New P2P Battle is Heating Up 376
Digital Dharma writes "News.com has an article about a new P2P war just getting underway in congress. With Senator Hollings retiring, the RIAA and MPAA have found suitable replacement hosts in three key members of the House of Representatives. Lamar Smith, R-Texas; Howard Berman, D-Calif; and John Conyers, D-Mich are taking up arms against P2P networks with a bizarre new bill that would require companies that create certain types of software such as web browsers, instant messaging clients and e-mail utilities to add a warning that it 'could create a security and privacy risk.' How this would deter P2P activity is a bit of a mystery. The article also talks about putting software company executives in jail for failing to correctly label said software, empowering the FBI to release anti-P2P propaganda and other typical RIAA/MPAA sponsored oddities." A network application can create a security risk? Best firewall off every port!
Come on! (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Come on! (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Come on! (Score:5, Interesting)
Isn't it funny how whenever Microsoft builds something in, people complain about bundling or lack of modular design (and usually point out how the Unix way of having separate components for each part of a job is better), but when Microsoft does something the Unix way (e.g., the browser browses, and if you want pop-up blocking, get a pop-up blocker component), and the major Unix browsers do it the Microsoft way (incorporate the pop-up blocker into the browser), suddenly that is the right approach?
Re:Come on! (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Come on! (Score:3, Insightful)
And yes, Mozilla does bundle several applications into one package, but note that they are moving away from this, and eventually everything will be released as separate components.
Re:Come on! (Score:3, Insightful)
No one has said that all bundling is bad. Popup blocking should belong in a browser, and there is no reason why Microsoft couldn't add more features to their browser. If they hadn't already secured a monopoly in the browser market and couldn't care less about innovation...
But the kind of bundling which kills off competition, with products of lesser quality bundled with the operating system just to push dangerous competitors out of the market, that is the bad kind of bundling.
Microsoft should never have
Re:Come on! (Score:3, Funny)
In relate
Re:Come on! (Score:3, Insightful)
Let me see if we're talking about the same thing. At the top you have your standard menu bar "File / Edit / View / etc.". Below that you usually have some of the navigation buttons (Back, Forward, Reload) and the address area where you can type in an URL.
In the space below that you can put folders such that when you click on each folder you get a drop-down list of bookmarks
Re:Come on! (Score:3, Informative)
Go here [crazybrowser.com] and download a copy of CrazyBrowser for Windows.
It's a wrapper for IE that adds pop-up blocking AND tabbed browsing, but still uses the IE engine. It shares the same folders for favorites, history, temporary internet files, etc., so once you load CrazyBrowser it will look and act just like IE with all your favorites and everything already in place.
Oh, and did I mention it's free (as in beer)?
p2p is the future (Score:4, Insightful)
The problem is further escalated by the fact that the ranks of broadband users are growning every day. I hear that Verizon is wanting to dump somewhere around 11 billion dollars into their network to ensure that all of their customers are able to get DSL, and they have lowered their prices across the board...You can now get 1.5 down/128 up for a flat $30/mo, similar to what SBC's been offering. With all this broadband around, popular web sites will not be able to keep up, expecially if they have downloadable goodies. The answer is distributed computing. p2p represents the infancy of the inevitibility of distributed storage, processing, and bandwidth.
Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re:p2p is the future (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:p2p is the future (Score:5, Insightful)
But I don't want to share my bandwidth with leechers ! Quite frankly, if I knew of a BT client that flat out rejected people refusing to upload, I'd use that instead. It's attitudes like yours that cause problems for the whole concept of sharing. How long do you think people would make anything available if no one gave anything in return?
Re:p2p is the future (Score:3, Interesting)
You have to allow some slack in the protocol for people who are just starting a download and don't have anything useful yet. When I start a BitTorrent download it can take up to 30 seconds before I start uploading because I don't have anything useful.
Plus a lot of people are on asynchronous connections, so they may be capable of receiving more than they can send, and shouldn't be punished for
Re:p2p is the future (Score:3, Interesting)
Well, BT clients essentially participate in a tit-for-tat; that means that anybody not uploading will have a horrendously slow download, because no clients will want to give them anything. There is a bit of slack for people just starting out, of course, but if your client doesn't upload a single byte of the torrent, you'll have a hard time downloading anything. You know how BT is a bit slow to st
Re:p2p is the future (Score:3, Insightful)
If they want me to download something,
They don't want you download to something. You want to download something. If you don't want to share, don't use bandwidth sharing apps. Use http. Geez.
~jeff
Re:p2p is the future (Score:2)
But I for one perfer to get a 110 KB/sec download if it means I have to share a bit of upload too. Far better than waiting "in queue" with one of the major download sites for a spot to open up.
Re:p2p is the future (Score:2, Troll)
"I don't want to pay for a BMW! If BMW wants me to have one of their cars, there should be a way where I don't have to share my money. I want it now, and I don't want to pay. If there is a car manufacturer I like and they need money, then yes, I'd like the choice please, but don't assume everyone likes to pay money just to drive the latest BMW model."
Please tell me that's not what you were trying to say.
Re:p2p is the future (Score:2)
And you probably feel you should be able to speed down the freeway in your luxury SUV without having to wait for anyone to get out of your way.
Where did we get this crop of people who feel they are entitled to everything they want, when they want it?
Re:p2p is the future (Score:3, Interesting)
Didn't you ever see that movie "A Beautiful Mind" starring Russel Crowe? Anti-hollywood/MPAA/aussie FUD aside, it shows nicely with a dating analogy why, for the best results, each entity should do what's best for their own interests AND the group's interests. Bittorrent is the very embodiment of this for the inte
Re:p2p is the future (Score:2, Insightful)
Redhat is a perfect example. You are able to download RH iso's directly from Redhat, as a paid subscriber, you will even be able to get them before the general public. Problem though. They have limits on what they can provide. The last bittorrent for RH was flying, I averaged 150KB/sec for the entire 3 cd set which was about 15 times what others claimed RH was giving out under load. The choice is there for you. Stick to downloading at maybe 15k/sec or jump on a torre
Re:p2p is the future (Score:2, Insightful)
Maybe not P2P...
But I wouldn't be surprised to see larger broadband service providers providing their own "P2P"-like products that might distribute the load for popular files to their own servers while at the same time monitoring those files (for copyright or to cover their asses). Perhaps something like my current binary usenet setup: BNR2 configured to pull binaries from my broadband host (free/blindingly fast) and pull missing parts from another news host (paid for/still fast/better completion and rete
Re:p2p is the future (Score:2)
Yes, but it's more fashionably known as grid computing.
Re:p2p is the future (Score:3, Insightful)
I agree, I'll allways use the fastest download.
Rarely in my experience is the fastest download from a peer, usually the fastest download is froma server dedicated to that activity, with the bandwidth to prove it.
IMHO, P2P is a reaction to the napster case, not the best methodology. The best methodology is those big bandwidth servers, with mirrors. Let's face it, I've never topped out my downstream rate in a peer to peer situation. I routinely do hit my maximum downstream rate from dedicated servers
AHHHHH! SoM3On3 H4lp ME! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:AHHHHH! SoM3On3 H4lp ME! (Score:3, Funny)
<@Mike> I just got a security alert
<@Mike> MY COMPUTER IS BROADCASTING AN IP ADDRESS!!!!!!!
<@Mike> OMFG
<@Mike> what do I do?????????
* @Mike clicks the helpful lil message
<@Mike> oooh look. A purple monkey wants to sell me a firewall
http://www.bash.org/?71953
Damn them... (Score:5, Funny)
"People are violating copyright on the internet?"
"Pass a law banning Collies and Yorkshire Terriers from public areas!"
Stupid gits.
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:So let me get this straight... (Score:2)
been found by the State of California to be a carcinogen" or something like that. Once everything that you use is classified as carcinogenic you really start to ignore it.
Re:So let me get this straight... (Score:2, Insightful)
I mean, carbon monoxide is probably the least dangeous thing in cigarette smoke. You'd have to be pretty damn stupid to die from carbon monoxide in cigarette smoke.
ignorant politicians... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:ignorant politicians... (Score:5, Funny)
Your post immediately conjured, in my brain, the image of a world ruled by slashdotters. Suffice it to say I was scared to hell.
You shall be hearing from my lawyers soon.
Re:ignorant politicians... (Score:2)
First item for consideration this session
What are they going to do... (Score:5, Interesting)
America we hardly new ye!
And here are the Bribe numbers ! (Score:5, Interesting)
Lamar Smith received a little over $21,000 from the TV/Music/Music lobbies in 2004 [opensecrets.org]
In 2002 he received almost $25,000 [opensecrets.org]
Howard Berman received a little over $4,000 from the TV/Music/Music lobbies in 2004 [opensecrets.org]
In 2002 he received almost (can you believe this?) $223,000! [opensecrets.org]
John Conyers received almost $5,000 from the TV/Music/Music lobbies in 2004 [opensecrets.org]
In 2002 he received almost $50,000! [opensecrets.org]
The ROI on congressional payoffs is insanely high..
Re:And here are the Bribe numbers ! (Score:2)
Re:And here are the Bribe numbers ! (Score:2)
There's a difference?
Re:And here are the Bribe numbers ! (Score:2)
Re:And here are the Bribe numbers ! (Score:2)
Re:And here are the Bribe numbers ! (Score:2)
They only listen to people with money.
Re:And here are the Bribe numbers ! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:And here are the Bribe numbers ! (Score:2)
Re:And here are the Bribe numbers ! (Score:3, Insightful)
A firewall in every port (Score:5, Interesting)
Don't laugh -- many incompetent managers think this way. I am sitting behind a firewall that blocks all outbound traffic, with the exception of ports 80 and 21. This, I am told, will help prevent viruses from entering the network. Moreso, I might add, than any kind of coherent patching strategy.
============
Re:A firewall in every port (Score:3, Informative)
Re:A firewall in every port (Score:3, Informative)
Now at the office, "ssh -p80" to your machine at home. You can do whatever you want (IM, ftp, browse, IRC, etc.).
If you downloaded a file and need to get it to the office, "scp -P80" or "sftp -oPort=80" will let you do that.
If ANY outgoing port is open, you can do anything you want or need to. The assumption that this isn't the case is the assumption that everyone knows as little as you*
"could create a security and privacy risk"? (Score:2)
No, that's just crazy talk.
P2P War (Score:2)
Re:P2P War (Score:2)
priorities (Score:3, Interesting)
These kind of laws are showing how the government has always treated citizens, with mistrust. They are doing more for copyright protection then they are for things like healthcare, it really shows their prorities.
-Seriv
P2P is here to stay (Score:5, Insightful)
Now, give people free content without restrictions and you have something that everyone wants. Why are search engines the most popular websites? because the user types in what they want and gets it. From a users point of view, kazaa is the same as google except you can get everything that you cant get on google - its like the too hot for google channel. Are you seriously telling me that people dont want to be able to download all the music, films, porn, software, games, books and southpark they want for free!?!?! get real!
The only things that might kill p2p filesharing as we know it are:
Governments (well in the UK anyway) are pushing broadband for all sorts of PHB reasons like "education" and obviously the ISPs - AOL etc are gonna try and sell it. Sen. Hollings is even for it. The absolute irony here is that the very same people who are pushing broadband so they can sell content are the same ones who will be fucked out of their money by filesharing! its brilliant, serves them right for their evil DRM plans.
John Conyers? (Score:2, Funny)
Have you seen this boy?
Re:John Conyers? (Score:2)
yeah, he is my moron rep. if you have not seen him speek, he is truly a puppet moron. talking head, whatever, we can seem to get rid of him.... from this state.. mi...
anyone hiring? I am cisco certified, and am great at everything except programming....
And typing, spelling, being funny, understanding parent posts...
Phone (Score:2, Insightful)
Say what? (Score:2)
That'll help, what do you think a firewall is?
I'd think that firewall's would fall into this same category.
Security and Privacy Risk! (Score:2, Insightful)
The logic reminds me of.... (Score:5, Funny)
And what else floats on water ?
A Duck..."A DUCK!"
"Exactly! Soooo . . . "
" . . . If she weighs . . . as much as . . . a duck . . . "
"Yes?"
"Then she's made out of wood . . . "
"And therefore . . . ?"
" . . . . A WITCH!"
"A WITCH!"
"BURN THE WITCH!"
"BURN HER!"
"To the scales!"
Re:The logic reminds me of.... (Score:5, Funny)
"It wasn't about the Shift key...It had nothing to do with that. It had to do with reviewing a rabbit when we invented the duck and saying the rabbit didn't work right."
God knows what he was talking about, never mind how he got to be CEO with nuggets of insight like that.
You're not far off.... (Score:3, Interesting)
Warnings already there (Score:5, Informative)
(Obviously, there is no P2P connection at all. That is just Slashdot spinning.)
Jail music industry executives... (Score:3, Insightful)
I believe (Score:2, Funny)
Re:I believe (Score:2)
More random Matrix quotes!! (Score:2)
Fear (Score:4, Insightful)
Perhaps this is the point of the bill: to keep software writing in the hands of those rich enough to hire a group of lawyers who can keep away other lawyers.
The Almighty Label (Score:3, Insightful)
Of course, then again, we all know that thousands of people still die every year from a nice warm class of bleach. Don't quite see how Internet Explorer can cause people to die. Well, on second thought...
Re:The Almighty Label (Score:2)
Throw all the software developers in jail (Score:2)
Glad to see it (Score:2, Interesting)
Same goes for IM. THe only port they can connect on is through the secure port 443. Of course none of
Re:Glad to see it (Score:2)
However, throwing those responsible in jail doesn't seem fit to me. A crime like this should be punished with injunctions and fines. We don't put people in jail who make unsafe children's toys so long as they recall them and rectify the problem. Even if something does happen to a child, the
Re:Glad to see it (Score:3, Insightful)
Same goes for IM. THe only port they can connect on is through the secure port 443. Of course none of the employees have quite figured this out so I am the only one that can IM with outside people. Rendevous only works on the internal network so they can only chat with other employees.
Plus we're not paying people to chat with friends. Funny how project completion times went up after I disabled the port.
Except for you that seems. I'd have little respect for sysadmin that does not honor his
Re:Glad to see it (Score:3, Insightful)
Wow, your policies must really have stood the test of time. I mean you've been around for how long now, 22 days?
Re:Glad to see it (Score:2)
Re:Glad to see it (Score:2)
I don't think you have a company at all. I think your webpage was made as a highschool project. I find it absolutely insane that you list "Proof Re ading" as one of your services, considering the shear number of spelling mistake in your website. To make mistakes in a slashdot post is one thing, but on your "company's" website is going to make you look unprofessional, which you obviously are. And what's this with project completion time going up after you disabled ports. As far as I can t
443 is not inherently secure (Score:3, Informative)
If you are running an unencrypted IM client over 443, then you will be running an unencrypted IM client over 443. There's nothing secure about it. You are a dumbass and a retarded admin.
Somebody mod the parent down, he ain't interesting or informative...
Re:Glad to see it (Score:4, Informative)
GAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!!
Somebody above pointed this out, and I know you're just a parody, but I can't let this slip by:
PORT 443 IS NOT MAGICALLY ENCRYPTED JUST BECAUSE OF THE NUMBER 443!!!!
A port is an integer, nothing more. It's just a number that a client and a server agree to associate with a given connection so that they can keep track (ok, it's not quite that simple since most clients and servers have multiple connections running that are notionally but not actually using the same port).
Associating the number "443" does not magically cause your data to be sent encrypted. Similarly, port 80 (or 21, or 110, or what have you) does not magically prevent you from sending encrypted data: if I set my server to receive https connections over port 80, and you set your client to send https connections over port 80, we will have a secure connection over port 80. If I set my server to listen for a plaintext connection over port 443, and you set your client to send a plaintext connection over port 443, we will have an unsecure connection over port 443. (This is importante because your IM client is almost certainly not encrypting your chats).
OK, like I said above, it's impossible that you actually run a business (and kudos on a brilliant late-90's "do-nothing" firm parody), I just couldn't leave any lurkers with the mistaken belief that something about the number 443 mysteriously encrypts communications.
IHBT IHL IWHAND
Parody I hope (Score:2)
Given that the portfolio is "Coming Soon", the fact that the "Proofreading Services" paragraph had three typos, and the utterly brilliant meaningless name of "problem-solution.biz" (could we be more 1998?), I had to assume this was an impressive parody.
If not, I'm very, very sad that these idiots managed to get their hands on enough money to start a business.
I've got a bill to propose myself (Score:5, Funny)
Anyone care to sponsor?
Re:I've got a bill to propose myself (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:I've got a bill to propose myself (Score:2)
It's no mystery at all! (Score:5, Insightful)
Not a mystery to me!
By saying that this product that you're willfully installing has a "privacy risk", you're saying you don't mind if the product compromises your privacy.
It's a legal loophole that could allow the RIAA/MPAA to install plugins that will monitor you at your machine. After all - you agreed to it when you installed the software. You said you didn't mind if your privacy was compromised.
This one is very sneaky. I'd never install anything that told me it might compromise my privacy.
Weaselmancer
Mystery? (Score:5, Insightful)
How this would deter P2P activity is a bit of a mystery.
Is it any more of a mystery than the belief that spying on every American citizen will deter terrorism?
"could create a stupidity risk" (Score:2)
When Smith, Berman, and Conyers are up for re-election, ballots papers should give a warning against them:
Flash back to.... (Score:5, Funny)
(for those of you a little slow today and before I get accused of being flame bait, this is sort of a 'toungue in cheek' rant).
Warning Labels (Score:2)
The RIAA thinks it's too broad? (Score:2)
Mitch Glazier, the RIAA's senior vice president and lobbyist, says "notice is a good idea, and quite frankly, P2P services ought to be doing it voluntarily...So, we support the chairman, we like the concept--but agree that it is overly broad in its current form."
How bad does it have to be for the RIAA to think it's too broad? That's like Rush Limbaugh saying [insert name here] is too conservative.
Where is the encrypted P2P? (Score:2, Insightful)
In other words... (Score:2)
In other words, don't be surprised when someone (read: RIAA) has been snooping on your activities in said program.
Congress Critters (Score:3, Funny)
Let's post a similar warning in front of Capitol Hill.
'a security and privacy risk' (Score:2)
As far as file sharing, I have no problem with my household teenage unit enjoying free music. Given the typical bitrate of the tunes she's downloading, there's very little difference between P2P music & taping off the FM radio. OTOH, all that garbage that her favorite P2P softwar
Not bizarre at all.. this is what it means: (Score:4, Insightful)
In the current 9 year-old suing world of the RIAA, victims are found by firing up Kazaa (or Grokster or [insert your favorite gnutella-like p2p client here]) and seeing who is sharing and who is downloading. The "who" is given by the IP address of the P2P client computer. Now.. that doesn't really do the RIAA any good because they cannot sue an IP address. So they bully smaller, weaker ISP's into giving out their private customer information. Thus an IP address leads to a name.
Here comes the problem. Some ISP's aren't buying it. Some are saying "our customer privacy is more important than your rampage". This bill makes it so that the clients have "agreed" that they are not annonymous, and that the federal government has the right to grab your personal information and hand it over to the RIAA as they see fit (or just allow the RIAA to grab the now-non-private personal information directly from the ISP). What's more, you cannot counter-sue for privacy infringment because you've agreed to this (since you're using this software that has these statements embedded, and it's all part of the EULA).
Bought & paid for legislators (Score:2)
Howard Berman, D-Calif; = Movie Industry Lackey
John Conyers, D-Mich = Recording Industry Lackey
But who's paying for this guy?
Lamar Smith, R-Texas;
You get what you sow. (Score:2)
First of all, when you ask government to intervene in any issue, you will have to expect unintended consequences of that action. Most of the time those consequences happen years if not
The Bill Offers RIAA Protection for Reprisal? (Score:5, Interesting)
It is possible that this is meant in part to help RIAA attack users' machines through the P2P medium... if everyone accepts the risk, the RIAA could claim that this is a sort of consent to allow projected electronic damage by those running the software, or at least an acknowledgement that it may happen. I know it is a stretch, but why else would the RIAA push for this?
Isn;t MS's... (Score:2)
Dubious criminalization. (Score:2)
It's easy to see how this could be used as a tool against unpopular sites much in the same way that the DMCA's takedown notices are used now. Even if you have a warning you could always be attacked for not warning someone "enough."
What intrigues me more a
Legal music sharing alternative... (Score:2)
Many current apps ARE security risks (Score:3, Insightful)
Agreed, firewall off every port. I'm sick of all the worms that crawl through irresponsibly managed computers. Apps with security holes are setting up PCs on broadband as spam relays, DoS drones, and other blended threat tools.
Many current P2P, email, and instant messaging apps are security risks, and cause problems for naive Internet users (i.e., the vaste majority). Those insecure apps, quite simply, pose a risk to network security, privacy of the end-user, etc. They should be behind firewalls. I find no rational reason to disagree with those stated intentions for the bill, aside from FUD relating to the RIAA's intentions and long-term goals for their puppets.
Re:Uh oh! MOD Parent Funny (Score:3, Funny)
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(This is part of the new M3 Moderation system, for people who can't M or M2 Moderate.)