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Media Software Linux

MythDora — MythTV 0.2 In a Box 197

peterdaly writes "MythDora 3 is the first MythTV 'in-a-box' style distribution to include MythTV 0.20. Based on Fedora Core 5, MythDora 3 is designed to format your hard drive then install everything needed for a fully functional MythTV System. Here is a walkthrough of the entire MythDora installation process, including screenshots and a screencast."
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MythDora — MythTV 0.2 In a Box

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  • Um...KnoppMyth? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Kadin2048 ( 468275 ) <slashdot.kadin@x[ ].net ['oxy' in gap]> on Thursday December 14, 2006 @12:50PM (#17238766) Homepage Journal
    How, other than being based on Fedora, is this any different from KnoppMyth? It runs as a LiveCD and will then (if you want it to) install itself onto your hard drive, doing all the requisite steps.

    I'm not panning MythDora, but it just doesn't seem totally unique, unless I'm missing some critical thing about it.
    • Re:Um...KnoppMyth? (Score:5, Informative)

      by rGauntlet ( 54921 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @12:56PM (#17238896) Homepage
      Well, right now MythDora using Myth 0.20 and KnoppMyth (Which I use, and prefer) is on 0.19. Aside from the Debian vs Fedora, that's the main difference I think. The issue I had with MythDora was that it ships with a single-processor kernel, SMP disabled. KnoppMyth worked with my simple SMP rig right outta the box, no recompilation required. If you care and find yourself with nothing better to do, and trust me there are far better things to do, my read on it is on my website [yeraze.com].
      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by harryk ( 17509 )
        From the MythDora website, atleast with this release, they are indeed using an SMP kernel. Perhaps an upgrade is in order. It would be of my opinion that since they are effectively releasing a new distro, they should update the yum repositories to reflect their own, so that performing a 'yum upgrade' would grab packages based specifically on their distro as opposed to the raw Fedora distro. just a thought
      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by ManxStef ( 469602 )

        You can fairly easily upgrade the latest KnoppMyth (R5D1) to the developer-provided packages, provided you're capable of using a command prompt, as explained in this thread:
        http://mysettopbox.tv/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1155 8 &highlight= [mysettopbox.tv]

        Unfortunately registration is required for the KnoppMyth forum (I'd encourage you to join as there's a wealth of information there and they're generally very helpful folks) so I've taken the liberty of posting the relevant info below:

        [Posted by Cecil, KnoppMyth's lea

    • AFAIK KnoppMyth hasn't been upgraded from Myth 0.19 to Myth 0.20, but please correct me if I'm wrong.
      • The standard branch is still at .19 with fixes. Tester branch is .20. Sign up to be a tester.
        • I prefer to compile MythTV from source instead of using a packaged distro - it gives me as much flexibility as I want, and in my experience MythTV isn't that difficult to get working. Plus it keeps me from being tied to a particular distro - my master backend and a 2nd backend are both on Debian, while my frontend is a FC 4 box. I'm researching building a dedicated frontend for my entertainment center, and maybe one of these prepackaged distros will seem more appropriate there.
          • I just follow the route of install OS with the check boxes they need, edit the yum config, yum install mythtv-suite. It really isn't difficult enough any more to need knoppmyth, etc IMHO. When I first started using myth, it took days to get it running right with ivtv, lirc, etc.
    • "How, other than being based on Fedora, is this any different from KnoppMyth? "

      Well for one thing hopefully it'll work with SATA drives without having to jump through hoops.

    • Isn't the general mythtv installation - it's the driver installation for all your hardware (most specifically, Lirc). The only way I really see a tool like this being groundbreaking is if they manage to stick a great GUI on top of Lirc setup (which is quite a bit more difficult than a graduate quantum chemistry course). Lirc aside, mythtv setup is fairly trivial these days. And excuse me for wanting Knoppix (a distribution time-tested at dynamically picking up new hardware) as the foundation rather than
      • which is quite a bit more difficult than a graduate quantum chemistry course

        Huh? I had both a serial port IR emitter and transmitter working easily (heck, the blaster worked on the first try). Configuration of the receiver was a matter of running irrecord and following the instructions, and then tweaking the lirc key mappings until I was happy with them.

        Honestly, I have no idea why people have so much trouble getting lirc working.
        • by norton_I ( 64015 )
          My biggest problem with LIRC is that lircd doesn't support multiple kernel drivers. I have 3 different LIRC devices on my myth system, and I have to run 2 different lircd instances. Everytime I think I have things set so that the modules load in a predictable order an update changes something and everything will break. Also, one of my devices is the I2C port on my PVR-250 card, and there is some weird dependency with module loading order and the ivtv module that is not handled correctly automatically. Wh
          • Yeah, multiple LIRC devices is definitely more difficult than it should be. In my case, I built a split BE/FE system, and so each box only needs to control a single LIRC device. Later, when I expand my BE with multiple capture cards, I'll need more than one blaster, and I'm sure things'll get a little more hairy.
    • by Shawn is an Asshole ( 845769 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @01:17PM (#17239308)
      Nothing against MythDora, but after getting burned by Fedora far too many times I don't want to go near anything Fedora-based. Basing off of Ubuntu would rock.
      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        by strick1226 ( 62434 )
        Just recently, I did try an Ubuntu Edgy combo backend/frontend setup on another machine (my main box runs KnoppMyth).

        I found it to be incredibly easy to setup, and there are some pretty good guides ready for anyone with the interest:

        http://https//help.ubuntu.com/community/MythTV/ [https]

        For what it's worth, I did try setting up my backend about 1.5 years ago with Debian, but the dependencies and everything proved to be a bit too painful for my use. I settled on using KnoppMyth and I have to give the guys credit--i
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by harryk ( 17509 )
      Just a thought, I think someone else might have noted it though... KnoppMyth, while being stable, is out of date, atleast currently. Which is unfortunate because I think using the knoppmyth as a live CD for the front-end works great, assuming you have a .19 backend.

      The other thing to note is that the 'live' CD is only good for the front-end. I've read on the site that they are trying to get a back-end running on a CD, but I think its still under development.

      just my 2cents
    • I haven't tried for at least a year, but last time I checked the Knoppix HDD install was in beta and very buggy. Knoppix distros aren't good for much more than LiveCD boots.
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      Other than some of the arguments already stated about Knoppmyth using an older version of MythTV, there are other reasons that MythDora is a good thing. I am currently running MythTV on a Fedora Core 4 x86_64 system. It took me a couple tries to get to a point where I could live with it, and one of those tries was Knoppmyth. Since I was having so much trouble getting things configured properly (remote, some DVD issues, etc.) I decided to give KnoppMyth a try in hopes that it would be a simple and quick s
    • How about because it actually works? I'm no Fedora fan, but when I tried Knoppmyth my machine wouldn't boot after I installed it. MythDora worked virtually instantly. It even took care of the TV-out on my PVR-350 card, something I'd never been able to get to work when I tried Myth under Gentoo.
      • by smchris ( 464899 )
        Apparently, "your mileage may vary". Many people seem to have a flawless experience with Knoppmyth, but I had a similar experience to your's where it just wasn't playing nice with my pcHDTV card and some other stuff. Using the instructions from the guy who follows the Fedora releases and some other web docs I had a reasonably uneventful .19 install in the course of the learning curve,

        That _is_ an admission. My other handfull of machines are Debian and I use Knoppix disks all the time so Knoppmyth would h
      • iMedia MythTV is made out of box for the PVR350 cards, and to my knowledge, it supports video out from the card. http://www.mini-box.com/s.nl/it.A/id.421/.f [mini-box.com]
    • I think a little variety can help. When I tried Knopmyth, it simply wasn't compatible with my computer with an Intel workstation chipset, despite the fact that the chipset was over three years old at the time. If I had another option to try, then it might have helped.

      I have done an install of Myth on Fedora, but it's 95% done and I left it that way for a long time because there was some setup stoff that needed to be finished that I couldn't get to work reliably. Eventually I just gave up and bought an Ey
  • by theGil ( 1010409 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @12:51PM (#17238798) Homepage
    Enseñemos a nuestros cabritos a utilizar Linux con Dora!
    • by hal2814 ( 725639 )
      Map says we should get a computer, get a TV, and run MythDora. Say it with me:
      Computer, TV, Run MythDora
      Computer, TV, Run MythDora
      • Oh man, just hearing that damned map in my head made me shiver. He always sounded like he was trapped, pleading for his life - that somehow if the viewer made it to the end the animators would stop torturing him. It was just sad.

        I am so glad my daughter is out of that phase. Of course, now she watches Handy Manny - which I'm amazed they actually produced. A show about a hispanic handy man? A short jewish shop owner with a cat and a combover? (the cat has a combover, too, btw). And I think there's just a
        • by ettlz ( 639203 )
          And I think there's just a little too much sexual tension between Manny and Kelly (the chick who owns the hardware store).

          Ah, you've never seen Balamory then.

      • With your help, we just installed a new Linux operating system!

        ***cue mariachi band music***
    • "Enseñemos a nuestros cabritos a utilizar Linux con Dora!"

      I have to go ask my kids what the hell that means.
  • by gr8_phk ( 621180 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @12:53PM (#17238840)
    Why not just install Fedora and then "yum install mythtv"? Why has installation of Myth always been non-trivial? Now it's to the point where someone would rather format and install the entire OS...
    • by LordSnooty ( 853791 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @01:00PM (#17239020)
      There are many dependencies needed to provide a fully-functional set-top box affair - video codecs, players, DVD apps, games, tuner card drivers, version of X, fonts issues etc. Even an educated linux user can find a mythtv install daunting, so packages like this are a godsend.

      Also I'd imagine that most mythtv installs are deployed on single-use machines - the set-top box that does TV and nothing else. Thus Knoppmyth or this example are very much useful. Just slap it on and go.
      • by Xugumad ( 39311 )
        Daunting? I still have nightmares *shivers*

        (Although that was on Debian, which is not the easiest platform to install MythTV on, by a long way)
      • what can be done to make it trivial? I use Windows MCE and in spite of its quirks getting it up and running has been largely trivial. If using non standard hardware I'd understand but getting myth up and running for example with the common Hauppauge line of tuners isn't trivial.

        I don't know what to say but if it requires one to jump into console mode and isn't dead simple it won't get widespread market penetration. Even though i'm an experienced windows user and a little better then a newbie I gave up after
        • Knoppmyth and its ilk make the process trivial, in the majority of scenarios. Of course the level of knowledge needed to do almost anything in Linux is the reason why we don't have mass market penetration in the non-server arena.
    • Why has installation of Myth always been non-trivial?

      Since every mythtv box might be unique in terms of hardware and sofware configurations, things might be complex at installation. The options for the TV card alone are numerous. Also MythTV has many options that you could or could not install. Like I use the MythWeather but not the phone. If everything was the same everytime, you could just put in a CD and run do a yum install and it would be done.

    • by Dynedain ( 141758 ) <slashdot2@anthon ... m minus language> on Thursday December 14, 2006 @01:12PM (#17239230) Homepage
      Because there are so many extra components you need. Outside media players, codec libraries, driver packages, various MPEG decoding/encoding libraries, etc, etc.

      I tried getting MythTV installed from the Knoppix disc. Plenty of things didn't work. It took me a few days to track down DVD playback problems. I then had to mess with getting the NVIDIA binary drivers installed and xconf configured properly. And then after that I still didn't have sound support (lack of drivers for my onboard soundcard). Oh, and I still had to deal with subscribing to a program guide service (with a one month renewal process). It got to the point where it was no longer worth my time. $150 for Windows MCE, and $40 for the NVIDIA mpeg encoder and I was up and running with everything working within a few hours.

      People who want to use MythTV or Windows MCE, for the most part want it run as a dedicated Tivo-like appliance. They are going to be doing little if any desktop computing on it. For that reason, it makes perfect sense to have a full OS configured specifically for it, with default large fonts and display in the GUI, drivers and codecs pre-installed for most media types, auto-boot directly into the TV/Media interface, etc.

      Sure, it's nice to be able to install something like this on top of your pre-existing, pre-configured OS. But for most people who want to use this technology, they'd rather wipe the machine and start clean.
      • by Lumpy ( 12016 )
        Upgrade your MCE box... install MediaPortal on it.

        Works far better with way more features.

        Mediaportal is so much better than MCE It's silly to pay the premium and have a wonky XP install (Yes MCE is a wonky XP install not PRO and that is silly in their design)

        My biggest problem with Myth is that the menus are wierd, non intuitive and not customizable. I want to remove the TV functions as I only view video content I snake over the network... Myth takes an advanced programmer to do that, MEdiaportal takes
        • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

          My biggest problem with Myth is that the menus are wierd, non intuitive and not customizable.

          Actually not true at all - the MythTV menus are fully customisable, and are all written in XML. A great guide on how to modify the menus can be found here [myhdbox.com].

          I have customised my menus to have the top level screen only show the wife-friendly options (Watch TV, watch recordings, listen to music and TV guide) with all the nuts and bolts hidden under an admin menu. Also added a number of functions (update guide, ena

      • by N0decam ( 630188 )
        People who want to use MythTV or Windows MCE, for the most part want it run as a dedicated Tivo-like appliance.

        Speak for yourself - while that's certainly true of my one dedicated frontend, my backend serves as all sorts of server type things (mail, web, database, storage)

        I didn't find it overly onerous installing from the gentoo portage, and the feature list can't be beat. It's also nice that I can (and do) run a frontend on any other machine in my house - laptop, mac mini, xbox. There are some rough

    • Umm... installing Myth *is* trivial. Installing all the hardware drivers and so forth, not so much. Fortunately, there are resources like Jarod's Myth-on-Fedora HOWTO [wilsonet.com] which make this process much less painless. Personally, I had my backend installed on FC5 in an afternoon. My frontend took a little longer, only because I'm using a fairly recent VIA EPIA board, and so the OpenChrome drivers were a bit troublesome.
      • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

        by Hel Toupee ( 738061 )
        there are resources like Jarod's Myth-on-Fedora HOWTO which make this process much less painless.

        I've found that many online instructions make things much less painless, also.

        Personally, I had my backend installed on FC5 in an afternoon.

        I prefer my backend to be installed on the couch most afternoons :)

        My frontend took a little longer, only because I'm using a fairly recent VIA EPIA board

        I'm not even gonna touch that one.

        Seriously, though, good link, and I'm glad it worked out so well f
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by itsdapead ( 734413 )

      Why has installation of Myth always been non-trivial?

      Er, lets see: do you use satellite or terestrial TV? Is that analogue or digital? European-style DVB or the US equivalent? Does your tuner card need a firmware blob to work? Does your tuner card have onboard MPEG decoding? If not, does your video card have MPEG acceleration and is it supported by Xorg? How do you enable TV-out and set it to native PAL or NTSC resolution with sensible overscan? (anybody using a low power Via Epia system as a HTPC should b

  • My 2 cents (Score:3, Interesting)

    by rgavril ( 805158 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @12:58PM (#17238952)
    If you're willing to install a linux distribution in your living room you should give Pluto [plutohome.com] a try. It incorporates myth and many more from media to home automation and is a free as in beer Debian based Linux.
  • by Zordak ( 123132 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @01:05PM (#17239112) Homepage Journal
    The first image that came to mind on reading the title was a MythTV box dedicated to recording episodes of "Dora the Explorer." And then my brain let out a primal scream, because if there is one thing I don't need in my house, it's more Dora.
  • I'm running a Fedora Core 6 box in my living that runs mythtv full time and is serving me as general purpose linux box. It's working out very well for me, (though admittedly I'm a bachelor and have no wife in charge of my decor). Twinview with myth on the TV and computer stuff on the monitor. With mythweb running, it can't be beat.

    It's easy to set up. "yum install mythtv-suite" installs -all- the myth packages including mythweb and such. Pretty minimal configuration involved. I'd say that starting wit

  • by bgarcia ( 33222 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @02:08PM (#17240272) Homepage Journal
    I tried installing MythDora on a Dell XPS 410. Didn't work. Knoppmyth wouldn't install either.

    The problem is that my desktop has no legacy interfaces. In particular, the DVD drive is SATA, and the keyboard is USB. Knoppmyth and Mythdora cannot currently handle installing from a SATA optical drive. Knoppmyth kindly popped me out to a shell when it couldn't find the installation source directory, but the drivers for the USB keyboard apparently hadn't been loaded, so I couldn't type anything anyhow.

    I'm currently installing Myth 0.20 over Fedora Core 6 with the help of the MythTV on Fedora HOWTO [wilsonet.com] by Jarod Wilson. It's been very helpful, but I still find myself spending a lot of time tweaking things to get everything working correctly. MythTV installation is just plain hard.

  • by kimvette ( 919543 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @02:20PM (#17240558) Homepage Journal
    . . . and considering that Fedora 5 comes with 2.6.16 (at best) it's not likely to fare any better on current-generation hardware. I'd still have to download the vanilla kernel, track down any vendor-specific optimizations, merge those in if the process isn't too time-consuming, then figure out which combination of kernel modules/firmware/tuner settings work with each rev of each card. Combine that with the suck that is Hauppauge -- I bought a PVR-150, chose it over the PVR-500 because I was skeptical and now I'm glad I saved my money on the dual tuner card. With a 500ms or so delay on the display it renders the cable guide totally worthless -- and you have a recipe for a craptacular HTPC. I then ordered an uber-cheap-but-easy-to-configure MSI TV@nywhere, and I had that card up and running in literally five minutes, compared to 3-4 hours of trying various firmware and tuner setting combinations with the Hauppage. Not only that, the MSI does hardware MPEG2 encoding, hardware-assisted MPEG4, plus NO appreciable delay in the display. Not only that, the MSI works with standard TV apps like xawtv and kdetv, whereas the Hauppauge works ONLY with Myth.

    Or, install Windows Media Center and have it all work out of the box. MythTV may be GORGEOUS and offer tons and tons of functionality Windows Media Center will never provide, but Windows Media Center can be installed and fully configured out of the box in a half hour to 45 minutes.

    I like Myth, really, and plan to put time into getting it to work perfectly, but it's hard to put aside an entire day to devote to setting up a TV/PVR application.
    • ???

      I just went to the driver homepage and selected the option consistent with my kernel version.

      More than anything else, it looks a little Mickey Mouse to have different releases for different versions of the 2.6 kernel but it was by no means difficult.

      While it will be nice once the ivtv takes it's place with the classic bttv drivers in the kernel and in the distros, the sad fact remains that you can't follow simple instructions. If not for TV dinners and canned foods, you would probably starve.
    • Vendors choose to support Windows because of the large user based. This is no surprise... What is a surprise is that a lot of tuners cards that do work on Windows won't work with MCE. Why is that?

      Or, install Windows Media Center and have it all work out of the box. MythTV may be GORGEOUS and offer tons and tons of functionality Windows Media Center will never provide, but Windows Media Center can be installed and fully configured out of the box in a half hour to 45 minutes.

      Given hardware that works with Linux, KnoppMyth can be installed in under 30 minutes. One user reported getting it working in 10 minutes. That is from a bare hard drive to watching TV in 10 minutes!

      A new KnoppMyth is just around the corner! It is smaller, faster and offers more features. Just be a little mo

      • On OLDER chipsets, OLDER videocards, sure. But I wanted to run a Core 2 Duo, not a Pentium II or Pentium III.
    • My install took about 15 mins to do on FC6.
    • Combine that with the suck that is Hauppauge -- I bought a PVR-150, chose it over the PVR-500 because I was skeptical and now I'm glad I saved my money on the dual tuner card. With a 500ms or so delay on the display it renders the cable guide totally worthless -- and you have a recipe for a craptacular HTPC

      What are you going on about? The 150 *captures*, it doesn't display, so I don't know what this "500ms or so delay on the display" that you're talking about is. Nor do I understand how said delay could "
  • Here I am installing FC5 as I speak, specifically to set up MythTv.

    I have tried getting my tv cards working on a currently installed FC4 but had no real luck, and didn't fancy ruining a perfectly functioning media server just to experiment. The cards definitely work BTW (dvb_bt8xx Zarlink MT352). I have a spare HD so I tried installing a live cd [tlm-project.org] version of PCLinuxOS which has been remastered to concentrate on MythTV. Unfortunately, the damn installer kept complaining that I needed to reboot to make the chan

  • iMedia Linux [imedialinux.com], a division of mini-box.com [mini-box.com] has had MythTV .20 in their latest release of iMedia MythTV [mini-box.com] distribution for a couple weeks now.

    And like many before me, what is so special about MythDora? If I want to do a MythTV install I'll use the iMedia distro (SFF / small install footprint) or KnoppMyth.

  • ... is anyone can make their own. I just finished one based on Ubuntu Edgy. It's more hardware and configuration specific, though -- it installs MythTV 0.20 as a combined system, the pcHDTV-5500 drivers, the nvidia driver, and LIRC. It also pre-configures MythTV with the pcHDTV-5500 card.
  • Well, open source linux PVRs. Closed source Proprietary Linux PVRs like Tivo will be available for a subscription fee.

    What we need is to hire some lobbyists to get the US government to mandate that the standard be opened up. Otherwise we're going to be stuck with Standard Def and over the air HD.

    No Dish, DirectTV, or cable High Def.

    I'd throw a couple hundred $'s in.
    • Well, open source linux PVRs.

      Well, open source HD-capable PVRs. You'll always be able to pull an SD feed from an external tuner.
  • There are three discrete steps separated by reboots. There are about twenty pieces of information that the system could either (a) guess defaults, (b) probe for hardware during setup, or (c) leave for a built-in configuration tool run ex post installo. If this is what passes for easy, I'd hate to see hard... Never mind, I've seen hard on Linux before.

    The bottom line is if Linux folks (and make no mistake, I am one myself) keep deluding themselves about what's "easy", we're not going to gain acceptance fo

  • Been down this road! (Score:3, Informative)

    by old_skul ( 566766 ) on Thursday December 14, 2006 @05:41PM (#17244734) Journal
    Having started with Knoppmyth, and then moved briefly to Mythdora, I settled in on a manual compile of Myth 0.19 on Suse 10.1. It was this configuration that worked best for me - because I had invested in 2 PCHDTV HD-5500 tuners. I could not get them working in Myth 0.20 at all, and finally made them work in 0.19. The feature set between the two is minimal, with 0.20 being a lot of fixes and optimizations, so there's not a lot of love lost.

    Myth is not an easy thing for even the experienced admin to make work. Because of the dependencies and the hardware involvement, this is more than just installing an application and having it work. For people new to the Myth infrastructure, it's actually rather nice to have a live CD install everything that's necessary. For 90% of the folks wanting to try it, they're going to have a dedicated PC for it anyway. Of course, if you want to just throw in a tuner card and try it that way, you can compile it too.

    If you're a Suse person, you can check out a HOWTO I put together for 10.1 and PCHDTV cards here [pchdtv.com]. It covers all the stuff one has to do to make a Myth box work with HD under Suse 10.1. While there are RPMs available for Myth 0.20 on Suse 10.1, the package doesn't support HD, which is what my project was specifically designed to be.

    If you do plan on doing HD - be vigilant in your hardware selection! HD playback takes a considerable amount of computing horsepower. I really recommend getting an nVidia 5200 card for playback - not only are they super cheap, and sometimes fanless (read: noiseless), but they also support the nVidia XvMC playback driver, which accelerates MPEG2 streams, offloading decoding from your processor. It also does a fine job at Bob2X deinterlacing, required for watchable HD.
  • Wake me when MythTV starts supporting Postgres.

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell