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Movie Studios Unveil New Anti-Piracy Lab 495

PaulusMagnus writes "According to the BBC Walt Disney, Sony, Paramount, Warner Bros, Universal and 20th Century Fox have formed a new organisation called the Motion Picture Laboratories. They've also given them a nice tidy sum of US$30m to play with to develop new technologies to combat piracy." From the article: "There are thousands of new concepts floating around the hi-tech community about how to develop tools to fight piracy ... Researching and developing these technologies now will help save the major studios and other motion picture producers and distributors money in the future."
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Movie Studios Unveil New Anti-Piracy Lab

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  • by Dark Paladin ( 116525 ) * <jhummel&johnhummel,net> on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:06PM (#13607004) Homepage
    Make another "Mary Kate and Ashley Olson" movie, and *nobody* tries to pirate it.

    Success!
  • by Marxist Hacker 42 ( 638312 ) * <seebert42@gmail.com> on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:06PM (#13607013) Homepage Journal
    Price your movie tickets within the reach of NORMAL FAMILIES!
    • Marxist Hacker, there is an alternative that is available to you. You should produce a movie that people want to see and then price the movie tickets within the reach of normal families. You can make the free and voluntary choice to do that. What's stopping you?
    • Price your movie tickets within the reach of NORMAL FAMILIES!

      Which is just so much hogwash. When you adjust for inflation, movie tickets are actually kind of cheap [go.com] especially when compared to 1971-ish prices, where they were 50& MORE expensive than today!

      A notable quote from the linked article:

      Defenders of movie ticket price increases point out that while prices have increased in recent years -- to an average of $5.66 in 2001, according to the Motion Picture Association of America and the National Ass

    • In other words, if you don't like the price of something, take it illegally instead. It's not your fault for breaking the law, it's someone else's fault for pricing it wrong. After all, Slashdot posters have a god-given right to DEMAND how anyone else does business.

      I believe in the free market. If you don't like the price of something, don't buy it. I think that Premiership football clubs charge too much for tickets. But I don't climb over the gate and sneak into the stadium, I just don't go. Simple, no?
  • by Conspiracy_Of_Doves ( 236787 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:07PM (#13607020)
    They actually think they can stop piracy
    • build a better mouse trap, get a smarter mouse.
    • They actually think they can stop piracy

      I'm sure they are under no delusions that they can even make a dent in Piracy. Any technology that would represent even a speed bump for pirates would make the "product" unusable for the average consumer.

      All that the implemented "anti-piracy" technologies do, indeed all they are intended to do is make it harder for people to exercise their fair use rights.

  • by Quinn_Inuit ( 760445 ) <Quinn_Inuit@ya h o o . com> on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:08PM (#13607034)
    ...and not one penny for good movies!
  • Why don't they take that $30M and make a movie people might want to pay money to go see?
    • My thoughts exactly! Most of the movies out there I won't even bother to download simply because they aren't even worth the time getting. So if it's not worthwhile for me to get for free, then why would I pay for it.
    • Why don't they take that $30M and make a movie people might want to pay money to go see?

      Because that would mean that they would have to admit that the main reason for the drop in movie attendance is their shitty movies instead of piracy?
      That they would actualy have to admit to their shareholders that they have run out of ideas and can't make a decent product (aka movie) anymore without rehashing old movies/remakes/sequels?

      Other stuff in here as well, just can't phrase it properly. But maybe this will
  • by yroJJory ( 559141 ) <(gro.yroj) (ta) (em)> on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:08PM (#13607040) Homepage
    I thought the best "technology" was to make a decent product. Then people would likely feel more inclined to actually pay for it, rather than waste their $$$ on a turd.

  • by Arandir ( 19206 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:08PM (#13607043) Homepage Journal
    Just outlaw motion pictures! When there are no motion pictures to pirate, no one will be able to pirate motion pictures.
  • If they mass-produced lots and lots of porm at, say, $1 per DVD the market would be enormous and it wouldn't be worth anyone's trouble trying to copy it illegally.
    • Re:Cheap porn (Score:5, Interesting)

      by arkanes ( 521690 ) <arkanes.gmail@com> on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:19PM (#13607198) Homepage
      It's kinda funny. Porn is some of the most-pirated content around, both the full blown commercial infringment (like sites stealing content from one another) and casual consumer piracy. It's also far, far, far more profitable than the regular movie industry, theres a thriving cottage industry of amateurs and an equally thriving industry providing tools (hosting, web applications, cam/phone brokering) to those amateurs. It's actually a very healthy, vibrant economy. The traditional movie houses could do worse than to watch what pornographers do more.
      • Providing tools? I thought that was the job of the male actors.
      • Re:Cheap porn (Score:3, Insightful)

        by meringuoid ( 568297 )
        The traditional movie houses could do worse than to watch what pornographers do more.

        I'm sorry. It's puerile, I'll grant you, and the sort of humour that most of us should give up on at about the age of fourteen, but... that sentence cracked me up like nothing else.

      • Re:Cheap porn (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Usaflt2003 ( 881612 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @03:17PM (#13607943) Homepage
        You have actually hit on one of the open secrets of technology, porn is A. an early adopter and B. a driving force behind large amounts of technology and marketing strategems. I often baffle my friends when I tell them that, besides the obvious reasons, when I go to a gentlemans club or adult boutique (yes yes I am a dirty old man, I admit it) its to see what new tech there is or get ideas for various marketing plans I am involved in. For the doubters I invite them along on my next trip and point out certain things then tell them to watch for it over the next 6 to 12 months. They are amazed when those ideas filter to the mainstream.

        If Hollywood would adopt some of the business model of the porn industry they would see a marked improvement in profits. And its not like the quality of acting or writing is all that high above porn anyway...
  • Once the new protection is released, how many days will it be before it's cracked? :)

    Copy protection can and will be broken, unless the studios do things like weld the discs to the inside of the DVD players.

    • Once the new protection is released, how many days will it be before it's cracked? :)

      How long before the authorities start getting serious and sending in the jack boots to sort out the pirates?

      They'll just keep tightening the screws.

  • No more fair use (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Nonillion ( 266505 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:12PM (#13607085)
    This just means you can kiss all your "fair use" rights goodbye. No mater what they try, it will certainly hobble my fair use rights to make copies of my disks so the kids cannot ruin the originals....
    • by moexu ( 555075 )
      They're doing a pretty good job of interfering with fair use now. Part of the reason that I buy stuff on DVDs is that I want to watch the content and not all the crap surrounding the content (commercials, previews, etc). I've gotten DVDs with introductions or previews that can't be skipped and even one movie that disables fast forward. WTF is that about? Why don't I get to decide which parts of the disc I want to see and which I don't? I bought the thing after all.
      • It's because you don't own the product. You are merely paying for the license and the priviledge of watching it. And that license is under their terms only. Well, that's what the **AA will tell you anyways.
  • by stox ( 131684 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:12PM (#13607098) Homepage
    Judging from this summer's releases, the studio's have obviously found the perfect solution, only release material nobody would want to copy. So far, it appears to be working. No wonder cinema and DVD sales have fallen off so much.
  • not making the content to begin with?
  • Lower the cost of the theatre tickets and lower the cost of DVDs!
  • by DerekJ212 ( 867265 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:13PM (#13607105)
    All the while, DVD Jon sits in his laboratory funded only with chips and soda. Score: DVD Jon: 2 MPAA: 0
    • There's one thing that the individuals/groups who break copy protection are funded with in abundance, something that the entire music industry can never have, and that they can never beat...

      Love.

      (No, I'm not a Hollywood writer, I'm serious. Love for what they do, not for the Female Lead. Time and time again, we see how love outmatches the almighty dollar. Screw movies! Real life can teach us everything we need to know, like how fire hurts.)
  • by thebdj ( 768618 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:13PM (#13607109) Journal
    Seriously, how many pirated copies of TOP movies actually make their way into the world via cameras? I mean, most the cam caps I have seen are horrible, poor audio and poor video, nothing I want to watch, especially on an HDTV. The GOOD copies come from screener versions of the movies. Heck some even have the, if you are watching this call...

    Also with new digital equipment at theaters I am starting to wonder if some people working these booths haven't found some new way to offload the movies and possibly make copies that way. It just seems that there are too many HIGH quality rips coming out to possibly be the result of geeks with cameras.

    Finally, while ticket prices are arguably high, I do not believe the real problem is ticket prices so much as nothing people are wanting to see. Actually I am more annoyed with the theater to dvd turn around time. I would honestly prefer this get as short as 3 months even on GOOD movies. Once again the digital formats available make this transition a lot more feasible, and most the extras are filmed during production or shortly post-prod anyway. So the three months release time should be enough to clean them up and release great DVDs....

    If only the intelligent and tech-saavy people were running these industries nowadays and not the old fossils who developed the industry into what it is...
    • If only the intelligent and tech-saavy people were running these industries nowadays and not the old fossils who developed the industry into what it is...

      Were the industry being run by intelligent and tech-savvy people, they likely wouldn't have the capital until they gave the proverbial pound of flesh to those you refer to as "old fossils".

      Whenever anything innovative and with growth potential comes along then monied interests move in and you get last decade's basic assumptions applied to new techno

    • There are many forms of piracy. But the MPAA believes it is in their best interest to plug them all.

      The camcorder-pirated movies are going for $4 each on a blanket on a New York sidewalk. They're not worried about HDTV owners for this particular form of piracy -- as you mentioned, you wouldn't lower yourself to watch these things filmed in craptovision. They're mostly being sold to exceedingly poor people who would never pay ticket prices to see a movie in a theater anyway.

      However, these same camcord

    • The biggest threats from breaking content protection do not come from without, they come from within. Most of the high quality rips you talk about come from people who work inside the DVD production plants and save an extra copy of the files to take home with them. Or the person who works in the editing room and gives themselves a copy. Or a whole host of people involved in the chain of production who can be bribed.

      Then there are some other things involved. I knew a guy who was working at a TV station
  • $30 million stating out, and nowhere to go but UP! I want that job. It'll be like the anti-virus and operating systems security industry all over again. Pay us to protect you, make you feel good, and we'll do a crummy enough job so that you keep wanting to pay.
  • This will come in handy for them when they actually manage to make a movie people want to see!
    • Perhaps making a movie people want to see is how to stop piracy. If the movie looks lame I'll just not see it, or if I do I'll borrow the DVD from a friend, technically piracy. If it's a movie I do like I will buy a copy, even if I've seen it, so that the nice bean counters know that this movie that is cool will make money...Then again, I'm just one Slashdot troll, odds are my buying habits are not normal.
  • by mr.dreadful ( 758768 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:14PM (#13607125)
    two words: RCA out. Fancy encryption can always be trumped by an a/v signal out into a recording device. It's not the fastest, but it works everytime.
  • by Anonymous Coward
    According to the article they are looking into "ways to jam camcorders being used to record movies in cinemas illegally, and developing methods of detecting illegal content sharing on peer-to-peer networks". I don't have a problem with that. At least they're not proposing another copy protection scheme that will only ever inconvenience their paying customers while the pirates probably won't even notice.

    Yet.
  • The C-64. I remember ripping the C-64 game protection just for fun. They spent tons. What will change now? Only the names.
  • Stop Pirating (Score:5, Insightful)

    by CastrTroy ( 595695 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:16PM (#13607153)
    I've got a way for them to stop piracy. It's called not overpricing your product. I used to pirate a lot of movies, then I discovered Zip.Ca, where I could rent 15 movies a month for $25. I could rent more, but I can't watch them that fast. If they would drop the price on CDs, I wouldn't pirate those either. I think the biggest reason for pirating is the cost of getting stuff the legal way. $10+ to see a movie in theatres, $80 for a concert, $20 for a dvd or cd. If they don't lower their prices, people will continue to pirate, no matter how much they try and stop it.
    • "If they don't lower their prices, people will continue to pirate, no matter how much they try and stop it. "

      Even if they lower their prices, people will still buy black market copies. Why do you think most second-run theaters are out of business? Pirated copies will always be cheaper.

      You want to know what their biggest profit problem is? I'll give you a hint, it's not revenues.

      Obviously, Tom Cruise ain't worth 25 million if his movies don't sell well. Obviously, crazy-good special effects aren't
  • Best of luck... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by HerculesMO ( 693085 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:17PM (#13607171)
    The brightest minds in the world being paid to create copywrite protection is NO MATCH for the brilliant mind in some Norweigan country who is MOTIVATED to crack that protection.

    It's always a losing game. Maybe think about offering better choices and making it more CONVIENIENT to get music? Oh what do I know... I'm just a consumer!
  • This is rich! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Criterion ( 51515 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:18PM (#13607183)
    They can spend all they want. As long as the movie is viewable in some form, it can be captured. Even if they were to come out with the ultimate gee-whiz uncrackable encryption, all it takes is somebody to rig up their hdtv setup with a high def camcorder, and it's all over. It's not even a fair fight, because it's one that absolutely impossible for them to win... kinda like trying to keep people from snagging a picture off the 'net. No matter what you do to try and protect it, there are ways around it.
  • What was that famous quote? "Those who don't learn history are doomed to repeat it." I think that's it.

    Have we not seen since the days of VCR's and tapes and CD's that things are NOT changing? No matter what, there is always going to be someone trying to circumvent the technology, and someone is going to succeed. I'm compare this with terrorism:

    To think that we can stop terrorism is complete hogwash. We may kill a ton of bad apples, but there's always gonna be atleast one more guy that thinks he's

  • I remember when... (Score:2, Insightful)

    by goldspider ( 445116 )
    I remember when it didn't used to be a crime to watch a movie.

    • When they came for the people who were camming movies in the theaters, I said nothing, because I didn't watch crappy reencoded cams.

      When they came for the people leaking the screeners, I said nothing because I never watched them: I hated that stupid time-counter at the top of the screen.

      When they came for the P2P filesharers, I said nothing because I never downloaded movies: I hated the hassle and could never find what I wanted.

      Now they're coming for my fair-use rights, and I can't watch anything a

  • by FlukeMeister ( 20692 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:24PM (#13607284) Homepage
    A simple guide for movie executives.

    1. Release films worldwide at the same time.
    2. Stop policing movie theatres with security guards and confiscating mobile phones as potential "recording equipment" and creating customer antipathy.
    3. Release films to DVD within a month of their theatre release.
    4. Stop putting region coding and anti-copying measures on DVDs.

    And finally, the most important:

    5. Stop your own employees from stealing and duplicating your films and selling them to criminal organisations for mass duplication.
    • by cliffski ( 65094 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:39PM (#13607456) Homepage
      you forgot the best one:

      remove unskippable bits fom DVDs, and dont put adverts in front of the feature on a DVD I flipping PAID FOR.
    • A simple guide for movie executives.
      1. Release films worldwide at the same time.
      2. Stop policing movie theatres with security guards and confiscating mobile phones as potential "recording equipment" and creating customer antipathy.
      3. Release films to DVD within a month of their theatre release.
      4. Stop putting region coding and anti-copying measures on DVDs.
      And finally, the most important:
      5. Stop your own employees from stealing and duplicating your films and selling them to criminal organisations for
    • 2. Stop policing movie theatres with security guards and confiscating mobile phones as potential "recording equipment" and creating customer antipathy.

      There's a legitimate reason to require customers on the theater's private property to deposit all phones in lockers: If it's in a locker, it can't ring or "chainsaw ring" in the screening rooms.

  • Mark the film (Score:3, Interesting)

    by sxmjmae ( 809464 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:27PM (#13607311)
    Why not insert a visibly hidden serial number to the film. This serial number could be applied to all releases of the film (pre-theaters reviews one, etc). A unique serial number for each real.

    If a pirated moved if found just go to the point in the film where the hidden serial number is located. Then track back you had access to that film. If a theater then threaten not to allow them access to your films any more and sue them for damages for allowing the piracy. If it is a pre-release reviewer edition the same actions can be taken against them.

    How hard would it be to just add a serial number to 10 frames here and 10 frames there? Hidden in the back ground somewhere. In stead of just a number it could a colour or the insertion of a special object (IE: Green coffe cup of a specific style.)

    I do not think the studios want to really know where the piracy is really come from - their own staff!
  • The only thing to stop piracy is market forces. And, the odd thing is, market forces won't even stop piracy. Here's what has to happen for folks to be happy (and this just won't happen, folks!), even though I've said it several times now.

    Ignore pirates completely. If the amount of revenue you get from your product from paying customers isn't enough to produce more product, you stop producing the product and people don't have it. People aren't entitled to always have someone producing a product, and you're

  • The studios are quietly admitting to themselves that a big part of this season's lousy box office has been the glut of LOUSY MOVIES (NYT link [nytimes.com]).

    However, throwing $30M at an anti-piracy effort lets them point fingers as do all the RIAA lawsuits against 14-year-olds, vs. actually admitting their business model is desperately fscked.

  • Just as long as they don't test their shit on poor defenseless animals, they can open as many labs as they want. I say.
  • Interesting... Philosophically, how can you stop somebody reading something that is designed to be read?
  • ...and beg him to stop!
  • by Stormwatch ( 703920 ) <(rodrigogirao) (at) (hotmail.com)> on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:50PM (#13607596) Homepage
    "If Coca-Cola accidentally created 100 million cans of faulty Coke, you know for sure the entire 100 million cans would be dropped in the Atlantic or Pacific Ocean, without a second thought and irrespective of what that did to the year's profits. What do we do with a crappy movie? We double its advertising budget and hope for a big opening weekend. What have we done for the audience as they walk out of the cinema? We've alienated them. We've sold audiences a piece of junk; we just took twelve dollars away from a couple and we think we've done ourselves no long-term damage."--- David Puttnam, movie producer (from GQ magazine, April 1987)
  • I've said it before, and I'll say it again: the *IAAs are fighting a lost cause. And I think they know it.

    First off all, I have difficulties with their acclaimed 'stealing' of music, as they always proclaim it is. As far as I know, stealing implies that the one that has been stolen has been derived of something. When you take a copy, you do not take the original away, thus they have not 'lost' anything. They might claim that they loose money when ppl d/l music, but even that is far from certain. Not only is
  • by serutan ( 259622 ) <snoopdougNO@SPAMgeekazon.com> on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:57PM (#13607719) Homepage
    These movie piracy articles always have the same themes -- stop p2p, stop camcorders in theaters. The fact that 80% of pirated movies are leaked by industry insiders (New Scientist) [newscientist.com] is NEVER mentioned. They've got the public convinced that movie piracy consists of techno-geeks sneaking hidden cameras into theaters and posting the files on p2p networks. Never mind that those camcorder versions are crap. The high quality copies everybody wants are made directly from the originals by people within the movie industry. It's the same mentality as blaming terrorists for every problem.
  • by Windcatcher ( 566458 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @02:58PM (#13607734)
    ...it's not what's causing them to lose money. They're losing money because they're making movies no one wants to see. They don't seem to understand that word gets around about bad movies and we're not such undiscriminating cattle that we'll shell out $9.50 just for the heck of it.

    I just saw AVP: Aliens vs. Predator for the first time on cable. On the one hand I'm glad I knew to wait for cable (you can usually tell if a movie is dog sh*t from the trailer), but I'm also sorry I wasted two hours last night watching it. It's bad enough that it was crap -- but it's such a blatant attempt to sucker in the fanboys that it's just sickening.

    As I think about this, I think there needs to be a Godwin's Movie Law:

    When a movie is compared to Aliens in an effort to sell it, it is immediately relegated to the category 'Dog Sh*t' and should not be watched on any medium, ever (even free ones).

    Translation: if moviemakers can't make their Sci-Fi film stand on its own and have to try to ride the popularity of Aliens to sell it, then you already know everything you need to know about it: it's crap.

    And here are some of my personal movie laws:

    - Do not watch a movie based on a video game, ever. It is not worth watching. If you know someone who actually paid to watch one, slap him with a large trout for being such a sucker.

    - Do not star in any of the above movies -- it will wreck your career. People sometimes confuse bad writing with bad acting. Don't walk away from such a movie, RUN.

    - CGI is no substitute for talent (yes, George, I'm talking to YOU)
  • Can't win (Score:3, Insightful)

    by HangingChad ( 677530 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @04:17PM (#13608569) Homepage
    There's no way MPAA can win this way, trying to build a hack proof bunker around their product. In the age old arms race between warhead and bunker, always bet on warhead.

    Ran into a perfect example of this concept in operation yesterday. Heard a song on a commercial that I liked. The company had a link to the site that had the song.

    I would've had to download their special player and set up an account, just to download one song. Screw that, there's no way. If I could've gone somewhere and downloaded a high res copy for .50-.75 cents that would play on my Linux box, I would have done it. But all the hoops I'd have to go through, forget it.

    Getting tough didn't work, getting tougher isn't going to work any better.

  • by t35t0r ( 751958 ) on Tuesday September 20, 2005 @05:24PM (#13609169)
    If it can be viewed, then it can be pirated.

If all the world's economists were laid end to end, we wouldn't reach a conclusion. -- William Baumol

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