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GNU is Not Unix Government Politics

Japan To Adopt Open Software Standards 75

em8chel writes "Japan has adopted a policy under which government ministries and agencies will solicit bids from software vendors whose products support internationally recognized open standards. Japan thus becomes the first country in Asia to embrace open software standards (PDF), the OpenDocument Format Alliance says in a press release. ODF managing director Marino Marcich is quoted: 'By giving preference to open software formats such as ODF, it is saying that information should be competitively priced, innovative, and easily available to the widest range of people, now and in the future. We hail Japan for its diligence and vision.' The new guidelines are available (in Japanese) from Japan's Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry."
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Japan To Adopt Open Software Standards

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  • by UncleWilly ( 1128141 ) * <[moc.liamg] [ta] [70ylliWelcnU]> on Sunday July 15, 2007 @07:57AM (#19866117)
    The ODF alliance press release aside, interoperability is the last mile in lots of "IT Plans Gone Bad", as plot-point-two. Japan seems to make a lot of smart decisions. Guess I'm just a little jealous.
  • by Anonymous Coward
    I mean, isn't Japan notoriously known for proprietary computer systems?

    -jl

  • For how long? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Given the behavior of Microsoft anywhere else that a move to ODF has been tried, I'm sure that somewhere near Redmond a 747 is being loaded with free software coupons, free educational locking computers, free bribes and ooxml documentation as we speak.
    • by 140Mandak262Jamuna ( 970587 ) on Sunday July 15, 2007 @08:25AM (#19866195) Journal
      Small correction. The ooxml documentation takes a 747 all by itself. The freebies are ina seperate 747.
  • by Anonymous Coward
    Stuff that appears in Japan shows up in the U.S. two years later. Yay!
    • yea but by the time something comes from japan to here the next thing they got makes us even more jealous here! Face it, Japan is in the future (by a whole day but its a long day too)
  • This is a fine example of how regulated capitalism can be better for the consumer than Open Market capitalism. I hope the EU is next. And I hope they hurry :-)
    • Re: (Score:1, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Hang on, I thought we *liked* "Open".

      Crap. I'm confused.
    • When it comes to software, don't even talk about "Open Market Capitalism". Once taxpayer dollars are being spent to buy monopoly products, you don't have a free market anymore.

  • How exactly is this story connected to the gnu project? I could only find their statement [gnu.org] against proprietary standards (such as M$ Word). They are not the inventors of odf, though they of course support odf. But what makes them so special that they deserve to be tagged in this story, instead of sun for example?
  • I reported on a survey showing that the penetration of Linux in the public sector was virtually nil [whatjapanthinks.com], and in addition two months ago office suites meant MS Office [whatjapanthinks.com] in both the private and public sectors.
    • Re: (Score:1, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Choice of software is largely irrelevant to this. This decision is on Open Standards for file formats, not Open Source. There are perfectly fine examples of closed source and proprietary software using Open Standard file formats.
       
      They'll probably keep using MS Office on MS Windows, they'll just save their documents as OpenDocument instead of a Microsoft format.
      • by Bert64 ( 520050 )
        Tho one of the other things mentioned in the document says:
        - Selection of solutions that provide greatest value for least cost

        If the formats are open, it's only a matter of time before microsoft is given the boot and replaced with something cheaper.
  • Japan thus becomes the first country in Asia to embrace open software standards (PDF),
    To me that reads, let's announce our (IMHO) intelligent move towards open formats by announcing it in a closed document format from a company famous for pushing proprietary formats.
    • by DrSkwid ( 118965 )
      troff doc.tr | ps2pdf works fine for me
      • by thethibs ( 882667 ) on Sunday July 15, 2007 @11:07AM (#19867327) Homepage

        There are 11 types of people in the world, those who know binaries and those who don't.

        Apparently, you're one of those who don't.

        • by DrSkwid ( 118965 )
          Are you sure ? I could have sworn I did my research before changing my signature. You'd best apologise now before it gets messy.
          • It's binary, not "binaries" and 11 in binary is 3 decimal. You only list 2 types of people. You're looking for 10, not 11.
            • by DrSkwid ( 118965 )
              Is it now? You seem sure for someone who is wrong.
            • by Hucko ( 998827 )
              Sir, I would suggest you research; humour: computers, binaries, and 'play on words'. Irony wouldn't go astray, but you imply you understand it in your subject.
      • You are conflating the original joke: (http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts/frustrations/5a a 9/)
        There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

        With the mathematician joke:
        There are three kinds of mathematicians: those who can count and those who can't.

        Also:
        There are two groups of people in the world;
        those who believe that the world can be
        divided into two groups of people,
        and those who don't.

        There are two groups of people in the world:
        Those who can be categorize
    • PDF is a published, documented format. It is copyrighted, but usable royalty-free in any software. From the specification book
      PDF Reference
      third edition
      Adobe Portable Document Format
      Version 1.4

      "Adobe gives anyone copyright permission, subject to the conditions stated below, to:

      • Prepare files whose content conforms to the Portable Document Format
      • Write drivers and applications that produce output represented in the Portable Document Format
      • Write software that accepts input in the form of the Porta
      • by bit01 ( 644603 )

        Software that accepts input in the form of the Portable Document Format must respect the access permissions specified in that document. Accessing the document in ways not permitted by the document's access permissions is a violation of the document author's copyright.

        Close, and not really closed, but not an entirely open format either.

        If they'd made that item a recommendation, rather than a legal requirement, then I for one would've regarded the PDF standard as truly open.

        ---

        DRM'ed content breaks

        • That restriction is not a restriction of the PDF format, but a specification of correct functioning of the PDF, i.e. access controls are a specification of the format. It is a statement that if someone (you) access someone else's (Bob's) document not permitted by the document's permissions, you are violating Bob's copyright.

          The statement says nothing about the document format requiring DRM. Anyone is free to create software that produces PDF documents with no DRM. In fact, it protects the specification

          • by bit01 ( 644603 )

            I see your point however that's not what the condition as posted says. Just because the PDF creator has slapped a "do not copy" bit on some PDF is irrelevant to whether part or all of the material the PDF represents is copyright the PDF creator or not. Only the law in the relevant jurisdiction can decide that, not some specification.

            That's why I was happy with a recommendation, not a contractual requirement. The recent slashdot story on false copyright claims [slashdot.org] is relevant. The blocking of excerpting for re

  • Everytime I see a /. article "X Chooses Open Source", "Country Y Goes Linux", "Province B Going MS Free", I'm reminded of some of my Mormon friends.

    Everytime some celebrity converted, they crowed about how their church was gaining ground and would encompass the world.

    Everytime some new temple complex was found in Central or South America, they'd claim it was evidence of Nephite civilization.

    Everytime there was a "gentile" event that paid homage to the Mormons, they go into theological orgasms.

    The facts

    • by Pecisk ( 688001 ) on Sunday July 15, 2007 @09:37AM (#19866571)
      And this is relevant to this article because...?

      Or you just wanted to start another flame war about how open source/open standards guys are zealots, etc. etc.

      Guess what - even if you are neither, one of most advanced countries in the world using really open standards IS news, even for you.

      Yes, maybe posting about every time when such things happens in local level - county, city, region - is a little bit silly (but even then I would like to know details), but this is different case.

      p.s. Munich still goes "to the church", by the way (3thd year, and still going. Yes, they have mixed success, but they don't look back). So does lot of other organizations, cities, regions and countries.
      • by jadavis ( 473492 )
        Guess what - even if you are neither, one of most advanced countries in the world using really open standards IS news, even for you.

        I think the excitement of a religious victory drives this story more than the mundane details about what open standards will really mean in this instance.

        The simple test to determine whether something is based on ideology or reason is whether different facts could change your opinion.

        Hypothetically, if the open standards were a mess, and the implementations were much worse than
        • by bit01 ( 644603 )

          I don't think that's a bad ideology, in fact I share the ideology of open standards. But I recognize that there is some ideology there

          By that reasoning making a commercial software choice is also ideology.

          All decisions can be looked at as ideology and reasoning attempting to label open source usage only as ideology, simply because characteristics of software not traditionally associated with closed source software are considered important, shows a closed source ideologue. Most characterization of open

    • "Everytime" I read a sentence in your post I wanted to puke out of the nonsense. I mean, seriously it is so terrible , must have been modded off topic but if there was a -1 lame tag....
      • by WED Fan ( 911325 )

        Incredible that a post can engender such feelings. Are you sure you are stable? Are you under a physician's care?

        Really now, if my post caused you that much grief, perhaps you feel that it was too much of a threat to your beliefs and that perhaps you are not that sure of validity of your beliefs?

        The point of the post is to draw that exact point.

        The Mormon kids I grew up with sought validation by all those points. Only those who are comfortable in their faith and beliefs stop seeking validation.

        The /. co

    • You're off topic (Score:3, Informative)

      by dreamchaser ( 49529 )
      Altogether off topic. This is about a major country adopting open *standards*. Nothing says they need to use Open Source Software, Linux, or ditch MS to do so. You're grasping at troll straws.
      • by WED Fan ( 911325 )
        Perhaps you need dots connected. By using an unrelated and but not too dissimilar look at an idealogic driven movement, the idea is to remove the idealogue from his/her argument far enough to enable those to review their situation from a distance. Those unable to see it, do need dots connected, but then it then becomes more difficult for the idealogue to take a fresh look at their position.
    • That's fine and all for church, but there are very compelling arguments (if not clear factual benefits) for changing to open standards. You're not locked into a specific application or version or vendor or toolkit or API. Middleware can be created for your data to work with proprietary applications if you so desire. You can even convert back. With proprietary software, it's a lot harder to "stop going to church" and you're pretty much stuck if your files are held hostage and you need to get work done.
    • Yes, Mitt Romney is Mormon, but so is Harry Reid, and both just look like slimy used car salesmen.

      Irrespective of what they look like to you, Mitt Romney is tangible contender for the presidency of the United States and Harry Reid is the majority leader in the Senate which suggests that Mormons have considerable political power.

      If OSS had similar presence in the IT industry, even if it continued to look 'questionable' to some people, that would be a cause for celebration, no?

      ]{
  • (Or Don't want to know...)

    PDF is an ISO Standard.

    http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/standards.h t ml/ [adobe.com]

    And here where thay are woring with ISO on PDF V1.7 and ISO 32000 http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/adobepdf.htm l/ [adobe.com]

    PDF used as a native output format by Open Office. So far Abobe have not sued over this. Just the opposite, they are promoting PDF as an implementable standard.

    If you go to here http://partners.adobe.com/public/developer/pdf/top ic.html/ [adobe.com] you will see that the specification is fre

    • by delt0r ( 999393 )
      I don't think they can sue. The standard contains no patented "technology" IIRC. You can't "copyright" a format, you can copyright the specification however of the format. But you are still free to read the specification and implement readers and writers of that format. As is done with the pdf format. Adobe have made the specification public. So its "propiroty" as in a company has specified the format, but its open in the sense that the format is strictly defined and its easy to get that definition and crea
  • The PDF press release from the ODF Alliance is peppered with a lot of things like "open formats such as ODF ..." To me, that sounds like Japan has decided to encourage open formats, and the ODF Alliance is spinning it to be about them.

    I don't know, as was asked by others around here, whether OOXML would qualify for the same treatment by Japan -- I suspect it would, though (as would other formats), therefore making this press release little more than a bunch of spin.
  • Not only that. In a high level conference on research collaboration between the EU and Japan this week, the words open source and standards were included in the draft. A few years ago I remember "open source" being dropped.. Times change and Microsoft is entirely to blame for its own shortcomings.
  • What's with the image of what looks like a hindu holy man with a trident?
  • This is not really news. Japan is an active member of just about every international standards body there is. The Japanese government has always favored standards-based products and actively supported Japanese companies in establishing standards where there were none. It's all good for business and, in Japan, what's good for business is good for the country.

    I'd say the ODF is easily pleased.

    BTW, what would a "closed international standard" be?

  • .. and interoperability is an easy game to play. Web Services, XML, open document formats - all very possible in a closed source, embrace-and-extend model. There's a lot of things not to like about it, but reality is what we're all here to deal with.

    To be honest, I find the spin that the ODF Alliance is putting on this just as pathetic and self-serving as Microsoft. Their main enemy, the Office Open XML format, is open too: documented, royalty-free, implemented in XML, maintained by an international body. S
    • But the definition of "open standard" in the framework document is:

      1. that the standard was created through an process of open participation, and practical details have been published to a degree that allows anyone to implement what it describes
      2. that anyone can make use of it
      3. that there are several products on the market which implement it.
      Does OOXML meet all of those criteria?
      • Erm, officially speaking, yes.

        Did you have a point?

        Incidentally, where is that definition quoted from? I didn't see it in the summary, or the linked article, any of the posts, and while I'm afraid I don't read Japanese, it doesn't sound like the translation of an offical document to me. It is also contradictory to all of definitions I can think of, including all of the ones quoted on Wikipedia.
  • this seems like a good idea, when will they land of the free embrace such a thing?
  • by mattr ( 78516 ) <mattr&telebody,com> on Sunday July 15, 2007 @11:55AM (#19867801) Homepage Journal
    Hello, I would like to mention some points from the Japanese PDF.

    First of all, Japan has some very strict new laws on how corporations must handle personal information of individuals to protect their privacy. Along with the changes in the Corporation Law recently, these laws mean that virtually all major corporations in Japan have been rewriting their articles of incorporation, employee manuals, IT department guidelines, and so on. It doesn't mean things are more secure, but it does mean they are supposed to be more secure. IIRC if your company handles the personal information on more than 500 people then you have to implement certain procedures. (Anyway I am not attempting to provide authoritative information here.)

    There also have been a number of scandals (mainly at big banks) on customer information being leaked. So now all corporations' fundamental articles include words like "leakage" and "falsification" of information as things that must be prevented. Japanese companies usually have their fiscal year begin April 1 which means that just a couple weeks ago, most corporations had their general shareholders meetings (many on the same day, to avoid organized crime from interfering) where things like this got voted on (if they weren't the previous year). ODF and standards haven't been on the plate but maybe they will be next year with this announcement.

    Okay, on to the PDF. The PDF includes definitions of many terms including "vendor lockin", "open standards", etc. ODF and XML are mentioned by name. It seems to be well written (though I have not read the whole thing). It would seem to exclude allowing Microsoft's horrible new format as an open format because it mentions in the vendor lockin definition the nonavailability of an API, or the limitation on ability to implement it due to licensing requirements. IANAL but it would seem that the government has the leeway to make sane judgements, even in the case of for example Microsoft taking over the standards process and making OOXML an international standard. That said, Japan is probably Microsoft's best or second best market.

    The document also states clearly that open formats are to be preferred, and must be used to promote exchange of information between ministries. The word "saiyou" (adopt, use) is used in the statements that say software that adopts open standards is desirable. It is not clear that this forbids the software to also support closed formats, but the spirit of the document would seem to prefer fully open software/solutions so that data may not be saved in closed formats, as this would hamper free exchange of information and the ability to store/view the documents into perpetuity.

    Here is a translation of section 4.2.3 on page 19. I, Matthew Rosin, hereby release this translated text to the world in the public domain but deny responsibility for any mistakes.

    ---
    4.2.3. Policy related to giving priority to open standards

    It is desirable for the government and public organizations to secure the mutual interoperability of information systems between administrative organizations and with related private sector and international organizations, in order to pursue efficient administration and to provide highly convenient service. To this end, it is necessary to procure software for which protocols, APIs, etc. that use interfaces that are compatible with open standards, to the extent to which implementation is possible.

    The government and public organizations, in order to secure transparency related to policy, fulfill their responsibility for providing explanations, and realize expanded participation by the citizenry, software must be procured, to the extent to which implementation is possible, for which the formats of data and files are compatible with open standards, in order to guarantee for public documents the ease of access and ability to save and browse over the long term.

    Mutual interconnection between related organizations, including governmental organs, and the free exchange of data among
  • You mean you don't need a specious govt run anti-trust trial to take down a monopoly the govt help create? I guess the lawyers had to get rich somehow...

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