TV Delays Driving AU Viewers To Piracy

Astat1ne writes in with a story in The Register about the delays Australian TV viewers are experiencing getting overseas-produced series and how this is driving many of them to download the shows via BitTorrent and other peer-to-peer networks. The problem is compounded by the fact that Australian viewers are unable to download legal copies of the episodes from the US iTunes website. Quoting: "According to a survey based on a sample of 119 current or recent free-to-air TV series, Australian viewers are waiting an average of almost 17 months for the first-run series first seen overseas. Over the past two years, average Australian broadcast delays for free-to-air television viewers have more than doubled from 7.9 to 16.7 months."

Why the delay?

[Weaselmancer]

Seriously, 17 months?

Why the delay? What exactly is it that could possibly take so long? You could almost put the DVDs in a hot air balloon and get them there quicker.

Especially considering that this is sales. Who waits that long to make money? Especially in that industry?

Re:Why the delay?

[Anonymous Coward]

Basically the older a show is the cheaper it is to buy. The Australian tv companies would have to pay a lot more to the American production companies if they wanted the rights to a show soon after it came out.

Re:Why the delay?

[krosov]

This is also the case in region 2, where I happen to live. There's a similar delay in episodes of all american shows, from Southpark to Oprah. I'm downloading Southpark and The Daily Show (of which only quotations make it to the region 2 television) solely because I'm not going to wait 18 months until the show is less fresh, therefor less funny, is and broadcasted with commercial interuptions for phone sex, at 23.30h at night when I really do need to sleep. I can get a sure weekly southpark fix from the local bittorrent dealer in a dark alley of an internet and watch it hours after it was broadcasted at prime time. With movies, the same issues occur. Whe have to wait at least 6 months, which made sense in the old days when the marketing machines would also arrive 6 months late. At least the release was in sync with the marketing peak. Now, we do see movie trailers, reviews, blogs, parodies, pleasant scandals and bloopers at the same time the Americans do, thus months before the movies enter our movietheatres. I'm not a film lover, but I can see why people download the movies. Since the advertising reaches us all the way here, the marketing boosts the filesharing! Most DVD players in .eu are region-free now (I 'hacked' mine), otherwise we can't watch the movies we legally order over the internet! There's no way you can be 100% legal!

Re:Why the delay?

[Anonymous Coward]

Give 'em a break. They need time to translate the show into Australian.

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

Give 'em a break. They need time to translate the show into Australian.

There's also a minor issue with standards conversion; although Australia uses PAL, like the UK, their programmes have to undergo further conversion to flip the image upside down (which, of course, looks the right way up in Australia). The reverse also applies; this is why Britain is a bit behind Australia when showing Neighbours.

You can take a British TV set to Australia (and vice versa), and even receive pictures, but the programmes will be the wrong way up.

It's true, I swear.

Re:

[urlgrey]

You can take a British TV set to Australia (and vice versa), and even receive pictures, but the programmes will be the wrong way up.

It's true, I swear.

Sounds to me like turning the tube/tele upside down is the way to go. ;-)

It's fast. It's cheap. It's easy. And, best of all TVs are easily re-flipped for shows that don't need conversion. Channel surfing becomes challenging though....

MOD DOWN (-1, urban legend)

[mangu]

southern hemisphere CRTs (i.e. older TVs and computer monitors) ARE manufactured to compensate for a different magnetic field direction than northern hemisphere ones

Then I guess I was lucky to get by mistake a super-secret military monitor when I lived in the US. I later brought that monitor to Brazil, and guess what? It worked absolutely perfect in any position at all, just like it did in the US.

The earth's magnetic field varies everywhere [wikipedia.org], not just from the northern hemisphere to the south. Besides, the

Re:

[Builder]

Whoosh!

Re:

[the_arrow]

Well, it can happen the other way round too. I bought a Mad Max dvd some years ago, and default spoken language was... American! Yes, the movies was dubbed to american english! After changing it to australian, I really can't see why because the actors barley spoke with an australian accent.

Re:

[zerocool^]

Fair Dinkum?

Re:

[kinko]

1) the seasons play an important part... tv is pretty crap over the summer months (around Nov-Feb), and all the new series get shown on tv once people have stopped being on holiday, going out to the beach, etc. So that give you 6 months.

2) obviously they want to get popular shows to attract audiences. How long does it take until they decide that a US show is popular and looks like it will be around for a while?
Once they find a series that they think would also be popular in Australia (or New Zealand), how l

It's the same for new movie releases

[Average_Joe_Sixpack]

Much of the piracy of new releases is by those of us who can't stand the theater and don't want to wait half a year for the DVD.

Re:

[prelelat]

I wouldn't put it that its the same as a movie being pirated, usually you could get the content for a movie by going and watching it in the theater within a few days of it being released. The dvd is usually out within 17 months. This is saying you can't even access the media until over a year later in some cases, unless you pirate that media. That I think would drive more people to pirate a TV show than to pirate a movie, as some people will go to a theater to see something but would hate to wait an extr

standard register article

[gEvil (beta)]

I find it humorous that the article talks about how the Australian TV networks are "unable or unwilling to change their programming policies", yet makes no mention about the actual core problem here--the licensing of the content. Yes, if a TV show is produced and owned by an American TV network, then the Australian TV network needs to license it from the American company. They can't just decide to air it whenever they feel like it (which is what this article seems to suggest). Whether the problem is the American company not offering up the content for licensing, or whether the Australian companies don't want to pay the fee until it's lowered needs to be mentioned in order for this article to be more than an uninformed gripe. Then again, it is the Register, so it comes as no surprise to me that it's actually missing the point...

Re:standard register article

[Mateito]

Many of the US shows last year (CSI and SVU spring to mind) had double episode end-of season finales. In the US, these were aired a week apart, so that the cliff-hanger was resolved in 7 days. Here in Australia, the local networks played half the finale around mid-November, then advertised that the second part would be shown in early February. This is an absolutely dispicable way to treat your loyal fans. So, yeah, I pulled down the second half via P2P. Stuff them.

And you know what? I discovered that could get an HD version with no commercials and with better sound. So, I kept doing it... just for one or two of my favourite shows. I can honestly say that if the local networks hadn't treated me (the viewer) with such contempt, I never would have bothered to look around the Net, never worked out which P2P client was the most efficient, and frankly would be watching them on local TV week to week.

Note that most of the current shows are aired only a few of months after the US. Heroes, NCIS, House and Grays Anatomy all fall into this catagory. We are about 3 or 4 episodes into the current season of each of these. I think in the US the episodes are up to the mid teens. The delay in airing doesn't bother me, but being forced to wait four months for the resolution of a double episode pushed me over the edge.

Re:standard register article

[grimJester]

I don't even know how far behind the shows I watch are in Finland anymore. There simply is no legal way to get them within a reasonable time. I've quit watching TV almost completely - all I watch nowadays is BBC News or found on the net.

I follow several "currently airing" series. Battlestar Galactica, Stargate, SG Atlantis, Rome, The Simpsons, South Park to name a few. I'd be happy to pay, for example, $2/episode for subscriptions for these if I could get them to start downloading from a trusted source as soon as they're available. Heck, I'd be willing to develop the service for a pittance. Still, the content providers are more concerned with preventing the audience from viewing their product than making it possible for the audience to view said product.

The current state of copyright no longer serves the purpose of making as much art as possible available to as many as possible. It needs an overhaul. Badly.

Re:

[nathanh]

I follow several "currently airing" series. Battlestar Galactica, Stargate, SG Atlantis, Rome, The Simpsons, South Park to name a few. I'd be happy to pay, for example, $2/episode for subscriptions for these if I could get them to start downloading from a trusted source as soon as they're available.

$2 an episode is too much. Let's imagine I watch 12 series with an average of 24 episodes per series per year. That's $576 per year on top of the Internet bandwidth costs which are still quite significant i

Obvious...

[bigbigbison]

I know that as a Doctor Who fan in the states I'm not going to wait to see new episodes of Who. When I can download them and watch them less than 12 hours after they have been on in BBC, there really isn't any reason to wait until SciFi channel or whoever decides to air it. More and more it seems as if my favorite shows aren't aired on channels in the USA or if they are, they are shown months later.

Sure it may be copyright infringement to download them, but since there's no legal way for me to see a lot of these shows in the first place, I don't have a problem with it. I can't pay for them if I wanted to, I do pay for cable, and I'm not a Nielson Rating's house, so the arguments against downloading these shows seem pretty weak.

Re:Obvious...

[sokoban]

Also, Doctor Who on BBC-America looks like crap. I guess it is due to the PAL-NTSC conversion, but everything on that channel looks awful.

I do the same thing with Bleach, a Japanese anime show. I can either wait a few years for the dubbed english version, or get the subbed Japanese show the same day in really high quality DivX. I don't know what it will take to convince the networks that people really would like to download content and have it at home. I also don't understand why networks don't just release shows for free with targeted advertisements. It seems that if you had people sign up with some sort of basic survey about where they live, how old they are, their interests, etc. advertisers gladly pay to have commercials interjected into the programming people download. Free, but with advertising, television downloads would be a big hit, I imagine.

Re:

[gEvil (beta)]

It seems that if you had people sign up with some sort of basic survey about where they live, how old they are, their interests, etc. advertisers gladly pay to have commercials interjected into the programming people download.

The reason is really quite simple: If they start offering up content with commercials to other countries, then they are (as far as the law is concerned) doing business in that country. Which suddenly means that they have to get a business license, follow all applicable regulations,

Re:

[cptgrudge]

Free, but with advertising, television downloads would be a big hit, I imagine.

I agree. Why don't the networks just set up their own bittorrent trackers and supply TV shows with ads in them? I'd be happy to fill out a (quite intrusive, but non-identifying) survey about my habits/details in exchange for a single use torrent URL. As it is now, if I miss an episode of a TV show that I watch, the crippled version on the network web site is the last place I go because I don't want to watch it on my comput

Re:

[MojoStan]

Why don't the networks just set up their own bittorrent trackers and supply TV shows with ads in them? ...the crippled version on the network web site is the last place I go because I don't want to watch it on my computer... And I would watch the commercials, because I know that I'm getting something in exchange. Not everyone would watch them, but people get up to go to the bathroom or the kitchen during commercials as well.

Do you really expect the networks to offer their shows (in their current form) with skippable ads? They're already throwing a hissy-fit over the ad-skipping feature on DVRs. I'm sure that's why they only offer the "crippled version" on their web site: the web site's embedded video player does not allow ad-skipping. I don't expect the networks to offer free downloadable shows (with ads) until they can find an acceptable video-playing system that can restrict ad-skipping.

Also, the few shows that I've watch

Re:

[ArsSineArtificio]

Also, Doctor Who on BBC-America looks like crap.

Yeah, I don't get it. All the Doctor Who broadcast after 1989 has looked awful.

Re:

[sokoban]

I can either wait a few years for the dubbed english version, or get the subbed Japanese show the same day in really high quality DivX.

How good can the quality of the translated subtitles be if some fanboy has it done on the same day?!

Really fucking good. The worst problems I've seen are occasional spelling errors. Dattebayo Fansubs does pretty damn fine work.

Re:

[Haeleth]

How good can the quality of the translated subtitles be if some fanboy has it done on the same day?!

In the days when I used to watch them, it used to be excruciatingly poor, with cringeworthy translation errors, unreadably wooden dialogue, and typos galore; most of the effort usually seemed to be put into dancing animated karaoke lyrics for the opening song, rather than actually translating the script well. I glimpse the odd screen capture on blogs and so forth from time to time, and it doesn't look like t

Re:

[zerocool^]

Also, BBC for a while licensed Top Gear out to the discovery channel (I think) but it just isn't the same as the UK version. They re-recorded all the parts in the studio to replace "bonnet" with "hood", "boot" with "trunk", and to remove all of Clarkson's "Everything from America is rubbish". They also switched the videos such that they were reviewing cars available in the US (Ford GT, Cadillac STS-R, and like a bently or something)

Now, I don't think that Clarkson really is fair about the quality of Ameri

Re:

[bigbigbison]

So the bank is who gives me my money and not my employer? It would be nice to get your comparisons right is you are going to make them.

If you take money from someone, you are taking something. they don't have the money. Who is being hurt by my not wanting to wait to watch Doctor Who? Or by my wanting to watch some other show that is not and probably never will be available in my country? Explain to me how I am hurting anyone and then maybe I'll think about stopping.

Piracy is bad

[bhalter80]

While piracy is bad, I think most people would agree, this study shows an interesting phenomenon of our shrinking world. With the increased availability of digital content the barriers to acquiring a product available in a region of the world that is not your own are almost non-existent. In the past you would have to fly to the region that had the product you sought out, buy it and fly back or have it imported via some other means. Now there is no technological reason you shouldn't be able to do the same, just some legal hurdles imposed by countries out to make a buck anywhere they can and media companies out to do the same. I don't know what the solution to the former is but in regards to the latter I would think this would be enough to show that there is a demand for the content and for them to find a way to distribute it.

Re:Piracy is bad

[frdmfghtr]

Now there is no technological reason you shouldn't be able to do the same, just some legal hurdles imposed by countries out to make a buck anywhere they can and media companies out to do the same. I don't know what the solution to the former is but in regards to the latter I would think this would be enough to show that there is a demand for the content and for them to find a way to distribute it.

I don't follow how you can say that the "countries" are out to make a buck...unless you are referring to government officials who will allow their influence to be, well, "influenced" by the industry that wants to make a buck then make another one without extra effort.

I would like an explanation from somebody in the industry as to why content is not made available to more viewers/listeners/etc. Demand is there; we see that in the amount of sales that come from online digital resources and transfers via other means such as BitTorrent. If there is demand for your product, you can do business and profit. If you don't do business, somebody else will.

People download from p2p nets because YOU (the content provider/copyright holder/whatever term you want to use) won't provide quality content and a reasonable price. Do that, and you will profit. Those who continue to use p2p weren't going to buy your product anyway, so you have lost nothing.

It all seems so simple, I must be missing something somewhere.

Re:

[frdmfghtr]

You will only profit if what people consider a reasonable price is high enough. By offereing direct download they will lose renvenue from TV stations. If they lose more than they earn from direct download then it doesn't make sense to do so. Things aren't as black and white as you are trying to make it out to be.

I agree that I made it a very simple argument--corporations hire people magnitudes smarter than I am in these areas to figure out these answers.

To counter your argument about lost station revenue;

The real problem

[mdboyd]

Is the that the toilets in Australia flush counter-clockwise. This really messes with Ted Steven's tubes and prevents licensed content from quickly reaching the country.

You heard it here first folks...

The whole 'entertainment' experience is wrong

[Anonymous Coward]

TV in Australia sucks because of the constant barrage of overly loud advertisements for 3 minutes after every 5 minutes of TV show.

Cinema in Australia sucks because of long queue lines, high prices and poor quality movies, as well as the 20 mins of lead-up-to-the-main-feature advertisements.

DVD release in Australia suck because we have to wait and wait and wait for a DVD that gets superseded 1 month after arrival by the Gold Edition, then the Extra Gold Edition, then the SuperMegaHypeUltraBlaster edition shortly after.

The whole experience of entertainment via TV/DVD or cinema is completely wrong. It lacks that all important component - ENTERTAINMENT.

Why bother? I can buy a bootleg copy of just about anything, download it if I can be bothered or borrow someone else's copy of whatever it may be. Either way, these three elements of access to entertainment guarantee I get my entertainment fix.

Yes - I am an Aussie.

Re:The whole 'entertainment' experience is wrong

[Overzeetop]

Let me just say that, as an American, I feel entirely superior in my media consumption, as I have the ability to watch 3 minutes after every 5 minutes of TV show, stand in long queue lines, pay high prices for seating and refreshments, all to watch 20 mins of lead-up-to-the-main-feature advertisements before I get to watch the poor quality movie, only to then wait several months before I can purchase the DVD, which rapidly gets superceded by the arrival by the Gold Edition, then the Extra Gold Directors Cut Edition, then the SuperMegaHypeUltraBlaster edition, up to a year or more before you get to get caught up in the whirlpool!

Quite honestly, I'd say you're in the perfect position. With global commerce, you can get the DVD, rip it to disc, and watch the whole thing before the theatrical release even get to Australia! Of course, that's 6 months after you could have downloaded it of oosnet-yay (the first rule of...) as a screener or cam-capture (they're getting better you know, thanks to the Canadians).

Of course, none of this makes up for the fact that we (and I mean "we" in the most generic, ugly American sense, not me personally) are churning out an amazing volume of absolute crap every year, which we so carefully delay in sending you.

Somehow, in the era before the internet and digital cinema, it made a certain amount of sense to have a staggered release. Given enough theaters with digital projection capabilities, it shouldn't really matter. I know that time is not here yet, but it's close enough that it could be. Maybe it's a little like HDTV in the US. If the FCC had had a backbone in the 90s, we could have all been happily watching 720p already. (And for you 1080i zealots - wouldn't it have been better to have 720p that actually worked than the spaghetti that is HDTV now?)

exuse me...NO, bartender, I'm just fine...in fact you can top me off if you would. Of course I won't be driving home...

Re:

[askegg]

The problem is even worse than that - the networks are unwilling to change. Advertisements are constant and loud (to spite investigative "reporters" proving otherwise - have they never heard of dynamic compression?), the repetition of shows is repeatative in the most repeatative of ways you can repeat, the switch to digital is slooooooow (when can we get a proper EPG that shows more than the current and next shows?).

Of course, all of these issues are a little off point. The fact is most shows are dela

No surprise

[Dan East]

I guess a bunch of execs are sitting around the board room table, still thinking it is 1970 and they have exclusive control over video distribution of their content. It will probably take an entire generation worth of executives to die off before some of these industries can reform. It really takes serious denial to think that consumers would prefer to wait for them to broadcast the content over their channels, when it can be obtained immediately, on-demand, in HD without commercials for free.

Dan East

now I wished i watched television

[atarione]

so i could tell all our Australian friends how the shows they are still waiting for ended =p

seems like there are similar problems everywhere..I for example really like TopGear on the BBC..... sadly however there is no legitimate way for me to watch it here in America.... So naturally I never watch it at all =p (pro tip never admit piracy or other crimes on teh interweb)

TopGear- On later tonight.

[RotateLeftByte]

TopGear is apparently the most pirated(sorry watched) BBC show after Dr Who worldwide. It is very un PC and that is what makes it so attractive.
Goody, 55mins to go before this weeks edition. The lads are messing around in Tractors trying to grow their own Fuel.

Keep up the good work lads. I'll be at Dunsfold next week for the show.

Perhaps the BBC should copy UK Channel 4 and setup a pay downoad site for non serial shows like TopGear
Off Topic:-
The place where the show is filmed is the place where the

Re:

[atarione]

Keep up the good work lads. I'll be at Dunsfold next week for the show

you lucky bastard =p seriously I would be so excited I wouldn't know what to do if I could goto the filming of the show.

Re:

[Winckle]

I can make you even more jealous, since i'm a licence fee payer and it's a BBC show the tickets for the filming/recording of any BBC TV/Radio show are free of charge, you just ask for them. :D

Re:

[zerocool^]

Sooo... Gambon Bend is YOUR fault!

You've nearly KILLED the Stig!

The same is true in Germany

[Anonymous Coward]

Not only do we get most movies much later (if at all). We also get TV series MUCH later (if at all), and to add insult to injury, it's all in some crappy translation (you just can't translate puns, nor can you really adequately translate interesting dialog), spoken by speakers with totally different voices than the original ones, and so forth...

As a result, I don't even own a TV anymore (just not worth it, especially since the government makes us pay >$15/month), only watch DVDs once in a while, and otherwise watch downloaded stuff from overseas.

It's like the war on drugs: wake up, nobody cares if it's illegal. When people want something, there are two choices: sell it to them in an open, competitive market, or prohibit it and live with the results (mafia gangs, illegal distribution). But you can't change people.

Other benefits to consider.

[Blimey85]

Lets not forget the other benefits from downloading tv shows. As the article discusses the main one is acess to something you otherwise wouldn't be able to watch at all, or at the very least much sooner than you'd would otherwise be able to watch it. The benefits do not end there. I recently moved and switched from Dish to DirecTV. I missed approximately two weeks of tv shows that are on the first dvr while I am now using the second dvr. There is now way (that I know of) to move shows from one to the other

Good TV or Good Broadband? Hmm........

[LibertineR]

First, it isnt just the Aussies.

Germany has a thriving torrent culture for the same reason.

I often wonder if I would trade their lack of good media with our lack in America of good fast and CHEAP broadband connectivity?

Were it not for Battlestar, Firefox and 24, I would probably vote for the broadband.

Well, duh

[Cholten]

I don't pirate software (there's enough very good free stuff out there).

I don't pirate movies (anything worth having is worth buying on DVD).

I don't pirate music (same as DVDs).

However I do download 7-10 TV episodes off usenet every week. I pull them the day after they are on in the US as they won't be shown here in the UK for months - if at all.

What I can never understand is why Murdoch et al don't sign deals with the American networks to show their channels as part of their cable / satellite packages. Sam

Happens in America too.

[kahrytan]

I know how it feels to wait a long time for TV shows. And I suspect many Americans do too.

      Scifi channel delayed finishing up Stargate Atlantis' Season 3 and Stargate SG-1's last season until April. But Canadians and UK (Sky One) have been watching it since December and January. So many Americans have to wait 4 to 5 months just to watch their favorite show.

Tape Trading

[mrshowtime]

It seems that in the torrent age, everyone has forgotten that tv shows used to be traded on VHS all over the world. I used to get Dr. Who episodes from my cousins in England (I had a very expensive PAL/NTSC converter-player) and I used to trade episodes with a lot of people all over the world. Now I can just download whatever tv episodes that I want. I don't understand why nobody gave a shit about tape trading, but now if I share a private torrent or a custom made dvd of a tv show with my friends, instead of sending them a tape, I am a now PIRATE! Television has always been regarded as "disposable" entertainment. It was not till Lucille Ball started filming all her show that anyone thought that a tv show could hold any future value after once it aired. Look at the BBC, they have had a policy of no reruns past the original broadcast. While we here in the states got to watch Dr. Who/Blakes 7 over and over again on PBS stations, it was difficult to find old episodes in the UK.

Re:

[tymbow]

They did care, but the physical aspect of tape trading and the cost to make tapes limited potential damage. It was also constrained to the physical borders of the country of origin. The other significant issue is that it is near impossible to police this type of trading activity. The Internet changes this - the impact is huge because the reach is orders of magnitude greater, it extends well beyond physical country boundaries and duplication costs are near zero. Policing is where changes are the largest; thi

Sweden used to be like that

[the_arrow]

In Sweden, many american tv-series and moves could take quite some time before getting shown or released. It's much better now though, with many tv-series only a couple of episodes behind, if even that.

Here are some examples of the delays

[dns_server]

It is really that bad for a majority of programs especially scifi:

Alias for example, according to wikipedia it was shown 2005-2006, It has not been shown in australia yet with no plans from what i can see to have it shown, There is also no release date for the dvd. Star Trek: Voyager was the worst you finished in 2001, we finished in 2005.

With Battlestar galactica we just showed the last episode of season 2 a few hours ago (started at 11:40pm but would be shown anywhere between 10:30pm and 2:30am) You are half way through season 3.

Stargate sg1, we finished season 9 last month, Stargate Atlantis we are at season 2 episode 6.

Extras started their second season last week.

The O.C. Is one exception though, channel 10 actually showed episodes of this within a week of the us, You showed it on the 22nd we showed it on the 23rd or 24th (the Australian rules pre-season has started so some regions where delayed).

Most programs are put on a 6 month delay much of this is because of the difference in ratings periods, yours is around September ours started a few weeks ago.

Re:

[AeroIllini]

Star Trek: Voyager was the worst

Right on.

Money

[forgoil]

The first who can get 720p/1080p high bitrate surround sound TV series on the net, in a way that is fairly priced, is bound to make a huge amount of bucks, and make it a hell of a lot easier to start convincing people to pay instead of pirate. It is about two things first and foremost:

1. Convenience. I can watch it when I want, where I want, with no commercials or similar horrors.
2. Quality. TV/iTunes just doesn't cut it. I want full widescreen 720/1080 HDTV with full quality surround and top notch bitrate

Re:

[Overzeetop]

There are three things stopping them:

(1) Poor penetration of high speed net access. Delivering ATSC 720p ODP programming will saturate all but the absolute fastest residential pipes, and even then there would only be one stream at a time available. Overcompression and pipe optimization help the few iptv over fiber providers. If some people have this and others don't, then its more likely to lead to

(2) Piracy. Who wants all those precious little bits out there, just waiting to be swapped for free? I mean, ex

Re:

[MojoStan]

2. Quality. TV/iTunes just doesn't cut it. I want full widescreen 720/1080 HDTV with full quality surround and top notch bitrate choices (I'll pay the double for 2x the bitrate).

Wouldn't 720p or 1080i be much more than 2x the bitrate of iTunes Store 640x480 video?

640 * 480 = 307,200 pixels
1280 * 720 = 921,600 pixels

And that's not counting the full quality surround sound.

BTW, Xbox Live Video Marketplace offers 720p HD television downloads for $3 (240 points), but you need an Xbox to use this service.

bullshit laws just suck

[zogger]

Now I am old enough and ornery enough and imbued with a certain sense of basic right and wrong. And as such, some of the things I did when I was younger was I walked in protest marches where the bullshit laws said people of a certain color could not use certain public facilities or go into certain open to the public businesses. Yes, that was "the law" back then and the pigs tried to enforce it, sometimes extremely violently, on orders from their masters, their pig political bosses and pig lawyers and pig "b

Would drive me batty...

[A_Non_Moose]

BSG's pilot, I watched a year or so after it aired after I downloaded it. Liked it and
watched "33" on Sci-fi's website for about 10 minutes before saying "screw this".

Real media (blech, but whatever) 3 inch window (c'mon, 640x480 days are long gone)
and of course frequent pauses for buffering.

Fired up BT client and all of the rips were from Aussie satellite and looked fantastic.
Also, they were 1/2 to 3/4 through season 1, so "what the heck" snagged them all before
they even showed on Sci-fi. Still watched them on Sci-fi (hey, Sci-fi/charter how about
a hi-def channel, or ffs a bit more gamme on your output, please! This is BSG, not
DooM3).

Still bought the DVDs.

Same thing with Dr Who, heck season 2 was worth it for the Daleks vs Cybermen exchange of
"Daleks would not be at war with the cybers, it would be more like pest control" (pause)
BWAAAHAHAHAHA.
Heck, I forget where Sci-fi is with Dr Who, but doesn't matter much as the DVD's are
released shortly after the British season ends, if I'm not mistaken. 80 bucks is
rather steep, but as I said, for some eps well worth the price.

Torchwood, too. Show grew on me quite quickly. Depending on season2, might actually
be worth it to get the DVDs.

Heck, the US/UK/Aus TV ppl would make a killing money/ratings-wise with an P2P/iTunes like
distribution without the bullshit delays and some easy way to unlock it/burn it.

Heck, the shows are going to get to viewers eyeballs one way or the other, and you'd think
something that benefits the studios bottom lines (rating/$) with them in the picture would
be better than out.

Global market whether they want to admit it or not, and as one quip by a brit I recall:
Yanks get Dr Who/Torchwood, and we get Sopranos and 24...fair trade.

Agreed, heck that 7month hiatus for BSG almost hurt, tho giving American Idol to the Aussies
first and us waiting a year sounds splendid.

Blame the delays?

[DoofusOfDeath]

Saying that "TV delays" drive piracy ignores the Australian citizens' free will in the matter. TV delays may whet their apatites to the point where the Aussies are willing to break the law, but the delays certainly don't force them to.

An alternate headline could have been: "Australians chose to break the law rather than patiently await delayed entertainment."

AU more ads than anywhere in the world

[pwylltwiceborn]

The MAJOR point should also be that australia has more ads per show than ANY country on the planet.. HEROES was almost 2 hours long for the first ep when it aired here (seriously 1min view for 1 min ad) We are, on average, at 20 minutes of ads per hour. (its sweden or norway next on the list at 17min) Also for all of us SCIFI watches - BSG, Stargate, Trek, DrWho etc, we want to watch it as it is released as well read the forums etc. Also in the 90's - did you know that they SPED UP the shows so that a 44minute show ran for 43minutes? Yeap - another minute of ads there. (channel 9 was the main user of this)And that was when they didn't choose to edit Star Trek:Next Gen to fit more ads in..(yeap that's right they cut whole scenes out!) Another example was with the Muscial Buffy Episode - they sped it up slightly (shown on channel 7) so it was a bit out of key - My Wife was soooo pissed, but loved me for my DVD copy i had got earlier (was first getting tapes sent from the states then dvds - love my mates) and all this quickly from memory while at work........

Helpful hint for non-USians to use iTunes

[patio11]

You *can* download from US iTunes. You just need an American address, an email account which is not the same as the one linked to your AussieTunes account, and a US payment method. For the American address, you can use the White House for all I care (or, if this scares you for some reason, use Google maps to pick out a city/state at random and use "1234 Maple Street" with the appropriate zipcode). The email can be whatever the heck you want. The payment method is the only tricky part, and its a lot less tricky thanks to eBay. You see, lots of people who get gift certificates but really wanted cash put them up on eBay and some other sites. Buy some gift certificates from eBay (at a discount to face value), get the codes mailed to you, use them to buy from iTunes. Since you aren't inputting a credit card they won't have the computer verify your address because there is nothing to verify it against.

I keep two iTunes accounts around, one for Japan and one for the US. Thankfully they don't do geotracking or anything, and they'll both happily integrate into the same iPod/iTunes/etc.

(Incidentally, the White House address:

The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW
Washington, DC 20500
)

Re:

[Neoncow]

So in order to avoid copywrite infringment, you have to commit fraud to obtain these shows?

Scheduling and generally crappy performance

[Craig Ringer]

Australian TV broadcasters tend to keep only loosely to broadcasting schedules, so don't expect to be able to just watch one show. You'd best start ten minutes beforehand. And, of course, everything is on long delays as compared to the US, and often broadcast with weird gaps and sometimes even out of order.

Of course, they might just cancel the show if there's a football or cricket match on. Sure, they knew it'd be on weeks in advance, but they didn't bother planning for it.

To top things off, the ads are incessant and REALLY BAD. We're talking mind-bogglingly awful patronising badly-made crap.

So ... why would anybody endure free to air TV in Australia? Until the Internet became a useful alternative, I just stopped watching it. Borrowed the odd DVD from friends, bought the odd DVD, watched more than the odd CD of AVIs, but that's about it - it just wasn't worth enduring the suck.

So, let me see - I could put up with that miserable crap, or I could otherwise obtain the show and get it:

• when I want it (on time)
• in better quality; and
• ad free

I'd pay for HD downloads of shows - at decent prices and without that DRM crap. Unfortunately, most services don't provide access for Australians or are TV-like ("you'll watch what we want when we want you to"). They're also all DRM'd or at best streaming-only. The DRM is pointless, since the shows are ALREADY available on the 'net, so it deeply confuses me as to why they bother.

Sure, it's dodgy, but until the media industry is willing to move a bit and meet people in the middle, I'll continue to use the alternative means available.

If you can make a copy of my Ferrari

[Anonymous Coward]

If you can create a cloned copy of my Ferrari without damaging mine, then I'd have no problem with you doing so. Make two.

Re:

[bendodge]

I would, because you agreed not to let that happen in your EULA, and the engineers who spent years designing it wouldn't get their earned pay.

In regards to the article:
Shocking! People want something they can't get, so they bootleg it!?! How surprising!
Come on, this is obvious. But it is still wrong.

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

and the engineers who spent years designing it wouldn't get their earned pay.

Newsflash! The engineers already got paid while they were designing it.

Re:

[Sj0]

Actually, the dealerships buy the ferraris. They're the ones that actually pay for it, so the engineers would get their money. Also, in this example, the dealerships don't need to sell their cars to individuals. They make their money by selling advertising at stoplights. Since the standardized metrics used to estimate the number of people watching aren't affected by piracy, the only people who are hurt are the advertisers.

Don't hold your breath on me crying a river for advertisers who get slightly less expo

Re:

[Dun Malg]

But Ferrari would. You didn't pay the engineers to design the car and the machines to manufacture it, or the marketers to sell it.

No, Ferrari wouldn't care, so long as you didn't attempt to make copies to sell to others, misrepresenting the copies as Ferrari originals. You could even make copies and give them away and Ferrari wouldn't care much, as the cost of materials would drive you to bankruptcy very, very quickly. This is why the "car analogy" shit fails. "Content owners" only care about digital duplication because it exposes the fraud of their business, that they've made a living out of distributing information based upon an ar

Re:

[suckmysav]

"The only thing that makes one item counterfeit from another identical item is the brand owner saying it's fake."

Sounds like DeBeers and their ongoing efforts to discredit "man made" diamonds as being somehow fake, despite them being indistinguishable from the "real thing."

Re:It's Still Wrong

[unformed]

Who said it's about justifying piracy? It's not. It's still wrong, but it shows that there IS a market that is willing to pay for it ... if it was provided.

Piracy isn't justified, but if the consumers want to see a TV show, they will. The question now is, are you going to sell it to them, or are they going to have no choice but to steal it?

Re:It's Still Wrong

[anagama]

Chances are these people aren't stupid, but have looked at the numbers and concluded that people aren't willing to pay enough for them to make a profit.

How does that make sense? If they intend to never sell in AU, they've made the show with the presumption it will make a profit in other markets. If it turns out they can also sell in AU, then that's all pure bonus money. And how much exactly would it cost for them to get the show on iTunes? Doesn't apple actually provide the bandwidth for their pay stuff? There's just no downside.

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not that simple. Production companies charge more for new shows and less for old shows. Basically the AU tv company has said we are willing to pay $X for your show and no more. The Production company then replies, well if that's all your willing to pay you'll have to wait at least 12 month since we have other markets whom are willing to pay a lot more. If they where willing to sell for $X to AU at once then for example the UK market who where willing to pay more than $X will refuse to do so and t

Re:It's Still Wrong

[anagama]

Except they can make money by directly selling it to the people and cut out the networks altogether. I suspect that since the media companies are really married to the advertising model however, they don't consider the potential for direct sales. Now, I don't condone piracy when the piracy might interfere with the content producer's ability to earn money, but by the same token, I've become quite accustomed to having commercial free entertainment on DVD or through iTunes. I'm in the US so it is easy for me to get things by legal means and so I do. If I was AU, I wouldn't feel guilty about downloading because nobody wants to sell it to me anyway. Right or wrong, this is the future market media companies have to deal with and what they ought to do, is figure out how to deal with it profitably.

Re:

[dangitman]

So, sell it on DVD direct to the Australian market. As you said, new shows are worth more - so they can sell at a premium. If they wait until after it shows on Aussie TV, the DVDs are worth less, and people might pick them up from a bargian bin, if at all. After all that time, the show is less desirable, so people might forgo buying the DVDs altogether.

Re:

[anagama]

This ignores the fact, whether illegal or not, that people will get the material when they want it. Laws and lawsuits notwithstanding, the media companies have a choice -- make some money and provide the content in a form people desire, or make little to no money and watch the people receive the content in a form they desire through unauthorized means.

Re:

[miskatonic alumnus]

They are not stealing it. I don't know about the law down under, but in the states, if you receive a copy from someone who made the copy, not only have you not stolen it, you also have not received stolen goods nor violated copyright law. Please explain this whole stealing business.

It's Illegal, but is it Wrong?

[batwingTM]

They are not stealing it. I don't know about the law down under, but in the states, if you receive a copy from someone who made the copy, not only have you not stolen it, you also have not received stolen goods nor violated copyright law. Please explain this whole stealing business.

O.K. Let me come out and say this. I live in Australia and I regularly download TV episodes from the States, and the reason, you cannot trust Aussie TV stations. Many years ago in Australia a show was broadcast called American Gothic. it had received good reviews and Network Ten had the rights to it. So I watched the first episode, it seemed good, I watched the second episode, it was alright, I watched the third episode... And I had no idea what was going on. I spoke to friends in Oz, seeing if I h

Re:

[bonhomme_de_neige]

Anime is the best example of this. Fansub groups have been pirating Anime for a couple of decades, more so in the past 5 years as VCD/DVD and digital subtitles became practical. Most fansub groups pirate material until such time it becomes licensed in their country, which they feel they contributed to creating a market for material that otherwise did not exist. 100% justified. Whether it's right or wrong is up to the respective copyright holders, who in the past have shown tolerance to anime fan-sub groups

Re:

[Harmonious Botch]

While slashdot has indeed tended toward becoming a forum for piracy excuses, this is not neccesarily an example of it. This seems more to document a stupid move by a corporation that give the unethical a stronger motive for piracy.

Re:It's Still Wrong

[Sj0]

"The unethical"?

I'd say that's pretty subjective. Personally, I believe that since I pay a lot of money for cable TV, I've 'paid my dues' with respect to gaining access to the media. I don't believe that advertisers have any moral right for me to watch their ads, and I can easily show that nobody in the entire chain loses money as a result of my downloading a TV show I've paid for access for, to watch at another time and place.

Within my ethic, then, I am acting in a perfectly ethical manner. I'm simply attaining content I've paid for from another source, using an internet connection I've paid for. Since, in my ethic, I am not obliged to watch advertising just becuase some company paid for it, downloading TV shows is completely ethical for me.

Re:

[9mm Censor]

Yes, it is wrong. The media is wrong by not catering to the world market. If the media gave the market what the consumers want, there would be less of a problem with piracy.

We have the media corps not giving the consumers what they want.
and
We have the consumers taking what they want, but not from the media corps because they are not giving the consumers the choice to choose what they want, legally.

No one is really right in the situation, and thus it continues to perpetuate digital theft, and aggressive li

Re:It's Still Wrong

[MillionthMonkey]

Well, we wanted all this "globalization", didn't we? And we have worldwide communication now, don't we? So why do they act surprised when people start pirating titles when they delay release dates across different continents by months?

I mean, geez, who's running the television industry, the Dutch East India Pictures Association? Why is their incompetence the fault of the market? Why do we have laws to protect incompetence?

Re:

[LighterShadeOfBlack]

Just because some people can't get something, doesn't make it right. I can't afford a Ferrari, but nobody would justify me stealing it.

- Whether piracy is wrong under this circumstance or any other, the "piracy is theft" mantra is pure unadulterated bullshit. For God's sake stop using it.

Re:

[grimJester]

Piracy IS theft.

Copyright violations ARE NOT theft.

a) wrong.

b) correct.

To elaborate, piracy is robbery, not theft, committed at sea. Stealing something from a ship without getting noticed in the act would not be piracy. Threatening the crew of a ship with a cutlass while helping yourself to their booty is piracy. Possibly rape, depending on your definition of "booty".

Re:

[LighterShadeOfBlack]

It's not about semantics. It's about clarifying what the of the act of piracy is and is not. There's no point even trying to have an intelligent discussion about software piracy if one party doesn't understand what it is to the point that they can't differentiate between piracy and theft.

As far as the term "piracy" goes, I guess the last time you checked that meaning was some time before the 1990's since it has been used colloquially within this context for well over a decade. If anybody misunderstood my po

Re:It's Still Wrong

[pnattress]

You can't afford a Ferrari. That doesn't mean it's not available to you, just that you don't have the means to get it. The issue here is that Australians don't have the means of legally acquiring this material. They can't even log on to the US iTunes and pay for it. That's the problem.

I love how Slashdot has become the only place to come for incorrect car analogies.

Re:

[YouTalkinToMe]

Yes, it is still probably illegal, but when or how it is released does have an effect on the legal/moral implications of downloading.

For example, if the show was NEVER aired in Australia, and is never made available for sale on DVD, then is it still illegal to copy? It would have no impact on earning potential, or?

Re:

[HowIsMyDriving?]

If you would have told me that Jake and the Fat Man would be on DVD two years ago, I would have laughed. Now it is. What you would be doing is impacting future earnings. It is a companies right to not distribute something that they paid for and created. While you might not like that, it is true. If a company makes a movie that they do not like and don't distribute it, which has happened before, that does not mean that it is ok to pirate it. It is a buisness calculation to not release it and whatever happens

Re:

[Original Replica]

Either wait or it, or petition for it to be made or sale.

In a passive/aggressive kind of way piracy is a petition for change. No stealing it is not right, but mass piracy does convey the will of the masses. People want their entertainment, fresh and cheap. Maybe in order to supply that, quality will suffer, but that is what the demand is. If a legal unlimited media-crap P2P network that cost the same as cable TV, was made availible, there would be much less piracy.

Re:It's Still Wrong

[anagama]

I disagree with you here. Note, I've been modded flamebait and troll a lot for saying stuff against the partyline on copyright. The problem with piracy is that has the potential to harm producers because some people who would have paid won't (it's impossible that all copyright infringers absolutely never would have paid for the content). Thus, the producer is harmed by illegal downloading and it should not be condoned.

This situation different. If the material is not released in any pay format, the content producer cannot possibly suffer any negative consequences by banned groups' piracy.

The question is different when there is delay as in this case and there are more questions to be answered. For example, do all shows make it to Australia or just a few? Why exactly are the content producers delaying so long? Is it actually the AU media that is standing in the way of distribution?

Answers to these kinds of questions could sway my thinking (remember, it is based on the potential for lost sales, not any "moral" argument posed by either side). If it is simply a choice by the content producers not to sell to AU, then I don't really have a problem because they would never have made a dime of Australia. I would think the answer though is more complicated. Politics? Protectionism?

They can't?

[Leuf]

This situation different. If the material is not released in any pay format, the content producer cannot possibly suffer any negative consequences by banned groups' piracy.

Just because they haven't released it YET doesn't mean there's no potential harm. If they can't get the content in a timely fashion and everyone has already watched it off bt, then why bother releasing it late? You don't get to decide when and how they have to release the content.

The reality is that we have a global audience now. Aussies can get on the net (except for the Tassies that are still working on that whole fire thing) and want to talk with other fans of the show, but it's impossible for them

Re:

[anagama]

Just because they haven't released it YET doesn't mean there's no potential harm.

And I recognize that fact in my original post. However, there are questions in my mind about whether it is wrong to illegally download shows when they are 17 months behind (note I make a distinction between wrong/illegal). I believe that illegal downloads have the potential to cut into profits. However, when a content producer makes a choice to not sell their product within a reasonable time, it seems somewhat unreasonable

Re:It's Still Wrong

[MostAwesomeDude]

Woot, a troll.

Okay, so listen up. If you can't afford a Ferrari, that is understandable. Ferraris are spendy little cars. But DVDs? They're perfectly affordable. So is basic cable. The problem here is not cost, not at any level -- Australia is an English-speaking country with similar obscenity laws and a excellent grasp of American culture. There should not be any costs associated with "preparing" episodes for export to Australia, neither for broadcast nor for DVD.

People are pirating it because there is no other way to get it. For some inexplicable reason, the industry seems to think that there is little to no demand for importing these shows, and so they've neglected to do so. It's sort of sad, really; the industry hasn't always been this way. For example, Cartoon Network started airing late-night anime precisely because polls showed that the biggest demographic of anime fansubbers and traders was also the demographic most likely to sit up late at night and watch cartoons. While this may not seem like a big deal to you, it was an amazingly awesome thing for anime lovers, and I think that Cartoon Network got it right.

Your "wait for it" method assumes that the show in question will in fact be aired and released in Australia regardless of consumer input. This is not true. There are many shows in markets which simply never arrive in places due to a lack of demand. For every anime imported, dubbed, edited, NTSCed, and aired or released in America and Canada, there are dozens that they predict just won't sell no matter how snazzy the packaging is. The only way to show that there is a serious demand is to pirate the shows.

The TV business is usually not as receptive to input as the Adult Swim guys. They don't understand much besides money and ratings. The only way to force them to speed up their importing schedules is to create economic impetus -- to pirate the shows that are being demanded. Anything else is futile.

Re:

[Yvanhoe]

Well it is wrong in the legal sense but I would call it right in the moral sense. Americans have the show for free on broadcasting networks. They can tape it, share the tape with friends, but can't do this digitally or can't give it to australians friends ? Yeah, that's the law, you should comply but you should also change it quickly.

Luckily I am free of the series addiction that seem to get all my colleagues, but I must say that it is very hard for those watching the series on the national network to no

Brainwashed

[clang_jangle]

You sir are brainwashed.

The people who began calling the process of copying files from the network w/o the permission of the "IP owner" "piracy" and "stealing" are the **AA parasites, and they add little to no value while conspiring to hold us all back technologically and for what? To keep milking a clearly obsolete business model.

Data wants to be free; we can only restrict distribution and charge $$ for it by making some artificial arrangement (which is always going to be defeatable). Even so if they would price their "IP" at a level the market is willing to bear and provide it in a format people find useful (vs restictive) most people would rather just buy it, it's easier.
These are some *reasons* piracy happens.
So the real excuse makers and criminals here are the **AA .

All this is not big news --- do try to keep up old man!

The post about copying the ferarri is spot on and should be modded up.

Re:

[Wicko]

You sir need to be modded up. How piracy managed to get in the dictionary with respect to copyright infringement, I'll never know. This is a slang term which in its actual definition has very little in common to the acts described by the **AA. I can't stress enough how twisted this situation is, with all the brain washing and "studies" performed by **AA and friends. People need to start thinking for themselves instead of horribly disfigured articles and news reports doing it for them.

Re:

[Richard_at_work]

Data wants to be free;

Oh god, not that crap again - data isnt tangible, it doesnt want to *be* anything, let alone free. Its owned by someone, someone controls access to information and the price is whatever that someone says. Data doesnt sit on a hard disk somewhere tunneling under the wire, it doesnt hide in supply trucks, it sits there until an external entity does something to it.

we can only restrict distribution and charge $$ for it by making some artificial arrangement (which is always going to be defeatable).

Be very careful, because the only reason you can leave your car in a car park with a reasonable expectation of it being there when you g

Re:Brainwashed

[Dun Malg]

Data wants to be free;

Oh god, not that crap again - data isnt tangible, it doesnt want to *be* anything, let alone free.

Hey genius, let me introduce you to the fascinating world of Rhetorical Devices [wikipedia.org].
Note that those with "nothing to lose but [their] chains" need not actually be confined by chains, nor does a comment of "I wouldn't want to be in your shoes" have anything to do with the relative merits of footwear.
"Information wants to be free" is a catch phrase, shorthand for the larger, more complex principle that the entire purpose of information is to be shared. But you knew that. You were just being an ass.

Re:It's Still Wrong -- NOPE!

[Visaris]

If the copyright holders are unwilling to sell a copy of a digital work, how can it possibly be morally wrong to obtain your own copy at zero cost to the original owner? The owner can't even try to claim that they lost "potential sales", because they were not selling copies in the first place.

Re:

[aplusjimages]

Is that you Ben Affleck? Don't worry the Aussies aren't downloading Daredevil or Gigli.

Re:

[dangitman]

OK, so what's wrong about it?

Just because something is illegal does not make it morally wrong. I download shows on bittorrent, and if I like a show, then I go and buy the DVD when it is later released. So, they are making more money from me than if I were watching them on TV. Everybody wins! I get the shows when I want them, the producers get to make money. Where's the crime or immoraility?

Re:

[TeraCo]

It's true, it is nothing more than a justification. But strangely enough, we don't care.

I mean.. I'm pro-copyright in principle. I buy loads of stuff on itunes and I think there is a case for DRM (in that content producers should control what happens with their content) but ultimately, I'd rather download the TV shows now and buy the DVD's later than wait for Australian TV networks to get their shit together.

Ultimately downloading + DVD buying = Watching good TV shows earlier for me + Extra cash for the

Re:

[WilliamSChips]

Go read a freakin' book!

I hate people always saying this whenever TV comes up. If all I wanted to do was read books I wouldn't even own a TV. But I do own a TV.