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The Media The Internet News

Meet Joe Blog 343

theodp writes "According to the new issue of Time, we may be in the golden age of blogging, a quirky Camelot moment in Internet history when some guy in his underwear with too much free time can take down a Washington politician. Amateur scribblers posting on the Web are becoming the tails that wag the media, says Time, citing an underperforming undergraduate at a small Christian college in Michigan as an example." Hey, if Circuits can discover USB, I don't see why Time can't discover weblogs.
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Meet Joe Blog

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  • neato! (Score:5, Funny)

    by B3ryllium ( 571199 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:01PM (#9421881) Homepage
    Wow, what an awesome news story, I shall add it to my blog immediately.

    (omgwtfbbq!?fp?)
  • journalists (Score:5, Interesting)

    by mabu ( 178417 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:02PM (#9421898)
    If there were any real legitimate journalists left in the world Bloggers wouldn't matter, but in lieu of the mainstream media and news networks no longer having any journalistic credibility, someone has to do a little research.
    • by wankledot ( 712148 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:07PM (#9421969)
      Riiight. Because when I want credibility, I look for random semi-anonymous college kids and geeks with egos to stroke for me hard-hitting news.
      • Re:journalists (Score:4, Insightful)

        by happyfrogcow ( 708359 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:09PM (#9421999)
        no, it's that the journalists are on the same level as these college hacks
      • Re:journalists (Score:5, Interesting)

        by jayhawk88 ( 160512 ) <jayhawk88@gmail.com> on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:23PM (#9422161)
        As opposed to semi-ethical tv news reports and political mouthpieces with agenda's to push?
        • Re:journalists (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Dachannien ( 617929 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @02:10PM (#9422660)
          What, you think bloggers are impartial conveyors of information? If anything, blogs are 1% news items and 99% political commentary. Even Slashdot, as a collective blog, has its own political bent, evident from the slant delivered by the article poster and the editor comments, to the posts that follow, to moderation and even M2 of those comments.

          • Re:journalists (Score:5, Insightful)

            by jayhawk88 ( 160512 ) <jayhawk88@gmail.com> on Monday June 14, 2004 @02:23PM (#9422775)
            Did I say anything about bloggers being rocks of impartiality? I just found it rather amusing the poster was bashing bloggers for being unprofessional and potentially biased, given the state of the news media today.
          • Re:journalists (Score:5, Insightful)

            by the_mad_poster ( 640772 ) <shattoc@adelphia.com> on Monday June 14, 2004 @03:07PM (#9423167) Homepage Journal

            What, you think bloggers are impartial conveyors of information? If anything, blogs are 1% news items and 99% political commentary.

            You just described the three major twenty four hour "news" outlets: CNN, MSNBC, and Fox. The only way to get information from them a lot of the time anymore seems to be to put the TV on mute and watch the blurbs scrolling on the bottom of the screen.

            The point that the original poster was trying to make was that the media are just a bunch of hyenas looking to further their own careers. If that means slanting stories to the popular opinion - so be it. If that means slanting the stories to incite the TV equivalent of a flamewar - so be it. You touched on Slashdot. Well, /. has ads to sell, so if slanting the stories and having the editors make snide comments keeps people coming back that's what they'll do.

            If all of the sources - blogs, journalists, talking heads, etc. are all on the same crappy level, what difference does it make which one you pick? They may all be full of shit, but at least the bloggers are interesting.

      • by zogger ( 617870 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @02:19PM (#9422736) Homepage Journal
        Fake "news" videos produced by the government using actors [thememoryhole.org] instead. Much more credible then "real" people actually reporting stuff. Nope, the US government doesn't "embed" propoganda, it's all those other furrin countries that have funny sounding names who are slap fulla "tarists" that do that.
    • Re:journalists (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Tuvai ( 783607 ) <zeikfried@gmail.com> on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:08PM (#9421981) Journal
      As far as the general public is concerned, the vast majority of bloggers don't matter.
      After all, who is Joe Public going to trust the most, a fully professional New York Times employed scribe, or "Zergrush_7" ranting on his Livejournal.
    • by SuperBanana ( 662181 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:17PM (#9422099)
      If there were any real legitimate journalists left in the world Bloggers wouldn't matter, but in lieu of the mainstream media and news networks no longer having any journalistic credibility, someone has to do a little research.

      Are you seriously suggesting that bloggers have more journalistic "credibility"? Many (not all) blogs I've read tend to be unabashedly biased rants and take extreme positions- or do nothing more than mindlessly link to other stories.

      While a few news outlets have credibility problems, they're far from worthless, and there are tens of thousands of excellent reporters who have dedicated their lives to the pursuit of reporting, and actually have degrees in journalism. It is almost sickening to hear you equate them with bloggers, who have so little dedication, 95% of them stop blogging after a month or so.

      Just because you watch FOX news and read USA Today doesn't mean journalism is dead, and it certainly doesn't mean that we should be turning to bloggers.

    • Re:journalists (Score:5, Insightful)

      by GrouchoMarx ( 153170 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:19PM (#9422112) Homepage
      There are a few legitimate journalists around. But when most major media outlets are owned by the very companies they are reporting on, legitimate objectivity is impossible.

      Step one to taking back America: No more than one media outlet owned at a time, and "content producers" (ie, cartels) cannot own news outlets.
    • Re:journalists (Score:4, Insightful)

      by mcgroarty ( 633843 ) <brian.mcgroarty@nOSpAm.gmail.com> on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:20PM (#9422128) Homepage
      I think you've hit the nail on the head.

      Most of what's out there is regurgitated AP and Reuters news. It's good stuff, mostly. But it's also very incomplete, and too easily controlled. You can pay for press releases to be put out on the wire, and aren't even directly flagged as such by the time they're posted by many newspapers and news sites.

    • Re:journalists (Score:5, Insightful)

      by ValourX ( 677178 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:30PM (#9422229) Homepage
      Too bad you're completely unqualified to make a statement like that.

      What do you know of the field of journalism? What do you know about writing, freelancing, working for a news company? What do you know of integrity?

      The very fact that Jayson Blair (and others like him) are found, fired, and publicly condemned for unethical journalism is proof that the industry does not tolerate such practices.

      But you, the random nobody on someone else's blog site, happen to know the dark and dirty secrets of journalism. You don't need the facts -- you have the truth! All journalists suck because they're biased! Just like Rush Limbaugh and Michael Moore and Gordon Liddy and Ken Brown and Darl McBride and Al Franken know the truth in spite of the facts. Journalists, despite your bleak and uneducated assessment, are people obsessed with the facts regardless of what the drooling, feebly tutored folk-minds believe based on their faiths and fantasies.

      Is your life so boring that you need to invent conspiracy theories to make it more interesting? Why don't you try using your imagination for more active purposes?

      -Jem
      • Re:journalists (Score:5, Insightful)

        by johnnyb ( 4816 ) <jonathan@bartlettpublishing.com> on Monday June 14, 2004 @02:10PM (#9422659) Homepage
        "The very fact that Jayson Blair (and others like him) are found, fired, and publicly condemned for unethical journalism is proof that the industry does not tolerate such practices."

        The fact that it took so long to find him out shows that the industry's editors believe anything and aren't doing their jobs.

        However, we're not talking about people falsifying reports. The inability to use logic and accurately report multiple sides of the story are characteristic of modern journalism (if you've researched multiple sides of the story, you'll almost always find that one of them is horribly misrepresented every time - which side it is varies by the journalist).
      • Is your life so boring that you need to invent conspiracy theories to make it more interesting?

        Hey, it's always worked for me. Did you hear the New York Times is secretly owned by the Church of Scientology, who channels the profits into providing arms and electric back massagers for the Flemish Independence Front? See, that was way more fun than flaming people on slashdot.
        • Amateur. The whole point is to come up with a theory that would be borderline plausible if you were just a bit more misinformed, or in a more panicy mode of thought. Back massagers, Flemish Indepence Front? For instance, here would be a suitable drop-in replacement for your outlandish joke of a conspiracy theory.

          Arthur Ochs Sulzberger, owner of the New York Times, has secretly been selling shares of the legendary newspaper to unknown persons believed to be associated with the Church of Scientology. Being
      • Re:journalists (Score:4, Insightful)

        by NoMoreNicksLeft ( 516230 ) <{ten.tsacmoc} {ta} {relyo.nhoj}> on Monday June 14, 2004 @02:48PM (#9422992) Journal
        The very fact that Jayson Blair (and others like him) are found, fired, and publicly condemned for unethical journalism is proof that the industry does not tolerate such practices.

        Since I was 8 years old, it's been obvious to me that an "iceberg principle" is at work in all corners of life. What percentage of rapes go unreported? How many reported felonies result in a conviction? If J Blair was caught, how much of this happens that we don't know about?

        The scary thing is, the tip of the iceberg is, oh... let's say 10%. And with as many political scandals as there are in any given month, think of how many slipped through! (Assuming that political scandals also obey such a principle).
      • Re:journalists (Score:3, Insightful)

        Journalists, despite your bleak and uneducated assessment, are people obsessed with the facts regardless of what the drooling, feebly tutored folk-minds believe based on their faiths and fantasies.

        Bull. Shit.

        Facts are the last things journalists care about. They care about deadlines. They care about making their editors happy. They care about their paychecks. As long as those three things are satisfactory, the facts can be included in the story -- if they feel like it.

        Every single time I've seen or

    • No longer? Take a look at some of the so-called journalism that went on throughout history.

      Today is no different than yesterday - or yesteryear for that matter. Our perceptions of journalistic integrity is a myth.
  • by flyboy974 ( 624054 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:02PM (#9421902)
    Sounds like a chapter right out of Ender's Game. Damn that Peter Wiggin, err.. Locke! Yea! Damn that Locke!

    Now we just need to have a pen based computer for each kid in school. Whoops, that's already happening too.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:04PM (#9421921)
    Is this slashdot.org site any good? and what's the url?
  • Comment removed (Score:4, Insightful)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:04PM (#9421926)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • by 4of12 ( 97621 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:13PM (#9422042) Homepage Journal

      It's good that Blogs will get some kind of ranking.

      Categories of blogs would be nice, too, so that we're not overwhelmed by Pop Culture, Sports, Movies, One Micron Deep Political Commentary, Etc. We might even divide these categories into groups, something like comp.os.linux.x and so on:)

      Popularity might be a good measure of Blog site after it gets discovered and gets a bunch of hits and links to it.

      The problem is that brute force popularity metrics will miss new, emerging Blogs that might have high quality writing, insightful analysis, but only a slowly-growing audience.

  • by Ars-Fartsica ( 166957 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:04PM (#9421929)
    ...is the sound of ten thousand bloggers blogging. Is it the contradiction of people ranting about privacy while divulging their innermost details to crawlers? Is it the pointless exercise of the bored and unemployed blogging screeds that eventually devolve into pseudo-intellectual angst sessions?

    Friendster, Blogging - get on the shelf next to Geocities (everyone will have a webpage by 1998!).

  • ...nicely. What's nice is that some of them are open source and written by savvy folks, i.e.:

    RubLog [rubyforge.org] - Dave Thomas
    bloged [java.net] - James Gosling
  • by Dan the Intern ( 649261 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:06PM (#9421946)
    Meet Joe Blog
    or
    Slashdotting CmdrTaco.
  • by Gogl ( 125883 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:06PM (#9421947) Journal
    Slashdot just Slashdotted Cmdr Taco's website. I'm not sure how to react...
  • Prime example (Score:5, Insightful)

    by darth_MALL ( 657218 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:06PM (#9421955)
    Most Blogs are uber-forgettable ego stroking crap, but the truth in this statement - "some guy in his underwear with too much free time can take down a Washington politician" - can been seen in tons of places. A prime example of the influence a joe-nobody can weild is Harry Knowles. Check him out Here. [aintitcool.com] Maybe not technically a blog, but the concept is the same, and this guy has ended up on the list of the 100 most influential people in Hollywood.
  • ugh, BLOG (Score:5, Funny)

    by anethema ( 99553 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:07PM (#9421962) Homepage
    May the person who invented that word have his eyes poked out by an angry swordfish while swimming.
  • by tearmeapart ( 674637 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:07PM (#9421972) Homepage Journal
    Does anyone find it interesting/comical that commander taco's [cmdrtaco.net] site has been slashdotted?

    Google cache of main site [64.233.167.104]

    Google cache of page on Rob [64.233.167.104]

  • I suggest... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Dark Lord Seth ( 584963 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:07PM (#9421974) Journal

    ... a seperate section on Slashdot for all *blog related articles, to clearly define which articles are about blogs.

    So it's easier for people to ignore it.

  • Personal Blogs (Score:3, Insightful)

    by artlu ( 265391 ) <artluNO@SPAMartlu.net> on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:07PM (#9421976) Homepage Journal
    I run two different blogs and it is amazing the response I get between both of them. I recently started a stock market blog [groupshares.com] and I have gotten an enormous user base within one week. However, you have to be careful about what you say so that you cannot get sued. Thus, I had to have a lawyer draw up a disclaimer when registering to my site.

    Will politicians use lawyers to stop these blogs? I know I am very fearful of that.
  • Bloggers? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Cthefuture ( 665326 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:08PM (#9421979)
    I'm not a blogger, and I don't read any blogs. I don't understand how the blog thing works.

    Do people just sit around and read other people's blogs? How do they know which ones to read? If everyone is blogging then it seems like there would be so much useless crap out there that you wouldn't know what to look at. Who would waste time sifting through it all? Doesn't seem very useful to me. Good thoughts would go unnoticed and the sewer would spew forth. There's no focal point.

    What am I missing?
    • nothing. nothing at all...

      then again, why the hell are you browisng slashdot? :D
    • by mihalis ( 28146 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:14PM (#9422059) Homepage

      If everyone is blogging then it seems like there would be so much useless crap out there that you wouldn't know what to look at

      Um... I don't know how to break this to you, but...

    • Re:Bloggers? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Scarblac ( 122480 ) <slashdot@gerlich.nl> on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:21PM (#9422136) Homepage

      What am I missing?

      If you take ten thousand web logs, approximately 9954 of those are exactly what you think they are. The other 46 are made by people who are actually capable of creating something special. Finding real news, writing well, or just being amazingly ridiculous. Those are the ones that become popular.

    • Re:Bloggers? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by mcwop ( 31034 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:26PM (#9422198) Homepage
      Some blogs are good. I find them by reading or hearing about good one. Example: Forbes listed 5 good ecomnomics blogs.

      There are blogs I read regularly, and they are in some ways similar to slashdot. The blog points out things of interest, and sometimes allow comments.

      Some interetsting Blogs: Seth Godin's Blog [typepad.com]

      Poor and Stupid [poorandstupid.com]

      Marginal Revolution [marginalrevolution.com]

      EconLog [econlib.org]

    • I think that factor that you miss is that the content on the blogs can (and WILL) be spread easily if there is something worth noticing.
      So if Joe writes something interesting, then in a few hours Mary and Bob will link to him in their blogs and in the next day you will receive the entry (or just a link to it) via email from Suzy because she saw it linked on Bob's blog and thinks that all her friends just have to read it.
    • Re:Bloggers? (Score:3, Informative)

      by aengblom ( 123492 )
      I'm not a blogger, and I don't read any blogs. I don't understand how the blog thing works.

      My God. I don't understand why this concept is so difficult. You just posted to a blog. At its most basic all that's required is the notion that the posts are chronological.

      Blog = Web Log = Chronologically arranged web site = Slashdot.org.

      You will find, however, that blogging (as a medium) is particlarly good for certain subjects and they share certain qualities. These are not mandatory to be called a blog, but
  • by illuminata ( 668963 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:09PM (#9421991) Journal
    The article's subtitle:

    Why are more and more people getting their news from amateur websites called blogs? Because they're fast, funny and totally biased

    Thanks Time, you've just encouraged a site with more traffic than most others on the internet to keep being more biased, as opposed to just giving the story. Does michael get to post smart-assed statements after an article twice as long as they used to be. Does CmdrTaco get that feeling he does absolutely no wrong even stronger? Does this site continue to get treated like a small site by the people who run it when it should be treated like the big one it is, all because of your little article?

    With the site going on such a downward spiral, do they really need their ego stroked? God damn you Time. God damn you.
    • The only problem I had with the article (it went through the whole blogosphere, as we call it, yesterday), is the assumption that blogs are somehow more "biased".

      They're not.

      The biggest bias in modern media, is the fairness bias. In essense, they take all claims, regardless of any sort of factual truth to them, as being equally valid. That's the bias that these blogs tend to throw right out. And by doing so, they often times come up with analysis that is way above what mainstream pundits are doing.
  • by umrgregg ( 192838 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:12PM (#9422031) Homepage
    "Blogs can be a great way of communicating, but they can keep people apart too. If I read only those of my choice, precisely tuned to my political biases and you read only yours, we could end up a nation of political solipsists, vacuum sealed in our private feedback loops, never exposed to new arguments, never having to listen to a single word we disagree with."
    Which is pretty much exactly how I feel about my friends who watch only Fox News. ;) All joking aside, isn't this the direction that most people on the politcal margins are moving towards to get thier news? Supporting their dogma rather than for the enlightenment of facts? Who wants to (or has time to) make an educated decision without input from 'source x' these days anyway? Is it that hard to stay in the center?
    • by jdbo ( 35629 )
      This relates to the (frivolous, IMHO) /. thread regarding shutting down the FCC from last week.

      The FCC used to be one of the major forces behind (reasonably) centrist, balanced news printing and broadcasting. This was accomplished by means of limiting ownership (preventing the sort of mega-and-vertical consolidation we see today) and requiring that opposing viewpoints be heard (on controversional issues, not factual matters as some people mistakenly believe).

      However, due to congressional (primarily large
  • The Great Blog Myth (Score:4, Interesting)

    by ackthpt ( 218170 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:13PM (#9422041) Homepage Journal
    a quirky Camelot moment in Internet history when some guy in his underwear with too much free time can take down a Washington politician.

    The great blog myth exposed: There are more people contributing to blogs than actually

    Care
    or

    Can do anyting about it

    What it all boils down to is like giving the AM radio dial a spin, through all those talk shows. Lotsa blather, all given with about the same amount of passion and nothing much coming of it all.

    Just go out and ride yer bike, you'll get more done.

  • by frekydeaky ( 788109 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:14PM (#9422054)
    Seems to me that there are a few different sites that are just waiting to be converged. While some of us are aspiring writers, much fewer of us have the writing skill to keep an anonymous audience enthralled. A different subset perhaps doesn't use the written word eloquently at all, and prefers to share his/her life through pictures.

    What all these sites are nibbling around the edges of, is that people want to communicate more effectively. In the last 20 years we've seen two major advancements in communication: the web-based message board (like slashdot), and instant messenger. More recently some social networking sites have come close, but none have succeeded in that perfect combination of being able to easily share your thoughts, words, and photos with everyone you care about (and everyone they care about).

    The only site I've seen that even comes close is called Multiply [multiply.com], and even that needs some work before it's truly powerful (I'd like to see more integration with existing communication tools, for instance).

    The next few years are going to bring some dramatic change to the way we communicate -- that's for sure. Wonder which direction we'll be taken; let's just hope it's not an "embrace and extend" strategy by Microsoft!

  • by AnomalyConcept ( 656699 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:14PM (#9422056)
    I know that there are many types of blogging. There's the 'personal' type, where people write about their daily happenings for friends and such to read. My site is one of those. Then there's those (and many, I may add) that focus on a particular area or subject, eg. technical or scientific news (like Slashdot) or certain lawsuits (Groklaw). There has been a trend of the mainstream media citing blogs as sources and reporting on that, and maybe they should search around and be able to present two opposing views, or what not. I read blogs (type two) to learn about things; it's always nice to know both sides of an issue. Many type one blogs center around communities such as Xanga or Blogger. I suppose their goal is to promote the sense of being a community, while also conveniently creating the feeling of exclusiveness by limiting it to members only, even though the service is free... So, can blogging be seen as merely exercising free speech? If "one user in his underwear" can change/skew the media, well, maybe they should do more research first. Too bad the media isn't entirely objective, though. But then again, it's impossible to present everything pertaining to an issue.
  • /.ed Taco? (Score:4, Funny)

    by GrouchoMarx ( 153170 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:16PM (#9422085) Homepage
    Dude, it looks like we just slashdotted CmdrTaco's web site. How's that for irony? :-)

    (And now Taco is going to go smack michael upside the head for posting this story. Gotta love it.)
  • by dekeji ( 784080 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:17PM (#9422090)
    Why are more and more people getting their news from amateur websites called blogs? Because they're fast, funny and totally biased

    Well, then they have one of the three in common with traditional media, and it isn't being either fast or funny.
  • Japanese I-Novel (Score:3, Interesting)

    by nilspace ( 676196 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:18PM (#9422110)

    What I recently discovered was that this form of autobiographical 'drivel' is by no means a new form of literary expression.

    Taken from Narrating the Self: Fictions of Japanese Modernity [psu.edu]
    The term I-novel started to be used in literary circles (called bundan) around the mid-1920s. Originally it meant contemporary autobiographical sketches whose authors appeared to write directly about their personal lives for a closed circle of fellow writers.
    So yeah, the weblog is really nothing new, just a much easier form of distribution.
  • by rjnagle ( 122374 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:23PM (#9422168) Homepage
    As someone who writes for 7+ blogs, I certainly don't want to sound as if I'm putting down the trend of self-publishing. But it's hard for people who make little or nothing from blogging to have the time or resources to deliver good reliable news and analysis over a period of time. True, adsense/google ads provide some sort of revenue for A-list bloggers, but that's more the exception rather than the rule. Full time writers may have corporate responsibilities/biases, but at least they have more time to do what they love doing.

    One heartening trend is that big media is now adding blogs to their websites (and are presumably paying these writers to blog). It would be nice if employers could recognize the value of blogging so that blogging wouldn't have to be done so surreptitiously.

    The biggest worry I have is that the Time's and New York Times will start casting off full time journalists and switch to the slashdot/ALD format that basically poaches off the content from other publications.

    To repeat: bloggers do good important work. But at some point writers need resources and infrastructure and collaborators (and a paycheck) to do a good job consistently.
  • by ianscot ( 591483 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:24PM (#9422176)
    Some guy in his underwear who can take down the President? Other than the President himself, you mean?

    Seriously, I don't think this is quite true. It's not the case that an isolated blog is capable of single-handedly taking down an administration. They can maybe be a spark, or at most kindling, for that fire. It still has to get into "legit" big media right now in order to do someone in.

    Blogs are the sort of "echo chamber" that right wing radio has been -- they try to punch a story up, and media organizations catch onto some stuff. The blogs alone wouldn't do it though.

    A classic example is the Trent Lott thing. For days after he made his comments about how we'd have been so much better off electing Strom Thurmond back when he was a segregationist, the mainstream media ignored it. A bunch of incredulous blog writers wrote harangues about how people were ignoring it, and eventually it did catch on with the big news sources.

    The papers vetted the Lott story, made sure the details of the story hung together, in a way I wouldn't trust any Blog to do. Not that papers are pure truth or anything, but a Blogger can claim anything without answering to the editors and the owner and the public at all. At least with a news source you know they have something to lose if they're wrong.

    This is a sort of creative tension, though, that we haven't had. That's completely true. Some guy in his skivvies is helping to set the news agenda, and that can't be all that bad.

  • by jokach ( 462761 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:28PM (#9422217) Homepage
    Although its true that blogs can be very biased, so can mainstream TV news services. Fortunately, we have the same option with a blog as we have with TV, whereas you can choose NOT to turn on a certain news channel, or don't view a certain blog.
  • by nine-times ( 778537 ) <nine.times@gmail.com> on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:32PM (#9422248) Homepage

    It seems to me that this is an example of what people are talking about when they start to wax poetic about the power of "what the Internet could be".

    We live in a world where the land, money, and power are becoming more and more concentrated into fewer and fewer hands. The evening news only reports on stories and opinions that have pre-approved by corporate-mentality politically-correct editors, who only hire corporate mentality politically-correct writers and reporters in the first place.

    Part of the reason behind the Internet's popularity and open-source fanaticism is the fact that it puts small amounts of power back in the hands of individuals. People can distribute thoughts, information, and opinions to millions of people, unstoppably, without the possibility of censorship, with virtually no cost.

    The general absence of publishers and editors means an absence of filters. It may allow amateurish writing to make it to your browser, but it also allows you to read the views that the New York Times won't print merely because it's against the owners' political views or economic interest.

    Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to put on my tin-foil hat.

  • by S. Baldrick ( 565691 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:32PM (#9422249)

    But I bet we can finish off that stuck-up Alicia Watkins who thinks she's all that because Brad who sits behind that chinese kid in chemistry bought her that tacky bracelet from Zales. Anyway I heard from Jennifers sister who works at the DMV that she heard from her friend Christine that the real reason Alicia missed the class trip to Fun Mountain was because she has herpes. I SWEAR TO GOD I am not making this up LOL.

    Anyway Brad can't you see that I'm the one who really loves you? Doesn't that mix tape I left in your locker mean anything to you?

  • by irikar ( 751706 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:34PM (#9422275)
    I see Blogs as an extention of reality TV. Your average Joe wants his share of fame while, in some cases, lacking the necessary talent to earn it. So he starts a blog and measures his popularity by the number of hits to his site.

    Mind you, unlike reality shows, the blogs are not controlled (yet?) by big production corporations and blog's primary goal isn't to make money, so at least there could be a certain sense of 'integrity' in blogs that's painfully lacking in reality shows.
  • by ryantate ( 97606 ) <ryantate@ryantate.com> on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:34PM (#9422276) Homepage

    I can imagine all the kvetching we're about to hear about how mundane and pointless the vast majority of weblogs and personal websites are (ala this [kuro5hin.org] and this [indstate.edu]), and how too many people are jumping online to post what they had for lunch or what they thought of Lord of the Rings or what they did over the weekend or pictures of themselves drinking a beer, and how it's all a bunch of crap. Someone will use the term "signal to noise ratio," someone will use the word "dreck," someone else will say "mundane."

    Here's the thing: Even the most mundane minutae of human existence if fascinating compared with the prevailing (but fading) obsession with network topology and computer technology. The Web was not invented so people could talk about the Web. You People -- the technologists on Slashdot -- have had control of the vast majority of original Internet writing for the past ten years, and it's been nothing but CSS this, or XML that, or RPC SOAP OSS GNU GPL PHP this, or PGP that, SSL HTTP HTML DOM .NET blah blah blah ... Webmonkey stuff.

    Does technical discussion have its place on a network first used to distribute physics papers and so forth? Of course. Is talking about the network by definition the most boring thing to do on the network? Absolutely. Do I like asking myself easy, rhetorical questions? YES!!!

    My point is, people are going to post baby pictures and bad cryptical poetry about their personal lives and recipes for pulled pork and shallow reviews of episodes of popular mindless TV shows, and I think that's brilliant. It means the network is finally open -- FOR WRITING -- by the masses. By people who are not engineers. It means everday people are CREATING media rather than just consuming it. You might think it's dreck, but their friends and family will get something out of it, and every now and then we'll discover someone writing (or singing or designing or photographing or filming) something brilliant and posting it on their blog, and we'll get something the likes of Viacom or Time Warner wouldn't have put in front of us if we paid them to.

    And there will finally be more to the Web than tech talk and old media shovelware.

    Just had to get that off my chest.

    • Done venting? Good. Now, get over it.

      All that "CSS this, or XML that," RPC, SOAP, etc., is writing. It's not creative writing, granted; but technical writing has just as much of a place on the internet as yet another LOTR slash-fic, insightful political commentary, or anything in-between. The web is just another medium. What writers choose to write is their business; and what you choose to read is yours. But don't try to pretend that you, or your chosen style of writing, has any sort of exclusive ri

      • don't try to pretend that you, or your chosen style of writing, has any sort of exclusive right to this medium; for that assumption is as mistaken as it is arrogant.

        I'm not saying "ban things I find boring from the Internet." Otherwise all my own pap would be banned, because it is boring as hell, including the post in question.

        I'm saying what you're saying. This is an Internet for all of us. I am not a second class citizen because I write something silly about cheese and you write something boring abou

        • I would boil my boring post down as, "I am sick of the engineers who run the Internet judging and bitching about how I am using this fabulous network infrastructure they have built, when they're not exactly writing universally fascinating stuff."

          I don't think it's exactly unexpected.

          If you go to a forum on a particular topic, the people there will tend to be, y'know, interested in that topic, and probably there's a general feeling that that topic is more interesting than other topics.

          Go to a dog-breedin
    • Just had to get that off my chest.

      And boy, did you ever...

      It was great invective, too bad there wasn't an ounce of truth in it. I started on the Internet as an undergrad at University of Michigan, when it was mostly UM-Merit and connected only to other universities. In those days, the VAX had BBS system, quite crude. Later, I had an account of GEnie, General Electric's version of Compuserve. And I started pretty early on Usenet. Every one of those forums had much more "lite" talk than tech talk.

      Al
  • by dpille ( 547949 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:34PM (#9422277)
    I'm not sure how to express why I think it's so odd that Time featured that piece, so let me spit out the background of what's got me thinking about it:

    Sometime in early 2003 a journalist goes to to northern Iraq ("Iraqi Kurdistan") working for Time. He doesn't seem to get anything published. He asks for and apparently receives permission from his editors to leave things on his blog [serendipit-e.com], which he then sets up and starts contributing to. Somebody in the mainstream press discovers it (Boston Globe?), thinks it's interesting and reports on it, and the guys at Time say 'holy shit, quit posting'.

    This seems a very different situation than Time would have us believe from the Andrew Sullivan quote in the piece:"Because we're not trying to sell magazines or papers, we can afford to assail our readers," says Andrew Sullivan, a contributor to TIME and the editor of andrewsullivan.com. "I don't have the pressure of an advertising executive telling me to lay off. It's incredibly liberating." Unless, I guess, your boss tells you to lay off entirely.

    I also wonder why they might publish such a 'little guys push big media' article without examining _at all_ what media giants do to control that area, particularly in light of the above.
  • by cmacb ( 547347 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:35PM (#9422288) Homepage Journal
    Well, I don't think blogging is going to replace Time magazine, CBS nightly news or the New York Times next week, but it DOES impact these institutions. Specifically, it raises the bar substantially on what readers will PAY for in their reading habits.

    I used to get a daily paper, subscribe to several news magazines and watch the nightly news, well, nightly.

    These days almost all the news that's fit to print has been all over the internet before you can get it in printed form. I know this by talking to non-internet news junkies. They'll start by saying "Did you hear about Bush falling off his bike..." and I'll interrupt to tell them more than they already know on the subject. Print media won't die next week, but the Internet has done much more to hurt print media than television ever did. There really is very little reason for printed publications these days other than those people who still don't use the Internet regularly, and I suspect the ratios will eventually put many of the print -only publication out of business unless they adapt to the Internet.

    Getting the story first will still be important for news publications, including TV based ones. But the story they will drive to get first will be the one that breaks on the Net, while they will strive to offer more in-depth coverage than their competitors for the print edition (while it exists).

    More importantly, blogging "commoditizes" opinion. Who needs Andy Rooney when there are thousands of bloggers our there that are just as funny, and in many cases more insightful too? News anchor people might eventually learn that we are not interested in the "spin" they put on stories. When you can read entire transcripts of hearing, do string searches, or even view almost all of the world in action Dan Rather and the like can't afford to spin so much or they lose their credibility (well they already have for me at least). C-SPAN started this trend, and watching our government in action taught me how bad the reporting really was. Getting news on the Net has multipled that affect many times over and I think that as a new Net savvy generation takes over there will be fewer and fewer "media giants" who can manipulate the news for their own agenda.

    Getting there will be good. The ride will be bumpy though.
    • These days almost all the news that's fit to print has been all over the internet before you can get it in printed form.

      Not necessarily. I still get a dead tree paper because it's the best way for me to get local news. The local TV news only reports on a few top stories and the paper's web site doesn't include everything from the print version. If I want to know exactly what's going on in my county, city, and neighborhood, from what the governor's up to down to who bought the house for sale down the stree
  • by Gatton ( 17748 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:39PM (#9422328)
    I like the idea of blogging even though I don't blog myself. I do wonder though if all these blogs might be valuable in the future. Consider Samuel Pepy's Diary. [pepysdiary.com] It provides an invaluable look at what life was like in the 17th century.

    I imagine that while a majority of blogs are from angsty self important whiners it's when significant events happen that it's interesting to go back and read people's take on it. I don't know about anyone else but I've often clicked on the Hall of Fame [slashdot.org] section and read comments from some of the most replied to stories. It's fascinating (well to some) to see what people thought and said during significant events. Assuming that many blogs will still be around thanks to sites like The Internet Archive [archive.org] it could be a valuable reference and research tool for future generations. And then again maybe only the bad blogs will survive. The ones that proclaim Lemmy is god and George W. is teh suck.

  • Warning: Shameless blog self-promotion in progress.

    My blog exists for one simple reason: websites don't hyperlink.

    I started it two years ago because rense.com [rense.com] had interesting stories, about half of which are verifiable (i.e. about 80% of the non-UFO stories). The problem is it took quite a bit of time for me to research Rense's stories to figure out which ones were true. And to not let that go to waste, I started dumping my results into a blog -- all with hyperlinks to either mainstream news sites or to "original" web documents from government, scholastic, or non-profit organization websites.

    In the meantime, providing such links became de rigueur for the myriad of blogs that have popped up over the past two years -- in order to provide credibility. The result is that Rense.com now provides hyperlinks a lot more frequently now due to the new competition.

    Rense.com has changed its ways, but newspaper sites still have not yet clued into the mystery of Tim Berners-Lee. Newspaper websites currently just duplicate the newsprint onto the computer screen. They refer to pending legislation without linking to the legislation. They refer to charters, press releases, products, budgets, etc. without linking to them. Or, sure, some have some newspapaper site have software that automatically goes through and creates links for popular keywords such as company names and people's names, but that's about it. Blogs, such as mine, provide deep links directly to the crucial material at hand, so that readers can assess the original material for themselves.

    Sites like wired.com and salon.com are a bit more with it. Sites run by "Old Print" are going to have to adapt or die.

    When we start seeing mainstream popular news sites with deep links to relevant material -- i.e. when newspapers embrace the web -- then maybe I can retire my website.

  • by danharan ( 714822 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @01:51PM (#9422467) Journal
    Why are more and more people getting their news from amateur websites called blogs? Because they're fast, funny and totally biased
    You have to hand it to them... even when they discover blogs, and in fact do a fairly good job of covering their history and name-dropping the most popular blogs, they still don't get the WHY. Le'ts break down the arguments from the byline:

    FAST:
    If I want yesterday's news, I'll read a paper. If you read a blog, it's often the news that appeared in yesterday's newspaper.
    As for the time I spend reading /., it would be faster to read news.com.com every day. Either way, reading blogs is not a fast way of getting news.

    FUNNY:
    Imagine a beowulf cluster in russia... well, ok, sometimes they're funny. Sure as hell is funnier than all the idiotic talking heads and pseudo-intellectual writings of Time. So I'll concede blogs as funnier than mainstream media.

    TOTALLY BIASED:
    Russ Kick is biased if he shows photos of coffins but mainstream media's silence is a sign of impartiality? Pot, meet kettle :)

    So the author gets a 1/3 in the byline. Some of the arguments in the article are shoddy too, but perhaps the most surreal thing was reading that "the little guy is a lot smarter than big media might have you think." Is that condescension masquerading as humility?
  • by deacon ( 40533 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @02:12PM (#9422680) Journal
    In other news, huge corporations that control most print and all television media hate and fear competition, and are trying to ram home the message that only BigMedia (TM) is worthy of the eyeballs and dollars of CONSUMERS.

    Is anyone here surprised?

    This article is from exactly the same mindset that Microsoft displays when they tell us that Windows is cheaper and better than Linux.

    Fact is, many in the media realize they have a serious trust [instapundit.com] problem, but things will get much worse before they get better.

    Blogs are a huge potential threat to the media establishment, and the best ones provide information which BigMedia wishes to see suppressed, such as the UN Oil for Dictators program known as UNSCAM [instapundit.com]

    There will be lots of loud and shrill posts in this thread reminding YOU, Citizen, that blogs are bad for you, boring, and will make your palms hairy.

    Certainly, if you agree that your betters at BigMedia are best qualified to tell you what to think about, carry on as you are.

    I mean, BigMedia has YOUR best interests in mind right? Right? It's not as if they are trying to sell you something.

  • by deacon ( 40533 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @02:48PM (#9422996) Journal
    You [daybydaycartoon.com] do [coxandforkum.com] not [instapundit.com] need [volokh.com] to [lileks.com] be [samizdata.net] aware [kimdutoit.com] of [nicedoggie.net] any [blogspot.com] information [indcjournal.com] sources [blackfive.net] not [vodkapundit.com] sanctioned [celluloid-wisdom.com] by [littlegreenfootballs.com] Big [nytimes.com] Media [time.com]
  • by Dimensio ( 311070 ) <[moc.uolgi] [ta] [ratskrad]> on Monday June 14, 2004 @03:25PM (#9423300)
    In the past week I've seen a number of calls go out for people to contact Congress and ask to have the World War II memorial monument changed to add in the removed "so help us God". This has been spreading thanks in large part to web blogs hosting this information, which people then email out to friends and family.

    So yes, clearly blogs are helping a bunch of retards spread an urban legend around to the point where letters are written to Congress, all because bloggers can't be bothered to check a few facts.
  • by stgabriel ( 787316 ) on Monday June 14, 2004 @05:57PM (#9424645) Homepage
    There was a time when many intellectuals started private journals and newspapers. The net is giving people the opportunity to start newspapers, like www.brainsnap.com or www.theonion.com. Fifteen years ago, starting an independent press would be expensive and have an incredibly small circulation for many years. This can potentially over throw the largest brokers of news, but on the other hand, they do still have all the money. Marketing is everything in this world today.

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