Radio Listening Declining w/ Digital On Its Way Up 192
Redlands CRC writes "According to C|Net and The NPD Group, the number of listeners to radio media has declined by 4% against the previous year, and the number of people listening to music on their computer has risen 22%. The study has also shown that online radio station listeners have increased to 53.5 million this March, up from 45.3 million a year ago. Music streaming also saw an greater uptake in listeners this year, with an increase of 37% compared to the previous year."
Was bound to happen.. (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Was bound to happen.. (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Was bound to happen.. (Score:3, Insightful)
I mean, look at Shoutcast. They have at least two or three stations for every genre and sub-genre of every music format ever invented. Radio simply can't match that kind of bandwidth.
Re:Was bound to happen.. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Was bound to happen.. (Score:2)
Re:Was bound to happen.. (Score:3, Insightful)
Stations like that have appeal because they are recognizably staffed by human beings instead of computers programmed by marketers.
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Was bound to happen.. (Score:2, Informative)
Stations like you propose will never come again simply because that is against the interest of the corporate monopolists
Re:Was bound to happen.. (Score:2, Informative)
Last night one of my favorite on-line broadcasters got in to an hour-long c
Re:Was bound to happen.. (Score:2)
As an exile in the Great White North, I've come to depend on the internet for my NPR fix. I like the ability to listen to whatever I want, whenever I want, and to be able to pause or rewind if I didn't catch something. However my university h
They should sue (Score:5, Funny)
Oh, wait ...
Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:5, Interesting)
I don't understand why RIAA wants streaming stations to pay them for what amounts to advertising for their members. Do radio stations pay to play music? I'm thinking not.
What I'd like to see is an itunes enhancement that either apple or other stations streams music and while a song is playing, there's a "buy" button so I can just download it if I like it. That would drive my purchases up through the roof. I get to hear if I like a song (more than 30 seconds worth) and the impulse factor is right there. (I've sent that suggestion in already). The streaming stations could get revenue that way too. A referal fee for following a link from a station to buy should help offset the stupid ASCAP/BMI fees to online stations.
The few times I listen to traditional radio, it annoys the piss out of me to hear something good and then not have the artist or song announced after it and have no clue how to find out to buy it. Screw em, let them all play conservative talk radio hosts 24 hours a day.
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:5, Informative)
Yes, they do.
Also, any time you hear music being played in a restaurant, taxi cab, elevator, clothing store or anywhere else that is "public", someone is (or is supposed to be) paying the RIAA.
The only time I ever hear FM radio is when I'm in a cab or someone has it on in an office as I'm walking by. Strangely, the last six times in a row that I've heard an FM radio on, the song blaring out of it was some stupid thing about "sugar" which, from what I gather, is basically a half-assed rap song about pussy juice (edited for broadcast, of course).
If that's what's being played the most these days, ther eisn't any cause for wonder at why the industry is crapping out. So awful.
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:2)
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:2)
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:4, Interesting)
Do radio stations pay to play music? ASCAP! (Score:5, Informative)
Radio stations PAY.
The Mall PAYS.
The elevator company PAYS.
That's why there are "studio session" musicians who play 'covers' of popular songs, give up all rights to their music so that the cheezy music playing every hour in that elevator makes money for the elevator company. The artist who recorded the original version is probably not getting a dime.
ASCAP had to listen to every dreadful hour of the crap that was aired 24/7 until they got the idea of making the content consumers keep and submit play lists.
The reason they don't announce they artist to you anymore is that they are doing it to those that count, ASCAP, on paper so they don't need to lose commercial airtime (which pays for the 'filler') to the names of the artists or the songs.
That's also why they don't announce the 'songs' at the mall or in the elevators.
Re:Do radio stations pay to play music? ASCAP! (Score:2)
However, the mall (the owner of the elevator, BTW) could easily bring in commercial radio and would pay similar roya
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:2)
Maybe it's just me, but I'd rather see a button on the radio that will record the song when pressed. Pressing the button would save the previous two minutes of broadcast and the next four minutes, format the recording into a 224kbps MP3 file and store it in internal memory for later download to the PC for editing. It
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:2)
---
telnet://sinep.gotdns.com [gotdns.com] -- It's a BBS for those who want to get away from all the spam and play a few games!
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:2)
"I don't understand why RIAA wants streaming stations to pay them for what amounts to advertising for their members. Do radio stations pay to play music? I'm thinking not."
Put aside "greedy RIAA" for a moment and think more in terms of "greedy artists." Most of the royalties collected from webcasting go to the composers and songwriters. A bit goes to the union that supports session musicians and singers.
Despite the impression you may have gotten from "MTV Cribs," trying to make a living as a compose
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:2)
I'm not saying that. One almost always buys music only after hearing it somewhere else. I'm not going to buy something from a band I've never heard. So radio play is like advertising the music. It's to the music industry's benefit that stuff gets radi
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:2)
Heh, and people wonder why jobs go overseas... Well, even when people try to advertise themselves as discount workers in the U.S., it's hard to find companies that will go that low. A cult of overvaluation in some cases, IMHO (how many consultants are really worth $50 or more per hour?)
Re:Link streaming stations to buying in iTunes... (Score:2, Informative)
This couldn't possibly... (Score:5, Insightful)
{fineprint}
Notice: Latest hit has been defined as the latest album or single that the master controlling agency (see RIAA) demands be played over and over and over and over.
{/fineprint}
Three things annoy me about radio stations
1. Lame on-air "personalities" that are never critical of anything [specially sponsor related].
2. Same music over and over
3. Lame advertisements and endorsements that are for things you just don't need that much advertisement for. e.g. I don't care how often you mention it, I'm not buying a $200,000 yacht!
And seriously an mp3 player with a shuffle mode can replace the "selection" of music played on air.
Tom
Re:This couldn't possibly... (Score:5, Funny)
Well duh! (Score:5, Insightful)
how can a radio compete? (Score:2)
Too late now. I won't be going back to plain old radio even if they do remember why a DJ is better than a top-40 playlist on shuffle. If I was Clear Channel, I'd be looking at getting out of radio
Re:how can a radio compete? (Score:2)
Uh, yeah, they've tried that (eh, maybe my sarcasm detector is faulty today). Though they're apparently selling off the concert unit [chicagotribune.com] now.
Re:how can a radio compete? (Score:2)
Look at the numbers.... (Score:5, Insightful)
Internet Radio - Tens of thousands of stations, if not more, plus you can listen to your favorite station in any city.
The huge variety of internet radio menas there literally is something for everyone. With more choices, there's bound to be migration to the more robust medium.
Re:Look at the numbers.... (Score:2)
Radio programming sucks. (Score:5, Insightful)
It's so much cheaper to lose most of your audience and deliver pre-programmed drivel without a host (or just an automated "host") from another part of the country than it is to provide customized, interested, live, provocative, intelligent local content.
I was never a fan of FM, but I did listen to AM talk radio since I was eight years old. After 20 years, I've stopped listening. The last great talk show I found was Rick Emerson's geek-oriented program and Clyde Lewis's bizarre (but better than Coast to Coast AM) program on the weekends. Now that they removed that from the Portland air-waves and I've moved to Colorado where the only talk radio states are sports, jesus and Air America, I don't even own a radio.
Radio is eating itself and will hopefully implode soon.
Re:Radio programming sucks. (Score:2)
Please. Maybe? (sad puppy face)
Re:Radio programming sucks. (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Radio programming sucks. (Score:2)
There's also talkSPORT [talksport.net], a UK commercial talk station. They broadcast on the web as well, there's a fair amount of sport but mornings and late evenings (UK time) have some great non-sport presenters. James Whale, Mike Dickin, Ian Collins are all worth a listen, I even enjoy US Rebublican Charlie Wolf (if only because he makes me want to scream at the radio as I disagree with him so strongly and so often).
BBC Five Live [bbc.co.uk]which has a similar mix but without the ads. Their morning (again UK time) shows are pa
Re:Radio programming sucks. (Score:2)
Try BBC Radio 4 if you want talk radio (you'll obviously need to get it over the Internet).
Who can afford in-car Internet access?
Re:Radio programming sucks. (Score:2)
Too many music formats gone. (Score:3, Insightful)
As for talk radio, it works because it's cheap to syndicate and also talk radio doesn't ne
Re:Too many music formats gone. (Score:2)
I'm listening to it right now on MPR's classical station.
Let's see... (Score:2, Insightful)
Listen to a prefab mix of so-called "Top 40," most of which consists of people screaming off-key as if they had been seriously injured, no matter what kind of music I feel like listening to; having to put up with constant advertisements as the price of listening to this crap; only while in range of a radio station, and with dubious quality.
Hmm. No wonder I h
List of internet science radio programs (Score:3, Informative)
Science Friday [sciencefriday.com]
Bi-Weekly Astronomy Radio program hosted by David Levy [letstalkstars.com]
BBC Science Radio [bbc.co.uk]
Well this one's not a radio show but is one of my favoritesJack Horkheimer Star Hustler [jackstargazer.com]
Comment removed (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Only a matter of time before (Score:2)
Old radio had to be regulated because there was only room for 20-30 stations in each market. If a new station popped up, and broadcasted over the old one, then that station is essentially put out of business. M
Net audio isn't just about avoiding Clear Channel (Score:5, Insightful)
That said, I do listen to some stuff that's not available via broadcast (at least locally) as well, but the point was I normally prefer to listen via the computer either way. In fact, I don't listen to a couple of shows just because they're not available via the net.
Also interesting to me is that I'm increasingly listening to recordings of radio broadcasts (that weren't originally intended as "podcasts"). That's a big deal for me since I'm frequently interrupted in my listening, but I like to hear a complete program.
Re: (Score:2)
I listen for the music (Score:3, Insightful)
Instead, I got a series of advertisments, including the station self-promotional ones, periodically interrupted by a pair of ADD sufferers who seem to be under the mistaken impression that I might be interested in what happened to one of them last night at the grocery store, or, for that matter, find it amusing.
The standard CD player in my car meets my needs quite nicely.
Re:I listen for the music (Score:2)
Unfortunately, a CD doesn't hold enough music for me. Even an MP3 CD would get old quick, I think, especially since I would select the music. I just like havi
why is online radio so hard 2 get (Score:3, Insightful)
How about shock jocks and talk radio? (Score:3, Insightful)
iTunes (Score:2)
Re:iTunes (Score:2)
Actually, these aacPlus streams [tuner2.com] sound really good to me, and they're considerably lower than 128kbps (the top two there are actually 5.1 surround audio).
this study ignores a critical player in the game (Score:4, Insightful)
This article also makes the mistake that is almost always made when comparing traditional radio to newer mediums for delivering audio entertainment. This isn't the 1940's, a very low percentage of radio's listeners are in their homes or offices. Nearly all tranditional radio listeners are in their cars. Sure people bring their iPods with them in their cars and that does provide some competition to traditional radios but the 80's technology of casette tapes probably has a bigger impact and more people are listening to CDs in their cars than an mp3 player.
Re:this study ignores a critical player in the gam (Score:2)
How long before it starts hurting the big radio chains? People are hungry for choice.
Radio? (Score:2)
I think I know some old people who still listen to it.
Radio??? (Score:2, Funny)
Linkage (Score:2, Informative)
Jobs (Score:3, Insightful)
I think most jobs are like this. Anyway, didn't we think that "video killed the radio stars" about 20 years ago? IMO, Radio's still alive and kicking.
Re:Jobs (Score:2)
So this is why audience membership is declining? Every time I make the mistake of tuning into a radio station I hear commercials. People these days, in the era of Tivo, want to hear what they want to hear, not what someone tells them they should listen to.
It's been mentioned ad naseum in these comments, but the reasons why radio is failing are threefold: 1) half the content is commercials anymore, 2) the annoying DJs that really think they are funny and interes
why pay? (Score:2, Insightful)
1. No commercials.
2. Clear signal (I haven't tried it but it should be a nice signal...someone with experience chime in)
3. No commercials.
4. More targeted programming.
5. No commercials.
6. Wider Selection.
7. NO FREAKIN COMMERCIALS
Disadvantages:
1. You gotta pay
2. No local news and info
3. Pay to listen.
4. Needs special equipment.
5. You gots ta pay!
TANSTAFL
Re:why pay? (Score:2)
Re:why pay? (Score:2)
You can get all of these same things with a strong public radio system. Case in point is the latest of our three local public radio stations, The Current [publicradio.org], whic
Here in Canada... (Score:3, Interesting)
Since many car stereos play mp3s now, people can carry more variety in a cd than what is available through the radio. Hopefully in a couple of years high speed connections will be common in cars.
I was thinking that I'd lose out and hear nothing (Score:2)
I couldn't remember. The Buggle may have had something with "Video Killed the Radio Star" and the constant hammering with ads is doing the same for the Video star.
Does MTV ever have music videos anymore? It seems that, every time the station flickers past, its always something airheaded or plain stupid (Bevis & Butt-head or some maschists traipsing around wearing diapers in the jungle looking for so
Re:I was thinking that I'd lose out and hear nothi (Score:2)
Yes, inevitable but..... (Score:2)
Digitallyimported.com rules. 4 or 5 years of vocal trance and now I can't listen to a
Problems with Broadcast Radio (Score:4, Insightful)
What station do I listen to? The 24/7 news station with 10 minuite Traffic and weather. If not that, I have tapes (Err im too poor to afford a CD player) of Downloaded Trance tracks you cant get anywhere else.
Do i really want to listen to howard stern talking about how hed like to fuck some dumb bimbo because she has big boobies? Or How funny it would be for two morning talkshow hosts, who laugh at themselfs cause their so damned funny, taser their lacky? No, I don't want to listen to that crap at all, it isnt funny, and if people belive it is in *FACT* entertaining, they need to be cleansed from the world, seriously. Fart jokes, big boobies, How bush is the greatest president in the world and how they (who hide behind) freespeech is the bane of the world, is NOT actual entertainment. Its drivel to be archived on 8tracks and remembered like Disco.
Yes Broadcasting industry, yes RIAA, yes the Entire music industry, you
To the RIAA/Broadcast Industry: Either Shit, or get off the pot. Seriously.
woxy.com- Internet Radio (Score:2, Informative)
You cant PAY me to listen! (Score:4, Funny)
"This is XXX radio 101 FM, and we're going to reward you if you listen to our station. If youre listening to our station right now you can win $1001 dollars!!!"
I told them that it wasnt nearly enough money, and if they would please call back when their station wasnt a clearchannel whore, I might think about it.
FM is so bad these days that you cant PAY me to listen to it. That should be a sign to them.
Radio Burnout (Score:2)
Locality (Score:3, Insightful)
Some people have already mentioned "Jack FM" and other similar formats. "Like an iPod on shuffle" they say. Sure, they bump up the playlist to 1200 songs instead of 300, but you're still stuck in the '80s for the most part. They completely do away with DJs for many of these stations, so if there's a new song, you'll never know who sings it. It's not conducive to learning about new music.
I like to hear new music. All the time. Not just one or two new songs dribbled in each week. Most radio companies seem to believe that very few people are interested in hearing new music nearly as much as I am. Maybe that's true, but I can't say for certain. Apparently at least 50 million people think that they aren't getting enough stuff over-the-air (though obviously some folks are listening to talk, or are using the cleaner online stream rather than a fuzzy AM/FM signal).
Here in the Twin Cities, people had been getting fed up with radio. You might remember that the Walker Art Center in Minneapolis even did a "Radio Re-Volt [wired.com]" last year. Sure, there have been a handful of livable or even excellent options in the dozens of stations in the area. The top two cited were usually KFAI [kfai.org] and 770 Radio K [radiok.org]. Both had problems, though, primarily with weak signals. KFAI adds up to about 250 watts. Radio K is 5 kW, but on AM, and only during the daytime. They both stream online, which mitigates the problem a bit, but you can't trail an Ethernet cable along as you drive in your car.
Minnesota Public Radio launched a new 'eclectic' music service called "The Current" on KCMP 89.3 FM [kcmp.org] back in January on a big 100 kW transmitter they'd bought a few months earlier for $10 million. Most of my friends listen to it (and even support it), so I think it has a good chance of surviving. No, I don't like all of the songs they play, quality varies from DJ to DJ, the DJs sometimes make mistakes, and CDs sometimes skip. But they actually have DJs, CDs, and even vinyl, and hope to eventually build a library of 50,000 albums. They have a hefty concert calendar [publicbroadcasting.net] and bring musicians in for very-nearly-live performances [publicradio.org] every day or so. Local music is in frequent rotation, and the DJs have the freedom to go talking about all sorts of random things. Yeah, there are some people who hate it (and The Morning Show [publicradio.org] is still an oddball
Online streaming provides a bunch of great options, but it's nice to have something with a local flavor that you can talk to your friends about, and have them know about it and understand. While there are some big notable exceptions, terrestrial radio is meant to be a community affair (well, here in the U.S. where there aren't big national networks). XM can't have that, and it's fairly rare for streaming audio. Admittedly, MPR is a pretty big beast itself and has taken over a
Each has its place (Score:2)
I listen to streamed music most of the day. I found a lot of music that I love that I would never have been exposed to otherwise. But It is good to listen to the local radio on the way to/from work, as I learn about local events that are going on (which bars/clubs will the good bands and hot women be at on any given night? What is the traffic like, and should I
ClearChannel is doomed (Score:2)
Podcasting killed the radio star (Score:2)
Some radio stations will survive (Score:2)
Those radio stations are dedicated to classical music. I believe they will continue broadcasting, because those that listen to them will continue to listen.
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:4, Insightful)
Most people probably can't hear the difference between 44k and 48k audio (frequency range, not bitrate). I know I can.
Where do you get 48kHz material... (Score:2)
Re:Where do you get 48kHz material... (Score:2)
Re:Where do you get 48kHz material... (Score:2)
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:3, Informative)
1: 44.1k and 48k are not frequency ranges, they are sampling rates.
2: You are either comparing apples to oranges (CD to DVDA), or you are listening to music on your computer equipped with a known flawed soundcard. Many many many soundcards out there (including popular SoundBlasters) can not play 44.1k material and upsample it to 48k. This is not a problem. The problem is that the
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
You're a bat?
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
Well, not really
I did mean sample rate, actually. Brain cramp. Nearly terminal.
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:4, Insightful)
As far as I'm aware, there is no scientific evidence that any human can. Members of the Audiophile cult claim they can, but their methods are as credible as astrologers'.
Of course, mp3s (at the level of compression used in file shares) and radio broadcasts sound like crap. We're talking much more serious distortion and bandwidth limitation than this.
It may be that to your ear, for what you listen to, for a particular level of compression, OGG sounds better than mp3. That's be hard to demonstrate in any scientific way. Both methods do substantial transforms on the signal, and if one "sounds better" than the other there's no trivial explanation.
Psycho-acoustics is very complex.
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:3, Interesting)
When I was a little tyke, I had massive clustiotoma and mastoiditis in one ear. Destroyed all the bones, eardrum, and my mastoid. (almost cochlea) After all is said and done, I have an implant that serves as a transfer medium between my new eardrum (made from a vein I think) and my cochlea.
Damaged ear, 37 decibel loss. good ear, 4 decibel loss (loud music and looong flights). But it
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
Sounds like you have really good auditory acuity. I have no reason to question that. My first order guess is that many software/hardware processors generate some horrible high-frequency harmonics in the 15kHz range that offend your ear. I suspect the squeal from some CRT monitors drives you crazy, too.
If it is 15kHz that bothers you, the problem will correct itself as you get older.
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
An example I persoanlly experience is that the non directionality of low frequency sounds doesn't seem to apply to me the same as science claims it should. Put simply, I can usually place the bass unit in the room with my eyes closed. I've done this with a variety of bass units in a varity of settings. Some of these bass units were high-quality "reference series" units as well.
Now I'm not saying science is wrong h
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
In another response, aliasing was discussed. It is possible that if you flood the room with ultrasonic noise, that it may heterodyne with other noises to form lower frequencies. The principle is similar to that of aliasin
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2, Interesting)
Secondly although to be able to gain some semblance of a correct sampling at a certain frequency one must sample at double that frequency (Nyquist, as referred t
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
You may like vinyl better than CDs but it has nothing to do with ultrasonics. You simply like the coloration. In double-blind tests, subjects are unable to distinguish vinyl records from CD recordings of vinyl records.
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
That's why CD players have a brick-wall filter that suppresses everything above 20kHz.
"For a frequency close to 22kHz, we could end up with a very low frequency sound being detected as the samples effectively move along the wave, getting successively louder and quiter as
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
Hearing sound in that range is not uncommon. The human ear doesn't (damage notwithstanding) just suddenly stop detecting sound at a particular frequency. It's like anything e
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
A 15KHz square wave is indistinguishable (by a human) from a 15KHz sine wave. The first harmonic difference is 30KHz, which is inaudible.
Re:I listen to online streams sometimes but... (Score:2)
Re:Opie & Anthony (Score:2)
Re:Lies, @#$!# lies and Statistics (Score:2)