FCC Indecency Ruling Struck Down 548
arbitraryaardvark writes "Reuters reports that the 2nd circuit has struck down the FCC's recent ruling on indecency, in a case brought by Fox. The court said the U.S. Federal Communications Commission was 'arbitrary and capricious' in setting a new standard for defining indecency. 'Republican FCC Chairman Kevin Martin angrily retorted that he found it "hard to believe that the New York court would tell American families that 'sh*t' and 'f@ck' are fine to say on broadcast television during the hours when children are most likely to be in the audience ... If we can't restrict the use (of the two obscenities) during prime time, Hollywood will be able to say anything they want, whenever they want," Martin said in a statement.' No word yet on whether the agency will appeal.
But Wait... (Score:3, Insightful)
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Wait.... I think I just goofed that up. I was never good at conspiracy theories.
Re:But Wait... (Score:5, Insightful)
Gay tolerance, making fun of Christianity, making fun of immigration laws - yup, that has "GOP" written all over it.
Re:But Wait... (Score:4, Interesting)
That's not necessarily so; though they often have such a moral, the character giving voice is usually compromised at the end of the episode and made to appear unreliable.
The real problem with this quasi-subversive dreck is that it tears everything you consider sane apart by the end of the episode, subverting not just government and morality, but the idea of that people can be governed, can be loved, and can embody right action. The real losers at the end of a Family Guy or Simpsons episode are the characters that try to adjust this status quo. The message to the viewer is: The world is unjust and insane, and the worst thing you could possibly do is try to fix it.
Fox a Republican lapdog... (Score:5, Insightful)
Republicans are supposed to be political conservatives. Political conservatives are supposed to be against government interference in private lives. Terri Schaivo, abortion rights, gay marriage, etc. show that they care more about their 'base', the social conservatives, than they care about political philosophy.
And the fact that Fox has been leading the charge when it comes to smutty, sensationalist television, which you think would offend the religious right, and they they get a free ride from the Republican Party because they're such whores about supporting the NeoCons is just another example of the hypocritical politics we have these days. Another reason why religion and politics are a bad, but historical, combination.
I'd love to support the Republicans (fiscal conservatives, political conservatives), but I don't dare support the whores and hypocrites in power right now.
Re:Fox a Republican lapdog... (Score:4, Insightful)
The Republican party isn't conservative. (Score:5, Interesting)
They are no longer, and haven't been for some time, "conservative." In fact they seem to want to change quite a lot. They're probably best described as 'authoritarian,' particularly on the social side. And IMO, "social conservatives" aren't conservatives at all; the title is a complete misnomer. They're not trying to prevent some sort of drastic change to the social fabric, they're trying to induce a drastic change. They are, by many objective definitions, actually quite radical. (Of course, they tend not to think so -- they prefer to think of themselves as trying to take the country back to some 1950s idyll that never existed outside their own imaginations.)
The actual conservative wing of the Republican party died with Barry Goldwater; what remains has nothing to do with conservatism and everything to do with pushing a transformative agenda. It's just a different transformative agenda than what the more far-left elements of the Democratic party want.
The FCC missed the point -- as usual (Score:5, Insightful)
Kevin buddy, write down what indecency is, and everyone will comply. It's a neat idea...give it a try.
Xesdeeni
Re:The FCC missed the point -- as usual (Score:4, Informative)
* Shit, Piss, Fuck, Cunt, Cocksucker, Motherfucker, and Tits.
Re:The FCC missed the point -- as usual (Score:5, Insightful)
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This is why I hate the media-they deliberately blur every line they can find to make it harder to figure out who owns what.
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So now we're afraid of swearing on the internet? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:So now we're afraid of swearing on the internet (Score:5, Funny)
Re:So now we're afraid of swearing on the internet (Score:3, Funny)
I believe it's pronounced as FSHIFT2CK!
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How exactly did the guy pronounce "f@ck"?
I believe it's pronounced as FSHIFT2CK!
I have one of those horrible JIS keyboards where @ gets its own key (to the right of the P) but you have to use shift to get the quote marks (' and ").
On these things, I can only surmise that it's pronounced as spelled: "FATCK".
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Re:So now we're afraid of swearing on the internet (Score:2)
Re:So now we're afraid of swearing on the internet (Score:3, Interesting)
But I'd say "cat-you-cockatrice-kobold".
Then again, you can't say "cock", so that should be "cat-you-c@ckatrice-kobold"
And then we get "cat-you-cockactrice-you-cockatrice-kobold-ant-fa
Not censorship isn't about free speech -- it's about avoiding recursive pronounciation problems with censored nouns in the nethack/adom languages, as any geek should know.
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Freedom of Speech? (Score:5, Insightful)
If I'm not mistaken, thats the whole idea of freedom of speech right?
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Not only that but *if* people actually deemed saying fuck during prime time to be a bad thing, those people can always just change the channel, or not buy the products advertised on those shows.
I know I'm just hacking on Carlin and a thousand other comedians and broadcasters here, but I have never understood the idea that saying certain words is intrinsically harmful.
Also, the rules, such as they are(were?), are ridiculous.
You can say crap or ass with impunity but shit is "an ess bomb" that you can (c
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Nope, you're not mistaken. The whole idea of the 1st Amendment is to protect speech that is offensive, for whatever reason, because no one's interested in restricting speech that's inoffensive.
What a Revolutionary idea.
The goal of course is not just to have freedom of speech but freedom after speech. You know, because you can say whatever you want in China, but you mi
Re:Freedom of Speech? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Freedom of Speech? (Score:5, Insightful)
I still don't see what George Bush has to do with this discussion. You have never been able to say "Shit" or "Fuck" on the public airwaves during prime time. George Bush may not be a great president, but every discussion on Slashdot should not be viewed as an opportunity to flame him.
Re:Freedom of Speech? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Freedom of Speech? (Score:5, Insightful)
The sweeping executive powers of FDR dwarf anything fathomed by the current administration, and don't forget the massively high (at times around 1/3) portion of the GDP that was accounted for by government spending at points in the past. Not to mention the times when the top bracket income taxes were above 70%. Are you blaming Bush for the higher government revenue realized despite lower taxes?
If you want to bash Bush, fine. But don't do it for things that the progressive heroes of the past were far more guilty of.
Why don't you and the other slashbots stop being such drama queens?
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$ grep -i privacy us_constitution |wc -w
0
That's quite right. The power to invade my privacy without a warrant is not explicitly granted to the federal government by the constitution. Therefore, the federal government does not have that power.
The bill of rights is not a complete list of rights. The 9th and 10th amendment clearly state that other rights exist, beyond those that are enumerated. However, the constitution is the complete enumeration of the powers of the federal government. Any power
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Re:Freedom of Speech? (Score:5, Insightful)
The short version (Score:5, Interesting)
Actually, one of the most amusing parts of the ruling was the court citing the fact that the words can't be that bad if George W Bush and Dick Cheney use them (to Tony Blair and Patrick Leahy respectively).
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This is a good thing anyways. It's been documented that the FCC is pandering to a very vocal minority of ultra-conservative special interest groups in recent years.
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Re:The short version (Score:5, Funny)
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F@ck (Score:2)
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Every freakin' fr@k knows what friggin' fr@k means... dadgummit!!
Fleeting use... (Score:5, Informative)
What he's leaving out is that the case was over the "fleeting" use of such words, such as during live events when something accidentally slips through. If a pre-recorded show has the words in there and it is deliberately broadcasted, the indecency rules still apply.
The problem is that currently, the FCC sometimes enforces the standard of "fleeting use," and sometimes it doesn't. The courts are just saying that it needs to be standardized and rationally applied.
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And here I thought fleeting use had to do with the Navy...
It doesn't just have to be a word either. Remember the flap over Janet Jackson's "fleeting glimpse"?
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Censorship is good? (Score:2)
Wouldn't that be a good thing?
Why would censorship be considered de-facto beneficial?
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Re:Censorship is good? (Score:4, Insightful)
So, public communication should be limited by government fiat to that which is acceptable for a two year old?
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Are you arguing that censorship to protect the children IS a good thing?
While I tend to believe that the first amendment is more to protect our right to express any IDEA we want rather than say any specific word we want at any time, I still think that the FCC limiting this shit is stupid.
Here's a better idea.
Parent: "Little Bobby, that show/movie/whatever is inappropriate, let's watch this instead." Then change the channel.
or
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"Hey, bobby you fat fuck go and get me another beer and then piss off out somewhere 'cos I can see your mums gagging for it right now."
"Right then you filthy whore lets see what you're packing under that dress. Eh, I've told you once bobby - Fuck Off, don't make me come and smack you one you lazy little bastard."
Re:Censorship is good? (Score:5, Insightful)
If your kid isn't old enough to ignore stupid stuff they see on TV, they should not be watching it without your active supervision PERIOD. You people are fixating on lame stuff like adults swearing and ignoring the more insidious things that MORONS like Valenti wouldn't even catch. The gross stuff is actually easy to deal with. It's the subtle stuff and trivialized misbehaivor of minors (often considered cute rather than dangerosu) that you have to watch out for.
Fuck is not a problem. Disney Children's movies with the main character casually committing felonies with no apparent consequences are a problem.
This isn't about children. This is about uptight old crones that will have a conniption fit if you violate their sheltered puritanical outlook on life.
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Re:Censorship is good? (Score:5, Funny)
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BUWAHAHAHAHA!!!
Yes, I'd forgotten that naughty words cause little heads to asplode. Silly me.
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Poor Guy. (Score:2)
(If you know who he is you are *OLD*)
Parents: (Score:5, Insightful)
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Except the parents are not in the room to see the warning, as they are not policing what their kids watch on TV. My 8-year-old was bugged the other day because I wouldn't let him watch Stephen King's "The Stand" or Cops. We use the parental controls on our cable box to keep them locked out of things they don't need to watch, and to keep the cable off when they get home from school so they'll be able to do their homework. Now if I could just hook up the X-box the same way...
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Re:Parents: (Score:5, Insightful)
It's called life. The only reason "Fuck" is cool to say is because it gets such a huge reaction. If it was treated like any other word, say hemmoroid perhaps, then it wouldn't be used nearly as often.
Watch TV with your kid, or ensure it's turned off. It's called parenting, and it's been fairly effective for about 3,000,000 years. It's only been ineffective for the last 20 or so.
Sticks and Stones (Score:5, Insightful)
They are only words. Banning words is what gives the words power. My wife and I allow have told our kids that they are allowed to "cuss" around their friends and we don't have a problem with it. We'd like them to not cuss around us, but it is not "banned." We have asked that they not cuss around other adults, but it is not "banned." It is their own choice.
Our kids understand that the use of those words simply is a sign to people of how dumb and inarticulate you are. I don't have a problem with using those words, but I choose not to (except when one-on-one with my wife... go figure). I am 100% sure that my kids have never heard me use profanity, but I am 100% sure that they hear it every day in other places. I have no problem with others using profanity at all. Sometimes it is funny, mostly it says an awful lot about the person using it. It is just words.
Anyway, we have never heard any cussing from our kids and have never heard any comments from other parents/teachers.
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Re:Sticks and Stones (Score:5, Insightful)
Do you also teach them not to judge a book by its cover, and how generalizations and prejudice are wrong?
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Re:Sticks and Stones (Score:5, Insightful)
The parent is simply saying "When you choose an ambiguous swearing word like "f*ck", you are either outright dumb or too lazy to think of something more appropriate. Neither reflects well on you".
OMFG
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What could be more appropriate than "FUCK!" when you hit your finger with a hammer, lock your car keys inside the car with the motor running or drop your laptop while walking up a flight of stairs?
I understand your point, but there are situations where expletives are definitely "appropriate".
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Don't be an idiot. What people *say* isn't an appearance (except for politicians :^)) and it seems perfectly reasonable to draw conclusions about someone's intelligence based on their speech.
Actually, this is an example of the fundamental attribution error [wikipedia.org]. Intelligence is not the same as one's manner of speech, or even necessarily of how articulate one is. Ideally, one should try to judge intelligence based on the content of ideas imparted by speech, not by the structure of the speech itself. In fact, judging a person on their speech is very much akin to judging them on their voluntary appearance, for example how they dress. Obviously manners of attire send social cues which reasonable people
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Just wait until start gaming and hear that grating annoying godawful pseudo-female voice say, "Additional Supply Depots required."
I always thought that if Microsoft played that audio clip when you got a BSOD there would be a lot of PC's flying out of Windows.
disgraceful (Score:5, Insightful)
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God forbid... (Score:4, Insightful)
Now, showing live video from the Virginia Tech massacre (you know, the camera phone that recorded the shootings from outside) or showing massive explosions and horrific, gory deaths, that's fine. Totally fine. We want to breed killers so we can send them to fight our wars... er... defend Freedom(TM)
Two small victories in one day. (Score:5, Insightful)
Hmmm... (Score:2)
Isn't that why we've got that first amendment there?
Bowdlerization (Score:2, Interesting)
No, he mentioned the words shit and fuck (see the article). It's ironic that someone felt the need to alter the (highly relevant) quotation in this supposedly uncensored medium.
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the moneyquote not from that article (Score:2, Funny)
Adopting an argument made by lawyers for NBC, the court cited examples in which Mr. Bush and Mr. Cheney had used the same language that would be penalized under the policy. Mr. Bush was caught on videotape last July using a common vulgarity in a conversation with Prime Minister Tony Blair of Britain.
If President Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney can blurt out vulgar language, then the government cannot punish television stations for broadcasting the same words in similarly fleeting contexts.
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/n ation/stories/060507dnnatdecency.388fcfc.html [dallasnews.com]
What's latin for "pwned?"
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Arbitrary & Capricious (Score:2)
---
Kramer: Well, I have to say this seems capricious and arbitrary.
Dean Jones: You fly is open.
---
Freedom of Speech (Score:2)
Isn't this one of the greatest freedoms we Americans have? Freedom of Speech? I can understand the concept of "indecent" and around kids agree, but not at the expense of censorship. It's up to parents to take care of their kids. If a show is kinda raunchy then don't allow your kids to watch it, if it's not in your personal beliefs. But don't limit people who want to express or see this form of expression.
I think we spend too much time
Here's the line that "gets me." (Score:2)
Hollywood will be able to say anything they want, whenever they want," Martin said in a statement.'
OMFG! We should be able to say anything we want, whenever we want!!! I'm against the over-use of offensive slang, but I'm not against the use of it. People really SHOULD be proud of their vocabulary strength. But more, still, people should be allowed to discriminate against others on an individual basis for the language they use giving more social level influence over what's acceptable and what's not. Putting control in the hands of a regulatory body and/or law makers is just ridiculous in my opinion.
good... (Score:2)
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If there was no regulation, it'd be crazy to think that primetime would basically be "The Fuck Hour" where a different celebrity goes on the tube to say the f-word for 44 minutes not including commericial breaks that include urges for you to "stop drinking that shit and drink XYZ Cola." Maybe on a few channels, sure, but when government makes it a standard
Tech has made FCC irrelevant (Score:2)
Why are words bad? (Score:5, Insightful)
What is the actual purpose of "bad" words? Why not just consider that bad words don't exist and everyone can say any word they want and we just not "have a cow" over it?
Seems to me we're taught to take exception to the words. It's a learned behavior. How about just not learning it in the 1st place?
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And the problem is... (Score:5, Insightful)
And the problem with this lies where? We do too much to shelter our children, it's a disservice to them from us who are supposed to be raising adults. Let them hear the words, learn their intent and meaning, with a parent to teach them when it is and isn't appropriate to use them.
*WE* are the parents, not the FCC. How dare they be so arrogant as to take the roll of parenting my children for me.
( 7, 5 and 3 year old girls )
A Worthless Shill for the Fascists did speak: (Score:4, Informative)
And since this is a "free country" you will have every right and opportunity to NOT WATCH the television. You and your children can do something like READ A BOOK, or GO FOR A WALK, or LEARN TO PLAY AN INSTRUMENT, or any number of perfectly useful activities that do not include glotzing some retarded screen full of disinformation and jejune entertainment that reinforces a false consciousness that convinces people to act and live in a way that fosters the parasitic tapeworm economy.
Feh.
RS
Fucking ludicrous (Score:5, Funny)
http://www.mercurynews.com/politics/ci_6063897 [mercurynews.com]
So he thinks that every form of the versatile word "fuck" is inherently sexual. I keep wondering, is he fucking serious? That's a fucking ridiculous stance to take! If he is in charge of censoring our airwaves, things have gotten pretty fucked up.
I don't give a shit what they say. (Score:4, Insightful)
Shit is a particularly stupid example since we use it every day. It's like a rated "G" word which is peculiarly forbidden.
Obligatory FCC song (Score:3, Informative)
According to Eric Idle, it is dedicated to the FCC, and if they broadcast it, it will cost a quarter of a million dollars. Have a listen. :)
Typical. (Score:3, Insightful)
Good. Fuck you. They should be able to say anything they want, whenever they want. Read the First Amendment sometime.
There's a reason I despise the Republican party. If you guessed "stripping away our constitutional rights for the sake of catering to the moral majority/religious right" you win.
Comment removed (Score:3, Insightful)
No, you're wrong. (Score:2, Informative)
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Far left? You Americans have really fucked up politics.
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rj
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