that provided most of this functionality for around $700.
        • If you were the head of engineering at TiVo, you'd have a better idea of the possible markets for such a product. I can assure you that there are people that will pay $1500 for consumer electronics devices. Additionally, you didn't specify "computer", you said box. Now that you claim your comparison was about "computer" to "mass produced consumer electronics device", i have to ask, what the hell was your point? That's like saying "oh wtf, why does a an iPod cost $400, when i can build a p2 with a 10gb drive for that much, and decode mp3 faster".

        • i think your point here is mereley to be argumentative. Comparing an IPod, an over-priced piece of consumer hardware, to a computer would be stupid, the two have very little to do with each other. The Zap deivce IS very similar to a computer and can be compared more easily. What the hell is a home PC anyway if it's not a consumer elcetronic device? A fricken' marital aide? You sir mereley want someone to flame on, so I'm going to go outside, away from my computer, and leave you find more targets for your venting. Have a nice "life".

  • Cost-benefit summary (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Brijam ( 242526 ) on Friday November 09, 2001 @02:12PM (#2544935) Homepage
    So what am I getting for $1,500?

    A closed-architecture 800mhz Celeron with 128mb of RAM, a 30gb hd, 10baseT, soundcard, video out, DVD and CDRW, wireless keyboard and remote, and some cruddy software that almost certainly pales in comparison to existing free software.

    Sounds like about $500 in hardware so far.

    You can't record TV shows with it. Can't upgrade to new codecs unless they release updates, so forget OGG. I doubt it supports DivX.

    If they sell 10 I will be amazed.

    -B
    • I don't think this thing has a burner in it. The site says that you can "record your CDs", but I think that is referring more to the ability to rip them to MP3/WMA.

      -PhilMills
      • You're probably right, I was giving them the extreme benefit of the doubt. Drop off $50 from my price estimate, and now I'll be amazed if they sell 5.

        -B
    • divx support on a media-player would be a godsend.. are there any players that support this format yet? Divx is going to become the next-big-thing format for pc's just like mp3 did, it would be smart for devices to begin supporting it (I'm sure an 800mhz celeron w/ 128megs of ram could.. my system is slower than that and I run divx's with no trouble)
      • divx support on a media-player would be a godsend.. are there any players that support this format yet? Divx is going to become the next-big-thing format for pc's just like mp3 did, it would be smart for devices to begin supporting it (I'm sure an 800mhz celeron w/ 128megs of ram could.. my system is slower than that and I run divx's with no trouble)

        I convinced my Digital Video Professor at the University of South Florida to use DIVX as the standard codec for all of our video projects. He was largely impressed and praises it now.
    • Yeah, honestly, dont dis the software on this device. I've used one before, it's really feature rich and fairly easy to use.

      • Let's say that it is really superb software, which again I doubt. But let's say you're right. Say the software is just the cat's meow and somehow improves on the one or two clicks it takes me to rip with CDDB or burn from MP3 using the free software already on my PC. That still doesn't make it worth the extra $750-$1000.

        Furthermore, if I don't like the software I have no choice-- I can't swap it out for better or even different stuff.

        -B
        • I'm impressed by your ability to judge software that you've never seen. I've seen one of these before, i had one in my cube at work, hooked up to my TV set. I know what the software is like. Thank you for your uneducated opinion on the matter, however.

          In terms of having no choice for software, you're absolutely correct, you cannot choose the software that runs on the device. You can only choose which device you want, and there are a handful to pick from. This is just like every other consumer electronics device out there.

          By thinking that this is a computer, you are completely missing the point. In fact, the whole point is that this is _not_ a computer.

          • Always glad to impress. ;)

            I have already made it clear that I am assuming about the software. I believe I'm entitled to an opinion, regardless of how uneducated you think I am.

            BTW I assume you already would have disclosed any financial interest you have in the company.

            But really, let me get this straight-- you are claiming that this machine *isn't* a computer? Are you telling me that an 800mhz Celeron with 128mb RAM, a 30gb HD, video out, a keyboard, dvd, etc etc is a 'consumer device' simply because it runs proprietary software and has a special case? Come now.

            Anyway, last time I checked, computers *were* consumer electronics, and have been for some time. I fail to see your distinction entirely.

            Give the device any label you want, call it an Ecosystem for all I care (oh wait, that's already what its called-- reminds me of a quote from the Princess Bride-- 'I do not think that word means what you think it means'). Call it 'Your Gateway to Digital Entertainment.' It still doesn't change it from being an overpriced low-end computer without the benefits typically associated with successful low end computers-- namely expandability, compatibility, and reasonable cost.

            Larger companies than this (3Com and Microsoft to name two without pausing) have tried selling low-end, high priced computers marketed as 'dumbed down consumer appliances' and failed miserably. The simple reason is that there is no market for this kind of device.

            Who is the target market here anyway? The average consumer? No way. Most people don't even know what MP3s are, and don't give a rat's ass about watching grainy video clips or USA today online. Most people are lucky to have the knowledge it takes to bring up their word processor and check their email on AOL-- not because they are stupid, but because they don't care.

            Given the device is suggested for broadband (or it requires a home network), and broadband's extremely low market penetration, there is only one possible target, the technically sophisticated user. This device does not appeal to that segment. Period.

            No, I'm afraid it is you and some non-technical investors who unfortunately threw their money away who are missing the point.

            -B
            • I have no financial interest in zapmedia. At most i have a technological one, since my company has worked on similar products. But there's no partnerships or propreitary information here.

              Yes, you are indeed entitled to your opinion, however, my original comment was that you didn't really deserve the moderation you got for your opinion, because it was baseless.

              Yes, i am claiming this device is *not* a computer because it is prepackaged and targeted towards a specific use. A computer as the world currently knows it is a general purpose device capable of running a variety of software; this is a purpose built device capable of running the zapmedia software. Additionally, computers are not consumer electronics devices. If they were, dont you think you could go to CES in January and see the latest lineup of computers from Dell? Also, computers crash. When was the last time your VCR or tuner crashed?

              In terms of it being underpowered, you are fixated on what you can buy the components for on the street. I dont really see what the point is here though - you're not going to run custom software on it, and their software runs really well on their hardware (this is another difference between consumer electronics devices and computers).

              With 3Com they were trying to sell the kerbango device (what did they call it, audrey i think), and it was ugly and proprietary - it only played RealAudio, didn't have a very good UI or screen, and i personally would have been embarrassed to own one. Note all the issues with the device have nothing to do with what kind of internals it had - the whole point is you dont need to know that.

              At this point, i think i'm done. Your complete lack of understand of the point of such a device, misrepresentation of technical details (do you even know how many people in america have broadband?), and failure to recognize the value of this device (which is the software, not the hardware that you can go buy on the street) make it impossible to carry any sort of reasonable discussion with you.
              • Interesting you had access to a pre-release version of the device yet you have no financial interest or ties to Zapmedia. So Zapmedia provides their potential competitors access to their products before shipping? That is an interesting business strategy.

                In point of fact, your original comment had nothing to do with the modding of the post, but was specifically directed to my opinion of the quality of the software in the device, sight unseen.

                Video game consoles like PlayStation, Xbox, and Dreamcast aren't at CES either, does that mean they aren't consumer devices? Or computers for that matter? How naive you are. The reason computers aren't exhibited at CES is because there are too many computer manufacturers-- they find it more useful to go to Comdex, just as the Game industry prefers E3.

                Your idea of what a computer is does not agree with the dictionary.
                (see http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=com puter -remove the space-). Prepackaged and targeted to a specific use? So are Dell systems.

                Of course I'm fixated on the components and their street value -- I'm a consumer, not a charity! I need to see value in anything I buy, particulary consumer electronics. The reason I won't buy it, and the reason nobody will buy it, is because of its proprietary nature.

                You think that is a benefit. It isn't. It is a shortcoming. Even if, as you say, the software runs 'really well'. What if I want to transfer the audio to my 20gig portable MP3 player? What if I think USAToday worse than useless and I want to change to Slashdot? What if I want to watch something more than a cheesy marketing video clip, say a real movie or tv show? I'd have to buy another consumer electronics device, aka a personal computer that gives me this flexibility.

                And incidentally, my computer doesn't crash. I run Linux. You should try it sometime. Oh, I get the occasional unexpected program exit, sure, but its more than worth putting up with for the power and flexibility it provides out of the box.

                To claim that a consumer doesn't need to know what the internals of a device is in order to make a purchasing decision is patently absurd. Anyone with even the tiniest bit of experience in marketing consumer electronics or even basic observational skills knows that high-end consumer electronics buyers, the kind that might shell out $1,500 for a gadget, are technophiles that drool over every last technical detail. There are many segments of this demographic, but all of them are highly, highly focused on technical details, and, incidentally, value.

                Its funny that the reasons you cite for Kerbango's failure (not Audrey, that was something different as I recall) are exactly the same ones that are going to kill the Zapmedia product. Its proprietary (USAToday?? I'd be laughed out of my house if I was doing the geek techno demo of this unit and up popped USAToday. No DivX, no OGG), relies on a suboptimal TV screen for display, which proved a massive failure with WebTV and is certain to do so with this.

                Last time it was important to me to look at broadband adoption rates was a year ago. The rate was in the single digits at the time, hardly the kind of penetration one needs for massive success with consumer electronics. This article
                (http://www.ecmag.net/Magazine/Editorial/ECedito ri al9_01.html -remove the space-) dated Sept/2001, the first thing that came up on a Google search, backs up my point.

                Your argument that the value of the device lies in the software may be correct, I haven't seen the software. However, there is no software meant for personal use worth $1000 that exists today. The reason for this is because people won't pay it. It doesn't matter how much you may think it is worth, people will not pay it.

                I'm astounded that you can continue to think this device has a chance at all in the market. Furthermore, I've yet to see anything but hot air to back up your points. I'll take your lack of future response as acknowledgement that you were wrong.

                -B

  • 12 minutes... (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    This article isn't garnering the usual amount of posts.

    Could it be because all the geeks are scratching their heads wondering why they didn't think of sticking a 800MHz Celeron and 128M RAM into a box and sell it for $1500? You could build this system with OTS parts and still make a mint. (If anyone was stupid enough to actually shell out for such an overpriced, underpowered system.)
    • To get the same functionality you will have to stick in Microsoft Windows for $200 and add a DVD player package for $20-$40. As much as I like Linux I haven't been the least bit impressed with DVD playback.
    • Yeah, except most OTS parts you buy sell at 5-10% margins, whereas consumer electronics devices sell at much higher margins. Additionally OTS parts are more likely to be spot buys, or inventory clearing. If you tried to make 50,000 of these devices you wouldn't be able to get OTS pricing.

  • For less than $1500 I can build a budget box with TV out and Ethernet cards. I could even build it in a component box so it has the right "look". They need to price this lower to attract my interest.
    • MEMORANDUM
      To: All ZapMedia Employees
      From: CEO, ZapMedia, Inc.
      Date: November 9, 2001
      Re: Picass0 does not like our product

      Dear employees of ZapMedia,

      Over the last few years, we have yearned to make a product that allows home users to easily play a wide range of media. Today we have released our ZapStation flagship product. However, there is a critical flaw in our design. A user on the popular Internet forum "Slash-Dot" known only as "Picass0" does not like the product.

      We plan on launching a full-scale investigation into the dissatisfaction. The ZapStation 2000, our successor product, will likely be a full-tower case with seventeen drive bays and an eighty-gigabyte hard drive with Linux preloaded. We will also offer users the choice of twenty different operating systems (FreeBSD, Windows, and eighteen distributions of Linux) to appease all Slash-Dot users. We will also be forced to lower the cost of our hard-ware to $149.99, and include free shipping.

      In unrelated news, I have noticed an overweight, pot-smoking, foul-smelling person in the parking lot shouting "Free software!" and poorly singing a song which sounds like "Sadi Moma." Security has been notified.

      Sincerely,
      Your CEO

      • A user on the popular Internet forum "Slash-Dot" known only as "Picass0" does not like the product.

        Besides dripping with sarcasm, you post is also incorrect.

        I did not say I do not like the product. I just ask the question "Where's the advantage in doing this?" It's a rather high price point for a set top, and It doesn't sound like much more than a plain-label Tivo with some codec support. A Tivo goes for ~$400 last time I was at Best Buy, so I see $1100 going for --- ???

        For $1100 dollars I can continue my hippie lifestyle for a year, going from one computer store to the next harrasing windows users without ever showering. I could be just like RMS.

        I still encourage you to send you post to ZapMedia.

        Groovy man...
      • I'm not sure if you were trying to be funny, or a troll. Either way, it sucked. Read first, then post. Most of the gibberish you posted had nothing to do with his sentiment.

        There is no reason for a box this expensive. The major target market isn't going to spend that much on it when they go, "Well, I got a computer to do half and an entertainment to do half" and realize dropping over a grand to do it in one place isn't a good move. That's what I interpreted his point as, plus the additional I'm-a-techy-I-can-h4x0r-it philosophy which is great.

        Score: -1, Dumbass.
  • (Yes, I'll probably get mod'd way down for this but I stand by what I say.)

    No press release, no review, nothing but them taking orders. How much did they pay VA/. to post this? I mean, any of us could have found this, gone to their website, and read their marketing literature. Where's the beef?
  • One of my former roommates works at Microsoft now in the Windows Media division. He said that, although he can't attest to malicious/anticompetitive conduct on the part of his employer, the WM division was very slow in delivering the specs and code that the ZapMedia people needed to support the WM[AV] formats. Supposedly, the ZapStation was ready sans WM support several months ago, and was held up mostly by licensing and delivery delays on Microsoft's end.

    I'm not trying to imply a conspiracy, but isn't it interesting that Microsoft may have been withholding critical information to give the Xbox a leg up? Something tells me that they are still concerned about the Xbox's success in the marketplace, even when competing with more expensive rivals. I guess that's just one of the risks of letting a single company control so much technology.

    -CT

    • Given they make such a point of internet-donwloadable upgrades, why didn't they release early, and upgrade when ready?

      They didn't _need_ WM* support out-of-the-box...
    • what does xbox have to do with zapstation ?

      The two are absolutely in no way competitors.

      i beleive licensing delays and what not, but that would be a function of the MS legal department... you of course know how "efficient" the legal system is (when you're not wrongfully sueing or imprisoning someone, anyway)
      • The two are absolutely in no way competitors.

        A web browser, such as Netscape was never supposed to be a competitor with Windows. But everyone somehow had downloaded a copy of Netscape on their desktop.

        Microsoft follows the money and takes it accordingly.
        • A web browser, such as Netscape was never supposed to be a competitor with Windows

          Obviously you don't remember the rhetoric streaming out of mcom.com about "rendering windows irrelevant". They were working on that desktop integration that everyone crucified microsoft for before MS had finished reading the code they had just licensed from Spyglass.
    • XBox isn't going to compete. The XBox isn't an MP3/MPG/DVD/whatever playback unit. It's a game machine that can rip songs soley for the purpose of playing in games. Microsoft doesn't want to turn it into an MP3 playing machine. With an 8GB drive you'd fill it up pretty fast.
  • From their website:

    What can it do? The short version:


    Play streaming audio/video, MP3, and CDs and DVDs
    Store up to 10,000 songs or 20 hours of digital video
    Browse the Internet through your television
    Record CDs to your ZapStation local hard drive
    Create Playlists of your favorite songs
    Organize and manage your digital multimedia assets
    Download and stream audio and video content from ZapZone
    Access and listen to Internet Radio stations
    Access news and information from USA TODAY in a madefor TV format.
    Enjoy all this from the comfort of your living room with a user- friendly remote control


    But I have TV out on my PC's video card, and it's 2 feet away from my TV. So I can do all these things already. (and more - I can burn CD's onto CD-R's!!! Hah!)
    OK - so I can't access their "zap zone" - So that's why I have gnutella.

    I guess this is a nifty piece of hardware for the great unwashed who have too much money.

  • The hp unit sucked most because it has DRM, anyone know what, if any, DRM this unit has?

    • Re:DRM? (Score:1)

      by mdh ( 28855 )
      The ZapStation does not currently support any DRM. If this is something high on your list, please contact customer support. ;-)
  • 800 MHz Celeron? What were they thinking?


    It says that it records video. But I couldn't figure out if that was just from their ZapMedia portal or from one's cable TV. If it did that, recorded to DVD, and had integrated TV-Guide like behavior, I'd buy one.


    As it is (with that $1,500 price, yikes!), it's doomed to failure.

  • DVD and no 5.1? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by YuppieScum ( 1096 ) on Friday November 09, 2001 @02:19PM (#2544988) Journal
    How can a contemporary DVD player ship without some form of 5.1 - either Dolby or DTS?

    And you can't play MP3s from your network - only from the box itself...

    No Tivo-like functionality either...

    And for how much??? I don't think so...

  • Already Dead (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Q. Can you ship the ZapStation internationally?
    A. The ZapStation is currently available and operable only in the US.

    Sounds like this company doesn't know about the internet. You know, the thing that lets us Canadians view American content and buy American devices?

    And what about all you people from Europe, Asia, etc? Doesn't this irk you a little? How can a company be so shortsighted?

    Anything this expensive, so niche, and only marketed to less than a few percent of its potential customers is doomed before it leaves the door.

    It's been dead before it even got up.
    • You are 100% correct, sir. The ZapStation will work just fine in Canada. As soon as we are certain that we have all the required permits and certifications we will send it there.

      Europe will take a lot longer. The standards there are quite different. Canada and the US are almost identical as far as certifications go.

  • A good PC setup? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by truthsearch ( 249536 ) on Friday November 09, 2001 @02:25PM (#2545020) Homepage Journal
    I have an old PC running Linux that I'd love to set up to handle all of my multimedia. I have it networked to my DSL, so it'll have internet access. I have 2 real problems, however:
    • How can I have a comprehensive user interface to control all media? And of course it would use all of the latest libraries.
    • How can I set up a remote control to the PC?
    Of course I could write a program to handle every media type I'm interested in with a nice GUI, but I definitely don't have the time or knowledge of the libraries. The remote is probably just a technicality that I could find out more about (generic remote, buy an IR reader connected to serial port, etc). But without loading 100 different programs and user interfaces, does anyone know how or where to find a nice GUI to handle everything? Because that's really the only benefit I see in their product: usability. It would be a fun hack to mimick that with an old PC.
    • A comprehensive UI? What about your favorite wm in X? I've been thinking about getting a PC for my entertainment center for the same purposes and the only hurdle I see is how to physically control it. However, the solution is quite simple - use a wireless mouse. Whenever you need to use your entertainment PC, switch your receiver's video input and then just USE the PC.

      Actually, the only real hurdle is making the PC look like it belongs in my entertainment center.

      - MayorQ

      • But that's just it. The remote's not a big deal. In fact, I really like your wireless mouse idea. And a few posters below mention IR methods.

        I do use X (I like KDE). But in no matter what wm or desktop I use, there's a plethora of disperse apps to control all multimedia. Want to play MP3s or CDs, load XMMS. Want full audio volume controls for every a/v connection, load KMix. Want to play a DVD, load your DVD software. Want streaming audio, load something else.

        It would be great, just for this purpose, to have one nice, clean app which takes up the whole screen and has everything layed out. All simple controls are layed out like a huge remote with easy-to-find buttons and graphics. One "Next Track" button that works with whatever you're running (CD track, MP3 playlist, or DVD chapter, whatever). Press a CD button and press play. Press the MP3 button and use the same play button to start it. A nice, clean common interface. Looks like I'll be staying up late trying to write it myself.
      • I have been thinking about the 'case' problem... Why not gut an old audio component and even potentially use some of the hardware (i.e. knobs and the like)
    • GUI: code yourself (sorry)

      remote:
      watcha think about one of these
      fancy webtablets hooked up via wireless
      LAN and remote X??? Yummy!!!
      (OK, old crappy laptop will do)

      Or hook your media server up to the TV
      and use a wireless keyboard and mouse...:-)

      one of these days I will put some time aside
      and do exactly that...:-)
    • For the remote you can always use the good ole X10 mouse remote. [x10.com]
    • You can setup remote control of your PC with an IRman from Evation [evation.com]. I use this to control xmms, there is a plug in so it's trivial to setup. You can also setup a much more complex IR gateway using software from LIRC [lirc.org]. This will allow you to map IR input to shell scripts.

      For IR output I quite like the RedRat2 as an IR driver. I wrote some GUI software for it, initially to drive my ReplayTV, but eventually to drive my whole A/V stack. See Linux RedRat2 Software [orbit2orbit.com]. The package can easily be used to wrap a simple control panel around most any mechanism(IR, X10, web, ...). For example I used the same software to create a control panel for my TV card(All in Wonder Pro). Here is a screenshot [orbit2orbit.com]

      The home grown package I have put together gives me most of what I want. It's lacking some integration, the ability to use the TV as the visual interface, a web gateway ... Then there are some features such as librarian and presentation tools. It would be rather cool to be able to script a Music/Video/Picture/X10 party mix!!!
    • A friend of mine just got a Keyspan USB Remote [keyspan.com] for his Mac OS X system. It's pretty neat: he remapped the buttons to switch between apps, cycle through his playlists, mute the volume, etc. No word about Linux support: the web page only specifies Windows and Mac OS software support.

  • without using a pc? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by tunah ( 530328 )
    without using a pc? This IS a pc. It just has a very simple OS and TV-out. At $1500 it's not even a very cheap PC.

    From the specs page: Graphical interface, wireless keyboard, usb port, ethernet, 800Mhz processor, 128Mb ram, 30Gb HDD, CD/DVD, Stereo Audio, Digital Audio (S/PDIF), Composite Video, S-Video, SVGA, 1/4" Headphone jack...

    The only thing different is some hardware controls on the front (an extension of the multimedia keyboards), and a remote.

    It's nice and simple, but you don't get the infinite(*) customisability of a real pc.

    With some customised linux box I could do all this, burn cds of this media, and play quake3 or gnibbles :)

  • If you look at their Spec sheet they don't have any analog input. The only to get things into this box seems to be via USB or ethernet. With the audio USB chips entering the market perhaps this is not such a big deal, tho a ADC would have been nice.
  • What this thing really needs is DivX compatibility. As far as doing things an Xbox or PS2 + HD cannot, can either of these play MP3, MPG, WMA, or WMV? I know with the Linux-PS2 kit [slashdot.org], one could do most of this, but what about the Xbox? Is it going to have an OS port? And would the PS2's processor be able to keep up with MPEG-4 decompression?
  • It'll be nice in a year when these things are sold for $89.95 like the 3Com Audrey.

  • Translations: (Score:5, Funny)

    by shepd ( 155729 ) <slashdot.org@gmail.COMMAcom minus punct> on Friday November 09, 2001 @02:36PM (#2545075) Homepage Journal
    [Please note, this is just an opinion piece. These really aren't translations.]

    Q. Is a Service required to access all of the features of the ZapStation?
    A. Currently no ZapMedia service or subscription is required to access all of the features of the ZapStation.

    T. We will ream you for service charges once we run out of venture capital.

    Q. Do I need an Internet Service Provider (ISP) to use the ZapStation?
    A. To experience all of the features of the ZapStation you will need to have an ISP. Broadband service is strongly encouraged. However, the ZapStation will work with a dial-up connection through a home network.

    T. Our device is almost useless to many people in our target market

    Q. Will my ZapStation be updated with new releases?
    A. Yes, your ZapStation will receive software updates via the Internet.

    T. We have designed our device to update itself with anti-consumer code whenever the RIAA/MPAA says "jump".

    Q. Can I record my CDs and DVDs on the ZapStation?
    A. You can record your CDs but not DVDs.

    T. The MPAA already told us not to do this.

    Q. What audio streaming formats will the ZapStation support?
    A. The ZapStation currently supports MP3 and Windows Media formats.

    T. Our product doesn't support the most popular streaming format, RealMedia, because, well... we don't know why. We suck.

    Q. Can I transfer MP3s and WMA files from my PC to the ZapStation?
    A. Yes, the ZapStation supports transferring MP3, WMA, WMV, and MPEG files.

    T. We didn't want to mention if you can transfer them off the ZapStation(tm) because if someone does that the RIAA will be... angry.

    Q. Can I create a "music jukebox" with the ZapStation?
    A. Yes, you can build audio playlists comprised of songs you have recorded onto the ZapStation from CDs along with songs you have downloaded from the Internet or transferred from your PC to the ZapStation. You can also build video playlists with video files you have downloaded from the ZapMedia portal, the ZapZone, or from the Internet.

    T. We want to portalize the internet because look at what it did for excite@home!

    Q. How many songs can I record on the ZapStation?
    A. Approximately 10,000 songs can be recorded on the ZapStation depending on the recording quality selected and the length of the songs.

    T. Our margin wasn't high enough so we put in a tiny 30 Gb HDD and recorded everything at 128 kbps.

    Q. Can I record TV programs onto the ZapStation?
    A. Currently, the ZapStation does not support recording TV shows.

    T. We'll do this when the MPAA says it will let us.

    Q. Can I load applications on the ZapStation?
    A. No, the ZapStation is a closed system.

    T. The ZapStation is about as well supported as a Timex Sinclair is right now.

    Advanced Networking -- Fast connection through DSL, Cable, or T1 access

    T. We threw in an RTL8139 because it only cost $2. It's advanced because it was made this decade.

    110V/220V Power Supply

    T. We're one stupid company. We only sell to America, but think that home theater afficandos hook up their equipment to their Dryers.

    Pardon me for being cynical, but at $1500 I can buy a laptop with the same features that doesn't come with RIAA/MPAA baggage.
    • Shut up you whinging prat. There's no conspiracy here.
    • T. Our product doesn't support the most popular streaming format, RealMedia, because, well... we don't know why. We suck.

      Actually, the ZapStation played both RealAudio and RealVideo over a year ago (I should know: I wrote the code to integrate them back when I worked for Zap). This capability was shown at several trade shows. So why isn't that capability in the box now? There are $everal very good rea$on$...

      • >There are $everal very good rea$on$...

        You aren't suggesting that somehow my wacky conspiracy ideas might have actually lead somwhere, are you?

        Wow... I was just joking! :-)

        However, a tech company working alongside another tech company isn't too unusual I suppose.
  • $1,500...? Goodness! For that kind of bread you can build yourself a pretty nice box, sans monitor. I thought the whole appeal of the X-Box or a PS2 was that it's a relatively inexpensive alternative to a computer. Sure, they can't do everything a computer can do, but it can be competitive on one or two levels (games, DVD movies...)

    To put things another way: I always thought you'd buy a game console because you couldn't afford a computer. Maybe I'm oversimplifying things just a tad (I know quite a few people who own both) or maybe I'm just a computer snob, but who in there right mind would buy this sort of thing?

    Cheers!

    -Kevin
  • Great website.

    A bunch of full-screen stock photography urging me to "take control of my digital universe".

    Do they use Perl to generate this stuff?
  • It doesn't even have a cd burner. This is a huge oversight: if I'm going to store all my audio on a device it needs to be able to generate CDs for my MP3 playing car stereo.

    All in all it looks like a loser at that price with those features... though clearly there is room for this sort of combination device. It ought to be a tivo, too, no reason for my storage to be compartmentalized between incompatible devices.

    Some day.

  • can they compete with X-Box or PS2+Hard Drive devices that will be hitting the market and doing many of the same things, but far less expensively?

    Um, no. This unit is nothing more than a commercialized version of what hobbysits have been doing for several years: take standard equipment, spray paint a small case, Add IR, and set it next to your TV.

    Contrast this with a PS2. You can play DVDs (with Optical Digital output). Upcoming games support DTS 5.1 for in-game sound (not just pre-recorded custscenes). It plays CDs (again, with nice Optical Digital out). Oh, and did I mention Linux? Sony announced that they would be releasing a version of Linux for the US PS2. So, $300 for the unit + ~$100-$150 for a 40GB HD + $39.99 for a NIC = Hell of a lot cheaper, but with all the features. You can plug in standard USB keyboards, mice, and Sony Cybershot Cameras. Hell, those ghetto USB ethernet adapters even work on it (The latest Tony Hawk skateboarding game supports online broadband play throughg them, even though Sony's official NIC hasn't been released yet). Oh, and I heard there are some cool games out for it, too...

    Like everyone else hass said: I'll be surprised if they sell 10.

  • Breaking News (Score:3)

    by gmhowell ( 26755 ) <gmhowell@gmail.com> on Friday November 09, 2001 @03:01PM (#2545243) Homepage Journal
    No Press Release, no info, no nothing. But they are going to give me a toy for free, so let me pimp them here.

    (PS, please be nice to them. They might advertise on my site.)

    (PPS, Microsoft bad. Linux good.)

    Love,

    CT
  • When they first announced these things way back when, I signed up as a pre-order client because they sounded cool and the pricepoint was right. They asked for $599 for when they would ship the pre-release for testing (RSN!), and the retail version would be $899. They promised regular updates on where they were with the product (none ever came), and status queries were met with press releases. Harmon Kardon came into the mix at one point (I notice the pictures have the logo removed now - hmmm...) and further delayed development for re-branding and packaging. Several months ago they said they were releasing the beta units as promised, you just had to reply that you were in. I replied, multiple times, and no one ever got back to me. Yesterday I got an email saying "we're shipping! (oh, but for $900.00 more than we promised you'd get it for)". Late to market, no responses ever to queries other than one form letter, at least 5 "official" scheduling delays (they final figured out using months and yers was bad, and switched to "sometime RSN" about a years ago. Ba ha ha, I'll pass, as I think it is doomed. At the $899.00 it seemed cool. It's kinda interesting though - Compaq's unit went up $100 from release, and the ReQuest is only available in a $2500 flavour. I look at the other audio servers that are out there, and the pickings are really slim. Anyone have a used RQ1-30 for sale?
  • It really pains to to see things like this fail when there could be an open source "lite" version of Linux with real standards for vendors to meet. Perhaps even the Linux gaming movement could benefit from this as well. What ever happened to Indrema? Is that development just sitting in the trash or what?

    Microsoft is about to take over with the DirectXbox. Support for OpenGL will die after that.
  • So, let me get this straight...

    It's a DVD player that doesn't do component video. Even $100 DVD players have these. Even my PS2 has these - and it's supposed to be a *horrible* DVD player. Serious A/V-philes won't be using this feature. Yeah, it does SVGA, but again, this is a set-top box. I don't see myself connecting this to my PC, much less to a LCD projector.

    It's got some vague TV Guide features...but apparentally can't be used as a PVR. It claims you can "navigate ZapStation's channels..." but doesn't explain what this means. Does ZapStation have a tuner in it so you can use it with your existing cable system? What if you have satellite or an external cable box? Meanwhile, you can buy a DVR - which comes with a detailed guide service - from a variety of companies. (My personal favorite is Tivo.)

    It's a WebTV-like device, but doesn't support the lowly analog modem, so you either need broadband, or you need to rig your PC to share the modem.

    It doesn't (appear to, anyways) support VCDs, MP3 CD(R/RW)s. Again, many $100 DVD players do this already. (to say nothing of PC-based players...)

    It only comes with a 30GB drive. Yeah, that's a lot of MP3s...but 30GB is nothing if you want to record video.

    I know many are saying "...but I can build a PC to do this for $700..." but that's not what this is supposed to be. It's supposed to be an all-in-one appliance, so you pay for the convience of being able to take this thing out of the box, turn it on, and have it work. This is the same reason people buy toasters, instead of building their own.

    Even as an all-in-one integrated appliance, it still fails miserably. You can buy existing products which exceed each function the ZapStation. For around $150, you can get a DVD player that supports component video, digital audio, MP3, VCD, CDR, CDRW. For another $300 you can get a Tivo (even without the extra service fees, this will be more usefull than ZapStation.) For another $300-700 you can get a stereo component MP3 player, which either streams from your existing PC, or stores the tracks locally.

    The point of an all-in-one appliance is that you save money due to the integration. However, for $700-1200, you more than replicate the ZapStation's feature set - FOR LESS.
    • It doesn't (appear to, anyways) support VCDs, MP3 CD(R/RW)s. Again, many $100 DVD players do this already. (to say nothing of PC-based players...)

      I am a Test Engineer for ZapMedia and I can confirm that we do support VCD playback as well as MP3 CDR/CDRW. You can play the MP3s directly from the disc or transfer them to your ZapStation.
  • A closed device that contains its own storage is bound to be a failure in the long term:

    1) 30 Gb is not enough. OK, its fine for this year - but I've got about 20 Gb of media, and that covers about 1/8 of my CD collection, let alone the DVDs

    2) We all know that hard drives break. If you are doing this seriously you need RAID, or some form of backup. Am I the only person who thinks that the DAT market is about to explode as we all realise that we have 10s of Gb at risk?

    So what I'd like is:

    1) A dirty great PC (hidden away) that has an arbitrary quantity of disk (200 Gb RAID 5?), a tape drive and a network connection. Linux, 2K, whatever, as long as it can export a file system.

    2) A nice SMALL, ELEGANT device that sits with the TV/stereo. It can play video, mp3, whatever - all accessed over the network. It only needs enough flash rom/ram to hold a simple OS and be updateable with new codecs/formats etc. Hell, I'd like several of these things all over the house, all served from the central PC. Use the TV screen to display the menu, or have a simple LCD like the current HDD based mp3 players.

    I would easily pay $500 for such a gadget. I'll build the file server myself - probably using all of the noisy HDDs that are currently spinning under my desk.
    • I agree that 30GB is too small... but I don't see a reason to put RAID or a backup system inside it.

      The MP3s you're playing are already "backed up" on CD, right?

      As for video...I'm not quite clear on how the ZapStation deals with this...

      At any rate, losing the HD would be the sort of thing that's covered by the warranty (this thing *does* have a warranty...right?) While it would suck, it shouldn't result in a catastrohic loss of data.

      I like your idea of a simple, small set-top box which would access a server elsewhere. The purpose of this thing would basically be to provide an elegant interface to the content on my server, and stream my selection to my location (be it video, audio, etc.) Unfortunatly, I don't have cat5 running through my house :(
  • What about the Shuttle SV24 previously discussed here [slashdot.org]? A barebones system for $250 (Get it with a free floppy drive from newegg). Add a cpu, RAM, hard drive, dvd with decoder, wireless keyboard and mouse.

    Approximate cost for add ons -

    Celeron 800 - $40
    128MB PC100 - $8 (or $15 if you want name brand)
    40GB hard drive - $73
    DVD w/ DXR3 - $127
    Wireless Keyboard - $55

    for an approximate grand total with shipping of $400. I surely won't be forking out $1500 for one of these.
  • Let's say I take my $1500, and instead buy a real nice rig with all the goodies, including a couple big hard drives, say 80 gig each. Maybe even a raid, so I can add more later easily. And I have a TV in card. Is there software that acts like a Tivo, where I can reocrd stuff on a schedule? More importantly, is there software that acts as a reciever box, so I can not only schedule a time, but a channel as well? I don't think there is. But imagine the hemmoraging that would happen if someone cracked the directv reciever, not just the h-card stuff, so that some software would act as the the receiver box. It'd be the ultimate Tivo, a fully functional pc (linux or otherwise) that performed tivo operations, then you could take those shows or movies you enjoyed, and either archive them, or burn them onto DVD's. I think I just started a law suit.
  • On your credit card transaction:
    Security

    We employ reasonable and current security methods to prevent unauthorized access, maintain data accuracy, and ensure correct use of information.

    Well, we thought the "Keep Out" sign on the server door was reasonable...

  • DIY (Score:2)

    by nowt ( 230214 )
    After seeing the relase of HP's "media deck", I decided to take my underutilized debian home server and see if I can turn it into something akin to these beasties. Of course it's all custom this n' that but here's where I'm at so far...


    mp3 server. mp3's actually play off server itself with 75' stereo cabling going through my house to stereo in family room. I then built a handy web page to control this. apache/php webpage manages playlists and such and actually plays them through madplay for low cpu usage. I have an ap downstairs and can then access webpage on my ipaq through dillo. works well :-)


    The next step is to try getting the ntsc off my nvidia card to my vcr (same fashion prolly.. stereo cable + rca connector but prolly need vid amp for the signal). If this works, I'd be able to play avi's, .rm's etc. on tv and of course get stereo sound.
    So far, beyound what I already had in my box, I invested $10 for stereo cabling + rca connectors from rat shack.

  • Oooh man! Do they think this will sell ANY units at $1500? I MIGHT pay more like $400-$500 for it but $1500? I bet it won't take long before the XBox can do everything this can do (well, maybe) but I can CERTAINLY build a computer for about $500 that is faster with a bigger hard drive that does everything this does except the remote and front LCD panel, which I can live without for the $1000 price difference. PLUS mine would be upgradable, play divx and do lots of other stuff. I suppose if it needs custom software I could just whip that up in vb over a weekend.

  • Kelly had just finished the last summer cheerleading practice.She was the first
    girl in ten years to make the squad their freshman year. Several of the other
    cheerleaders were upset. Kelly wasn't concerned about their thoughts. She shyed
    away from others and had very few friends. She didn't believe in the clicks
    people got into. Kelly is one of the prettiest girls in school. Shoulder length
    reddish blonde hair, acute face with a small button nose, and always smiled.
    Breasts the size of small grapefruits with nipples same size as quarters. Flat
    slightly sculptured belly, slender waist, narrow hips, small plump butt and
    perfectly shaped legs. All wrapped into a 5'4" 115pds frame.

    After showering Kelly dried herself, as she went to her locker. She noticed four
    girls across from her locker talking and snickering. Kelly ignored them. After
    slipping her cotton bikini pantys on, she grabbed her bra. Somebody had cut the
    straps. There was no way she'd be able to wear it now. She turned around to
    confront the now, laughing girls. They quickly walked out of the lockeroom.
    Kelly put on her low cut tank top, and shorts. After throwing her stuff into her
    bag, she headed out. Her breasts stood just as if she had a bra on. Her breasts
    firmly jiggled as she walked to the bus stop. Kelly was headed downtown to the
    library first. Then to a movie.

    Kelly had noticed lately that boys as well as men were looking her over as she
    walked by. Today more so than ever. After she got off the bus downtown. She went
    to walking the 4 blocks to the library. When a old black man walked out of a
    alley. Hey there. Where you headed? (shyly and quietly) Oh, hi. I'm going to
    have lunch with my dad. Kelly walked a little faster. She didn't notice that the
    old black man was following her. Kelly went into the library and looked over a
    couple of books untill it was time to go to the movie. She looked up. Over a few
    tables was the old black man. Since she had noticed men looking her way. Kelly
    was starting to become a tease. So, she walked his way to put the books away.
    She knew he wouldn't do anything in public place. When she was in front of him.
    She dropped the books. Bending over to pick them up. (without bending her knees)
    Her tank top layed so the old black man could get a good look at her white
    breasts. The old black man's mouth dropped open. Oh! Excuse me. (acting as it
    was an acident)

    Kelly headed to the movie. Which was a couple of blocks away. She loved the
    reaction she had got from the old man. The movie Kelly wanted to see was sold
    out. She wanted to see a movie. So, she got a ticket to another. Then she saw
    that another was starting and it was rated R and nobody was around. She went on
    in. Hardly anybody was there. Kelly sat towards the back . The movie started.
    When a nude scene started someone came and sat by her. She didn't even pay any
    mind. She in awe of what was on the screen. This was her first R movie. There on
    the screen was a black slave climbing on top of his master's white wife to have
    sex. Kelly liked the sight of the slave's black skin on the white woman's body.
    Kelly didn't even realize the person beside her had placed their hand onto her
    knee.

    But, when he moved his huge hand upto her thigh. Kelly regained her awareness.
    She turned. It was the old black man. She tried to push his hand away. He just
    leaned over and kissed her neck. He kissed his way down to the tops of her white
    breasts. As he moved his hand upto her shorts. He kissed the tops of her breasts
    as he rubbed her crotch. He then unbuttoned and unzipped her shorts. Even though
    she liked the sight of his black face to her white chest area. She knew she had
    to do something before he got any further. She thought to herself (that she
    shouldn't have teased this old man) As the old black man started pulling at the
    young white girl's shorts. Stop. Or I'll scream. At this time an usher was
    making his rounds. Kelly got up to leave. The usher stopped her. your not old
    enough to see this movie. I know. I came into the wrong movie by acident. Kelly
    left and went home.

    It had been several weeks since the incident with the old black man. School had
    started. Pro football season had started the week before, and Kelly's school was
    going to have their first game tomorrow morning. Today they were having a pep
    rally at the end of the school day. Kelly stopped over Stacy's house for awhile.
    It was about 6:00p.m. Kelly hurried home to help set up things for her dad's
    party. Every month her dad and some of his friends would get together and have a
    few drinks and discuss sports. This was her dad's turn to have it at his house.
    When she got home. Her dad told Kelly that her mother had went out with aunt Mae
    and that she'd be out late. Kelly helped her dad set things up. Most of the guys
    were there. Kelly fixed herself something to eat and took it to her room. She
    turned on the stereo as she ate.

    It was about 8:15 now and Kelly decided she'd take swim as it was unseasonabley
    warm tonight. Kelly danced around to the music as she got her bikini out.
    Without thinking she took her top and bra off. She was in front of the window
    and hadn't pulled the blinds down. She looked outside and noticed Mr. Turner
    looking up at her. Mr.Turner was retired runningback from the local pro team. He
    was black very muscular. He stood about 6 feet tall and weighed around 235
    pounds. Kelly was so embarassed. She hurried away from the window and put on her
    bikini. She thought about not swimming. But, after a half hour she went on down
    to swim. As she tried to sneak by the rec room. Mr. Turner walked out and almost
    bumped into her. Oh! Hi. Didn't mean to run you down. Kelly couldn't even speak.
    By the way. I didn't mean to stare earlier. It isn't everyday you see such
    beauty. That's ok. (very quietly) As she went onto swim.

    Kelly swam and relaxed poolside for a couple hours. She went on upto the
    bathroom and took a shower. Dried herself. Then, slipped on a robe. She went
    across the hall to her bedroom. As Kelly entered her room she looked to see who
    was coming up the stairs. It was Mr. Turner. May I use the restroom. Sure. Kelly
    pushed at the door. The door sounded like it closed. But, it came open slightly.
    Kelly saw Mr. Hicks looking through his upstairs window towards her. He must be
    around 73 years old. Kelly turned on the radio and started dancing. Her robe
    came open. Mr. Hicks just stared as she danced. Kelly turned off the overhead
    light after turning a lamp on. She thought to her self. She'd realy give
    Mr.Hicks a surprise. She slipped her robe off. Exposing her totaly naked body to
    him. After all he was in his house and to old to do anything. She danced around
    for a few more seconds. Then she layed down on her bed. Mr.Hicks still had view
    of her. Kelly was turning into a real tease and was liking it. She rolled over
    onto her belly, so that Mr.Hicks would get a good look at her butt.

    She heard the bathroom door open. She glanced at a mirror across the room, and
    noticed her door was open slightly. She thought about getting up and closing it.
    But it was to late. Mr.Turner was in the hallway next to her doorway. Kelly
    acted to be asleep. After a few seconds she heard the door close. Kelly figured
    that he pulled the door closed. But, when she heard some movement. She became
    terrified. She kept her eyes shut as if she was sleeping. She then felt
    Mr.Turner run his hand up the back of her white thigh. Kelly trembled as he
    caressed her young white buns. She instantly felt herself getting wet inside.
    Mr.Turner kissed her white butt. Kelly liked this but knew it was wrong. She
    turned over onto her back. Don't!

    Then she saw him. Totaly naked huge black man. Huge biceps, a very muscular
    chest, ripple tummy. Kelly let out a quiet gasp as she noticed his huge erect
    penis. It must be 11inches long and realy fat. She couldn't get her eyes off of
    his huge black monstercock. Mr.Turner walked upto her face. Suck on it. No! as
    she thought ( that would be gross) He rubbed his black cock across her lips a
    couple times. He then went to the foot of the bed and knelt down. He kissed the
    young white girl's thighs working his way up. Don't! Stop! I'll scream. As
    squeezed her legs together. He kissed her blonde pubic hair, then lower belly.
    Kelly became speachless as he kissed white belly and licked at her bellybutton.
    Mr.Turner wasn't going to take a no for an answer at this point. He kissed his
    way to her teenage white breasts. He kissed and sucked at her nipples at the
    same time ran his hand to her young pussy.

    Kelly let out a moan, as he inserted his finger inside her. She tried to push
    him away. Even though she was enjoying what he was doing. Kelly knew this was
    bad and besides he would most likely rip her in half. Mr.Turner rubbed at her
    teenage pussy for moment to lubricate the outside of her pussylips. Mr.Turner
    climbed onto the bed to mount her little white body. Kelly held her legs
    together. Please don't It will hurt me. It only will hurt for a moment. Ohhh! As
    Mr.Turner rubbed his huge black cock up and down her little pussy. He pushed
    forward. No penetration. He gave big shove forward. Still no penetration of the
    little white girl's pussy. He pushed again and finaly managed to get his
    cockhead inside her. Kelly tightened up. He pushed a little deeper. She felt his
    huge black cock press against her hyman. She knew that one more push would pop
    her cherry. Just as he drew back. A knock at the door. Kelly! Kelly! Are you
    awake. As the door opened. Mr.Turner jumped off the side of the bed.

    Hi dear. Mmmom! Yes. Are you ok? ya. Dad, said you'd be late. The movie was sold
    out. So, I came home early. Are you sure? That you are ok. Yes. Just tired. I've
    told you to pull the blinds down. You are old enough now that guys will love to
    see you dress and undress. You sure seem nervouse. Is there anything wrong? No
    mom! Well, you look flush and sweaty. I'll get the thermetor. No. That's ok. I'm
    alright. Ok. Call for me if you need me. Goodnight. Goodnight mom. Kelly was
    trembleing. Mr.Turner jumped up and dressed and quietly went back downstairs
    where there were still a few men gathered having their last drink. Kelly finaly
    fell asleep a couple hours later. But, within another hour she woke up from a
    bad dream. Her mother rushed in and comforted her. Kelly couldn't tell her
    mother that she dreamed about being raped by twelve black men.

    After this Kelly quit teasing men for a couple weeks. She started slowly once
    more. She would mostly like old black men. She would go without a bra and leave
    a button undone then lean over in front of them. During the holiday vacation.
    When her parents were at work. Kelly even went totaly naked. Except a long
    winter coat. She rode the public bus all the way downtown. She aboat croaked
    when an old black man sat beside her. They talked awhile. He was headed to work.
    He was going to retire in the spring, after 40 years of service. When he looked
    the other way. Kelly undid the top button of her coat. Which exposed just a
    little of the tops of her white breasts. Your a very pretty young lady. You need
    to be careful. Someone may try to have their way with you. I can take care of
    myself. Here's my stop. Take care.

    Kelly felt ashamed. She stopped such things. Untill the last day of school. She
    had worn her white blouse and plaid skirt.(the catholic school girl look) She
    decided to walk home since it was very nice day out and school let out early.
    She was walking through the park. She was nearing the walk bridge across the
    creek. She heard some voices coming from under the car bridge nearby. There were
    three black hobos. There was nobody else in sight. They were washing theirselves
    in the creek. She starred at them. They only had their pants on. But, she liked
    the sight o their black chests. Kelly also knew that they would most likely see
    her cross the walkway. She was realy excited. After a moment she slipped her bra
    then pantys off and put them in her backpack. This excited her. Even though they
    were to far away to notice. She only had two blocks to go to get home from the
    park. When she walked across the walkway. The men whistled and yelled to her.
    They were close enough to see that she was a pretty girl. Kelly liked this but
    ignored them. But, then she noticed they were following her. She picked up her
    pace. A short distance from the street. They caught her. One of the black hobos
    grabbed her. Turned her around. Man! We're goin to have a good time today. As he
    saw her quarter sized pink nipples poking through her blouse. Then a cop drove
    by. Then backed up. The men ran off. Mam! Were they bothering you? As the cop
    walked upto her. No sir. He was a tall black man in his fortys. He took a double
    take when he noticed her pirky breasts through her blouse. You need to watch how
    you dress. Your asking for trouble.

    That night she dreamed of Mr.Turner fucking her. She woke up in a sweat. She was
    showering when her parents yelled in at her. Honey! We're headed to work early.
    Kelly wondered more and more what it would feel like to be fucked by a black
    man. Mr.Turner was very gentle with her. She couldn't believe how close she came
    to being fucked. Kelly thought to herself-(I know it's wrong. But, I'm going to
    find out today) She put on her bikini pantys then bra and her summer sundress.
    After slipping on shoes she went downtown on the bus. Remembering the first
    experience with an old black man. She walked towards the alley where she first
    saw him. It was almost 10:00a.m. Ahead was a tall old black man. It might even
    be the same man. Kelly acted as if she didn't notice him. She walked as if going
    to the library. Hey baby! Don't you say hi to your friends? So, she knew he was
    the same man and he remembered her. Oh. Hi. (acting not to be interested) Hey!
    You want a puppy. (Knowing this was a ploy) (Even though she was scared-she was
    going through with her plan) Sure! Where is it? Down here. In a box. Directing
    her to the alley. Kelly nervousely followed. I sleep here and this puppy came
    upto me and had no tags. A third of the way through the alley. There were stacks
    of large cardboard boxes with blankets on them. There were five other old black
    men laying on their blankets. Untill they seen her. Kelly started to leave. Not
    soon enough. They surrounded her.

    Don't I'll scream! One of the black men pulled out a knife. No you won't.
    Unless! Kelly stood there while the black men fondled her. Two of them fondled
    her breasts and two others played with her firm butt. One watched the street as
    one of the black men unzipped her sundress and slipped the straps off of her
    shoulders. Her dress fell to her ankles. Please! Don't hurt me. The man with the
    knife walked upto her. Not saying a word. Cut the right strap of her bra. With
    the other black men laughing he cut the left strap. Starring into her eyes he
    ran the knife across the tops of her breasts. Then suddenly cut her bra in half.
    Kelly's bra fell to the ground. Exposing her firm white breasts to the old black
    bums. They all got quiet. Starring at the young white girl. The black man put
    the knife up. Then with two hands grabbed her pantys and ripped them from her
    petite teenage body. Kelly felt herself getting wet. Even though she was
    terrified. Here she was a virgin about to be raped by six old black men in an
    alley downtown. She didn't even know if they would kill her or not.

    Kelly just watched as the man in front of her dropped his pants and undershorts.
    He was black as midnight. His cock was hard pointing towards her. It was smaller
    than Mr.Turner's. But, Kelly didn't see how it would fit into her. Kelly shaked
    like a leaf and tears started to run down her face. The black man's cock pressed
    against her belly as he stepped closer. He shoved her down onto a blanket. He
    knelt down and pushed her legs apart. She was to scared to fight back. She
    looked to the side as he mounted her. She noticed that the other men's dicks
    were larger and fatter. He whispered to her I'm the nice one. The others would
    just ram it inside you. He rubbed his black cock up and down her blonde pussy 4
    or 5 times to slicken her up. He then pushed forward. Without sucess. Then
    another, and another. Your one tight chick. One more huge shove forward and
    Kelly felt his cockhead push inside her. Then another push and he was touching
    her hyman. He pulled back. Then with a smile gave a quick shove forward. Kelly
    screamed out in pain as his black dick ripped through her hyman.

    The black man took pleasure at the painful look on her face. Your just a spoiled
    white brat. As he slammed all 8 inches of his cock into her. Blood ran down her
    butt. He squeezed her white tits so hard she thought that they would pop. She
    felt his hairy black balls slamming against her white butt. The other black bums
    were urging him to hurry. They wanted their turn. The pain subsided after a
    couple minutes or so and Kelly was starting to enjoy the fucking she was
    getting. She wrapped her legs across the backs of his. Kelly let out moans of
    delight as the black man pounded his cock into her white pussy. She was about to
    climax when she felt the man cum inside her. With one more lunge forward. He
    pulled out of her. Who's next. She's a fine piece.

    The next black hobo ordered her to her hands and knees. Like a dog you know.
    After penetrating the young white girl from behind another got infront to force
    her to suck him. She learned quick how to suck. Kelly first thought it was gross
    to have a man's dick inside her mouth. After a couple minutes she even started
    enjoying cocksucking. The man behind her fucked her as hard and fast as he
    could. Making her buns and tits bounce around. She felt herself building to a
    climax again. This time she squeeled in delight as she climaxed and felt the
    black man cum inside her pussy. The old black man in front was cumming into her
    mouth as the man behind pulled his black cock out and squirted a couple times
    across her butt. The two black men quickly stepped away from the petite white
    girl. When another layed beside her and directed her on top of him.

    Kelly sat on his 12 inch black snake. She let out a gasp in dispair as the last
    4 inches went inside her. It was uncomfortable as he fucked her. But, after a
    moment it felt good being stretched this far. She figured he must have the
    biggest dick in the world. To her surprise one of remaining black men knelt
    behind her. He pushed her forward. He guided his 10inch black cock to her white
    butt. He gave a hard continued push. Kelly screamed and tears appeared again as
    she felt like she was being ripped in half. Without hesitation the black men
    fucked her hard and unmerciful. One in her white ass and the other in her blonde
    pussy. Even though it hurt after a few minutes of being double fucked. Kelly
    yelled out in another orgasm. As the black man inside her butt squirted streams
    and streams of cum inside her. Then the last black man traded places with the
    man that was buttfucking her.

    As he started buttfucking the teenage white girl. He yelled out. Hey! we're a
    oreo cookie. Kelly was getting exhausted and was going limp. It felt like she
    would pass out. Then she orgasmed again. After she came off of her third orgasm,
    the man pumped her white ass full of his black seed. He quickly withdrew from
    her as the man under her. Rolled over on top of her. He went to fucking his
    black 12 inch pole in and out of her as fast as he could. He sucked on her white
    breast. When he started cumming inside her he bit down. Kelly let out a yelp.
    This didn't stop her from climaxing again, for the fourth time. The man stood
    up. She was exhausted and just layed there. To her amazement they were still
    standing around naked. We want you to meet Bubba.

    Kelly was amazed when she saw Bubba. He was about 50yrs.old 6ft.6in. tall
    220pds. His cock must be around 14 inches long. As he mounted Kelly's little
    white body. He told her that he was going to fuck her brains out. It looked like
    a black monster mounting a little white doll. He entered her slowly. Even though
    she had been reamed out several times. It was slow going for him to get his
    black cock into her. After getting 10 inches inside her white pussy. He started
    fucking her hard. After a few minutes his huge black balls were smacking against
    her white butt cheeks. Kelly orgasmed first. Then she felt him shoot a couple of
    squirts of cum inside her pussy. He pulled his huge black cock out of her and
    finished cumming all over her flat white belly. After he stepped back. She was
    surrounded by the other six black men. They jirked theirselves off all over her.
    She was drenched in cum. Her hair and face was covered with cum. Her white
    breasts, belly, pubic hair, pussy, and butt was also was covered with cum. She
    thought to herself I can't move. She figured that she was about to pass out with
    exhaustion.

    Kelly just layed there naked and covered with cum. The black men were dressed.
    When she saw reflections of flashing lights. The black men had went to the
    entrance of the alley. Kelly heard them talking to what seemed like police
    officers. She slowly got up and peeked around the corner. It was the police. She
    grabbed her sundress. As she walked out the otherside of the alley she slipped
    on the dress. Her shoes had fallen off during all the fucking. Her breasts,
    pussy, and butt ached from the pounding and stretching. She was drenched in cum
    which was starting to dry on her now. No place to clean up. Oops. Excuse me. She
    bumped into a lady. Are you ok. Yeh! Sure. Kelly walked three block as everyone
    starred at her. Since she was such a mess. People kept asking if she was ok. She
    got home on the bus. She threw her sundress in the washer, showered. Redressed
    and fell asleep on the coach.
  • ZapMedia has release complete specs on the ZapStation. I'm biased (I work there) but I think it compares very well to any of the competitors. Read them here [zapmedia.com]

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