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Television Media Encryption Security

Cable Box Piracy Ring Busted 352

WC as Kato writes "The U.S. Attorney's Office said it has busted a huge cable piracy ring. They made over $10 million in 5 years by advertising on the Internet and in magazines. Their only cover to the illegality of their actions was a disclaimer that the boxes were not illegal to own. Police say customers who purchased them are now at risk of being arrested. Did any customer actually fall for their 'legal disclaimer?'"
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Cable Box Piracy Ring Busted

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  • Well... (Score:5, Funny)

    by lamery ( 598414 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @05:43AM (#7762540)
    If it looks like a binding legal agreement it must be one. *cough* eula *cough*
  • 4 when it's /.ed (Score:3, Informative)

    by fmlug.org ( 695374 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @05:44AM (#7762545) Homepage
    Here it is find the story here-->
    http://fox40.trb.com/news/ktxl-121703ille galcable, 0,4418393.story?coll=ktxl-news-1

    Two Men Accused In Illegal Cable Piracy Scam

    Police Say Suspects Offered Free Television For The One-time Price Of A 200 Dollar Chip

    Mike Bond

    December 17, 2003

    SACRAMENTO -- It was installation day for residents at a new apartment complex in North Natomas.

    But for every legitimate cable customer who signs up, Comcast officials say there are plenty of people ripping off programming with illegal descramblers called black boxes.

    Assistant US Attorney Robert Tice- Raskin says, "The disclaimer were really nothing more than a wink and a nod by these conspirators to members of the public."

    At a news conference this afternoon, federal prosecutors announced they'd arrested two people who are accused of selling descramblers throughout the state and the country.

    Over the past five and a half years, they're accused of masterminding a money laundering scheme that's earned them more than 10-million dollars.

    US Attorney McGregor Scott says, "The dollar amounts that are involved really make this stand out -- it really is a unique and distinct set of circumstances."

    Officials say the descramblers were advertised on the internet and in magazines with a disclaimer that the boxes were not against the law to own.

    Nevertheless, police say customers who purchased them are now at risk of being arrested.

    Sacramento County Sheriff Lou Blanas says, "Common sense dictates if you have a black box, you're violating the law, disclaimer or no disclaimer. I mean if that was the case, everybody would have access to these movies!"

    Cable Customer Gwenice Garnett says, "I'm not going to squeal on 'em, but I do know people who have them."

    Gwenice Garnett was happy to hear about the bust as she stopped by Comcast this evening to upgrade to digital cable.

    She's paying 70-bucks a month.

    Garnette says, "I pay a substantial amount of money for my cable and if I have to pay, they should have to pay!"
    • by Anonymous Coward
      Boggle!!! Do people really do that??? Are they really that desperate for television??? Don't they have lives to get on with???
      • Actually.... (Score:5, Interesting)

        by TygerFish ( 176957 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @07:59AM (#7762982)
        Actually, I've seen people pay more for it... especially in packages combinating basic television, premium/movie channels, data services and what have you.

        Considering that in New York city at least, Time Warner Cable appears to have withdrawn pay-per-view movie access from all but its digital customers without bothering to mention that it has done so, there is a strong pressure for its customers to pay more.

        It is also easy to see why some people see nothing wrong with trying to avoid paying eight-hundred-forty dollars per year for access to the USA network and, eventually, Gigli shown and repeated again and again and again...

      • Have you looked at the price on some of those "season pass" style sports packages? You know... the ones that give you every game the league plays... We're talking HUNDREDS of dollars.
  • DMCA,,,? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by cRueLio ( 679516 ) <cruelio.msn@com> on Friday December 19, 2003 @05:45AM (#7762546) Homepage Journal
    I bet they will try the customers under the DMCA, having used the cable box as a "circumvention device" against protections put up by the cable provider.

    Then again, a crafty legal time might just be able to argue this case in terms of the fact that the customer was fooled by the legal disclaimer.

    Just my two cents...

    • Re:DMCA,,,? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by dissy ( 172727 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:49AM (#7762743)
      Before the DMCA, technically they were right, these boxes _are_ legal to own.
      Now, its very illegal to _USE_ them... But to just own one, that was not.

      Now granted, who in their right mind would spend money on one just to own and not use, I couldnt tell ya. But as far as the disclaimer goes, they only mentioned owning, not using, so it was technically acurate and truthful.

      But you are no doubt right. DMCA makes any trafficing in them illegal now, including buying one.

      I'm shocked these two people kept records around at all.
      Saving finantual documents for 7 years is only for ligit businesses after all ;)

      • Re:DMCA,,,? (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Eggplant62 ( 120514 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @07:02AM (#7762781)
        Before the DMCA, technically they were right, these boxes _are_ legal to own.
        Now, its very illegal to _USE_ them... But to just own one, that was not.


        I'm curious about this situation where I might be able to see where there *is* a legal, non-infringing use. Suppose I already am a subscriber, but I purchase my own equipment, ie, one of these black boxes, to use instead of my cable provider's in order to save the extra charges they tack on to the bill for each box? Fair use? Or illegal?
        • Fiar use... (Score:3, Insightful)

          by FreeUser ( 11483 )
          I'm curious about this situation where I might be able to see where there *is* a legal, non-infringing use. Suppose I already am a subscriber, but I purchase my own equipment, ie, one of these black boxes, to use instead of my cable provider's in order to save the extra charges they tack on to the bill for each box? Fair use? Or illegal?

          Fair use. But don't tell that to our whored out congress; they'll just use it to sell themselves cheap to yet another corporate media John and turn another Trick.
        • Here you go: (Score:4, Informative)

          by geekoid ( 135745 ) <{moc.oohay} {ta} {dnaltropnidad}> on Friday December 19, 2003 @12:03PM (#7765582) Homepage Journal
          " In Section 629 of the Communications Act, as added by the Telecommunications Act of 1996, Congress directed the FCC to create rules that would allow consumers to obtain "navigation devices" -- meaning set top boxes, remote control units and other equipment -- from commercial sources other than their multichannel programming service provider."

          http://ftp.fcc.gov/Bureaus/Cable/News_Releases/1 99 9/nrcb9009.html

          "Service providers are prohibited from taking actions that would prevent navigation devices
          that do not perform conditional access functions from being made available from retailers,
          manufacturers, or other unaffiliated vendors."

          http://www.fcc.gov/Bureaus/Cable/News_Releases/1 99 8/nrcb8013.txt

          Here is what is going on, in a nut shell:

          In 1996* the FCC ruled that consumer can by set top boxes and use them to access cable TV sa long as trhe consumer is paying for the service. Basicaly giving the consumer an option to renting the devices.

          The the Cable/Satalite companies started adding 'security' devices intergrated into the set top box, and has said consuymer can't create something that 'circumnavigates' those device.

          So now the commision as saifd that the security devices need to be seperated from the reciever.

          Cable companies have tried to fight this, but the FCC has rulled against them.

          • Re:Here you go: (Score:3, Interesting)

            Yeah but the guy with a black box may think he's safe because he pays for basic cable, but the black box decodes all the channels including the pay per view stuff so he's really not paying for it all.

            A person using this while paying for basic cable service is theft. It's no different then walking into a store, shoplifting a bunch of stuff and paying for a pair of socks!

            To steal cable without paying at all requires running a cable a splicing it to the pole. This happens but it's less likely due to the te
        • Re:DMCA,,,? (Score:4, Informative)

          by zakezuke ( 229119 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @12:26PM (#7765911)
          I'm curious about this situation where I might be able to see where there *is* a legal, non-infringing use. Suppose I already am a subscriber, but I purchase my own equipment, ie, one of these black boxes, to use instead of my cable provider's in order to save the extra charges they tack on to the bill for each box? Fair use? Or illegal?

          The problem is actually talking to the cable company and getting them to hookup third party equipment. In theory you can do this no problem, though I've had NO luck picking up boxes at the local thrift store as their responce was "It looks stolen the stickers are missing". I assumed that it was probally cable owned, but some poor sap didn't return it and got charged an arm and a leg for it, and as a direct result it was actually legaly purchaced rather then being stolen. But alas, they won't even look into it, they'll just snag the box, put it under their desk, give you $20.00 and send you on your way.

    • Re:DMCA,,,? (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Urkki ( 668283 )
      Actually I see this as one of the few places where the principle of DMCA is somewhat justified. Ie the principle that it's illegal to go around digital protection techniques in order to use non-free digital content for free.

      Anything beyond that (such as saying you can't make mp3 rips of your own CDs for your own convenience, like for car *and* portable player *and* summer cottage), as well as the punishments in DMCA are still ridiculous though, as well as a lot of other implied stuff in it.
      • Re:DMCA,,,? (Score:2, Interesting)

        interesting. so you own the right to use the content on the cd you purchased, but not the right to inspect and possibly use the extra content being streamed into your house by the cable company provider that you didn't order?

        lets say new cd's start coming out with extra content on them (high quality mp3's of tracks not on the disk perhaps) that is encrypted, and to access the work, you need to purchase a key from the distribution company (RIAA). maybe microsoft media player licenses the right to have emb
        • Re:DMCA,,,? (Score:4, Insightful)

          by Urkki ( 668283 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @08:59AM (#7763401)
          I'm talking about the principle here. We're entering an era where a lot of things are digital, immaterial. There are a lot of issues that are still seeking form, such as copyright issues with material that is trivial to copy.

          Also, this is not a case where the users who bought the device in article figured out a way to get protected content. They paid somebody else to get their hands on that content wihtout paying the content provider. My common sense says that's on a general level same as stealing (like sneaking into a ball game or a movie without a ticket, or buying a forged ticket from street and using it, you know what I mean). Wether it is a big or small crime and how it should be punished is a good question, but IMHO there's no question that making it punishable is somehow wrong.

          In my opinion, digital protection schemes should be such that you can not "unintentionally" or trivially go around them, but they don't need to be unbreakable, because that puts too much cost in the distribution, and guess who pays that cost... Ordering a descrambling device is not unintentional, and it's not trivial either (if it were, you wouldn't need to order a plug-and-play device from somebody else, you could just do it yourself). Therefore I think that this is *just* the kind of thing a sensible version of DMCA would be about.

          There's a lot of gray area here obiviously, but I don't see this as a big problem. There's a lot of gray area in other legal things too, such as traffic. Like you can get fined for jaywalking on an empty street if you meet a nasty police officer, but it's not very sensible to suggest that jaywalking should always be legal.
  • by errl ( 43525 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @05:49AM (#7762560) Homepage
    ... why people never stop their illegal activities when they've earned enough money? I mean, $5,000,000 should be enough for anyone for quite a while? It seems that they'll eventually get caugh otherwise and don't have any real use of the money anyways, like in this case...
    • by fmlug.org ( 695374 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @05:54AM (#7762587) Homepage
      Money, thats why people dont stop there illegal actions. Its like gambaling, oh I just won $50 but if I put it all back in I get $500. That kinda pay off clouds peoples judgement, most of the time the fact that they may end up losing everything doesnt even enter into their minds. We live in a society where every one wants to get rich easily and dont wana work for the money. The reality is the easier the money is to come by the quicker your going to lose it, well at least most of the time. I guess thats my 2 cents.
    • by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 19, 2003 @05:54AM (#7762588)
      640K should be enough for anyone.

      -- Bill Gates, 1982.
    • they do! just in the cases when they stop at $5M, and never get caught, you do not see thm in the news. that's the main reason for stopping at $5M - not to be caught, not to make it to the news. vajk
    • Stainless Steel Rat (Score:5, Interesting)

      by wowbagger ( 69688 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @07:49AM (#7762949) Homepage Journal
      In Harry Harrison's "Stainless Steel Rat" series, one of the central tenets of the lead character, "Slippery" Jim DeGriz, the most wanted interstellar criminal, was "When a con finally starts going bad, walk away - don't try to cash that last check". Hence he very rarely got caught.

      It is the same thing here - the folks who are smart enough to walk away before things go south are never caught - thus we never really hear about them in the news. The only ones we hear about are the stupid ones who cash the last check and get busted.

      I once heard a cop say "I've been throwing these punks up against the wall for 20 years, and I've never once found a Mensa card in their pockets."
      • by Motherfucking Shit ( 636021 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @09:16AM (#7763559) Journal
        It is the same thing here - the folks who are smart enough to walk away before things go south are never caught - thus we never really hear about them in the news. The only ones we hear about are the stupid ones who cash the last check and get busted.
        Ponderous, man, ponderous.

        This reminds me of something I saw on 20/20 or 48 Hours a couple of weeks ago. A pair of guys came up with an ingenious scam: their local horse racing track posted unclaimed winning ticket numbers on its website. Apparently, winning tickets could be fed into a machine at the track which would verify things via some OCR magic, then spit out cash money. These two guys got the bright idea to print up fake unclaimed "winning tickets" with the right font, etc. to fool the cash machines.

        Everything was going just fine. They were pulling the scam and cashing out to the tune of thousands of dollars a month - as one of them said in the interview, it was "unclaimed money," it's not like they were sticking up banks. At this pace, they never would have been caught; a few grand a month was way under the radar of the gaming commission. Then, one of the fools got greedy and decided to print up a forged ticket for a practically impossible series of bets, which paid off in the millions. People got suspicious damn quick. Now they're both in jail.

        It's definitely true, greed will ruin just about any successful scam. If these two guys had just kept running their few-$K/month scam, I bet they'd still be out there living the good life.
        • God, I'm always amazed at the people who blow some solid scam, good for a reliable source of money. A couple of $K per month would be perfect and, over time, would be a huge amount of money that could substantially increase one's standard of living. In 5 years at $2k per month, you'd have over a hundred thousand dollars, tax free!

          If you used it to pay off your mortgage, the savings would be even larger -- potentially hundreds of thousands of dollars. At that point the weatlh effect would be trivial.
    • You will never see reports about the people who had that plan and did it right and got away with it.

      You can't distinguish between people who had no plan and those who had your plan but set their sights too high. Maybe these people simply planned on $15M and got caught before reaching their goal.
  • Geez" (Score:4, Funny)

    by Sklivvz ( 167003 ) * <marco,cecconi&gmail,com> on Friday December 19, 2003 @05:51AM (#7762573) Homepage Journal
    Two guys got arrested. Big news, indeed. What a huge ring!

    Was it "The One Ring", by any chance? :^D

    And now for some karma whoring: "in Soviet Russia the ring arrests you!"

  • Dear DirecTV (Score:5, Insightful)

    by mikeswi ( 658619 ) * on Friday December 19, 2003 @05:53AM (#7762579) Homepage Journal

    Dear DirecTV,

    Please take note. This [trb.com] is how you deal with people pirating your signals without being viewed as jackbooted thugs. You find people buying and selling equipment designed specifically to do that.

    Contrast this to your current methods which involve extorting protection money out of people who do NOT pirate your signals simply because they bought a programmable smart card with a wide range of possible uses, one of which *might* lead to the pirating of your signals.

    • Re:Dear DirecTV (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Pompatus ( 642396 )
      Contrast this to your current methods which involve extorting protection money out of people who do NOT pirate your signals simply because they bought a programmable smart card with a wide range of possible uses, one of which *might* lead to the pirating of your signals.

      True, but on the other hand if you bought your smartcard programmer from a site called www.hackdss.com I think there is a plausable argument that you might have purchaced said equipment to hack dss.
      • Re:Dear DirecTV (Score:3, Informative)

        by Freedom Bug ( 86180 )
        True, but on the other hand if you bought your smartcard programmer from a site called www.hackdss.com I think there is a plausable argument that you might have purchaced said equipment to hack dss.

        How about if that was because it was the only way to get one at a reasonable price? Most of the legitimate places that sell things like that are not set up to sell single units to consumers. You can pretend to be a real engineer actually designing products for sale and get yourself a free evaluation unit, or

  • I have to say... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Zog The Undeniable ( 632031 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @05:55AM (#7762591)
    On a scale of major crimes, this one is seen by Joe Schmoe in the same serious vein as crossing at a "Don't Walk" light. Apparently a contributory factor to the collapse of ITV Digital in the UK was that hundreds of thousands of Scots were using pirate viewing cards, sold openly on Glasgow and Edinburgh street markets, and not paying a penny to ITV. There's a huge appetite out there for "free" TV as subscription TV is seen as overpriced - considering you get even more adverts than on free-to-air TV.

    Significant that it was Fox who carried the article though - they have something to lose ;-)

  • by AndroidCat ( 229562 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:03AM (#7762621) Homepage
    I wonder if these jerks were any relation to the ones who keep spamming me for "completely legal" descrambling devices?

    The fact that they hijacked someone else's computer to send me that "completely legal" message would be a tip-off if all the other signs failed.

  • by Lord Bitman ( 95493 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:04AM (#7762624)
    There are very simple methods by which the box on the street, which you own, can be forced to not send signals into my home.
    Sorry, though, as any signals which you broadcast directly into my home without any contract between us, I will do whatever I want with.
    Anyone who thinks they shouldnt be allowed to recieve whatever signals are being broadcast into their home is an idiot. I'm not hacking in to your box, or touching your property at all. If you beam signals directly toward me, you don't get to complain when I use them.
    Stop sending signals to the homes of non-subscribers and you will absolutely never have this problem again. You are not allowed to take away basic rights of perception in order to save a few bucks.
    • by WIAKywbfatw ( 307557 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:37AM (#7762714) Journal
      (OK, I going to get flamed to hell and back for posting this, but here goes nothing.)

      This "if your signals penetrate my airwaves then they belong to me and I can do whatever I like with them" argument really is flawed.

      Yes, if you were an island state that would hold true, but you're not, you're an American citizen (or the citizen of another country) and you're bound by the rules and laws of the country that you live in.

      Now, if you live in the US, you have to play by the US government's rules. One of the rules says that killing someone is forbidden, and that if you kill someone then that's a crime and you have to pay for your crime.

      Another one of the rules says that certain wavelengths of the RF spectrum belong to (or are for the exclusive use of) certain governmental organisations (eg, the US armed forces, police departments) or private corporations (eg, DirecTV). In the former case, these wavelengths are used without compensation, but in the latter case, the corporations concerned are paying for the right to exclusive use of those frequencies.

      Just who are they paying? Well, directly, they are paying your government, and hence, indirectly, they are paying you/i>. So, although they might not be sending you personally a cheque (check) in the post, you are being paid for the use of those airwaves.

      Now, if you disagree with this arangement, if you don't like any third party owning then the solution is simple: Lobby your Congressman and/or other representatives.

      But, please, don't pretend that DirecTV or whoever has no right to be upset when you decode their signals without paying for their service. They have every right, and that right was sold to them by your government.

      Obviously, this arrangement of rights between the individual, the government and the corporation will vary from country to country. (For example, if you're Canadian, then intercepting signals intended for the US market and doing with them whatever you want is legal, as determined by the Canadian legal system.)

      But pretending that the law of the land can be ignored and that "if you beam signals directly toward me, you don't get to complain when I use them", and "you are not allowed to take away basic rights of perception in order to save a few bucks", are poor arguments that fail to take into account that the rights here (as determined by law) are with the transmitter and not the receiver.

      Now feel free to retort. Just keep the personal insults out of it please?

      • > This "if your signals penetrate my airwaves then they belong to me and I can do whatever I like with them" argument really is flawed.

        Like the old Benny Hill skit where a woman leans over his fence and he thinks that gives him a right to grope her tits.

      • I don't disagree with you in principle. However, most companies that use the airwaves do not in fact pay the (U.S.) government (and by connection, me) for the airwaves. The government just gives them away because they are stupid. Thus, regardless of the explicitly illegality of tapping a broadcast signal, there's no implicit payment going on. They got my air for free.

    • You seem to be trolling, but anyway...

      Stop sending signals to the homes of non-subscribers and you will absolutely never have this problem again. You are not allowed to take away basic rights of perception in order to save a few bucks.

      Stop sending the signals... um... how? If you have even the faintest idea how broadcasting networks work you know that this is not feasible.

      The signals are encrypted for a reason, you pay for a service, and get the decryption harware as part of the deal. If you decrypt th
      • by Anonymous Coward
        Actually it is possible to stop sending the signals to a person's house. I was recently annoyed at my $100 cable/internet bill and was going to downgrade my service from whatever was just a step above basic back down to basic.

        They told me it would cost $15, so they could send out a service man to install a "part" that would filter out the channels they normally send descrambled.

        ----

        What I'm guessing it boils down to is that it is too much hassel and expense, especially when the cable industry was young,
  • Gwenice Garnett was happy to hear about the bust as she stopped by Comcast this evening to upgrade to digital cable. She's paying 70-bucks a month. Garnette says,
    "I pay a substantial amount of money for my cable and if I have to pay, they should have to pay!"

    Wow, with people like this all the cable company has to do is offer a prize of $25.00.00.00 (Twenty Five $$$$$$ only) and every "pirate" is going to be rat-ted out in no time.

    More money will of course be made when the Rat gets on the TV shows "selling" their story of how they bravely turned in every Tom, Jane, and Harry to collect their Mega Bounty.

    And with DEA conspiring to get the Kids to rat on their parents, the determination of the Assistant US Attorney should be in doubt to no one ..


    • What I find scary is that there are people out there willing to pay 70 dollars a month for TELEVISION!

      Sure it also includes the "premium" channels but:

      70 dollars a month for the privilege of being able to suckle at the electric teat every night???

      INSANE.
      • 70 dollars a month for the privilege of being able to suckle at the electric teat every night???
        INSANE.
        Not nearly as delicious as the delicate aquamarine teat of Slashdot. mmmm... /.teat...
      • 70 dollars a month for the privilege of being able to suckle at the electric teat every night???

        I pay more, but my cable modem is part of the deal. I use that more than the TV. There are only seven or eight channels that I watch, but the buck or so a day isn't that bad a deal. The other part of the bill, the buck or so a day for the cable modem, is even less of a bother. While I'd love to pay for the channels I want instead of the hundreds (including music) I get, what you're really paying for is the

      • Stiletto says:
        70 dollars a month for the privilege of being able to suckle at the electric teat every night???

        INSANE.

        Now, $70/month for DSL, on the other hand...

        (Yeah, I have static IPs and faster-than-minimum service.)

    • cable companies don't even need to pay people to get them to rat on each other. You can do it for free on this website [cabletheft.com], and I'm sure there are others. I know Comcast is involved in the above one, there was an article in the Baltimore Sun a while ago about the program - they have been running ads on TV and have had quite a bit of luck getting people to turn on their neighbors.

      For an amusing, RIAA-esque read, check out the cabletheft.com "get the facts" section, which blames cable theft not only for highe

  • Bloated Prices (Score:5, Informative)

    by Saint Mitchell ( 144618 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:14AM (#7762651)
    I was going to get Comcast at my new house. Then when I called to find out what it would cost me for "basic" digital cable + internet. $120+ a month. I about fell out of my chair.

    Since I had made up my mind I wasn't going to swallow that pill, I decided to mess with the guy. I asked im if he knew why they couldn't say fuck on basic cable. "I don't know". Well, it's because technically it's a FREE service. We pay for the access to the cable, the programming is FREE. This is how HBO gets away with things like Real Sex, you PAY for the service. So, my question is why are you jacking up the price when you pay nothing for it? "Well, sir, that is our price. I have no control over what we charge. Can I set up an install date for you?" Maybe, can you tell me if there is an equipment rental charge in there somewhere. "Yes sir." Can I guy buy a cable box so I don't have to rent one from you. "No sir, that is illegal. Can I take your order for service, sir" No, no you can't.

    Oh how I miss Time Warner. I never thought the day would come when I would say that. It is indeeed a sad day. I've even ordered DSL from the evil phone company. Did I move to bizzaro world and didn't know it?
    • That's about what I pay Cox, but that includes a DVR rental and fee for service.

      I don't think it's that much. The digital cable is something like $60/month and the internet service is $35; the remainder is the DVR rental and service fees, plus taxes, of course.

      --RJ
    • Just get the cable modem for 45.00 and hook up your tv you will get basic cable. They only filter out above channel 75 and the pay channels that you need a decoder for. At least in denver that's what i do.
    • Yeah - I had basically the same - and Comcast was jacking up the price of my package again, so I decided it was time to try Satellite.

      Before:
      Phone - Comcast $45/mo (was $29 when first obtained)
      Internet - Comcast $50/mo ($60 w/o basic cable)
      Cable - Digital Silver package - $50/mo
      net total: $145/mo

      Switch (all numbers rounded):
      Phone - Qwest $40/mo (incumbent required by ISP)
      Internet - SpeakEasy - $70/mo (1500/768 w/2 static IPs - for 1500/256 it's $60 - promotional rates go through Dec 31)
      Dish network $40/mo
    • FOr me DSL costs just about as much, with a $200 install fee (or something in that $200 neighborhood) for slower speeds (I get T1 from my cable modem, I guess no one in my neighborhood uses it!). It doesn't make sense! Cable seemed to come out cheaper.

      So I get the basic, the plus, I added HBO, and Cable modem. I don't like digital (I think its 300 channels you don't get and 80 you do, most of which suck) so my bill is right around $100.

      So $100 for T1 speeds and HBO. And their uptime has been pretty goo
  • by nich37ways ( 553075 ) <slashdot@37ways.org> on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:18AM (#7762661) Homepage

    Gwenice Garnett was happy to hear about the bust as she stopped by Comcast this evening to upgrade to digital cable.


    She's paying 70-bucks a month.


    Garnette says, "I pay a substantial amount of money for my cable and if I have to pay, they should have to pay!"


    Living in Australia digital tv and all the joys of interactive tv and movies on demand is still to be rolled out AFAIK anyway, I believe it is due sometime next year


    However I find it hard to believe that people are so willing to pay so much to watch advertisements and it will surely get worse in the future.


    *put on tinfoil hat*

    Digital tv means providers can finally start to monitor who is watching what and when, this means they get to build up massive databases of viewing patterns. Combine this with an increased level of profiling and we get targeted advertising. The great joy of been told what we want according to what we watch and whatever random data the advertising companies have bought.

    If anyone out there has digital tv, they are monitoring you, they will use the data to directly advertise to you and to take as much of your money as possible.


    *takeoff tinfoil hat*

    Anyone who believes this will not happen is at best naive and worst extremely foolish. I know it will not happen in the next year, but the ground work is been laid now and I see no sensible way to avoid it unless people refuse to watch digital tv, an unlikely proposition or it is legislated by the government (an unlikely thing)


    Anyone with any ideas on how to try and escape the future of advertising hell..


    • Actually, I don't think the problem is with advertising per se, or even with targeted advertising.

      I'd rather think that the primary objections people (well at least I) have are:

      Getting advertising despite paying for a service (for example, with cable TV, or TV license fees (YUCK!) in some European countries.

      Ways in which "targeting" data is obtained and handled--i.e. resold.

      I don't mind advertising targeted towards me, as long as I (a) get to pick what's sent my way (I rather enjoy some well-done ads

      • Getting advertising despite paying for a service

        You're paying for your internet connection, but you understand the need of sites like Slashdot to have advertisements. When you're paying for your cable connection, ask yourself where the TV content providers are supposed to get money from. My ISP doesn't give a dime to Slashdot, The Onion or any of my favorite sites. Even the Goatse guy doesn't get any money from them. I can't pretend that my cable bill supports DIY or Speed.


        • TV content providers make money by selling that content to TV stations. TV stations charge cable providers to allow them to carry their signal.

          Viewing a website is not my prime motivation for using my internet connection--it is not the raison d'etre for the internet. I use my internet connection primarily to check mail, download things, etc--that incurs _bandwidth_ costs, which is what my ISP fees pay for. And the ISP fees of the guy on the other end of the line.

          You can't really make the comparison bet
          • Viewing a website is not my prime motivation for using my internet connection--it is not the raison d'etre for the internet.

            You're here on Slashdot, and your ISP's bill doesn't pay their bills. I live out in the woods, so I need to pay a Cable Service Provider to bring me TV. The TV stations that I am now paying to watch aren't getting paid, unless they're along the lines of HBO. So they sell advertising, which I don't like, but understand.

            I don't think that TV is much more passive than the internet


            • Yeah but you're missing my point--I come here to get the "free" content, in exchange for which, I agree implicitly to view their ads. That's fine. It's something I do on top of my "normal" use of the Internet.

              I guess your TV system works different from mine then, since TV stations here (Switzerland) are paid by cable providers. Think of the TV stations as a combination of resellers and providers of content.

              Naturally, if you have regular non-satellite broadcast TV, the situation changes radically.
      • You'd be surprised at how many of these you get on TV during dinnertime here.

        This is intentional. Your disgust increases the chance that:

        You remember when you are less unfortunate

        You break a dinner conversation to express your disgust and focus the attention of someone who already is.

        So it is calculated and intended.

    • Digital tv means providers can finally start to monitor who is watching what and when, this means they get to build up massive databases of viewing patterns. Combine this with an increased level of profiling and we get targeted advertising. The great joy of been told what we want according to what we watch and whatever random data the advertising companies have bought.

      Actually I quite like the idea of targetted advertising. I'd be more interested in adverts of technology gadgets, restaurants, sports and m

    • by Roofus ( 15591 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @08:15AM (#7763078) Homepage
      If anyone out there has digital tv, they are monitoring you

      You are so full of it. Might it happen in the future? Maybe. Is it happening now? No.

      Once the digital cable box has been provisioned and 'hit', it does not talk back to the headend when you change a channel, since it already has the access list in memory. Do you have any idea how much memory one of those boxes has? Not enough to be recording your viewing habits.

      The above statement doesn't apply to services like VOD and PPV, since when you order one of the those the box does talk back to the headend. But of course, if that really bothers you that much, do you boycott Blockbuster and all movie rental stores as well? Because they know what you watch! Ooh!
    • Digital tv means providers can finally start to monitor who is watching what and when, this means they get to build up massive databases of viewing patterns.

      Not in my world buddy! here in the UK, I have free to air digital TV and there ain't no way for them to tell which channel I am watching at any given time. I am not sure about the technology of determining which channels are being watched without some kind of "upstream" connection in addition to just the decoder, but even so the broadcast version

      • But you forget that you've got the trucks driving around the neighborhood checking to see how many TV sets you have so you'll pay the appropriate tax. Free? I think not. Anonymous? I think not. No way to tell what you're watching? Maybe not directly for the provider, but not that hard for a government bent on monitoring its citizens.
    • If anyone out there has digital tv, they are monitoring you, they will use the data to directly advertise to you and to take as much of your money as possible.

      While I don't want to be monitored, I don't mind targetted advertising. Let them do it anonymously. I'd rather see ads for new-to-market products and services that interest me rather than a lot of garbage that does not.

      This is, for the most part, good stuff. It's what makes the economy run. At least in the US, we could use a boost. I have

    • I'm still not sure what's so terrible about targeted advertising. I'll only see ads for things I might be interested in. That's awful! No more ads for Viagra? No more ads for Depends Adult Diapers? What ever will I do?!?!?!

      They aren't forcing me to buy anything, they're simply tailoring their ads to things I might want. Good. That's sort of the point of technology, to improve people's lives. And I consider NOT seeing ads for luxury cruises, mutual funds, and pay-per-view sporting events to be an im
  • by Powercntrl ( 458442 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:18AM (#7762662) Homepage
    A quick search on Google [google.com] reveals that Digital Cable services have not been hacked. Indeed the only cable descramblers that are/were sold can be broken down into 4 catagories:

    1. Analog filters
    These removed a signal that was placed on a nearby frequency to that of the channel the cable company wanted to "scramble". I'm not even sure if this old form of protection is even used anymore. The end-user benefit of this protection was you did not need a cable box.

    2. Chips/jumpers
    Usually the channel is scrambled by missing a sync signal and you're provided by the cable company with a decoder box that can selectively re-create it. Adding a chip or jumpers tricks the box into decoding channels you didn't pay for. This method of analog protection is also quite old.

    3. Digital cable filters
    Blocks your digital cable decoder from communicating with the mother ship. Briefly get PPV movies for free, then you can't order any more until you remove the filter (at which point it phones home and you get billed anyway). Similar in effect to unplugging the phone line from a DirecTV box.

    4. Cable TV "decoder" boxes
    Found online and in your typical junk magazines... These are basically just an external tuner and remodulator to make a non-cable-ready TV (the old kind that just get VHF and UHF only) analog cable ready.

    If this business was really hacking digital cable, that would sure be some big news... Most likely they were selling old analog crap or snake oil products.
    • There's another way as well. Don't know if the cable co.s still do this, but I knew someone who, all they needed to do to get cable into their house, was remove a 'gapper' that was screwed in at the house. In other words, the only thing that was preventing a connection was the lack of a physical connection. A little cyclinder about an inch long, screwed into the cable line where it connected to the house, and all it did was create a gap in the line. My friend removed said gapper, and had free cable. Ca
      • The gapper you refer to was just a filter installed on the line. It attenuates the signal to the point where it's too low for a TV to tune to. The frequency range on the filter was probably from 52Mhz to around 400/500 MHz. Anything above that is usually reserved for cable modem downstream and digital cable, both of which are useless unless you have the ability to put yourself into the cable company's provisioning databases.
  • by Channard ( 693317 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:19AM (#7762663) Journal
    .. instead of the ten dollar one.' as the Gord [actsofgord.com] would say. Certainly it seems that there are some completely loopy disclaimers that crop up when grey or illegal activities are involved. There's:

    'These discs are only provided as backups and you must own the original game.' - which raises the question, why isn't the person backing up the game themselves?


    Or 'These roms are legal to download provided you delete them within 24 hours' - despite there being no such law.


    Or my personal favourite.. 'If you are affiliated with any government, or ANTI-Piracy group, Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA), Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), local or state police or government agencies, any record label or recording company or distribution company or group or any other related group or were formally a worker of one you cannot enter this web site, cannot access any of its files and you cannot view any of the pages contained herein. All the objects on this site are private property and are not meant for viewing or any other purposes other then bandwidth space. Do not enter whatsoever! If you enter this site you are not agreeing to these terms and you are violating code 431.322.12 of the Internet Privacy Act signed by Bill Clinton in 1995. That means that you cannot threaten our ISP(s) or any person(s) or company storing these files, cannot prosecute any person(s) affiliated with this page which includes family, friends or individuals who run or enter this web site.'. Wow. Well, that's the feds screwed then. Anyone got any examples of loopier disclaimers?

    • by Afty0r ( 263037 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @07:53AM (#7762957) Homepage
      'These discs are only provided as backups and you must own the original game.' - which raises the question, why isn't the person backing up the game themselves?

      Because the person lives in a contry run by a government which has enacted laws that, while giving them the *right* to make a backup, has made it illegal to sell, give or talk about the equipment required to make the backups. Thus, while the person has the right to carry out the activity, they are prevented by law from doing so.
  • by arcanumas ( 646807 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:19AM (#7762664) Homepage
    Did any customer actually fall for their 'legal disclaimer?'"

    People have bought land in the moon and you are wondering if others would fall for that?

  • "Legal disclaimer" (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Zocalo ( 252965 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:28AM (#7762692) Homepage
    Did any customer actually fall for their 'legal disclaimer?'. Sure they did; the same demographic of people that receives a "confidential email" from a Mr. Mobutu of Nigeria and parts with large sums of cash. However, it's far more likely that the majority of customers probably saw that and thought "yeah, right!", followed quickly by the thoughts "cheap cable!" and "where's my credit card?"
    • ..which leads to another intresting question: why would you give your cc number to people you're fairly sure are criminals? buying from street markets with cash is another thing, the only thing you can lose is the cash(and the electricity network at home if the box is really bad).

      -
  • This story sucks. (Score:5, Informative)

    by Matrix2110 ( 190829 ) * on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:35AM (#7762707) Journal
    I happen to work for a TV station in the area and we reported it a week or so ago. I also happened to get a look at one of these cards and I can safely say they are very fragile in every since of the word. A very thin card, one chip. a couple of resistors, plus a one page of small print. No tech support.

    I know what I am doing and I had a hard time with this thing.

    And no, it never worked.

    Move along, nothing to see here.

    These rip-off artists milked a bunch of greedy people that got burned but did not dare turn them in.

    Until, somebody got ticked off enough to turn everybody in.

    I will leave it to Slashdot to calculate the odds of the squeal factor.

  • by goldspider ( 445116 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @06:50AM (#7762746) Homepage
    Ahoy matey, thar be PIRATES off tha port bow!!

    Seriously foolks, how does one "steal" cable? Did they back a truck up to the back of the cable company building and steal a spool of cable?

    Oh, you mean they're "stealing" information? But but but... INFORMATION WANTS TO BE FREE!!!

    These people are LIBERATING cable, not "stealing" it!

    • Alright, so when the cable company gives you basic cable, you get all extra encrypted channels that you can't view. So I simplified the whole thing and I just, I decode all of them, with a chip that I bought.

      So you're stealing?

      Uh no, no, you don't understand, it's uh, it's very complicated, it's uh, it's, it's aggregate so I'm talking about fractions of a channel here and uh, over time, they add up to a lot.

      Oh okay, so you're gonna get a lot of channels right?

      Yea.

      They're not yours?

      Ah, well they becom
  • blue blackground, gilbert gottfried holds a letter

    "dear directtv

    i made millions selling fake cable boxes. these boxes aren't legal they say? lies! lies!

    sincerely, joe schmoe"

    applause

    "did i capture the guys anger?"
  • by John Seminal ( 698722 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @07:18AM (#7762839) Journal
    don't the cable companies have a rental charge for those boxes? if you order service and pay for it, don't they charge you for each additional descrambler you have to rent. how is owning your descrambler any different from buying a cable modem. you still pay for the service, but instead of renting the equipment, you own it. why should anyone be forced to rent the box? this sounds to me like they are shifting the burden from proving you are doing something illegal like stealing cable, to saying we know you have the box, now prove you are innocent.

    also, for the money you spend, why can't you buy individual chanels from the cable company. why do you have to buy them in a package? what if all i want to buy from them is just cspan and cnn? why cant i buy just those two chanels? what do i also have to get a package? because they are a monopoly and the only other option is a dish, and if you live in a condo or apartment and do not face south, you are screwed.

    • According to federal law...

      http://www.satellite-tv-free.com/rightstosatellite .htm

      You cannot be denied satellite TV. Condo and Apertment regimes may TRY to tell you you can't put up a satellite but they can't do so. I fought this battle with my condo regime and won.

      And technically you can contruct something "unobtrusive" to face the proper direction. This means in MY case a 12 foot pole.

  • by cblguy ( 697834 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @09:04AM (#7763444)
    We had a guy who worked across the hall from me. He was the 'cable cop'. He even had a little silver badge pasted on to his employee access badge. His job was to purchase pirate devices, and then get with engineering on how the company could defeat them. :)

    It was pretty interesting, getting to play with the chipped boxes, seeing what happened. Of course, that was a few years ago when analog still ruled the roost and digital was working but not prevalent.

    Engineering had to come up with different scrambling algorithms to try and keep one step ahead. Those head end scramblers were pretty cool pieces of equipment. We'd throw the latest scrambler firmware at the pirate boxes and see what happened. And then there were the attempts at total picture obliteration (no "nude parts" in a picture). Those were interesting to test. =8)

    I bailed out of that industry, but I must admit, the trade shows were pretty darn good. ;)

  • Here's my problem... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by j-turkey ( 187775 ) on Friday December 19, 2003 @09:44AM (#7763821) Homepage

    My problem with this is that part of the AT&T breakup ruling was that AT&T could not require you to rent or purchase their equipment (anyone here old enough to remember the US pre AT&T breakup remembers that it was "illegal" to buy your own phone and hook it up...or "illegal" to hook up additional phones on your line).

    The federal government stepped in and said that you can't be trapped into renting or buying equipment to use a communications service.

    Now, that being said, why do I have to buy or rent equipment from a cable provider? I can provide my own cable modem. If I plug my computer directly into the wall for cable (in order to use a product like Showshifter, and I pay for premium service -- why can't I descramble it myself? It's decidely not stealing in any was (unless you count timeshifting as stealing, but this is a completely unrelated issue). That being said, why can't I have a descrambler box?

    This is no different than Hughes witch-hunt where they went after anyone who bought a smart card reader...they just assumed that anyone who bought one was going to steal their service. Sure, they may catch a few theives, but at what expense?

    I'm surprised that many of the same slashdot readers who were against the DMCA (and its use in enforcing copyrights) seem to support the use of the DMCA here. I can also draw some parallels to the DVD-CCA/DeCSS case with regards to the DMCA, but hopefully, those anti-DMCA readers will get the picture by now.

    --Turkey

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