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Star Wars Prequels Media Movies

7-Year Old Prequel Fan On ANH 937

Posted by Zonk from the see-them-again-for-the-first-time dept.
Random BedHead Ed writes "It is a subject often pondered by Star Wars fans: what is it like to watch the six films in order with a fresh perspective? From the Desk of Ghent, On one of the Star Wars blog site's many journals, answers this question in a recent blog entry about the writer's 7-year old son, who recently watched A New Hope for the very first time. Some enlightening quotes: 'Look... Obi-Wan is pretending he doesn't know R2-D2,' and 'Why don't those ships need Hyperspace rings?' It's a pity the end of Empire has been spoiled."
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7-Year Old Prequel Fan On ANH More

7-Year Old Prequel Fan On ANH

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  • yeah (Score:4, Funny)

    by softends ( 886321 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:39PM (#12785923)
    "'Why don't those ships need Hyperspace rings?'"M

    Because they didn't even exist in the past in the future in the past. DUH.

    • You meant... (Score:3, Funny)

      by dscho ( 819239 )
      Future past future!

    • Re:yeah (Score:5, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:54PM (#12786011)
      According to the books, the fact that X-Wings and such had hyperdrive was something of a novelity, most fighters didn't, and used larger ships for long distance travel.

      An example of this is in episode 3 when they talk about the short range TIE fighter.

      In reality this makes perfect sense. Hyper drive units would add a lot of bulk to a combat fighter. Yet add nothing to it's abilty to actually fight in comabat.

      So keeping the Hyper Drive unit seperate would be a simple way to increase combat performance.

      -------
      I would create an account but after 10 attempts to find a user name that isn't taken...

      • Re:yeah (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Clay Pigeon -TPF-VS- ( 624050 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:08PM (#12786079) Journal
        Except all rebel fighters have them because they cannot count on capital ships, which the empire pretty much monopolizes. The miniaturized hyperdrive is what gave the rebellion a fighting chance to topple the empire.

        • Re:yeah (Score:3, Funny)

          by debilo ( 612116 )
          I've had a post go from +5 insightful to 0 flamebait in 6 hours. The moderation system is broken.

          True. How did it get 5, Insightful in the first place?

        • Re:yeah (Score:5, Insightful)

          by SamThePondScum ( 136366 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @10:41PM (#12786565)
          You can't do hit and run if you can't run, right? :)

          The hyperdrive seems more important for getting the hell out of Dodge than getting to Dodge in the first place.

          Further, the blog presumes/suggests that you should watch the movies as Episode I thru VI. IMO, the proper order of watching these films is:

          1. IV
          2. V
          3. VI
          4. I
          5. II
          6. III
          7. IV
          8. V
          9. VI

          It has often been said that the true story of Star Wars is the rise, fall, and redemption of Darth Vader. This is certaintly true--from a certain point of view--but you can't even guess at that until at least the end of The Empire Strikes Back, when The Big Secret is revealed, and Darth Vadar becomes more than just a Very Bad Guy.

          Instead, by watching the movies in the above order, 1-3 works on the obvious level: the rise of Luke Skywalker, farm boy, to Luke Skywalker, Jedi Knight and hero of the New Republic, and true carrier of Skywalker honor. Then, watching 4-6 (i.e. episodes I-III), you see the almost-rise of A. Skywalker, who dramatically fails to live up to everyone's hopes, and instead becomes Darth Vadar, Dark Lord of the Sith. Then, you can watch 7-9 (i.e. episodes IV - VI) again, with the further understanding of just who this Darth Vadar guy is, what he's all about, and just how far he has fallen, for the full the Fall and Redemption story.

          Further, the above order preserves all the major surprises and plot twists. The only downside, IMO, is that the plot holes are more obvious, even discounting that you watch 3 of the movies twice (and therefor are more likely to notice them).

      • Re:yeah (Score:5, Funny)

        by NoData ( 9132 ) <<moc.oohay> <ta> <_ataDoN_>> on Friday June 10, 2005 @10:47PM (#12786600)
        In reality this makes perfect sense.

        Hahahahah. Truly, Friday night Slashdot is the purest form of Slashdot.

    • OH FOR GODs SAKE!!! (Score:5, Funny)

      by THEUBERGEEK ( 891151 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @10:11PM (#12786427) Homepage
      OK people, pay attention and learn something There have been tech advances in the 20 years since the "end" of eps 3 and the start of 4 Obi-Wan did not "recognize" R2D2 because he was not supposed to let on what had been happening, obviously he had been training himself to hide from Vader. Uncle Owen did not recognize C3PO because threepio did not have coverings when he was on that farm previously. In additon there are probably MILLIONS of similar protocol droids, recall the one that threepio ran into on Bespin? Vader walked like "frankenstein" because he was 1) in pain, 2) using new prostheses 3) probably having problems breathing He shouted NNNOOOOO!!!! because he went through everything he did in order to SAVE his wife and yet he has been told HE killed her. Would eny of you done differently? AND FINALLY>>>> you people need to quit trying to apply EARTH and HUMAN values and concepts to what is supposed to be an ALIEN and NON_TERRAN society, these people were not meant to think like you and me, their culture is considerably different than the USofA
      • Yet the designations of the two that we see are C3PO and R2-D2. Never do we find out if C3PO is a model number or a serial number, but the latter seems to be implied. As for R2, It is clearly implied that it is an R2-unit. Meaning model number R2, serial number D2. Even granting that there could be more letters in the galactic alphabet, The population of the republic is so large that our named numbers probably don't do it justice. Those droids have very low numbers indeed. What are the odds that two '

  • And from Empire Strikes Back (Score:5, Funny)

    by scolby ( 838499 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:43PM (#12785949) Journal
    How did Yoda go so senile so quickly?

  • why the new series sucks (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Ubergrendle ( 531719 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:44PM (#12785957) Journal
    You will never have the opportunity to relive the moment of truth at the end of Empire, or learn about the twins in Return of the Jedi. It will all be a foregone conclusion. Robbing a child of this opportunity is a heinous crime, given how much I enjoyed the original series given its original presentation.
    • There's nothing wrong with the prequels.

      But I realized back when Ep2 came out that it wasn't a good idea to watch the movies in chronological order.

      The prequels are interesting in the sense that they fill in some gaps and the backstory, but I don't recommend watching them without seeing eps 4,5, & 6 first.

    • Yeah, so hard to cheer for Rebellion anymore.. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Shivetya ( 243324 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:51PM (#12785994) Homepage Journal
      If one thing I found was that I was more bound to side with the Empire simply after seeing how inept the Republic truly was.

      The new perspective gained from watching the first three puts the whole series in a new light. The Empire really became what it was simply because the Republic and Jedi had become so egocentric and inept they had to be replaced to move forward.

      • Re:Yeah, so hard to cheer for Rebellion anymore.. (Score:5, Interesting)

        by AHumbleOpinion ( 546848 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:27PM (#12786187) Homepage
        FWIW, when I played x-Wing vs. Tie Fighter long ago it was fun to work through the ranks as an Empire pilot. Being indoctrinated, bringing peace, stability, and law-and-order to the galaxy. A different perspective added a lot.
      • So Anakin not only brought balance to the force, the light side was seriously overrepresented, but also the fans, the light side was seriously overrated. ;-)

      • If one thing I found was that I was more bound to side with the Empire simply after seeing how inept the Republic truly was.

        The new perspective gained from watching the first three puts the whole series in a new light.The Empire really became what it was simply because the Republic and Jedi had become so egocentric and inept they had to be replaced to move forward.

        The same can be said for real-life historical precedents: the diseased Roman Republic-turned-Empire before the literal barbarians at the g

        • Re:Yeah, so hard to cheer for Rebellion anymore.. (Score:4, Insightful)

          by zippthorne ( 748122 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @10:14PM (#12786441) Journal
          After the second movie, I was hoping the "separatists" would evolve into the rebellion as they figured out what was going on. This would add extra [dramatic stuff] in that the emperor sowed the seeds of his own defeat by creating them in the first place.

          I was especially disappointed when they turned out to STILL be working for sideous in the third movie despite the fact that they were double-crossed in the first movie and knew he was a dark jedi in charge of the senate in the second film.

      • Re:Yeah, so hard to cheer for Rebellion anymore.. (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Kesh ( 65890 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @10:06PM (#12786393)
        Marx called. He'd like to have his book back. ;)

        Seriously though, the most effective form of government is a dictatorship. Any government based on freedom is bound to be (at least somewhat) inept and inefficient. That's why the Republic looks slow, inept and complicated; while the Empire looks efficient, directed and simple.

        So, which do you prefer? :)

        • Au contraire. Despotism lacks efficiency. (Score:5, Insightful)

          by rolofft ( 256054 ) <rolofft@nOsPaM.yahoo.com> on Saturday June 11, 2005 @03:48AM (#12787811)
          If your contention were correct, Idi Amin would have lead Uganda to world domination while Margaret Thatcher tumbled the UK. Weren't the lessons of the 20th century [pbs.org] to the contrary? Is it efficient for the Poliburo to have party members honeycombed through the whole economy, reporting every time someone neglects their duty? Would you take the Commissariat for Food over Wendy's? And doesn't hindsight (The Gipper v. Gorby) show whom to choose in a battle for military might? The Cathedral may work adequately for a campus in Redmond, but The Bazaar is the only realistic model to run a whole nation by.
      • I am rather amazed that this is the sort of take-away view that people might have of the series overall. To me, this is missing the entire point Lucas is making.

        Look, I'm not saying that all members of the Galactic Empire's fighting forces were evil; in fact, I'm of the opinion that many thought they were on the side of right, attempting to restore order, etc. That does not mean, however, that the Empire is the side to side with.

        I also do not believe it is correct to brand the Jedi, or other members of the Republic, as inept. Yes, the Jedi were blind to the manipulations going on around them due, supposedly, to their arrogance and, yes, supporters of the Republic way of doing things put too much faith in democracy. These sorts of weaknesses are time-honored in storytelling of this type.

        That said, I hardly consider the Emperor's assumption of power to be a move in the forward direction. That would be akin to saying that Nazi Germany was a good step forward because the trains ran on time. Remember, we are led to believe in Ep. 4, 5, and 6 that the Empire is pretty naughty in implementing it's plans--one need look no further than the destruction of Alderaan for evidence of this. Not the sort of environment I'd look forward to living in.

        Yes, the prequels, especially Ep. 3, do a decent job of filling in the backstory, but I think the real lessons of the series come from 4, 5, and 6: fighting oppression, facing your enemy, and redemption.

        Anyway, that's my view.

    • Re:why the new series sucks (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Jugalator ( 259273 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:14PM (#12786119) Journal
      Robbing a child of this opportunity is a heinous crime

      "Robbing"? "Heinous crime"? Are you talking about taking away a child's school education or taking away some minor plot twists in a sci-fi movie?

    • Wrong....adds new depth (Score:5, Interesting)

      by DesScorp ( 410532 ) on Saturday June 11, 2005 @12:22AM (#12787154) Journal
      First off, I think the series should now be watched in this order:
      1. Ep. 4, A New Hope - Introduces you to the story, concepts, and characters. The best way to start the mythos, no doubt. Lucas did good using this as a starting point.
      2. Ep. 1, The Phantom Menace - Goes back to the things Obi Wan Kenobi was talking about. You still think Luke's Father was a hero, and you see the similarities between them. The Jedi still seem wise, and the Sith evil, though it's apparent the Republic is on its last legs.
      3. Ep. 2, Attack of the Clones - Further elaborates on the history. By now, a few people should be picking up clues, especially visual clues with the Clone Trooper armor and Anakin's revenge upon the sandpeople. Mysteries are no good unless you have some chance of deducing the truth. Things begin to get dark at this point.
      4. Ep. 5, The Empire Strikes Back - To those with some deductive ability, Vader's interest in Luke is a further clue, especially "He's only a Boy. Obi Wan can no longer help him". Most newbies to the series haven't figured it out yet, though it's tugging in the back of their brains. When Vader finally tells him, probably 10 to 20 percent of the audience is going "I knew it!", but the rest are still going "Oh shit...". But after the revelation, it all makes sense. Otherwise, thee's still the possibility that Vader is simply lying to Luke. We're about to hit the low point with...
      5. Ep. 3, Revenge of the Sith - Now that we know that Vader is Luke's father, we want to know "what the hell happened to cause the change?". We now fully grasp Palpatine's deceptions, how he got an Empire, and the buttons he was helping to push to get Anakin to the Dark Side. But we also lose some sympathy for the Jedi, for by now, it's not that we realize they're inept, but that they are, in their own way, as arrogant as the Sith, but their arrogance blinds them. We get the sense that the Old Republic really wasn't worth saving, but that the coming Empire will be worse (Alderaan, anyone?). But most important...the Luke and Leia revelation is a SUPRISE this way...when it's revealed in 6, it was done in a totally cheesy way. This is a far better way to spring another "Oh crap!" on people. We also have sympathy for Anakin/Vader, as we understand he's not a monolithic evil villain; we understand his reasonings, where he went wrong, and that through it all, he was trying to do right by those he loved, and that he was being used (by both sides). But we also see just how twisted he became. The Emporer makes much more sense at this point as well...all questions about him are answered.
      6. Ep. 6 Return of the Jedi- The only remaining question at this point is now "Can Luke turn Vader back?". Also, we get more insight on the Jedi, especially the hippy-dippy "our own point of view" crap, that reveals that while why the old Jedi were more refined and powerful, Luke is a better man. He's more honest and straightforward, and is more in tune with the good side of the force, because he's not a moral relativist; and that's precisely what the old Jedi had become. They bent the rules whenever it suited them in the Clone Wars because, after all, they're the Jedi. In many ways, they had become as bad as the Sith. This is why they couldn't see the Sith coming, and it's why it's good the old Jedi Order was destroyed. Luke will rebuild it from the ground up, with a much more honest perspective. We also cheer when Vader is gone and Anakin is back; the prophecy if fulfilled. Anakin brings balance to the Force by killing the Emporer, and for the love of his son. It was a long, twisting, winding road, but it all makes sense now. The New Republic can start without the baggage of the corrupt Old Republic, and a new, BETTER Jedi can begin with Luke and Leia.

        Now on to the parent comments...

        You will never have the opportunity to relive the moment of truth at the end of Empire..

  • I know what I'd be thinking... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:45PM (#12785961)
    "What happened to everybody's madd light saber skillz???"

    • Re:I know what I'd be thinking... (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Nate4D ( 813246 ) on Saturday June 11, 2005 @12:41AM (#12787229) Homepage Journal
      This one's not too hard, actually.

      Let me start off by pointing out that Lucas' series is chock full of plotholes, and I solve them only because it's a fun mental exercise.

      Now then.

      Vader no longer has biological legs or arms in episodes IV-VI. Instead, he has robotic prosthetic limbs, and not very good ones compared to Luke's hand (and what's left of the organic parts is in pretty bad shape). He's also ~40 years old. His abilities with the Force are nowhere near as powerful as before his death [vanityfair.com], according to Lucas.

      So, his lightsaber fighting isn't going to be very good anymore.

      Obi-wan, now, he's explainable too. I don't remember the real numbers, but I'd assume he's around 60ish. While he's been training for a long time in the desert, he can't have had a remotely challenging lightsaber fight in the past twenty years, with not even potential sparring partners... Put those two factors together, and you can see where he might have lost the touch.

      Luke is the easiest. Sure, he's strong with the Force, but he has no idea how the Jedi used to fight with lightsabers, and since Obi-wan dies so soon after they meet, he has no one to teach him the advanced technique. When he goes to train with Yoda, he doesn't learn it, presumably because Yoda had such a handful just getting this overaged pupil to use the Force at all, and to concentrate properly.

  • Ah ... (Score:4, Funny)

    by SpooForBrains ( 771537 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:45PM (#12785965)
    "Why are red leader and gold leader the leaders? They don't know what they're doing..."

    A question many of us have been asking ourselves ever since *we* saw it the first time ...

    • Re:Ah ... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by fishbowl ( 7759 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:53PM (#12786004)
      "Why are red leader and gold leader the leaders? They don't know what they're doing..."

      Point men... Expendable. Call them "heros" or "leaders" or whatever it takes to get them to fly in front, or detect land mines, or draw out the enemy fire, or whatever suicidal thing you want them to do.

      • Re:Ah ... (Score:4, Funny)

        by ScrewMaster ( 602015 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:59PM (#12786040)
        "turbolaser cannon fodder"

      • Re:Ah ... (Score:3, Interesting)

        by kfg ( 145172 )
        When bicycle racing I like to find some really big guy who obviously isn't that experienced, and continually bolster him up with how great he's doing, while drafting him the whole time.

        Come to think of it, I used to do much the same thing while playing dodgeball in grade school.

        Same deal I guess.

        KFG

  • It's all about the droids (Score:5, Funny)

    by Soong ( 7225 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:47PM (#12785971) Homepage Journal
    "So, does this mean that R2-D2 is really the main character in Star Wars?"

    Yep. R2 is truely the most Force attuned of them all. Yoda and the other Jedi may have Midichlorians, but R2 has METAL chlorians! [guitar riff!] Excellent!

    • Re:It's all about the droids (Score:5, Interesting)

      by ajs ( 35943 ) <ajs.ajs@com> on Saturday June 11, 2005 @12:01AM (#12787035) Homepage Journal
      It has been my speculation since about 2 seconds before the end of Episode 2 that R2 is, in fact, an avatar of the force. Here's the details of the theory:

      Long ago, Corsicant, a plantet girded by a single city, became not just self-aware (which many droids are), but self-motivated and free-willed.

      It decided that humans (and I'll use that term, even when I mean "all biological sentients") were a threat of some sort. Perhaps their wars could have destroyed the computer, or some other, more subtle sort of threat.

      In order to keep humans in check, it produced a nanotech tool called mediclorians, which could simulate a number of seemingly magical effects such as enhancing strength, generating magnetic and gravitation fields, providing sensory data, modifying the moods and simple surface-thoguhts of other (by dispersing a small cloud of them into the target creature) beings.

      By dispersing this tool among the humans, two factions were created. The first (the Sith) were meant to maintain order, but they were too ruthless, and warred among themselves. So, a second group was created to counterpoint the Sith (the Jedi). This group, however, simply wiped out the Sith, rather than achieving a balance with them.

      Anakin was created either directly by Corsicant's agents and avatars or by Palpatine on behalf of the planet (almost certainly without knowing the purpose). R2 was sent along by way of Padme to look after Anakin and make sure he was being guided down the path to "restoring balance to the force" (which becomes quite a bit more sinister when you think about it meaning the death of all but a handful of Jedi from the beginning).

      Evidence:

      R2 is the hero in so many scenes in all six movies that the point is hardly worth mentioning.

      "He's been known to be wrong... from time to time." We never do establish how smart R2 is, but clearly it's far beyond the capabilities of most Astro Droids.

      Several times people do things around R2 which make little sense (e.g. wiping the memory of C3PO, but not R2, combat droids deciding that the noise in the corner was "nothing"... do droids here things when R2 ISN'T around?)

      R2 and Yoda have a very interesting relationship. Either R2 makes Yoda forget who he is (surely a blue R2 unit showing up along side Luke isn't a mere coincidence), or they both know what's going on... which makes me wonder who exactly WAS Yoda's master....

      R2 is everywhere that an avatar of Corsicant would need to be to see the prophesy fulfilled and then set the whole process in motion again.

  • Good question. (Score:5, Funny)

    by NIK282000 ( 737852 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:50PM (#12785987) Homepage Journal
    So, does this mean that R2-D2 is really the main character in Star Wars?
    Well you could ask Lucas but I doubt he would know.

  • Hilarious (Score:4, Insightful)

    by alan_dershowitz ( 586542 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:51PM (#12785991)
    A seven year old is more sophisticated watching his movies than George Lucas could muster while actually engaged in writing them. But then, some of us suspected as much, having been exposed to Howard the Duck.

  • That seals it (Score:5, Interesting)

    by portforward ( 313061 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:52PM (#12785996)
    When my three year old is old enough to watch the movies, I'll just show him IV through VI and skip the others. Finding out about the family relationsips, (as well as who Yoda is) is just too important, and the whole series suffers way too much. I liked episode III better than I or II, but watching Darth throw out his arms and arch his back screaming "NNNNOOOOOOOOOO" was terrible. As I left the theatre, I thought, "that is the last bit of new Star Wars I'll see. And it ended with a "NOOOOO!!!".

    • Re:That seals it (Score:3, Insightful)

      by graveyhead ( 210996 )
      You know what I find especially lame about the now infamous "NOOOOOOOO!!!" scene? It was delivered by James Earl Jones, not Hayden Christensen. James of course was responsible for making Darth Vader such a badass in Ep. 4-6. The fact that a distingushed [achievement.org] professional as him could have delivered such a horrid stinky scene is highly dissapointing.

      Oh well, personally I'll just continue to enjoy those 3 great original movies and ignore the latest 3 stinkers.

      • Re:That seals it (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Gulthek ( 12570 )
        Yeah, Lucas really knows how to deaden the hell out of his talented actors' performances. He's a genius that way.

      • Re:That seals it (Score:4, Insightful)

        by LurkerXXX ( 667952 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @11:31PM (#12786857)
        I hate to tell you, but I don't think James Earl Jones wrote the script or had much input into what his lines would be. He delivered the scene the way Lucas wrote it. Put the blame where it belongs. On Lucas.

      • Re:That seals it (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Cappy Red ( 576737 ) <miketoon@LISPyahoo.com minus language> on Saturday June 11, 2005 @12:15AM (#12787115)
        I think the big problem with the "NOOOOO!" scene is the difference in Vaders. In the original trilogy, Vader was a cold, calculating, determined, evil badass. In the prequel trilogy, Vader/Anakin is a whiny, annoying, petulent ass. There is no "bad" involved in his prequel ass of any kind other than the old, "not good," variety.

        We don't see him become what he was in the original trilogy, we're left to assume that the intervening years actually made him an interesting character.

        That "NOOOOOO!" bit worked with the prequel Anakin, but not with the original Vader. Whereas Lucas might have intended that disconnect to be striking, I think it came off more off-putting and irritating than anything else.

    • Re:That seals it (Score:3, Insightful)

      by mabhatter654 ( 561290 )
      frankly, I'd like to have seen more badass things in the dark suit as vader to show he was EVIL. But I thought the scene came off OK... after all, the point of the scene was that the emporer had a total lock on anakin. The only thing he had to live for he took away himself! HE destroyed his entire live..by himself.. from this point on he's not just the Empororer's henchmen, but a "trusted" friend who is totally commited to only him.

  • Storm Troopers? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:52PM (#12785999)
    At what point did the Emperor decide that it was time to change Storm Troopers into a zesty new outfit and cut back on the accuracy training budget?

    And when did they all get a new accent?

  • Suitability (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Alphanos ( 596595 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:52PM (#12786002)
    Am I the only one who thinks that the Star Wars movies aren't really something that a 7-year-old should be seeing? This isn't some crack about the movies' quality, I'm just thinking that some of the scenes in these movies are very dark and scary for a 7-year-old.

    • Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:11PM (#12786102)
      Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • Always in the order written (Score:5, Interesting)

    by DrRobert ( 179090 ) * <rgbuice@m a c .com> on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:53PM (#12786005) Homepage
    I always read things and watch series in the order they were written, not in the order of the books. It is better to watch Star Wars this way, read the Foundation series this way, and just about anything I can think of. In this way you follow the natural creative process of the writer rather than an artificial storyline; you grow with the writer and the story, the last three Star Wars movies certainly don't flow like Lucas wrote them all at the same time, maybe he had a vague treatment...

  • spoiled? no. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by MORTAR_COMBAT! ( 589963 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:54PM (#12786008)
    It's a pity the end of Empire has been spoiled.

    Now instead of surprise it will be irony, as the audience knows what Luke does not. The audience also is left ahead of time wondering why Obi-Wan lies to Luke about his father.

    Spoiled? Perhaps, in a way. But also brings up other things which are potentially interesting.

  • Children and RotS (Score:5, Interesting)

    by SpooForBrains ( 771537 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:55PM (#12786020)
    Slightly off topic, but this guy mentions that his kid has watched RotS twice (I think it was).

    My four year old girl has started expressing a MAJOR interest in all things Star Wars since seeing, for some reason, a Darth Vader poster (I hope that doesn't say something disturbing about her bugeoning subconscious).

    I have sat with her and watched A New Hope, which she thoroughly enjoyed, but having seen Sith myself, I think the scene of Anakin's "disfigurement" was a wee bit much for a child of her age, and I don't know how mature this guy's seven year old is, but is ANY child of that age ready for something like that?

    • Re:Children and RotS (Score:5, Interesting)

      by CristalShandaLear ( 762536 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @10:03PM (#12786372) Homepage Journal
      I think the scene of Anakin's "disfigurement" was a wee bit much for a child of her age, and I don't know how mature this guy's seven year old is, but is ANY child of that age ready for something like that?

      After Episode One, my 12-year-old daughter really got into the series, watching Episodes IV, V & VI over and over again. These remain her favorites. The month before Episode III she watched them all in the order they were made.

      The part that was hard for her was the slaughter of the Jedi. She cried and was so upset we had to leave the theater for a while.

      She was sad and angry enough to want to kill Anakin, and she was frighteningly glad Anakin got his legs burned off. She said, "he deserved worse than that for those kids," and she didn't say a word else the rest of the day.
      • The part that was hard for her was the slaughter of the Jedi. She cried

        Hell, so did I. My seven year old was fine.

  • I call shenanigans (Score:5, Interesting)

    by AnswerGil ( 891222 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:56PM (#12786022)
    This sound like awfully sophisticated thoughts for a 7 year old. Maybe kids have gotten better at understanding these things, or maybe it's a particularly intelligent 7 year old, but I'm doubting this is for real.

  • Bad Acting (Score:5, Insightful)

    by ndansmith ( 582590 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @08:59PM (#12786038)
    I have noticed that it is en vogue to bash the acting of Star Wars episodes I-III. However, after watching III, I watched IV-VI, and discovered that bad acting is something which plagues the entire series.

    Also of note is how much Lucas' writing and directing style have changed. Episode IV is very slow paced compared to III. There is only one light-sabre battle, and it consists of Obi-Wan and Darth walking around calmly while being careful not to break a sweat. Contrast that to III, which has tons of sabre (and other) battles, and it quite fast paced.

    • bad acting and dialogue (Score:5, Insightful)

      by YesIAmAScript ( 886271 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:57PM (#12786342)
      Yep, Eps IV-VI had bad acting and dialogue.

      They succeded better for two reasons:
      1. The directors worked around the bad dialogue a bit better.
      2. Alec Guiness.
      3. By far the biggest, Harrison Ford. Without Harrison Ford there would have been no episode V, let alone VI,I,II,III. He made the character work, he made his dialogue work. He knew the character better than Lucus. He ad-libbed the "I know" response to Leia's "I Love You".

      The other actors and their dialogue varied. Hamill was a great farm boy, a mediocre Jedi. Fisher was terrible all around. But Harrison Ford glued it together and made it work.

    • Re:Bad Acting (Score:3, Insightful)

      by horza ( 87255 )
      Also of note is how much Lucas' writing and directing style have changed. Episode IV is very slow paced compared to III. There is only one light-sabre battle, and it consists of Obi-Wan and Darth walking around calmly while being careful not to break a sweat. Contrast that to III, which has tons of sabre (and other) battles, and it quite fast paced.

      I know, with all the spewing lava backgrounds etc. I felt it was just missing a few car chases, with a few rolling and exploding, to complete the effect.

      I and

    • Re:Bad Acting (Score:5, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday June 10, 2005 @11:07PM (#12786710)
      Episode IV is very slow paced compared to III. There is only one light-sabre battle, and it consists of Obi-Wan and Darth walking around calmly while being careful not to break a sweat.

      Well, perhaps if you knew a little about fencing... allow me to explain.

      I am a fencer of.. yay.. two years. What I notice about Vader vs Obi-Wan is that it's actually quite frantic. Obi-Wan is an old man, with slow reflexes and low energy levels. He can't afford to twirl and swing wide - when fighting with a very centered style like that, he could effectively hold Vader off all day without tiring. Vader, of course, would get quite frustrated and then be prone to making silly mistakes. That's Obi-Wan's best hope for winning.

      Of course, Vader isn't exactly normal - he's getting on, too. He must be about 40 by that point, so his reflexes are long gone, not to the point of Obi-Wan's, but still he's not a young man. He does have strength and stamina that Kenobi doesn't have and so will use them to his advantage. Naturall, Obi-Wan won't run around in circles because he's just not capable of it any more.

      I remember reading a study where a 30 year old male has lost around 15% of his reflexes, on average, over an 18 year old. I did a few tests in class 4 years backs. I was 26, and the kids I was testing against were all 18. My reflexes were noticably slower than theirs.

      Don't make the mistake of seeing an old man using a technique with small movements as "useless"... something you learn pretty damned quick in fencing is that when you make a big movement, even if your opponent is a 70-year-old, a skilled opponent will make an attack around your movement and nail you. Fencing is very, very fast and precise.

      I've fenced a 78 year old who just had a knee replacement. He wouldn't be capable of doing the big wide swings that we see in the prequels, but by god, try one of those against him and you're screwed.

      So now you know. If you're curious as to what I'm talking about, get in touch with the local Salle or fencing club, and go along for a look. You'll discover that fencing isn't much fun to watch unless you know what you're looking at, and while it has a reputation as a "gentleman's sport" it's certainly a lot of hard work, too.

  • That's what I was saying. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by SeaFox ( 739806 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:13PM (#12786110)
    'Look... Obi-Wan is pretending he doesn't know R2-D2,'

    I recenetly rewatched Episode 4 and was struck with the same thought. I guessed that Obi Wan was just pretending he didn't know R2D2 since he's supposed to be keeping a low profile and Luke obviously knew nothing of Ben's role as a Jedi knight in the Clone Wars.

    R2D2 could have had his memory erased, could be reprogrammed as an Imperial spy, ect. So until he saw the message from Leia and knew it was not a trap of some sort, he had to maintain his cover.

    • Re:That's what I was saying. (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      You do realized that he filmed Star Wars first, and then made the other movies?

      I find it odd how people try to resolve plot holes with fiction or twisted justification, as if this will somehow make order in the universe. the only people that may have to give this sort of matter any sort of concern is an official comic book writer or someone else publishing something under the Star Wars license. Allow me to explain the real reason: Obi Wan isn't real, and that scene was either somthing Lucas didn't think

  • Where is Qui-Gon? (Score:4, Funny)

    by mre5565 ( 305546 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:18PM (#12786138)
    Answer: George didn't think of till it till after the latest re-release of a A New Hope. Don't worry, George will digitally add Qui-Gon and dialog with Obi_wan when the 3D version comes out.

    It's all about more money for George.

  • Best order (Score:5, Interesting)

    by darnvader ( 693357 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:24PM (#12786174)
    I think the best order dramatically is IV, V, I, II, III, VI. You still get the surprise in Empire, and then treat the prequels as an extended flashback, which adds much more weight to the scenes with Luke, Vader and the Emperor in Jedi.

  • Darth Vader's prosthetic penis. (Score:5, Funny)

    by CyricZ ( 887944 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:29PM (#12786199)
    When Anakin started to burn up after losing most of his limbs, it is quite possible that his penis was severely burned. Considering that he was engulfed in flames, it is probably safe to say that his penis and scrotum were literally quite gone. Now, my question is, did the Emperor install a prosthetic, mechanical penis onto Darth Vader?

  • My order... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by MagicDude ( 727944 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:40PM (#12786262)
    I always felt that when showing the movies to someone who's never seen the movies at all and doesn't know about Luke's father (though most people do know about Vader, since that line is so engrained in pop culture), the proper order should be 4-5-1-2-3-6. Thus you get the story of Darth Vader who's this magic "Force" weilding goon for the empire, and of Luke, this farm boy from a desert planet who also learns of the force from Crazy Old Obi-Wan (Who tells him that Vader killed his father), and then rescues the pricess, joins the rebellion, and kicks ass. Then he goes to learn more of the force from Crazy Green Yoda, but leaves too early to finish his training, gets his butt kicked, and then learns that Vader is his father. Now, start in Episode 1 where you learn how Aniken became a Jedi, how the empire began, and how Aniken became Vader. Now, a small problem with this is that you learn that Leia is Luke's sister right at the end of 3, but that's not so big a deal since Yoda hints at there being another in 5, and you find out about Leia pretty early in 6 anyway. Then after seeing the prequills, you watch ROTJ to see how everything resolves and how Luke redeems Vader and defeats the empire.

  • Viewing in numeric order is a travesty! (Score:5, Interesting)

    by inkswamp ( 233692 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @09:58PM (#12786350)
    I'm currently introducing my nine-year-old daughter to Star Wars and am showing her them in release order, not numeric order. We watched A New Hope last weekend and she was blown away. She loved every minute of it and I can't see any benefit to showing her the prequels first.

    To me, one of the greatest thing about Star Wars is the Big Revelation in Empire. Why spoil that? I will be watching Empire tomorrow night with my daughter and I can't wait to see her jaw hit the floor just as the jaws of the collective audience in 1980 hit the floor. If any of you out there have children coming of age and want to show them these films, PLEASE show them in release order. They don't need the prequels to appreciate the original trilogy

    Don't get me wrong. I am one of the few who think the prequels kick ass from start to finish, but why spoil one of the greatest surprises in movie history just to give a lot of back story that doesn't matter much until you've see the originals anyway?

    Besides, for a new viewer, the prequels still contain the surprise of Palpatine being the Emperor so it's just fine to end your viewing of the films with Sith. Palpatine isn't referred to by name in Jedi so there is still a satisfying build-up and climax in the prequels with that revelation (most of us hardcore fans might not realize that because we already knew who he was. New, younger viewers won't.)

    • That's exactly the way to do it... All too often things get re-arranged from the order in which the creator presented them into the plot's chronological order.

      A recent upsetting discovery of mine was realizing that children these days are given the C.S. Lewis Chronicles of Narnia with "The Magician's Nephew" as book one instead of last. Not only does it spoil the mystery of things in Narnia for the rest of the series, but it spoils the wonder and pure fan service done by reading "The Magician's Nephew" las

  • Wookie Survivors (Score:5, Funny)

    by Servo5678 ( 468237 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @10:30PM (#12786515)
    - "Is Chewbacca the only Wookiee that survives the Clone Wars?" (with great concern)

    No, there is another.

  • Proper Order (Score:4, Interesting)

    by glwtta ( 532858 ) on Friday June 10, 2005 @11:05PM (#12786704) Homepage
    There's a couple of posts suggesting the proper order to watch all 6 movies.

    I personally find that the best order to watch them is:

    I, II, III.

  • Ben's "certain POV" (Score:5, Insightful)

    by KMitchell ( 223623 ) on Saturday June 11, 2005 @12:37AM (#12787216)
    While watching ROTS, as Obi-Wan picks up Anakin's lighsaber--leaving him to burn to death--all I could think of was the ANH quote "your father wanted you to have it when you were old enough" and damn was that that a stretch. Makes the "betrayed and murdered your father" seem pretty reasonble by comparison...

  • It's Only A Flesh Wound (Score:5, Funny)

    by Ranger ( 1783 ) on Saturday June 11, 2005 @01:38AM (#12787440) Homepage
    After watching the final fight scene in Episode III between Obi Wan and Anakin, was anyone else reminded of King Arthur's fight with the Black Knight [rit.edu] in Monty Python and the Holy Grail? Oh, well. Sith happens.

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