RIAA Announces New Campus Lawsuit Strategy 299
An anonymous reader writes "The RIAA is once again revising their lawsuit strategy, and will now be sending college students and others "pre-lawsuit letters." People will now be able to settle for a discount. How nice."
A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:4, Funny)
Re:A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:4, Funny)
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The OP says (as you so helpfully quoted) "lawyers and judges
The GP says that their are many lawyers who criticize this tactic. The implication here is that they are not silent, therefore the assertion that they condone the RIAA's tactics with their (non-existent) silence is not true.
The point the OP was asserting was that other lawyers are not criticizing the RIAA's tactics. The GP is maki
Re:A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:5, Insightful)
What better way to stop that from even happening by not taking them to court?
Why are they targeting college students? Not because they are the biggest file sharers but because they have the least amount of money.
Yeah... (Score:5, Interesting)
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Re:A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:4, Insightful)
If anything, the RIAA is going to create a whole generation of people who could've afforded school, but thanks to those annoying bastards can't really finish their degree, are left with huge loans and don't have a degree allowing them to pay their debts. The RIAA is really pissing me off, they're not helping educate people, they're helping them drop out of school and get even further into debt!
If the RIAA had any kind of patriotic interest whatsoever, they would stop suing students right NOW and instead try to have lotteries for scholarships for people who legally buy music. That'll get any students' attention, and they'll want to buy music in the process!
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What I want to know, however, is what they hope to gain by extorting money from people who don't have it. If, for example, they sent me such a letter, I would simply wipe my ass with it and send it back (obviously, an email wouldn't be tactile enough, but you get the idea.) Now, what would they do then. I own almost nothing of value - no h
Re:A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:5, Interesting)
"Except when they target students on financial aid, whose very education could be depending on the few thousands of dollars they're demanding! If anything, the RIAA is going to create a whole generation of people who could've afforded school, but thanks to those annoying bastards can't really finish their degree, are left with huge loans and don't have a degree allowing them to pay their debts. The RIAA is really pissing me off, they're not helping educate people, they're helping them drop out of school and get even further into debt!"
Personal responsibility and ownership of one's actions goes a long way here. Having that fast Internet connection sure makes it tempting to build your music library with P2P, but it's essential to understand the potential consequences and to also understand that you don't need to have that music -- and if you just can't do without music, there are plenty of free and legal sources. Trust me: I got through all seven years of college without once firing up a P2P app. Those kids could have, too.
It's like anything else: if you participate in any illegal activity, there's a chance that you will get caught. I hope that most people understand this before they get to college. In this case, if your financial situation is such that paying a ~ $3.5K settlement would force you to drop out of school, then think very, very carefully before deciding to get heavy into P2P. We can't directly control the RIAA's actions, but we sure can control our own.
Re:A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Student: guilty until proven innocent (hardly has a way out except pay)
**AA: legal until someone puts up enough cash for an investigation and is not shot down by "funded" politicians.
Re:A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:5, Funny)
I suspect quite a few Slashdot readers made it all the way through school without using a P2P application.
John Sauter, class of 1967
ReRetaliation under the wire. (Score:3, Insightful)
I can certianly
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But most of them _do_ do it (Score:2)
If I sat down with 100 college students that had a P2P program running on their machine and files in their upload directory, I'm guessing that 100 of them would have swapped files with other users on the network. If I trie
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Re:A Rose by Any Other Name... (Score:5, Interesting)
How is it different than 10 years ago? (Score:2)
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Threatening you with a civil suit for the commission of a tort is not a crime when all you demand is a cease and desist. Demanding monetary compensation I would think would be a different matter. If not extortion, how about blackmail? "We know you've committed a crime. Pay us to keep quiet about it or we'll see to it that it goes on your criminal record
Re:Wrong, clearly you don't know the law (Score:5, Informative)
So the wronged party (RIAA in this case) is approaching the wrongdoer and saying "look, we can sue you for $X in damages, but we'd like to spare you and us the trouble of a court proceeding to collect said damages. Sign here, pay us $N in reduced damages to cover what we feel are reasonable damages in this instance, and in this contract you are signing you will see that we voluntarily give up the right to sue you for this particular infringement in the future."
Just as if your kid broke one of my windows accidentally with an errant baseball. I could sue you, but I'd probably propose that we settle out of court for reasonable damages. Hardly a crime for me to propose that. And if you choose not to pay, I can of course take you to court.
No "crime" is being swept under the rug. Just because you wish it was extortion or blackmail does not make it so. You ANAL and all of the moderators here clearly ANAL
felony charge - for a screener posted to the web (Score:5, Informative)
LOS ANGELES Feb 22, 2007 (AP)-- A man who allegedly uploaded a copy of the film "Flushed Away" onto the Internet after getting a copy from an Oscar voter faces a felony charge.
Salvador Nunez Jr., 27, was charged with copyright infringement and faces up to three years in prison if convicted. He was scheduled to appear in court March 1.
Prosecutors said he obtained a copy of the movie after it was sent in advance to his sister, an Oscar voter and member of The International Animated Film Society.
The Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences received a tip in early January that someone put "Flushed Away" on the Internet, and a digital watermark identified it as an Academy screener film.
When interviewed by FBI agents, Nunez acknowledged he uploaded "Flushed Away" and the Oscar-nominated film "Happy Feet" onto the Internet, court documents said. However, investigators only found a copy of "Flushed Away" in his computer hard drive.
It wasn't immediately known whether Nunez has retained an attorney.
Man Charged With Uploading Movie to Web [go.com]
There are many points of interest here, but most significantly the feds decision to prosecute the uploader on the felony charge. That would be a first and a major change in policy.
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"Threatening you with a civil suit for the commission of a tort is not a crime when all you demand is a cease and desist. Demanding monetary compensation I would think would be a different matter. If not extortion, how about blackmail?"
Listen to the AC; he's right on this one. Settling out of court happens all the time. Even "good" companies and people do it.
The trouble with calling this "blackmail" or "extortion" is there may be a day down the road when you think you've been wronged, or you know you'
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In the case of extortion and blackmail, the matter is not settled. The extortionist can come back at any time and hit you up for cash again.
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Look up the term. They are demanding money "or else we will sue," without bothering to even interview the person that they BELIEVE to be the culprit. That's barratry as I understand the term.
In today's world of homes where several family members, dorm mates, roommates, cohabiting parters or whatever other domestic situation is present in a residence, happen to SHARE a computer, there i
Piracy is hurting? (Score:2, Redundant)
Is this true? Does anyone have sales or statistics?
Re:Piracy is hurting? (Score:5, Insightful)
Who cares if it's true? They say it is, and there's not exactly a pirate's lobby to refute them. Truth is completely and utterly irrelevant. It's not a question of what's right or wrong, it's a question of what you say and how loud you say it. And the media cartels own the conventional news sources.
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Not Piracy, DRM hurting, Suing customers hurting. (Score:2, Insightful)
DRM was an attempt to put the Internet back in the bottle.
People expect to be able to download stuff at a reasonable cost, (and some amount of information people expect for free).
People expect to to their play and copy purchased media without barriers.
College students will "copy tapes", as they have no spare book or beer money to spare. if you use legal threats or take money from them, this will not incre
Pre-letter responses. (Score:5, Funny)
Slashdotters are once again revising their RIAA strategies, and will now be sending RIAA extortionists and barrators "pre-letter responses." Barrators and extortionists will now be encouraged to go fuck themselves sideways with a bowling pin. How goatse.
Yay! (Score:5, Funny)
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College student feeling the wrath (Score:3, Interesting)
I don't remember if they said what would happen if I didn't delete the file (which I did, I'm not going to stick my neck out for the principle of it) but I'm sure it would have been ugly. I wouldn't be surprised if the RIAA is doing this too - intercepting communications out of your friendly campus and then telling the campus to enforce their restrictions. Way to scare your customers. How do they stay in business?
Any other people get busted/almost-busted/pseudo-busted at their university?
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Generally, when you have something offered up for sale, and someone finds a way to rip it off instead of paying for it, you don't think of that person as a "customer."
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And a jolly good thing you did, too. Campus network admins can tap into your computer's mainframe using soviet hacker programs, hack your files right out from under your C drive, and even report their findings to Universal Studios.
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I have a friend that got an email from our University saying that some movie industry threatened them because he downloaded Babel. He also said that it included instructions. He didn't tell me what these instructions were, but I seriously d
Only $$$ speaks to them (Score:2)
You are only a customer if you buy something. Have you sent the RIAA a letter telling them that because of this tactic, you will be boycotting? How much did you spend on CDs last year? Here at
We're all "customers" (Score:2)
More from the chorus. Thing is, we ARE customers. Someone may not have paid for every movie on their computer, but most of us DO rent DVDs (often to rip them to our drives), most of us go to movies and a great many even go to concerts.
The problem isn't that the copyright holders are suing their customers - the problem is there's so little opportunity for the competing voice to reach the folks affected by this - to remind them that, while Universal and Sony may s
I for one, (Score:4, Insightful)
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What a load of bullshit. If you took something without paying for it, you are NOT a customer. Just because you rent a DVD or go to movies once in a while doesn't magically make you an impervious customer who is entitled to download anything they want and make sure a bunch of
Re:We're all "customers" (Score:5, Insightful)
Who the hell wouldn't want that? I would like very much to have a complete copy of the sum of human knowledge -- every book, every song, every film, every picture -- at my disposal. And I think that most people would probably like the same. Even if we only used a small fraction of it, it would be a great thing to have. And to get it for free (or nearly so) would be even better, since it's the cost of the thing that is generally the big obstacle to having it.
Are you saying that you don't want a copy of everything there is, for free?
Remember: copyright is like a necessary evil; it does a bad thing (temporarily and partially restricting the free flow of knowledge and culture) for a good reason (to encourage the creation of more knowledge and culture which can be partially shared immediately, and fully shared after a while). If implemented properly, the good outweighs the bad. But copyright is never a tolerable or desirable thing for its own sake, and it is always wrong to support copyright in cases where it would not produce more good results than bad results.
Piracy is basically a good thing (it is the free flow of knowledge and culture) but which can have bad, or more accurately, self-defeating, results (in that it reduces the encouraging effect of copyright). Still, if the good of piracy happened to outweigh the bad -- i.e. if the good of freely flowing information was better than the reduction of encouragement to create -- then piracy would be preferable to copyright.
We don't have to have absolute copyright or absolute piracy. We can vary them. We could arbitrarily say that copyright applied on weekdays, and not on weekends, if we wanted to. If this produced a better outcome than seven days a week of either copyright or piracy, then it would be what we should do (barring something better yet).
So maybe it would be a good idea to allow ordinary individuals, acting non-commercially, to pirate music without consequences, accepting that there would be a bad effect in that less music might get made, and accepting that there might be a good effect in that people would be more free vis-a-vis music, while we still kept copyright for commercial purposes as well as for corporate entities.
Don't dismiss the idea out of hand, and even if you ultimately don't think that it would produce a better outcome than the current system, if you think that there could possibly be any improvement to the current system -- particularly one that people could live with and which they'd be inclined to do anyway, even if there weren't a law about it -- then surely it would be worthwhile to consider it.
To quote George Carlin's description of the current generation: "Gimme that, it's mine! Gimme that, it's mine!"
Meh. I agree, that people are greedy. People who listen to music are greedy, and want free music. People who make music are greedy, and want to be paid for their music. Neither side is good or bad. Copyright, as a utilitarian system, handles this adeptly. The genius of copyright is that you can appeal to the long-term greed of music listeners by getting them to suffer some short-term deprivations, and you can use those deprivations to appeal to the short-term greed of the music creators, who suffer long-term deprivations. Everyone ends up a winner, so long as you do it right. But for decades now, we haven't done it right, and it's getting worse. The reason that piracy wasn't such a big thing in the past is not because people acted differently. People have always acted the same. It's because more things were legal, so the same sort of conduct in the past was unremarkable, while now it is notable. Conduct hasn't changed, but the laws around it have, and not for the better.
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We would track down students after receiving a complaint let
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Was there no clause in the student handbook or AUP that covered downloading?
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You're not a customer.
By selling products created by artists who sign contracts with them, not giving shit away for free and having freeloaders defend it by scapegoating them as bad guys.
Results in court (Score:2)
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I guess justice assume your innocent unless it's about pirating music.
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They get a settlement without going to court.
The defendant doesn't show up and they get a default judgement.
Their case falls apart and they dismiss with prejudice.
Are they winning cases? Not very often (that I'm aware of).
Are they getting money out of people? Yes.
If I'm wrong, please feel free to cite cases, but I've been under the impression that very few cases have been completed in court.
NEW George Foreman RIAA family lawsuits (Score:5, Funny)
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A letter to the RIAA (Score:5, Informative)
I feel that I must point out that the quality of the music distributed by your members has sunk to such depths that if I have to listen to any more of it, I might just gnaw my own leg off in desperation. Of course such a situation would be grounds for an inmediate lawsuit by myself against your members for the sum of $3,000,000 US. I ask that you kindly desist from producing such self-mutilation inspiring music and, failing that, I am willing to settle for ten percent ($300,000 US) in advance in order not to pursue the lawsuit in the event of my loss of a leg. Thank you.
Sincerely...
Sneakernets: The Original P2P System (Score:5, Interesting)
My laptop sometimes has problems starting up (Score:2, Funny)
meeting face to face with people. And you know you get to meet people and you help them out
and then they help you out.. Like with my notebook lately, it has sometimes problems starting
up with new tunes and a friend of mine will hook it up to his notebook with what I believe is a
starter cable and jumpstart the music machine or the movie engine. Then sometimes its his
laptop that has novelty stalls from time to time and
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The problem is that you still have to get the original file into the 'protected net'. thats where they can nab you.
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We Will Sue You (Score:5, Funny)
Playing music in school, gonna be a big man some day
You got music on myspace
You big disgrace
Kickin your ipod all over the place
We will, we will, sue you
We will, we will, sue you
Buddy you're a young man, pirate man
Shoutin' in the school gonna take on the MAFIAA some day
You got music on myspace
You big disgrace
Wavin' your napster all over the place
We will, we will, sue you
We will, we will, sue you
Buddy you're an old man, poor man
Pleadin' with our lawyers gonna make you pay today
You lost your court case
You big disgrace
The MAFIAA kicked you off of myspace
We will, we will, sue you
We will, we will, sue you
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Did you make this up? Because it's very, very good!
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Where is the story here? (Score:2, Interesting)
So admit you are breaking the law and do it like a criminal, out of the open and looking over your shoulder. Swap with people you KNOW. If you are doing it online do it in clos
Re:Where is the story here? (Score:5, Funny)
Operators are standing by! (Score:2, Redundant)
This offer won't last long, so call now!
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(sorry. couldn't resist.)
Are they still bothering to obtain evidence? (Score:4, Interesting)
Leveraging the university? (Score:3, Interesting)
From TFA, it seems to me that one of the new aspects of this strategy is: So the student gets a letter delivered through the university. It's not clear if some kind of university action is implied or explicity stated in this letter, or if the universities have agreed to cooperate with the RIAA. Either way I bet getting the university to communicate with the student is a way of providing additional leverage. Perhaps now you are not only threatened with financial damage but with your educational status being revoked?
Wow... (Score:2)
It becomes more and more apparent that this is now part of their business strategy, and not primarly to defeat piracy this way. Tomorrow... Local shops with RIAA reps where you can settle lawsuits without going to court for convenience? Advertisements on how to best lower your lawsuit expenses? Lawsuit insurances?
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Another great idea:
RIAA pre-lawsuit gift cards. Load them up with $10, $40, or $250,000,000 - great gift for college students and little old ladies!
When will we just say enough is enough? (Score:3, Insightful)
it could be stopped tomrrow.
Re:When will we just say enough is enough? (Score:5, Insightful)
as long as it takes the geek to admit that he isn't entitled to everything that isn't nailed down.
the divide between town and gown is an old one, of course.
off-campus, no one cries in their beer when a free-loading student with time on his hands, a pricey computer and unlimited bandwidth has to cough up some cash or forfeit some privileges.
Lawsuit Money (Score:3, Funny)
Piracy for the Poor (Score:2, Interesting)
Profit!! (Score:5, Funny)
1. Get postal addresses of students accross the U.S. via their University
2. Send them pre-lawsuit letters
3. Wait for a fraction of the students to take up the discount offer
4. PROFIT!!
Note the absence of both an ??? and an "prove that the individual is infringing copyright" steps.
Turn the tables? (Score:2)
Next Step (Score:3, Funny)
(Oops, I just infringed on the work of Philip K. Dick).
Missing the point about the MPAA (Score:2, Interesting)
Since all the downloading results from an inability to come to an agreement of what price people will pay to watch MPAA product, then if people can't watch MPAA product then they will watch something else.
MPAA product is in its most basic form a sequence of video images edited together in standard film 'grammar' devised over the past 100 years that tells a stand
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Copyright holder organizations have shown a consistent behavior in the face of technological change: seek special protection through lawsuits and legislation. They will do the same with the scenario you envision. When hardware & software improve to allow tools to play and produce real-time film-quality images, they will also allow the tools needed to identify and report "infringing" material in real-time. (Just as they
Reverse Tactics (Score:3, Interesting)
Start out with this content is copyrighted by "Your Name"
Then you can just spend some time saying la, la, la, la, la, la, la or whatever
trips your trigger. Now put it on a p2p network share folder changing the name to metallica.mp3 or whatever trips your goat. Place a sniffer on the connection, when the goons grab your file
trying to figure out if you are hosting copyrighted tunes you slap them with a big ole fat lawsuit
for copyright infringement.
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The problem with the media industry's heavy handed approach to copyright, puts
a damping effect on anyone who actually wants his copyrighted work to be freely
distributed. Part of the reason for this is that the idea has been firmly ingrained
in the minds of millions that "copyright" means "illegal to copy or distribute", which
is not always the case. Copyright and controls on distribution are related but not the same.
Also, people te
100% lying (Score:5, Informative)
1PAA (Score:5, Funny)
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Spyware? (Score:3, Informative)
And this is to enforce the law? Aren't there laws against doing such things?
Furthermore, what shitty evidence is an IP address. IP addresses do not equal individuals, for several reasons.
Boycott RIAA (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Pre-lawsuit letters are cool (Score:5, Funny)
Tag this article: thievingcunts
Re:Pre-lawsuit letters are cool (Score:5, Insightful)
1. College students as a whole can barely afford books, rent, or food, let alone music.
2. College graduates can afford lots, including lots of music CDs.
3. as a consequence of 1. and 2. it can be said that college students are a tiny market which will become the largest market for premium content, due to their massive disposable income.
4. It seems that because of 3. it is unwise to piss off said demographic.
5. I'm a professional, but I haven't bought a CD (or pirated music -- they don't even deserve mind-share!) in 7 years, because behaviour like this seems unethical to me, and pisses me off.
6. ???
7. Profit!
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I thought the SeaOrg [wikipedia.org] uniforms were blue.
What is wrong with this? (Score:4, Insightful)
Okay, maybe I'll get modded down for this (or get modded up for writing that old cliche), but what exactly is wrong with this? The RIAA is locating pirates via IP and, instead of suing them, offering them a quick and easy settlement.
Back in 2000 during the Napster lawsuits, every Slashdotter including the editors said the RIAA should go after individual infringers rather than P2P networks. Well, now they're doing that, and you don't like that either. What's changed? Are you just opposed to the RIAA protecting its own intellectual property period?
Re:What is wrong with this? (Score:4, Insightful)
now that *is* extortion. if you get a letter from me saying give me money or I'll sue you for violating my copyright when you are certain that you have not? what would you do? could you prove in a court that you did not? it's a civil case, the level of proof is much more lax than in a criminal case. if i can convince a jury that it is more likely that you did than that you did not...then i win and the court orders you to pay me.
of course give me some cash now and we don't have to go through that dance. lets just make life easier for the both of us and no one gets hurt. except you.
Re:What is wrong with this? (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, I hope you don't get modded down because you express a popular view, though not necessarily one held by many slashdot readers.
Perhaps many of us here are just plain irritated by stupidity, some of us are even inconvenienced by it.
Let's be real, the Internet is the best content distribution system ever. The Internet is a giant file-sharing network by definition.
For hundreds of years great works of art were produced with no copyright laws. We live is a very small part of history. Obviously artists need to get paid for what they do. But the costs of making quality recordings are greatly reduced compared to what they once were. Most bands I know today have their own web sites and distribute their music freely with the aim of making enough money to continue doing what they love by attracting enough people to see them perform live. For most artists today, the era of the highly paid entertainer is dead. It takes a new generation to realize this.
The problem with the RIAA is that they're out of touch, out of time, and out of their heads. Deep down they must know they cannot possibly win in the end. But they're like the old horse and buggy manufactures who cannot bring themselves to face the reality of a new world.
All the lawsuits and threats of lawsuits in the whole world will never stop people from sharing music. This is not an opinion or an emotional argument, it's a fact based on reality.
Re:What is wrong with this? (Score:4, Insightful)
One does not have a right to make a profit from what one does, even if it produces useful outcomes. If I go around mending everyone on my streets fences I am not entitled to compensation for doing so.
If you cant think of a way to make a profit out of music, then live with the markets decision. Copyright is artists welfare, which we allow the recording industry to abuse.
Re:What is wrong with this? (Score:5, Interesting)
Flip on your local radio station. Anything that gets played gets pre-approved by the RIAA. If you're an indie artist, you can kiss air time goodbye. You don't get any.
Most people still get exposed to new music and artists on the radio. That means you get zero publicity for your work while the lastest Brittany Spears song will be played until you're ready to gouge out your own ear drums with a cocktail fork.
Then, if by some miracle you do get signed, the record label-RIAA cartel fronts the money for the production of an album, foists off a producer on to the artist that will get the "right sound" based on what the record label executives think you & I like, and then bill the artists out the ass for "production costs" which have been know to include things like hookers for the label executives. Honestly, you'd be better off charging the production on your MasterCard since, with the fees and such the equivalent interest rate is about 41% APR, whereas your credit card has a maximum of 25% in most states. Keep in mind that it takes a minimum of 2 years to bring an album from concept to distribution. $100,000 at 41% = 141,000 (year1) 141,000 at 41% = 158,000 (year 2) 165,000 by year 3. That's just for a low budget CD. Now that money plus a bunch of fees comes out of anything that the artist might get.
Recording contracts have this clause in them called recoupment. What that means is that the artist doesn't get a dime until the record company gets all and I do mean all of it's investment back. Record contracts are usually 20-40 pages of legalese describing what the artist owes the record company and how the proceeds from any sale of anything from T-shirts to CD's are to be distributed. Typically, artists get less than $1.00 of the $16.95 you pay for a full price CD. If you buy the CD from a discount store (read Wal-Mart) or a club (e.g. BMG Music Club), it may only be a few pennies per CD.
Next, since you have an album you have to go on tour to promote it. Guess what, the label fronts the money again and takes it out of your hide later, along with interest. It works roughly the same way as your recording session. And yes, Virginia, recoupement comes into play again. If the tour doesn't make money, you don't get paid.
Now add that to the fact that they routinely cheat the artists out of the comparative pittance that they're due. Then consider that this entire industry would be completely and utterly non-existent without the artists, do you really think that they deal fairly with anyone? Sympathy for the RIAA? Hah, more like sympathy for the devil.
2 cents,
QueenB.
Cynical (Score:4, Insightful)
If you get sued by the RIAA and you go to court, there is a chance that you'll win. This will cost you a lot (a LOT) of money and time, sometimes even years of your life. Sometimes you'll get cost awarded to you as in a recent case, but the RIAA will appeal, taking more time and more money. If you win without being awarded legal costs, you will most likely have spent more money than the RIAA was going to settle for.
Then there's the chance that you'll lose, and you'll have to pay everything the RIAA asked for, plus your legal cost and if you're very unlucky theirs as well (I think, IANAL).
So, basically, going to court will cost you, even if you win.
The RIAA knows this. That's why it's a little cynical that they're offering a "discount" now, don't you think?